Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: paintmaw on January 23, 2001, 11:09:00 PM
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I'm amazed how many europeans truly hate Americans . Although , Ive never seen one face to face , why is that ??
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Excuse me but isn't dislike and hate two different things?
I don't hate americans, but I dislike those several immature dummies in the net
does that mean I hate americans? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
of course I don't like that they left that nut called saddam hussein alive when they were to throw him over and same thing with this milosevic guy..
but that goes for politicians and I hear that americans doesnt like that hussein being alive either....
if that will mean "hate" , I suppose I hate americans then... funny though, I thought those fanatics in the middle east were those who hates americans and europeans just those who dont like americans
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America is a really big place, including Central America, South America, the Caribbean, Canada, etc.
Yet Citizens of the USA refer to themselves as Americans, and the rest of america is just some foreign place.
My point is, there is a lot of arrogance there. USA is not a bad country. But they are (not all, but the majority) very arrogant, thats why they are DISLIKED by much of the world.
But that dont mean HATED. I am American. I was born in AMERICA. I dont hate people from the USoA, but SOME of them really make you wish they were a little more humble.
They are fun people tho (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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Fat DRUNK Bastards.
Nothing feels sweeter than facing a powerful enemy 1 on 1, the battle is tough, but you emerge victorious. As he types <S>!!! on channel one, you open fire on his chute.
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Originally posted by paintmaw:
I'm amazed how many europeans truly hate Americans . Although , Ive never seen one face to face , why is that ??
uhmm... Your football sucks? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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We don't (or at least I don't).
But...you are a bit "loud" (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif) and well...My "location" on the left here, is taken from a real life experience.
Are you sure what you read here was realy, well ... maybe did you missunderstand someone's sense of humour... I tend not to take anything seriously on these BB's (or at least, i try...)
As I said, we don't "hate" you, but it's just sooooo tempting to pick again, when you see someone "bite" so fast (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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MASS/SAW
click HERE (http://eismeer.port5.com/) for info on III./JG 5 Eismeer
"kindergarden must be closed... all those little girls running around screaming..."
-Fd ski
(http://cwm.ragesofsanity.com/s/blackeye/UNCLESAM.gif)
[This message has been edited by Saintaw (edited 01-24-2001).]
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Animal,
I hear you, man. I'm from Guam, kind of like the Puerto Rico of the Pacific.
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Heh I don't hate Americans. Recently met an exchange student here, and he was incredibly nice, easy going, mellow and overall a great guy.
Americans are a hard breed to define - there are so many types of Americans that I am not sure it is possible to give a good definition. The poor black American in Texas is way different from the succesful Asian businessman in LA. They live under completely different circumstances and the culture is more different that that between two neighboring European countries.
What can tick Europeans off, I guess, it the culture (or lack thereof) Americans very succesfully export to the rest of the world - and for such an export to be succesful, there must be some sort of a demand.
Temptation Island. 'nuff said. Then again, Big Brother was a European production.
What is also a bit irritating to me as a European is the minority middle class white American's lack of humbleness - "we're great, we're patriotic and everything we do is better than anything anyone else can do. Love us or get the hell out; critique is not welcome". This attitude can be found in a minority of Americans, but the arrogance involved is greater than even that found in the French.
Comments such as "we saved yer bellybutton in two world wars" are first of all incredibly simplistic but also stink of this arrogance/superiority complex.
There are some other differences - like European welfare state semi socialistic thinking, which conflicts with the American one. The exchange student I talked to said what struck him most is in Denmark, everything is so *normal*. All are pretty content, all are middle clas, and people make sure to take care of each other if stuff goes wrong, whereas in the US, it is much more competitive; a more Darwinistic society (for good and bad, I see positive aspects of this) where the weak are weeded out. More of a "succeed or die" scenario. I won't go into the flaws of the Danish approach, but they're there and fairly obvious.
Lastly, the US is the biggest power on earth. it has the most powerful industrial might, one of the greatest economies and there has never been such a potent force on earth - greater than the Greeks, the Romans, the Egyptians.
Such a force will *always* be a welcome target, a uniter, if you will, for others.
Incidentally; watched David Letterman show yesterday. he had a clip of some dumb commercial and called the kid "European", whereupon the audience booed. "Tough crowd, booing at Europeans he said with a wry smile".
I suspect this is just healthy siblings rivalry. It has all the traits and characteristics of it (and I know, I have two older brothers and a younger sister). This is how it mostly is
Til someone stomps someone on the toes (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif).
So, dumb ugly Americans, take your socalled football, that has next to nothing to do with a foot or a ball, and go the hell away (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif).
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Baron Claus "StSanta" Von Ribbentroppen
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"
(http://us.st5.yimg.com/store4.yimg.com/I/demotivators_1619_4916770)
"I don't necessarily agree with everything I think." - A. Eldritch
[This message has been edited by StSanta (edited 01-24-2001).]
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Comments such as "we saved yer bellybutton in two world wars" are first of all incredibly simplistic but also stink of this arrogance/superiority complex.
... and are absolutely correct. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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Yeah Funked, I especially admire how you saved Finland from burden of communism (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Uuups... sorry. You didn't.
So you're too another stupid un-educated burger eating fat yankee (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif) (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
Maybe Hollywood could make a movie telling how USA saved Bulgaria, Czechoslovakia, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Romania etc etc. Those countries are European too (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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ROFL staga (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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Baron Claus "StSanta" Von Ribbentroppen
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"
(http://us.st5.yimg.com/store4.yimg.com/I/demotivators_1619_4916770)
"I don't necessarily agree with everything I think." - A. Eldritch
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Originally posted by paintmaw:
I'm amazed how many europeans truly hate Americans . Although , Ive never seen one face to face , why is that ??
During my service times i had to go ashore of various Europian cities along with about 5000 other US servicemen.
I hate to tell ya, but the opinion of "loud and obnoxious" that US citizen have in Europe is quite deserved.
It's not because of who you are or how you act. I came ashore with other guys, spoke english with american accent, dressed like other americans and not a single person was ever mean or demeaning to me. Why ? Because in my interaction with them i didn't assume a superior position, i didn't have an implied expectation of them to speak english. I showed respect for local customs and traditions as well as all of those i've met. Even a guest has certain obligations they have to live by. Unfortunatelly, most americans don't travel enough to know those simple rules.
Also, as others pointed out, europians don't HATE Americans. Dislike and hate are two different things.
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Bartlomiej Rajewski
aka. Wing Commander fd-ski
Northolt Wing
1st Polish Fighter Wing
303 (Polish) Squadron "Kosciuszko" RAF
308 (Polish) Squadron "City of Cracow" RAF
315 (Polish) Squadron "City of Deblin" RAF
Turning 109s and 190s into scrap metal since 1998
Northolt Wing Headquarters (http://www.raf303.org/northolt/)
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Edited out Stipid comment on my part.
<smoooooootch!>
Saw
[This message has been edited by Saintaw (edited 01-24-2001).]
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Originally posted by Staga:
Yeah Funked, I especially admire how you saved Finland from burden of communism (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Uuups... sorry. You didn't.
So you're too another stupid un-educated burger eating fat yankee (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif) (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
Maybe Hollywood could make a movie telling how USA saved Bulgaria, Czechoslovakia, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Romania etc etc. Those countries are European too (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
You are taking things too literally, Staga. "we saved yer bellybutton in two world wars" is not directed to every country, person, dog and a cocroach on the European continent.
While the list of countries US helped against Hitler's and Stalin's domination is large enough not to be quoted in a casual post, it definitely does not include the whole bunch of statelets no one really cares about and has no reason to.
Do you think americans have any obligation to do so? Or should every american put a whole bunch of exceptions in to every sentense where he used a word "you" to indicate he does not mean Finland?
I know for a fact that standart if living is very high in many small European countries. Why the hell do you have to suffer inferiority every time someone forgets to mention Finland by name?
miko
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I have been to other countries and felt ashamed for how fellow Americans treated the local population...but as it always is in life, a handful of bad apples will always give the majority a bad name in the eyes of the beholder.
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Originally posted by Staga:
uhmm... Your football sucks? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
Heck your football is really soccer (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Now your rugby is kinda cool. Sorta like kill the man with the ball with teams (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Eagler
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"The list of countries US helped against Hitler and Stalin's domination" has one big country in the very first place...that is the USA itself. Rightly so, but stop spitting in our face how magnanimous, generous, etc. you were on WWII, conveniently forgetting that was YOUR war too, like it or not. I think everyone has to be thankful on the job made by U.S. forces in WWII, but this kind of attitude is what make Europeans dislike americans.
Btw, you were not "exactly" helping Spain against fascism '40 onwards, did you?. You were not "exactly" helping South America against dictatorship '50 onwards, did you?. Not to mention South East affairs in the '60/'70...Every country has some skeletons in their wardrobes, mine too, so, as a rule of thumb, be humble.
Your country is a wonderful one(been there several times) & I like USA people, in the great majority of cases I know personally. But stop behaving as if USA were the world's navel. Even if it were, would be a nice change in attitude to act like you were just like the average human being. Did you forget the superior race/superior country doctrine's consequences yet?
Oh....almost forget....What Saw said (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
Cheers,
Pepe
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Originally posted by Animal:
America is a really big place, including Central America, South America, the Caribbean, Canada, etc.
Yet Citizens of the USA refer to themselves as Americans, and the rest of america is just some foreign place.
My point is, there is a lot of arrogance there. USA is not a bad country. But they are (not all, but the majority) very arrogant, thats why they are DISLIKED by much of the world.
But that dont mean HATED. I am American. I was born in AMERICA. I dont hate people from the USoA, but SOME of them really make you wish they were a little more humble.
They are fun people tho (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
I'm curious. What are people from a country named the United States of America supposed to call themselves? United Statesians? It's not called the United States of North America. We would probably refer to ourselves as North Americans if that were the case. We happened to pick the name America for our country. Anyone else could have. Why is that an example of arrogance? I really don't see the point. If we would have picked the name of any other geographic feature would you feel better. I think there is a lot of arrogance in the US also. But what does calling yourself an American have to do with it? It's the name of the country!
[This message has been edited by Jimdandy (edited 01-24-2001).]
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Originally posted by Pepino:
"The list of countries US helped against Hitler and Stalin's domination" has one big country in the very first place...that is the USA itself.
I am pretty sure that USA would not be worse off if Hitler did dominate Europe. His plans did not include world domination or even colonial involvement. In fact he was violently opposed to both. European domination by communists would have been much more dangerous because those did have a world domination agenda and were much closer to their goal (with US help).
Communist regime eventually crumbled for economic and political reasons, the same would have evantually happend to Hitler's regime if it were victorious before any harm could have been done to US.
Btw, you were not "exactly" helping Spain against fascism '40 onwards, did you?. You were not "exactly" helping South America against dictatorship '50 onwards, did you?.
Why should have they? Anybody asked them to? How does the fact that US got dragged into an international world war make it justifiable to get involved in a civil war? Isn't that a matter of internal politics?
Besides, many people would blame US for not helping Spanish "fascism" against Spanish communism.
I see equal number of posts from europeans blasting US for interfering into other countries affairs as for not gettng involved in them.
miko
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Now for a very important difference:
At least the women here shave their armpits and legs, err most of them (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) More than we can say about the average European woman (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Eagler
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Originally posted by Eagler:
Now for a very important difference:
At least the women here shave their armpits and legs, err most of them (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) More than we can say about the average European woman (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Eagler
Imagine all those US chicks with silicon implants ten years later (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/eek.gif)
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Heh yeah.
And I can tell by personal experience that eagler hasn't been to Scandinavia.
Women here shve their armpits. And..well, no need to get graphical (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif).
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Baron Claus "StSanta" Von Ribbentroppen
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"
(http://us.st5.yimg.com/store4.yimg.com/I/demotivators_1619_4916770)
"I don't necessarily agree with everything I think." - A. Eldritch
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I, in the great American tradition, dont give a toejam what anyone thinks!
Yeager (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Americans give so much juicy ammunition for bashing. Plus, it's fun to see what others think of this great country, even if it's in jest. While it's nice to walk around thumping chests all the time, a little reality doesn't hurt much.
Fury
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It is only short sighted the perception that Iron Pact would not go for world domination after securing the "vital space". So soviets. Remember, soviets, not communists. It was not a communist regime, but a soviet one. And a Marxist-Stalinist one, after that.
Concluding that Hitler's regime would collapse is only wishful thinking. Altho there were severe imbalances in German economy in year 1.936, and admitting that they could eventually lead to an economic crisis, the situation was one of an overheated economy. So, eventually, it may not collapse if proper measures were taken.
About the harm to the US, just think about WWII taking place in 1.945-1.950 instead of 1.939-45. Even worse, think in an hypothetic WWIII against the Iron Pact now comprising a whole united (by then oppressed) Continental Europe. How would U.S. cope with extended range V2's (just to put an example)? Not that U.S. & Allies would not win the war, but I'm sure that USA would suffer a hell lot more in its own homeland.
Spanish Civil War ended in 1.939. The point is not Spanish Civil War, but how the USA looked with a blind eye to a fascist government in exchange for Torrejón Air Base and Rota Navy Base, just some 5 years after WWII ended. From my point of view, even political-wise, that movement do not show a high standard, in moral terms. Not that I care much, I like Spain like it is today, and history is only intellectual curiosity for me.
Anyway, the point of this thread was about US-Bashers, and why the rest of the world hate Americans. If you read the answers, you will get the picture. Most of us do not hate America. Plus, most of us like it (and Americans too). Even more, we do not hate the few arrogant and/or ignorant characters that degrade the rest of Americans. Most of us disdain them. I'm sure you do as well. Poor souls, after all.
Cheers,
Pepe.
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while you are sitting at home, comfortable, and safe, remember one thing, those arrogant americans will send their youth to defend your freedom at the drop of a hat. That is of course, as long as there is a threat to our national security (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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Not mine, I'm spaniard (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
Cheers,
Pepe
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Pepino,
Soviets were behind the Spanish "communists". 25 years of my life were spent in Sovier Union. Believe me that if we won, Spain would have suffered much more then under Franko's "dictatorship". Just remember polish officers shot wholesale after they were "saved from fascism".
US should have supported Franko more, not opposed him - the same they supported Pinochet. Both saved their countries from communist threat and ensured peacefull return to democracy.
Hitler went out of his way to make peace with England - the war he did not expect when he invaded Poland. Did you read his memoirs? He respected englishmen more then he respected germans and argued for Germany to yield colonial and economic competition to England in reurn for their good will.
Why would he want to fight USA if he did not even want to fing England?
Living space? Get real, Pepino. Just 50 years after the Hitler's times, and Germany's german population is shrinking because if low birth rate. It would shrink even more if the life expectancy did not grow so fast. Why would aging and numerically shrinking germans need living space in America?
Americans realised wery well that after US help won WWI, France and England created the unfair, unreasonable and cruel Versaille peace treaty that raped Germany (which did not start WWI!) and practically insured WWII.
That is why there was such an opposition in US to join WWII.
Eventually americans had to go back to fight in Europe for the second time to save their asses. But this time they arranged the peace - not raping the defeated countries but helping them with Marchall plan to become peacefull and productive members of european community.
My ancestors at that time were fighting to bring the communist domination to Europe and free the precious Spain from teh evil Franko who wisely kept his country out of the war. Thenk god we only half succeeded - ended up with easter-european countries instead of all of them!
miko
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Huh ? Zapkin still alive and breathin ???
...
You are verry wrong on one point Eagler, verry wrong, trust me (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Who actually gives a rats bellybutton what the Europeans or the rest of the world think of us?
I am sure the "REST OF THE WORLD", ie, those without power hated the Romans, the Huns, the Greeks, the English etc.
It is our turn and in a few years, if they get enough boats it will be the Chinese.
The difference is that we have the power but do not use it to subdue you and force our perception of good on you.
We know we could kick all yer tulips but we are nice so we do not and all we got left is to tell you all how great we are and build McDonalds all over your Countries so we got a decent place to eat when we visit you.
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When did they put this thing in here and WTF is it for?
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I dont have anything against hairy women; They're kinda wild (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
(well old DDR's athletic women are other case, They needed to shave some other parts more than armpits or legs (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif))
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We invent Rock and Roll, Harley-Davidson, and Breast Augmentation. And still they claim we have no culture.
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I've dated more than a few Italian women in my day and age, gives a whole new meaning to 'the black forest'....did I just say that? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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BTW. For those of you to young to remember. In the late 60,s early 70,s there was a period when girls refuse to ware bra,s, didn't shave, demanded orgasm, and were generally delightful in every way (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif).
Yes. I am a veteran of the sexual revolution
[This message has been edited by easymo (edited 01-24-2001).]
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Ripsnort, I see we have a very different understanding of Italian women. Black forest? AFAIK, all the ones with back hair emigrated to the US.
the "unshaven" part we just make up to feel good about the fact that we are fatter than anybody else in the world. They really do shave, and they weigh less and where tighter clothing. Seriously, whenever I return to the US, the first thing that strikes me -- whether in California, New York or the Midwest -- is how fat, ugly and ill-dressed the people are.
What Santa calls our "culture", really isn't our culture. We have that, and we don't export it. What we export is a cheap substitute for culture the fulfills all the requirements without adding any substance that might limit its appeal. The same could be said about our beer; we do have good beer, guys. Calling that crap "american culture" is an insult to us.
What really bothers most of the world is that they are everyday reminded that the US exists, and that it has an impact politically, culturally, economically and environmentally on their daily lives, but that Americans themselves don't even know they exist. When they do meet, most Americans expect their hosts to act like Americans.
Now, in all fairness, tourists all over the world act like jerks; after all, tourism is not the act of going and experiencing another culture, but rather it is the extension of one's own local culture beyond normal boundaries: most people become tourists to collect things (visits to monuments, museums, etc.) that will enhance their standing back home. In my time, I've seen my share of loud and obnoxious tourists from all corners of the globe. It's just that with Americans, the current geopolitical situation aggravates things.
And, yes, I've seen and lived in my share of foreign countries, and I've never been treated rudely because I was an American. I've had people try to screw me over; I've caught an occasional insult, but the type of hatred I hear others describe just doesn't occur that often. Unless, of course, you're unbelievable rude.
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Agreed Dinger, American women are over-sexed, over-weight, and OVER HERE! 60% of our population is overweight!
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Americans are not exporting our low-brow culture to Europe.
Europe is importing that crap itself. European intellectuals prefer to think that this low-level "culture" is forced on them rather then admit they have very fertile soil for it in their countries.
Granted, due to better mobility of american society much of the new crap appears here first and then spreads to Europe, even if some of it was invented there. Witness the reality shows!
While our youth may be wild, ignorant and overweight, most of them work unlike huge number of unemployed youth in european countries.
They also take showers more often, support more classical music orchestras then most european countries, and those are not state-subsidized.
miko
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Alittle off topic, but why is it that the people that shouldn't be wearing stretch pants here in the USA always do?
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wall-mart
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I guess I should have posted "Dislike Americans" #1 sadam is there for a reason (balance) we dont want iran and the saudies fighting over iraq .
lol Yeager , great comment
Without the europeans , WWII might have dragged on for a few more years , we owe All other countries involved for there part in the war's.
I do agree when traveling , Americans ( any traveler ) need to be humble , and respect the people of the country we are visiting .
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Originally posted by miko2d:
While our youth may be wild, ignorant and overweight, most of them work unlike huge number of unemployed youth in european countries.
Last i checked the point of having a childhood was to enjoy and learn not work for 5$/hour flipping burgers.
They also take showers more often, support more classical music orchestras then most european countries, and those are not state-subsidized.
Since i do have a wife who is about to get her Masters from Juilliard in few months ... and is out looking for work (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
American classical music scene is none existant with exception of New York City and there most of the musicians are immigrants.
At this time there is only one offer for a cellist in US - in Kentucky paying 22$/K a year.... and most likely that orchestra only plays 3 or 4 times a year... just like the one where I live..
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Bartlomiej Rajewski
aka. Wing Commander fd-ski
Northolt Wing
1st Polish Fighter Wing
303 (Polish) Squadron "Kosciuszko" RAF
308 (Polish) Squadron "City of Cracow" RAF
315 (Polish) Squadron "City of Deblin" RAF
Turning 109s and 190s into scrap metal since 1998
Northolt Wing Headquarters (http://www.raf303.org/northolt/)
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22K a year for four gigs? Man, where do I sign up for cello lessons!
Anyone want to buy an Alvarez acoustic, cheap?
We invent Rock and Roll, Harley-Davidson, and Breast Augmentation. And still they claim we have no culture
Man, hard to add anything to that.
But seriously, it's Whiny Europeans that are the easy targets.
This "we saved your bellybutton toejam" started in a bar in London probably, a little under sixty years ago.
Some smarmy, "ed-ju-kated" British guy probably got tired of listening to some Okie toss back good ale like it was Coors Lite, and expound on how wonderful and great the U.S. is, generally ruining the mood in some quaint little tavern with a funny name, and a large crest-like sign hanging outside.
Said smarmy British guy probably walked up to the chugging, boastful Okie, and made some really intelligent, learned, sarcastic remark.
Stunned by this sudden attack of wit and mental prowess, the inebriated subject from the Bosom of the American Heartland had to do something he probably wasn't used to. He had to think fast.
"Ga-hilk," he thought, "Duh...I wonder what would REALLY push this Limey's button..."
Slowly, and with a thick tongue, the serviceman from the U.S. turned to the Brit, and stuttered, "Wuhl...um...whul...whul you better get down on your knees and kiss my rosey red Sooner butt pretty boy, 'cause we came over here to SAVE YOUR ASS!"
And the rest is history.
So chaps, take heart. When you hear a Yank use that line, they have realized with lightning speed, how best to push your button. It's kind of like the BFG9000 in Doom. With one quick line, we can simplify any argument you could make, and piss you off in no time flat.
I hate to tell you this, but really, very few of us actually believe this.
But, we just can't resist being a bee in your bonnet, and just love watching you go into an absolute kanipschin fit after we've said it!
We call it "Euro-baiting." (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Mk
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Originally posted by mrfish:
wall-mart
ROTFLOL, great comment to my post MrFish! LOL!
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Yup, even though Americans are these big assholse there sure seems to be a lack of threads where out of the blue we decide to try and belittle europe, however that seems to be the major europien squeak "americans are amazinhunks" every time I read this bord i see that and a bunch of other CRAP about how americans suck, yet its not very often ya see americans bashing anyone for no reason other than a reply for some remark, yet we are the badguys...I went to paris with my parents a while back we walked into a restraunt WITH DOGS IN IT btw, and we sat for 15 miniutes waiting for a waiter, a whole groupe of waters were just standing around just chatting and helping other costumers but never came our way, eventually we just quietly left, who is the amazinhunk in this instance...no wait im sure someway that us horrible rude american offened the waiters so they had every right to treat us like toejam..
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TheWobble
Please use the spell checker when speaking for us Americans (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
BTW you're not speaking for this American...
thanks
Eagler
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You would know if I was speaking for you (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/tongue.gif)
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Originally posted by Eagler:
TheWobble
Please use the spell checker when speaking for us Americans (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
BTW you're not speaking for this American...
thanks
Eagler
haha - eagler, this is just another wobble fantasy anyway....
HEY WOBBLE PARIS TEXAS AINT IN FRANCE!!!!
bwaaaahaha (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Dinger I agree. Ill tell you a tourist story. A buddy and I rode our Harley out to west Texas. A place called Hells Half Acer (Yes there is such a place). We threw bed rolls down when we got tired, and slept in the desert. Not the tidiest environment. Anyway, one morning im setting on my bike, in a gas station.
Waiting for my pal to get out of the john. This van pulls up. And this hoard of Japanese people come pouring out of the thing. There are about 6 of them and they all have cameras. They spot me, and for some reason start clicking away at me. There is this big, table top mesa behind me and at one point they indicate, as best the could, that they wanted me to pose, with this thing over my shoulder like John freaking Wayne. I drew the line at that. But I tried to be a good sport about the thing. They knelt down, so they could get an upward shot of me, with that hill behind me. And somewhere enshrined in Yokohama are some pics of a very dusty biker.
[This message has been edited by easymo (edited 01-24-2001).]
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Why's urrip even considered a continent? Isn't it just a small arrogant part of the great mother continent of Asia? Heck with out our life giving gulf stream, it would be a frozen wasteland. Geologists please educate me. I can't be right. I'm just a dumb 'merican.
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All Americans are dumb, uneducated farmer boys that got nowhere fast til they got some decent European blood.
All American science, I mean absolutely ALL, was based on the works of European scientists.
There were no American fighter pilots in WWII - instead, secrelty various Europeans flew the yank planes; most noticeable of these forces were the Danes.
Fat, undereducated, lacking a culture, Americans devour and rape mother earth, spitting in her face as they guzzle up gas.
They dinnae save anyone in any WWII. They just repalced one opressive regime with another - their own.
Worthless piles of dog manure. Flithy pieces of distended rectum. As hopping mad as two sexually confused kangaroos during the mating season.
Their only redeeming quality is their ability to constantly be an amusement for the rest of the world.
Americans; I fart in your general direction
Thought this discussion needed some gasoline.
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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Baron Claus "StSanta" Von Ribbentroppen
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"
(http://us.st5.yimg.com/store4.yimg.com/I/demotivators_1619_4916770)
"I don't necessarily agree with everything I think." - A. Eldritch
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Originally posted by miko2d:
Pepino,
Soviets were behind the Spanish "communists". 25 years of my life were spent in Sovier Union. Believe me that if we won, Spain would have suffered much more then under Franko's "dictatorship". Just remember polish officers shot wholesale after they were "saved from fascism".
US should have supported Franko more, not opposed him - the same they supported Pinochet. Both saved their countries from communist threat and ensured peacefull return to democracy.
miko
I cant believe this went unanswered.
Miko2d. I already answered one stupidity like this in AGW, dont make me repeat the full post. There you said few less taht we had to THANK the USA for 40 years of Fascism.
Had the REPUBLICANS (R-E-P-U-B-L-I-C-A-N-S, not MARXISTS ,nor COMMUNISTS, REPUBLICANS) Won the war, a REPUBLICAN DEMOCRATIC GOVERNMENT (Just like the one on place in 1936) would have taken place.
Instead we had 40 yeards of repression, fascism, and US bases on Spain. THANK YOU, OH OUR SAVERS!
But...your comparation with Pinochet is really an ABOMINATION. You REALLY know what happened there? do you know, by any means who was Salvador Allende? you call that man COMMUNIST?! You say that pinochet, a MONSTER, a GENOCIDE, is an HERO!? for KILLING A DEMOCRACE!?
I wont take the work to answer suck load of stupidities, but I will tell you this: Before you talk, please have a LIGHT idea of what are you talking about.
because right now YOU HAVE NO IDEA.
[This message has been edited by RAM (edited 01-24-2001).]
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Gonna have to disguise the bait a little better than that Santa (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
RAM- tell us how you really feel (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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LJK_Raubvogel
LuftJägerKorps (http://www.luftjagerkorps.com)
(http://content.communities.msn.com/isapi/fetch.dll?action=view_photo&ID_Community=Raubspics&ID_Topic=2&ID_Message=30)
[This message has been edited by LJK Raubvogel (edited 01-24-2001).]
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Dammit StSanta, keep that up and we will stop amusing ya!
And, if we decide to stop amusing you we will also refuse to amuse the rest of the world at the same time AND we will tell 'em it was you who pissed us off and caused the amusement deprivation and they will be really pissed at you and we will be off the hook for awhile.
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When did they put this thing in here and WTF is it for?
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we (Americans) won't judge europeans by the standards set by StSanta
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Cmon, we dont hate you US people. We just hate your government and its policies.
We all know that more than half of the US population dont know there is a world outside their border. "Japan" is a place near Oklahoma, "China" is right below Virginia, "Europe" is a tourist spot near the Alamo (its even said there were 2 big wars near there... damn santanas!), "Mexico" is where all those taco restaurants come from and of course "Kuwait" is the other name the media has for the arizona desert (where its said a big oil fire was started by some of those turban-wearing hippies a while ago). (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif) (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
Seriously though, its the decisions made by the US govt regarding other nations and the arrogance & conceit displayed by US tourists when they travel around the world that makes this phenomena happen.
When I was in Korea with a group of US guys in a company-paid trip, my trip-buddies, all of them between 18 and 25 made a damn mess of the hotel we were in, refused to pay damage bills and deposits and were a general pain in the bellybutton for the tour personnel the whole time. Peons wanting to be treated like kings during a FREE trip halfway around the world and staying in the Hilton. Perfect example of why "US Bashing" has a reason for being.
One thing that touched me though is that when we were walking down a shopping center, we were stopped by a mid-aged woman who wanted to thank us for saving her country and son and housband during the Korean War. She even gave us free coffee at her shop. I mean, WOW.
We talked with her, she remembered that there were some Colombian troops in Korea as well when I told her where I was from, even said "thank you" in Spanish!!!!! WOW.
She leaves, im deeply touched and then the moment is completely ruined when the gringo starts boasting of what they did in Korea.
#$#@$#@$#@%$#$ .
The rest of the trip I spent alone and staying veeery far away from the group, spending almost all my time with the tour guides (and one of them was a really cute girl!).
I think about it...and end up staring at a wall of disbelief.
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TAC , your post says your from Orlando USA . ARE YOU ?? if not , are u ashamed to say your from Spain?
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RAM, that was not answered because I was going home. Anyway, you do not need to be so rude, IMO. We try to show our superiority to Americans, right? j/k (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
And, while we are at it, some facts:
Spain, 1.936, Republican Democratic Government allowed church burning, and political prosecution.
Spain, 1.936, crime raging, economic crises, local governments chaos.
Spain, 1.936, anarchists and communists pushig for power, but by means of wild & violent labour strikes, instead of democratic vote.
Spain, Civil War, Republican Democratic Government is overan by anarchists and communists supported by the PCUS (U.S.S.R. communist party). The anarchist are massacred by the communists in Barcelona shortly after. Communists became, in fact, the leading force of the Republican side.
I am not saying fascists in Spain were right (btw, technically speaking, Franco was not a fascist but a dictator) and I am not making an apology fo the Coup d'Etat, nor the Civil War, Heaven forbid. I am only saying that nothing, and especially Spain in the thirties, is white or black.
On the dictatorship support, bear in mind that U.S.A and U.S.S.R. were in fact fighting WWIII (cold war). In a hot war, civil casualties die under the bombs, I guess in a cold one, under the different tyranies supported by each side. Both sides of the conflict were ugly monsters those days, and we were caught in the middle. As a personal choice, I rather like the U.S.A. ugly face than the U.S.S.R. one, and not only by economic standards.
Now, on an answer to Miko, Hitler's target was, as the Deutsch national himn says, "Deutschland über alles", a superior nation with a superior race. With this philosopy in mind, clash with the U.S.A. was only a matter of time. Should not the U.S.A. get involved in European War, the consequences would be much, much worse for you at the end. Hitler would have the time to consolidate his conquers, and climb a step higher on the ladder when he felt his feet on solid ground. In fact, FDR saw it very clearly, and IIRC, he was one of the strongest voices against isolatinists. Wise man, thank god.
European continental nations lacked what Spanish Civil war meant: a general essay on WWII, on the axis side. And they lost the only chance they had, for a brief moment to attack Germany just after the Sudeten anexion, when they were still weak. But having France & U.K. agreeing on the when, what and how on that times is utopic. Heh, even now it's utopic (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
So to the why the U.S.A. got involved into WWII, it is because your president saw clearly that isolationism was not the answer, but it was the snake egg. The Lend & Lease Act (I think it is the right name) is only an intermediate step towards full involvement.
For what plan Marshall is concerned, It's really brilliant. But take into account that besides the evident help it provided to rebuild Europe, it is also a wonderful business for the U.S.A. (and I am not critisizing it. I believe Marshall plan was the most effective weapon against rampant Soviet influence), and boosted U.S.A. exports big time.
On a side note, I think If we go on talking on this subject, we should move the thread to the History forum.
Cheers,
Pepe
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Originally posted by TheWobble:
Yup, even though Americans are these big assholse there sure seems to be a lack of threads where out of the blue we decide to try and belittle europe, however that seems to be the major europien squeak "americans are amazinhunks" every time I read this bord i see that and a bunch of other CRAP about how americans suck, yet its not very often ya see americans bashing anyone for no reason other than a reply for some remark, yet we are the badguys...I went to paris with my parents a while back we walked into a restraunt WITH DOGS IN IT btw, and we sat for 15 miniutes waiting for a waiter, a whole groupe of waters were just standing around just chatting and helping other costumers but never came our way, eventually we just quietly left, who is the amazinhunk in this instance...no wait im sure someway that us horrible rude american offened the waiters so they had every right to treat us like toejam..
You have to know that some waiters in Paris have a special "style" it's not the general case.And it can happen to French people too (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif) it hapened to me several time ending with a lot of noise and bad words (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
And about the dog I'm pretty sure you where in a Bistrot not a real restaurant (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Originally posted by Jack55:
Heck with out our life giving gulf stream, it would be a frozen wasteland.
Absolutely right Jack55, we europeans way to often forget, without USA
we would be an Iceblock. So thank you again for heading the Gulf Stream
in the right direction!
greets Gh0stFT (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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As an "American" living in Europe (20 years in total),
I can say this, most Americans think that there way is better, or the only way to do things. Most are very arrogant, and have very little respect for other cultures. The reason I say this is I see them every day in places like London, Amsterdam etc..if you could see the way they (or most) act, you would just shake you head and walk away in disgrace. an example.
At McDonalds in Amsterdam US Air Force TSgt's (in Dress Blue's) were at the counter placed there order in English (ok well American) then went to pay in dollars when the clerk said the did not take dollars they got pissed off and made the statement that everyone takes dollars as it was the only currency that was worth anything.
I know that not all Americans are the same but it's people like the two above that make it bad for everyone else, BTW the above example happens more than not. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
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!!! Heater !!!
(http://www.geocities.com/heater_nl/_private/heater1.jpg)
Shit Happens All The Time
"If you have any trouble sounding condescending, find a Unix user to show you how it's done."
[This message has been edited by Heater (edited 01-25-2001).]
[This message has been edited by Heater (edited 01-25-2001).]
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Um. Paint, the "From" is column is for where you're living now, or where you'd like to be from. Tac doesn't have to put Spain if he doesn't want; in any case, I thought he said he was Columbian.
Yeah, I love French restaurants. One time I went in to some bistrot, and the waiter recognized me from my previous (and only) visit: Eight months before, I was with 6 other loud Americans who didn't finish any of their plates.
It's strange how you can make an impression.
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LOL Ding!
Straffo, True thing, the waiters in Paris will not wait for you to be American... they are rude to just everyone (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Originally posted by Pepino:
RAM, that was not answered because I was going home. Anyway, you do not need to be so rude, IMO. We try to show our superiority to Americans, right? j/k (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
Pepino, there is a big involvement factor in that answer. As many people in our nation I have missing familiars due the "thankfully-sit-in-his-seat god-blessed Franco". To hear someone REPEAT (he had said a similar thing on AGW already) such a thing, its really hurting.
And, while we are at it, some facts:
Spain, 1.936, Republican Democratic Government allowed church burning, and political prosecution.
Spain, 1.936, crime raging, economic crises, local governments chaos.
Spain, 1.936, anarchists and communists pushig for power, but by means of wild & violent labour strikes, instead of democratic vote.
Spain, Civil War, Republican Democratic Government is overan by anarchists and communists supported by the PCUS (U.S.S.R. communist party). The anarchist are massacred by the communists in Barcelona shortly after. Communists became, in fact, the leading force of the Republican side.
No white nor black and I agree, Pepino. Both sides committed really atrocious things during the war. But I really think that, had the republicans won the war, democracy would have stayed on its place. it is true that the republicans had lots of anarchist and communists backing them up, but no less true is that they were minority (a loud one, for that matter, still, a minority).
A war won by the republicans would've been a fast war. The long term war was to be won by the nationalists (As it was). After a short war, IMO, democracy would have been enforced. Noone can ensure that, but its quite more probable that than a stalinist regimen taking place. Noone in the republican side had enough power and prestige to claim a #1 spot as Franco did with the nationalists (although that only after Mola died). So after a short war noone would've been able to take power in the way that a stalinist dictatorship would've needed.
Just IMO, of course.
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Heh yeah.
And I can tell by personal experience that eagler hasn't been to Scandinavia.
Women here shve their armpits. And..well, no need to get graphical .
Huh? No need??? We want pictures! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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"Um. Paint, the "From" is column is for where you're living now, or where you'd like to be from. Tac doesn't have to put Spain if he doesn't want; in any case, I thought he said he was Columbian"
Yep. Im living in the US now, am a resident and due to the undeclared civil war that has been going on for more than 60 years in my country i'll never be going home again. That is why the "from" is from where im posting from, not where I come from. I've gotten some really bashing responses after the elections just because my profile says "from fluh-rih-duh" (heeheee (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif) ) . Im ashamed of it saying Florida than Colombia right now lol. Im electorally-challenged.
BTW, its Colombia, not Columbia. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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At McDonalds in Amsterdam US Air Force TSgt's (in Dress Blue's) were at the counter placed there order in English (ok well American) then went to pay in dollars when the clerk said the did not take dollars they got pissed off and made the statement that everyone takes dollars as it was the only currency that was worth anything.
I've never been on a deployment to a foreign nation where some kind of exchange was not set up by the deploying unit. I have Danish, Colombian, Panamanian, Japanese and whatever else currency to reflect that. I always end up with a little left over.
I don't know of a single person that I deployed with that assumed a foreign nation would take American dollars. I do know that upon occasion, with high dollar purchases, the request was made. Usually, though, a visa card would suffice.
BTW, I'm quite suprised that military personel in Amsterdam were in dress blues. Usually, those areas are civilian attire only even for those stationed there.
AKDejaVu
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...unreasonable and cruel Versaille peace treaty that raped Germany (which did not start WWI!) and practically insured WWII.
Miko2d - I believe you ought to study the inter-war years a little closer.
You assert that Versailles was the reason behind WW2. The truth is that it was one reason, and there are in fact others which are as equally important.
Firstly, the Nazi party was a fringe organisation with very little popular support, until 1929. The Wall Street Crash bankrupted the German middle classes, who had previously had no real interest in supporting the extreme nationalism espoused by the Nazis. This hugely significant (and electorally vital) group found themselves without a penny to their names; they looked to the party that was promising to return them to their prosperity. That party was the National Socialist Party. Post 1929, support for the Nazis grew tremendously (they increased their electoral share some 800%).
Versailles and the Wall Street Crash are inextricably linked to the onset of WW2.
If you want to blame the creators of Versailles, you must also blame the capitalists behind the Wall Street Crash.
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ok I've got a question, if we Americans are so stupid why do we lead the way in arias like aviation, space exploration and stuff like that, hmmm the Germans made the first jet, we made it better, Russians got to space first, we kicked some more bellybutton and went to the moon, you get my point.
one more thing no one on this planet is perfect, theres room for improvement in every country
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(http://www.user.shentel.net/vonz/jato.JPG)
[This message has been edited by jato757 (edited 01-25-2001).]
[This message has been edited by jato757 (edited 01-25-2001).]
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Thanks for all the posts. I printed them out and ran them through the shredder a few times. Then I spread them on the flower beds.
Amazing how well this stuff seems to provide nutritional opportunities for plant life!
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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Originally posted by jato757:
ok I've got a question, if we Americans are so stupid why do we lead the way in arias like aviation, space exploration and stuff like that, hmmm the Germans made the first jet, we made it better, Russians got to space first, we kicked some more bellybutton and went to the moon, you get my point.
one more thing no one on this planet is perfect, theres room for improvement in every country
Well, Jato - let me answer this for you (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
PERFECT GEOGRAPHICAL LOCATION
Every other country on the planet - especially in europe asia or africa - was ravaged by the war at least once in last 100 years and usually about 3 times a century for couple thousands of years back.
It's hard to develop lasting things when toejam gets blown to bits every 50 years (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
As for the wonderful developments - all i can tell you is that US has enough money to buy a lot of talent... come to think of it - it was german scientist that took you to the moon, wasn't it ?
As for aviation - i'd venture to claim that Su35 is the best aircraft in the world at this time... and it was prodiced without pile of computers... had the russians had this sort of technology - god knows what they would develop...
Know that whole AIM 9X hoopla ? Thrust vectoring air to air missile ? Russians had it operational for over 10 years now (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Come to think of it.. russian programmers seem to be quite a commodity in US last time i checked... (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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Bartlomiej Rajewski
aka. Wing Commander fd-ski
Northolt Wing
1st Polish Fighter Wing
303 (Polish) Squadron "Kosciuszko" RAF
308 (Polish) Squadron "City of Cracow" RAF
315 (Polish) Squadron "City of Deblin" RAF
Turning 109s and 190s into scrap metal since 1998
Northolt Wing Headquarters (http://www.raf303.org/northolt/)
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Toad, I argue with you constantly but I have to say I LOVE the way you put that!
I have never seen "you are all full of toejam" put in such a humerous and artistic way.
<SALUTE!>
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Doh! And all this time, I thought you guys had named yer country after all the pigeons in bogota.
Seriously, I screwed up. I'm really sorry about that.
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JimDandy (or whoever it was)
I have no problem with north americans calling themselves americans. Hell, you are americans.
The problem is when I visit the states, and someone asks me where I'm from; if I say AMERICA, they say NO YOU ARE NOT.
My point is that the arrogant population believes that NORTH america is the ONLY america and the rest of the hemisphere is just something else.
I have seen several tourists get pissed in the streets of my country because a shop clerk wouldnt understand english.
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ok I've got a question, if we Americans are so stupid why do we lead the way in arias like aviation, space exploration and stuff like that, hmmm the Germans made the first jet, we made it better, Russians got to space first, we kicked some more bellybutton and went to the moon, you get my point.
Err... Ummm... It was Brits who made the first jet last time I checked (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) I dare say that Russians are miles ahead in space exploration - they just don't have as much cash right now (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif). You also fly Russian designed helicopters (Igor Sikorsky), drink Chech beer (Bud) etc - the list goes on forever...
I don't think Americans are stupid. Arrogant - yes. Ignorant - sometimes (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)...
Plus - for many people American is their citizenship, not their nationality...
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The Russians designed the Commanche??!...NO
The brits made the F-22?!...NO
sure they were first, America wasn't the first at any of those, however it is the best at them. Cavemen invented the first wheel, but it sure as hell wasnt the best.
You've got me on the beer though (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
[This message has been edited by TheWobble (edited 01-26-2001).]
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Actually Wobble, its true about the choppers. Ruskies are the leaders in that field.
If they had the same ammount of cash the US has, they would be making some really amazing helos.
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(stirring the pot (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif))
The brits made the F-22?!...NO
Nah - Brits just invented the jet engine. Then Americans "borrowed" vectoring thrust concept from Russians and voi la - F22 (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif).
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Indeed, the US has improved upon/completed the design of many wonderful things initially invented by folks in other countries.
During our history we've welcomed immigrants from everywhere that have in turn made this country into a technological world leader.
I wonder why all those really smart folks left their wonderful homelands and went to the United States, don't you? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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Originally posted by Toad:
I wonder why all those really smart folks left their wonderful homelands and went to the United States, don't you? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
Maybe for a cruel war you never REALLY suffered....
Maybe for an economy devasted by the above war, instead to be improved like in your country...
Maybe for the lack of freedom sometime you suffer in the above situations...
Maybe just for money...
Maybe...
Well, who know...
If you cant do something by yourself...
buy it!!
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
Assuming you have money
And now, to the original question, I think Dinger, Fd-ski, ripsnort, and others got the point...
If you act as an amazinhunk expect to be traited as you deserve,
if you are respectful you will be surpriced how kind the people will be with you.
secondary argument
A. "We save your ass"
E. "No, mate, you save YOUR ass"
IMHO
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Originally posted by -lynx-:
Err... Ummm... It was Brits who made the first jet last time I checked
check again, He178, 1939 (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
Originally posted by jato757:
ok I've got a question, if we Americans are so stupid why do we lead the way in arias like aviation, space exploration and stuff like that, hmmm the Germans made the first jet, we made it better, Russians got to space first, we kicked some more bellybutton and went to the moon, you get my point.
one more thing no one on this planet is perfect, theres room for improvement in every country
Germans made first jet, and first swept wing designs, american did them better------>after studying all the german research,designs and planes in that field.
Russians got the space first (with help from captured germans), USA later and better, (With help of almost all the V2 design team, headed by Von Braum himself).
I dont say that USA has not great tech and research, but the examples you are giving are mostly of captured technology. The moon was conquered in 1969 because Von Braun went to the USA, had him gone to the USSR, the russians would'be put a foot there before.
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Ram - check it again yourself - Sir Frank Whittle was British. Patent applied for in 1930, granted 1932.
Russians never "captured" any German rocket scientists - they never made it as far West, Von Braun et al went to the States.
Soviet space program was "homegrown" and miles ahead of an American one - it worked, Mir was up there for 15 years (whatever happened to that SkyLab thing anyway? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)), space launches became routine, it worked reliable and to the point of becoming almost commercially viable... Until the funding had run out.
Btw, Soviet shuttles (a Russian idea again - Soviet chief designer Sergey Korol'ev published sketches back in late 50s...) had fully automated landings pioneering the completely crew-less cargo-haul into space.
As for "saving our ass" point which seem to be so popular in certain circles across the pond I'd like to point out that those were Russian T-34s and IS-2s on the streets of Berlin in May 1945, not American Shermans. By the time "the saviours of our asses" landed in Normandy the Soviet army had already made it's way back from Moscow into Europe. And before you even think "lend-lease" I'll tell you that we paid for it, in gold, for every Jeep, tank, plane, tin of beef.
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Originally posted by -lynx-:
Ram - check it again yourself - Sir Frank Whittle was British. Patent applied for in 1930, granted 1932.
first jet engine was british. First jet plane was german. He178, summer 1939.
Russians never "captured" any German rocket scientists - they never made it as far West, Von Braun et al went to the States.
you are talking about the V2 project team. but a lot of german scientists and researchers were captured by the USSR. I dont have data on it, but its almost sure that some rocket scientists fell into soviet hands, and were used for researching into the Soviet Space Program.
I hope that someone has real data on this matter, but its a simple thing of statistics: of X german scientists captured by the soviets, some of them MUST have been involved in peenemunde's V2 project, or into Lippisch's rocket aircraft.
Almost all post-war Soviet aircraft technology was captured one (except the RR Nene jet engine that was english). the first soviet jets were based on the Jumos on the 262,some of the first jet designs were almost copies of the Me262. And almost all the swept-wing technology in the Soviet Union in 1946 had been captured in Germany, along a lot of the investigators involved.
Its not hard to think that some germans used in researching rocket technologies in Germany in WWII were captured by the russians. And where to use them?...missile, ICBM and space technologies, its clear
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and if i remember correctly.. it was captured german scientists that invented the internet too !! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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Bartlomiej Rajewski
aka. Wing Commander fd-ski
Northolt Wing
1st Polish Fighter Wing
303 (Polish) Squadron "Kosciuszko" RAF
308 (Polish) Squadron "City of Cracow" RAF
315 (Polish) Squadron "City of Deblin" RAF
Turning 109s and 190s into scrap metal since 1998
Northolt Wing Headquarters (http://www.raf303.org/northolt/)
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huh? is Gore german?
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ah, Naso...
They've been coming to "America" for more than 200 years.
They're still coming; the bright ones, the motivated ones, the hard workers (and some of the lesser lights as well.)
Why do they come? Why not stay in their own societies?
It's not just war. We don't PAY people to immigrate to the US.
It's opportunity, Naso. That's all. A simple chance.
It's why the first ones left Europe to begin with. It's still true. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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Aaaah, Toad.
I read today that Britain is the number one destination for Asylum Seekers in the world.
And that includes America. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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RAM when you get facts - post them here. Von Braun et al from Pennemunde research facility were captured by the Allies, not the Russians. Pennemunde was the only main center Nazis had for developing of V1 and V2 (although the manufacturing and testing sites were moved elsewhere after Allied bombardment of the main site).
As for the jets - the point was the origins, not the later (much later, for that matter) use.
One has to give you a medal for perseverance in pushing the German supremacy idea. Those cheeky bastards Russians did steal every advance they'd ever had from Germans, including the victory in WW2 - the audacity of some people, sheesh... (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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That's because the rooms are padded better in the UK Dowding.
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When did they put this thing in here and WTF is it for?
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Good, Dowding. May Britain forever be the world's best place to seek political asylum.
Guess we'll just have to stumble along and make do with the folks who just want to maximize their opportunity.
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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I for one , forget sometime just how good we have it this great country (United States of America ). I hop in my rig and drive to the mountain (45 minutes ) and go snow skiing every weekend , In summer I drag my boat to a lake ( 30 minute drive to one of a dozen lakes )and water ski . GOD I LOVE MY LIFE
hehe ..
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OH and BTW the U.S. doesn't have a monopoly on prettythangholes .. I see them all the time here
(college town) ,, arrogant foreign salamanders!!! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Originally posted by AKDejaVu:
I don't know of a single person that I deployed with that assumed a foreign nation would take American dollars. I do know that upon occasion, with high dollar purchases, the request was made. Usually, though, a visa card would suffice.
BTW, I'm quite suprised that military personel in Amsterdam were in dress blues. Usually, those areas are civilian attire only even for those stationed there.
AKDejaVu
DejaVu,
The were here for a "Tops in Blue" show, which I agree with you, they travel enough that they should know better.
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!!! Heater !!!
(http://www.geocities.com/heater_nl/_private/heater1.jpg)
Shit Happens All The Time
"If you have any trouble sounding condescending, find a UNIX user to show you how it's done."
[This message has been edited by Heater (edited 01-26-2001).]
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OH and BTW the U.S. doesn't have a monopoly on prettythangholes .. I see them all the time here (college town)
Quack (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
Dude.. you live in Eugene. THEY are talking about YOU (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
AKDejaVu
-The only thing worse than the dislike between Euros and the US is the dislike between people from Portland and hippies from Eugene (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif) (Oh.. except maybe the French/British relationship... they do have history on their side)
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OK your beloved German engine had to be completely remanufactured after every 20 hours of flight, I don't think the P/F-80 had that same problem, in ww2 we supplied the Russians with p39s, the British, we leased them P-51s, and I cant remember when this started but the all mighty luftwaffe still flys f4 phantoms, the I.A.F. flys our F-15s and F-16, japan has an order with Boeing for a 767-200 awacs, and they fly a number of U.S. fighters. Thewobble, I totally agree with you man, there is not a single other country with stealth technology. and I hate to remind you all of this one,..................................... IT WAS A AMERICAN WHO WROTE THIS GAME YOU ALL LOVE SO MUCH. hahahaha
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(http://www.user.shentel.net/vonz/jato.JPG)
[This message has been edited by jato757 (edited 01-26-2001).]
[This message has been edited by jato757 (edited 01-26-2001).]
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jato! LET US SMILE AS WE BURN SIDE BY SIDE ON THE FLAMING CROSSES!!!
crosses will probably be made in america aswell (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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I just got around to reading this thread, and am posting a reply to a MUCH earlier post:
Someone said that Americans are arrrogant because we call ourselves "Americans".
What else can we call ourselves? "Citizen of the United States of America" doesn't abbreviate too well and is awfully long to say. And, if we used the particular state we live in to identify ourselves, things would get confusing pretty fast.
"America" might include more countries than the USA; however, the USA is the only one with "America" in its name. The residents of Mexico or Brazil or Argentina or El Salvador don't NEED to use "America" when identifying themselves.
But, what else can those of us from the USA call ourselves? I don't think we call ourselves "American" out of arrogance, but out of lack of a better term.
But I DO see how it sure LOOKS like arrogance, especially in the impersonal world of the INTERNET.
J_A_B
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C'mon Jab, you know as well as everyone that if Americans were held to a standard that wasn't attainable by anyone but god that just wouldn't be fair. We cannot speak without being arrogant or stupid, and of course silly we cannot defend ourselves against the Eurofunk because then it would be US who are bashing them, and god knows that saying something about them make you a racist bigot pig.. come on man get with the program, you are making the rest of us idiot arrogant pigs look worse.
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Americans = USA?
Well lets look at another example:
The United States of Mexico.
Does anyone have a problem with calling citizens of that nation Mexicans, or informally calling the nation Mexico. I doubt it.
There is a North America, a South America, and a Central America. When it is just America, then that is the USA. When the whole North and South American land mass starts to be refered to as America then there may be an issue.
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Thats a missprint in my "from" column , its
Bluegene , Oregon ...
damn Portland crack heads (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Heheh, the Swedes and French beat the US with having a 4th generation jet fighter out in operational units (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif).
Helmet mounted sights, thrust vectoring on short range missiles, IR targetting system, inexpensive space launches. The US is doing very well, but it ain't the best at everything. "Just" a lot.
Good thing yanks got the F-22, or they'd get some serious spanking as the Russians start exporting their latest aircraft.
Now I am gonna see if i can spot more of those American F-16's flying in formation; saw a flight of four doing low level exercises yesterday. Woodie time (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif).
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Baron Claus "StSanta" Von Ribbentroppen
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"
(http://us.st5.yimg.com/store4.yimg.com/I/demotivators_1619_4916770)
"I don't necessarily agree with everything I think." - A. Eldritch
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Know that whole AIM 9X hoopla ? Thrust vectoring air to air missile ? Russians had it operational for over 10 years now
Hoopla is it..
Who was it that designed the first AIM-9 again? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
The 50's were the Hay-Day for American design and enginuity. SR-71, AIM-9, U-2, Flying Wing... just some fricking incredible things.
AKDejaVu
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the russians couldent even make a decent long range bomber capable of carrying a nuke, they had to STEAL 2 american b-29's and just made clones of them.
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Also, you can have all the thrust vectoring missles ya want (if they exist) but they wont hit a damn thing if they cant see it, I.E. stealth. Why would we need those missles, we already have the best pilots, best planes and best intel system, on a side note I cant find any mention of thrust vectoring missles anywhere on the net. But if they do exist im sure we have them..or something better.
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oh yea forgot about all them, hahahahahahaha
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(http://www.user.shentel.net/vonz/jato.JPG)
[This message has been edited by jato757 (edited 01-26-2001).]
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hey guys look at this, in the center good old American technology, in the background leaving contrails, Im sure you know, hehehe P.s. the bird is safely cruzin away at 300,000 feet, that is cool
(http://www.aviatorart.com/west/images/habu.gif)
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(http://www.aviatorart.com/west/images/habu.jpg)
[This message has been edited by jato757 (edited 01-26-2001).]
[This message has been edited by jato757 (edited 01-28-2001).]
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Ohhhhhh BOY!!!
That one's a hotty!
I agree with both Wobble and JATO...
If it's war you want....
WAR IT IS!!! (Here comes the calvery)
Quiet.
(http://www.bilderberg.org/mush.gif)
(http://members.aol.com/rwohorror/skull03.gif)
[This message has been edited by Quiet109 (edited 01-26-2001).]
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"..But I DO see how it sure LOOKS like arrogance, especially in the impersonal world of the INTERNET.."
Can you try to elaborate on this, pal?
Sorry I may have got the wrong, stupid message.
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Originally posted by Jimdandy:
I'm curious. What are people from a country named the United States of America supposed to call themselves? United Statesians? It's not called the United States of North America. We would probably refer to ourselves as North Americans if that were the case. We happened to pick the name America for our country. Anyone else could have. Why is that an example of arrogance?
Heh, maybe you never heard this one before. You and I may not call ourselves "North Americans" or "United Statesians", but if you ever watch the spanish language news on TV (available in much of the US), you'll here the newscasters refer to us Americans as norteamericanos and even estadunidenses, which of course means "United Statesers." (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
There was a really cool picture in one of my US history textbooks of Times Square. On the big TV screen in the middle, there was a shape of the 48 contiguous states with big letters superimposed on it saying, "This is Not America!"
(http://www.jump.net/~cs3/sigs/uns_sig.jpg) (http://www.jump.net/~cs3)
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Also, you can have all the thrust vectoring missles ya want (if they exist) but they wont hit a damn thing if they cant see it, I.E. stealth.
Yup, that stealth fighter is untouchable, isn't it?
(http://www.users.bigpond.net.au/phoenix/images/stealth.jpg)
Oops, back to the drawing board (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
BTW jato, 300,000 feet? Hmmm, try just over 100,000. Typical American exaggeration. Next thing you'll be telling us it flies at Mach 10.
[This message has been edited by Jekyll (edited 01-27-2001).]
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Originally posted by jato757:
P.s. the bird is safely cruzin away at 300,000 feet, that is cool
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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TheWobble: interestingly enough the pilots we send to the US for training usually finish near the top or the top of their class (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif).
Aah, the benefits of having a small air force and a huge number of people applying to fly jets (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif).
Our pilots rule you. We're the best. We're almost LW.
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Baron Claus "StSanta" Von Ribbentroppen
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"
(http://us.st5.yimg.com/store4.yimg.com/I/demotivators_1619_4916770)
"I don't necessarily agree with everything I think." - A. Eldritch
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BTW jato, 300,000 feet? Hmmm, try just over 100,000. Typical American exaggeration. Next thing you'll be telling us it flies at Mach 10.
He was just a little confused. He meant the space shuttle. Of course, that flies higher and much faster than any of the figures quoted here.. but oh well.. probably just American Exageration again (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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Animal~
When I say "The impersonal world of the Internet", I mean that we are sitting looking at computer screens rather than at "real" people. Most norms of our day-to-day culture don't apply over the Internet--but since we're human, we still try to apply them.
On the Internet, we can't see a person's face or hear his voice. We don't even (usually) know the person's real name. The only contact we have with others is through written word--and this is where the problems start.
Humans are used to communicating through a combination of body language, words, tone of voice, and situation (you talk to your boss differently than you do to your best friend). Online we have only words. Despite this, most of us still try to use the same words we would use in a "normal" setting. Without things like body language or voice tone to support what we say, the meanning of our words sometimes becomes lost.
Compounding the problem is the fact that many of us are from different countries. Each country has its own customs, and its own way of speaking. But when we read something, we always apply the norms of our culture to what we're reading. This too can lead to misconception, as an offensive statement to one culture might be (and often is) perfectrly acceptable to another.
Eurpoeans are naturally somewhat better at bridging the culture gap than Americans are, because they often have to do it on a day-to-day basis. Keep in mind that most Americans have never been out of their country, and have never talked to someone of a different culture. Consideration for other cultures is NOT something most of us have ever had to deal with before--myself included.
Likewise, Europeans are so used to dealing with other cultures that they tend to forget that Americans AREN'T.
To apply all these ideas to the original statement--
A person from the USA calls himself an "American". He simply calls himself that because that's what he always has, and there really is no better word to use.
To a European, this lack of consideration for the people from other American countries can seem like arrogance, almost as if the USA resident feels that residents of other countries don't count as humans.
From there, the minsuderstanding starts, and rapidly increases until we have....well...this thread on the messageboard.
The best thing for ALL of us to do, is assume that ALL comments are in good faith and not intended to be derogatory, unless it's BLATANTLY OBVIOUS the intent is otherwise (eg. "You're a f***ing S***head!!!")
J_A_B
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Wobble - read on on air-to-air missiles pal, most of them use IR or TV guidance. You do know that stealth does not make planes invisible, just reduces the radar signature, don't ya?
As for B29s - they weren't "stolen" (how do you "steal" a B29 anyway?) - they landed in Russia damaged after raids on Japan. Russia was not at war with Japan at the time, they had to be interned (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif). Everybody knows that (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif). Russians tried them, decided they were crap and sold the lot to China (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif). Made good money on them too I heard (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif).
BTW, Russia did have very capable buffs to carry anything but there's nothing like good ol' ICBM to deliver anything anywhere. And you know what's really not funny? There's still no reliable anti-ICBM defence...
p.s Apologies to paintmaw for h/j his thread - I'm a European and I don't hate Americans (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif).
p.p.s. Wobble, you know that Americans came to England to look at Meteor, promised collaboration, took all the research with them (yep, F80 etc came from there), never gave anything back though... that's stealing, right? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif) 15 years later Brits are again ahead of everyone with TSR2 - you guys could't outsmart them, so your gov't pressured Brits to close the project down - tsk-tsk...
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We DID give one or two XP-59's to the brits, which was about the most advanced thing we had at the time. The USA did get the better part of the deal though.
J_A_B
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Not to mention the british were the ones to SELL Rolls-Royce jet engines to the USSR, which allowed the USSR to build their first decent jet engines (copied from the rolls royce).
Oh yeah, the result were the Mig-15 and Mig-17's. Superior airplanes than the Sabre... unfortunately the pilots of the Migs were quite lacking during Korea, thus the Sabre came up on top (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
"you'll here the newscasters refer to us Americans as norteamericanos and even estadunidenses, which of course means "United Statesers."
Use spell check. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif). Oh and please, use the correct term "GRINGOS" (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif) (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif) (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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OK Jab its cool, I thought you meant something else.
What I'm talking here is based on personal experience, not from people I meet on the net.
I AGREE that north americans can call themselves AMERICAN, I have no problem with that because they ARE americans.
My problem comes when some other person from another country in american calls himself american; and a north american would go ballistic over it.
I has happened to me before.
I have heard many times:
"YOU ARE NOT AMERICAN!"
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Oh, and contributing to the thread's hijack:
remember the AVRO ARROW?
How it was better than any US plane and the US FORCED the canucks to CANCEL THE PROJECT?
I know Canucks stink and their women are a joke, but man, that was a low blow.
At least their beer is good (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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TheWobble: interestingly enough the pilots we send to the US for training usually finish near the top or the top of their class .
Aah, the benefits of having a small air force and a huge number of people applying to fly jets .
Our pilots rule you. We're the best. We're almost LW.
Let's see...Denmark...is that one of those places people sit around smoking hash all the time? Must be...either that or they're just NATURALLY delusional...
We also make sure pilots who come over here are "helped," so they have some confidence when they cover our six's when we go into battle to SAVE SOMEBODY'S ASS! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Mk
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Wobble - read on on air-to-air missiles pal, most of them use IR or TV guidance. You do know that stealth does not make planes invisible, just reduces the radar signature, don't ya?
And Lynx.. you do know that the stealth features of the F-117 go far beyond radar signature don't you? No afterburners.. 6 feet of vented "ducts" for jet exaust so it can be cooled. They did plan for a low IR signature too.
Guess they actually may have known what they were doing.. eh?
AKDejaVu
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"BTW, Russia did have very capable buffs to carry anything but there's nothing like good ol' ICBM to deliver anything anywhere. And you know what's really not funny? There's still no reliable anti-ICBM defence"
NO, they didn't have any bomber capable of carrying ANYTHING very far.
All I know is that thousands of Americans died over there to help save your asses, just so you can spend your days calling them ignorant and calling them pigs, mabe they should have waited a little longer.
[This message has been edited by TheWobble (edited 01-27-2001).]
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Originally posted by StSanta:
TheWobble: interestingly enough the pilots we send to the US for training usually finish near the top or the top of their class (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif).
Aah, the benefits of having a small air force and a huge number of people applying to fly jets (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif).
Santa, my class had 4 Norwegians in it and they finished near the top in it.
Of course, before they even came over to the US for school they had completed a 250+ hour flight training course in Norway in a tandem seat Saab trainer. They had already qualified in normal operations, aerobatics and formation.
Most of us had about 30 hours of "introductory" flight training in Cessna 150's when we started. Basically it was a course to see if we had any aptitude that might be developed and covered takeoffs, landings and short cross country ops.
The entire UPT course in T-37's and T-38's was only about 225 hours, so the Norwegians had more than that when they arrived. Wonder if that helped them?
Does Denmark do any training prior to sending the students over?
[This message has been edited by Toad (edited 01-27-2001).]
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Don't know Toad. Know we have a Danish top test pilot though.
Seems our airforce regularly train with yanks; a few months ago there was an incident where an F-16 touched wings with a tanker. Pilot only discovered it when he landed and checked his right; wingtip and sidewinder missle on it gone (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif).
Great plane, the F-16. Ours are A's that are being upgraded with glass cockpits and all sorts of neato things.
When I visited the airfield back when the Thunderbirds came for a visit, I was surprised of just how primitive the A models were in terms of instrumentation. Thought "hell, in my computer games I got cool things. What's THIS?".
Btw; it's interesting to try to make out planes at a distance. From far away, all you see of the F-16 is a glimmering delta wing, really. Hearing when they kick in the afterburner is nice as well.
We need MORE fighters. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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Baron Claus "StSanta" Von Ribbentroppen
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"
(http://store4.yimg.com/I/demotivators_1619_3845234)
"I don't necessarily agree with everything I think." - A. Eldritch
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I think it is probably unfair to expect Americans to behave like civilised people.
http://www.washtimes.com/national/default-2001126231129.htm (http://www.washtimes.com/national/default-2001126231129.htm)
After all, if the outgoing Administration behaves like thieves, looters and small children, why should we expect the rest of the populace to behave any better?
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all Europeans are good for is bashing America, cloning sheep and then screwing them. Europe in general should qualify as 1 big hate group, all ya do is squeak and talk toejam about America and then cry when ya need some help, then as soon as yer done being helped yer right back to calling us pigs and idiots again, not all but most of the Europeans I have seen or read posts from seem to have never been to America but yet seem to be experts on how much it sucks, well that yer opinion and thanks to America you can freely express it, so enjoy trashing the people that saved yer tulips watch the history channel, Churchill cried like a little girl to get the US to come bail you idiots out and this is the thanks we get.
This post is no less rude than any other of the Anti-American crap I have been reading, but im sure I will portrayed as the anti-Christ because of it, cause im a stupid American pig.
Oh yea..And at least we can protect our public figures from being killed by paparazzi.
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Oh yea..And at least we can protect our public figures from being killed by paparazzi.
At least OUR public figures don't get murdered by their own countrymen (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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That's true. Euros just like to kill Euros from other countries in huge numbers I guess.
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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(QUOTE)
I think it is probably unfair to expect Americans to behave like civilised people.
After all, if the outgoing Administration behaves like thieves, looters and small children,
LOL ,, this quote from a guy living in a place where ancestors were living in a brit prison colony
[This message has been edited by paintmaw (edited 01-27-2001).]
[This message has been edited by paintmaw (edited 01-27-2001).]
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TheWobble is just an idiot who gives a bad name to other Americans.
Its because of people like you that your country is disliked in many places.
Go and crawl back into your hole.
And then try to pay for this game.
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Go diddly yourself Animal, you know precisely nothing about me, I don't personally attack anyone here, your the amazinhunk.
[This message has been edited by TheWobble (edited 01-27-2001).]
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Hehe, and the first one to lose his cool was ....... (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Hehe aint it amazing how Wobble proves most of the reasons posted above?
BTW animal, that is one SICK picture. Get help... fast...
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--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Hehe aint it amazing how Wobble proves most of the reasons posted above?"
How does me defending myself against a personal attack prove anything other than I dont like personal attacks?
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The Wobbel: Nine of ten.
It woulda been ten but the first rebuttle to your "Piss off Euros!" post above came from Australia.
Toad: Five of ten.
The guy you answered got thrown outa Europe awhile back.
If Jekyll turns out to be English just living in Oz ya get a 7.
Animal: One of ten.
You are from Puerto Rico and the "try to pay for this game" line was lame.
TAC: Sorry bud, Zero of ten.
You are from or now living in Florida.
The guys who almost hijacked the topic with intellligent discussion: Nice try!
(BTW TW, ya get another 1/2 point for your last post, good comeback kid.)
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When did they put this thing in here and WTF is it for?
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good god sun, no matter how pissed I am you alsways make me laugh (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
<S>
[This message has been edited by TheWobble (edited 01-27-2001).]
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Sure Sun, nice score, I wasnt expecting a better review from Wobble's girlfriend. And what is me being from PR has to do with a low score? hmm..
Oh and Wobble, every time you post you just prove what I said over and over again (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
And no, I wont diddly myself if thats what you were going to say AGAIN, thats why I have my fine lady. Your arguments are stupid and you are as smart as a three legged dog.
Like I said, go save some pennies and pay for AH.
Tac: Here's the pic again
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Fat DRUNK Bastards.
Nothing feels sweeter than facing a powerful enemy 1 on 1, the battle is tough, but you emerge victorious. As he types <S>!!! on channel one, you open fire on his chute.
(http://home.coqui.net/dimitri/secret/cassie6.jpg)
[This message has been edited by Animal (edited 01-27-2001).]
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"Sure Sun, nice score, I wasnt expecting a better review from Wobble's girlfriend. And what is me being from PR has to do with a low score? hmm.."
Wow, what are you 12 years old?
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LOL! was asking the exact same thing about you. The nice thing about having you around is that your constant posting is always consistently stupid.
Thats why its funny.
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"Nothing feels sweeter than facing a powerful enemy 1 on 1, the battle is tough, but you emerge victorious. As he types <S>!!! on channel one, you open fire on his chute."
Your signature says alot about your mentality and attitude, your not stupid or crazy, your just mean. Your one of them people who will tell someone that someone else said something bad about them just to see what unfolds because it might amuse you. Meanness is a sickness, and you need treatment, im not responding to any more of yer crap seeing as how it forces me to communicate on a very sub-par level.
And sorry i told you to go diddly yerself, i just dont respond well to personal attacks from people for no reason.
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LOL.
Bye.
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Originally posted by TheWobble:
Go diddly yourself Animal, you know precisely nothing about me, I don't personally attack anyone here, your the amazinhunk.
Originally posted by TheWobble:
Your signature says alot about your mentality and attitude, your not stupid or crazy, your just mean. Your one of them people who will tell someone that someone else said something bad about them just to see what unfolds because it might amuse you. Meanness is a sickness, and you need treatment, im not responding to any more of yer crap seeing as how it forces me to communicate on a very sub-par level.
And sorry i told you to go diddly yerself, i just dont respond well to personal attacks from people for no reason.
Eh? So, you don't attack anyone, and it's wrong to make assumptions about people you know nothing about? Good points (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
SOB
BTW - Animal's not mean...he is an ugly non-american Puerto-Rican, but he ain't mean. (thank god for killshooter) (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/tongue.gif)
BTW#2 - Boobies...I think you know what I'm getting at Animal (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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Sun... what does it have to do that I live in florida now?
I dont need to bash the US.. they do it quite well all by themselves (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif) .
Wobble: Its not that you defend yourself, its how. I can actually picture you working at that website Superfly put a link up to (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
[This message has been edited by Tac (edited 01-28-2001).]
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Tac, I dont respond well to what I percieve as an unfounded personal attack, im a nice fellow until someone goes below the belt with stupid comments aimed not at my ideas but at me as a person, all bets are off..and I LOVE that websight! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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TheWobble:
You are a retard who stumbles on the same rock 6 times. However talking on the internet is roadkill. I hope you make it to the next con. But what the heck, you dont even pay for the game, you wont be there.
Again and again you have proved around the BBS that you are just a lowlife little closet-bigot with nothing better to do than making posts faster than a chog can kill 10 zekes.
I know you will come with a dumb comeback trying to be clever, and at the end you will say "I WILL LEAVE THIS THREAD AND NOT LOOK AT IT AGAIN" but we all know you will.
However, I hope someone LOCKS this thread before you get to reply. This dumb thread has gone too far even for the O'Club.
Yankees whinning about people not liking them is ironic. Why should anyone care if someone they dont know likes them or not.
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Did someone say boobies?
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Well, SOB does have boobies..
But man-milk should not be very nutritive.
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LOL! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
You will pay for that Lamina!
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oops
[This message has been edited by TheWobble (edited 04-15-2001).]
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Originally posted by Animal:
You are a retard who stumbles on the same rock 6 times.
bwwwwahhhhhhhhhhhaaahahahahah aha!!!!!!!!!
wait a minute <eyes tearing from laughing trying to catch composure>
bwahhhhhhhahahahahahahahahaha hahh!!!! <rolling coughing>
wobble you dipshit you really pissed em off this time! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
you have had so many chances to come clean and stop irritating everybody - this community will still deal with you if you just grow up -
by the way...you claimed to have played in the ma but wont give up your handle so.....what is it? i say if you dont fess up to fibbin you might as well put on a frilly skirt and go play dolls
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EDIT: screw that nice post, I never do anything rude or hateful to anyone here and yet i get attacked all the time out of nowhere, and when I fight back it is I who am being the amazinhunk. i try to be nice and courteous even when confronted with just rude antaganist comments which i have done nothing to provoke, yet ya just jeep pushing and keep saying stuff that is more insulting and more rude, even when I completely quit posting on a thread you keep calling me names and calling me an idiot, and then finally when ive been pushed and pushed for no reason I shoot back, and when i do I "piss everyone off" and I am the amazinhunk for defending myself against constant rude remarks and name callings. Well if thats they way ya wannt play it you can kiss this "amazinhunks" amazinhunk.
[This message has been edited by TheWobble (edited 01-28-2001).]
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Wobble, ya do realize ther eason for your findings is that the US is ONE big country with a somewhat shady history, and Europe is a LOT of countries with equally dubious histories.
Go out and search for anti-French sites, or ant-German ones. I found a lot.
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Baron Claus "StSanta" Von Ribbentroppen
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"
(http://store4.yimg.com/I/demotivators_1619_3845234)
"I don't necessarily agree with everything I think." - A. Eldritch
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TheWobble whined this stupid toejam:
EDIT: screw that nice post, I never do anything rude or hateful to anyone here and yet i get attacked all the time out of nowhere, and when I fight back it is I who am being the amazinhunk. i try to be nice and courteous even when confronted with just rude antaganist comments which i have done nothing to provoke, yet ya just jeep pushing and keep saying stuff that is more insulting and more rude, even when I completely quit posting on a thread you keep calling me names and calling me an idiot, and then finally when ive been pushed and pushed for no reason I shoot back, and when i do I "piss everyone off" and I am the amazinhunk for defending myself against constant rude remarks and name callings. Well if thats they way ya wannt play it you can kiss this "amazinhunks" amazinhunk.
HAHAHAHHA; DUDE, I can ALMOST hear your panting and sobbing thousand of miles away. You are crying over something people said over the net on a MESSAGE BOARD, MWAHAHAHAHHA!!
[This message has been edited by Animal (edited 01-28-2001).]
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StSanta, good point, Im not going to check but I imagine my finding would have been different, anyone know why the South Korean school books say that stuff about us? I would assume the Korean war is to "blame" but Im not sure.
great rebuttal animal, hope ya didn't cook too many brain cells on that masterpiece..
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Dont worry Wobble, no burned cells here. It dont take much thinking to reply to the stupid drivel you type.
"so basically the results conclude that Americans in general harbor no hatred for Europeans on Europe in general, and yet that Europeans in general see Americans as "rude", "bigots" (that's funny)and "stupid"
Well TheWobble, I didnt call you a bigot for hate towards Americans, like I said in the second post of this thread, Americans are fun.
I called you a bigot by reading many of your other posts in this bbs, in wich show you a bigoted attitude; yet when someone mentions it, you deny it completly and act offended. Thats why I call you CLOSET-BIGOT.
And its pretty obvious you are TRYING to act all civilized and smart (you dont succeed) now that you've been bashed on this thread; you want to be the victim. But by scrolling up this thread and looking at your other posts in the bbs, its obvious you are a tard, and almost everyone in this board knows it.
Oh, and I hope there were more moderators in these forums, so someone would lock this fugging thread up.
[This message has been edited by Animal (edited 01-28-2001).]
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Wow, I stopped reading this thread after about 50 posts......is it worth my time to go back and read the last 102? Did we solve world hunger yet?
Fury
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No Fury, but the half last part is quite funny!
Hey Fury, do you by any chance like cars? what would you recomend; Accura Integra, or Mits. Eclipse?
Sorry I dont like mid-priced americans. Americans can only make Pickups, SUVs, and high-end cars (like my vette)
Oh and does anyone by any chance know any really good TV-in video card to do some editing? I want to make a movie with my girlfriend. The plot is still secret.
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"But by scrolling up this thread and looking at your other posts in the bbs, its obvious you are a tard, and almost everyone in this board knows it."
all I see is me arguing the thread topic and the like along with everyone else until someone named ANIMAL jumps in out of nowhere and puts
"TheWobble is just an idiot who gives a bad name to other Americans.
Go and crawl back into your hole.
And then try to pay for this game
"
which was TOTALLY un-provoked, un-warrented, and way out of line, of course like any other creature on the planet i fight back when attacked, I just want to voice opinions and address the thread topic like everyone else but I will not sit idle when someone makes rude comments at me out of nowhere for no reason.
And I am the "tard", try again, and this time concentrate.
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Ok, I did skim far enough to catch this juicy sig line (it's sorta like driving past a car wreck), with apologies to Wobble -- no harm intended, but I found it to be very amusing.
As for cars, I don't know enough about the ones you mentioned, but IIRC the Eclipse is a sports car I think? And in my midlife crisis, I'd probably go with that one.
Fury
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"Go * yourself Animal, you know precisely nothing about me, I don't personally attack anyone here, your the *.
-TheWobble
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"sort of like driving past a car wreck"
LOL! I can see that, no offense taken. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
"Go * yourself Animal, you know precisely nothing about me, I don't personally attack anyone here, your the *.
-TheWobble"
boy I really botched that one didn't I (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) LoL
but hey I did apologize
[This message has been edited by TheWobble (edited 01-28-2001).]
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LOL thanks Fury I consider it an honor to be on people's sigs.
As for wobble, boy you sure are worked up over a stupid argument.
Shows how important all this is to you.
What a loser.
bye.
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StSanta, now that Analmal and I have Hijacked, beaten, and raped this thread can you please put it back on track..... (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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SO.....um....who's gonna win the Superbowl?
J_A_B
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Originally posted by Animal:
Oh and does anyone by any chance know any really good TV-in video card to do some editing? I want to make a movie with my girlfriend. The plot is still secret.
hehehe...what KIND of video, animal? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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lol Wobble
Your bigotry shines through the roadkill yet again.
If ain't the damned gooks, it's the damned Euros...
Toad,
Opportunity or asylum? That must be a very hard choice.
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Originally posted by -lynx-:
Wobble - read on on air-to-air missiles pal, most of them use IR or TV guidance. You do know that stealth does not make planes invisible, just reduces the radar signature, don't ya?
As for B29s - they weren't "stolen" (how do you "steal" a B29 anyway?) - they landed in Russia damaged after raids on Japan. Russia was not at war with Japan at the time, they had to be interned (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif). Everybody knows that (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif). Russians tried them, decided they were crap and sold the lot to China (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif). Made good money on them too I heard (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif).
BTW, Russia did have very capable buffs to carry anything but there's nothing like good ol' ICBM to deliver anything anywhere. And you know what's really not funny? There's still no reliable anti-ICBM defence...
p.s Apologies to paintmaw for h/j his thread - I'm a European and I don't hate Americans (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif).
p.p.s. Wobble, you know that Americans came to England to look at Meteor, promised collaboration, took all the research with them (yep, F80 etc came from there), never gave anything back though... that's stealing, right? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif) 15 years later Brits are again ahead of everyone with TSR2 - you guys could't outsmart them, so your gov't pressured Brits to close the project down - tsk-tsk...
Lynx,
You should read the latest edition of the Smithsonian's Air and Space magazine (www.airspacemag.com). It contains an article on the 3 B-29's interned in the Soviet Union prior to their Decleration of War with the Japanese in WW II. You may be surprised by the factual events and the respect the Soviets had for the B-29.
ah1g
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"the U.S. holds no top decision-making post at the U.N. over peacekeeping, economic or social programs"
Sorry wobble, that is completely incorrect. The US holds a VETO power over almost any UN decision. Why? Because the US is the one that provides most of the money and troops. You dont need to be part of the decision, the brain may say something but if the hands refuse then that's that. Which is why the only succesfull UN actions have been of GREAT benefit (read:$$$$) for the US, not because the US is part of the UN. Im sure the folks at Somalia would have been "helped" with much more enthusiasm if they were sitting on the world's largest oil reserve. 'tis rotten politics and self-interest.. the core of any and all nations.
The UN is a joke and always will be a joke.
Animal: MATROX makes a great dual-monitor/video capture card. I'ts been highly reccomended to me. Im getting one with my new 1.5ghz P4... when I win the lottery of course. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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Jato... This guy is afraid that bloody Russians moved one of the S-200 SAMs so the SR-71 will enter it's interception range. After the guidance beam will be locked at him - he has nothing else to do but pray: his bird's turn radius is 180km, while S-200 can get the target 250km far and 40+km high.
JFYI: S-200 "Angara" can be deployed and be ready for launch in 14 hours. It's conventional warhead consists of 300kg of explosive and 60000 steel balls, enough to shred a B-52 to small particles if exploding 60-100m from a target. It can also carry a 10kton nuclear warhead. In NATO it's called SA-5...
SR-71 flights over Nothern shore of the USSR were almost useless. They had to avoid missile interception ranges and MiG-25/31s. Nice to wake up in a hotel in Murmansk and see an S-200 target-illuminating antenna on a nearby hill. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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With respect,
Pavel Pavlov,
Commissar 25th IAP WB VVS
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Originally posted by Dowding:
Opportunity or asylum? That must be a very hard choice.
Well, at the beginning of our US history, folks left your place to come here. Perhaps there was neither one available in your place at that time. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
As for now, I'm glad we're getting the "opportunists". I don't know where you got your stats or how you define "asylum" but if you're happy with the situation, I'm simply overjoyed as well.
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Tac:
That card is nice for 2d and video editing but.. DONT get it for AH. Its not the fastest thing, better get a Radeon All In Wonder. Better video editing, better 3d, fast AH.
I was actually asking for a pci card to add to my GF2
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Originally posted by TheWobble:
Bunch of nonsense about american-hating web sites cut out
You've proved nothing with this, except that there are amazinhunks in every country. It's not Europeans that hate Americans, it's some europeans that do. It's not Americans that hate Europeans, it's some Americans that do. Finding more American bashing web sites proves nothing. The average American amazinhunk probably isn't smart enough to figure out enough about what's happening in Europe to make a web site about it.
SOB
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im done arguing on this topic, we don't have to prove what a great country we have, as far as what I said about that pic with the SR-71 yea I was wrong, it was drawn at 80,000 feet, anyway the pilots who flew the SR-71 not only wore pilots wings but also wear astronaut wings, im sure U all know why they wear thoughts wings, the U.S. has not stated any information on the bird but ill bet it flies a lot higher than 100,000 feet.
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(http://www.user.shentel.net/vonz/jato.JPG)
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Another problem is that Americans are still stuck to the Imperial measurment systems. Even Brits switched to Metric (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
Well, if SR-71 pilots wore Astronaut wings - then should I wear "space-defence" insignia? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) I am an S-200 technical division officer, one of that guys in insulation suites, working in brown vapours of oxydizer liquid. I didn't get my papers, but I think I had enough studies to fuel the 5B28 and bring that 11 meters long beast to a launch site. I told you already that my Uncle had at least 4 confirmed victories as an S-75 "Dvina" targeting officer in Vietnam. So it goes. He didn't start that war...
Yes, I agree that you do not have to prove that your country is great. Only a stupid will not admit it. The case is that you should understand that in many places people want to be just left alone. Even in North Korea they try to live on their own and built whatever they want.
In Central Asian republics the marriage age is 13 or 14 years old. Should you "bomb them down to the stone age"?
People are different everywhere, and noone has the right to decide if they are right or wrong living like they do. I have to admit that I don't have a right to judge Americans too (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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With respect,
Pavel Pavlov,
Commissar 25th IAP WB VVS
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Toad,
Apparently, 81% of applications for asylum to the UK are turned down (whether they are bogus or fraudulant is another question).
But if we can help even a handful of seriously abused people, I don't mind paying the extra taxes.
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a few of these will mess up that s-200 or whatever, and americans dont usualy fly solo
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(http://www.boeing.com/defense-space/military/abl/m_abl.jpg)
[This message has been edited by jato757 (edited 01-28-2001).]
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SR-71 was widely used in the Arctic in 1960s-80s. The DID avoid S-200 interception ranges, and dealing with MiGs they had to rely on sattelite recon data. There were rumours that one or two Blackbirds were shot down, but I doubt it. They were harmless, so why bother? Better install a few mock S-200 sites (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Legends say that MiG-25 interceptor pilots new all the SR-71 pilots by names talked to them a lot, and they did not want to kill people they were aquainted to. Their goal was to repel Blackbirds from important targets, and when they had a chance to "frame" them and launch a missile - they simply refused, or stated some kind of a system mailfunction.
It's an old PVO (Soviet air defence) legend, but it's a nice one. IMO that's how all the problems should be solved: let the "big brothers" do what they want, but if we, ordinary people get a chance - we'll talk easily and share a couple of drinks (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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With respect,
Pavel Pavlov,
Commissar 25th IAP WB VVS
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Originally posted by Boroda:
Jato...
JFYI: S-200 "Angara" can be deployed and be ready for launch in 14 hours. It's conventional warhead consists of 300kg of explosive and 60000 steel balls, enough to shred a B-52 to small particles if exploding 60-100m from a target. It can also carry a 10kton nuclear warhead. In NATO it's called SA-5...
SR-71 flights over Nothern shore of the USSR were almost useless. They had to avoid missile interception ranges and MiG-25/31s. Nice to wake up in a hotel in Murmansk and see an S-200 target-illuminating antenna on a nearby hill. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
i think the SR-71 could get to russia and back to U.S. in under 14 hours (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
[This message has been edited by jato757 (edited 01-28-2001).]
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I was part of a recon/intel mission in the Murmansk area. Two RC-135's and an SR-71 were tasked into the area at the same time.
The mission achieved it's goals completely...without overflying any sovereign territory. The data proved very helpful.
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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Originally posted by Boroda:
we'll talk easily and share a couple of drinks (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
drinks,sounds good to me, hey no hard fealings to you, im sure u would be mad if this was directed at your country
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I didn't realize we had so many bigots here. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
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This is yet another thread where all I have to say is "Good grief". There seem to be so many lately.
Swoop
P.S. Whoever said Britain's switched to metric......nah mate, it's only the government that switched, the British still think in imperial. I buy my dope by the ounce. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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Originally posted by Boroda:
IMO that's how all the problems should be solved: let the "big brothers" do what they want, but if we, ordinary people get a chance - we'll talk easily and share a couple of drinks (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
S! Boroda, well said.
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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I can't blame em, just look at the culinary catastrophe that is American Cheese. It's more of a national embarrasment than even Temptation Island.
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Im still alive...although after the three major heart lung transplants i just went through, it is a miracle. They finally found some that work...so here I am...
just kidding !
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I am not an evil bastard, i just play one on Aces High
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well,
I love the USA, i work at INTEL in the UK and we have a lot of americans working here nad they are all cool, we get a lot of american visitors too, our small part of the world is buzzing with europeans and americans alike standing shoulder to shoulder looking at stonehenge in Salisbury and the Avebury stone circles and the spa at bath. I do not have a problem with anyone live and let live i say.I think that this world is getting smaller and smaller and squeaking about how f**king horrible each other is , well, it just makes me feel sick,
<shakes his head>
<says a prayer>
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No toejam PapaEcho...the main difference is that we come from different parts of the Earth, and we talk with different sounding accents.
After that...we're all basically the same. We worry about our families, where we'll be in ten years, and how to enjoy our lives and cook and eat good food!
Peace Y'all!
Mk
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LOL this thread cracks me up...
First of all, I have to give a special acknowledgment to Miko2D: You are one sick puppy!
His view of the world is twisted in a way that's almost fascinating. And he's defending his countrymens against accusations of ignorance and rudeness by posting a very rude and ignorant post.. WTG!
USA has created many many cool things and will continue to do so.. Still, its a large country. There are beggars on the streets.. The obese people stare tv most of the day and think europe is some weird part of USA..
There are super genious kids going to famous universities, then there are smart-ass kids living at their daddy's house posting to bb's acting like they know jack toejam.. Well dream on boys =)
Even if your granddads kicked bellybutton in WW2, most of you aren't worthy to lick their toes.
I dont hate Americans.. I hate only stupid people (and in every large country there are many of those.)