Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aircraft and Vehicles => Topic started by: Nosara on October 05, 2005, 01:35:57 PM
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Would it be possible to have this mod for the Stuka. It was the anti tank model that was used to great effect on the Russian front.
Forward guns
ju.87G-1
2×37 mm BK3,7 cannon
Rear guns
2×7.9 mm
Junkers Jumo 1300 hp
"The Stuka's design featured some innovative features, including an automatic pull-up system to ensure that the plane recovered from its attack dive even if the pilot blacked out from the high acceleration, and wind-powered sirens on the wheel covers that wailed during dives to scare its victims."
And please add the wind-powered sirens so that we can let the ground pounders know we are coming...lol
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havent flown it in a while but Il2 the d model has the siren.
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You only get 6 shots for those big guns though.
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six tank kills per run will do, for the rest i will just dive with the siren...lol
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would be everywhere for the first few days then it will just be a hangar queen.
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Think of the HO possibilities...I could see whole squads adopting it as their main ride. :eek:
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the siren was taken off on late-model stukas because the russians weren't scared anymore.
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Think of the horror to the tigers when a large flight of tank busters arrive over head. Just dont forget the escort for us please...
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Should be perked.
Either that, or no perked tanks.
Any fool can take up a Ju87G and go crashing into a nearby tank guns blazing.
People already do things like clusterbomb the entire vicinity of the tank at 1k alt, with 42,000lbs of ordnance raining down from Lanc formations - just to knock one tank down.
What'd they do if they were given a much more effective weapon that drills 100mms of tank armour upon impact? Who needs to practice GV strafing in Hurri2Ds or Il2s? Learn to aim vital spots or set up strafing angles and bearings? No need for such things. Up that flying twin-37mm tungsten core shell shooter and hit it anywhere at close distance, and 100mm penetration guaranteed.
The tanks would be wiped from the face of the MA earth, and once more the GV aspect of the game would go totally stale. Everybody would up Osties exclusively - just like the old days when any strafing gun would disable or kill tanks easily. The end of the whole ground war, armoured assault, tank-blitz part of the game.
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The siren should be perked.
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More perks = louder siren :D
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Originally posted by Squire
Think of the HO possibilities...I could see whole squads adopting it as their main ride. :eek:
Naw not a chance its not fast enought to get away in after they miss the HO attemt.
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U need to fly the A-20 more. I've got a CEP of 5 meters against armor with 500 pounders.
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When i am in my Panzer and see an A20 rolling in on me fromout of nowhere it makes me very sad. It needs a siren ...lol
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I don't know about perks. The Ju87 is still very vulnerable in the air.
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Originally posted by hubsonfire
gah, I can't do it. This forum should be renamed again, this time to "The same crappy ideas rehashed over and over until your eyes bleed, with the occasional reasonable suggestion thrown in so you don't just give up and stop reading".
Wrong forum, but all the same. One of the best kept secrets of the intardnet BBS is the search button.
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Originally posted by Kweassa
Should be perked.
Either that, or no perked tanks.
Any fool can take up a Ju87G and go crashing into a nearby tank guns blazing.
People already do things like clusterbomb the entire vicinity of the tank at 1k alt, with 42,000lbs of ordnance raining down from Lanc formations - just to knock one tank down.
What'd they do if they were given a much more effective weapon that drills 100mms of tank armour upon impact? Who needs to practice GV strafing in Hurri2Ds or Il2s? Learn to aim vital spots or set up strafing angles and bearings? No need for such things. Up that flying twin-37mm tungsten core shell shooter and hit it anywhere at close distance, and 100mm penetration guaranteed.
The tanks would be wiped from the face of the MA earth, and once more the GV aspect of the game would go totally stale. Everybody would up Osties exclusively - just like the old days when any strafing gun would disable or kill tanks easily. The end of the whole ground war, armoured assault, tank-blitz part of the game.
YOU IS WRONG
YOU IS PARANOID :noid
:D
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Originally posted by Nosara
Would it be possible to have this mod for the Stuka. It was the anti tank model that was used to great effect on the Russian front.
Forward guns
ju.87G-1
2×37 mm BK3,7 cannon
Rear guns
2×7.9 mm
Junkers Jumo 1300 hp
"The Stuka's design featured some innovative features, including an automatic pull-up system to ensure that the plane recovered from its attack dive even if the pilot blacked out from the high acceleration, and wind-powered sirens on the wheel covers that wailed during dives to scare its victims."
And please add the wind-powered sirens so that we can let the ground pounders know we are coming...lol
the Ju-87G-1 is cheap
Ju-87G-2 is better, more aammo
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Originally posted by 1K3
the Ju-87G-1 is cheap
Ju-87G-2 is better, more aammo
What good is more ammo when you're dead ;)
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YOU IS WRONG
YOU IS PARANOID
That's what they said to people who foresaw Pearl Harbor coming.
I've been here long enough to witness how the ground warfare changed over the years. The ground warfare wasn't tank-oriented like it is now. In the years before, the tanks were totally useless and everybody used Ostards. It was a bland, stale, tasteless heap of sludge.
It wasn't until the suggestions of some long-time advocates (including myself) were implemented into the game that the ground war shifted to what it should be. Finally the tanks were the main stuff and the AA vehicles became side kicks. Armoured assault became a real option to suppressing enemy territories.
The suggestions were simple - the tank armour model was fixed. Before that even Zeros could strafe a Panzer and knock it dead. The current ground warfare was achieved only when the tanks were tough enough to withstand aerial strafing attacks upto certain amount. You can still disable tanks with concentrated 20mm fire nowadays, but compared to what it was before, the tanks are practically immune from aerial strafing unless it is a very dedicated tank buster like a Hurri2D or a IL2. The rise of these battle tanks as an important factor also gave real use to Hurri2Ds and IL2s, which role in the MA as professional tank-busting equipment is pronounced.
If the Ju87G which totes a 100mm armour penetrating shell comes free of price, I guarantee that the tanks will go extinct once more, and with it, the Hurri2Ds and IL2s.
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i say perk it, that way we have more stuff to spend our TRILLIONS of bomber perks on!!:aok
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Originally posted by Kweassa
That's what they said to people who foresaw Pearl Harbor coming.
I've been here long enough to witness how the ground warfare changed over the years. The ground warfare wasn't tank-oriented like it is now. In the years before, the tanks were totally useless and everybody used Ostards. It was a bland, stale, tasteless heap of sludge.
It wasn't until the suggestions of some long-time advocates (including myself) were implemented into the game that the ground war shifted to what it should be. Finally the tanks were the main stuff and the AA vehicles became side kicks. Armoured assault became a real option to suppressing enemy territories.
The suggestions were simple - the tank armour model was fixed. Before that even Zeros could strafe a Panzer and knock it dead. The current ground warfare was achieved only when the tanks were tough enough to withstand aerial strafing attacks upto certain amount. You can still disable tanks with concentrated 20mm fire nowadays, but compared to what it was before, the tanks are practically immune from aerial strafing unless it is a very dedicated tank buster like a Hurri2D or a IL2. The rise of these battle tanks as an important factor also gave real use to Hurri2Ds and IL2s, which role in the MA as professional tank-busting equipment is pronounced.
If the Ju87G which totes a 100mm armour penetrating shell comes free of price, I guarantee that the tanks will go extinct once more, and with it, the Hurri2Ds and IL2s.
perking Ju-87G-2 is too harsh
why not give it an ENY of 5?
when "ENY limiter" kicks in, the team with most players dont get to use it. The team who are close to the ropes get to use it.
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I'd rather have the Ju87D-5 with the 7.95mm machine guns on the wings replaced with 20mm cannons on each wing. Would make furballing so much more enjoyable and I'd actually be able to do some damage other than annoy my target with the constent pinging sound of spit wads hitting his plane.
ack-ack
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perking Ju-87G-2 is too harsh
why not give it an ENY of 5?
Because giving it a small ENY doesn't do anything to control its numbers.
You need to set up a firing angle to kill a Panzer with a Hurri2D or a IL-2. And even then, you need to hit it at certain speeds and angles to achieve penetration. It takes time and practice to kill tanks by strafing. Tigers are mostly immune to strafing from any aircraft in the first place. Also, a low-alt ordnance drop against GVs takes lot of practice to execute perfectly.
In other words, killing tanks with aircraft isn't easy for most people. Unless there are a number of experienced tank busters operating from a field, currently it is entirely possible to overwhelm aerial defenses and reach the town/field by armoured assault and suppress it.
This gives people reason to use tanks, because, the survivability of the tanks is balanced with the difficulty of tank busting in the MA. Tanks are dead meat without aerial cover, IF there are people who know how to bust tanks. BUT, it takes a lot of practice to knock out tanks, and the number of people who know how to do it is always few.
However, that particular Stuka is armed with a gun that penetrates a Tiger hull armour from the front. You don't need to set up angles, or aim for engine compartments or top armour and stuff in that plane. Just approach, aim, and get a round or two on it and the tank will be at least damaged somewhere.
In other words, the difficulty of tank busting goes waaaaaaaay low if this plane goes free, and that means the end of tank battles in the MA. Unlike in the game, these Stukas operated in limited numbers and according to exact schedule. In the MA we can respawn again and again and again, until one gets that 37mm AP shot into the target tank, which results in a dead tank.
There's nothing harsh about perking the Ju87G-2.
People should consider it a real risk to use it, and think of operating it only when there are absolutely no enemy threats nearby. Their numbers should ALWAYS remain very few in the MA - about as common as seeing Me262s in the game.
Personally, I think it should be perked no less than 30 bomber perks.
The fact that it's slow or vulnerable to AA vehicles or enemy fighters doesn't matter at all. The only thing that matters is how well it does its intended work , and the answer is that it does it SO well, that it endangers the entire ground warfare aspect of the game.
If the Ju87G goes free, then there should be a mobile 5" gun mounted on M3s as a countermeasure for GVs. That's how much that plane is threatening to tanks.
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Geez, talk about an alarmist.
The Hurri and Il2 are both able to offer some real self defense.
Not so for the Stuka. Especially Stukas with big heavy guns and short clips.
And if that were NOT true, no one would launch Il2's in base defense.
I have yet to see anyone launch a swarm of Stuka's to defend a base.
But you see it often with Il2's.
And armor shouldn't be used if you can't offer it at least some air support and cover. Not to mention some anti air armor.
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Kweassa, don't worry about the ju-87 tank killer numbers.
Your talking about a plane that can't outrun a zero or a hurri.
A plane that is realively fragile, easily killed.
Might see a few if your attacking in GV's with no air cover, but thats a no no anyway.
The average pilot is going to get 1 kill with that stuka, then be trying to rtb.
While everything that sees it is going "Free lunch!, Fresh Meat!"
The only way to be sure of course is to test it.
Put it in the lineup and see what happens.
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What adv would the 37mm guns of the 87 have over the 40mm of the hurriD?
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Kweasa , Then the people doing the ground war should be smart enough to bring the aa with them . Each tank should have its own osti or m16 for aa. As it stands now all gv's have to do to avoid gunfire is run into the trees anyway. Also most dedicated gvers are smart enough to send in a squady to kill ords, and vh hanger. Once ords and vh are down there is no effective way to kill tigers from the air at said target.
I dont think it will be as easy as you think for the common pilot to kill tanks with twin 37 mm. I't still requires smooth control. I'll use my self as an example. At the begining of the last tour i started upping IL2s anytime i found a base under gv attack. I had never made an effort to get any better killing gv's before from this aircraft. By the end of the tour I could still only get 2-3 kills a sortie. I think only the dedicated tank busters would still be an effective threat against gvs. Most pilots dont take te time to get good at it.
Bronk
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Well, if Ju-87G-2 enters the AH world... bring in the WHIRBELWIND mobile AAA and give it an ENY of 5 also.
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immune to strafing from any aircraft in the first place.
The Tigers aren't Immune to my Hurricane Mk IID.
But anyway, the 37mm cannons are the ultimate tank busters. They have high velocities, good momentum and great armor piercing abilities.
I'd have to agree with Perking the Ju87g. However, it should not be perked above 20. It's still a really vulnerable aircraft to ground fire and other aircraft.
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This has been debated extensively before. I'd love to see the Stuka Tank Buster here.
See: http://www.hitechcreations.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=132600 (http://www.hitechcreations.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=132600)
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Originally posted by Kweassa
Should be perked.
Either that, or no perked tanks.
Any fool can take up a Ju87G and go crashing into a nearby tank guns blazing.
SNIP
Not so. You exaggerate the issue. It flies worse than a hurri2D. It's slower, less manuverable, and can't do squat. It has weaker guns with less ammo per gun. The ONLY thing it would have is a dive brake. The rear guns are useless, as in a hurri2D you don't need them (can evade).
Can anybody just go diving into a tank with a Hurri2D? Yes they CAN, whether or not they'll hit the tank on the way down is another matter. To date I've only hit one tank ever with the hurri2D's guns. They suck, totally. Some people can do it, I can't. I know a lot of others cannot, as well. Heck I'm a seasoned pilot, but it's only those that know what they're doing that are going to get any kills at all with a stuka tank killer, and those people are just as lethal (if not more so) in the hurri2D which we already have. No reason NOT to add this stuka... eventually.
Just no reason to rush it either. We have more important needs right now.
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I think the G model Stuka didn't have dike brakes, but according to Rudel's Stuka Pilot[/b]
it could absorb many 37mm hits without consequence
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Theoretically so could the hurricane, with its wooden construction.
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So no Ju87 with 37mm. But dive bombing Lanks and La7s with guns are ok to rip open your panzers and tigers. gmafb...
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Krusty,
The 37mm guns on the Ju87G-2 have much, much, much higher armor penetration than the 40mm guns on the Hurri IId. To the point that the 37mm guns will take a Tiger out from the front, through the hull armor, no aiming required.
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Either way, seeing a stuka in the would mean easy kill for us fighter pilots. So bringing in the tank busting stuka doesnt matter to me, its just free pickings.
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Originally posted by Krusty
Not so. You exaggerate the issue. It flies worse than a hurri2D. It's slower, less manuverable, and can't do squat. It has weaker guns with less ammo per gun. The ONLY thing it would have is a dive brake. The rear guns are useless, as in a hurri2D you don't need them (can evade).
Actually, the Ju87D-3 we have in here will out turn pretty much all fighters and the D-3 was the Ju87 that had the worst maneuverability of all the Stukas. The dive brakes were also removed in the G versions, I think the D-5 was the last one to retain them since the Ju87 was no longer considered a dive bomber once it became the primary tank buster in the East.
ack-ack
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Like Karnak said, be it a more crappy plane than the Hurri2D(which, is a fighter, and the Stuka is technically a bomber), or possess less ammo, doesn't matter at all.
Again, the only thing that matters is how well it can do its intended job. If it can do its job so easily as to make a certain portion of the gameplay nigh useless, then it needs to be perked.
Imagine a slow, lumbering 4-engined bomber that carries a nuclear warhead is to be introduced in the game. When the bomb is dropped, it will obliterate everything, be it ground object or a plane in the air, within a 10 mile radius. So, because the bomber is so slow and weak of defense, should it be non-perked? Is it the bomb alone not worth perking?
I don't care squat about how easy it is to kill with fighters. I think from the GV perspective, and that perspective tells me that if there are free Ju87Gs flying around bases, I'm never, ever gonna up a tank to go rush a town or field ever again. I'm gonna up an Ostie, and go hit towns with Osties. All my friends will also be upping Osties, because, there is no reason to ever up a tank at all ----- just like the old, AH1 days. Say adios to the ground war as we know it, and welcome back the old, bland, stale, Ostie swarms.
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Originally posted by Kweassa
Like Karnak said, be it a more crappy plane than the Hurri2D(which, is a fighter, and the Stuka is technically a bomber), or possess less ammo, doesn't matter at all.
Again, the only thing that matters is how well it can do its intended job. If it can do its job so easily as to make a certain portion of the gameplay nigh useless, then it needs to be perked.
Imagine a slow, lumbering 4-engined bomber that carries a nuclear warhead is to be introduced in the game. When the bomb is dropped, it will obliterate everything, be it ground object or a plane in the air, within a 10 mile radius. So, because the bomber is so slow and weak of defense, should it be non-perked? Is it the bomb alone not worth perking?
I don't care squat about how easy it is to kill with fighters. I think from the GV perspective, and that perspective tells me that if there are free Ju87Gs flying around bases, I'm never, ever gonna up a tank to go rush a town or field ever again. I'm gonna up an Ostie, and go hit towns with Osties. All my friends will also be upping Osties, because, there is no reason to ever up a tank at all ----- just like the old, AH1 days. Say adios to the ground war as we know it, and welcome back the old, bland, stale, Ostie swarms.
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LOL Kwessa they do that now with just IL2s upping . Here is the way it goes. 2 scenarios:
1 I see a town flashing but not field. I up an IL2 find a panzer heading twards the town. I make 2 good passes tank dead. Same person does this maybe 2 more times. Now either he ups an osti or moves to another undefended field.
2 a planned attack even numbers of tanks and aa gvs. Thease provide fun fights. This is where i see aa in close procimity to tanks. MUCH MUCh harder to kill tanks. You might get 2 good passes before you get pinnged up enough to take you out of the fight.
So in senario 1 yup it would make it a easyer. But in 2 nahh wont be any easyer.
Bronk
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Panzers unprotected by Ostys and m-16s are dead meat now. I up a ki-84 with 2 x 500 pounders and there is 2 dead panzers. I doubt with the low ammo supply I would get more than 2 dead panzers strafing with the Stuka.
If the Panzers are protected by Ostys, I may still get them with my Ki-84. At least it has speed to give the osty a hard shot.
The low slow Stuka would be an easy kill for the Ltars.
I see no change in the gameplay, other than an interesting addition to the planeset..
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Y'all act like it's freakin' EASY to hit a moving tank. Hell it's hard to hit one standing STILL. Just because "if you hit, you'll do damage" -- that don't mean squat. You still gotta HIT, and it's not easy, screaming down in a dive. Some seem upset that it will kill from any angle -- big whoop. So can the Hurr2D. Hurr2D comes in from the side it can knock out your tracks easy, kill your turret just as easy. Come in from back can kill you outright, kill engine, kill turret. Come in from front can get the odd pilot kill thing, can take out turret. All the while you can be shooting the bugger in your pintle gun (which is highly effective, as of late...).
Fact of the matter is, given 30 rounds in a Hurr2D, people are going to miss over half of them. Same goes for stuka. A select few are "uber leet" and can hit on every pass -- but that's the small minority with freakishly long stick time in tank killing planes. They'll kill you no matter what they're in.
Stuka won't change anything.
My $0.02 (sorry, exact change only)
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Heaven forbid we have tank busters doing their job efficiently against unprotected tank columns.
A JU-87G2 is worse than a guy in a Lanc carpet bombing a group of tanks. At least with the Stuka, they have to target a tank individually and use SKILL to hit them.
I say bring it in, not like the other Stuka will be used anyway.
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Y'all act like it's freakin' EASY to hit a moving tank.
It is easy. It took me about 2 weeks of practice in an IL2 to become proficient at dropping bombs on moving and non moving tanks.
It also helped me learn the HurriD. Btw, the only real disadvantage the HurriD has is speed. It's not fast at all. It does not suffer any maneuvaribility problems at all. Most of the time I can keep up with a Hurri2C.
Kweassa is right. The Ju87 needs to be perked. How much is the real topic of debate. The Ju87 will kill anything it touches. It's not hard to hit a tank, even in my hurriD. However, I need absolute focus and a steady hand to hit the right spots. And even then I need the perfect run to get a straight out instant kill.
This would not be true with the Ju87. The Ju87 that touches a tank will injure it.
However, the Ju87 is very vulnerable in the air. An AAA tank on the ground could easily defend any more tanks (if it's a good shot). Any plane passing in the air could take it out.
So you have to weigh cost vs. Use. I think if you make it 50 perks, people won't take it. If you make it 10, People won't mind losing it and will do things they shouldn't be doing.
I'd say 30-40.
Another point I'd like to make is that the M16 and M3 are almost invulnerable to the Hurricane mk2D. It would also be that way to the Ju87.
The M3 and M16 have a lot of thin armor with nothing important on the other side of the armor. The AP rounds just punch clean holes, no explosions. You need to make a PERFECT shot on either to hit anything important. Also count in how fast they are moving and how easily they can dodge.
You're better off shooting them with .303's.
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If AND ONLY if this plane ever sees the light of the MA, perk it and it will become a hangar queen. The reasoning will be, why up it and waste the perks when I can do the same job with something else. Either that or the perk cost will be so low as to be pointless.
LOL...people act like this lone little plane will be the king of battle or something. As was brought up, a single tank trying to attack a field would get popped. A dedicated force attacking a field would include AA (and probably air cover).
It's just a slow, flimsy, little plane with an awesome set of guns (and very little ammo for those guns). To compare it to a bomber carrying n00ks is ridiculous (besides, in that case I would perk the n00k and not the ride). I seriously doubt that this one plane would totally change the face of the game any more that any other plane (or GV) has and there is no empirical evidence to suggest it would. Assertions are not proof, just assertions.
Bring it and bring it free. If life as we know it in the game for GVs goes down the toilet, then perk it. That takes all of what, 5 minutes and a server reboot?
Anyway, good discussion.
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Originally posted by Nosara
Would it be possible to have this mod for the Stuka. It was the anti tank model that was used to great effect on the Russian front.
Forward guns
ju.87G-1
2×37 mm BK3,7 cannon
Rear guns
2×7.9 mm
Junkers Jumo 1300 hp
"The Stuka's design featured some innovative features, including an automatic pull-up system to ensure that the plane recovered from its attack dive even if the pilot blacked out from the high acceleration, and wind-powered sirens on the wheel covers that wailed during dives to scare its victims."
And please add the wind-powered sirens so that we can let the ground pounders know we are coming...lol
From what I've read this version of the Stuka was a deadly anti-tank variant. Believe they took the dive flaps off too.
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Bring it and bring it free. If life as we know it in the game for GVs goes down the toilet, then perk it. That takes all of what, 5 minutes and a server reboot?
Anyway, good discussion.
So true Blammo! Nothing ventured is nothing gained. Bring it on and if it doesn't work then go back to previous settings
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How would you like your 60 perk tiger to be popped in one shot by a skilless hack who upped a free plane?
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Originally posted by lasersailor184
How would you like your 60 perk tiger to be popped in one shot by a skilless hack who upped a free plane?
Same way when I get shot down in a 262 or a Chog
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Don't confuse luck with skill. It's luck that someone caught you in your 262.
It's not luck or skill that a Ju87 will be able to kill a tiger.
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I can usually get two tank kills a run with the 1000kg bomb and two 250kg bombs that the stuka can carry... I get altitude and drop the 1000kg bomb on the tiger then circle and get altitude again and repeat on smaller targets IE.. panzers and Ostys with the 250kg bomb...
This requires skill and great patience.
I dont see how adding another version of this plane that will take MORE skill and patience will possibly unbalance the game.
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Originally posted by lasersailor184
How would you like your 60 perk tiger to be popped in one shot by a skilless hack who upped a free plane?
I'd say live with it. One of the prices of upping a perked vehicle.
ack-ack
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Ok, yess, a Stuka-G could likely blow away a Tiger from the front. I argue the 'no skill' part, because you need to get close enough to count rivets to do it, but it is still possible...
The way I see it, the people whining about a Stuka-G being too powerful, are probably the ones that dont want to worry about needing air superiority before rolling that expensive tank. Face it, the airplane is the mortal enemy of the tank. Tank drivers here do not know this. I think the Stuka-G is NEEDED to remind them of this fact. :aok
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Anything with a perk price has an advantage over anything that does not.
Mainly, they are hard to kill. Take the 262 for example. It is perked so heavily because it moves so fast. It is hard to catch and kill.
Take the Tempest for example. It is perked higher then the other planes because it moves so fast. It is hard to kill.
Now take the Tiger for example. It is perked so heavily because it is resistant to most bombs and shots. You need to be precise shooting it with another tank or dropping a bomb on it to kill it.
It will take no skill to shoot a Tiger with a Ju87g.
You can try it yourself. Up a Hurricane Mk2D. Fly it out and try to shoot a tank with the 40's. It's easy to hit a tank, but it's hard to do any damage.
This is not true of the Ju87. It will be easy to hit a tank, and WILL do damage.
Remember, the F4u1c was perked because of it's affect on the arena, not because it's a super plane.
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Originally posted by lasersailor184
How would you like your 60 perk tiger to be popped in one shot by a skilless hack who upped a free plane?
Sorry, I don't think a "skilless hack" will be able to do much more than crash next to the 60 perk tiger.
Besides, all of this is just guesstimation until and if the plane (and weapon system) is ever modeled in the game. I still don't see anything to suggest that 1) it will dramatically alter the land warfare game and 2) should be perked out of the gate. Let it be modeled. Let it be tried out in the MA and if everything the FEAR THE STUKA[/u][/i] crowd has been saying is true, then perk it.
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Blammo, take any plane in existance in AH. Shoot at a tank, even a moving tank.
It takes no skill to actually hit it.
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So take a buddy with you in an Ostie to make sure that super uber dangerous "I have to laugh at this" Stuka doesn't kill you in your perked uber Tiger tank. Stuka's not that hard to hit and it's doesn't take allot of hits to bring it down. How fat does a Stuka go anyway? 250ish in a dive with a strong tail wind? You want to perk this thing?????
Dude puff puff pass, your smoking too much of something!!!!
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Originally posted by lasersailor184
Blammo, take any plane in existance in AH. Shoot at a tank, even a moving tank.
It takes no skill to actually hit it.
I think you have forgotten when you were new to the game. It comes second nature to you now because you are used to doing it. To someone who is new, even if they hit the tank they are likely to auger. Besides, any tank out there my itself without AA and/or air cover is just waiting to die anyway...Tiger or not. By the same token, any Stuka that ups on it's own is just waiting to die (and it probably will to someone's pintle gun).
EDIT: Been reading up on that gun. If modeled correctly they will still have to hit the tank right. They will have a lot more room for error, but even these guns don't assure a kill for any given attack run. As a matter of record, even with these guns the Stukas would flow over the front line and attack enemy tanks from the year. Granted, that made it more likely they would get home, but it was also done because they were more likely to get a kill on a tank that way.
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Originally posted by lasersailor184
Blammo, take any plane in existance in AH. Shoot at a tank, even a moving tank.
It takes no skill to actually hit it.
Don't blame the Stuka pilot because you couldn't be bothered to bring any AA assets or have air cover for your GVs.
You don't want the Stuka to blow up your precious Tiger while you spawn camp? Have a squadron mate spawn a AA GV to provide protection or *GASP* have them provide on over head CAP. Ju87s are only effective if they can enjoy local air superiority. It was true back then during the war and the same axiom holds today in the MA.
ack-ack
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Interesting read: http://www.studenten.net/customasp/axl/profile.asp?cat_id=10&ple_id=103 (http://www.studenten.net/customasp/axl/profile.asp?cat_id=10&ple_id=103)
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You keep assuming too much Ack Ack. My favorite ride is the Hurricane Mk2D.
Though that doesn't mean I'm not aware of what would happen.
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Originally posted by lasersailor184
You keep assuming too much Ack Ack. My favorite ride is the Hurricane Mk2D.
And that is supposed to prove what?
ack-ack
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Originally posted by Ack-Ack
And that is supposed to prove what?
ack-ack
Camels live in Europe!!! Duh!
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I can disable up to 8-10 panzers in IL2/sortie, (or track 1-2 tigers ) with cannons only,
tips :
1.---hit them in turet from above, from 45 degrees or higher ungle
2. FIRE CANNONS ONLY, cuz the balistic is different, you never know when you hit with cannon or mgs if you fire both ,