Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: FTSnafu on August 04, 2005, 02:12:27 AM
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Have you ever tried to do a bombing run and hit a target when the are fighters all around and ack coming up.
Fighters atleast can move around.
Can't do that and hit something.
Ever wonder why more bomber crews died in WWII than fighters.
It's harder than going around and throwing bb's around.
Also next time try hitting a carrier on the move.
PS you fighter jocks would never take all these fields woth out us BUFF's.
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yes, its easy. take 20 mins getting to target, press Y for 3 seconds, drop a few bombs, lazer gun a few fighters, and thats it.
who said we wanted to take bases?
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I'll admit I suck as a fighter jock.
But it ain't easy or all of you would be up
here going slow and getting jumped.
Would just like to get alittle credit.
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Buff pilots are a very under appreciated part of the game.
Some actually do prefer to do it properly from alt, and it can take longer than 20 mins. Only to get bounced when they are nearly to their target.
There must be someway of giving them credit through system messages.
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Apparently OUR buff drivers want to make movies as well as
history now.
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Anyone else hate how it's been made easy mode to calibrate your bomb sight?
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When I 1started playing I was a bomber. It was simple and after 2 months I could easily hit things. I soon got bored and worked on becoming a fighter. I've now been playing about 7-8 months and can say I'm still far from mastering the fighter department. And this isn't WW2, it's a WW2 flight sim. Oh, and try to understand this, we don't want to take a base or sink a CV. We want to fight real people who take off from them. This is your 4th or 5th thread on the same thing, we get it already. You like to land grab and think everyone else should too, gotcha:aok
You admit you suck as a fighter jock, how long did you try? Did you just take the easy road and go with buffing after gettin shot down a few times in fighters??? Trust me, to become even a decent fighter you have to get your butt handed to you for a good 3-4 months AT LEAST from a good stick. If you flew a fighter in the MA just following the horde and got killed then you have learned nothing. If you want to learn to fly a fighter let me know, I'll help you. Thats a serious offer, let me know.
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Originally posted by FTSnafu
I'll admit I suck as a fighter jock.
But it ain't easy or all of you would be up
here going slow and getting jumped.
Would just like to get alittle credit.
Its the other way around. It is because it is so easy and boring that we dont do it. You can kill from 1.5 out with a little practice and if you really have probs holding the stick still for 3 secs to calibrate then well, try the mouse (much easyer).
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Originally posted by lasersailor184
Anyone else hate how it's been made easy mode to calibrate your bomb sight?
I enjoy doing the buff run, although lately Im in the P-38J a lot.
What annoys me is HTC has made the bomb sight synch up a lot easier to bring in more buff pilots. Yet it seems most of em opt for the NOE/suicide thing.
Gives those of us who do actually use the sight and use some tactics to get into hostile airspace a bad rap.
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Originally posted by lasersailor184
Anyone else hate how it's been made easy mode to calibrate your bomb sight?
Yup, far too freaking easy.
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Originally posted by Kev367th
Yup, far too freaking easy.
Agreed.
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Originally posted by FTSnafu
Have you ever tried to do a bombing run and hit a target when the are fighters all around and ack coming up.
Fighters atleast can move around.
Can't do that and hit something.
Ever wonder why more bomber crews died in WWII than fighters.
It's harder than going around and throwing bb's around.
Also next time try hitting a carrier on the move.
PS you fighter jocks would never take all these fields woth out us BUFF's.
Get real. You get credit for killing planes because they can fight back last time I looked a FH wasnt trying to kill you. And with the "its harder the going around throwing bbs around" thing yea flying a buff and bombing stationary targets really takes a rocket scientist to figure out. Oh and the carrier thing LMAO thats just about as easy as hiting a hanger. And last time I looked anyone with 4-5 ppl can take a base w/o buffs: 2 fully loaded 110s for the town, 1 190F8 for vh and ack and vulching , 1 190A5,A8 for ack and vulching and a goon. You jsut gatta know what your doing. Most ppl jsut go deack and vulch while GVs roll out and kill them. And before you get all "well you must be a fighter jock" I'v been playing for 4 years the first 6-8 months I didnt set foot in a fighter then I thought "hey Ill try a plane that can only shoot forward." Been killing bombers and others fighters ever since and about once every week I hop in a buff and go bomb toolsheds and its goten alot easyer then the old AH1 days, these days I can hit a VH from 30k thats alittle TO easy.
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Some enjoy the aspect of flying bombers in a large group using
assigned formation positions and detailed target instructions, using salvo and delay calculations, and the historical aspect of re-enacting it,,,how it effects the current map or war,,or how ez or difficult it is may be irrevelant.
But, yes, too easy
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I miss the old calibration routine..
Now, THAT, took skill.
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Originally posted by Rino
Apparently OUR buff drivers want to make movies as well as
history now.
:lol :rofl
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Originally posted by Cooley
Some enjoy the aspect of flying bombers in a large group using
assigned formation positions and detailed target instructions, using salvo and delay calculations, and the historical aspect of re-enacting it,,,
But, yes, too easy
I can appreciate that, but I wish they'd do it someplace where the fight isn't :)
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Were there any CV's or any other ship sunk by a Buff group? And none of this low level crap where it was a one way trip either! A "Normal" High Alt drop, like bombing is suppose to be done...
EDIT:
Found this....answered my question, but not much info there, doesn't even tell how high they were. Did some looking around, couldn't find much else....
NICHIMEI MARU (January 15, 1943)
Japanese army cargo vessel, part of a convoy transporting Allied prisoners of war, sunk by bombs from USAAF B-24s about two hundred miles southwest of Rangoon, Burma. (13º30'N 97º30'E) Also part of the convoy, the army cargo ship Moji Maru, was damaged. Around 500 Allied prisons-of-war on board the Nichimei were lost.
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Not sure about altitude either, but the British battleship Prince of Wales was sunk by level bombers. Bettys, IIRC.
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I think Nells got the Prince and Repulse.
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According to this website, it's...
both!
http://www.tamiya.com/english/products/31615prince/
Nells and Bettys. :)
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I don't know of any aircraft carrier sunk by high-altitude level bombers. Level bombing with gravity-guided bombs doesn't lend itself well against maneuvering targets. Bombing carriers from 25,000 feet with B-17's in AH will have about the same level of effectiveness as it did in reality--which is to say, none. Hence why they choose to dive-bomb (survival not being an issue).
Prince of Whales and Repulse were sunk by torpedo attack. All the final level level bombing against Prince of Whales really accomplished was killing more people on an already sinking ship. Also take note that the planes weren't flying at particularly high altitude.
J_A_B
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Originally posted by LePaul
I enjoy doing the buff run, although lately Im in the P-38J a lot.
What annoys me is HTC has made the bomb sight synch up a lot easier to bring in more buff pilots. Yet it seems most of em opt for the NOE/suicide thing.
Many of us could not bomb using the "old" method. I'm serious. Many could NOT get their computers to do it. I know my computer sucks. It's been okay since AH came out, but it's a P3 650MHz. There was something with my hardware setup and my crappy bellybutton joystick and the lack of CPU and lack of RAM that meant I could NOT bomb at all. Keep in mind I started out AH many years ago bombing with AKNimitz. We did some lanc runs on the HQ back when it was a hard thing to do but could be taken down by 1-2 men. I liked bombing. From alt. But when they redid the bomb site with the calibration I could not get it to work. I did it all properly step by step (no I'm not kidding, I did it perfectly every damn time) but the bombs were way freaking off target every single time.
There were others that had problems with it too. An anecdotal example is where one guy when to skuzzy or pyro or somebody and told them about the problem, tried to get some help, and they eventually said "You can't calibrate with your current setup".
So there was more to it than *just* encouraging bombers.
Hell, with the newbies that only want to suicide they're not going to get anywhere near the level of enjoyment the rest of us get from this game. They'll suicide in anything. They don't care. If the bomb dropping became slightly random (wind scattering bombs, what have you) they'd drop from 10 feet instead of 40 feet, they'd do vertical dives at 90 degrees instead of lame duck 45 degree plow-ins. I see the change in the bomb calibration as an acknowledgement that the old one didn't work for a lot of people. I don't see it as any prevention of dweebery. You'll find dweebery anywhere. I think it was changed to help those that cared to use it, not those that will never even try it.
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Originally posted by Kweassa
I miss the old calibration routine..
Now, THAT, took skill.
Not really, just an extra 10-15 seconds. ;)
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Originally posted by LePaul
I enjoy doing the buff run, although lately Im in the P-38J a lot.
What annoys me is HTC has made the bomb sight synch up a lot easier to bring in more buff pilots. Yet it seems most of em opt for the NOE/suicide thing.
Gives those of us who do actually use the sight and use some tactics to get into hostile airspace a bad rap.
I agree heap much with that---wish eggs had to fall minimum 10 seconds or something if dropped from norden plane
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Originally posted by lasersailor184
Anyone else hate how it's been made easy mode to calibrate your bomb sight?
I no longer fly buffs because there is no challenge to it at all. It is one of the few things I think HT got COMPLETELY WRONG. There is no fun when there is no challenge, and there ain't no challenge in holding down one key for a few seconds.
Bombing at altitude used to be a very difficult thing since holding the crosshairs steady from far away was a son of a beach.....now instead I get fake haze that encorages low level bombing runs and makes traditional bombing 99% useless. At 30k in an airplane you can very often see perfectly fine....unles you fly AH at which point 16k-17k has a magical white blanked of bull schnit.
A year or so ago I flew buffs a good portion of the time.....I rarely fly them now since HT has basically encouraged dive bombing in them as their only real effective use.
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Originally posted by Krusty
Many of us could not bomb using the "old" method. I'm serious. Many could NOT get their computers to do it. I know my computer sucks. It's been okay since AH came out, but it's a P3 650MHz. There was something with my hardware setup and my crappy bellybutton joystick and the lack of CPU and lack of RAM that meant I could NOT bomb at all.
So if someone has a crappy computer that prevents smooth framerates near the ground in a fighter should we add an autokill button for them as well?
One thing was done when the bomber callibration was changed, the challege, hence the fun was removed.
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If fighters had a checklist of things to do in order to "prime" their guns, and if that list of steps wouldn't work on lesser hardware, then YES, there should be an auto-prime feature for the guns... Think about it this way... what if you had to harmonize your guns in the cockpit before you ever fired a shot? And only if you got it perfectly right would your shots land anywhere near your gunsite center?
THEN it would be important who could and could not actually do what the game was asking.
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Originally posted by lasersailor184
Anyone else hate how it's been made easy mode to calibrate your bomb sight?
YES
If wind was brought back It might help alittle bit with that.
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Some like taking bases and other prefer furballs. What I dont enjoy, though, when I find a good furball some idiot takes a bomber and kills the FHs at the enemy base. By doing this they kill the fight. Then the enemy come from a base even farther away and come up at 18k and will just cherry pick causing extreme lameness or vise versa. Other times we would be vulching and some bomber pilot comes in and bombs the FHs getting rid of the easy kills. Yea bomber pilots are good when it comes to sinking cvs but I dont appreciate them going into of the best fights of the night and killing FHs at either base causing the fight to die. Ive started to fly underneath the bomber bombsights trying to get them to miss. If I find a good fight and start engaging and having a good time then a bomber pilot comes in kills FHs and says,"I killed FHs and says ha ha now we dont have to worry about enemy fighters." I start thinking to myself I wish killshooter was off so I could blast them out of the sky because I travel a sector or so to a good fight just to see it disappear. I would like bomber pilots to realize when they are wanted and when they arent.
I dont fly bombers and only fly fighter 99% of the time in a 38. I dont do jabo mission and all I want to do is furball. I think too many bomber pilots think to highly of themselves thinking they can do whatever they want not thinking none of their countrymen will be angry at them. I am one of those people that dont like seeing bombers because they usually end up porking the fields and killing a good fight because thats what I see most do.
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Originally posted by FuBaR
YES
If wind was brought back It might help alittle bit with that.
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Wind was at 16k, most folks come in under 10
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Originally posted by FTSnafu
Have you ever tried to do a bombing run ......
Nope :D
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Originally posted by Hoarach
Other times we would be vulching and some bomber pilot comes in and bombs the FHs getting rid of the easy kills.
Oh, the humanity.
- oldman
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Originally posted by bj229r
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Wind was at 16k, most folks come in under 10
I typically came in at 20-25k because that was an altitude that allowed enough time to make your bombing run without interception if the NME wasnt paying attention. Now you basically cant bomb effectively above 16k so fighters can reach you in the time it takes to reach the base after the flashing/radar starts.....result....why come in high when you can some in low as dirt. Gameplay has been negatively effected.
Fortunately I like flying fighter too.
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Originally posted by ALF
I typically came in at 20-25k because that was an altitude that allowed enough time to make your bombing run without interception if the NME wasnt paying attention. Now you basically cant bomb effectively above 16k so fighters can reach you in the time it takes to reach the base after the flashing/radar starts.....result....why come in high when you can some in low as dirt. Gameplay has been negatively effected.
Fortunately I like flying fighter too.
You mean because of the clouds? They also seem to be about 16k..same difference I spose--I fly B24's a bit, and ALWAYS bomb at 16k, and find 95% of the enemy below me--doing 2-3 passes over same base is usually only thing that gives em a chance at me
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Well I haven't seen Snafu post in a while, so I assume he realizes his thread was pwned. =)
In any case Snafu, you will see after you have been here a while that if you have 6 or 7 guys who know what they are doing you can take any base on the map. I'm serious about that, any base on the map. And to cap it off, you don't need a single bomber, besides the c47. You aren't going to get any sympathy from me either about the guns on a a bomber. Take up any fighter you want, and try and shoot down 999000 in 17s or 24s. Get out of that deathstar and hop into an xwing for a while, its rough at first, but once you get started, I bet you won't go back. :aok
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Originally posted by CHECKERS
Originally posted by FTSnafu
Have you ever tried to do a bombing run ......
Nope :D
:rofl
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Quote:And none of this low level crap where it was a one way trip either! A "Normal" High Alt drop, like bombing is suppose to be done...
Then what of the B-25's in the Pacific fitted with extra cannons for low-level straffing,what about "skip bombing",oh and The Doolittle Raid?
Quote:
Japanese army cargo vessel, part of a convoy transporting Allied prisoners of war, sunk by bombs from USAAF B-24s about two hundred miles southwest of Rangoon, Burma. (13º30'N 97º30'E) Also part of the convoy, the army cargo ship Moji Maru, was damaged. Around 500 Allied prisons-of-war on board the Nichimei were lost.
Casualties of WAR
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Great, you have 2 specific applications of atypical toolshedding tactics geared toward specific targets (A strike on Japan to break their morale and boost ours, and strafing lightly defended boats).
However, we have neither B25s setup for antishipping roles, nor lightened, stripped b26s for carrier service.