Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: deSelys on October 10, 2005, 04:44:59 AM
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I've always wanted to shoot and own a "scout rifle".
I can buy through a colleague a K31 swiss rifle for what seems a reasonable price: 250€
It is still legal in Belgium to buy this kind of weapon without any authorization, but the law is about to change (not in the easy direction) and I don't want to wait too long.
As I'm looking for a sturdy, uber-reliable and reasonably accurate rifle, is this a good choice? Does the price seem right to you?
Thanks in advance.
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If I'm thinking about the right gun (6.5mm caliber?) then I guess that price seems about right. I think they go from 150-250 here depending on quality.
I'd guess because of supply and demand, the price would be a little higher over there.
I'd say go for it.
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I am not a rifleman but do know this... All swiss rifles are accurate and well made. These guys love their rifles.
If the law changes.... How long before the rifle you buy now is confiscated anyway?
lazs
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Lasersailor, the caliber is 7.5x55mm swiss.
Lazs,
The next change in the law is that I'll need an authorization to own a rifle. Not hard to get if you have a clean criminal record and if you're member of a shooting range, but some red tape and a 3 months waiting period.
I don't think that a complete ban is in the works (yet). I also don't think that it would be a good thing.
If that happens someday, I'll just remember what the president of the french hunting association answered to a journalist about law restriction. Basically, he said that during the 40-44 german occupation of France, having any gun was punished by death penalty. Well, there weren't much french hunters who weren't able to hunt a couple of days after the germans left. Then he said to the journalist that the french government shouldn't have too much faith in laws restricting gun ownership
;)
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Originally posted by lazs2
I am not a rifleman but do know this... All swiss rifles are accurate and well made. These guys love their rifles.
If the law changes.... How long before the rifle you buy now is confiscated anyway?
lazs
The Swiss make the best anything when it comes to weapons. Ironic, eh?
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I know 7.5x55mm ammo is not too plentiful over in the States. I'm assuming the supplies are a bit more plentiful in your area. From all I have read on the Mosin Nagant boards I read, many people love their K31's that they also have.
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If yer hung up on the K31, eyeball a K31/55 before you commit. Several needed modern upgrades (1950's) to the rather 'dated' original design and reported accurate at 800 yards. Shorter than the standard K-31, and usually always comes with the very fine Kern scope.
If yah like bolt action scout carbines, the K31/55 is an excellent weapon for europe. As marakov notes, ammo's pretty pricey for it here, and not abundantly available. In my mind, availability and price of ammo is a big part of weapon selection. ;)
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Originally posted by AdmRose
The Swiss make the best anything when it comes to weapons. Ironic, eh?
Comes with the mindset. Last time I checked a swiss's closet there was an arsenal in there. The price for neutrality and national survival was an extremely well armed populace. ;)
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Originally posted by AdmRose
The Swiss make the best anything when it comes to weapons. Ironic, eh?
Same goes for the Swedes.
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Err, 7.5. That's what I meant to say. :rolleyes:
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Thanks for your replies.
Ammo is plentiful here, and not too pricey: .35$ / cartridge
I'll try it tomorrow evening and then make my decision.
I'll post pics if I buy it.
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rosie... why would it be ironic that a nation of riflemen would produce fine rifles?
lazs
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Can you buy a BAR?
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It is theoretically possible to buy a BAR (without the full auto mode), but it is classified as a 'war firearm' and to get a permit you'll need a lot of patience because you'll have to go to the seventh circle of bureaucracy hell and back. Although the law doesn't forbid you to own a full auto firearm as long as you answer to the conditions, governors don't deliver permits for this kind of weapons anymore. They don't answer NO to your request, they just don't answer at all (and don't break the law by doing so).
If you want it able to shoot full auto, you'll need to know some friend of the governor... Democracy at its best.
For some weird reason, the K31 is not classified as a 'war firearm' but as a 'sport and hunting firearm'. I want to make good use of this error before they correct the law text ;-)
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Originally posted by lazs2
rosie... why would it be ironic that a nation of riflemen would produce fine rifles?
lazs
The Swiss producing the best weapons in the world is kinda like an atheist when they die - all dressed up and no place to go.
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mayhaps your impressions of the swiss is incomplete.
That happy little nation was the one european nation that was able to rid itself of it's king and establish a republic that stuck. It's mercenary army was fearsome 200 years ago, and it's modern national sovreginty never sullied by a succesful invasion.
And it's because Switzerland maintains 100% of it's male population trained and armed, at all times, by law. Every single male of military age is a trained soldier; always on call, he keeps his squad loadout and weapon in his closet at home. He's well versed in modern small unit tactics, guerilla warfare and the mountainous terran he lives in is his expected battlefield. He will be fighting for his home and his family, his town, his prefect and his nation.
He would be a very very dangerous adversary.
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Up until recently Switzerland had some of the least gun control and least crime. I believe it was actually law that all men had to have a rifle and be proficient in it.
But the swiss were never warlike. They had the guns for defense and defense only.
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Not only do they all have rifles, every single household has a FULL AUTO rifle. By law. And every citizen is required to serve in the military. The Swiss are proof positive that Education is the key to fewer deaths and less violence involving firearms. Not silly gun control laws.
Who do you think guards the Vatican?
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The Vaticainians, of course.
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rosie... are you thinking of the swedes? What exactly do you mean?
lazs
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The key here is that every single male goes through military training.
My dad has maintained for years that everyone should have to do a minimum of 2 years active duty in the US. Get em right out of high school, teach em right.
Also by the time the've done their service, they'll have a much better idea of what they want out of life & how to go get it.
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Your dad and I would get along fine, Ghosth. I'd go so far as to add that any citizen that serves should be Tax exempt for as long as he/she serves.
How's this one... No immigrant should receive citizenship without public or military service, minimum 3 years.
But that's just me.
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Originally posted by Ghosth
My dad has maintained for years that everyone should have to do a minimum of 2 years active duty in the US. Get em right out of high school, teach em right.
Your Dad sounds like a smart man.:aok
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While this writeup may be slightly biased, its pretty good at sticking to the facts, and does provide a great deal of history and insight into the Swiss model. Very weak central govt, alot of responsibility on the individual, and a lifetime of service.
http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3ae771eb4adb.htm
Anyway, enough of the hijack. As to the original question, my only concern would have been ammo availability, and that has been covered. The only other guns that might be considered along with the K31 for reliability, accuracy, etc. are the 8mm Mauser rifles, and the 7.39x54 Russian bolt actions, preferably the M38 if you are wanting the shorter rifle. If you go that route just stay away from the Russian military ammo.