Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aircraft and Vehicles => Topic started by: KD303 on January 05, 2006, 06:18:44 AM
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I thought I'd post a photo or two from my collection. I've been promising to do this for a while. A relative of mine was a nav on Mosquitos at Banff and I inherited a load of pictures from him. This one is from a 248 Squadron Mosquito MK XVIII Tsetse. The shell from the Molins gun can clearly be seen at centre of pic, near bottom. I have very little information about this particular attack. Just click the link and if you left click on the photo it will become magically larger!
(http://xs.to/xs.php?f=Norway13.JPG&h=xs62&d=06014)
This next is from a 235 Squadron Mosquito (J/LA) attacking a ship just a few days before the end of the war.
(http://xs.to/xs.php?f=Norway12.JPG&h=xs62&d=06014)
Now one from a RCAF 404 Squadron Mossie attacking shipping in Haugesund, Norway October 21 1944. This was an early Banff Strike Wing Attack. The flak gun crews were below decks having beakfast when the attack occured.
(http://xs.to/xs.php?f=Norway8.JPG&h=xs62&d=06014)
Hope these are of interest. I shall post some Beaufighter pictures later.
KD
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a while back was talkin to a squady of mine and was saying that second seat in mossie was for a navigator, he didn't believe me. This clears it up,
and interesting pics.
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Thanks for the photos. Gotta love Mossies. Even the Luftwaffe fans can't hate them.
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Wow lets see more.
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Mighty cool pics there KD303
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thx for sharing , great pics.
38
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Great pics KD303!
There are at least two authors who'd be interested in your collection: Andrew D. Bird, who is doing a second edition of his marvellous "A Separate Little War", and Alex Crawford, who's doing a new book on Tsetse ops.
Have you considered looking either of them up to get your pics published?
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OK, glad you liked them. I know they're from Mossies rather than of Mossies but, well that's the way it goes... I have 1 or 2 with Mosquitos in them but only one scanned so far. This shows a Mosquito MK VI of 235 Squadron during an attack on a surfaced U-boat in the North Sea. Picture is dated May 3 1945, just a few days before the surrender of Germany and was taken by Mossie LA/A.
(http://xs.to/xs.php?f=Norway11.JPG&h=xs62&d=06014)
I will hunt out another pic from the above raid which shows an excellent view of a Mosquito attacking a U-boat. Not as rare as these but worth posting anyway. In the next day or two I'll post some photographs from Banff's Neighbouring wing, the Dallachy Strike Wing, which operated Beaufighters. I have a sequence from 4 or 5 planes all taken within 2 or 3 seconds of eachother, showing different angles on the same attack on ships in a Norwegian fjord.
KD
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Originally posted by Scherf
Great pics KD303!
There are at least two authors who'd be interested in your collection: Andrew D. Bird, who is doing a second edition of his marvellous "A Separate Little War", and Alex Crawford, who's doing a new book on Tsetse ops.
Have you considered looking either of them up to get your pics published?
I've read Andrew Birds book, A Seperate Little War, he infact describes the attack of the Harbour in Haugesund. To be honest I haven't thought about contacting him, but he may well be interested. The thing with having photos like these, is you (or at least, I) assume lots of people inherited photos from grandfathers and uncles and that they've already been aquired by those who have a specific interest (authors and historians etc.) . However, it's quite possible that very few copies of some of these pictures survive today.
KD
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Hi Again:
I'd agree with you that there are lots of images for which very few copies survive. In many cases, the images are no doubt unique.
There's a thriving market for these things over on ebay, but I've always felt there is a certain responsibility to get the pics published wherever possible or appropriate. The pic you've posted of the Mossie above the sub is I think one of the unique ones, and is quite startling.
Really, thanks for letting us see these incredible shots.
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Great pics and thank you for sharing.
You now it would suck to get killed a few days before the war was over. I fill kinda sorry for those German submariners, and boat guys that probabley got killed, and never got to go home before the wars end.
Is there any info out there that might have the casualty list of Allies and axis killed like a week before the wars end.
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Originally posted by Klum25th
Great pics and thank you for sharing.
You now it would suck to get killed a few days before the war was over. I fill kinda sorry for those German submariners, and boat guys that probabley got killed, and never got to go home before the wars end.
Is there any info out there that might have the casualty list of Allies and axis killed like a week before the wars end.
The information and statistics exist ( for certain groups anyway) but it's more a case of having to check each group individually. There are some very good U-boat sites on the web, for instance.
http://uboat.net/boats/index01.html (http://uboat.net/boats/index01.html)
This site has information about the fate of almost every German submarine in WWII. Of course, like all web sites, I'm not sure how accurate it is...
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KD have you any goog pict of Max Guedj plane ?
I'm still gathering data to make texture when a real mossie will be introduced in AH.
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Originally posted by straffo
KD have you any goog pict of Max Guedj plane ?
I'm still gathering data to make texture when a real mossie will be introduced in AH.
Sorry, no. All my Banff photographs are combat pictures, so I don't have any plane to plane shots other than those which happen to have other aircraft in the frame during an attack.
The RAF web site does have a picture showing 248's markings
(http://www.raf.mod.uk/history/h_images/248sqnmosquitovi.gif)
I also came across this picture of a model of a 248 squadron Mossie.
(http://www.mossie.org/images/models/die-cast/corgi/AA32805.jpg)
Although they purport to be of the same aircraft, different underside colour schemes are shown.
Then there are these pics by Bob Pearson showing different schemes again.
(http://www.airwar.ru/image/idop/sww2/dh98tsetse/dh98tsetse-c1.jpg)
(http://www.airwar.ru/image/idop/sww2/dh98tsetse/dh98tsetse-c2.jpg)
By the way, the above photo of the Mosquito over the U-boat was most likely an attack against U-boat U2359 (type XXIII)which was sunk with all hands by Mosquitos of the Strike Wing in the Kattegat on May 2 1945. It may be another U-boat of the same type which was damaged in the attack.
KD
Stay tuned for the Dallachy Strike wing Beaufighter Pictures! They'll be up today.
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Hi KD303,
Excellent strike photos, thanks for posting.
I have one or two comments about these and other posts in this thread.
The first is definately a frame from a Tse-tse. The tracer on the 6pdr is clearly visible. Shots like this are extremely hard to find.
The 404 Squadron RCAF attack on 21 October 1944 also involved Tse-tse's. Three ships were attacked during this raid. They were Eckenheim 1,932t, Vestra 1,432t and Taube. The escort vessels VP5310 and S11 were also damaged. The ship in the photo is high out of the water suggesting it has no cargo. The Vestra was carrying a load of limestone so we can rule her out. I don't have cargo details for the other two. The Vestra was sunk and the other two damaged.
During this raid a Tse-tse PZ251/I was shot down by flak with the loss of Fly Off Driscol and Fly Off Hannant.
The colour side views are interesting although HR138/Y was not a Tse-tse. I have a full list of all 17 Tse-tse plus the prototype. The Tse-tse serials are:
HJ732 (Prototype), HX902, HX903, HX904, MM424, MM425, NT224, NT225, PZ251, PZ252, PZ300, PZ301, PZ346, PZ467, PZ468PZ469 and PZ470.
Regards,
Alex
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Here is a list of all Mossies, http://www.dehavilland.ukf.net/_DH98%20prodn%20list.txt
It is pretty accurate, overall.
Some other good links to the Mossies.
http://www.faqs.org/docs/air/avmoss.html
http://www.mossie.org/Mosquito.html
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Very cool pics, especially the one with the U-boat! Thanks for sharing!
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Originally posted by Alex Crawford
Hi KD303,
Excellent strike photos, thanks for posting.
I have one or two comments about these and other posts in this thread.
The first is definately a frame from a Tse-tse. The tracer on the 6pdr is clearly visible. Shots like this are extremely hard to find.
During this raid a Tse-tse PZ251/I was shot down by flak with the loss of Fly Off Driscol and Fly Off Hannant.
The colour side views are interesting although HR138/Y was not a Tse-tse.
Regards,
Alex
Thanks for posting Alex. The artist who painted HR138/y has made a boo boo!
Unfortunately the photograph I posted from the MK XVIII doesn't have an identifying letter on the offical stamp on the back and there is no frisket with usual info on the photograph itself- only has the squadron number hand-written on the RAF Banff stamp which itself is dated - 3 May 1945.
Could the ship in the Haugesund photograph be Eckenheim which I believe was very badly damaged? I think she sank in a related incident sometime after she put to sea again. Whichever one she is, the ship in the picture was clearly under heavy attack and the photo seems to be from the first aircraft attacking her (in formation with others, judging from cannon splashes etc. ) as I can't see any aircraft infront. I'd be very interested to know for sure.
Thanks for everyone's comments.
KD
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What's a Tse-tse?
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Originally posted by Scrap
What's a Tse-tse?
A nasty kind of fly. It's also the name given to the MK XVIII Mosquito, which had a 6 pounder gun in the nose.
KD
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a mossie with a big f* off cannon in the nose ;)
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Hi,
Apparently I can't post any attachments or I would have posted 1-2 piccies of the 6pdr as fitted to the Tse-tse.
Alex
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Alex you need to upload them somewhere then link them using the 'IMG' button at the top when you post a message.
you can create an account and upload them here: http://www.furballunderground.com
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Furbie, do you hold that site?
I have tons of stuff that I could give to ya. Freeeee!
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Hi KD303,
No luck yet on trying to find out the cargos of the Eckenheim and Taube.
I've just had a look through 'A Seperate Little War' by Andy Bird. He has a photo of the ship under attack in Haugesund Harbour that appears to have been taken seconds earlier than your photo.
The shell spalshes on the left and right of the photo are fresh, ie you can still see the water splashes, whereas in your photo they are more subdued. The photo was taken further out from the ship so it could still be from the same aircraft.
Alex
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Interesting. I imagine it would be from the same aircraft or one off its wing due to the lack off other aircraft in my photograph.
Me picture is from "R" 404.
Frisket tape reads: 364 BNF 21 OCT 44// R404. F8 ATTACK ON ENEMY SHIPPING, HAUGESUND 500' BNF/02/21/OCT.
I must have a look at Andrew Birds book. It's a while since I read it. Seem to remember a picture of the Haugesund raid.
KD
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Hi,
Andy is working on a 2nd edition of 'A Seperate Little War'. He is also working on a book about the Beaufighters of the Dallachy Strike Wing.
Alex
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Any idea about publications dates? He might be interested in seeing the Risnes Fjord pictures. There's a painting "Strike And Strike Again" which looks like it depicts that attack. The page I've linked below offers signed prints and mentions that two of the aircrew who signed the prints were on the Risnes Fjord shipping strike. The fact that the text points this out suggests that the painting is of that raid.
(http://www.aviationartgallery.co.uk/Images/Aviation-Art-Gallery-Images/Strike-and-strike-again.jpg)
http://www.brooksart.com/Strikeandstrikeagain2.html (http://www.brooksart.com/Strikeandstrikeagain2.html)
KD
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Thank for the profile KD
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KD you seen this signed print?
Bargain at only £25.00.
http://www.dehavillandmuseum.co.uk/mospaint2.html
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Originally posted by Angus
Furbie, do you hold that site?
I have tons of stuff that I could give to ya. Freeeee!
i think i missed this - it is Morph's site. he is very eager to create a "gallery" section of wwii images etc, im sure he will take you up on it!
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In January 1945, my uncle Flight Lieutenant W.M.O. Jones was posted to RAF Banff as the pilot for the RAF Film Production Unit covering the operational missions of the Banff strike wing Mosquitoes and some of the RAF Dallachy Beaufighters strike wing missions as well.
>He flew DZ 592, a PR 1V Mosquito up to Banff in January 1945 from RAF Benson after it had been modified for film work.
>My uncle was accompanied by F/O Allan J Newell as his navigator/cameraman on all missions.
>Sadly they were killed in an attack, 09/04/45 accompanying the Banff strike wing over the Katterat. The strike wing attacked three U boats sailing on the surface. The FPU a/c made three low level passes over the U boats filming each wave of the attack. As they were over the second U boat it blew up killing both of the crew.
>I have been in contact with Andy Bird and he included the info I sent him in his excellent book A Separate little war.
>If any of your photos are shot by the FPU mossie covering the Banff/Dallachy wings I would be very grateful for a copy.
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My cousin was F/O A.J.Newell who I met once when a small boy but he made a lasting impression on me and it is fascinating after 67 years or so to find so much information and indeed pictures.The basic facts were part of family folk lore but this is the first time I have ever seen them substantiated.
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The pics are gone!
Can someone post them again by any chance?
I developed a fascination with the exploits of coastal command. They had some insane Mossie/Beau raids including wild dogfights with the LW.
"A separate little war" is in my shopping list.
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I have them bozon, will try to post, will require an enormous act of organisation to get it done, bear with me.
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Copies of photos, not mine as indicated by thread. Titles give some info:
(http://i937.photobucket.com/albums/ad212/mhuxt/Norway12.jpg)
(http://i937.photobucket.com/albums/ad212/mhuxt/HagesundOct211944.jpg)
(http://i937.photobucket.com/albums/ad212/mhuxt/Apr2345T144.jpg)
(http://i937.photobucket.com/albums/ad212/mhuxt/Apr2345W144.jpg)
(http://i937.photobucket.com/albums/ad212/mhuxt/Apr2345U455.jpg)
(http://i937.photobucket.com/albums/ad212/mhuxt/Apr2345F144.jpg)
(http://i937.photobucket.com/albums/ad212/mhuxt/Apr2345O144.jpg)
(http://i937.photobucket.com/albums/ad212/mhuxt/From248SqnTsetse.jpg)
(http://i937.photobucket.com/albums/ad212/mhuxt/May31945fromLA-A.jpg)
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Unbelievable!
Great many thanks Scherf.
In the one with the ship parked at the fjord wall, they couldn't have been more than a couple of meters above its masts.
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Yeah, rather white-knuckle stuff.
There was one Mosquito, right at the end of the war, came back to Banff with a ship's ensign embedded in its nose.
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Yeah, rather white-knuckle stuff.
There was one Mosquito, right at the end of the war, came back to Banff with a ship's ensign embedded in its nose.
And in mid 42 a Beaufighter hit the cable between the 2 masts of a merchant ship and snapped it with only minor damage to the plane. Same could not be said of the ship as it had taken collisions from multiple 20mm shells and 303 bullets.
in 1 attack six Beau used 1400 cannon and 20,500 rounds of 303 attacking japanese at Leahy's farm in New Guinea
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Excellent pics - many thanks for reposting them Scherf, missed them first time round.
Wurz
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Fantastic pictures! :salute
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The title of the pic with the U-Boat indicates 3 May 1945 - I believe Beaus attacked subs on that date, but not Mossies. If it's actually 2 May, that might be U-2359, which was sunk by the Banff wing on that date, another u-boat being damaged and an M-Class minesweeper left burning. I have know idea if the shape of the conning tower ir right for U-2359 however.
The other startling shot is the one with the Molins shell racing towards the ship - very rare pic. Another M-Class perhaps, though that's just a guess.
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This site has shots apparently of U-2359, for comparison. Seems the boat has been found, and there is an effort underway to raise it.
http://www.u2359.com/?p=813
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(http://media.iwm.org.uk/iwm/mediaLib/9/media-9602/standard.jpg)
Alot of Coastal Command attacked from low to wave height.
(http://media.iwm.org.uk/iwm/mediaLib/54/media-54402/standard.jpg)
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Alot of Coastal Command attacked from low to wave height.
From my understanding, when they started to do rockets attacks, they were doing them at shallow angles in an attempt to hit the waterline (or under) on the ship hulls. With cannons, the bridge is the prime target which favors shallow angles as well. Inside the confined space of the fjords this was not always possible to do.
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:O
I forgot about those photos. They were amazing. But you can't help but feel some of the horrors of war, there were men on those ships and in those airplanes. Men with wives, families, kids, and people who cared about them.
Thanks for posting the, guys.
Fork
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I forgot about those photos. They were amazing. But you can't help but feel some of the horrors of war, there were men on those ships and in those airplanes. Men with wives, families, kids, and people who cared about them.
Men back then were different than man today. For starters, they did not have colors - I have photographic evidence of that.
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Men back then were different than man today. For starters, they did not have colors - I have photographic evidence of that.
(http://www.photographyblackwhite.com/wp-content/uploads/yapb_cache/dadbandwandcolour.2z3t9j8r9we8cgkk8804s08w8.6ylu316ao144c8c4woosog48w.th.jpeg)