Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Yoda on July 07, 2001, 02:48:00 AM
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LOL! WTF?! Yeah, here's a million for letting us stay at the luxurious facilities in China because you rammed our plane. http://www.cnn.com/2001/US/07/06/china.us.plane/index.html (http://www.cnn.com/2001/US/07/06/china.us.plane/index.html) :rolleyes:
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HO Dweebs!!
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For as close as they get, EP-3's can't run away fast enough. Been that way for years. If one is going to operate that low and that slow, a bit more buffer is a good idea.
The other obvious fact is that the Chinese and North Koreans still don't "play the Recon game" the way the rest of the world does. Time to revert to the old method of reacting to their reaction.
As for paying them... as one government official said it's nice to see they have a sense of humor.
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In another story (http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/ap/20010707/ts/us_china.html):
Zhang Yuan Yuan, the spokesman at the Chinese Embassy, said he had no idea where the $1 million figure came from. He said the two sides will hold talks to decide on an appropriate compensation figure.
Once again, a lame bellybutton attempt by the media to create news when there is none.
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Im only familiar with Philippine HO's, but I can assure you it's a mutual respect thing, well worth it, and in contrast, $10 was well worth it.
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Simple question,
what would the us do to an chinese spy plane outside the US coast?
really curious for the answer (cincerely)
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Hmm, Yoda...
Why not?
They lost a pilot, and it's hard to define a cost of human life...
Maniac, I am 100% sure they will do the same things as Chineese do, or that Soviet VVS have done to Sweedish P-3s in late-80s (I hope you remember - there also was one collision, but everyone returned to base).
And I am 250% sure that the hysteria that could start if only it was a US pilot that died in a collision with a Chineese spyplane should rock the whole world, including mr. president shaking his nukes and the whole mess of "democracy" slogans and other "whothehellaretheseyellowbasta rds" screams under the flag of "democracy" and "freedom".
When I look at he current American media - I think that Soviet propaganda machine really sucked.
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I wouldn't be surprised if they did have planes flying off the US coast. The USSR did for 20+ years. I don't remember any US planes ramming them.
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We've been over that "off the US coast" issue in great detail back when the incident happened. The threads are still there.
The Russians flew Recon aircraft off the East Coast of the US routinely. They flew off the Alaskan area routinely. They got off course; they got short of fuel. The US never shot one down or even shot AT one to my knowledge.
There's also links that describe the two DOCUMENTED times that Soviet recon aircraft landed at US air bases. They were refueled, the crew was fed and they were sent on their way.
So, now you know what would happen.
You are aware that the Mainland Chinese fly recon off Taiwan and the Phillipines aren't you? They don't have any truly long-range airborne recon platforms however.
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Originally posted by Boroda:
Hmm, Yoda...
Why not?
They lost a pilot, and it's hard to define a cost of human life...
And I am 250% sure that the hysteria that could start if only it was a US pilot that died in a collision with a Chineese spyplane should rock the whole world, including mr. president shaking his nukes and the whole mess of "democracy" slogans and other "whothehellaretheseyellowbasta rds" screams under the flag of "democracy" and "freedom".
When I look at he current American media - I think that Soviet propaganda machine really sucked.
They lost a pilot who was too cocky and got rammed at the E-3 since he was flying too close.
Could been as well dead E-3 too.
so, one crazy idiot less...
(I don't really believe that E-3 would ram a fighter unless the fighter comes too close, which they are not supposed to do)
So, you wan't to talk about that if it would been US fighter ramming chinese surveillance plane?
Well, you can see what media boom went on when those sloppy u-boat wannabe folks sunk the japanese ship with their nuclear submarine.
Boroda.. just look at yourself and you'll see effects of Soviet propaganda, hehe ;)
Just look at that how anti-US / Western you are at the moment, you don't seem to realise that there was fault in chinese too.
(at least so I take it, after what I've read)
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Boroda
You can't cause an accident then ask for compensation. We should charge them for our plane & time then have the crew sue them for mental anguish. I'm sure Johny Cochran would take the case :)
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Well, I have read evidences that US interceptors collided with Soviet recon Tu-95s in North Atlantic.
I still think that both sies are to blame in this accident. I can unerstand Chinese side trying to push forward it's version, that logicaly finishes in US compensation to China.
About propaganda - I have to say once again that US media that I see is unbelievably similiar to Soviet "developed socialism" period press. The only problem is that we hadd shortwave radios and listened to the Western POV, both in Russian (Radio Liberty, BBC Russian service, Deutche Welle, Voise of America) and native English radio stations. And now we have the Net :)
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Originally posted by Boroda:
Well, I have read evidences that US interceptors collided with Soviet recon Tu-95s in North Atlantic.
I still think that both sies are to blame in this accident.
1. Got any details? Anyone hurt? Anyone crash? Dates? Would appreciate reading such information.
2. The P-3 wasn't doing anything the "major powers" hadn't been doing for years. Russians, US, British... these three for certain and a probably a few others as well... have done and in some cases still do exactly what the P-3 was doing.
Recon prevents more problems than it produces. Believe it. Discoveries are made and solutions achieved in quiet diplomacy that avoid the confrontations that can escalate.
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Actually, what happens when planes are near the US is similar to what happened in this incident. A couple US fighters form up on the plane and escort it as long as it's near US airspace. I think there's a picture of 2 F15's escorting a TU85 (or whatever the designation for that big prop Soviet bomber was) in Modern Air Combat.
It's tragic what happened near China. No more needs to be said about it, however. It's been hashed and rehashed.
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those chi-com bastards
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What Eagler said. It would be like if I ran a red light, and crashed into someone else's car. Then, my family gives the people I hit a bill for hitting me. It's just silly.
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This is what happens when a 3rd rate country tries to act like a 1st rate country. :p
BOYCOTT CHINA!
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You guys need a good director to make you shout in tune.
Repeat after me:
CHI-NA! MUST-DIE!!!
CHI-NA! MUST-DIE!!!
CHI-NA! MUST-DIE!!!
BOY-COTT! CHI-NA!!!
BOY-COTT! CHI-NA!!!
BOY-COTT! CHI-NA!!!
CHI-COMS! CHI-COMS!
CHI-COMS! CHI-COMS!
CHI-COMS! CHI-COMS!
HA-RE!!! RA-MA!!!
HA-RE! KRISH-NA!!!
HA-RE!!! RA-MA!!!
Oh, sorry! ;)
:) :) :)
Better find a good company and get a few drinks :)
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Now - seriously.
Toad, I have heard and read many stories about US fighters intercepting Soviet recon planes. One of them described the carrier-born F-4 colliding with Tu-95, losing it's V-stab and destroying one of the engines. Certainly noone knew what happened to the Phantom pilot, but Tushka returned to base on Kola noodlesula "on a wing and a prayer" (In Russian that song was translated as "On a promise and a last wing", performed by Utyosov's jazz in 1944). That Tu-95 was performing a reconmissionagainst a US CV group in Northern Atlantic.
There were many stories about Tu-95 crews, probably the most stunning was about an inflight refueling accident, when the flexible refueling tube was torn away from the tanker and started beating on a Tu's wings and fuselage, almost destroying a tail-gunner cabin... That guys RTBed too...
I absolutely agree with you about the recon flights, but in this accident I still think that BOTH sides are to blame.
And now ;) - another provocation:
What happened to the EP-3 crew? Were they punished for landing a top-secret plane at the enemy base? Any Russian crew should have tried to reach friendly base or land on water...
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So, to be consistent then, blame also lies with any Russian recon aircraft that was involved in a collision with a US aircraft?
As for the EP-3 crew, you know what happened. All I can say is (puts on "old-timers hat") in my day we would not have landed in ANY "enemy" base. Orders were to ditch in deep water.
These young kids! :rolleyes:
;)
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Exactly so, Toad!
The only difference is that such accidents were reasonabely covered by our countries military and media. And we definetly didn't have opportunities to exchange opinions with our opponents personally. ;)
As for orders - I hate such things, but sometimes "so much depends on so few"... Indeed, poor young men :(
Looks like I have problems with English spelling after 4AM. Need to read some books. Last time I have read an English book from beginning to an end was probably 4-5 years ago. I know my English is funny for you, but these flightsim boards are my only "writing" practice in 12 years. :(
BTW, I saw that famous photo of F-15s escorting a Tu-95 near Cuba in an "Aviation Week" 1985-87, can't remember the exact time. My Father's istitute (26th NII VVS, Balashikha) was subscribed to such magazines, but they were stamped "classified"...
Funny. Me, a son of a Soviet military scientist, visited US in 1989 as an exchange student, and our trip from St.Louis to Florida, including a visit to a Kennedy Space Cetnre was sponsored by McDonnel-Douglas... At the very same time my Father worked on a launch facility for Buran...
Sorry, 5AM here, have to go to sleep a while :)
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Well, I still disagree with you Boroda. Slower aircraft always have the right of way. :)
At least you are consistent!
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Toad, in this kind of game the one that has nerves has the right of way. The way to RTB or to go down in wrecks.
This almost-realtime conversation made me switch from beer with salted fish (vobla) to Coke with pure ethanol and sweet snacks. Please, don't take me seriously %)
Tomorrow I'll have to work. Does anyone know is it possible to use a one D-Link DFE570TX 4-port PCI Server Card as 4 Tulip cards under Linux? :)