Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Axis vs Allies => Topic started by: FiLtH on February 06, 2006, 09:39:50 AM
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If you enjoy bombing, or want to learn how in the AvA, theres a few of us in there that usually go on around 9 pm et most nights. We try to keep close formations, and also enjoy the benefits of a good escort.
This isnt a squad...this is just a bunch of people who like to bomb stuff and look good doing it. There is always action. Normally we report to the Luftwaffe (simulating spies in England) that a B17 mission is leaving England. This gives the enemy time to organize a defense.
Although capture isnt on, the bombing missions we do are the type where the fun is in getting there.
So if it sounds good to you, stop in around 9pm et anytime. We will most likely be doing something in there.
Also..we arent locked into one side, so we could be on either side.
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if you want to bomb for the fatherland JG54 will provide capable and willing escort. if you want to bomb for the allieds then DIE DIE DIE.
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I'll provide some fodder.
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There thats the spirit :)
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Filth I flew with you guys friday night under my MA name you and MGD.
That was great.. PM me with what time you guys plan on doing it again I would love to join.
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I will be on tonight doing it if you wanna come in. Probably 9pm et-ish.
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AAR FEB. 6
Bombers- !- signifies sorties flown
MGD - !
Stringer - !
FiLtH - !
Escort- *- signifies kills
Tikto - ***
Later escort-
Kuhn
715B
Targets: A46, A49
Damage- Radars and fuel, and town A46 30%
Enemies Engaged-
FW190A5-
Gear1
Ditch
others unknown
B17s Lost -1
SpitIX Lost- 0
FW190 Lost - 4
1 to gunners
3 to escort
All ships returned to except 1 of Stringers.
Excellent escort provided by Tikto allowed us great success. Tikto is hereby awarded the Air Medal for his achievements.
Status of lost B17 crew unknown presumed KIA due to no chutes where seen.
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to Filth for the organizational work!
I was a 190 forced out of attack but not killed by Titko, had to take the butchered bird home without airelons. Give him another star!
I really wanted to have fun last night, but the combination of organized high alt enemies and a trickling stream of axis planes made that pretty much hopeless. In the end I look back on an hour spent either climbing or getting picked...by escort that knew its job.
I'm trying AvA again after giving up on CT. I've flown only axis, since every time I've logged in they're outnumbered, but I;ve only found fun fights once so far. I'll keep giving it a chance....but Oldman, somebody, counter organize the axis for the interceptions!
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Originally posted by Simaril
I'm trying AvA again after giving up on CT. I've flown only axis, since every time I've logged in they're outnumbered, but I;ve only found fun fights once so far. I'll keep giving it a chance....but Oldman, somebody, counter organize the axis for the interceptions!
Heh, intercepting bomber missions can be a lot of fun, but it does require both time and commitment (although not as much as it requires to organize and launch the bomber raid itself). Time, of course, because you have to climb to alt and form up with your associates. If the mission launches too late, people like yours truly won't be able to participate. Commitment, because you have to forego the pleasures of fighter-v-fighter combat while you form up to oppose the bombers.
Last night, unfortunately, although the mission launched in plenty of time, we just didn't have enough folks who were interested in giving up on the pleasures of dogfighting. Hey, I understand that better than most. What you should take from this, Simaril, is that last night was not a particularly good example of what an interception mission can be. If you get four or five fighters formed up and at the right alt, it's a rush, because it comes as close as anything in this game to simulating what you've read about all these years.
- oldman (who evaded the escort long enough to make two passes on the B17s, but who also forgot to enable his cannons after dropping his fuel tank. I could see the gunners laughing and pointing at me, but couldn't understand why until later.)
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family obligations kept me out last night until around midnight and i only stayed for two sorties as i was bone tired. if you guys will broadcast the next one i'll try to block the time out to participate.
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We're trying to do this..if not everynight..than maybe everyother night between 9-10 pm et. for the remander of the campaign. I will continue to post AARs. If the axis side wants to post theirs here under mine, it would be cool too.
Hopefully we can get more people involved as time go bys. As far as the intercept time involved..I think its a matter of timing. I will announce when a flight leaves England. It takes about 1/2 hr to climb and get close. So in that time Id do your regular stuff. But as the end of that 1/2 hr approaches, think about replaning and grabbing up to 20k. We dont go any higher than that..cant see.
Generally we only do 1...maybe 2 missions. So when we announce..plan on joining in as escort, bomber, or intercept. After that its back to dogfighting for all of us.
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Originally posted by Oldman731
Heh, intercepting bomber missions can be a lot of fun, but it does require both time and commitment (although not as much as it requires to organize and launch the bomber raid itself). Time, of course, because you have to climb to alt and form up with your associates. If the mission launches too late, people like yours truly won't be able to participate. Commitment, because you have to forego the pleasures of fighter-v-fighter combat while you form up to oppose the bombers.
Last night, unfortunately, although the mission launched in plenty of time, we just didn't have enough folks who were interested in giving up on the pleasures of dogfighting. Hey, I understand that better than most. What you should take from this, Simaril, is that last night was not a particularly good example of what an interception mission can be. If you get four or five fighters formed up and at the right alt, it's a rush, because it comes as close as anything in this game to simulating what you've read about all these years.
- oldman (who evaded the escort long enough to make two passes on the B17s, but who also forgot to enable his cannons after dropping his fuel tank. I could see the gunners laughing and pointing at me, but couldn't understand why until later.)
:lol
Yeah, I knew combined actions were necessarty, which is why I ".wingman" d you and tried to form up. Unfortunately, I just popped in to AvA looking for some fun and didnt have time to get to good intercept alt. Once we got co-alt with buffs and 3K under escort, I wasnt good enough to effectively evade the escort for long enough to make a difference. Broke a coupel times, then tried to reorient to set up alongside you again and lost SA on the escort unitl he was 600 back and diving.
Will keep trying....always looking for a fun fight or a fun mission, and to be honest the absolute BEST times I've had in AH came with the last BoB special event. Willing to do long and dull stretches for the sake of immersion, esp if fun times interrupt the tedium!
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FiLtH, Look for the 78th FG to begin running escort Missions for ya'll tonight, as Historicaly, the 78th went operational for escort duties within the 8th AF in April of 43.
Look for the "Little Friends" to help ya get to yer targets.:D
PS, Our current Squad nights are Tuesday and Thursday, 10PM EST.
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Great to hear! We also need to get some axis squads involved. Remember, even though if some of your MA squad doesnt want to come over once in awhile, you could form units in the AvA with guys that do.
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Bah, the Axis won't lace up those leather panties and come get some .50 cal B17/B24 lovin' :D
Maybe if we extend flap and gear and fly at 50 ft? :p
Filth, I think we should target their leather panty production facilities, maybe that will get them to come up and stop us :t
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S! Chaps
Had a great time escorting the Filth's bomber mission last night (thx chaps, twas fun), and as I said elsewhere, I usually prefer axis side. But anyways! What's wrong with you people - the last I can remember flying 190 on the axis side, we had a huge dominant role on the arena, and soon a huge chorus of complaints started under the other thread. According to the arguments (I might misread ya too) I have found under this thread, I can find that people are not satisfied of how axis are behaving (not going after bombers, not organizing their activities enough...) :rofl WTF :lol
Btw, one explanation is the shift in the time zones. The time I entered the spitfire last night, the local time was something like 5:00 am when most of us fins (and rest of the europe) had been asleep for a long time all ready. We usually fly much earlier (I dont bother to calculate the differences) but it just might be, that when we are sleeping, the allies are active and the other way around...
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Yes..the earth being round and only one sun makes global coordination a pain! Maybe someday they'll fix that and have us all sleep at the same time :)
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Well, my financial refund is coming back, so expect me to (attempt) give you bombers problems over the Fatherland.
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Everything was fine when the Earth was flat, before that darned Columbus got involved.
Meddling little (grumble grumble) :furious
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(http://FilthsHangar.homestead.com/AH_briefing_2-7_Mission_2.jpg)
Mission will start forming at 9pm ET. We need both sides. Luftwaffe and escorts please select a flight leader and form opposition. Meet me at A2 at 9pm ET allies, to form up. A mission will be posted.
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I don't get home until 10:30 ET, maybe there'll still be a buff that needs a gunner :D
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Originally posted by plank
I don't get home until 10:30 ET, maybe there'll still be a buff that needs a gunner :D
They might arrest you for being AWOL... :D
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Nahhhhh, we won't arrest him, we'll just divvie up His medicinal Whiskey shot instead:rofl
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Originally posted by Jaekart
Nahhhhh, we won't arrest him, we'll just divvie up His medicinal Whiskey shot instead:rofl
Ummm, shot... right. I keep my shot in a bottle surrounded by more whiskey as not to bruise it so don't be surprised if you find a little more than an ounce in there :D
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I spied on yer bottle when ya hid it. That's how I know theres enough to divvie it up.:lol
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Originally posted by Stringer
Bah, the Axis won't lace up those leather panties and come get some .50 cal B17/B24 lovin' :D
M
Filth, I think we should target their leather panty production facilities, maybe that will get them to come up and stop us :t
Now why would you want to see a bunch of men in leather panties:huh
That sound alot like a brokeback mountainish:lol
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FEB 7 AAR
MISSION #2
Bombing Alt:17,000ft
12 B24s left A2 this afternoon for target A49. Although escort of P47s was available, the force was overwhelmed by waves of enemy fighters. The escort got engaged and the bomber pulled too far out in front. They were left at the mercy of the Luftwaffe, which appeared lacking in that today.
It appears all 12 B24s were lost. The B24 in its combat debut appeared to flame up more readily than the B17.
Some bombers did drop, but caused little damage to the base.
MISSION #3
Bombing Alt: 21,000ft
12 B17s left A8, picking up many escort fighters along the way. They proceded to A46. They made it to target but not before a stunning headon attack by 3 luftwaffe fighters claiming one of Stringers B17s. The remaining B17s dropped, but due to cloud cover it appears the bombs went long. Light damage was caused by Kongkyuk's B17 to some structures on the base.
All but one B17 landed. Unknown status of escorting fighters but it is believed they faired well.
Overall, it is believed deep strikes into enemy territory at this time will be to costly to the fledgling 8th AF. Targets will likely be shorter range targets, such as coastal bases and cities.
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Originally posted by FiLtH
FEB 7 AAR
MISSION #2
Bombing Alt:17,000ft
12 B24s left A2 this afternoon for target A49. Although escort of P47s was available, the force was overwhelmed by waves of enemy fighters. The escort got engaged and the bomber pulled too far out in front. They were left at the mercy of the Luftwaffe, which appeared lacking in that today.
It appears all 12 B24s were lost. The B24 in its combat debut appeared to flame up more readily than the B17.
Some bombers did drop, but caused little damage to the base.
MISSION #3
Bombing Alt: 21,000ft
12 B17s left A8, picking up many escort fighters along the way. They proceded to A46. They made it to target but not before a stunning headon attack by 3 luftwaffe fighters claiming one of Stringers B17s. The remaining B17s dropped, but due to cloud cover it appears the bombs went long. Light damage was caused by Kongkyuk's B17 to some structures on the base.
All but one B17 landed. Unknown status of escorting fighters but it is believed they faired well.
Overall, it is believed deep strikes into enemy territory at this time will be to costly to the fledgling 8th AF. Targets will likely be shorter range targets, such as coastal bases and cities.
try more like an average alt of 22k+
I made a pass on your 1st sorti at over 22k :huh
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I dont understand how you are seeing the buffs so much higher than they are. The B24s were level at 17k to target. The second flight of B17s was 21k. The escort is alot higher. Is that what you are referring to?
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Originally posted by FiLtH
I dont understand how you are seeing the buffs so much higher than they are. The B24s were level at 17k to target. The second flight of B17s was 21k. The escort is alot higher. Is that what you are referring to?
Don't let your enemy tell you what alt to fly. If your buffing your number one defense is altitude. Your biggest threat as far as firepower right now is the FW-190. It's performance suffers above 22k. Your main escort right now the P-47 , has it's best performance above 22K. The 109s are a threat no matter what the alt, but at lest you can negate some of the FW-190 threat. As far as Spitfires are concerned at that altitude, I really don't know how it affects their performance. I can't fly them at sea level or at high alt.
No matter what you do , the game is going to get gamed, and your going to get insulted for your efforts by some of the people in here. Plan your missions to give you as much advantage as possible over your enemy.
Your going to need it.
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Originally posted by gear
try more like an average alt of 22k+
I made a pass on your 1st sorti at over 22k :huh
You Are Wrong.
I lead that first sortie and we leveled at 17k period.
Of course if you keep accusing us at being higher than we might as well be that high.
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Shifty,
I agree, but as I stated in another thread:
I knew we were going to meat on the table going it at 17k, but I also knew that having the bomb group there gave guys in fighters on both sides incentive and a reason to mix it up and have fun.
Now, if a couple of the vocal luftwhiners keep up with this BS, then yeah, the max ceiling of the bombers will get a work out.
For me, it's fun to try to create some level of that immersion, even if I may not know that the accurate tire pressure for the B17G loaded with 500lb bombs on a colder than average day in 1943 England.
It's like what the Fins did when they flew those JU-88 raids during the early parts of this RPS.
I bet they didn't have the historical throttle settings (gear, Ike), but it was alot of fun intercepting them.
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Ya thats the reason I like to go in at 20k. We could go higher, and probably have a better chance. But I like the excitement of the moment of interception. Besides, I cant see didlly of the target at 30k. Not that it would matter..I cant seem to hit anything lately at 20k :P
The early JU88 raids the Finns did is also an incentive to stay below our max alt. Theu could have come in higher, and being so fast, they probably could have survived even more than they did. But given the slower speeds of the spits/hurri1s, and the poor firepower, it wouldnt have been much of a battle. Im for keeping it fun, even if it means dying once in awhile.
Not to say we won'y try a few high runs..especially if we continually get waxed at lower alts. We can't expect the bomber guys to continually get reamed without some chance at a few missions with advantage.
To me the fun is getting there and seeing how our escort performs vs the interceptors. Then gunning is fun. Seeing if you can hit anything with the bombs is next. Getting home..well..thats a bonus :)
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Id like to continue doing nightly or atleast everyother night, atleast 1 if not 2 bomb raids throughout the remainder of the campaign. We need our numbers to grow so work on your squads in the MA to come over at around 9pm ET, when we have one going. Im sure what we are doing is what alot of guys in there are looking for. We wont get all of them, but 100 out of the 400-500 in the MA would be nice.
10 Bomber flights of 3, with 25 escort and 25 interceptors would be a nice sized battle. Lastnight the wife ack contributed greatly to my poor drop. Providing I can keep it suppressed, I will be in there tonight, for Mission #4.
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On historical bombing altitudes:
From:
Lamentations: Dusseldorf September 9, 1944 By Robert L. Longardner Pilot, 570th Squadron, G.I. Wonder At the briefing on the morning of September 9, 1944, we were given a bombing altitude of 26,000 feet. The combat crews erupted in vexation, grumbling about the severity of such altitude I "happy flak valley," Surely the targeted factory could have been hit from 28,000 feet as well as from this defenseless altitude of 26,000 feet which meant that the low squadron would be flying at 25,000 feet until the initial point of the bomb run.
Cologne, Germany, January 10, 1945 By Earl J. Malerich (303rd BG), Lt. Col. USAF Ret. On this mission, our target was the Cologne/Ostheim Airfield. We carried thirty-six l00 pound bombs at an assigned bombing altitude of 25,000 feet.
303rd BG (H) Combat Mission # 72 27 September 1943 Target: Port Area, Emden, Germany Bombing Altitude; 25,000 ft
And on the speed and throttle issue:
Normal Range: 2,000 miles (3,219 km) with 6,000 lb (2,722 kg) bomb load @ 220 mph (352 km/h) @ 25,000 ft (7,625 m)
which if I recall correctly our airspeed was right around 225 to 227 on bomb run.
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I guess we better appoint somebody as Throttle and Altitude Police. I'm sure the guys intercepting you flew with as modest throttle settings as possible .:rofl
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Originally posted by Shifty
I guess we better appoint somebody as Throttle and Altitude Police. I'm sure the guys intercepting you flew with as modest throttle settings as possible .:rofl
we had to in order to save our engines. you of all people should know how grumpy those crew chiefs are. :D
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Originally posted by storch
we had to in order to save our engines. you of all people should know how grumpy those crew chiefs are. :D
Well I do know how hard it is to intercept those high buffs in a 190. Then again I suck just as bad attacking JU88s with a spit at medium altitudes. I'll never be a good SturmJager