Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: B@tfinkV on May 24, 2006, 06:40:10 PM
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Whilst flying i 190A5 in the AvA arena BoB scenario, It struck me to immerse myself into the mindset of a 23 year old German Pilot. And i mean really try to convince my mind to collect information, and anything i ever listed to without realising, and create the world and environment around me in my head to an extent of being the view being more opaque through the mind's eye than the two balls in your head. the exersise is a form of meditation, and must be practiced in very quiet and unpoluted places, and low light, a forced daydream, I enjoy attempting to do the same with animals, try to best imagine the mindset of a cat, stupid things, but excelent mind excersises. unfortunately it would be next to impossible while playing aceshigh :)
Enough random rubbish, but there is a reason behind the madness. From my young days i would make a model spitfire, and a second a 109, paint them as best i could, and continue by burning holes in the Bf's wings and trailing cotton wool behind it with the spitfire in persuit hanging from the cealing. I would expect to see the reverse in a young model makers room in Germany, and rightly so. The ver largest % of us here are from the USofA, with another large chunk being {ex}allied and {ex}axis Europeans.
Little Jimmy from England would jump into a spitfire first time on AH and want to shoot at black crossed machines, and Hans from Austria would hop in a 109 and start shouting Arghtung Spitfire.
Now the Question is How many of the Player base here would fly soley the planes of thier countries and allies, and take most pleasure in shooting down historical opposition? How many fly anything and dont even think about it? how many feel strong patriotism to a 60 year old war?
personally i love jumping in a 190 and tearing some spitfires apart just as much as any other plane match-up.
I am curious to know peoples thoughts about the deeper significance of what we do for fun. I am sure there are some people playing the game that remember air raids and rationing, our squadron has a real old chap named DeeBee who was blitzed, or so he says.
I appreciate those that couldnt care less about philosophy and pointless thought are in a large majority in the world, so i just thought i'd type this down somewhere before i sober up.
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I think you're onto something. When I first started playing AW, I immediately went for the P-38 and A-26. I don't think I flew an Axis plane for a year.
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Started AW in '91 or so, pretty much nothing but US iron the whole time up to today. P-51, P-47, F4U , well ok, 5% spitfires. I'm pretty sure it's a national pride thing somewhere in the back of my drunken stupor.
WW2 movies were still a popular thing when I was a kid, Combat! was a prime-time show. Every drug store had plastic models of every WW2 plane and ship. I rarely see them anymore...*sigh*
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I wish I could fly the Corsair & do it well. Unfortunately I have to fly the Hurri & the Spit if I want to stay in the air in a fight more than a few seconds, & I end up in that position most of the time even then. That being said I'm sure you have hit on a bit of human nature accurately. ( I did the same thing with models when I was a kid, I used hot needles or safety pins to make the holes. What did you use?)
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Hmm. I fly mostly allied planes not because of a hate for the axis countries, but because they handle exactly what I like best in a plane.
I just don't like how the 109's, LaLa's, 190's and so on handle. They just don't handle the way I want them to, nor do they match my flying style.
But in FPS's, I mainly play as US soldiers. I just feel dirty and wrong playing as the germans..
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For the longest time, my favorite plane was the C205.
I am a fascist. ;)
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Originally posted by Sandman
I am a fascist. ;)
And I thought you just had a calzone fetish.:O
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Have to admit when I see a Zero I get that.."For Pearl Harbor" feeling.
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I dunno Bat, its a bit touchy in my family. Relative of mine on my dads side survived Auchwitz but her entire family didn't. I don't mind flying 109's or 190's from an aircraft perspective, but it is a bit disconcerting from a standpoint of what the symbology going along with it stood for.
For instance, if my wife is in the room and i'm playing IL2 - i'd up a 109 with American or Russian markings. B/c I know with a certainty i'd get **** from her the second she see's an iron cross b/c of her history.
As for me, I just like P-47's and P-38's and obliterating 109's and 190's at 20k.
But that is just me.
Wolf
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In CTF i'm always blue, becasue im no commie
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SM3RT FASCHISTAM !
At the time I discovered AH I was reading this :
(http://normandieniemen.free.fr/ceux%20de%20Normandie%20Niemen.jpg)
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Coming from a Navy (USN) family, where Dad, Granddad, Uncle #1 and Uncle #2 were all USN pilots, I have a preference for USN birds. Corsairs and Hellcats are my fav, but for base defence sometimes I'll up a spit, depending on if I think I'll have time to climb or not... You'll never see me in any axis planes, just on principle...
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I never really considered the nationallity of the planes when I started playing or even now. I see each plane and its abilities and try to pick the one that I like and feel is best suited for what ever type of fight or task I'm about to undertake. If I'm going after bombers low level I might pick a La-5/7, Typhoon, or G14. High Alt bombers (15k and up) I might use the 109k4, 190D9. Ground attack, Typhoon, P-47, Mosie, A-20G, 110. Base Defense, Nikis, Spits, Hurris, La-5/7. Goon hunting, La-5/7, Typhoon, Niki. I try to mix it up and fly something different.
what Bat said got me thinking about why I'm addicted to this game,or at least why I've stayed with it as long as I have. I still remember being in the library in the 5 or 6th grade and reading the "A" encyclopdia because thats where the airplanes where. I still recall the large foldout color plate of all the airplanes from the Wright Flyer to F-100 and F-105. Most of my 5 and 6th grade was spent drawing airplanes in class. I spent alot of weekends grounded because I got in trouble at school drawing those airplanes instead of school work. I remember sitting in the parking lot somewhere on base and I could see the F-105s and F-4s taxiing on the flightline. By the 7th grade I discovered all the books about WW2 and airplanes in the library and proceded to use the copier in the library to copy pictures from all the books I read and studied books on flight and rockets. Then I discovered models. I built them all, the monogram A-26, B-26, B-25, B-17, B-24, and B-29. Hurricanes, P-40, Typhoon, P-51, P-38, and Skyraider. I hated that Skyraider too, it had folding wings and I couldnt get the folding wings to stay together, and the more glue I used the worse it got.
Thanks Bat
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I know a couple people I've flown with that make their choices based on patriotism. I was asked the 69th HB's F-86 vs MiG. Some chose the F-86 because they consider it a better platform (radar gunsight, fast dives). Some picked the F-86 simply because they're American. I don't think anybody even picked the MiG.
In the MA... there's just so many good choices I couldn't limit myself to a single nationality, or even just ally or axis rides. I like Jugs & Ponies for JABO runs. My absolute favorite dogfighters are the n1k & la5fn. If somebody HO's me, and it makes me mad, I'll go get an 3-gun la7 and get my revenge. If I'm in an absolutely nasty fight with lots of cons and need better performance to make up for my lack of skills, I'll break out the SpitXVI or SpitVIII (unless I feel like paying perkies, in which case it's Tempest, F4U4, or 262). If I'm bomber hunting, I take up LW iron. It just feels like they're the best tools for the job, whether you need a truckload of cannon rounds & rockets or fast climb rates. For last ditch base defense I'll take up an A6M5b. If Fighter Town is available, I only up 2 aircraft, La5 & P-40E.
I know this is a weakness to my gameplay... I really should pick a single ride and stick with a few months to master it... but honestly, I'd rather just be decent in most rides, than the absolute god of a single aircraft :)
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first in AH i could not name a single participant in WWII except patton, hitler, and ummm... those jap kamakazi dudes. i know pathetic, it was just never a part of my life. i was more into the cold war type stuff.
got pulled in by an LW squad, and show the ropes. started learning about the war more and more. i read alot of accounts and pilot statements from the LW side, and realised many many of them were not nazi's in any sence of the word. they had no belief in hitler or national socialism, they were recruited to fly planes. they loved to fly, and got out of going to the "trenches". alot of these german pilots i read about only served because they were either forced to or to fight for their "country" as in protecting their family. the propagana made it sould to them like if they didn't the russians would come kill their family.
now though flying is for fun (when i am active) and a plane is a plane. once you have seen the true gang bang horde gaming the game nature of the MA it is pointless to say "i only fly this"
the Dora is still the coolist bad-ass looking plane in the plane set though :aok
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This morning it was:
Spit VIII
Hurry I
F4U-4
Lancaster
A6M2
Basically fly about everything, least the 190's and Jap planes though.
It's a simulator you see, and the sides are bishes, rooks and knights.
In Axis vs Allies, I usually join the team with less players.
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Bat I did the same stuff with models as a kid. I had a B26 that I put a few flak holes in, sanded away most of the plastic thickness around the holes and made it look like jagged metal. Then I painted silver around the jagged parts. I also cut pieces of plastic to look like the ribs of the wings inside. I was quite proud of it.
As for WW2, I have always been a buff since I was a kid. I like flying alot of the planes in here. I dont think I ever looked at is as "Im American, I should fly US iron! " though.
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Originally posted by asilvia
Have to admit when I see a Zero I get that.."For Pearl Harbor" feeling.
I couldnt agree more. When there is a CV attack on an airfield and i see zeros. The first plane i jump in is a P-40E. I stick to the runway to gain speed then pull her into the air and let er rip!
I pretty much fly all American Planes. There is that whole being from America and proud to fly such wounderful fighters. But also, like BatfinkV, i often "Daydream" while flying fighter, pretending im actually in this fighter and my life depends on how well i fly.
Alittle over a year ago, my old squad 31st BomberBarons were escorting the Screaming Ealges (now called Silent Executioners) on a long range high alt HQ run. The SE's were B-17s and we were P-51Ds. Once we got to around 25k feet, we set our engines to cruise and sat back and enjoyed the large amouth of 17s that were there. As i sat there, i began to get cold myself sitting at my computer. It was like 80 degrees outside and inside the house. I began to shiver. I got so much into "being" in the Mustang, that i felt like i was there at 25k feet. Feeling the coldness all the way down through my body!! Lets say, i had a nice big sleeping bag to warm me up!!
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Interesting topic. I did not realize I was a minority in being an American flying LW planes.
While I am a patriot and hate Nazi's, I have always rooted for the underdog. As a kid, when we played Cowboys and Indians I was always the Indian. When watching a football game and I don't really care which team wins, I always root for the loosing team.
My other reason is that LW planes are generally harder to fly and I feel I will be a better pilot if don't get in a nancy boy no skill TnB plane. Hence the reason you will NEVER see me in a LA-7 and the reason I hunt down those Dweeb LA's with great fervor.
So that is why I fly LW and IJN planes almost exclusively. I think the U.S. planes are too numerous and have too much of an advantage and someone needs to fly for the underdog.
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While it's not a powerful, pervasive mindset, I do find that I have a distinct preference for Allied choices in any game. In AH, my preferred fights are against axis airframes, when I'm in allied colors. Doesn't really matter, as I usually die in flames anyway. :D
Though I've enjoyed flying the occasional luftwobble aircraft, and always liked the look of 109's, I guess I'd still prefer to play for the good guys.
Both the Germans and the Japanese killed members of my family back in the day, and I can't quite forget that.
Yup...some patriotism does kick in here, I suppose.
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Nothing gives me more pleasure in AH than shooting down a N1K2 or Zeke in a F4F, F4U, or F6F. I love the scenarios and squad ops that feature the Pacific theater, and I usually want to be on the USN side of things (though I did lead a IJN attack squad in Midway scenario a few years ago.)
I still enjoy flying a Spit I in a Battle of Britain set too. My last name is of English origin, so I have a place in my heart for jolly ol' England. :)
I do like to try out different planes though, regardless of their country of origin.
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Originally posted by Wolfala
I dunno Bat, its a bit touchy in my family. Relative of mine on my dads side survived Auchwitz but her entire family didn't. I don't mind flying 109's or 190's from an aircraft perspective, but it is a bit disconcerting from a standpoint of what the symbology going along with it stood for.
Many German planes were assembed by workers of the concentration camps, see:
http://www.gusen.org/gu20101x.htm
"At Mauthausen-Gusen, DEST (the SS firm responsible for the exploitation of the prisoners in the stone-quarries since 1938), the German Air-Force (Luftwaffe), and Messerschmitt GmbH Regensburg started the joint venture of B8 BERGKRISTALL-ESCHE 2 for the final assembly stage of the Me 262 jet-plane within the Mauthausen-Gusen complex.
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So, Messerschmitt GmbH Regensburg (together with DEST) produced nearly one third of its over-all aircraft production at KZ Mauthausen-Gusen and KZ Flossenbuerg
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The Jews belonged to the lowest group in the KZ Gusen hierarchy. They had to do the worst jobs and often survived just for a few working-days in that "Hell of Hells"at KZ Gusen II. Fr other groups of prisoners, the average survival-period reached up to four months."
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I was very partial to the Mustang. I greatly enjoyed hunting Luftwhiners.
Kurt Tank invented Luftwhiners.
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I only fly US aircraft. Mostly the Jug and Corsair and P51B.
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I think 90% of my ammo in panzers & tigers is old surplus & they were assembled by concentration camp jews to start with. Because 90% of them are duds or don't penetrate, I think Schindlers people replaced the cores with talcum powder.
J/K sort of.
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My favorite AH scenario is flying P-51D against LW. If bombers are involved, it's even better.
I first started playing AW thinking that would be the normal thing.... oh well... I still do try to play the role sometimes.
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The first Balsa wood model I built (the type where you had a paper template and cut the stringers out each, individually by hand!) was that of a BF109 (or was it ME109? I don't remember...1968 was along time ago)...anyway, the first plane I flew in AW was the 109. The first squadron I joined in AH was JG2. German blood runs deep. :)
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u r teh nazii!!!1!!1!!one!!!11!!!ein!
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Originally posted by Ripsnort
The first Balsa wood model I built (the type where you had a paper template and cut the stringers out each, individually by hand!) was that of a BF109 (or was it ME109? I don't remember...1968 was along time ago)...anyway, the first plane I flew in AW was the 109. The first squadron I joined in AH was JG2. German blood runs deep. :)
heh, I seem to remember a thread like this a few years ago and both of us mentioning something about Corsairs and watching Black Sheep Squadron. :)
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When I first started playing AW on GEnie, I was all for the American planes. Tried the P-51 first, of course (High Blower Engaged). Then the F-4. I managed to become a fairly proficient moving target.
Then somebody turned me on to the Ki-84, the ultimate "lamer plane". I finally started getting some kills.
By the time AW hit the internet, I was flying the FW190-D9. That plane was so sweet it felt like cheating. This was my favorite ride for several years. No, i'm not a fan of nazis or fascism (no offense Skuzzy). The speed, roll rate and cannons on this beast made it a killing machine.
AH1 found me flying the F-6 and the D-9.
Now the game dynamics have changed. There's more gang banging, and reduced performance on my favorite rides. I've been flying 190s, F-4s, nikis, P-38s and mossies... it's generally the same old story. Start closing, and he heads for the deck while six of his buddies jump you. I'm still trying to find a plane that fits, and still holding out hope that this game can be as enjoyable as it once was.
A return of Fightertown would be nice.
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Thanks for the opinions everyone. The responses that interest me the most are those who still feel the effects of the conflicts in thier homes, and a few even feeling the past effect you personally through memories or family history. almost equally interesting is how many of us have absolutely no taboo or history in direct contanct with our day to day lives. would be interested to hear from any {ex}Axis countries in more strength.
the best point brought up was for me about the difference between the majority of all Allied and Axis service men, and thier Governments.
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We were supposedly neutral in WW2 so technically I should have no bias although in practice I would certainly have tried to join the RAF if I had been around at the time. In fact I did apply to join the real RAF in the eighties at a time when certain fellow citizens would have shot me dead as a traitor for doing so.
But I tend to fly whatever I feel like on the day. At least in part to get an idea of what it was like to fly famous aircraft. I tend to favour US Navy aircraft particularly the F4U but it tends to kill me quite a lot. Maybe I'm a reincarnation of a USN pilot:cool:
I'm toying with the idea of designing a skin for a Hurricane in Irish Air Corps colours.