Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Ripsnort on September 28, 2001, 09:06:00 AM
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Its a known fact that it is only a matter of time that Bin Laden disciples take Americans hostage somewhere in the world for an exchange for the prisoners in the US responsible for the 1993 WTC bombing. The question is...do we give into their demands? Take the risk, and send anti-terrorist squads to 'storm them'? Most certainly more Americans will die in the next few months, years. I guess we have to ask this question.
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Originally posted by Ripsnort:
Its a known fact that it is only a matter of time that Bin Laden disciples take Americans hostage somewhere in the world for an exchange for the prisoners in the US responsible for the 1993 WTC bombing. The question is...do we give into their demands? Take the risk, and send anti-terrorist squads to 'storm them'? Most certainly more Americans will die in the next few months, years. I guess we have to ask this question.
Never give in! We're all "combatants" in this war. We all have our lives at risk, some more than others of course, but we're all their targets. I'd use spec forces to storm them if they take hostiges. I know that sucks and hostiges will die, but most likely they're dead already and this way maybe we can save at least some of them.
U
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Yeah, my very same thoughts Udie. But, try to imagine if they were YOUR children, or Mom and dad..gets alittle confusing doesn't it?
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U.S. Policy. We dont negoitate w/terrorists.
xBAT
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Yeah, my very same thoughts Udie. But, try to imagine if they were YOUR children, or Mom and dad..gets alittle confusing doesn't it?
and thats why they rarely let anyone with a personal stake in it be involved.
nobody thinks logicly when their wife or kids are in danger.
just one example- look at that guy in florida this summer who swam out and took the kids arm back from the shark.
not exactly logical thinking
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YES it does Rip, that's why we need to crush these people pronto and make it very public and ugly. So the next time some maniac tries/wants to do something like this he realized that he 1. he doest go straight to Heaven and 2. he DOES get his skin peeled off and then he gets dipped into salt...
u
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As I noted in another thread, turning the 52 American Hostages into 52 American Martyrs via turning Tehran inta a glass crater in 1979 would have spared us the 5,200 dead in NYC today, and quite a few 'bushwars' in the intereim.
Never negotiate. Respond with horrible and overwhelming violence and unrelenting visciousness to terrorisim... had we done this initially; I doubt seriously we'd be in the toejam we're in now..
The formula.. One american hostage = one dead american martyr and 10,000 dead from the nation that spawned or harbored the hostage taker.
No mercy. Not even a tiny shred. This is not about justice.. it is about SURVIVAL now.
Darwinism writ as large as it can be written.
Quickly. Before they can react.
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The optimal strategy in the narrow context of hostage taking (capture of individuals or small groups people) would be to make hostage taking meaningless.
Which basically means writing hostages off as dead the moment they are taken and treating terrorists as murderers. The only leeway in that could be sparing the terrorist's lives upon unconditional release of hostages.
Another issue is when terrorists are holding us all hostages and killing us wholesale when we do not do what they want.
miko
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I think the way President Reagan explained it to Kadafe (spelling) was pretty effective.
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you call in Rainbow Six and fur-get bout it!
in reality it's a dam if you do, dam if you don't scenerio ... the press and then in turn, public opinion, will fry ya alive either way :)
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Or we could just sell the terrorist arms for hostages...
U.S. Policy. We dont negoitate w/terrorists
Was this policy before or after President Reagen?
10B
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Before.
So was the law against targeting heads of state. So what? He got the job done.
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Hey! ripsnort. "solve" easymo's puzzle. I am curious
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10 bears , your time line is wrong
1)reagan prez , hostages freed
2)congress cuts off aid to freedom fighters (like they did to south vietnam , remember)
3)reagan sell arms to raise money to arm freedom fighters
[ 09-28-2001: Message edited by: john9001 ]
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Known fact? There are a lot of things you know that the rest of us don't eh rip?
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john9001, I think yer thinking of the wrong hostages. The arms for hostages deal wasn't for the hostages that Iran held under the Carter admin that were released the day of Reagan's innaugeration (very questionable..there's some pretty good evidence that these hostages were held far longer than originally intended just so Reagan's election looked a little more certain. Bush himself had on more than one occasion visited with Iranian officials in France during Reagan's campaign). "Arms for hostages" (1986) was a different matter completely... and involved the sale of arms to Iran to secure the release of Americans held by pro-Iranian groups in Lebanon.
It was actually 3-prongued... Securing the release, raising money for contras and an attempt steer Iran's foreign policy in a pro-western direction.
"We do not negotiate with terrorists" got turned into "I don't recall" pretty damn quick. :)
Anyway... War has been officially declared now. I reckon that the rules of any war be applied... and that is hostages be viewed as prisoners of war. You do not and cannot negotiate for their release. If they are murdered, there will be hell to pay. However, no concessions should be made to secure their release.
[ 09-28-2001: Message edited by: Nash ]
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I'll bet some of our Russian players can describe the video tapes that were made of how some Russian prisoners of war were treated during their Afghanistan war.
Ethics? Only one side is likely to be restrained by any sort of ethics at all in this one.
See if you can guess which one.
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Originally posted by Toad:
I'll bet some of our Russian players can describe the video tapes that were made of how some Russian prisoners of war were treated during their Afghanistan war.
Ethics? Only one side is likely to be restrained by any sort of ethics at all in this one.
See if you can guess which one.
Bet the Brit's have a few memories also ...
"When you're wounded and left on Afghanistan's plains,
And the women come out to cut up what remains,
Jest roll to your rifle and blow out your brains An' go to your Gawd like a soldier."
Rudyard Kipling