Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Seraphim on January 05, 2006, 12:33:13 AM
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I have a 91/30 model, which led my friend to buy an m44....he asked if there was a decent scope available. i looked around a bit, but haven't found anything solid. Does anyone have any suggestions or experience with these? I'm also lookin for some decent practice ammo, but our stupid laws don't let us shoot steel core around here. So lookin for copper core or anything non-magnetic. The only thing I found was something called olympic ammo (imported) but not sure if its non magnetic.
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I've mounted 3 scopes on Mosin's so far, all of 'em removeable receiver side mounts. One was a WWII era replica thumbscrew mount the other two modern SVD/AKM lever types. All three reqiuired some 'gunsmithing' (squaring-up, drilling, tapping, inleting the stock, etc) and custom turn down bolt bodies. Pricey. With the scope about 200-300 bucks. Stay away from the 40 dollar ATI 'kit'.. pure crud. Modern scopes and mounts here:
Kalinka Optics (http://www.kalinkaoptics.com)
Another way to go is with the 'scout mount' setup. Works real well particularly on carbines like the M44 and M38. This puts the scope on the Mosin's rear sight leaf via a weaver rail replacement for the 'stock' rear sight leaf. No gunsmithing. Requires an 'EER' style scope. Better than the ATI crap, but not as versitle or dependable as the pricey receiver mounts especially like the long guns like your 91/30.
BTW, yer 91/30 will likely become a tack driver with a decent scope and a good recevier side mount... and you can still use the iorn sights as well as dismount and mount the scope in under 5 seconds.. and it holds zero, all without a single tool. Money well spent IMHO.
You can get lead core surplus heay ball Hungarian here for about 32 bucks per 440 round can:
Aim Surplus (http://www.aimsurplus.com/acatalog/copy_of_7_62x54R.html)
Shoot a bunch!! :aok
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You rule.
We're not big pro shooters, just looking to have some nice time shootin', looks like scout mount will be for us. I havent even fired mine yet, but used his & a few others, heavy stuff. Ill probably upgrade later, but for now cost is a factor.
Main reason I like my SKS, super cheap ammo.
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You get exactly what you pay for when it comes to optics. 200 bucks worth of optics on yer 70 year old battle rifle can make it shoot like a thousand dollar remington. 50 bucks worth of optics will leave you shooting worse than the iorn sights every damn time.
don't ask me how i know this is fact. ;)
whatever you get, buy quality; even if yah have to wait a bit and save for it.
:aok
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Seraphin, check out this site for lots of info on the Mosins. The right side of the page has some scope mount articles.
http://www.surplusrifle.com/russianmosin189130/index.asp (http://www.surplusrifle.com/russianmosin189130/index.asp)
I used a scout mount on my 91/30 and it's pretty good. You need to use a pistol scope with an extended eye relief. I'm using a cheapo NCStar 4x scope. It's OK but I plan on getting a quality Burris 4x soon. If I had any 'gunsmitthing' skill/hardware I would do a side mount like Hangtime has.
Oh Hang, I just got in a 880 rnds of Polish 7.62x54R for $65. I feel so naughty getting that much ammo at one time. :)
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I actually mounted a Pistol scope on one of my Nagants. I put it right in the rear sight well. No gunsmithing required. But I don't have the time to dig up the maker, though it does come in a blue box.
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Originally posted by Hangtime
You get exactly what you pay for when it comes to optics. 200 bucks worth of optics on yer 70 year old battle rifle can make it shoot like a thousand dollar remington. 50 bucks worth of optics will leave you shooting worse than the iorn sights every damn time.
don't ask me how i know this is fact. ;)
whatever you get, buy quality; even if yah have to wait a bit and save for it.
:aok
Ya, I was beginning to think that. I used to always get shafted when I bought cheap stuff. Think I'll save up (probably take me forever).
P.S. I think I made a mistake. Mine is the 91/38 carbine...I forgot the 91/30 was the quarter mile long version.
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What ever you do, do not sporterize them..
I'll buy them from you before you do that!!
If you need to sporterize it, do it so it isn't permanent to the stock or the gun.
It's a WWII gun afterall.
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No way!
I love that old look
The only thing I did to my SKS was add a good lookin flash suppressor to it, easy to take off, no modding at all.
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Originally posted by Hawklore
What ever you do, do not sporterize them..
I'll buy them from you before you do that!!
If you need to sporterize it, do it so it isn't permanent to the stock or the gun.
It's a WWII gun afterall.
You mean like this?
(http://www.gunaccessories.com/ati/SyntheticStocks/MOI0bipd.jpg)
Thats pretty close to what mine looks like now. :)
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:lol
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P.S. I think I made a mistake. Mine is the 91/38 carbine...I forgot the 91/30 was the quarter mile long version. [/B]
I also have an M38, which is shorter and easier to lug around than the 91/30. I scopped the M38 but haven't had a chance to bring it to the range.
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After reading this post, I'm debating whether or not to move the scope over from the mn38 to my 91/30.
****ty ammo and a surplus rifle doesn't make the scope seem too powerful.
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Just brought my son-in-laws M44 to the range today.. the damn thing shoots mighty fine fer a commie cookie cutter carbine. Once he can put 10 rounds in a 9" circle inside 30 seconds with the battle sights I'll scope it for him. ;)
Scoping the long guns is really worthwhile.. My 106 year old Finn shoots 1-2" groups on cheap commie ammo at 200 yards with a 4X 28mm russian scope. Freaks everybody out.. including me. Taking your time and working up great old veteran rifles to their accuracy potential is really quite rewarding. I can think of worse hobbies. :aok
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why is that ammo so cheap?
my 308 ammo is over 200$ fro 1k rounds?
223. 140$
havent bought 7.62-39mm yet as i am still chewing threw a few k of rounds
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Originally posted by StarOfAfrica2
You mean like this?
(http://www.gunaccessories.com/ati/SyntheticStocks/MOI0bipd.jpg)
Thats pretty close to what mine looks like now. :)
:cry
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Originally posted by GreenCloud
why is that ammo so cheap?
my 308 ammo is over 200$ fro 1k rounds?
223. 140$
havent bought 7.62-39mm yet as i am still chewing threw a few k of rounds
Go easy on the 7.62 x 39... that stuff is hard to come by on the cheap right now. B/O most places; seems Iraq and Argentina have mopped up Wolf's production on this caliber short term.
The .308 I'm paying about 150 per 1K, getting it from Aim Surplus. It's the surplus South African.. good stuff. The current supply of surplus 7.62x54r commie ammo is pretty good; lots of it on the market, which is why the stuff's so damn cheap.
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Yanno Hawklore, those old wooden stocks make GREAT kindling. I mean the fire just ROARS when I throw that stuff in. I dont know what they treated them with, and I sure dont want to breathe the fumes, but they made some great warm fires. :)
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Originally posted by StarOfAfrica2
Yanno Hawklore, those old wooden stocks make GREAT kindling. I mean the fire just ROARS when I throw that stuff in. I dont know what they treated them with, and I sure dont want to breathe the fumes, but they made some great warm fires. :)
It contains arsenic, so do back off! I keep all my old wood military stocks in the box the nice, pretty plastic one came in on a shelf in the garage. I don't know why...they'll never go back on the gun.
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reading on the best battle rifle s made website http://www.falforums.com
he hehe...it was said wolfs ammo actually built a "commercial:" factory just to sell to the worlds civilians...and that it was some other isuue..shipping going through export stuff or somthn like that
there was a minor scare as all the ak owners thought they were going to have to pay more then a penny a round.lolol
is that aimsurplus.com?
wonder if they ship to cali?
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Originally posted by Hawklore
What ever you do, do not sporterize them..
I'll buy them from you before you do that!!
If you need to sporterize it, do it so it isn't permanent to the stock or the gun.
It's a WWII gun afterall.
LOL. Hawklore, there's about 3.5 million 91/30's in the US right now, 1.2 and 1.9 million M38's and M44's.. it's not like these things are 'rare'. Same goes for Yugo and Norinco SKS's. Russian SKS's are a bit more rare.. only 950,000 of 'em here. The Albanian SKS is a mite more rare.. only 270,000 of 'em here.
The point is, carving up an old military surplus commie gun is not a 'crime against a museum piece'. I happen to like the damn things in their original furniture myself, but i wouldn't hesitate a second with regards to inleting or modifying one if it improved it's shoulder speed or accuracy.
On the other hand, rarer items like Finns and old Springfields or Nazi mausers, Swedish k31's, etc... I'd think a few moments before I carved it up, but still wouldn't feel bad if it improved the performance of the weapon.
In fact, I just put my best shooter, a classic and very rare Finn M27 up for sale on gunbroker because I wanted to scope it.. and cutting that stock for a scope hits me as not being a good thinng to do to a classic firearm of which fewer than 5,000 remain unsullied.
So, rather than carving it up, I'm selling it.. and I'll buy a second (and far more common) M39 with the proceeds and carve THAT up... unless of course it doesn't sell for my asking price, in which case the damn thing will be on the operating table in 9 days.
Finn M-27 (http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?item=42237549)
Now's yer chance ta put up, or shut up. Stop me, before I carve it up for a scoped tack driver. ;)
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Originally posted by GreenCloud
reading on the best battle rifle s made website http://www.falforums.com
he hehe...it was said wolfs ammo actually built a "commercial:" factory just to sell to the worlds civilians...and that it was some other isuue..shipping going through export stuff or somthn like that
there was a minor scare as all the ak owners thought they were going to have to pay more then a penny a round.lolol
is that aimsurplus.com?
wonder if they ship to cali?
LOL.. I've got a STG-58C built on an Enterprise upper. Had some 'teething' pains with it, was suffering feed problems. That forced me to bone up on FAL's, got the Arizona Arms gunsmithing manual and I repaired it. Runs like a fine Austrian Clock now. I also added 'free floating' handguards, a DSA scope mount, brass catch bag, new front sight, Israeli forward assist handle and bolt carrier... as well as a few other dodads.
I love it. Itsa freakin tack driver and my buddy the pilot with the M1 collection is jealous.. it's shootin the same groups at 200 yards his 'match'' springfield is doin for about 1/3 the cost.
Damn, but it CHURNS through the ammo.. especially since I mastered the 'bump fire' trick. ;)
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http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?item=42241174 That's the mount for the rear gun sight well. No gunsmithing required at all.
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=42131517 I believe that's the exact scope I have (except it's black).
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My 45/70 is sporterized by way of my grandfather, but he did it in the 40s, couldn't really stop him. Anyone know where I can get rounds for this beast?
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I love guns
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And... What real man doesn't?
lazs
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I am gonna pick up an Nagant, or a Makarov today.
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Why do you like pistols over rifles Lazs?
-SW
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More complex... handier... more variety... more challenging to get good with.. cheaper to reload for and..... women dig men who have handguns.
lazs
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Originally posted by Pooh21
I am gonna pick up an Nagant, or a Makarov today.
Ok, but I'm not cheap...
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Yeah, they are difficult to get good with. Especially the high caliber ones. With a 44 my spread was horrible after the first two shots in quick succession.
I prefer the AR-15 though, although I do like a nice 12gauge with slugs rather than shot.
-SW
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The FAL is cool, but I dont like the sites. Does someone make better then just the sheetmetal peep on the back?
Not that I would buy a FAL in Cali since the mag has to me fixed in place for it to be legal.
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Man, just went shootin yesterday, fired my moisin for the 1st time. Man that thing has some kick. Anyone know where to buy one of those slip on pads for the butt?
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most sporting goods stores that carry firearms have the pads. I use one on my .300WM
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If the metal butt plate hurts, then you are not man enough for the Moisin Nagant. Either toughen up or return the rifle.
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I dont even notice my Mausers kick, tuck it in and dont flinch.