Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Yeager on November 23, 2005, 12:43:28 AM
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http://www.insightmag.com/Media/MediaManager/slasheastasia_1.htm
the gist of the artical is a conventional war with China is impossible.
I cant imagine a nation of appx 350,000,000 (three hundred fifty million) defeating a nation of 1,750,000,000 (one billion 750 million) in conventional war.
Just arent enough bullets in this world.
The two parts that disturbed me were the assumptions that china will never evolve into a free nation and that china could survive a nuclear war with the united states.
Thoughts?
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the war of bullets and bombs is not the "battle" we should worry about with China
when they own us, why would they want to fight us?
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enduring_Stockpile
How many nuclear strikes against mainland china, including its government infrastructure, would it take to destroy china as a civilization. Assuming of course the united states is destroyed during the conflict.
What would the situation with the rest of the world be if both china and the united states destroyed each other, economically and environmentaly?
What would be the number of individual atomic detonations?
What would be the role of russia? would russia be drawn into the conflict and be destroyed as well? would russia prevail as the world only superpower without losing a soul?
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just one nuke on beijing should to it. the peasants out in the broader country could care less about a war.
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Problem is that is China able to unite for war against one of its biggest clients? Please, China is more concerned with herself and keeping Communism going strong.
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If the russians respond by launching their strike along with China we really shouldn't worry about the war. It's end of human kind.
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I think the United States should Challenge China to a game of table tennis.
oh.....wait :cry
I just want the world to know the united states has enough nuclear weapons, and the capability to deliver them, to end the human race. Just give us a big hug and everything will be fine :aok
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China doesn't wander about the pacific conquering neighbors. Not their thing. They absorb invaders and assimilate 'em.
The biggest chinese threat; near term, is a buy-out.. they'll literally own us.
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Well it's just like always... US boy scouts are incompetant cowards who cant defeat proud asian warriors in a serious world conflict - so says Mr Isihara - an official of the Japanese government..
Can we approach officials of the German government for comment on the matter as well?
:rofl
A war between china and the usa would be a messy affair and not an easy contest for either side, but its quite funny to see such comments from the Japanese. I guess they forget very quickly.
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The chinese do detest the Japanese. Intensely. And the feeling is mutual. If there's ever another pacific war, it'll be the two of them at each others throats.
wonder which side we'd wade in on.. if at all?
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I truly believe we should arm japan to the teeth. Can you imagine three divisions of pissed off samuri warriors rolling through the middle east.
Even China is freaked out at the thought of a militarized japan.
Arm them bushido warriors and send them fourth inot the desert! plus they play a great game of baseball :aok
Yes hang, the chinese have an inbred inferiority complex vrs the japanese. These ninja are our greatest asset! we must arm them and threaten to unleash them. the world will be our playground. and we will let the japanese play major league baseball :rofl
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USA vs China
Man this is Eastern Front (TM) Part Two! Billions of Chinese partisans/insurgents and computer hackers will wear down US military faster than you can drink soda!
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Originally posted by 1K3
USA vs China
Man this is Eastern Front (TM) Part Two! Billions of Chinese partisans/insurgents and computer hackers will wear down US military faster than you can drink soda!
I sip mine through a curly scooby doo straw, thus it takes me hours upon hours before I get fed up and throw the can at the homeless guy mumbling to himself and watch it ping off his 'ead
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It will probably take at least five years to win any war with China. So I guess that means its out of the question. :lol
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We would trick them by ordering a giant order of 100 billion eggrolls. Then, when all of the Chinese showed up with their arms full of delicious deliveries, we would all kick them in the n**s.
We win, plus free snacks.
U S A! (http://www.llerrah.com/images/military_private_salute_flag_waving.gif)
U S A!
U S A!
U S A!
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How to win a war with china, stop buying electronic goodies from them. No TVs, no cell phones, no computer chips and PC boards and walmart stuff. And dont waste so much money spying on them. :lol Oops I've said too much.
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Are you guys insane?
China can't attack the US at all conventionaly. They do not have the ability to operate a military outside of China.
China can't field a military very far beyond it's border, and even taking Taiwan would be a huge risk for them.
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I think we need an equalizer to China's billion-man army
meet... ASIMO (HONDA) :)
(http://www.watch.impress.co.jp/pc/docs/article/20001120/honda03.jpg)
lets build billions of them !
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What good does a billion guys in a brown suit do?
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Originally posted by NUKE
Are you guys insane?
China can't attack the US at all conventionaly. They do not have the ability to operate a military outside of China.
China can't field a military very far beyond it's border, and even taking Taiwan would be a huge risk for them.
That analysis is sooo 1990s!:p
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Originally posted by 1K3
That analysis is sooo 1990s!:p
Yeah? How could China attack the US conventionaly?
Mr. Ishihara said U.S. ground forces, with the exception of the Marines, are "extremely incompetent" and would be unable to stem a Chinese conventional attack
LOL! And the Chinese....all battled tested and verifiable war experts, have been proven in battle (not) and would be able to magically transport themselves to the USA in order to do battle.
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keeping all of the technology for themselves huh :lol
(http://www.watch.impress.co.jp/pc/docs/article/20001120/honda03.jpg)
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What would happen if a couple hundred saboteur units, similar to Spetsnaz, end up on the US soil?
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lets build billions of them !
You'd need to manufacture the parts in China. Oh the irony.
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We Asians talk about these stuff too.
Except in our talk, we have the Americans bang the French for no reason and the EU launches nukes at the US and obliterate the entire East coast and their population with it. Then the British Ami-fanboys stab the EU on their back, and Germany sweeps the whole Europe once again.
Talking about human massacre of different races, cultures, and civilizations - I mean, this stuff is really fun, right? Especially if one always assumes they're the ones who're gonna be manipulating and policing the world forever?
Rome went 1000 years - good news. You guys got another 800, or maybe even more!
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Originally posted by Hangtime
China doesn't wander about the pacific conquering neighbors. Not their thing. They absorb invaders and assimilate 'em.
Historically true. So even if the US does win, you'll end up Chinese...
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I remember 20 years ago when Japan was going to own the world "soon"
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Originally posted by bozon
Historically true. So even if the US does win, you'll end up Chinese...
Yup.
I see China's buildup of of a Blue Water Navy and their modernization of land and air forces as the Diplomatic Chip necessary to succeed in establishing themseleves at the dominate power in the Western Pacific. This will lead to their control of trade in the region and the sunset of American Dominance in the region. The day China has the military power to cancel out American dominance is the day Taiwan peacefully submits to re-joining the Mainlands political envelope.
In actual fact, as China's economic power grows and America's trade deficit with them increases this is coming about anyway. A close look at the trade China has with Australia, Indonesia, the Phillipines and New Zealand and it's incredible increase in the last 10 years pretty much indicates which way the balance of power in the region is in fact going. The peaceful re-absorbtion of Taiwan is probably less than a decade away.
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Originally posted by Hangtime
The biggest chinese threat; near term, is a buy-out.. they'll literally own us.
True. There is no way we can declare war on China. Who is going to finance our federal debt?
Day 1 - War is declared.
Day 2 - China stops exporting goods to the US.
Day 2+x - Every Wal-Mart, Dollar General, Big Lots, and Radio Shack closes as inventories dry up and the rest of the Asian market is unable to ramp up production to meet demand. The price of electronics increases 10-fold.
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Classic O'Club stuff - a thread based on a filler article based on comments by Governor Ishihara linked to by the Drudge Report.
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Originally posted by Mickey1992
True. There is no way we can declare war on China. Who is going to finance our federal debt?
Day 1 - War is declared.
Day 2 - China stops exporting goods to the US.
Day 2+x - Every Wal-Mart, Dollar General, Big Lots, and Radio Shack closes as inventories dry up and the rest of the Asian market is unable to ramp up production to meet demand. The price of electronics increases 10-fold.
Day 2+y - China has to pay Russia for accepting it's consumer goods.
Day 2+z - Trans-Siberian and Baikal-Amur railways are jammed by trains loaded with Chinese goods.
Day 2+N (sorry, N is too much, let it be Day2+K) - Russia finally builds Communism 25 years after it was promised by Khruschev. :rofl
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What Hang just said. Japan invade the pacific rim in order to keep resources flowing into it. The pacific rim can't give their resources to China fast enough (in exchange for chinese goods). However, as they interdependance grows it bebooves China to want to be able to militarily protect it. Hence they are shifting from a "let's protect our border (bufffer) state interests" paradigm, to a "let's be able to project military power over the pacific rim" paradigm.
Either way, no way in hell is China and the US going to have a conventional war in the forseeable future. Then again, perhaps the US and China will have a few proxy wars. But, I don't see how it would be in the US interests to do that.
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Originally posted by Russian
What would happen if a couple hundred saboteur units, similar to Spetsnaz, end up on the US soil?
Yeah there is no possible way we could figure out who they were or
where they came from :rolleyes: The only thing that could keep them
going is the liberals crying about profiling :lol
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Rino, I have to respectfully disagree with you. Arresting/harassing the twelve MILLION asians who live here who are as American as you and I is really not the right thing to do.
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Originally posted by Russian
What would happen if a couple hundred saboteur units, similar to Spetsnaz, end up on the US soil?
If they landed in Kalifornia or Massachusettes, they'd win and we'd MAKE them keep them. :p
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Originally posted by Boroda
Day 2+y - China has to pay Russia for accepting it's consumer goods.
Day 2+z - Trans-Siberian and Baikal-Amur railways are jammed by trains loaded with Chinese goods.
Day 2+N (sorry, N is too much, let it be Day2+K) - Russia finally builds Communism 25 years after it was promised by Khruschev. :rofl
Day 3 The russians would all get frustrated at not being able to figure out how to use all those electric goodies and then drink themselves to death.
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Chinas airforce is something to be very concerned about...Especially the
SU-30MKK...I think that hands down the raptor would absoutley PWN anything in the skies, but how would 15's, 16's and 18's hold up against the sukhoi
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http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/china/index.html
All the info you have ever wanted 2 know about Chinas military
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Originally posted by Maverick
If they landed in Kalifornia or Massachusettes, they'd win and we'd MAKE them keep them. :p
Socialist Republic of Kalifornia is half-communist already, so it should be no difficult feat. :lol
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Russia finally builds Communism 25 years after it was promised by Khruschev
Hehe.. With communist way of things you'd all die to starvation. Hell you couldn't even support your own nation let alone export to china.
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We wouldn't lose, but probably couldn't "win" either. With our intel gathering abilities and various other advanced technologies, we could do a pretty good job of chopping apart their command and control structure to the point where they couldn't mount a cohesive offensive or even a coordinated defense. The usual problem of course is that "winning" doesn't necessarily mean just eliminating the govt and taking enough strategic positions to cripple a nation. Countries nowadays are willing to enter drawn out wars of attrition even when it is an otherwise lost cause in the sense that whatever national entity survives will not be the same as the one in place at the beginning of the war.
A conventional war in China would probably start with an extremely fast paced and violent assault on certain infrastructure and leadership, and I suspect that we would be successful in eliminating their ability to coordinate their efforts except for the types of coordination that could be accomplished by couriers essentially on foot. But since we're a kinder/gentler sort of nation now, we would avoid hitting civilian infrastructure and that guarantees that a drawn out low intensity conflict would be immediately entered upon the end of the first phase of the war. The average citizen would have little incentive to stop fighting so they'd keep fighting as long as they had food. Not taking out their power plants, water sources, etc. would just empower the resistance forces.
The key thing to realize is that there is no currently acceptable way to convince the entire nation to give up, regardless of the use of conventional or nuclear weapons. The more we modernize our military and make it more efficient in achieving specific military goals with less collateral damage, the more our military becomes a defensive tool. We currently possess the ability to completely dismantle the leadership and command structure of any nation on earth in a matter of days, but we do not have the forces or nationl willpower to do much after reducing the organized military opposition. Iraq is proving that even though we have fairly good intentions regarding the future of Iraq, we are simply not set up to occupy and rebuild a nation that was disarmed but which never surrendered. It's an important distinction to make and although we're persisting in Iraq out of a sense of moral obligation after trashing their national infrastructure and government, we're essentially forcing a square peg into a round hole.
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well put eagl.
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It struck me recently how people fail to compare meaningful stats between WWII and later wars.
It took MILLIONS of people to win WWI and WWII and the military portion of the war lasted until the very end. With less than 300,000 troops actively engaged in the conflict, we took out Afghanistan and Iraq militarily in a matter of weeks. But without those millions of boots on the ground, neither nation will ever be truly pacified and the "war" will end only when we declare victory and leave. Even Korea is getting old, and after we leave Iraq it's only a matter of time before we make a real go at pulling out there too.
But it's important to look at the scale of the conflicts, and remember how many troops it really takes to capture a given region and truly pacify a particular number of people. One could argue that it takes 2 million troops or 2 rather spectacular explosions, but that's pretty unrealistic nowadays. Nobody cares enough to really WIN anymore. That's probably a good thing in the long run but it's obviously frustrating in the short term.
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Originally posted by cav58d
Chinas airforce is something to be very concerned about...Especially the
SU-30MKK...I think that hands down the raptor would absoutley PWN anything in the skies, but how would 15's, 16's and 18's hold up against the sukhoi
but what you are comparing is plane vrs plane. This is not how modern air combat is fought anymore.
Probably the biggest enabler of the Chinese air force is their recent purchase of several Russian tankers and cargo aircraft. This allows projection of power. A souped up Su30 is no match against a squadron of any 15 16 or 18s if it only has 5 minutes of lingering time on the battlefield. Then you have other force multipliers such as AWACS and other logistics.
You can buy yourself a farrari but if you don't have the mait to support it and the supply to keep it flying and the fuel to make it race.......it's just another car.
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I predict in the not so distant future the Japanese will annex several Asian countries using their Bi-Pedal tanks.
Since the Japanese cannot use a conventional Army/Air Force for self defense and it's a clause in their own constituion that prohibits them from actually seeking out those types of weapons they'll invest in that technology.
Heck I posted a video of some Japanese engineer that actually got a primitive mecha working so it's only a matter of time before they become quite common in their own military and the US military as well.
I mean for the Love of K.T. the "robots" the US Army and Air Force use(aside from the Predator UAV), are quite shameful they look like rejects from those battling robot shows Gah!
I bet on the Japanese will eventually get or abolish the clauses in their own constitution thatprohibit them from acquiring those types of weapons. I mean how can you let a pseudo ally of the USA be defenseless against an assumed "growing" North Korean and Chinese Threat.
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Originally posted by Yeager
I truly believe we should arm japan to the teeth. Can you imagine three divisions of pissed off samuri warriors rolling through the middle east.
You forgot one thing. There is no peace agreement between Japan and Russia. So we will withdraw from service our conventional bombs and missiles in the usual way. By using them in their straight practice. :-)
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Very well said Eagl.
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Originally posted by eagl
We wouldn't lose, but probably couldn't "win" either. [...........] It's an important distinction to make and although we're persisting in Iraq out of a sense of moral obligation after trashing their national infrastructure and government, we're essentially forcing a square peg into a round hole.
Good speech. One problem. Against of Chine, you don't have an Idea to fight for. But Chine do have it. Maybe the word "Communism" make you laugh. But for Chinese army it's a primary idea in mind.
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Originally posted by Estel
Good speech. One problem. Against of Chine, you don't have an Idea to fight for. But Chine do have it. Maybe the word "Communism" make you laugh. But for Chinese army it's a primary idea in mind.
Ok maybe now a days we can go to war with a 3rd world country with little an idea. But to go to war with a country as big, both economically and numerically, we would have the idea your looking for.
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You're right Estel. The discussion was based on a hypothetical assumption that we DID find some legitimate reason to go to war. I agree, there is currently no reason to go to war with China. But it's stupid to assume there never will be, so the discussion will go on even if it's purely hypothetical.
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Originally posted by eagl
You're right Estel. The discussion was based on a hypothetical assumption that we DID find some legitimate reason to go to war. I agree, there is currently no reason to go to war with China. But it's stupid to assume there never will be, so the discussion will go on even if it's purely hypothetical.
The problem is not only to find a reason. The main problem in all wars is to force the soldiers to fight. And in professional army, like in USA for example, this will be a problem. Because if you don't defend your homeland, you will need a very weighty reason to send people into battle. The chinese have this reason. Muslims have this reason. Do you have this reason? It's a hypotetical question too. If you do not have words to your soldiers except "You'll get a lot of money" - you'll loose. If you have something like "We will build communism/The world halifat" you'll win. It was thousand years ago and it is still the same. The Idea uniting the people. Considering an opportunity of the beginning the war you should be prepared to the situation when your soldiers or the whole nation will refuse the similiar idea. Or you think, that after Vietnam and Iraq, the nation will agree to be at war on any front for any ideas? I don't think so. And I'm not sure that you'll find that reason and that slogan for the war which in result can lead to the end of a civilization.
edit from here:
P.S. In Russia we have one saying. I'll try to translate it: "That soldier who has not left the ashes of the native house behind the back is bad."
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Even with Vietnam and Korea I believe that under a few circumstances the people of the United States would unite. Of course their will be those who are aganst it. No one enjoys war (Except Marines :p ).
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Originally posted by BlueJ1
Even with Vietnam and Korea I believe that under a few circumstances the people of the United States would unite. Of course their will be those who are aganst it. No one enjoys war (Except Marines :p ).
In that case, we should pray, that these circumstances have not been created synthetically.
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Estel,
The thing that has saved the US military, even after we became an all-volunteer force, is that we (most of us anyhow) actually trust our government to employ the military in legitimate situations. Sure, individuals will always question the value of a war, but time and again Americans have stepped up to fight when called to do so by their country.
If that's too strange of an idea, just consider the US Civil war. In that war, households were torn apart as people turned to their sense of moral obligation and came up with different answers. Some chose a loyalty to local or regional obligations, but a great number chose loyalty to the concept of a nation made up of many states. The union won, and to this day when that union raises the call to arms, people respond.
That trust may be lost in the future, but for now Americans still trust that their blood will not be spent by their elected government on useless or trivial endeavours, and that the government, once it has sent citizens into combat, will not abandon those citizens. Our enthusiasm for combat does not come close to the fanaticism displayed by various groups around the world, but what we lack in bloodlust we make up for with a passion for technical excellence. That makes the US military extremely effective from both the tactical and National Strategy points of view.
Give us a reason to fight and enthusiastic leadership, and the average US Soldier/Citizen becomes a match for any troop in the world in terms of both competence and "guts". Blame it on a constitution that pretty much guarantees that the average person MATTERS... Sure the US doesn't have a radical national religion to bolster our courage and tell us that we're destined to rule the world, but the constitution is a pretty good alternative.
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China contiunes to build up there army
China waits till after the Olympics
China brings land forces through alaska
USA moves gov from DC to Denver..where the final battle occurs..USA wins
eastern and western coast are glass
I do like the egg roll aproach though
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Statistically speaking, in China, even if you are one in a million, there are a thousand more just like you.
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Originally posted by GreenCloud
USA moves gov from DC to Denver..where the final battle occurs..USA wins
We already have enough pansy arse liberals in Colorado, don't suggest bringing more! :mad:
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How could China ever sustain a conventional war against the USA when they are utterly dependant on oil from the Persian Gulf, an area almost completely within the USA's sphere of influence? One wrong move and the US could close the spigot and China's industrial and military machine would grind to a halt.
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China invade the Continental US, naw, never happen. Besides, they need us as customers.
Now Australlia, THAT is tempting to the chinese.
Think of what they could do with all that empty space. Why they'd be able to drop the birth controls for 50 years! Tawain first, though, at least in my opinion.
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Originally posted by Ghosth
Besides, they need us as customers.
Dear god, how this incredible idea persists.
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Originally posted by Momus--
How could China ever sustain a conventional war against the USA when they are utterly dependant on oil from the Persian Gulf, an area almost completely within the USA's sphere of influence? One wrong move and the US could close the spigot and China's industrial and military machine would grind to a halt.
Siberia.
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Originally posted by Hangtime
Siberia.
They are building pipelines now for oil and gas to China.
Anyway, Chinese army is technologically and (!!!) numerically not far from Iraqi army. But they have nukes, and it makes them invulnerable to "democratisation" in American way.
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My dad could wip 10 chinese dads with one had behind his back.
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I dont know why some people think that China has some great military capability. They dont.
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Originally posted by NUKE
I dont know why some people think that China has some great military capability. They dont.
I think I should remember some Soviet jokes about Chinese.
China launched a first artificial sattelite. 2 million Chinese got hernia pulling a rubber band.
China built a world's biggest DC power station: 2 million Chinese in silk pants crawl on ebonite floor.
Soviet border-guard patrol sees a HUGE crowd of Chinese across the border. Chinese say: We have 2 million people here against you four soldiers! Soviet sergeant answeres: "Scary... Scary!!!" - "Are you going to surrender?" - "No, I am scared because we don't have space to bury you all!..."
TASS report in Pravda: "Today, at the Soviet-Chinese border, a peacefull Sovier tractor was attacked by three Chinese infantry divisions. Destroying the enemy force peacefull Soviet tractor got out of ammunition and launched into a near-earth orbit. Soviet government warns that if provocations will continue - we'll use a peacefull missile-carrying VTOL sheaf-binder."
A new one: Warning! Markets are full of fake Chinese Christmas-tree decorations! They look absolutlely like real, but they are no joy :(
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You know what else amazes me about China? They virtually never explored the world or sailed the oceans. They existed for thousands of years and pretty much just stayed put in their part of the world.
Maybe thinking that they were the center of the universe had something to do with that.
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Originally posted by NUKE
Maybe thinking that they were the center of the universe had something to do with that.
Mediterranean sea... Medi terrain... Middle of the earth....
Seems the Romans thought the same thing.
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Originally posted by NUKE
You know what else amazes me about China? They virtually never explored the world or sailed the oceans. They existed for thousands of years and pretty much just stayed put in their part of the world.
Imagine how peaceful place earth would be if all countries would behave like that.
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Originally posted by Staga
Imagine how peaceful place earth would be if all countries would behave like that.
Staying put in their part of the world and being peacful are two different things.
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Originally posted by Hangtime
Siberia.
Not if you are talking about the current timeframe. Maybe in 5 or 10 years, which is how long it will take to get the pipelines in place, assuming they get built at all. There is also the small matter of Japan, who are still competing with China for preferential access to Siberian oil. Approx. 35-40% of China's current oil imports come from the Persian Gulf and this proportion is rising annually. Russia cannot currently replace that capacity, since present supply is by rail only. Even assuming that a more dependable Siberian supply comes on-stream in the future, it will barely keep pace with Chinese domestic demand even if Persian Gulf imports remain at current levels.
"There's an illusion that ownership ensures either volume or price," said William H. Overholt, director of the Rand Center for Asia-Pacific Policy in Santa Monica, Calif. "Oil is an internationally traded commodity. The key is having secure lines of supply from the Middle East."
Many energy experts say owning oil fields provides no real energy security. It does not cushion against a rising cost of energy because no one country is large enough to determine the market price. Neither does it ensure access, because getting oil where it is needed depends largely upon shipping lanes policed by the U.S. Navy.
Article (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/07/12/AR2005071201546_pf.html)
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Originally posted by NUKE
I dont know why some people think that China has some great military capability. They dont.
I blame it on Battlefield 2.
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hey...hey...hey ...stop.... stop, wait a moment, did you amrican warmongers forget about the old Euro??? We are still here, (you insipid chinese wait for your turn ;) )..... since yesterday you warmongers were foretelling a war with us, now you are ready to give in for some billions yellow guys???
Thats not the way....:aok
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Stegor, that's so last century. We already beat Mussolini and the rest of you spaghetti eaters when John Bull, Uncle Sam, and Uncle Joe took care of them nazis.
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Bomb the Three Dams on the Yangtze River and it would break the back of China.
Karaya
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The Chinese couldn't touch the US, unless they launched some nukes, which they don't have many of, and of which few of those could reach the US mainland, contrary to popular opinion.
The US military is so much more capable than that of China's, it isn't even a logical comparison to remotely equate the two.
In a nuclear exchange, China would lose big time.
No nation on earth can defeat the US in an all out conventional war, and only Russia could trade blows with the US in a nuclear exchange.
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Another difference is that China can afford thier military. ;)
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Originally posted by Thrawn
Another difference is that China can afford thier military. ;)
You seem to think that the US economy is on paper. You are ignorant.
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Originally posted by NUKE
You seem to think that the US economy is on paper.
Actually quite the opposite, I think the US economy is hard concrete things, like factories and resources etc. I am surprised you would say that I think it's paper seeing as I've been arguing the opposite for so long and so vocally here.
Many economists, politicians, unions, etc and unfortunately a whole lot of citizens think it's paper. I guess that's why the Fed prints off so much of it. They think they can make those resources and factories magically more productive if they just print more and more paper with dead Presidents on them.
But I find it interesting that you would make the point about paper. Perhaps you understand the difference between money and wealth after all.
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Originally posted by Thrawn
Many economists, politicians, unions, etc and unfortunately a whole lot of citizens think it's paper. I guess that's why the Fed prints off so much of it. They think they can make those resources and factories magically more productive if they just print more and more paper with dead Presidents on them.
You do know that the bills the printing office (not the Fed) supplies are but a small percentage of the cash in the economy.... don't you?
Nobody buys a car or a house, no business purchases supplies with greenbacks. There may be a petty cash box for small purchases, but checks, credit, wire transfers, etc are the big movers of wealth.
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My northon worm protection annoyigly pops up warning windows of blocked attempts. Out of curiosity I tracked back a few IPs with neotrace. They all come from china..
I say NUKE EM :D
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Originally posted by Hangtime
wonder which side we'd wade in on.. if at all?
you'd probably do what you did last time, and wait to see who is going to win before commiting to any conflict. Seems to me in the last war you guys we're thinking of going with the German till after the BoB.
:p
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Originally posted by mechanic
you'd probably do what you did last time, and wait to see who is going to win before commiting to any conflict. Seems to me in the last war you guys we're thinking of going with the German till after the BoB.
:p
So how many lend lease destroyers did Adolf get anyway? Oh yeah,
it seems to me the tide didn't turn till late 42/early 43.
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Originally posted by mechanic
you'd probably do what you did last time, and wait to see who is going to win before commiting to any conflict. Seems to me in the last war you guys we're thinking of going with the German till after the BoB.
:p
I hope your past family enjoyed not starving either.
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Originally posted by mechanic
you'd probably do what you did last time, and wait to see who is going to win before commiting to any conflict. Seems to me in the last war you guys we're thinking of going with the German till after the BoB.
:p
how do you manage to suck air with out a snorkel.... yer head bein so far up yer own bellybutton 'n all?
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us brits have our arses installed with breathing apparatus from birth.
i was wondering, seein as you guys obviously dont get this perk, how do you lot breath up yours?
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Originally posted by mechanic
you'd probably do what you did last time, and wait to see who is going to win before commiting to any conflict. Seems to me in the last war you guys we're thinking of going with the German till after the BoB.
:p
oh.....snap....:rofl
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Soviet jokes about Chinese.
That's like trailerfolk in Alabama making fun of white trash in Georgia.
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Originally posted by Holden McGroin
You do know that the bills the printing office (not the Fed) supplies are but a small percentage of the cash in the economy.... don't you?
Yes, but I have enough problems trying to explain the basics of currency expansion and it's effects without making my job harder. ;)
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Originally posted by Boroda
China launched a first artificial sattelite. 2 million Chinese got hernia pulling a rubber band.
China built a world's biggest DC power station: 2 million Chinese in silk pants crawl on ebonite floor.
Man,
That made my night of laughing worth it. Thanks dude!
Wolf
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Originally posted by stiehl
Soviet jokes about Chinese.
That's like trailerfolk in Alabama making fun of white trash in Georgia.
Do trailerfolk from Alabama launch spaceships?
I'm probably one of the 0.1% of Russians who can understand what you mean.
In USSR "Chinese threat" was absolutely real. I grew up in times when China was our greatest enemy, BTW, supported by the US. Do yo know that on Chinese maps printed in 1960s-70s Soviet Far East was painted as native Chinese land? Does Damanskiy island mean anything for you? Border guards at Chinese border were fighting a war until maybe 1990s. I have friends who served there, one of them got wounded in 1988 on one of the "questionable" islands on Amur.
As for jokes: Chinese soldiers seeing Soviet border guards "boasted" that they have some rice for lunch, then political officers decided to bring hot lunch directly to border patrols, so Chinese saw Soviet soldiers eating hot borsch with garlick buns, goulash and dessert... When underfed Chinese saw it - they started to scream "Revisionists! Bloody capitalist pigs!"... Soviet border guard dog got more food then a Chinese soldier.
Another joke:
Chinese military command plans an attack against USSR.
"Here we infiltrate Soviet border in small groups, no more then 2-3 millions each."
"And here go our TANKS!!!" - "Really? All three tanks in one place?!"
"And here are targets for our aviation strikes!" - "Sorry, not now, our pilot is sick".
At Damanskiy island several Chinese divisions were stopped and then destroyed by one Soviet border-guard squad and a tank platoon, later supported by BM-21 jet-mortar batallion.
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Originally posted by Masherbrum
Bomb the Three Dams on the Yangtze River and it would break the back of China.
Karaya
Here is a variant, that after the strike you'll receive an official "Thank you very much for helping us to solve food problem".