Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Eagler on October 15, 2001, 11:21:00 AM
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First it was the airlines, then the stock market, now the postal service.
These anthrax attacks aren't against the individuals the letters are being mailed to, they are against our means of communicating/shipping here. First the USPS then FedEx & UPS, what then??? What happens too the us, the country/economy when the paraniod shut down these services??
It seems impossible to prevent so what do you do, how do you fight against this latest cowardly attack on our freedom? Seems to me it'd take one mass mailing in a major city of some junk mail that looks like a check/rebate filled with the toejame to throw us into a real panic...
Freakin crazy stunninghunks ...
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Maybe this will be the end of junk mail... from all things a little good must come...
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"Seems to me it'd take one mass mailing in a major city of some junk mail"
I'll be on the look-out for any Republican oriented mail in the future. :D
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Originally posted by weazel:
"Seems to me it'd take one mass mailing in a major city of some junk mail"
I'll be on the look-out for any Republican oriented mail in the future. :D
Yep, wondering about this: http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/nm/20011015/ts/attack_anthrax_daschle_dc_1.html (http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/nm/20011015/ts/attack_anthrax_daschle_dc_1.html)
1st NBC now Daschle, a few more Dems get tainted mail before any Republicans do, it will make some wonder. Shut down the mail while destroying national unity....
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I'm not worried about the USPS. Postal workers have shown again and again that they have all the necessary weapons skills to handle these terrorists.
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Oldest trick in the military book (Think its in Zens book), create distrust in the rear quarters of the enemies relations with one another, or something along that line. Funny that some folks still fall for it (Hiya Weazel/Goober) :D
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"a few more Dems get tainted mail before any Republicans do"
Nobody ever said the terrorists were fools, they recognize who is important in the US government. :D <it sure isn't the republicans>
Goober? Your looking at the wrong guy, I think AGWs *Goober* is probably <edited>.
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Hey there weazel nice jokes about this terror attack on our country. I hope laughing at it helps you sleep better at night. I'm sure the ones who are infected and will be infected are just falling over laughing so hard...
U
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I take the attacks seriously Udie, I just enjoy poking fun at the right wing.
They claim their philosophy has *all* the answers to our countrys ills, yet can't respond with a reasonable answer to simple questions asked.
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Anybody see South Park last night?
Laffed my bellybutton off; even if it was a repeat.
"Who do you think made the only bet against me??"
Hehhehehheee
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Originally posted by weazel:
I take the attacks seriously Udie, I just enjoy poking fun at the right wing.
They claim their philosophy has *all* the answers to our countrys ills, yet can't respond with a reasonable answer to simple questions asked.
what ever....
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my wife is a paranoid loon. she was flipping out because we got a letter from
anne thracks
666 death to infidels cir.
pueblo, co 10000
when will the paranoia end sheesh - i'm sure it's just some helpful information on getting gov't loans right!?.....achoo.
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before all you chicken littles run around saying the sky is falling, remember only one person has died from anthrax, as a "weapon of mass destruction" anthrax is a big bust
when your worried or in doubt,
run in circles, scream and shout
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what I'm saying is that if it continues, they WILL shut down the mail system, then Fed-Ex & UPS when the terrorist start sending the crap in packages. No one else has to die to have this happen. Another death will just expedite the process ...
How many orgs/offices have already shut down their mailrooms?? Between real attacks and sick mofo copycats, this could be a huge problem. Glad to see some of you can laugh it off ...
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Originally posted by Eagler:
what I'm saying is that if it continues, they WILL shut down the mail system, then Fed-Ex & UPS when the terrorist start sending the crap in packages. No one else has to die to have this happen. Another death will just expedite the process ...
How many orgs/offices have already shut down their mailrooms?? Between real attacks and sick mofo copycats, this could be a huge problem. Glad to see some of you can laugh it off ...
So what's YOUR answer to the current problems we face as a nation?
I'm not laughing at the problem....only you.
:rolleyes:
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Originally posted by weazel:
So what's YOUR answer to the current problems we face as a nation?
Guess I worry bout it as my wife is admin at a corporation, one duty is handling the mail. I think the problem is worse than will be reported while those reported are played down to minimize/delay panic.
Wish I had an answer. If/when a connection to the terrorist country responsible, our response should be to flatten said country/government. I think the military is hoping for an Iraq or Iran connection to justify complete and final military action against those "evil doers". If a connection isn't found outright, I think one should be "found"...
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Guess I worry bout it as my wife is admin at a corporation, one duty is handling the mail.
I can sympathize with your concern, I hope nothing happens to her or any other US citizen in this regard.
I think the problem is worse than will be reported while those reported are played down to minimize/delay panic.
I agree, I'm sure theres a lot of info on the perpetrators that we're not privvy to.
Wish I had an answer. If/when a connection to the terrorist country responsible, our response should be to flatten said country/government. I think the military is hoping for an Iraq or Iran connection to justify complete and final military action against those "evil doers".
Again I agree.
If a connection isn't found outright, I think one should be "found"
Are you advocating an attack on any country we might *suspect* without hard evidence of their guilt?
Sorry, I have to disagree. If we fall into that pattern then we are guilty of the same mindset the terrorists have and play right into OBL hands.
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It was one guy in a nation of what? 250 thousand. I am sure far more than that died in auto accidents the same day. Has anyone quit driving? This chicken little routine is getting old fast.
For those of you who need to grow a pair. There are helpful and eager drill instructors in both the Army, and The Marines waiting to assist you.
[ 10-15-2001: Message edited by: easymo ]
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Originally posted by easymo:
It was one guy in a nation of what? 250 thousand. I am sure far more than that died in auto accidents the same day. Has anyone quit driving? This chicken little routine is getting old fast.
For those of you who need to grow a pair. There are helpful and eager drill instructors in both the Army, and The Marines waiting to assist you.
[ 10-15-2001: Message edited by: easymo ]
What are you talking about easymo?
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Easy is talking about the Anthrax cases.
There's been 1 death, 3 people infected and perhaps (and I do mean perhaps- highly doubtful) a few more people infected today who work for Senator Tom Daschle (Wash, DC)...
The other people have been reported as treated and fine.
He's trying to get across: Anthrax ain't scary. It isn't contagious either.
Smallpox- that's something to get worried about... Anthrax is just a poor man's bio-warfare weapon, especially the way it's being delivered right now.
-SW
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No wait. Its one guy in 250 MILLION people. How astonishingly UNimportant can a news piece be.
When I was in that old war, there was an outbreak of the black plague. I don't know how many guys we lost. But there were a few.
The Army gave us shots. Showed us some very gross training films. We had an order for vector control.(kinda fun. we got to shoot all the rats we saw). Then we forgot about it. No big deal.
[ 10-15-2001: Message edited by: easymo ]
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Bock! bock! Grow some nuts you sissies, the USPS ain't shutitng down, and if you think you are exposed, take some AB from your medicience chest. Jeez, Anthrax went out as a viable weapon in the fifties.
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l
[ 10-15-2001: Message edited by: Shire_PLH ]
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As far as terrorist attacks go, we've had uneducated toothless backwoods wonders do much better than a few scattered spores.
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yeah - i work for the dept of the interior and though i doubt we're much of a target - all gov't bldgs are a little finicky at present.
everything (in typical govt fashion even in the age of computers)must done in triplicate, tons of mail passes thru everyone's hands everyday. poor mail clerks - they werent making enough as it was!!!!!!!
edit- and oh yeah eagler, tell that girl to get some damned gloves on. don't even take chances. :)
[ 10-16-2001: Message edited by: mrfish ]
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So far, the Anthrax "attacks" have been minor disruptions into everyday American life. (Keeping the Senate from working? Hey, maybe they're on OUR side! ;) )
<EDIT> This just in...
"Anthrax may be weapons-grade
10/17/2001
By Laura Parker, Kevin Johnson and Traci Watson, USA TODAY
WASHINGTON (AP) — The anthrax mailed to Senate Majority Leader Tom Daschle's office was "very potent," Daschle said Tuesday, and bioterrorism experts think that it was prepared by sophisticated scientists who could have worked on weapons programs. Initial tests show that the letter contained a high concentration of fine-grained anthrax spores — the kind that increase the chances of it being inhaled. Inhalation can cause the most deadly type of anthrax."<END EDIT>
However, to say that anthrax isn't deadly or that it isn't a threat is incorrect, I think.
Right now, it's not a threat, simply for two reasons:
1) "they" haven't used enough of it
2) "they" either don't know how to deliver it correctly or haven't decided to do so as yet.
http://www.fas.org/nuke/intro/bw/agent.htm#b02 (http://www.fas.org/nuke/intro/bw/agent.htm#b02)
"A lethal dose of anthrax is considered to be 10,000 spores; 80 percent of a population that inhaled such a dose would die. Less than one millionth of a gram is invariably fatal within five days to a week after exposure. According to an estimate by the US Congress's Office of Technology Assessment, 100 kilograms of anthrax, released from a low-flying aircraft over a large city on a clear, calm night, could kill one to three million people."
Where would they get 200 kilos?
http://www.fas.org/irp/gulf/intel/961031/0408pgf_90.txt (http://www.fas.org/irp/gulf/intel/961031/0408pgf_90.txt)
22 October 1990
IRAQ BIOLOGICAL WARFARE THREAT
"Iraq's biological and toxin weapons program is the most extensive in the Middle East. Large quantities of anthrax bacteria and
botulinum toxin have likely been produced. We believe that these agents have been weaponized and that biological and toxin
munitions already exist. We further believe that deployment of BW munitions in significant numbers will take place by the end of this year, if not already implemented.
...Agents believed to be in inventory and weaponized by Iraq include Bacillus anthracis, or Anthrax, and botulinum toxin. In 1988 [ (b)(1) sec 1.3(a)(4) ] reported that the Iraqis had already,
or were developing anthrax as a BW agent.
...Average concentrations of weaponized anthrax developed for the U.S. offensive BW program. which was disestablished in 1969, were sixty trillion anthrax spores or 8 billion human lethal doses per gallon.
The incubation period of anthrax introduced through the aerosol route is approximately one to three days. Treatment is ineffective
following the appearance of the first symptoms and 95 percent of those that have not been vaccinated or treated with antibiotics prior to presentation of symptoms will die."
[ 10-17-2001: Message edited by: Toad ]
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There is Anthrax..and there is Anthrax.
xBAT
P.S. Dont freak pep's and remind other pep's that if they're gonna try and use a BIO wep like this...Anthrax is one we can deal with very well. Its 50's 60's technology... the STUFF the USSR and USA developed latter though...hehe, kiss your bellybutton good bye.
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so were all of these mailed out at the same time and we are just now discovering the contaminated areas now? How can you shrug it off not even knowing the level of which this attack occured? It could have been only a handful of letters to test the waters.
Like I've said, it doesn't have to be deadly to be effective. All it has to do is terrorize, tying up our emergency response resources, disrupt things from the mail flow to the stock market.
Call me chicken little but this I fear is just the beginning of this branch of terrorization. It all adds up, they don't need a knock out blow, just body shots to keep us off balance & winded...
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"fear is the mind killer"
"we have nothing to fear but fear itself"
"Daddy...I went potty"
xBAT
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That's just it Eagler, even as a body blow this is extremely weak unless we either...
1) freak out in mass panic based on 1 unfortunate death.
2) freak out and start taking citro when not needed, resulting in immunity to it should we ever actually need it.
As far as real damage, flu season will hit us much harder than this round of amatuer anthrax.
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So far the two targets of Anthrax have been a Senator (Government) and Media related (NBC/American Media).
If you or people you know do not work in one of the two fields above- it's nothing to be worried about.
Really, the fact that there have been extremely isolated cases and only one death- I wouldn't get alarmed.
Now, if a city gets sprayed by a low flying crop duster- there goes a million or so peeps.
Has it even been proven that these cases were done by terrorists?
-SW
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So, why do you think Atta and the gang were checking out cropduster aircraft?
Just idle curiosity or what?
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Yawn.
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Yes, well we still don't have any concrete proof that THESE Anthrax cases are related to them.
For all you or I know, they could of been checking out crop duster aircraft for smallpox or another even worse disease.
Of course, these Anthrax cases could just be to test their batch and make sure it's still "alive".
Saving the rest of it for spraying or something.
-SW
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chicken little here :)
Anthrax Infects NJ Postal Worker
By John P. McAlpin
Associated Press Writer
Thursday, Oct. 18, 2001; 12:45 p.m. EDT
TRENTON, N.J. –– A postal worker who may have handled letters sent to NBC and the U.S. Senate has tested positive for exposure to anthrax, The Associated Press has learned.
The employee is a mail handler who was on duty at the time the letters were sent through the main Trenton postal center in Hamilton Township, state officials told The Associated Press, speaking on condition of anonymity.
Acting Gov. Donald DiFrancesco and federal officials planned an afternoon news conference to announce details, the sources said.
A second New Jersey postal employee, a maintenance worker, was also being tested for exposure, postal officials have said.
Operations at the post office were shut down Thursday. The facility collects mail from 46 postal offices in central New Jersey.
Letters postmarked from Trenton and sent to Senate Majority Leader Tom Daschle and NBC anchor Tom Brokaw tested positive for anthrax.
An aide to Brokaw, along with a police officer and two lab technicians, were exposed to anthrax. More than 30 workers in Daschle's Senate office were exposed. All are being treated with Cipro.
Postal officials have been examining video surveillance tapes to try to determine the source of the letters. They are also examining the envelopes for clues; both envelopes were pre-stamped.
Officials are also examining the black-and-white striped computer lines that route the mail. The bar codes give a date and approximate time the letters were processed, Postal Inspector Tony Esposito has said. Other information from the bar codes eliminated many of the post offices from the search, he said.
Meanwhile, federal officials questioned at least two New Jersey pharmacists about anyone buying large amounts of the antibiotic Cipro prior to Sept. 18, when the first of the two tainted envelopes was mailed.
Pharmacist John Berkenkopf, who owns Episcopo's Pharmacy in Trenton, said officials with the Food and Drug Administration questioned him Wednesday about anyone who 60 to 120 tablets of the antibiotic.
Cipro is usually prescribed for 7-14 days, which is about 10 or 20 pills, Berenkopf said.
"Any more than that would ring all kinds of bells," Berkenkopf said.
Special Agent Sandra Carroll, a spokeswoman for the FBI's Newark office, would not say whether any pharmacies had reported making large sales of the drug.
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like I've said it doen't have to be deadly to be effective...
on a more humorous note, does anyone else think of this guy everytime anthrax is mentioned:
(http://www.aflac.com/images/duck-on.jpg)
"AFLAC" (http://www.aflac.com/)
[ 10-18-2001: Message edited by: Eagler ]
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I wonder if we (the government) actually stopped the "real" bio attack? They grounded all the planes minutes after the 2nd crash, perhaps they stopped alot more from happening that day? Perhaps we actually won the war that day by stopping them from committing all the attacks they had planned ro 9/11.
Maybe on the 12th OBL was in his cave saying "Crap, we're screwed now! The plan didn't work!"
And now he's waiting to die.....
U
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chicken little here
Two U.S. Postal Workers Die, Anthrax Likely Cause (http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/nm/20011022/ts/attack_anthrax_dc_98.html)
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Originally posted by Hangtime:
Anybody see South Park last night?
Laffed my bellybutton off; even if it was a repeat.
"Who do you think made the only bet against me??"
Hehhehehheee
I saw it! :D
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Ignoring it won't make it go away...how amny PO's are now closed?
NJ postal worker now sick and this:
Tuesday, October 23, 2001
WASHINGTON -- The House Minority Leader said Tuesday it was time to stop parsing words about the type of anthrax found on Capitol Hill and in nearby postal facilities, calling it "weapons grade material” and a sophisticated product.
Rep. Dick Gephardt, D-Mo., emerged from a morning meeting with President Bush to tell reporters: "This is weapons grade material. This is serious material and we’ve got to err on the side of caution.”
Gephardt said he believes the investigation of anthrax found on Capitol Hill and at the nearby Brentwood postal facility keys on a mail sorting machine that puts pressure on letters as it processes them for delivery. He said such pressure could allow anthrax bacteria spores to escape through the minute holes in the envelope paper.
"The machine, I think was the critical factor,” he said. "I’ve been saying for some time we’ve been dealing with a sophisticated product. I think we’ve got to stop parsing words and being anything other than accurate about what it is.”
this I fear will be a larger factor in our military action over the coming months than the hijacked airliners..
you Anthrax experts, how easy is it for a domestic nutcase to produce this grade in his kitchen?
this type of terror is even more chicken toejam than any terrorism we have been subjected to so far due to it's nature and far reaching, long term affects on the productivity of this nation.
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Nor will freaking out over it. The two post offices where the original anthrax went thru had spores there. It's unfortunate, especially for the deaths and the two in critical condition, but the nation is not going to grind to a halt, neither is the postal service.
Even if you live in the immediate areas your chief health concerns should still be avoiding automobiles and then somewhere way, way down the line anthrax.