Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aircraft and Vehicles => Topic started by: Dace on January 05, 2006, 08:15:21 PM
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C'mon everyone, SCREAM!!!!!!!!!! with me. It is getting ridiculous, way worse than the La7. The bugger of it is, the poor Spit14 gets no love with its light perks because ...why the hell would u fly a spit14 when the 16 is way more uber and it doesnt cost.
Take perks from Spit14,..apply them to the spit16.
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Does anyone have performance specs on this thing??
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Look at the specs for 1943 LF IX, only difference is the LF IX has .303's instead of 50cals.
Or in other words it performs identically to a clipped 1943 LF IXc, and a clipped 1944 LF IXe.
They all use the same airframe, same engine, only reason for designating it the XVI and not IX, was the engine (Merlin 266 same as Merlin 66) was manufactured in the U.S. and needed different tooling.
http://www.spitfireperformance.com/spitfire-IX.html
Has figures for non-clipped LF IX, look for the Merlin 66 @ 18lbs ones.
Interesting is near the bottom, what a Merlin 66 based spit at 25lbs boost could do :) .
Unperk the XIV it's all I'll fly, it's way far more of a beast with its 2000HP+ Griffon motor.
Dace - You do realise the XVI is the same as an LF IX (see above)? And not some wierd late war Griffon engined spit.
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Regardless of date, or spreadsheet performance, the 16 is ridiculously overmodelled, and is far more dangerous in the MA than any other plane. It's ruining the game.
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Originally posted by hubsonfire
Regardless of date, or spreadsheet performance, the 16 is ridiculously overmodelled, and is far more dangerous in the MA than any other plane. It's ruining the game.
EXCATLY
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Originally posted by Dace
EXCATLY
Figures, guess what plane has killed Dace more than any other?
Whats up? Is it ruining your K/D ratio?
Sorry Dace uncalled for, my apologies.
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Guess which plane has killed more of EVERYONE in the entire game than any other plane? :P
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LoL - guess which plane has been shot down more than any other ;p
hubsonfire -
Overmodelled? - WHERE.
The ONLY discrepency found was that it was suggested it was a few mph too fast on the deck.
But that was comparing it to figures for a non-clipped IX.
All clipped Spits were faster at low alts (but slower high alts) than their respective non-clipped stablemates.
At least show some data to back up your overmodelled claim.
Dace -
I'll go along with unperk the XIV, perk the XVI.
Whats gonna happen the very next tour when you have 2000HP Griffon XIV's running rampant in the MA?
You'll be back asking for it to be re-perked.
I suggest you look at the performance of the XIV.
Theres also NO reason the XIV couldn't be clipped either.
Basically as it stands if you meet a XIV hi-alt once he gets on your tail you can dive for the low alt furball, reasonably confident he won't follow you down.
Remove the perk cost your unshackling a beast.
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Perk needs its own forum on the AH BBS.
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It is the apex predator of AH. How you plan to perpetually deny that using actual data from the war defies my comprehension. AH isn't WW2. The standard engagement of WW2 is nothing like the standard furball of AH.
The 16 is, while not the best in every category, the best compromise of each category.
There is no better plane for AH than the 16. It must be perked.
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The dive model in AH is porked big time. EVERY plane dives far better than it ought to, including spits. So basically a dive does nothing but keep you steady in the other guy's gunsights while he matches you move for move. If he's 600 off yer butt, diving won't help because he'll still be 600 off yer butt, shooting you down.
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Not unless other superior performing planes are perked with it. If it's a calling to perk the Spit16 only, and leave every other plane in the MA as it is, then I will never support something like that.
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43,991 kills last camp. What more do you want? Perk the damned thing, bring some balance back to the MA.
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Originally posted by hubsonfire
43,991 kills last camp. What more do you want? Perk the damned thing, bring some balance back to the MA.
i agree.
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Originally posted by hubsonfire
43,991 kills last camp. What more do you want? Perk the damned thing, bring some balance back to the MA.
And 38519 deaths with a K/D of 1.14
HARDLY the apex predator you describe.
Now if it had a K/D of 2 or more, I would probably agree.
Looking back at the CHog - When it was free it still maintainted an over 2.0 K/D ratio, I would say if the XVI ever hits the same it should probably get perked also.
Until then, LEAVE IT ALONE.
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Originally posted by Dace
C'mon everyone, SCREAM!!!!!!!!!! with me. It is getting ridiculous, way worse than the La7. The bugger of it is, the poor Spit14 gets no love with its light perks because ...why the hell would u fly a spit14 when the 16 is way more uber and it doesnt cost.
Take perks from Spit14,..apply them to the spit16.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0870210599/104-1079378-7529505?v=glance&n=283155
Originally posted by hubsonfire
43,991 kills last camp. What more do you want? Perk the damned thing, bring some balance back to the MA.
Balance in the MA ?
you want to break my Troll-O-Meter ?
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Originally posted by Dace
C'mon everyone, SCREAM!!!!!!!!!! with me. It is getting ridiculous, way worse than the La7. The bugger of it is, the poor Spit14 gets no love with its light perks because ...why the hell would u fly a spit14 when the 16 is way more uber and it doesnt cost.
Take perks from Spit14,..apply them to the spit16.
NO ! Leave the Spit XIV alone, no perks
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Total deaths for fighters tour 70 - 309785
Total deaths for fighters tour 71 - 339415
My point?
Thats 30,000 more sorties AT least between the two tours, was similar for tour 69 to tour 70.
So there's been an approximate increase of over 60,000 sorties over the last 3 tours. Thats a hell of a lot.
OK you perk the XVI, thats 41,000 sorties 'at least' that will go to other planes. Probably a lot to the VIII, a lot to the La 7 and the minor rest scattered around.
This would push the La7 most likely to a higher level of usage than before, so then we're back to the 'perk the Lala' whines.
Ok they perk the Lala, thats now all its flights to be redistributed.
You see my point I hope?
There will ALWAYS be a popular plane.
Does it mean it should be perked?
If it can maintain a good K/D ratio I would say yes.
The fact the XVI has only a 1.14 K/D proves it's not the APEX PREDATOR some claim it is.
The same reason probably saved the La7 from a perk, it never really exceeds 1.1x either.
The thought of 40,000+ La7 sorties per tour all running would conscern me a lot more than the XVI.
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Right now the Spit stands at the top of the kill list with its 43K+ kills. but if it was perked, another plane would get there, most probably the La-7. Ok, lets perk it too... only to see another plane becoming the main ride for the majority of players. There will be always a top one, a most numerous one. And as the Spit XVI has only scored about 10% of all kills - so i do not think you can say that it dominates the arena. And by looking at the K/D ratio, it is clear that the common perception of this plane is somewhat distorted - itīs not the killer you would expect it to be after you have read some threads here.
It may be true that the popularity of the Spit XVI results in diminishing use of other Spit variants - but if you like other planes more than the XVI, fly them yourself! ;)
So IMHO it is not necessary to perk the XVI (but that is not a statement wether the XIV should be unperked or not)
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Originally posted by Lusche
Right now the Spit stands at the top of the kill list with its 43K+ kills. but if it was perked, another plane would get there, most probably the La-7. Ok, lets perk it too... only to see another plane becoming the main ride for the majority of players. There will be always a top one, a most numerous one. And as the Spit XVI has only scored about 10% of all kills - so i do not think you can say that it dominates the arena. And by looking at the K/D ratio, it is clear that the common perception of this plane is somewhat distorted - itīs not the killer you would expect it to be after you have read some threads here.
It may be true that the popularity of the Spit XVI results in diminishing use of other Spit variants - but if you like other planes more than the XVI, fly them yourself! ;)
So IMHO it is not necessary to perk the XVI (but that is not a statement wether the XIV should be unperked or not)
Exactly.
Maybe before people start asking for it be perked they should ask themselves one question -
Which planes will get the 40,000 sorties currently the XVI is getting?
My guess - La7 mostly, followed by VIII/IX, very little spread out over the rest.
It only needs 3% of the Spit XVI sorties going to the La7, to result in the La7 exceeding current XVI sorties.
Would I pay for a Spit XVI - Nope, it's just not 'survivable' enough in the MA. The XIV barely survives in the MA, the XVI would become ultimate late war 'Hangar Queen'.
Try unperking the XIV for one tour, see what happens. Most newbs assume 16 v 14, 16 = higher number, must be better than a 14.
Most don't even know the VIII came after the IX and was considered by the pilots the best Merlin spit ever produced.
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Perk the spit 16 now.
Keep it cheep, heck split the perks for the 14 & the 16.
Perk em both at 2 perks for all I care.
But perk em and do it now.
Sick & tired of HO'ing running spitfires that can outclimb outrun out turn every plane in the set.
That is by definintion, unbalancing. Thats what the perks are for.
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GhostH-
"Sick & tired of HO'ing running spitfires that can outclimb outrun out turn every plane in the set."
Outrun?
I don't believe the Spit 16 is even in the top 10 fastest.
Outurn?
It's probably in top 10, but towards 10.
Outclimb?
Probably #3 in the planeset (depends on alt)
Hardly what your statement is describing.
Part of its beauty is that they have no option but to fight 90%+ of the time.
Or would you rather be chasing lots more, faster La7's if the XVI was perked?
If your not catching a XVI, theres no way you'll catch an La7.
Seeing as you seem to fly the La5N and Yak 9T, I can't see how Spit XVI's are running away.
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The 16 has a lot more deaths, and lower K/D, because the CHog was and remains a vulcher. Short flight off a CV, bunch of vulch runs, retreat to the puffy ack, and land.
I'm not sure why you keep saying we'll only have La7s. La7 kills, and K/D, are up, way up, since the 16 was introduced. This can't mean that all the La7 pilots upgraded to spits, and that perking the spit will mean another 40000 La7s. This is just your attempt at panic-mongering to attempt to prevent what must obviously be done.
You keep saying the Spit isn't good at anything. If it's such a rotten plane, why does anyone fly it? It's not well armed, it's slow, it turns poorly, blah blah blah. BS. 44,000 kills. More than any other plane. Perk it. Sick and tired of seeing nothing but free latewar uberspits hording anything in the air.
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Originally posted by hubsonfire
The 16 has a lot more deaths, and lower K/D, because the CHog was and remains a vulcher. Short flight off a CV, bunch of vulch runs, retreat to the puffy ack, and land.
I'm not sure why you keep saying we'll only have La7s. La7 kills, and K/D, are up, way up, since the 16 was introduced. This can't mean that all the La7 pilots upgraded to spits, and that perking the spit will mean another 40000 La7s. This is just your attempt at panic-mongering to attempt to prevent what must obviously be done.
You keep saying the Spit isn't good at anything. If it's such a rotten plane, why does anyone fly it? It's not well armed, it's slow, it turns poorly, blah blah blah. BS. 44,000 kills. More than any other plane. Perk it. Sick and tired of seeing nothing but free latewar uberspits hording anything in the air.
Re-check your La7 stats, youll find your wrong.
Its deaths and k/d have remained very similar throught the last 3 tours.
What has changed is that the overall number of fighter sorties has increased by some 60,000 the last 3 tours.
Well BS 44,000 kils to you. If it's flown the most OF COURSE it going to have the most kills, on the flipside it also has the MOST deaths.
A K/D of 1.14, is hardly the APEX PREDATOR you keep harping on about.
Spin it anyway you want, a K/D% of only 1.14 doesn't make it an apex predator of any kind.
Like I said if was above 2.0 I think you'd have a valid point, that puts it up in the same K/D range as other perked aircraft. (apart from the XIV).
OK then smarty, where do YOU think 40,000 odd sorties are going to go?
Maybe they'll just disappear never to be seen again.
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if ur dieing to spit16s alot, try using some ACM and not fight ITS fight.
if u fight the 16 on its terms u will die.
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They'll largely go to the Spit VIII, which will then suffer calls to be perked.
10% is a lot yes, but not that bad. The F4U-1C was hitting almost 20% before it got perked.
EDIT:
Ok, answer this then. As some fighter will always be at the top, what is the criteria that you find acceptable? Less than 7.5% of the total kills? Less than 5%? Must be American? German? Russian? Japanese? Italian? Must do more than 360mph on the deck? Must do less than 330mph on the deck? Must be armed with machine guns? Cannons? Like pornography, you'll know it when you see it?
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Originally posted by whels
if ur dieing to spit16s alot, try using some ACM and not fight ITS fight.
if u fight the 16 on its terms u will die.
Please give me some tips how I can fight against Spit XVI in 109G2/109G6?
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I must be missing something here. I usually fly a Spit VIII. Is the 16 so much more super duper that I am way outclassed by it? If so then I haven't noticed it. I hardly cringe in fear going against a 16.
Or is more that somebodys favorite ride is getting it's butt kicked by guys flying 16's?
Perk the 16 and the 8 will dominate I would think.
Oh, and perk the Tiffys and 190's. They are my personal pain in rear.
:D
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Heres the alleged 'uber' Spit -
Removing GV, buffs etc from the kills and deaths so it just plain fighter v fighter -
Last tour the spit XVI managed a whopping 1.06 K/D against ALL other fighters.
Wheres the 'uber' apex predator I keep reading about?
If you remove the current perk planes from the list the K/D gets worse.
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Originally posted by Vuokko
Please give me some tips how I can fight against Spit XVI in 109G2/109G6?
Outdated fighters simply rely on superior air combat manuevering. As this is a 1944/45 arena your Bf109G-2 and Bf109G-6 are just massively outdated, as is my Mosquito Mk VI. If you want the Bf109G-2 and Bf109G-6 to be competitive you need a 1943 MA really.
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Am I missing something?
So far on this tour (up to now, of course) the Spitfire MK VIII has killed 82 Spit MK XVIs
The MK XVI has killed 76 MK VIIIs.
So when they've fought each other, the MK VIII has come out on top more often. So I don't understand the problem with the MK XVI not being perked if it's not dominating the MK VIII which you don't want perked.
KD
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Anybody considered the fact that there could be more total killls & sorties with the introduction of maps with fighter towns? It's not like you have to up, climb for a few minutes, look for a fight, and start your engagement.
Now, you can jump in a fighter, up from a 5k base into a 1k fight, and start shooting immediately. You don't even have time for a smoke break since, for the most part, there's no climb out. The, with the non-stop fighters streaming into the area, escape options (especially in slow rides) are very severely limited.
I wouldn't be so quick to say 44k sorties in a SpitXVI is because it's uber. The biggest furball in the game never ends on some maps, and it's *right* there next to a convenient base on each side.
edit: okay, 1 fighter town that I know of. however, if it's up for an entire week, it's more than enough to skew the numbers with the 30 second trips to the fight.
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Originally posted by indy007
Anybody considered the fact that there could be more total killls & sorties with the introduction of maps with fighter towns? It's not like you have to up, climb for a few minutes, look for a fight, and start your engagement.
Now, you can jump in a fighter, up from a 5k base into a 1k fight, and start shooting immediately. You don't even have time for a smoke break since, for the most part, there's no climb out. The, with the non-stop fighters streaming into the area, escape options (especially in slow rides) are very severely limited.
I wouldn't be so quick to say 44k sorties in a SpitXVI is because it's uber. The biggest furball in the game never ends on some maps, and it's *right* there next to a convenient base on each side.
Thats just it, despite all the 'uber' XVI claims no stats come even close to supporting the claim.
Fighter v fighter last tour it managed a 1.06 K/D ratio.
Including GV, Buffs etc it rises to all conquering 1.14 LOLOLOLOLOL.
'Uber' for sure, .
Top 5 K/D non perked planes -
Tiffy - 1.507
K4 - 1.505
190D9 - 1.495
Ki-84 - 1.450
190A5 - 1.414
Yet people have the gall to suggest a 1.14K/D makes a Spit XVI uber, sorry nothing in the stats proves it.
Even the so called 'uber' XIV only manages 1.078 (consitently the lowest of all the perked planes by a LONG way, rest all manage 2.0+).
Its nothing to do with uber Spits, it about getting Spits outta the MA and making them 'Hanger Queens" like the XIV.
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Kev here are some speed #s wow is spit16 slow OTD.
SPIT 16 14 8 9
no wep / wep
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15k 368/385 398/413 363/380 375/383
10k 357/383 375/405 351/378 353/363
5k 336/363 352/382 330/358 331/341
otd 315/342 329/358 310/337 310/319
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Whels I don't believe it's even in the top 10 fastest non perked planes.
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Originally posted by Vuokko
Please give me some tips how I can fight against Spit XVI in 109G2/109G6?
i dont fly 109s much but id venture to say, rule 1 dont TnB vs spit16/8.
use speed/alt to BnZ the spit, keeping ur alt adv, maybe turn 1/2 turn for shots but keep speed n extend. if u get co alt/E then its time to extend away. G2 has speed advantage of about 10mph or more until OTD
where its just slightly faster.
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No surprising, its essentially a 1943 LF IX with an "E" wing. Its not a 2000hp Griffon Spitfire like the XIV or XII is.
...but it is faster down low than an F.IX to be sure.
I would have preffered a "LF IX" designation as I said before folks see "XVI" and they think its supposed to be as fast as a XIV.
That and XVI and XIV are just too similar looking, and I think just causes confusion.
1A
VB
F IX
LF IX
LF VIII
F XIV
Makes more sense to me for differentiating them.
A LF IX (late) is exactly the same as a XVI.
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Originally posted by Kev367th
Whels I don't believe it's even in the top 10 fastest non perked planes.
Kev,
try just barely breaks into top 25 in speed.
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It is also a fact of that when you see a horde rolling in, it is full of Spit 16's and Lgay-7's. The way the 16 climbs is crazy, although going vertical with a 38 and flipping over on it is pretty funny :rofl
It is seen all over the arena, just like the La7.... all the time! You go to Fighter Town, it is there. Tank Town it is there.... it is all over, that I think might be one of the points trying to be made.
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Originally posted by ChristCAF
It is also a fact of that when you see a horde rolling in, it is full of Spit 16's and Lgay-7's. The way the 16 climbs is crazy, although going vertical with a 38 and flipping over on it is pretty funny :rofl
It is seen all over the arena, just like the La7.... all the time! You go to Fighter Town, it is there. Tank Town it is there.... it is all over, that I think might be one of the points trying to be made.
well i see just as many la7s and nikis so they gona be perked too?
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Originally posted by ChristCAF
It is seen all over the arena, just like the La7.... all the time! You go to Fighter Town, it is there. Tank Town it is there.... it is all over, that I think might be one of the points trying to be made.
So you perk it and now the VIII is all over the place. Perk that and we're back to La-7s all over the place and running away. Perk that and hello Typhies. Perk that and we have hordes of N1K2-Js. Those are perked now and we have gobs of P-51Ds. Oops, can't have that so we perk it and now Fw190D-9s are too common, dang, perk it. Where'd all these P-47Ns come from? Well, perk them. Dang it, now we have hordes of P-38Ls. A little perk and that is fixed but now we have too many F4U-1Ds. But perking it has always worked in the past. Confound them, they shouldn't all be using Ki-84s so will teach them by perking it. What to do about these Bf109K-4s though? Ah, perk them. The La-5FN seems to be over used, but not after we perk it. The Bf110G-2 is overmodeled and over used, so we perk it. Same with the P-38J apparently. And the Spit IX. When will people learn not to use the best free fighter? Well, they can't use the Bf109G-14 anymore as we perked it. Why would everybody like the Yak-9U so much? Well, perked and it they don't. Arghhh, stupid Seafire Mk II! Perked I say. Ect, ect, ect....
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Originally posted by Karnak
So you perk it and now the VIII is all over the place. Perk that and we're back to La-7s all over the place and running away. Perk that and hello Typhies. Perk that and we have hordes of N1K2-Js. Those are perked now and we have gobs of P-51Ds. Oops, can't have that so we perk it and now Fw190D-9s are too common, dang, perk it. Where'd all these P-47Ns come from? Well, perk them. Dang it, now we have hordes of P-38Ls. A little perk and that is fixed but now we have too many F4U-1Ds. But perking it has always worked in the past. Confound them, they shouldn't all be using Ki-84s so will teach them by perking it. What to do about these Bf109K-4s though? Ah, perk them. The La-5FN seems to be over used, but not after we perk it. The Bf110G-2 is overmodeled and over used, so we perk it. Same with the P-38J apparently. And the Spit IX. When will people learn not to use the best free fighter? Well, they can't use the Bf109G-14 anymore as we perked it. Why would everybody like the Yak-9U so much? Well, perked and it they don't. Arghhh, stupid Seafire Mk II! Perked I say. Ect, ect, ect....
LOL, has to be the BEST and WITTIEST explanation by far.
There will always be a 'favorite' plane, as long as it's not achieving perk plane levels of a 2.0+ K/D ratio it won't get perked.
Ever wondered why the La7 wasn't perked?
Hint, check back through the stats, look at its K/D.
ChristCAF - The Spit XVI had a hell of a climb rate up to about 20k or so.
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While the spit16 is somewhat "uber"it is very beatable.I t wont prop hang with a 38 so take it in the vertacle and keep it there,watch the quick roll rate force tham to keep nose up and they WILL fall of before the 38.Killed plenty of them in ma the same way.I do agree that the pilot makes a lot of difference but there only so many moves that any a/c is capable of performing.If you decide to play into the strengths of the spit16,you will die.Thats just my theory but I can get my stats to prove it easily enough,or I 'd be glad to test it out in the DA sometime.I'm sure that someone would be willing to test this theory.I'll be in the DA Friday night @9:00 cst ,Just look for the 38J.Perking the spit16 wont change much though because the crowd will just move to the next favorite plane on the list.
VIC
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Originally posted by Vuokko
Please give me some tips how I can fight against Spit XVI in 109G2/109G6?
Forget it, G-2s and G-6s are outdated and wont stand up against 1945 spits like spit 16.
You'll need a 109G-14 (light weight version of 109G-6 with nitros) or 109K to combat them effectively.
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LOL
When the 16 first came out it was as if everyone flying it saw me in my 190A5 and thought "look at that idiot... I'll show him he can't get away now." This last tour wasn't so bad, like all Spitfires I just had to keep in mind they need to be kept "at arms length" so to speak, until the right moment. Or fly an FM2 ;).
Honestly, as the planeset becomes larger and larger I see less and less relevance in the perk system. Except for the jets and rocket plane. When the CHog was introduced the main arena was quite different from now. When you saw a sky full of CHogs heading toward your field (like the old screenshot of one of Ripsnort's missions), you knew it was going to hurt. Especially when all we had was the M16 MGMC. Add to that guys like Torque, kbman, and other CHog specialists. The result was many interesting threads on the BBS. Now the planeset is much bigger and on the whole seems more balanced in my opinion. Mixing it up in one of the current perk props can still result in a trip to the tower. No need to perk the 16.
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Originally posted by 1K3
Forget it, G-2s and G-6s are outdated and wont stand up against 1945 spits like spit 16.
You'll need a 109G-14 (light weight version of 109G-6 with nitros) or 109K to combat them effectively.
Thereby hangs the problem -
Most don't even know what a Spit XVI is or when it reached service.
Let do the 2nd one 1st -
October 1944 - NOT 1945.
What is it? -
It's a 1943 LF IX with an 'e' wing (20mms + 50cals).
Everything else is IDENTICAL to the 1943 LF IX
Same airframe, same motor.
Performance is for all purposes IDENTICAL.
A clipped wing 1943 LF IXc performs the same as a 1943 LF XIe, performs the same as an 1944 XVIe.
Why XVI? -
Because the motor was manufactured in the USA under US measurements. To prevent confusion and distinguish the different tooling required the LF IXe with a US produced Merlin 66 (Merlin 266) was redisignated the XVI.
(They couldn't use XV as it was in use for the 1st Griffon powered Seafire)
To summarise, yet again -
A 1944 Spit XVI has the same performance as a 1944 LF IXe has the same performance as a 1943 LF IXc.
It's not some 'uber' 1945 late anything, it's performance put it fairly and squarely in 1943.
The only way it would become a 1944/45 performing Spit XVI would be if the boost were increased from 18lbs to 25lbs.
The same Merlin numbering system was used for ones used in RAAF Mossies.
i.e. A number was added in-front of the Rolls Royce designation to show it was manufactured abroad.
Hence the Merlin 266 (used in the XVI) is an American built Merlin 66 (used in the LF VIII, LF IX), not some super boosted version.
To make it easy - IGNORE the XVI tag, think of it as a LF IXe.
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so you are saying....
if we get a Spitfire LFIX we will have to perk that too?
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What if everybody grabbed a VIII instead? which they would.
It would be "perk the Spit VIII". Its essentially a F IX but faster down low, just like the XVI.
That would be next.
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Originally posted by Squire
What if everybody grabbed a VIII instead? which they would.
It would be "perk the Spit VIII". Its essentially a F IX but faster down low, just like the XVI.
That would be next.
Spit 8 basically a refined Ki-84 and people havent discovered it yet
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They just picks 16s out of habit, but that would change under any new perk scheme.
I never really understood the "Perk Doctors" anyways, they think that those kinds of adjustements will "fix" something in the MA and it doesnt, it just shifts the same problem elsewhere, on to another type, LA-7, N1K2, P-51, Ki-84, whatever...its a multi sided war with free a/c and there will always be a top 2-3 choices that many players choose to pick.
Its like watching a dog chase its tail.
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Originally posted by Squire
Its like watching a dog chase its tail.
Best analysis so far... :aok
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Originally posted by Squire
Its like watching a dog chase its tail.
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:aok
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Originally posted by Squire
They just picks 16s out of habit, but that would change under any new perk scheme.
I never really understood the "Perk Doctors" anyways,
They cry for perk because they suck.
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HTC should add the Ki-84-I-Otsu with the four Ho-5 20mm cannon. That would be used with some frequency I think and it wasn't that rare with about 500 built, more than three cannon La-7s.
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Originally posted by Furball
so you are saying....
if we get a Spitfire LFIX we will have to perk that too?
Yup after all they are the same aircraft, just motor produced in a different country.
Funny thing was both the LF IX and LF XVI rolled off the same production line side by side in Castle Bromwich.
All that decided which one they were going to become was which motor got fitted, the US produced Merlin 266 or the Rolls Royce produced Merlin 66.
Prior to the US built Merlin 266 they were all LF IX's. (1943 - Oct 1944)
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lets hope we never get an LF IX then, would hate to see all 3 of the spits perked :mad:
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Originally posted by Furball
lets hope we never get an LF IX then, would hate to see all 3 of the spits perked :mad:
No point having the 1944 LF IX, we already have it - XVI. (only thing that makes it 1944 is the 50cals, everything else is identical to the 1943 LF IX).
Unless you mean a 1943 LF IX with 2 x 20mm and 4 x.303. Even then the VIII is so close theres still really no point.
Wouldn't worry anyway, XVI won't get perked unless -
a) It starts to get into the 2.0+ K/D range at current usage levels.
b) It starts getting 20%+ of the kills in the MA (like the CHog fiasco).
Can't see either happening.
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Originally posted by Karnak
HTC should add the Ki-84-I-Otsu with the four Ho-5 20mm cannon. That would be used with some frequency I think and it wasn't that rare with about 500 built, more than three cannon La-7s.
It'd replace the Niki, imo. It would take some time, but the Ki-84 outhandles the Niki in a fight, so the only reason to fly the Niki over it is that the Niki has twice the firepower. Put 4 20mm on the Ki-84 and you'd have a new top 5 plane.
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Originally posted by Furball
lets hope we never get an LF IX then, would hate to see all 3 of the spits perked :mad:
Prefer -
Old 'V' reinstated as a 1943 clipped LF Vc with Merlin 55M
Add XII
That would be the ultimate Spit list without getting into HF marks.
Although could always dream for an F.21 also , but that would be quite rightly perked.
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Originally posted by Urchin
It'd replace the Niki, imo. It would take some time, but the Ki-84 outhandles the Niki in a fight, so the only reason to fly the Niki over it is that the Niki has twice the firepower. Put 4 20mm on the Ki-84 and you'd have a new top 5 plane.
nah N1K needs rework. It's so daaaaamn smurfy that it's not funny. I still can't believe people still fly that smurfy plane.
If HTC reworks N1K2-J then it will recieve automatic-extending flaps. N1K2-J had that feature.
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Originally posted by whels
well i see just as many la7s and nikis so they gona be perked too?
If you would have read the my post... you would have seen I had the La7 in there... :rolleyes: Niki's are popular as well.... I don't don't care what you or anyone fly's. If they want to fly the little yank-n-jank planes, that is fine with me. I barely fly any perk rides except the Ta152 and a Tempest from time to time. I have more than enough perks to burn, so I don't care if I lose 5 or 250....
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Originally posted by Karnak
So you perk it and now the VIII is all over the place. Perk that and we're back to La-7s all over the place and running away. Perk that and hello Typhies. Perk that and we have hordes of N1K2-Js. Those are perked now and we have gobs of P-51Ds. Oops, can't have that so we perk it and now Fw190D-9s are too common, dang, perk it. Where'd all these P-47Ns come from? Well, perk them. Dang it, now we have hordes of P-38Ls. A little perk and that is fixed but now we have too many F4U-1Ds. But perking it has always worked in the past. Confound them, they shouldn't all be using Ki-84s so will teach them by perking it. What to do about these Bf109K-4s though? Ah, perk them. The La-5FN seems to be over used, but not after we perk it. The Bf110G-2 is overmodeled and over used, so we perk it. Same with the P-38J apparently. And the Spit IX. When will people learn not to use the best free fighter? Well, they can't use the Bf109G-14 anymore as we perked it. Why would everybody like the Yak-9U so much? Well, perked and it they don't. Arghhh, stupid Seafire Mk II! Perked I say. Ect, ect, ect....
:huh Were you drunk when you typed that, cause it sounded like rambling..... :confused:
Kev: Thanks for the for the info on the 16, I try not to fly it alot unless I need to climb up really quick. I figure there are like 9 billion of them in the game so I don't need to fly it! :D
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Originally posted by Urchin
It'd replace the Niki, imo. It would take some time, but the Ki-84 outhandles the Niki in a fight, so the only reason to fly the Niki over it is that the Niki has twice the firepower. Put 4 20mm on the Ki-84 and you'd have a new top 5 plane.
No, it'd only have 150 rounds per gun, and with the Ho-5s are the fastest firing 20mm cannon in AH whereas the Type 99 Model IIs are the slowest firing.
I think it would boost the Ki-84's popularity, bit not really at the expense of the N1K2-J's.
CristCAF,
No, just getting really tired of people's favortism and anti-Spitfire crap.
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Originally posted by Karnak
CristCAF,
No, just getting really tired of people's favortism and anti-Spitfire crap.
Trust me bro... I don't favor the Spit.... but your point is valid. We should perk everything!! :D