Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: texace on January 21, 2001, 12:16:00 AM
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Alrighty, for the 4th time in a row I log in to the arena where the Knights have the numbers. And as usual we're getting our butts whooped. WE have the least number of fields and the most people on.
Yes I understand the "turn in the bucket", but I have noticed a trend with the Knights.
WE always b*tch about not having fields yet we never actually do anything about it. Any time a mission goes up in the planner almost no one joins it, (save for Rip's missions)
and any time we get a field flat, no one brings a goon or attemps to but gets shot down for lack of support. It seems everyone has more fun furballing and perk saving no one does anything actually fun anymore.
So here's the question. Which country here has the best and the most teamwork to reach a goal?
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/confused.gif)
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Lt. Col. Aaron "txace-" Giles of the 457th BG
"Fait Accompli"
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Map location has alot to do with the situation. Lower right area of the map is the toughest to break out of.
As far as strategic aspects go... the middle of the map has less impact than the outsides IMO. The ports and fleets are usually to the outside. If the players swarm to the center of the map, the outsides fall and then the whole thing collapses. Today the knits basically proved this.
One more thing... Defence typically leads to losing. Offence is the only path to success in the MA.
AKskurj
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I really would like to see two separate arenas; One for mindless furballing and one for a game where you need to use your brains too. Just cut off those middle-islands from this map and put 'em away (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
Maybe airfields could locate so far away from coasts that fleet ack can't shoot planes over bases?
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One more thing... Defence typically leads to losing. Offence is the only path to success in the MA.
True, true. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif) Watched your AK's rally the knits and start rollin us up earlier today.. slapped down our city than poked out or HQ. Yah had us pinned till we got on the attack ourselves. Good show.
<S!>
Hang
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None of them Tex.
I think Hangtime is trying to rally some Bishops to the cause and I hope he succeeds.
The problems as I see them are:
1.Joe Player logs in, looks for the most red spots and heads off into the furball.
2.Joe Player logs in, looks for the least red spots and goes off to capture a vehicle field that is totally useless.
3.Joe Simmer logs in, looks at the map, sees where the most damage can be done and spends the next hour trying to get people to do it.
Now, sometimes Joe Player will jump into Joe Simmers effort if he feels like it but he bails as soon as the fleet is sunk or the base is captured instead of immediately reupping for the next nearest strategic target.
What we need is to find 4 or five guys, regardless of Squad affiliation, who can resist the furball mentality and stick to the strategy aspect for the duration of their time online that particular session and hope a enough furballers join in to keep the effort rolling.
This happens a lot but sustaining the effort is difficult, interest fades after several bases are taken unless the drive is toward HQ, which it should be but is not usually the case.
What we also need is some Fleet skippers who do not sail into the nearest large airfield and, after an hour of furballing lose the fleet.
It seems to me, using P14 as an example, that as soon as we get P14 and sink TG13, TG13 sails directly to A11 and is lost soon there after.
TG13 should either sail due west and launch attacks on 11 from a safer distance , withdraw toward A10 doing the same or sail down the East side and quickly grab A15 and tear up the enemy rear area.
It is also frustrating to watch a fleet sail for an hour and no one flies from it till it is just offshore an enemy base.
They could be attacking from further out, damaging an enemy before they can take off, fly 30 seconds and attack the fleet.
I fly bombers and C47s and have lots of time to look at the map and understand that most do not so the above is not a criticism of how anyone plays AH.
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When did they put this thing in here and WTF is it for?
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Originally posted by Sunchaser:
None of them Tex.
I think Hangtime is trying to rally some Bishops to the cause and I hope he succeeds.
The day he starts putting up missions with LW iron I'll go bish (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif). For now all he puts are sissy american planes (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
In fact I just logged off in disgust from the Main Arena. At this time (19.15 pm my hour), Knights are holding 4 fields only, on the right lower side of the map. We are getting seriously banged all the time, and the situation has been the same for nearly a week.
I am seriously thinking in switching sides until someone forces a reset (so far rooks and bishes are playing with the knights, but not trying to seize fields and end the gangbang).
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RAM.. put up LW missions!! The object is to get and hold fields... I do it with USAAF planes because I know them and their loadouts.. and they are insidiously effective in the Mission Enviornment. Sadly; they often go in without adequite screens or escorts; and we suffer high losses as a result.
I'd just be happy as a three donuted puppy in a squeak kennel if I had somebody writing 'associate' missions for forward screen and CAP for the Attack Raids (perfect for LW and IJN or LLVS A/C) we sent in! Man; it would be GREAT.. but the Planner is limited in the numbers of planes that can be dispatched from each mission, and normally outta 40 or so bish that are on; getting 25% of them involved in a mission is a RARE thing indeed.
I'd like to get more squad leaders involved in the bish efforts.. so we can have one squad doing the forward sweep and CAP over the target, writing it's Mission and staffing it; another squad doing the JABO work on it's own Mission Planer submission; a third on BUFFS and goons.. all working on the same objective with the three missions running simultaneously.. That would be heaven. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
Unfortunately; The planner won't allow more than one mission up at a time from the same author.. and as Sunchaser noted the majority of the population of each county is usually involved in action not directly related to playing a war game. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Still.. it's better than nothing, and when it works it's truly awsome to watch 10 lancs w/15 escorts head out to crush the enemys fields.. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Hang
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Hang, if you want to try an LW setup, here's one I consider fairly good(I don't know the exact loadouts for the Ju88, but you can guess at it)
4 Ju88s with heaviest bomb loadout(the biggest bombs available to it) for taking down the hangars at a medium or large field. (2 for a small field)
2 Ju88s with the smallest bomb load(smallest bombs) for deacking any sized field.
4 109F4s for escorting the Ju88s(or G6s, you may need speed here. You could use 190A5s as well, but 109s are a little better for escort duties)
4 190A8s(or A5s) with a single 250kg bomb(or whatever the largest bomb is) for diving in and taking out anything still standing. And then can be used to vulch the field while the 109s stay up high and protect the Ju88s.
1 or 2 goons or M3s to capture the base(obviously!;-).
It would be interesting to do I'd think because you don't see very many raids using just german aircraft. This is just if you wanted to try something different, USAAF aircraft are still by far the best for taking down bases with their large loadouts for the fighters. And they become good for CAP once all of their external ordnance is expended. Well, except for the P47D-25 if you have rocket tubes. :-(
Anyways, that was just my idea.. please use it against the rooks not the knits! ;-)
-SW
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Knights getting gangbanged! Cool! As a knight this means I dont have to go out into the fields and get the sheep, as they are just freely entering the slaughter house!! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Kill a few Rooks, kill a few Bishes, go to sleep with clear and refreshed mind!!
HeHe!!
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Knights are not so easily beaten...
The last 2 nights Knights have been down to the HQ island, most of the time without dar, and have managed to drive back the enemy. Not because RAM bishops and rooks have not been fighting us, but becuase we've managed to put up solid efforts to take back fields that have been taken from us.
As a new permanent member of Knightland, i have been very impressed with the knightland coordination lately. Great things are sure to come of it (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Kronos
CO No. 272 Squadron "Whispering Death"
---> http://members.home.net/wchiasson/no272/ (http://members.home.net/wchiasson/no272/)
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Hang, WD will be back in a week. I'll follow suit a week later. I'll probably be busy for awhile (hunting up BUG, if he flies, and TOWD - a little score padding never hurt anyone), but I can't wait to see how things have been going! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
Voss 13th T.A.S.
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Hi
Teamwork, and the apparent lack of it is kinda relative. I never noticed this before I visited the knits for a number of days and got into a few fights with some of my ole rook buddies. You often dont see the level of teamwork involved in even the simplest operation when u fly so often. When I fly rook it seems we dont have any kinda organization, and that the enemy is super organized. Now when I fly knit and fight my rook pilots, I clearly see that yes we are organized and that yes ppl do fly in cooperation and help each other out. Somehow when u fight- especially from some form of disadvantage- it might seem that the enemy is super organized. Maybe some of this has to do with how icons work, think about it lets say you see 3 enemy 109s above you, one of them dives to attack and u try dogfigting him- only to be shot down by the other two. Well naturally u think this must be a LW squad flying togeter- and you curse the fact that you didnt have a wingman and that your side doesnt cooperate. Simple right?
Well no it prolly wasnt a squad flight of 109s, they were most likely 3 guys who just happend to be in 109s in the same spot- one of them attacked you and the others just took advantage of ur preoccupation and helped out a teammate. But the fact that u saw 3 109s close who seemed to defend each other made u assume a high level of organized teamwork. What do icons have to do with this? Enemy planes are only shown by plane type- while friendlies are identified by individuals names. Imagine how many times we all dove to clear our teammates tail-its just normal and we dont think anyting bout it. Now imagine if u were all flying p51s- wouldnt the dead enemy pilot assume u2 were more organized, and put him in an organized trap? He might think-"damn p51 squaddies, why the hell doesnt my side fight like this!!!!!!, why arent we as organized as they are???" Its all relative.
thanks GRUNHERZ
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Some nights are good Voss.. others not so good. 13th TAS, Airwolves, NightHawks, 357th and FDB's have all been great about flyin the mission profiles, but the problem is usually the large number of guys just flyin the furball... newbies abound and when the system lights up; the newbie is deposited at the closest point to the center of the map.. in this case A1.
Bear in mind that we have no legs to stand on in dictating what a guy does with his online time.. hell if they wanna furball that's ok by me.
Sometimes tho; I'm awed by how damn dumb the bish can be as a group.. last night we were clobbered becuse about 20 guys just refused to let A1 die even tho the next friendly base was 150 miles away. Our radars were down, our city flat; flack factory; refinery, even the training base gone. Nothin left to do but defend our home island.. no ords or fuel or troops avail at any of our bases.. Unable to even mount an attack we HAD to defend.. and because of A1 draining our pilot resources we couldn't muster the numbers needed to defend the key home island strat bases, and we were invaded.
Those guys fighting at A1 woulda had just as much fun; made just as many kills fightin over the home island bases instead of trying to hold a strategicly useless piece of dirt not even worth the pee it'd take to get it wet 150 miles behind the lines.
Oh well.. I'll keep trying; tho the offers I get to move to rookland are getting more attractive after nights like this... (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
<S!> All u bish that made a stand on home ground.. and no grog fer the weenies at A1. Grudingly; I'll say that you all did a fine job holding that worthless dump.. but that's negated by the damage it did the rest of bishland to hold it.
Hang
1st/AG "Bishlanders"
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Agreed Hangtime...at one point I wuz thinkin of switchin' to rook or knit just to bomb the crap outta a1. If I wuz any good at buffin I woulda too...
Still, it's their $30.00, it just gets very frustrating when bish are without dar for most of the day. I left after we lost dar for the second time, and came back just in time to see the knits take a1 fer the reset.
Not a good day in Bishland (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
<S!> knits for being the first ones to get perkys on a reset
DmdBgm
[This message has been edited by craigr (edited 01-22-2001).]
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Ahoi all,
i also miss often the will to engage strategic targets is nessasary, not only follow the green stream to the neatest fields e.g. knights own a27 + engage a30 in an endlos furball, while squeak err bish city (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif) is 10 minutes out waiting for our jabos.
And if you ask some people to join for that short ride you get the answer that you only go for perks - that sucks .
blitz
PS1.Don't need no stinkin perks - have lots & lots & lots and already a plane i love (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
PS2. Love my country and the people livin there although we earn the name "The Wild Bunch" more often than " The Brainheads" (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
[This message has been edited by blitz (edited 01-22-2001).]
[This message has been edited by blitz (edited 01-22-2001).]
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Well, yah. Those Bish over at A1 held it... and our home island finally fell. All we were left with was A1 and the VH beside it, so we were pretty much hooped... causing the first reset I think since perk points were given for it.
Was a ton of fun tho while it lasted.
I did my share of country hopping about 3 months ago just to check out the landscape... and believe me, it aint any different anywhere else.
Just turns out that the Bish are way cooler.
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All sides are and all sides aren't.
I normally stay with a side for about a month just so I get a chance to fly with/against everyone.
I notice that every side has their group that works good together and gets things done but they also have the group that only wants to furball and gets nothing done.
So I think it all depends on when you come on and who is on. All sides are good and have fun guys to fly with but they also all have dicks who everyone hates to be around.
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manny times i had situacion that we where just loiter the flat fieald awaiting for goon and nothing (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif) that`s sad in knightlan but there are people that are trying to chnage things out (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) Rip that was about U (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
great missions and good coordination is alweays a key to win (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
special thx to Viks13 (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) we had lot`s of great jubo missions just 2 of us and almoust evrytime the fieald was flat (but noone goon it (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif) )
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I've been a rook my entire time in AH (besides one quick stint with the bishes during Beta Tour 1 I believe.
With any country it does depend on who's online. With someone online who's good at persuading others to join missions, cap fields, etc etc, things move more smoothly. Zigrat was doing that last night, trying in vain to beat up the knits before they forced the reset.
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Hang....
When your online, give me a shout and you'll have the 13th TAS's support.
We are currently training in different skill sets, and the squad would enjoy participating in a mission with a purpose...just make sure someone brings some goons (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
Ltr
Ice
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The tide of the war is often dictated by the horde mentality. All sides have it to some extent and it doesn't really help gain anything. What is more important is how many people don't subscribe to the mentality.
The knits were fighting on both fronts yesterday. We had numbers (70 knits, 55 bish, 50 rook) and we were still down to one island not making progress. There was a bish CV parked off of A17 and an endless wave of bish were attacking, being met by an endless wave of knits. Finally, someone spawned from a nearby base.. climbed to 10k and came in and bombed the bish cv. Not a single bish pilot was over 6k to defend... and not a single person knew what to do when the cv was sent back to port.
The knits quickly grabed 18 and the hord started again. The bish got the cv back near 18 and a battle started between 19 and 18 that sucked up 70% of bish and knit resources. The deciding factor was not how many people we had going after the CV/19 from 18... but rather how many people were NOT doing it. As the battle raged, several people got together and took A7.. then swept across the more northern bish fields as they were relatively undefended. The rooks began to take the northwestern bases as they too were relatively undefended... yet very few bish gave up the cv->18 battle.
Finally, we were able to take A19 and A21 from the north, rather than the east. Thanks to bish persistance, the CV for 21 was handily nearby for quick capture. The bish never recovered.
I've seen the Knits behave this way too. Afterall, we were down to one island because at one time 90% of the knits on-line decided it was more important to defend A5 than any of our ports. Basically, whenever 80-90% of your country is at the same location, you are doomed.
AKDejaVu
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<S> to all the bish who fought last night, you really made us work for that reset.
and <S> to the AK's and rest of the knights
who kept flying to force the reset great work guys
44MAG
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13 tas was defending 1, not heling hang last night ice
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Actually Zig; soon as I put out the word; I had 4 13th TAS pilots running a superb high cap and screen for a medium buff/jabo raid to A28.. they stayed in the area; supporting the subsequent missions on the CV too. There may have been a few TAS pilots in the A1 area before or after mission ops were being conducted.. but when we ran missions last night; those boys were on point.
There's a core group of bish pilots that seem to ALWAYS be there when we need 'em.. TAS is one of 'em. Special thanks to JCY19 and the Airwolves as well as our most recent guest squad; the Buccaneers... these guys fight like tigers and are always willing to put some weight into the 1st/AG "Bishlanders" Mission efforts... after all; regardless of what squad a Bish flies for, he IS a "Bishlander".
Thanks gents. Win or lose, at least we never die alone or without a cause.
<S!>
Hang
1st/AG "Bishlanders"
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I have approx. 30 pre-made missions (Yes, Ram, even a LW A/C only mission) that are available for everyone in Knightland, just call out the target, the A/C type, and I can post it with your name (Then you have edit permisions, not me) within 1 min. of your request.
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Originally posted by Ripsnort:
I have approx. 30 pre-made missions (Yes, Ram, even a LW A/C only mission) that are available for everyone in Knightland, just call out the target, the A/C type, and I can post it with your name (Then you have edit permisions, not me) within 1 min. of your request.
Rip ,that there are few LW missions doesnt mean I don't take part in them. I love to fly missions even if they mean to fly sissyfires (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
I was just making a comment about the all-US missions in bishland.With a big grin in my face, nothing else (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Check this post out:
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/Forum2/HTML/000591.html (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/Forum2/HTML/000591.html)