Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Ripsnort on October 12, 2001, 01:40:00 PM
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http://www.nypost.com/postopinion/opedcolumnists/33790.htm (http://www.nypost.com/postopinion/opedcolumnists/33790.htm)
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Rip
That was a good read, I have also read pretty much the same thing on the BBC. Thanks for the link.
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Anthrax (Siberian Sore, "Sibirskaya yazva") is dangerous mostly because the incubation period (extremely short, 2-4 days) is over - it's uncurable.
Epidemy of Siberian Sore was caused by fur-coats made of the infected animals during WWII.
What happened in Florida is IMO a fake, caused my a sensation-hungry media.
"Siberian sore cattle tombs" are a great threat in Russia even now. For example: if you want to open summer rereation mp for shoolchildren you have to inquire the locaal sanitary-epidemiological station for certain conditions, including siberian sore cattle tombs.
Stop worrying. If you know you are infected by a Siberian sore - you are already dead. After first symptoms appear - the victim is dead in a few hours. Anyone on the TV saying he was cured from Siberian sore is lying, like that Chechens who said they were under the "bomb/storming strike" performed by Su-25 shturmoviks.
Sorry for probable incompetence, it's what all Soviet civil defence manuals said. At least your "anthrax" my be something different from our "siberian sore", but Russian media translates it this way.
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Pretty hard to fake a death in Florida, Boroda, but I will agree with the press sensationalism.
And, I might add, my wifes whos been trained to identify Anthrax says "Anyone exposed to it, after 48 hours, has a small chance of living, and Anthrax has a incubation of 5 days to death if inhaled, 3 days if ingested"...thus the reason the guy in Florida died, once he got to the hospital, all the anti-toxins in the world ain't gonna turn it around.
Unfortunately, if the Terrorists do get a substantial supply of this stuff, its more than likely to come from your country rather than ours.
[ 10-12-2001: Message edited by: Ripsnort ]
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heh now they infected some lady at nbc nightly news - anyone still think it's coincidence?
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Originally posted by mrfish:
heh now they infected some lady at nbc nightly news - anyone still think it's coincidence?
Not just "Some lady." She was an assistant to Tom Brokaw, one of the United State's leading News Anchors.
Not to mention 2 cases of "Powder" content in envelopes in Michigan. One of them right here in my home town of Flint.
A clip from the NYPOST link at the top of this thread:
The technical hurdles and costs associated with exposing many people to enough anthrax is daunting. Before the spores can become a mass inhalation threat, they must be converted to powdered form.
Ok, powder has been found in envelopes at every sight.
Next?
BTW, do all crop dusters use liquid?
Is Anthrax the only agent we need to worry about?
Educate yourself indeed!
The current ideal in the press is to dispose of the threat of crop dusting agents, yet, if the very story linked here, in speaking of wind dispersion is missing the fact that "Crop dusters" are very careful to opperate in conditions that DO NOT disperse their sprays.
Go to Google and do a search on Crop Dusting...read a bit.
Then think about the other chemical/biological agents that are available.
Also, think about the Dry Chemicals used to fight forest fires from Aircraft.
No, we should not freak out, but there are too many possible ways of spreading bio/chem agents to say we should relax.
Viper
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Another envelope in Nevada tested postive:
http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/nm/20011012/ts/attack_anthrax_nevada_dc_1.html (http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/nm/20011012/ts/attack_anthrax_nevada_dc_1.html)
I'm sure it's all just a big coincidence. ;)
[ 10-12-2001: Message edited by: funkedup ]
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The one in NY.. when it was discovered, the powder was tested; results 'negative'. That was Sept 25th.
THEN she comes down with the disease, a week later.
The sample at the State Dept.. recieved, discovered and tested yesterday tested "negative".
Unhhh hunh. Riiiiiight.
No mention on the national news of the cases in nevada or michigan.
Unnnnhh hunh.
I revert to my earlier statement.
"oh; toejam."
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Hmm....powder
http://www.brianag.com/ (http://www.brianag.com/)
Check out the last paragraph on this page.
http://www.crop-dusting.com/Pages/SS2000environmental.html (http://www.crop-dusting.com/Pages/SS2000environmental.html)
They spray a fungus. (Fungus propogate through the release of spores.)
We talked about "Propoganda" via media sources in another thread in this forum.
Maybe they just don't know what correct information is?
Viper
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and the kicker is that if this were the plot to a novel i would think it was pretty cheesy.
"oh yeah....some planes crash into the world trade center and you tell me the whole complex will fall down and then tom brokaw gets attacked with anthrax? snicker snicker ok sure that's plausible."
hard to believe this is real.
[ 10-12-2001: Message edited by: mrfish ]
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Wll i say one thing if this was terrorist then we are doing a good job of misinforming them if they think killing the Tabloids will hurt us i mean not that i want them dead but some of us including me wouldnt mind if someone did something(NOT KILL) about those tabloids.
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I still say the media should be president.... they're better at politics. hell they invented it i thought..
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Boroda, Anthax = "Chuma"
Not quite the same thing
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Well! If we are going to tell ghost storys I'll join in.
It is possible to weaponize pulmonary anthrax. Mix it with an ordinary virus. Sneezing, and coughing will distribute the germs. The virus germs germinating in the lungs create lesions. The antrax inters these, then begians germinating itself. If you don't start a regiem of antibiotics BEFORE the symtoms appear. You are dead. Every time.
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Anton, here they say it's "Sibirskaya yazva". "Chuma" is "Plague", isn't it?
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they give diseases latin names for a reason:
anthracis or Bacillus anthracisto describe the spores so you never have to worry about whether its chum or svzdy..err whatever you said. :)
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The Latin should be the same, eh?
http://www.bact.wisc.edu/microtextbook/disease/anthrax.html (http://www.bact.wisc.edu/microtextbook/disease/anthrax.html)
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the article talks about anthrax by it's latin name as well, what am i supposed to see?
- the point is that anthrax may be called 'jumbojumbo' or something in namibia or 'heapum bad disease' by the native americans... that's why they give things latin names.
if two russians <hint hint> are arguing over what disease the americans are talking about - maybe someone <hint hint> would want to refer them to the latin name of the disease for clarity?
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Boroda, you're right. I was obviously quite confused :)
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Boroda; If the press/media in your country could concoct a story such as what you believe to be fake in Florida and get away with it then you should understand there is a vast difference in the way news is reported in our respective countries.
Certainly the various news reporting organizations in the US depend on public attention to stay in business. However, these organizations are not controlled by the US government and nothing would be bigger news than that a rival organization concocted a story of this magnitude.
So, your attitude is a bit revealing about the freedom of the press in your country. See my point?
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AKIron - a few years ago a "free press" over here concocted a story about CJD (which is a human form of mad cow desease) epidemic and that we all were going to die out like dinausors and all that malarky.
The whole thing was based on "many % increase in recorded cases" etc and all looked very real and scary. With percentages quoted in all papers the humanity's fate looked very grim indeed.
Problem was not that they "faked" the numbers. Oh no - they simply didn't report the whole thing or explained things properly. It would kill the whole issue outright.
That "epidemic" was based on 19 (nineteen, one nine) recorded cases in a year in a country with 60 million people. All "large percentage increases in recorded cases" were a few more cases recorded (some people believe just because more attention was drawn to a very otherwise obscure desease). Percentages are funny things - 2 out of 19 is a "10% rise" etc. You still have more chances to die being struck by lighting than ever to contract CJD.
So called "free" press is there for one purpose only - to make money by selling newspapers. It's not there for reporting "the truth".
Look at the current stuff: so many civilians died in some village in Afganistan from US bombs... Tsk-tsk... I don't think "taliban fighters" wear dog tags, there's no uniforms... Hmmm... Civilians my arse... But it sounds so tragic when you can write stuff like "stench of death in the air" and the like. It looks good in the headlines. It sells newspapers.
[ 10-16-2001: Message edited by: -lynx- ]
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AKIron, why did you make such a conclusion about my attitude to "free press"?
Looks like my personal information in the "From:" field makes everyone dig their memories for the stereotypes about bearded Russians wearing fur hats with red stars.
Generally I agree with what Lynx said. "Free press" means the press that isn't controlled by govermnent in Newspeak. But there is no press that is free from ideological or economical influence by certain groups of people and/or organisations that have their own interests. I'll not be surprised if one of such groups is interested in panic and fear of anthrax. Just to illustrate my point of view: it CAN be a group that is interested in large imports of anthrax-related medicines from Russia, that has probably the best experience in dealing with this desease (another opinion also made completely by media).
Sometimes I think that Soviet way of controlling media was sometimes extremely effective to avoid panic and organize people. You see - every system has it's pros and cons. ;)
Lynx, there will ALWAYS be a hysteria about civilian casualities. Even if "allies" will completely avoid them - Talibs will do their best to show that there were innocent victims.
As for CJD - I thought it is a nonsence and another media scandal, especially because in USSR all cows were vaccinated against this desease. But later I talked to a doctor who described the symtoms: inability to make any decisions, loss of will, general laziness and stupidity. I simply looked around and suddenly it shook me that more then 50% of people I meet are already infected :)
Some more thoughts about media: I am happy that in English it is called Anthrax, not Siberian sore. If it was - many people will immediatley think that it is an attack prepared by Evil Russians from Siberia ;)
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Originally posted by -lynx-:
So called "free" press is there for one purpose only - to make money by selling newspapers. It's not there for reporting "the truth".
[ 10-16-2001: Message edited by: -lynx- ][/QB]
-lynx- I fully agree with your comment above. My point wasn't that the US media always presents the truth but that the competing news organizations would never let a lie of that sort go unexposed.
A society based on a competitive free market has many advantages over the socialistic. This is one of them.
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Is it?
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Originally posted by Boroda:
Is it?
Can I assume by your question that you are asking whether a nongovernmental free press is better than a governmentally controlled press? If this is your question then I answer that it depends on whether or not you want to do your own thinking or trust someone else to do it for you.
If that isn’t what you were asking then please elaborate.
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Last night, while watching TV, there was a loud bang at the front of the house. Mrs. easymo pointed out that it might be a giant anthrax spoor trying to brake in. After a chuckle, I thought of you guys. :)