Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Chalenge on May 22, 2006, 12:28:22 AM
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Shouldnt shutting down and restarting your engine cause damage to your engine or something? Im seeing this alot now that Im looking for it.
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I thought someone would agree but maybe there is something I dont know. I came over from Falcon4 Allied Force where it can take a FNG up to 15 minutes just to start a plane. I dont fly and Ive never been in a WWII fighter but would think pressing e simplifies things a bit too much. Plus there has to be some other efect when shutting down your engine at super speed and restarting it doesnt there; fouled plugs or a damaged prop drive maybe?
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Shutting down and restarting a plane engine has no adverse effect in AH. It's often done when ground vehicles (GV's) are spawning into an enemy base...helps one detect the sound of the incoming GV engine. Some folks use it to reduce speed, forcing an overshoot.
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Piston engines are not like Jet engines which need to be started carefully in regards to blowing the compressor.
The biggest problem you will have with a radial is hydraulic lock. That is when oil seeps into the lower cylinders after sitting a while. As for inline or opposing cylinders this is not a problem to my knowledge.
As for AH the only engine management you have is RPM, MAP and WEP.
Would other engine management be fun? Maybe, does it enhance the fighting maybe. My biggest problem with it, would be the interface. Engine management on today’s joysticks would suck, not to mention an even bigger learning curve for most noobs.
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My engine shutdowns in the game are usualy accomanied by a strange black trail of smoke flowing behind the plane I have noticed. It happens pretty regular.
I`ve also noticed that right before shutdown, one of the little gaugie thingies has a fastly falling needle.
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Originally posted by mars01
As for inline or opposing cylinders this is not a problem to my knowledge.
Oil is tough to compress; you can easily bend a rod trying to do so.
The inline, inverted Ranger has to be pulled through too; oil collects in the rear cylinder(s).
The start/stop trick in AH is gamey. Not because it "couldn't be done", though. It could. WW2 engines are pretty robust and forgiving of abuse.
The engine will turn as long as there is airspeed to turn the prop (feathering not included). RPM won't change much if the engine is off for short periods and "shock cooling" isn't a factor in the short term.
The gamey part is that 99% of WW2 vet pilots would look at you as if you were demented if you suggested this as a valid air combat tactic.
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Originally posted by Jackal1
My engine shutdowns in the game are usualy accomanied by a strange black trail of smoke flowing behind the plane I have noticed. It happens pretty regular.
I`ve also noticed that right before shutdown, one of the little gaugie thingies has a fastly falling needle.
I suffer this same problem constantly. No amount of effort lets me restart them in this state. I wonder why that is? :)
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Originally posted by Max
It's often done when ground vehicles (GV's) are spawning into an enemy base...helps one detect the sound of the incoming GV engine.
Yea, I remember Henry Fonda doing that once. ;)
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My engine shut down sometimes is accompanied by
A: Red splatters on the canopy
or
B: The view of the airfield from the tower
I feel I did pretty good if I get away with a trail of black smoke.:lol
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Originally posted by Chalenge
Shouldnt shutting down and restarting your engine cause damage to your engine or something? Im seeing this alot now that Im looking for it.
Keep in mind that the key that starts/kills the engine is right next to the keys for flaps, mic, and landing gear. Immediately destroying the engine of anyone who missed a keystroke in a dark room would make for some really irritating gameplay.
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guys who kill their engine while in a fight r gay.
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Originally posted by Morpheus
guys who kill their engine while in a fight r gay.
Well then give me the rainbow flag award b/c that's how I roll!
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Originally posted by Morpheus
guys who kill their engine while in a fight r gay.
So you're saying you kill your engine in fights? :aok
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Originally posted by SuperDud
Well then give me the rainbow flag award b/c that's how I roll!
You roll both ways. Or so I've heard.
-- Todd/Leviathn
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LOL Murdr! The Bulge!
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See Rule #4
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See Rule #4
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See Rule #15
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I would think cowl flaps, radiators, and prop pitch (and the ability to manage them) would add to the game. To save some noobs there could be an auto-setting like trim currently has.
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Originally posted by Edbert1
I would think cowl flaps, radiators, and prop pitch (and the ability to manage them) would add to the game. To save some noobs there could be an auto-setting like trim currently has.
Currently, we do have control of prop pitch. Some of the late war fighters had automatic systems controlling radiator and cooler doors.
There are reasonable arguments for adding more realism in aircraft operation. However, the downside to added complexity is that many people do not have adequate SA now, and adding more workload will only exacerbate that. One of the never-ending goals of fighter design is reducing pilot workload. I think HTC has found a pretty good balance between realistic flight modeling and playability.
My regards,
Widewing
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See Rule #5
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Originally posted by Widewing
Currently, we do have control of prop pitch.
Am I missing something here? We can control propellor RPM, the "main throttle" just controls manifold pressure, then of course there's the various power-adders thrown in as WEP. So how do we control pitch?
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Originally posted by Edbert1
Am I missing something here? We can control propellor RPM, the "main throttle" just controls manifold pressure, then of course there's the various power-adders thrown in as WEP. So how do we control pitch?
Your propeller pitch control is what varies the RPM. Finer pitch, higher RPM, coarser pitch, lower RPM.
- oldman
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Originally posted by Oldman731
Your propeller pitch control is what varies the RPM. Finer pitch, higher RPM, coarser pitch, lower RPM.
But in RL the two (pitch and RPM) were separate controls, at least one some of the aircraft we have...right?
(not trolling, I really want to know if I got this wrong here)
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Originally posted by Chalenge
Shouldnt shutting down and restarting your engine cause damage to your engine or something? Im seeing this alot now that Im looking for it.
I think there is a lot of things that could happen in real life that won't make it into AHII. For instance, take any air cooled engine up high, getting the engine hot then chop the throttle and dive it to sea level. The shock cooling will crack every cylinder head on the engine.
I think it is a matter of playability. If HTC modeled every factor most of us would be on the ground.
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Edbert1,
In complex aircraft (adjustable pitch and retractable gear) the RPM is controlled by adjusting the pitch of the prop. Manifold pressure is adjusted by the throttle.
if you go into the E6B on the clipboard, it will list (as I'm sure you know) the various settings for Max power, Cruise, etc.
There would be a possible chance of Shock Cooling the engine for some of these vultures that cruise at 30,000' and then dive at "warp 6" to sea level. Pulling the throttle to idle at those extreme cold temps "could" possibly crack a cylinder or block "could"....:)
But that's not a factor in this game. I agree that if we made it totally realistic (Microsoft Flight Sim) it would detract from the enjoyment of the game for us vets, and make it near impossible for noobs.
In my humble opinion, of course.:):)
NAVCAD
Life is tough, but it's tougher when you're stupid!
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A computer keyboard is not a cockpit.
While you might easily mistake the tactile feel of the "t" or "h" key for the "g" gear key, it's much harder to mistake the gear handle with the big round knob on it for anything but the gear handle. They do things that way on purpose.
For example, you can easily be looking around outside while identifying the gear handle by touch alone.
A lot of this "realism" is going to be that way. In an aircraft, you can do a lot of things without looking or even thinking about it. With a keyboard and a 2D monitor that isn't always the case.
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I blew a 2" by 4" hole in the can of my MC exhaust
How, well I was riding down a large hill and I hit the kill switch by accident and it took me about five seconds to realise why I lost power, I flicked the kill switch back on and the resulting back fire was so FARKING big that I spent a split second thinking I was being shot at. She got louder and louder on the way home, it was so bad that my ears were beginning to hurt, but man did she get more power it almost made me leave the hole.
Why did this happen... My throttle was open and the bike was going down hill, the kill switch cuts the spark. When I flicked the kill switch back on I had 4 cylinders full of unburnt fuel.
Would be nice to make it so that you have to chop throttle when you cut your engine or else risk damage when you cut it back in...
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Except it didn't hurt your engine a bit; the spark and valve timing were still working as usual, so there were normal "explosions" in your cyclinders.
You may well have had some unburnt fuel in the exhaust system that caused your problem.
Of course, on WW2 military engines the "exhaust system" was usually a short piece of heavy metal tubing about 2-6 inches long. Not much fuel will collect in that, hence no explosion in the exhaust system.
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Not sure how this applies to other aircraft, but in my ride shutting the engine down actually reduces drag considerably, compared to simply chopping throttle.
So if folks are looking to "force an overshoot", not cutting the engine might be a better idea.
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Originally posted by Jackal1
My engine shutdowns in the game are usualy accomanied by a strange black trail of smoke flowing behind the plane I have noticed. It happens pretty regular.
I`ve also noticed that right before shutdown, one of the little gaugie thingies has a fastly falling needle.
Man I think you and I have been flying the same 'faulty' planes.... must be the RHM's (Red Headed Midgets) working on the planes again.... I usually hear a ping and then I get the :huh look on my face and float to earth slowly. Becarful if you land in the trees, the branches hurt when they stick in your....errr.... Nurse, more morphine please!