Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Skilless on November 03, 2005, 02:29:30 PM
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See Rule #5, #15
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My daughter is starting out in her working life. Wall mart is very good for her.
lazs
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The article pretty much hits the nail on the head, and is the prime reason why I refuse to shop there.
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See Rule #6
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In a town like mine it's almost impossible not to shop there. After they drove the local record shop out of business, I went in to the local "SUPER CENTER" to get a lopy of Radiohead's cd "Pablo Honey". It's an older album and I didn't expect them to have it in stock so when they didn't I wasn't surprised. I asked the clerk if I could order it and she LAUGHED AT ME! She told me, and I quote, "We only get what the vendor sends us honey."
Americans have confused value with cheap prices and the vicious cycle that a bullying retailer has creates with jobs and choices for the consumer will be felt for generations to come.
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See Rule #4
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With the spotty selection Wal Mart carries in their music dept. if they put a local store out of business, then the local store already had problems. Wal Mart coexists in several markets with niche stores that either duplicate Wal Mart departments or complement them. Music stores are a perfect example, video is another. Wal Mart's prices are great if they have it. But they also dont carry "adult" versions of albums with questionable lyrics, and the movies may not be the best version available.
To simply say Wal Mart puts locals out of business is a stretch, at best.
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Without as many exclamation points as the post two spaces above this one, I have to say I'm surprised that a PBS link classifies as trolling too.
Perhaps it's because you just posted the link without saying anything?
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INexplicable.....
:huh
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LMAO Skilless and WalMart in the same sentence... who'd a thunk it?
:confused:
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"Along with other giant retailers such as Best Buy and Target, Wal-Mart willingly loses money selling CDs for less than $10 (they buy most hit CDs from distributors for around $12). These companies use bargain CDs to lure consumers to the store, hoping they might also grab a boombox or a DVD player while checking out the music deals."
http://www.rollingstone.com/news/story/_/id/6558540/thekillers?pageid=rs.Home&pageregion=single1&rnd=1097616001120&has-player=unknown
They sell products at a loss to drive out competition, and get you in the store in hopes you will buy something else.
Wal-Mart recently lobbied (and failed) to get the Federal transportation laws changed so that it could allow its truck drivers to work 16-hour days instead of the current Federal restriction of 14 hours. All in the name of lower prices.
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Originally posted by StarOfAfrica2
With the spotty selection Wal Mart carries in their music dept. if they put a local store out of business, then the local store already had problems.
To simply say Wal Mart puts locals out of business is a stretch, at best.
A record store makes it's money by selling massive amounts of Britney Spears and Garth Brookes CDs, not by selling a few Radiohead CDs. In comes Wal-Mart with Britney Spears CDs as far as the eye can see for two dollars less and the local record shop is left selling a few Radiohead CDs.
Can you see the financial implications?
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See Rule #4
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Originally posted by Skilless
See Rule #4
Skuzzy always locks threads that just have a URL and says "Discuss". Don't take it personally. ;)
Consider it a learning experience.
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See Rule #4
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Originally posted by Skilless
A record store makes it's money by selling massive amounts of Britney Spears and Garth Brookes CDs, not by selling a few Radiohead CDs. In comes Wal-Mart with Britney Spears CDs as far as the eye can see for two dollars less and the local record shop is left selling a few Radiohead CDs.
Can you see the financial implications?
Sure I do. But what I'm saying is, every town I've ever lived in has had its Wal Mart, sometimes more than one, and the local stores still manage to do business. Sometimes it means specializing, or expanding. Many of them do a good business in used CDs, but alot of them make their money on LPs. Stuff in good condition goes for big bucks to collectors. You get the reputation as being the place to go for hard to find music, people dont bother to go to Wal Mart and dig for an hour through their confusing and rarely in order music section. Local stores often work with local radio as well, hosting remotes and providing space for concert ads (which Wal Mart will NEVER do), even album signings if you are lucky enough. There is plenty of money to be made in the low volume approach, if you market yourself right.
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There's a new BLACK FRIDAY strategy...
Wal-mart will sell $398 laptop PC and a $3 coffemaker!:eek:
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Originally posted by StarOfAfrica2
To simply say Wal Mart puts locals out of business is a stretch, at best.
Wal-Mart is able to sell products at a price that is LESS than what local businesses are able to BUY them. This happened to my local bike shop. Wal-Mart can do this because they have exclusive contracts with manufacturers and negotiate the price beforehand.
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OT: A thread started with nothing more than some links is not a discussion. It is a troll.
I left it open so it might recover. Nothing wrong with the topic. Skilless, if you want to discuss this topic, then please do so, but continued personal attacks will open a door you do not want to open.
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Originally posted by Mickey1992
Wal-Mart is able to sell products at a price that is LESS than what local businesses are able to BUY them. This happened to my local bike shop. Wal-Mart can do this because they have exclusive contracts with manufacturers and negotiate the price beforehand.
Then Mickey, your local bike shop was handling the wrong brands.
You want a cheapo bike for your kid? Go to Wal Mart, sure. You want a quality bike thats going to hold up over time? You might try Wal Mart once or twice, but you learn quick enough you go to a real bike shop. Wal Mart negotiates contracts and prices with a limited number of manufacturers. A VERY limited number. Again, if your local store was trying to sell the bicycle version of Britney CDs, no wonder they went out of business competing with Wally world.
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Originally posted by StarOfAfrica2
Sure I do. But what I'm saying is, every town I've ever lived in has had its Wal Mart, sometimes more than one, and the local stores still manage to do business. Sometimes it means specializing, or expanding. Many of them do a good business in used CDs, but alot of them make their money on LPs. Stuff in good condition goes for big bucks to collectors. You get the reputation as being the place to go for hard to find music, people dont bother to go to Wal Mart and dig for an hour through their confusing and rarely in order music section. Local stores often work with local radio as well, hosting remotes and providing space for concert ads (which Wal Mart will NEVER do), even album signings if you are lucky enough. There is plenty of money to be made in the low volume approach, if you market yourself right.
I don't think you've lived in a truly small, rural community. All of these things you speak of are unheard of here, a town of less than 5,000 year round residents, but we have our super center and we have our Rite Aid, and the last locally owned drug store went under a couple of months ago. The pharmacist who used to own it works at Wal-mart now.
The Super Center idea is so all-incompassing that it touches almost every corner of the community. You can walk in and do your grocery shopping, buy a TV, and get your hair cut.
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Originally posted by Mickey1992
Wal-Mart is able to sell products at a price that is LESS than what local businesses are able to BUY them. This happened to my local bike shop. Wal-Mart can do this because they have exclusive contracts with manufacturers and negotiate the price beforehand.
No, Walmart can do this because people continue to shop there.
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Originally posted by StarOfAfrica2
Then Mickey, your local bike shop was handling the wrong brands.
You want a cheapo bike for your kid? Go to Wal Mart, sure. You want a quality bike thats going to hold up over time? You might try Wal Mart once or twice, but you learn quick enough you go to a real bike shop. Wal Mart negotiates contracts and prices with a limited number of manufacturers. A VERY limited number. Again, if your local store was trying to sell the bicycle version of Britney CDs, no wonder they went out of business competing with Wally world.
Our local Super Center carries very nice looking Mongoose and Schwinn bicycles. The point is that Wal-Mart is selling the brand names that people want to see at prices that are rediculously low. Who can resist the 42" plasma made by 12 year-old chinese girls earning 50 cents an hour that Wal-Mart is selling for $1700?
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They are putting up 2 super walmarts in our town. My wife thinks it's freakin disneyland!
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Do they have stores outside the US ?
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I occasionally go to Walmart. Hell, I only occasionally go shopping in the first place.
Usually its for pants, maybe a shirt but I prefer Target for shirts. Anyway, looking through their pants section - I find maybe four pairs of pants my size - 32 waist. All the other pairs aren't even close. It isn't a slow gradual climb of 34s, 36s - no. It instantly jumps to 38+ and the 42+ waist with 30 inseams are 97% of the pants.
Apparently fat tulips are Walmart's core shoppers.
-SW
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Originally posted by Nilsen
Do they have stores outside the US ?
Absolutely. About a year ago, there was an item in the news about Wal-Mart putting one of their stores next to an ancient mayan pyramid, which I guess created some discontent with the people who lived nearby.
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Originally posted by Skilless
I don't think you've lived in a truly small, rural community. All of these things you speak of are unheard of here, a town of less than 5,000 year round residents, but we have our super center and we have our Rite Aid, and the last locally owned drug store went under a couple of months ago. The pharmacist who used to own it works at Wal-mart now.
The Super Center idea is so all-incompassing that it touches almost every corner of the community. You can walk in and do your grocery shopping, buy a TV, and get your hair cut.
My friend, the town I grew up in was so small if you blinked you'd miss it. Population of around 500 people. On a good day. The nearest big town (about 7-10,000 people) was about 15-20 minutes away. Only record store for ........... probably 80 miles. Main St. Records. When Wal Mart came, it hurt them. They darn near went out of business. But they did exactly the things I described. The place has something of the feel of a headshop and a Tower Records, mixed with the Mayberry garage. But it works.
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Originally posted by Nilsen
Do they have stores outside the US ?
Canada is in the process of kicking them out because Wal-Mart refuses to allow it's employees-I mean "associates"-to organize.
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Originally posted by Skilless
Our local Super Center carries very nice looking Mongoose and Schwinn bicycles. The point is that Wal-Mart is selling the brand names that people want to see at prices that are rediculously low. Who can resist the 42" plasma made by 12 year-old chinese girls earning 50 cents an hour that Wal-Mart is selling for $1700?
If you check with Schwinn, Wal Mart is not allowed to sell their bicycles in any market that competes directly with an established Schwinn dealer. Reason? Schwinn licensed retailers also perform warranty repairs. Wal Mart doesnt, nor are the bicycles purchased from Wal Mart eligible for such repair.
Schwinn isnt stupid.
This is retarded. I dont even like Wal Mart and yet here I am defending them. Or rather, I'm pointing out the holes in your arguments. Wal Mart has a marketing strategy that works. It doesnt cover every base though. There is always room for competition, even though existing business may have to adjust to fit into the new markets that Wal Mart leaves.
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Originally posted by StarOfAfrica2
My friend, the town I grew up in was so small if you blinked you'd miss it. Population of around 500 people. On a good day. The nearest big town (about 7-10,000 people) was about 15-20 minutes away. Only record store for ........... probably 80 miles. Main St. Records. When Wal Mart came, it hurt them. They darn near went out of business. But they did exactly the things I described. The place has something of the feel of a headshop and a Tower Records, mixed with the Mayberry garage. But it works.
If that store were around here, there would be me and about five other people that would frequent it. Specialty shops don't work in this kind of small market. Most people don't care enough to demand a special haircut or that out-of-print Santana album, so the salons make their money from people who "just need a haircut", and the record shops (used to) make their profits from the latest Garth Brooks CD, so the mentality is, "why should I make an appointment at the salon, when I can walk into Wal-Mart and pay 2 dollars less?"
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we deliver produce to wal-mart d.c's on the east coast from california and arizona. on my side they are a good place to go to. you know when you close the back doors when you delivery appointment is and currently (11-03-05) they are paying 5,500 usd fom arizona to henderson, n.c. ya the music selection isnt that good. smaller mom and pop stores may close. but its sure is nice not going to miami or nyc
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Whats better then.. Bestbuy?
The last Bestbuy I visited, was two days later shot up by a guy with an assault rifle.
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Originally posted by StarOfAfrica2
This is retarded. I dont even like Wal Mart and yet here I am defending them. Or rather, I'm pointing out the holes in your arguments. Wal Mart has a marketing strategy that works. It doesnt cover every base though. There is always room for competition, even though existing business may have to adjust to fit into the new markets that Wal Mart leaves.
You're right, they don't cover every base. That is why after they drive the local competition out, consumer choice goes right out the window.
I agree with the theory you are proposing. The reality I see around me however, says otherwise. Since Rite Aid, Home Depot, and Wal-mart have come to town, almost every drug store, hardware store, and retail store has gone under. The grocery stores are the only ones that are holding their own.
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Originally posted by AKS\/\/ulfe
Apparently fat tulips are Walmart's core shoppers.
-SW
:rofl That's awesome. Have you ever tried buying 34 waist and 36 or 38 legs though? That is a wild goose chase right there.
Oh and Wal Mart sucks and I shop there. Heck a girl in my English class, her brother, mother, and father ALL work at Wal Mart, they recently went on a trip to Hawaii, I didn't think wally world payed THAT well.
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Originally posted by midnight Target
They are putting up 2 super walmarts in our town. My wife thinks it's freakin disneyland!
They're going to close the one WallyWorld we have here in town and replace it with one of the Super WalMarts.
I'm never setting foot in it.
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Originally posted by Sandman
They're going to close the one WallyWorld we have here in town and replace it with one of the Super WalMarts.
I'm never setting foot in it.
That's another gripe I have with them. Instead of building on and expanding their old stores, they build entirely new ones and leave the old ones empty. Our old Wal-mart has sat empty for over two tyears now.
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The WalMart Supercenters are worse than the regular WallyWorld. They have more sections, but a smaller selection in each section. They also have the checkerless checkout, for the absolute minimum customer service possible on the planet.
They opened a new Stuporcenter in the neighboring town from my store. Our sales were down for 2 weeks, now they are stronger than before. There are certain items that I saw declines in like soap and paper, but my grocery departments were way up.
I kept hearing the same thing over and over, poor customer service and poor selection. We do custom meat cutting, special order grocery items, carry out and home delivery. They can't touch my customer service.
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Originally posted by Skilless
That's another gripe I have with them. Instead of building on and expanding their old stores, they build entirely new ones and leave the old ones empty. Our old Wal-mart has sat empty for over two tyears now.
Good reason for it too. I used to work on a remodel crew for Wal mart.
When they started out, they were big on expansion but didnt have the money they do today. Alot of the older Wal Marts were anchors at small malls and shopping centers, occupying pre-existing buildings and leasing them. As time went on, and they started making more money, they began seeing the benefit in owning the land and the buildings. So they began phasing out the old style stores and buying the land to for the "upgrade".
Not that they still didnt make money off the leases, alot of the properties of the old lease stores were owned by relatives of the Waltons. But thats why they leave the old stores and build new ones.
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google "girls of walmart", with safesearch off ;)
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Originally posted by Mickey1992
"Along with other giant retailers such as Best Buy and Target, Wal-Mart willingly loses money selling CDs for less than $10 (they buy most hit CDs from distributors for around $12). These companies use bargain CDs to lure consumers to the store, hoping they might also grab a boombox or a DVD player while checking out the music deals."
http://www.rollingstone.com/news/story/_/id/6558540/thekillers?pageid=rs.Home&pageregion=single1&rnd=1097616001120&has-player=unknown
They sell products at a loss to drive out competition, and get you in the store in hopes you will buy something else.
Wal-Mart recently lobbied (and failed) to get the Federal transportation laws changed so that it could allow its truck drivers to work 16-hour days instead of the current Federal restriction of 14 hours. All in the name of lower prices.
mickey this is common practice with alot of stores and a good business policy. I'm not talking about regularly taking a loss on items on purpose but advertised sales of big items bring people into the store. Once you have them there that's half the battle won. I'd venture to say 9 out of 10 people would not go to wall-mart JUST to buy ONE CD. That's like going to home depot to save a buck or two on ONE 2x4.
RPM,
I've allways said people are willing to pay for quality. I'd much rather shop at a butcher that offered better services and finer quality of meat than save $0.10 a lb on my ribs.
This is yet another reason I'd rather shop at a target. Target stores are allways so much cleaner than a walmart or Kmart. The staff is usually nicer and a ton more helpfull.
I have to admit I miss a lot of the ACE hardwares that have closed. They allways had that one old guy that was probably a retiree that would walk you around the entire store getting you what you needed from each dept. You wont find that, or much else good help at home depot or lowes.
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See the new JibJab for commentary on this issue....
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Originally posted by lazs2
My daughter is starting out in her working life. Wall mart is very good for her.
lazs
Do you mind me asking how old she is? It has nothing to do with anything... but that question just exploded in my head, for a reason I'm sure I'll figure out later.
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RPM,
Your post must be in error. You see walmart is teh EVIL and you cannot possibly compete or survive as a business when one moves into your area. Obviously your coming bankruptcy has totally unhinged you. Sad:cry
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West Sacramento. Population at the time I took my seat on the Planning Commission, just over 31k.
We sit in between 2 thriving markets. Downtown Sacramento and Natomas. Both have ample retail, both strong draws that each claim revenue from my zip code.
Other outlying areas like Davis and Woodland also have thriving retail.
We, on the other hand, had squat. Our local shops were drying on the vine as it was far too inconvienient to shop in town. Most of what you wanted could not be purchased here. No TVs, Clothes, anything major. We had Food and your basic Rite Aid along with a small office supply store.
After incorporation, the City spent years trying to beef up retail but the bottom line was, it wasn't going to come.
Those who worked would shop in the outlying areas for the bulk of their needs, and it just wasn't practicle to buy Most of what you wanted, then drop by the local store to buy the notebook or pencil, they were starving for years. The only game in town, but nobody played.
Outreach to the retailers showed that they could not justify coming to our City as their was not enough population to justify the cost of building. They already got our money, in the neighboring town's stores, so why bother.
We went to the community and explained that the retail they wanted needed bodies, and we showed that we could develop the outlying areas that were pretty much growing hay for the past 20 years, with manageable impacts to our roadway system.
This community had been left dormant by the County for over 40 years, and was in much need of improvements across the board, there was no existing retail that had a large enough base to draw the improvement funds from, so growth was accepted. 5 Years to design a well balanced plan.
One of the Key Ingredients during this was my insistance that any and all development Improve existing conditions, or it was not acceptable. One of the First concerns was our existing mom and pop shops that would, by all arguments, get eaten alive by the new stores that came in. Our mom and pops specialized, the mass marketers had cheaper versions of their products, so damage was envisioned at a massive scale.
One of the community leaders and small shop owners had me speak at the Kiwanis club, and explain how I thought growing and bringing new business to town, like a Target or Walmart, could Possibly be a benefit to the people who have held on so long by a shoestring.
I explained that they were starving. The streets during work hours were empty, Lunch time they swelled, only to empty out again after 1. Nights were Dead, everyone went home. In between this time everyone was out shopping near their jobs and were going home loaded up at night, bypassing the very inconvienient mom and pops around town.
The idea was to keep people Home, take away their reason to shop elsewhere. By increasing the population and attracting the larger retailers, we would provide the means to shop Locally, and be much more convenient to the public. They had but a few years left to stay in business at their current rate of withering, so a solid investment in the City Improvements would lift everyones impression of our town, thereby increasing the availability and desireability of our shops.
Fast Forward.
West Sacramento "was" the blight of Northern California.
Today, it is one of the top few National Markets for Home Investment. We have the Largest Employment to Resident Ratio in the State. We have Strong Independant Grocers as well as a huge and thriving Union Base Manufacturing Center.
The California Fuel Cell Partnership is located here. Residential impact fees has spurred roadway improvement and school investment like the area has never seen.
Major League Ball Park to house the Rivercats, the Triple A team of the Oakland A's is on the riverfront. We built the park as a Major League facility with the intention of attracting the A's here. No public money, our park just kicked the crud out of ball teams that were insisting that public money was needed. Our Cat's are The #1 team and we reward them with full attendance at nearly every game.
Ikea is building in a location directly off the freeway and has turned this location into THE address, as opposed to simply in between 2 existing markets. Ikea draws from half the state, and has helped turn one of the main arteries up to the center from a rundown 2 lane dive of a strip into a fully rebuilt 4 lane road where every shop has invested in everything from total facade improvement to full demo and construction of new expanded facilities.
Super Walmart is coming, bring it on. Again, it was part of the plan, bring retail Home, and it has proven to be the correct idea. Local stores are expanding and gaining ground as more shoppers are exposed to them During normal business hours for a change.
Home Depot? Our 2 local hardware stores cannot wait.
The older couple who own, and still own, the newly refurbished mom and pop stationary store, and asked me to speak at Kiwanis, were one of the first ones to endorse my council campaign.
You have to think beyond the scary stuff and figure out how things work and why, then make it happen to benefit your community.
Walmart isn't the boogie man. Reacting to sound bites and hype is the scary thing.
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ROC, you talk all that and seem to be saying that it is a good thing.
You can have it.
I`ll take small town and pay higher prices anyday.
Some of the Mom and Pop`s, as you have explained, have been hanging on by a shoestring around here also. Most of them have been "hanging on" for 20, 30, 40 years. :)
The "Cowgirls" are getting a new stadium also. People are loosing their homes over this. Not just houses , their homes. Everything is not dollars and cents. Some things go way beyond that.
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Originally posted by ROC
snip
Walmart isn't the boogie man. Reacting to sound bites and hype is the scary thing.
In another words, WalMart is better than nothing.
Okay... we'll give you that.
;)
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Originally posted by Sandman
In another words, WalMart is better than nothing.
(http://home.dc.rr.com/loboloco/images/walmart_greeter2.jpg)
"The fat chicks on isle 12 are to die for...
...hehehhehhehheeheheheh".
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And if I may, I'd like to take it back to the original post--
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/walmart/view/
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/walmart/view/#rest
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I went to Circleville when I was a kid. They have a pumkin festival every year.
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Originally posted by lazs2
My daughter is starting out in her working life. Wall mart is very good for her.
lazs
LOL Lazs! I saw the thread title, and was about to add "don't tell Lazs", but you were the first to reply! :lol
Hope your daughter's doing OK. :)
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Ok.. We have an ace hardware in town... those thieving aholes ran this town for 25 years with "sevice with a sneer" and any markup short of 100% was a godsend. they paid their emplyees the minimum wage and tried their best to cheat on that.
We had zero bookstores and a bicycle shop that opened when he felt like it and had no emplyees.
Most of the old bussiness in town are still open in their same slipshod way but ace has gotten bigger and now the same aholes are smiling and asking how you are doing with fake concern and bringing their prices down to reasonable levels... they couldn't find anyone to work their for 6 months when they needed a new person so they raised the starting pay and actually (gasp) offered a few benifiets.
My daughter needed a job bad and I need her to have one... she could have worked at the local places part time or fast food part time but got a job at Wall mart for $9 an hour to start and benifiets.
I buy some things there. mostly not. Most things they don't have that I want. I can't believe skilless is unable to simply order any cd he wants off the internet... maybe he really is skilless.
Wall mart also increases the general fund of the city by about 2 million a year... the old mom and pop stores brought nothing.
I am failing to see the evil here.
lazs