Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: StarOfAfrica2 on March 27, 2006, 05:13:33 PM
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Sorry for the wall-o-text. I cant link the story and couldnt find it on the news services.
ALEXANDRIA, Va. (March 7) - Al-Qaida conspirator Zacarias Moussaoui testified Monday that he and would-be shoe bomber Richard Reid were supposed to hijack a fifth airplane on Sept. 11, 2001, and fly it into the White House.
Moussaoui's testimony on his own behalf stunned the courtroom. His account was in stark contrast to his previous statements in which he said the White House attack was to come later if the United States refused to release an Egyptian sheik imprisoned on separate terrorist convictions.
On Dec. 22, 2001, Reid was subdued by passengers when he attempted to detonate a bomb in his shoe aboard American Airlines Flight 63 from Paris to Miami. The plane was diverted to Boston, where it landed safely.
Moussaoui told the court he knew the World Trade Center attack was coming and he lied to investigators when arrested in August 2001 because he wanted it to happen.
"You lied because you wanted to conceal that you were a member of al-Qaida?" prosecutor Rob Spencer asked.
"That's correct," Moussaoui said.
Spencer: "You lied so the plan could go forward?"
Moussaoui: "That's correct."
The exchange could be key to the government's case that the attacks might have been averted if Moussaoui had been more cooperative following his arrest.
Moussaoui told the court he knew the attacks were to take place some time after August 2001 and bought a radio so he could hear them unfold.
Specifically, he said he knew the World Trade Center was going to be attacked, but he asserted he was not part of that plot and didn't know the details.
Nineteen men pulled off the Sept. 11 attacks on New York and Washington in the worst act of terrorism ever on U.S. soil.
"I had knowledge that the Twin Towers would be hit," Moussaoui said. "I didn't know the details of this."
Sally Regenhard, whose firefighter son Christian died at the World Trade Center, said "at least there would have been a chance" to head off the attacks if Moussaoui had told investigators in August 2001 what she heard him admit in court Monday.
"I was convinced that this man was only a heartbeat away from taking the controls of a plane," she said.
Asked by his lawyer why he signed his guilty plea in April as "the 20th hijacker," Moussaoui replied: "Because everybody used to refer to me as the 20th hijacker and it was a bit of fun."
Before Moussaoui took the stand, his lawyers made a last attempt to stop him from testifying. Defense attorney Gerald Zerkin argued that his client would not be a competent witness because he has contempt for the court, only recognizes Islamic law and therefore "the affirmation he undertakes would be meaningless."
Moussaoui at first denied he was to have been a fifth hijack pilot but under cross examination spoke of the plan to attack the White House. He said Reid was the only person he knew for sure would have been on that mission, but others were discussed.
Reid pleaded guilty in October 2002 to trying to blow up Flight 63 and was sentenced to life in prison.
Moussaoui testified that at one point he was excluded from pre-hijacking operations because he had gotten in trouble with his al-Qaida superiors on a 2000 trip to Malaysia. He said it was only after he was called back to Afghanistan and talked with Osama bin Laden that he was approved again for the operation.
"My position was, like you say, under review."
The 19 terrorists on Sept. 11 hijacked and crashed four airliners, killing nearly 3,000 people in the World Trade Center, the Pentagon and on the planes. The intended target of the plane that crashed into a Pennsylvania field remains unknown.
Moussaoui testified for nearly three hours, ending his time on the stand by declaring his gratitude that he was an al-Qaida member. When Spencer asked him if he was also grateful to have been the fifth pilot, the defendant merely said: "I'm grateful."
Moussaoui's lawyer asked him whether he thought anything in his testimony or court proceedings would affect his fate. He replied: "I believe in destiny. God gives life and death. I just have to speak the truth and God will take care of the rest."
Before Moussaoui took the stand, the court heard testimony that two months before the attacks a CIA deputy chief waited in vain for permission to tell the FBI about a "very high interest" al-Qaida operative who became one of the hijackers.
The official, a senior figure in the CIA's Laden unit, said he sought authorization on July 13, 2001, to send information to the FBI but got no response for 10 days, then asked again.
As it turned out, the information on Khalid al-Mihdhar did not reach the FBI until late August. At the time, CIA officers needed permission from a special unit before passing certain intelligence on to the FBI.
The official was identified only as John. His written testimony was read into the record.
"John's" testimony was part of the defense's case that federal authorities missed multiple opportunities to catch hijackers and perhaps thwart the 9/11 plot.
His testimony included an e-mail sent by FBI supervisor Michael Maltbie discussing Moussaoui but playing down his terrorist connections. Maltbie's e-mail said "there's no indication that (Moussaoui) had plans for any nefarious activity."
He sent that e-mail to the CIA even after receiving a lengthy memo from the FBI agent who arrested Moussaoui and suspected him of being a terrorist with plans to hijack aircraft.
Prosecutors argue that Moussaoui, a French citizen, thwarted a prime opportunity to track down the 9/11 hijackers and possibly unravel the plot when he was arrested and lied.
Had Moussaoui confessed, the FBI could have pursued leads that would have led them to most of the hijackers, government witnesses have testified.
To win the death penalty, prosecutors must first prove that Moussaoui's actions - specifically, his lies - were directly responsible for at least one death on Sept. 11.
If they fail, Moussaoui would get life in prison.
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Moussaoui didn't kill anyone the U.S. Gov. is just trying to find someone to blame insted of themselves
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Your point is?
How about this. A man walks into your yard with a gun. You call the police, they arrest him. He admits he was going to walk into your house and kill everyone he could get to.
He didnt kill anyone.
Do you want him punished anyway? Or should we just let him free so he can kill you, THEN we can arrest him?
The govt. ALWAYS wants to blame someone when they screw up. This time they just happened to arrest the right guy.
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they should only give him life or 40 years not death
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Someone is gonna say it....
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Ah I see. You are only disputing the sentencing question. Fair enough.
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how old is Moussaoui he looks to be in his 30's if they gave him 40 years he would be in his 70's or 80's when he got out so that would be a fair sentence
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Sometimes the spinmeisters confuse the issue by calling revolutionaries terrorists.
Sometimes they call insurgents terrorists, just because they're on the other side.
This isn't one of those cases.
This guy admits to being part of a plan to launch a sneak attack on civilian targets. If that's not a terrorist, nothing is.
Give him life in prison. Federal Supermax. He'll spend the next 40 years wishing he was dead.
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well he actually didn't kill any 1 and the U.S. Gov. knew about the terror attacks but they did nothing so in a way the U.S. Gov. are the real criminals
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Originally posted by RAIDER14
well he actually didn't kill any 1 and the U.S. Gov. knew about the terror attacks but they did nothing so in a way the U.S. Gov. are the real criminals
no but is actions led to the deaths of almost 3000 people (at least that's the govt's case against him)
If I'm hiding a mass murderer in my closet of my home and police come by and say "have you seen this man" and I say "no" and he goes out and guns down school kids at random aren't I complicit in his crimes?
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remember the guy that knew about the OKC bombing before it happend did he get put to death he never told any 1 about the attack either
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He and Reid were supposed to hijack a 5th plane and hit the White House? By themselves? I call BS, this guy is just trying to make this into a media circus. He's either succeeding, or he's just really freaking dim.
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Wow.
Some of you liberals don't quite understand the simplicity, economy, and power of a .45 to the head. Should have been done a while ago to this ****.
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Originally posted by Gunslinger
no but is actions led to the deaths of almost 3000 people (at least that's the govt's case against him)
If I'm hiding a mass murderer in my closet of my home and police come by and say "have you seen this man" and I say "no" and he goes out and guns down school kids at random aren't I complicit in his crimes?
but he is not the 1 that killed the people so why should he get the death penalty:huh
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Because it will be great pay per view.
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Beer and Popcorn sales rocket sky high Raider.
Mac
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Originally posted by Gunslinger
no but is actions led to the deaths of almost 3000 people (at least that's the govt's case against him)
If I'm hiding a mass murderer in my closet of my home and police come by and say "have you seen this man" and I say "no" and he goes out and guns down school kids at random aren't I complicit in his crimes?
did any think of the Goverments failures on 9-11?
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Raider I look at it like this... Your Mom had a choice during conception...she could have swallowed, spit or lie there like a fish.. so we're now stuck dealing with a Guppy like you.
:rofl
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A 30 to 40 year sentence means he will be out in 10 to 13 years. Time served is not "straight time". "Good time" meaning time serverd where you are not violating prisone rules or commiting any crimes is served at double to tripple the rate. In other words you get credit for 3 days for each "good day".
So Raider does that change your opinion?
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but putting him in prison would be good cuase he would die either way especially if they put him in a New York prison
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Originally posted by AWMac
Raider I look at it like this... Your Mom had a choice during conception...she could have swallowed, spit or lie there like a fish.. so we're now stuck dealing with a Guppy like you.
:rofl
see rule 4:aok
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Is that chowderhead?
Yep.
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Maverick:
A 30 to 40 year sentence means he will be out in 10 to 13 years. Time served is not "straight time". "Good time" meaning time serverd where you are not violating prisone rules or commiting any crimes is served at double to tripple the rate. In other words you get credit for 3 days for each "good day".
Bzzzt. Not any more. Federal time is WYSIWYG. If you're sentenced to 40 yrs, you're gonna do 40yrs.
Notice how this knucklehead is trying to take credit for being more than just a failed flunky? He wants to get the death penalty. He wants to be a martyr. He wants 79 virgins.
I say deprive him of that "glory".
Federal Supermax is no Club Fed. They're locked in a cell alone, for 23 hrs a day. One hour of "exercise", in a cage, handcuffed and shackled. Showers every 3 days, also handcuffed and shackled. If they take you out of the cell for any reason, you're handcuffed, shackled and escorted by from 2 to 5 guards. Food comes in through a slot. 20 minutes later your tray better be back in the slot for pickup, or 6 guards will come in, throw water on you, and pin you down with electric stun shields until you turn blue from not breathing.
If you're good, they might let you have a cctv that shows educational videos. Religious services are by cctv as well. Human contact is kept to a minimum. You may be lucky enough to be able to yell into vents to talk to other prisoners, but most of them are crazier than a sithouse rat, eventually.
40 years of that sounds just about right for old zach.
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well I read this on the net not sure if its true but they scrambled fighters and if the fighters would have gone supersonic they could have intercepted the planes before they hit the towers
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I say deprive him of that "glory".
I say they should do the following:
"Ok Mr. Moussaoui. I've just finished injecting the last sedative. You will be passed out in roughly 40 seconds. You will not feel the pain of the death you deserve. Oh, and did you notice how that first injection kind of burned?"
"Yes..."
Dramatic Pause.
"That's because it was Pig's Blood. Have fun in hell mother****er."
"OH SHI..." Out like a light.
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creating a martyr == teh BAD !
btw I think Moussaoui is completly nuts.
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If he actually did fly a 5th plane, which is what this is about, he would have died anyway. We get to help him with his wish, without him getting to kill any of us first.
Having my tax dollars keep this guy alive in a federal prison is kind of ridiculous, so in that respect i'm all for the death penalty.
Remember what happened to alot of nazi's after the war? They did not get a nice "sleeping death". This may be just a rumor, but i heard that they made the ropes that they were hung with shorter than normal, so that they would aggonizingly choke to death instead of the proper length to snap there necks.
This moussaoui clown should get the same, and regardless of the outcome, he already is a martyr.
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Originally posted by RAIDER14
remember the guy that knew about the OKC bombing before it happend did he get put to death he never told any 1 about the attack either
actually IIRC they did try and convict the co-conspirator. I'm not sur if they gave him the death penalty or if he's currently appealing it.
At least the dumb federal prosecutor that coached the witnesses isn't gonna screw this case up too badly. Not after this testimony.
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I'll admit that I haven't been following the trial all that closely, but I'm confused why all of a sudden he is admitting to everything the prosecution is accusing him of.
Am I missing something here? Either he's nuttier than a 3 dollar bill stuffed into a fruitcake or he is TRYING to get the death penalty to turn himself into a martyr.
Just seems kind of strange to me.
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Originally posted by RAIDER14
well I read this on the net not sure if its true but they scrambled fighters and if the fighters would have gone supersonic they could have intercepted the planes before they hit the towers
Yup every thing you read on the net is true.
Bronk
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Originally posted by RAIDER14
did any think of the Goverments failures on 9-11?
Plenty of failures up to 9-11.
Lets see now fail to retaliate after the first WTC bombing.
Embassy bombing fail to retaliate there.
Khobar towers fail to retaliate there.
USS Cole attack fail to retaliate there also.
Yup raider you are correct lots of government failures . If the Government would have acted on any of these attacks, might have prevented the towers being downed.
Bronk
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Originally posted by Bronk
Yup every thing you read on the net is true.
Bronk
I never said it was true not sure if its true
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Plenty of failures up to 9-11.
Lets see now fail to retaliate after the first WTC bombing.
Embassy bombing fail to retaliate there.
Khobar towers fail to retaliate there.
USS Cole attack fail to retaliate there also.
And the common denominator here is?
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Originally posted by lasersailor184
And the common denominator here is?
A fat pant load ?
Bronk
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Originally posted by RAIDER14
but putting him in prison would be good cuase he would die either way especially if they put him in a New York prison
So basically you are saying you don't have the stones to kill him, but
you don't mind if someone else takes care of it for you? :rolleyes:
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http://www.news24.com/News24/World/News/0,,2-10-1462_1907360,00.html
Alexandria - In another twist to an already convoluted case, the jury deciding whether al-Qaeda conspirator Zacarias Moussaoui will be executed learned that he offered last month to testify for prosecutors against himself at his death penalty sentencing trial.
He also told agents he did not want to die in prison, the jury was told on Tuesday.
...
FBI agent James Fitzgerald testified that Moussaoui told him - in a meeting requested by the defendant - that he did not want to die behind bars and it was "different to die in a battle ... than in a jail on a toilet."
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Originally posted by Rino
So basically you are saying you don't have the stones to kill him, but
you don't mind if someone else takes care of it for you? :rolleyes:
no he shouldn't even be killed maybe 40 years- life in prison but not death he didn't kill any 1
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Conspiracy to commit a capital crime.
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Originally posted by Schwein
Conspiracy to commit a capital crime.
Keyword:Conspiracy
he should just get life in prison
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I don't have too much of a problem with life, no parole other than the cost. At that point it is pretty obvious that society has absolutely no use and no expectation for any real "reformation" for the convict. In all seriousness it's time to put them down in that case.
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Originally posted by RAIDER14
Keyword:Conspiracy
he should just get life in prison
Conspiracy is the crime of plotting to commit a criminal offense. Conspiracy occurs when two or more people agree to commit a crime and proceed to plan its commission. The crime of conspiracy is often considered as severe as actually committing the crime itself. For example, the seriousness of conspiracy to commit murder carries equal weight as the act of murder itself.
Each state has laws which criminalize conspiracy crimes relating to any offense which is criminal in nature. Conspiracy is a very controversial offense because a person doesn’t have to actually commit the crime to be guilty of conspiracy.