Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Ripsnort on June 26, 2001, 12:35:00 PM
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Police use "Passive Force" to prevent from being labeled "Racist" (http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/134310782_police26m.html)
Switch to 'reactive mode'
Last week, Officer Al Warner, a black officer assigned to the Central Area,
stopped in front of Deano's bar on 20th Avenue and East Madison Street,
where four black men were smoking marijuana in a car. The men accused
Warner of racially profiling them.
"It's the catch phrase now," Warner said. "If I were an African-American
drug dealer here, that's the way I'd play the game. It intimidates officers."
So, I don't think what the police have done is the answer, after all, honest, hard working families living in these areas suffer.
I also don't believe that the community should be so hard on the police when someone gets shot by the police...
Where does this end? It seems a Tit-for-Tat at this point.
[ 06-26-2001: Message edited by: Ripsnort ]
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Now this whole thing could of been bipassed if Marijuana were legal.
That's all I have to say. ;)
-SW
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I'm sure you're just jesting (not about legalization, but about the post in context), since that is just an example of the whole problem that surrounds this issue.
Alittle background, this all stemmed from a man, who left a 7-11 store, with a gun and a knife in his hand, he fired one shot in the air (no, he didn't rob the store)...then walked down the street with the knife in one hand, with the pistol in his belt....police came, tried to convince him to drop the weapon, "walked" with the man as he 'skipped' down the street...after about 10 min of trying to negotiate, the man finally lunged after one of the officers, and the man was shot dead. The African American community was outraged and condemned the police for 'unwarranted agression'.
So, where do we stand today? You want police, or you don't want police? I'm confused... :rolleyes:
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it's called playing the odds, just more race baitin going on ... When I see a under 25 black er excuse me African American, or hispanic driving around in a >30k car here in west central Florida, my money is he is 99 times out of 100 a drug dealer. If I were a cop, for my own safety, I'd approach him that way.
disgusting when you get some of these lawyers involved..
Eagler
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I lived in DC for 17 years. I currently work in it, and live just outside the beltway.
It's all about playing mind games. It works for the Cops, so the poor(literally I mean this, like living in the Ghetto poor) black community use racial profiling as a defense if they get caught by the cops.
I think it's sick, but man.. you gotta admit. The way the world is heading as a whole it seems someone's got their hands on the toilet handle just waiting to flush it. :eek:
-SW
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Originally posted by Eagler:
it's called playing the odds, just more race baitin going on ... When I see a under 25 black er excuse me African American, or hispanic driving around in a >30k car here in west central Florida, my money is he is 99 times out of 100 a drug dealer. If I were a cop, for my own safety, I'd approach him that way.
disgusting when you get some of these lawyers involved..
Eagler
Yeah and all the white kids with the same car, their daddies musta bought it for them right? I mean come on, white kids NEVER deal drugs, and black kids never have well to do parents! :rolleyes:
Moving on to the issue... If the person that is screaming "racial profiling!" was actually committing a crime, who f***ing cares WHY the cop decided to investigate him/her! The person was committing a crime, for crying out loud. It's probable cause if it is applied to whites, but racial profiling if it's applied to minorities.
sorry for the use of white/black and not caucasian/african american. I'm not very "PC" like that.
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The white kids aren't screaming about being profiled.
Yep there are many spoiled "young adults" of all colors driving around in brand new BWM's their parents purchased for them. That's a whole different thread.
Eagler
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Originally posted by Eagler:
The white kids aren't screaming about being profiled.
Yep there are many spoiled "young adults" of all colors driving around in brand new BWM's their parents purchased for them. That's a whole different thread.
Eagler
agree with you there, but it's still "profiling" and they're not being harassed by the police because "daddy bought them a car." Like you said, it's really only slightly related. My second point was so what if racial profiling caught a criminal. They pretty much fit the profile at that point. Racial profiling is a problem when cops randomly pull people over and assume they're a criminal. That's not to say they shouldn't be cautious when approaching someone. There has to be a line between that caution and the presumption of criminal activity/guilt. It's just really hard to walk that line.
Hell, I was racially and sexually profiled. My insurance rates were sky high on my car until I turned 25. The principal is the same, albeit slightly different.
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Originally posted by Ripsnort:
...after about 10 min of trying to negotiate, the man finally lunged after one of the officers, and the man was shot dead. The African American community was outraged and condemned the police for 'unwarranted agression'.
hmm, looks to me like this is the point where things went wrong. you don't lunge after law enforcement with a deadly weapon. when they "fear for their own safety/lives" they have that little rule or clause that says they can use that deadly force stuff. it's not a black or white issue...it's an ignorance issue. say it was a white guy, say it was a 12 year old white girl, say it was a trained monkey, say it was a robot, say it was the invisible man (of course we could see the knife), it's not racially who, it's physically who. you lunge at me with a knife, i'm lunging back with whatever it takes to stop you. no matter who "you" are/is.
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too bad instinct is being conditioned and out of people.
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Originally posted by mason22:
you lunge at me with a knife, i'm lunging back with whatever it takes to stop you. no matter who "you" are/is.
So.. what do you do to stop Fatty from "lunging" at you with his Johnson brand knife? :D
-SW
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that's because the "white" community realizes you don't pull a gun on a cop, you don't run from the law. If you do, you may get shot, and you my die. ANy "community" with half a brain realizes the same thing.
Here in the Tampa area, a group of African Americans just opened a gym on Martin Luther King Blvd (how ironic)named after a punk arse black dope dealer shot dead by the police after he refused to roll down his window then proceeded to run into the officer after the cop stepped in front of the car trying to get the driver and passenger to get out. Did I mention the car was "purchased" from a crack potato for a few rocks? Did I mention the African community then proceeded to burn down their neighborhood in protest?
So that we the tax payers can rebuild it for them...
If anyone is "profiled", there is a reason. Just as most high speed cigar boats hauling butt in the middle of the night can be "profiled" as drug smugglers...
It's all a pile of lawyer crap used to prey on the ignorance, emotions and stupidity of the average jury ..
Eagler
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I had hair down to my butt in high school, 1976 got my drivers license, was pulled over routinely due to profiling...yeah, I knew why they were doing it. Racism? Naaa, maybe stero-typing is a better word.
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Originally posted by Ripsnort:
I had hair down to my butt in high school, 1976 got my drivers license, was pulled over routinely due to profiling...yeah, I knew why they were doing it. Racism? Naaa, maybe stero-typing is a better word.
but it doesn't have that nice bigoted ring to it, Rip! "Stereotyping" negative sounding, but not too bad... "Racial Profiling" OMG!! call the lawyers now!!! racist! bigot!! ;)
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Hehe I use to have really long hair too, but I had a good cover when I was in HS...ye old '79 Bronco.
Instantly labled "redneck!", so I was never bothered. Despite what was being hauled around in the back most of the time. (I hung around with the artisitic/metal people, and we'd take the top off, it was so high up there no one could see in anyway) I think 2 out of the 4 years I had that shot gun rack on the left side with a 12 gauge and a 7.7 Jap, no one ever said anything to me, despite being in very urban school. We had an indoor shooting range as part of the ROTC unit, I routinely went in there and shot after school. Baytown PD officer use to go in there with me and we'd shoot all afternoon.
Hehehe. Come to think of it I did get some weird looks carrying that thing from my truck to the range. But only when I first started :)
We had 50 M-14's in the armory too. Had there ever been a "situation" our school would of been well equipped.
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Well, if you ask me, profiling does exist to an extent - no getting around that. But it's being used as a way for the black community to cry "foul!" now. Many situations are merely probably cause - maybe they're more likely to get noticed, but if they get caught doing something illegal, who cares?
We run into this all the time now; minorities often automatically assume that when something happens to them, it must be because of profiling and/or racism. An example: My mother was at the laundromat. This Hispanic woman and her two daughters had grabbed all of the machines, because they apparently just HAD to get done five minutes faster than they would if they shared. My mother asked the woman working at the laundromat at the time to secure a dryer or two for her so she could get it done. As she walked away she overheard one of them saying "Americano es bueno," obviously in a sarcastic tone of voice. Sorry lady. It was because you were being a macho-squeak, NOT because you are Hispanic.
Get a grip, people.
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I use this simple rule. I am not a cop, but I have friends who are. If I am in a situation (I'm the cop) and the suspect has a weapon (be he white, black, red, purple, whatever) I will treat him a as threat and attempt to get him to surrender. If he raises his weapon at me or fellow officers, he's going down, no matter what he intends to do with it. If I get accused of "racial profiling" then I'll ignore it, because I know I did my job the way I was trained to do it, and if they don't like it, tough. BTW, I try not to stereotype people IRL. I work in a grocery store and I see all sorts of people from all different races. I don't make assumptions on their personality at first glance. I have met many friendly black people, as well as Hispanic, Chinese, and English/British. Same thing goes on the police force. You try not to stereotype.
It don't matter who he is, if he's breaking the law or brandishing a weapon, I will do my job the way I was trained.....
[ 06-27-2001: Message edited by: texace ]
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Eagler,
You come out sounding like an racist, djust thought i let you know...
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Originally posted by Maniac:
Eagler,
You come out sounding like an racist, djust thought i let you know...
Now your profiling me :)
Not a racist, just sick of the ongoing reverse discrimination. Trash comes in all colors/nationalities.
Eagler
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Heh it goes both ways, I must say.
Anyone with any experience in "ethnic" gangs or groups will know such a one tend to be more biggoted than the average person.
In the US ghettos in areas where the majority of the population is African American, it'd be odd if a few weren't checked out.
That being said, I've heard that the rather harsh environment police officers live and work in tend to make them a little cynical and pragmatic, and I guess they're betting on the odds.
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Originally posted by Eagler:
Not a racist, just sick of the ongoing reverse discrimination.
Eagler
Unfortunately, this can CAUSE racism amongst whites, those who were "Rainbow Oriented" can start turning alittle racist when they see another ethnic group taking advantage of the system...sad, but true..I'm with you Eagler.
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I have to say that I agree with the basic theme of this thread - as I see it, "Racial Profiling" has become a catch phrase, and it gets used inappropriately. If people are committing a crime and are observed by the police, the police have an obligation to do something, and race has nothing to do with it.
Lets not forget, though, where the phrase came from - for example, the notorious case (and far from the only one) of a black woman who was stopped on the freeway, searched and found to be carrying a large sum of cash. The police then said it "must" be drug money and confiscated the money and the car. The woman was, in fact, fairly well off and was carrying the cash for legitimate reasons. She never was charged with any traffic violation. Why was she stopped? Because she "fit the profile" of someone involved with drugs. By the way, the last I heard, she still had not gotten her money returned, though they did return her car.
My point is, while the words "racial profiling" might get bandied about when they don't apply, the term was invented by the police themselves, and the concept has been used to deal unfairly with people who were NOT seen committing crimes. So, by all means lets deal reasonably with crime, but lets not get to the point where every person of color is automatically assumed to be a criminal. I own a nice car - I'd like to feel that I can drive it around without the assumption that I stole it or bought it by selling crack. If I'm seen breaking a law, stop me - otherwise, leave me alone.
- Yoj
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I love it! Theyl get exactly what they ask for those stupid arrogant race-obsesed idiots. Im gonna sing and dance when their apperently revitalizing neighborhhod goes to toejam with no police around.
I love it!
Very very sad...........
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Originally posted by GRUNHERZ:
I love it! Theyl get exactly what they ask for those stupid arrogant race-obsesed idiots.
The beer bellied rednecks?
Im gonna sing and dance when their apperently revitalizing neighborhhod goes to toejam with no police around.
The southern trailer parks?
I love it!
I hate it
Very very sad...........
Indeed
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<shared in a humorous mood...dont get all fired up, its funny, really!>
....reminds me of the days after before graduation and I'm talking to one of the high school guidance couselors. The schools I like all require a lot of financial aid and/or grants. Being white, and my folks jointly made about $60K or so, we were told they made too much for me to get any meaningful financial aid. Couldn't qualify for many programs since I wasn't Indian, a single teen mom and you know the long long list of "minorities we'll help" kinda crap. So I bluntly asked "Are there any groups out there that stick up for ordinary hard working white folks?" He chuckled and said "I think only the KKK is still around, but I wouldn't want that on my transcript!"
Remember the key to life in these days of race cards and "What, me be responsible" is personal responsibility. You see it everyday on the news, in every corner of America. If people can deflect blame or play the victim before a camera, they sure as toejam will.
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10bears have you no appreciation of subtlety?
I was making a sarcastic remark.
By deamonizing the police all the people will get will be criminals who are not afraid of them and give them one more weapon to commit crimes with.
As for them being race-obseesed idiots I fully stand on that one.
When pepole tie ethninc identity to political identity and political issues you always get a bad result no matter what society you are in.
In my home country we took that to great extent and proceeded to kill 250,000 of each other, make millions homeless, create a mess for the world community, and its still a problem in every day politcs.
What country is this? Take guess which little southern European nation blew itself up over "ethinc" conflicts.
It all started when we begain blaiming everything that went bad in our lives because the "other" ethnic group had control of this and that, or they did this and that to us 500 years ago.
This stupidid racist demonizing of police is no different, people will begin to hate them resent them and disrespect them even more. Then thery wont give a diddly and the neighborhood will g to toejam.
Then the racist demogaugues in the community will just reblame the racist police because they "abandoned" the community and are not enforcing laws arresting criminals and fighting crime.
You know this is exactly where its heading to...
They should ALL just diddlying stop and start seeing peole as individuals not some sort of "group" members.
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Of course they should. But you know as well as I that those things are reinforced through the group from day one. Not long ago you could see eight year old Irish kids throwing rocks at British soldiers for the "600 years of oppression" - as though they understood anything about it. Racial, religious and other biases are implanted early and deep - and they are reinforced by the things the people see in their lives, some of it imagined and some quite real. Saying people should give up those biases and stop being stupid is like saying they ought to grow wings.
- Yoj
[ 06-27-2001: Message edited by: Yoj ]