Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: lukster on June 23, 2006, 09:40:02 PM
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Don't know how I missed seeing this documentary for so long. I always figured the government screwed up royally in Waco but I had no idea. I'm stunned.
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Shopping list for thread:
Crying towels.
Beer.
Chips.
Popcorn.
1 easy recliner lawn chair.
Paper towels and Windex.
OK..let er rip.........................a gain. :)
The "they were doing their job" crew will be here shortly I`m sure.
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sometimes people are faced with setuations that they`re aren`t prepared to deal with....they can`t always be expected to do the right thing. We can only hope, they have the best intention to do right thing. Dealing with zealots ain`t easy....
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If the FBI did what it looked like they did in that documentary then they committed cruel premeditated murder. If you haven't seen the documentary then you don't know what I'm talking about. Near the end it appears that there are two agents firing into the burning building with automatic weapons. the FBI claims that they never fired a shot.
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That was Federal extremism to the extreme.
If they wanted Koresh they could have easily taken him in town or while out jogging.
Law enforcement had been invited into the compound before too.
That amount of force was unnecessary and there's really no defending it.
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the ATF was about to be absorbed into the FBI, so to prove that they were still needed as a separate bureaucracy the AFT decided to make a show of how good they were, they invited the media( thats how koresh found out about the raid), the AFT called the raid "operation showtime".
after the ATF blew it the FBI took over, they borrowed the armored vehicles from the national guard by claiming it was a drug bust. otherwise the FBI could not have used the guard, (posse comitatus).
the FBI said they had to act because it was going on too long and they had to end it.
years before, the indian stand off at wounded knee went on much longer and no more people died at wounded knee because the president at that time sent in a army general to take charge and his orders from the president was to settle it without loss of life.
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Different presidents for the two stand-offs: different mind-sets, which influenced their respective staffs and the heads of the agencies appointed by them.
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Be careful if you wish for the complete and undivided attention of the federal government. You just might get it.
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where do I put in a request for their 'complete and undivided attention' on the subject of leaving us all the hell alone and keeping their corrupt theiving politicians hands outta the till without getting gassed, sniped, BBQ'd and crushed?
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Originally posted by Hangtime
where do I put in a request for their 'complete and undivided attention' on the subject of leaving us all the hell alone and keeping their corrupt theiving politicians hands outta the till without getting gassed, sniped, BBQ'd and crushed?
If ya find out, let me know.
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yep... even ol klinton admitted that it was the biggest mistake of his presidency.
I don't see how the killing of all those innocent women and children has been taken so lightly for so long.
Not a violent criminal in the whole "compound" (church).... the local sherrif was over many times and said that the people were weird but harmless...
There is a lot of evidence that the feds fired the first shots and the last shots.
What we have done about Waco is a blot on the history of the U.S. to me.
lazs
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Originally posted by Hangtime
where do I put in a request for their 'complete and undivided attention' on the subject of leaving us all the hell alone and keeping their corrupt theiving politicians hands outta the till without getting gassed, sniped, BBQ'd and crushed?
www.lp.org (http://www.lp.org)
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Originally posted by ~Caligula~
sometimes people are faced with setuations that they`re aren`t prepared to deal with....they can`t always be expected to do the right thing. We can only hope, they have the best intention to do right thing. Dealing with zealots ain`t easy....
Hmmmm......maybe you could relate that to some of our Liberal friends about our proud fighting men in Iraq.
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FBI = Famous But Incompetent.
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I mean, If you've done nothing wrong, you have nothing to fear, right?
We definately deserve the government we get....
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ohhh mannn and here I thought it was going to be a thread on a new video game
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If you haven't seen this documentary you owe it to yourself to see it. I followed this pretty closely back in '93 on CNN. What was portrayed by CNN was at best a distortion of events, at worst outright lies. These people were definitely outside the mainstream but they were not Jim Jones crazy. David Koresh probably should have been locked up but all of these people definitely did not deserve to die.
After watching this I can't help but believe the FBI was after revenge for the killing and humiliation of the ATF. I think the congressional inquiry dropped the ball big time. I suspect they were afraid of what it would do to the country if the truth were widely known.
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Originally posted by Thrawn
www.lp.org (http://www.lp.org)
the libertarian party?
LOL!
puzzies, panzies and gehy marrige open border sweetheartbags.
still better than than the party of Klintonistas, sharptons and feinsteins.
*sigh*
it's like the diffrence between petrified **** and a warm ****. One really stinks, but they are both still ****.
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The Rules of Engagement "documentary" is just as bad as Michael Moore's stuff. All it does is tell a one sided view of the things that went on.
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that ATF agent who rolls off the roof after a fricken 10 yards of bullets into the wall hits him, I hope that gimp wears a colostomy bag and lives in agonizing pain to this day. he sucks. and is more then likely a huge fan of brokeback mountain
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Originally posted by lukster
Don't know how I missed seeing this documentary for so long. I always figured the government screwed up royally in Waco but I had no idea. I'm stunned.
Yea, thats the movie that warped my brain, i think. What is scary about this is you have to get this documentary from a hole-in-the wall producer while the main stream TV still reports it as a mass suicide. Kinda makes you wonder. Investigative reporting isnt what it used to be.
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Originally posted by Cougar68
The Rules of Engagement "documentary" is just as bad as Michael Moore's stuff. All it does is tell a one sided view of the things that went on.
Well professor, the other 'one side of the story' is all that has been told to the american public. Why not rip cnn and fox and History chanel and nat. geographic for reading the official story and editing the footage to match it? Sometimes you have to go to two places to see 2 sides of 'the story'.:huh
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Originally posted by WhiteHawk
Well professor, the other 'one side of the story' is all that has been told to the american public. Why not rip cnn and fox and History chanel and nat. geographic for reading the official story and editing the footage to match it? Sometimes you have to go to two places to see 2 sides of 'the story'.:huh
Ya beat me to it. Like most everyone else, the "other" side of the story was all I knew for years.
Maybe I didn't follow the story as closely as I thought in '93 but I got the distinct impression back then that the building went up shortly after the FBI began attacking it with a tank. That is far from what actually happened. The FBI tore many holes in that building pumping in CS for a period of about 6 hours. If they did in fact position agents at exits who fired into the building as it burned, as it appeared on the FLIR video, they are guilty of a most heinous murder.
BTW, the documentary is on again next Tuesday evening on The Documentary channel.
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luckster... In 93 cnn was in the klintons pocket but... even if it weren't.. there would be no way that they could have reoported more than one side since they, like the fire department, were never allowed to get close enough to have any idea of what was going on.
The ATF fired on koresh at the start while he was at the doorway and unarmed. They killed one man at that time.. the ATF on the roof were fired at but there is evidence that they were shooting at each other also.
When the ATF started firing at the house in general (the films show it) the davidians fired back... the idiot ATF fired till they were out of ammo and thene the davidians allowed them to gather their wounded and walk away... The Davidians could have killed every one of the ATF on the front line if they had wanted.
Even the most pro government slant admits that the FBI and it's negotiators were not in sync.. the negotiators told the davidians at one time that if they tried to give up they would be killed.
A real mess..
It is a perfect example of the best of government with the most tax money available doing the kind of job governments do.... Like FEMA or public schools...
Hey... I got an idea.... let's let the government "fix" global warming".
lazs
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I rented the video from blockbuster about 1 year after it happened. (I think it was the same video, although I think it may have been titled 'waco the big lie' or something at the time). I think what is really disturbing is the fact theat the main media sticks to the govts version despite visual evidience to the contrary. It sucks waking up from a good brainwashing.
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Originally posted by lazs2
luckster... In 93 cnn was in the klintons pocket but... even if it weren't.. there would be no way that they could have reoported more than one side since they, like the fire department, were never allowed to get close enough to have any idea of what was going on.
lazs
So, after all these years, i guess it wouldnt be worth a 5 minute piece telling the american public that a mass murder was probably committed at waco and here is the incontovertable pictorial evidence to support it? If you operate on the assumption that the media and the govt are owned by the same people, it starts to make a little more sense.
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If you operate on the assumption that the media and the govt are owned by the same people, it starts to make a little more sense.
Another American 'GETS' it!
:aok
Welcome to the 'new world order'.
Korporation Uber Alles.
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I don't know about "owned" but... They are about 80% or better far lefties and "reporting" is pretty well influenced by that.
Then of course, there is the fact that they are arrogant, cowardly and slovenly. They care more about their hair than the story and...
They really don't work for a story anymore... they go on what they are told... they don't want to get their sources too mad at em soooo.. A lot of times they just buy the story as told to em.
Again... hair is the main concern for em. That and imitaiting sincerity... that is tougher every year for em.
They woulda stepped on the bodies of those children to get a mike in the face of anyone on the scene.
lazs
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Originally posted by lukster
If the FBI did what it looked like they did in that documentary then they committed cruel premeditated murder. If you haven't seen the documentary then you don't know what I'm talking about. Near the end it appears that there are two agents firing into the burning building with automatic weapons. the FBI claims that they never fired a shot.
Waco confirmed the ineptitude of the government responding to this now infamous episode. They brought the wrong guns to the gunfight. Then again, even though the "FBI claims that they never fired a shot", how about the ATF?
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Originally posted by Hangtime
Another American 'GETS' it!
:aok
Welcome to the 'new world order'.
Korporation Uber Alles.
You know some people define facism as close cooperation between Corprate/Media/Goverment.
CNN means basicly - The Corprate News Network.
We are still argureing over whims of Hurst in this day and age.
Today, we have Rupert Mordouch and other media giants for people like Hillary Clinton to bow down too.
http://www.commondreams.org/cgi-bin/print.cgi?file=/views06/0510-20.htm
http://www.commondreams.org/cgi-bin/print.cgi?file=/views04/0322-07.htm
http://www.commondreams.org/cgi-bin/print.cgi?file=/views02/0223-08.htm
http://www.commondreams.org/views03/0518-01.htm
http://www.commondreams.org/scriptfiles/views03/1223-05.htm
http://www.commondreams.org/views01/0524-06.htm <== TV Uber Alles
And it isn't only a U.S. problem, Italian's and Britian's have had issues with media empires as well.
Vote Green or Progressive--Anything else is throwing your vote away.
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Originally posted by lazs2
yep... even ol klinton admitted that it was the biggest mistake of his presidency.
I don't see how the killing of all those innocent women and children has been taken so lightly for so long...
lazs
the first line in your post answers the second ...
if a mean ole republican potus would have done the same thing, he'd been impeached by the media before he was hanged, record economic growth or not..
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Originally posted by lazs2
yep... even ol klinton admitted that it was the biggest mistake of his presidency.
I don't see how the killing of all those innocent women and children has been taken so lightly for so long.
Not a violent criminal in the whole "compound" (church).... the local sherrif was over many times and said that the people were weird but harmless...
There is a lot of evidence that the feds fired the first shots and the last shots.
What we have done about Waco is a blot on the history of the U.S. to me.
lazs
QFT.. scary that I actually feel the same way as Lazs about something.
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Originally posted by WhiteHawk
while the main stream TV still reports it as a mass suicide.
It it had happened under the current administration it would have been reported differently for sure.
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Originally posted by Edbert1
It it had happened under the current administration it would have been reported differently for sure.
Agree 100%
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My wife watched this with me. She has little interest in politics (though she does insist on voting and feels I don't have the right to tell her how to vote). ;) She didn't follow the Waco event as closely as I did but we were equally shocked after watching. She wanted to know what she could do about it. Other than a letter to our representatives I don't know. Anyone?