Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: sky_bax on February 14, 2001, 10:15:00 AM
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(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
ok..........
1) What was the first official police pursuit car in the United States? Name the make, model, year. And in what state? (2 door car for speeders, not a 4 door sedan)
2) The Ford Mustang was a very popular pursuit car for police for many years. It was equipped from Ford with what was called the Special Service Package. What was the first year it was put into use? And in what state?
3) Pontiacs Hurst SSJ option for the Grand Prix in the late 60s early 70s was much like that of a GTO, Hurst/Olds, GS and so on. Additional performance and nice cosmetics added to the interior as well as exterior. How many 1972 Pontiac Grand Prixs were equipped with the special Hurst SSJ option?
4) What was the fastest mass produced passenger car in the world in 1987. (quarter mile / 1320 feet)
5) Name at least one car maker that used the spare tire air pressure to operate the windshield washer pump instead of an electric pump. (he he, thats a silly design)
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Skybax
328th Fighter Squadron
www.352ndFighterGroup.com (http://www.352ndFighterGroup.com)
Blue Nosed Bastards of Bodney
[This message has been edited by sky_bax (edited 02-14-2001).]
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I don't know any of them. I'll watch for the answers. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif) Good questions. One of my favorite cars is the 69' Royal Bobcat prepped Pontiac Grand Prix's. The Hurst were pretty cars. There is a 69' SSJ with the hood tach up the street from my house. I'd love to restore it.
[This message has been edited by Jimdandy (edited 02-14-2001).]
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4) What was the fastest mass produced passenger car in the world in 1987. (quarter mile / 1320 feet)
Really out of my league here... but I'll bite this one: Somehow I think its the 5.0 liter Ford Mustang.
Jay.
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Bzzzzzzzzzzzzzzit
Nope.
87 Mustang 5.0 with a 5 speed and few options to reduce weight would bring a best time of around high 14 seconds to low 15 seconds.
One second too slow. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) (about 4 car lengths)
The fastest mass produced passenger car in the world in 1987 did the 1/4 mile in about 14 flat depending on options. (13.8 to 14.2)
[This message has been edited by sky_bax (edited 02-14-2001).]
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I will make some WILD guesses:
1. 1932 Ford Model A, State CA.
2. 1983, CA
3. 500
4. Porsche 911
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Bzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzit, he he.
Half right on #2, and close on other half.
But since your that close I`ll give it to ya. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
#2 is CA, California Highway Patrol, and the first year used was 1982. Good guess!
Here is a history link:
http://www.intrlink.net/evooa/mssrart.htm (http://www.intrlink.net/evooa/mssrart.htm)
My buddy who lives upstairs from me has a 1992 Florida Highway Patrol Mustang fully restored with ALL the markings and ALL the equipment.
(http://performanceautosport.com/images/previous/990804picI1.jpg)
We take it to car shows, and the drive on the highway here in Pennsylvania to and from the shows gets ALOT of attention he he. People just move right out of the way for you LOL.
But we do have to use magnets and cover the decals on the doors & fenders when driving it on the roads.
PS: A Porsche 911 is not a passenger car. It`s a 2 seater sports car. Even so, its best 1/4 mile time in 1987 is not that much faster than this car. Maybe a few tenths of a second.
Would be pretty embarrassing having a heavy passenger car staying right with your 911 he he.
[This message has been edited by sky_bax (edited 02-14-2001).]
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4) My guess would be the Buick Grand National with that beautiful Turbo Charged T-Type engine. Was one of if not the quickest cars that year (and 86 also.. thought 86 was actually its premier year). It put the Camaros and Mustangs to shame. I've heard of slicks equiped no air filter versions of this car breaking 12 seconds in the 1/4. No other modifications made.
5) Ahhhh... no research necessary for this one. My 69 Volkswagen Squareback (dad gave it to me in high school) had a 1/4" line(or metric equivilent) with a valve-stem fitting hanging in the spare tire compartment. It still cracks me up.
AKDejaVu
[This message has been edited by AKDejaVu (edited 02-14-2001).]
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A Porsche 911 is not a passenger car
Ummmmm
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BTW It's Buick Regal GNX. There were quicker mass produced passenger cars around, but if you restrict it to Big-Three sedans then it's the answer to your question. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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WTG AKDejaVu!
You are correct on both. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
4) 1987 Buick Grand National/T-Type was the fastest 1/4 mile "mass produced passenger car in the world" in 1987.
(http://members.stratos.net/killerklown/Buick/Side.jpg)
(sorry funked, a well known fact, and not limited to a small few. I have more reading material in storage from high school than you could shake a stick at. One of my favorite cars for last 15 years, and owned 2 of them. And it`s not a GNX, only 524(?) GNXs made, that is not mass produced.)
5) LOL yes a VW. We had a Type 3 also growing up, but it was a fastback not a squareback. Loved that car (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) He he, the washer pump working off the spare tire is the dumbest idea I have even seen. Neat car though.
(http://www.thesamba.com/vw/type3/photos/fastbacks/fastback3.jpg)
That leaves these unanswered:
# 1 and # 3.
[This message has been edited by sky_bax (edited 02-14-2001).]
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Ya give up ? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
Come on...... (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) .... you got 3 out of 5!
Never say die!!!!
he he
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Here are the answers.
1) 1971 AMC Javelin AMX in Alabama
(http://www.javelinamx.com/javhome/copcar/javcop1b.jpg)
Here is a history link: (very cool)
http://www.javelinamx.com/javhome/copcar/copcar1.htm (http://www.javelinamx.com/javhome/copcar/copcar1.htm)
3) Only 60 SSJ made in 1972. (200 some in 1971)
(http://www.classicalpontiac.com/articles/images/98poci/9.GIF)
Here is a history link: (gold wheels are ugly)
http://soli.inav.net/~pontiac/gph2_7.html (http://soli.inav.net/~pontiac/gph2_7.html)
[This message has been edited by sky_bax (edited 02-15-2001).]
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Love those GPs (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Owned three 1972 Grand Prixs. First one was my high school car I payed $1,100 for and in 3 years & 50,000 miles it never let me down once. Here is the final 72 GP and nicest one of the 3.
Partially restored it, and refinished it in 1989 Corvette Blue.
If I could do it over again, I would have done it in black.
With black top & interior, triple black would have been the way to go. I don`t know what I was thinking. O well.
Doesn`t matter now, currently owned by a guy in Illinois. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
(http://pages.prodigy.net/dannyk1/.wi_3%20in%201%20gp.jpg)
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Nice GP. Damn your making me want one real bad again. There was a Dealership that used to prepare versions of the Pontiac's like Yenko did for the Chevy's. The one I liked the best was the 69' Royal Bobcat GP. It had a Ram Air V engine with sodium cooled exhaust valves and a 4-speed. It would blow away a Judge in the 1/4 mile. Man I'd love to find one. A luxury hot rod.
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"The one I liked the best was the 69' Royal Bobcat GP. It had a Ram Air V engine with sodium cooled exhaust valves and a 4-speed."
Sounds awesome. Love to see some pics or info on one.
If you come across anything on the Net, please post it so I can check it out.
Never knew that Ram Air V saw any other model than the T/A.
From what I know there were 500 and some Ram Air Vs produced special for the 69 Trans AM.
Pure race engine from the factory. Very rare engine & worth a ton of $ today.
It`s been too long and don`t remember the specs exactly, but it had an awesome set-up.
Think it was over 500 FT LB OF TORQUE!!!!!!
Imagine it, basicly that Bobcat GP drivetrain in a car that weighs almost HALF as much!
He he, scary.
I had a friend who had a 69 Firebird with a Ram Air II and it would scare the toejam out of me when he got on it.
[This message has been edited by sky_bax (edited 02-15-2001).]
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I can't remeber the exact tital and publisher but I have a book stored some place with a picture of it. I think it was a Peterson's publication and the tital was Pontiac's. It should still be out there. Look at Hastings and Barnes & Nobel in there automotive section. I bet it's still in print. It's a paper back with a glossy photo of I think a TA wagon on the front. It was a concept car in the mid 70's. I might be getting it mixed up with another Pontiac book I have. At any rate it is a paper back with a glossy cover. It was one of those books you always see about a brand or specific car. I looked real quik on the web and I only see Royal Bobcat GTO stuff. But like Yenko they did several different Pontiac models. Most of the time all you hear about is the Yenko Camaro's.
[This message has been edited by Jimdandy (edited 02-15-2001).]
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Sky_Bax.. I'm going to have to disagree with you on #1. As early as 1935 (as far back as I could find), 2 dr sedans were used by state highway patrols exclusively traffic control. These were hot-rods built for persuit.
I think someone may lay claim to the "official" persuit title.. but it is a paper claim at best.
AKDejaVu
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Originally posted by AKDejaVu:
Sky_Bax.. I'm going to have to disagree with you on #1. As early as 1935 (as far back as I could find), 2 dr sedans were used by state highway patrols exclusively traffic control. These were hot-rods built for persuit.
I think someone may lay claim to the "official" persuit title.. but it is a paper claim at best.
AKDejaVu
I would have to agree. I'm not sure if they were "Official" but there have been hot police cars since the 20's or 30's. They really got big in the moonshine states. There were some really wicked one's built in the 60's. A guy I know had an old Dodge police car that actually had ladder bars and a factory hi-po 440 that was VERY VERY fast. He never took it to the trak but there wasn't anything he raced in the 80's that could stay with it on the highway. That included Vette's, Porches, you name it. Some were a little quiker off the line. It was a big 4 door tank. Like I say I'm not sure what you mean by "official" but this was a factory engine. Not sure about the suspention. It was a very strange carberator. It was some wierd 2bbl 4bbl combination or something but all one piece. Wild car. BTW the car ended it's life along with the life of the driver when it hit a bridge abutment at an estimated 160mph. He sold it to a kid when he got married.
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Valid point guys.
And I`m sure there were all kinds of "modified" cop cars in the past 75 years or so.
But basicly my definition of "official" was that of a "pursuit" car specialy designed by a car maker and delivered that way to the police department of interest. Sedans excluded.
These Javelins, Mustangs and others, have special options and codes from the factory that seperate them from the other cars.
I don`t think there were any "factory built Police Interceptors" before that 1971 AMX.
Could be wrong. Interesting though.
[This message has been edited by sky_bax (edited 02-15-2001).]
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Here`s an example,
Take a 1945 Ford 2 door coupe.
A police department buys several of them, orders them the way they want, puts their makings, lights, radios, and uses them for pursuit purposes.
In that day and age, they maybe even trick it out a bit after recieving it if someone at the station is a gearhead he he.
But, it still is identical to every other 1945 Ford coupe that comes off the line with the same options except for a higher # at the end of the VIN.
So it`s not the same as a "factory police interceptor" built solely and coded officially for that purpose.
See what I`m saying?
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You asked "what was the first official pursuit car"... not "what was the first pursuit vehicle specifically developed for that purpose and not sold to the public".
The fastest cars available were used as early as 1935 (that I could find). That changed over time as more options (and spendier ones) were available. Budget became more of a concern and sedans were the cheapest. It may have been an issue during the 70's, but back in 35 it was not.
The cops weren't being outran, simply because they already had the fastest out there.
AKDejaVu
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Also sky_bax, I see that the AMX was available with a 401 in production vehicles too? Basically, the only real difference was introducing a production hot-rod as a fleet vehicle.
The only real distinction is that fleet vehicles exist now, whereas the title was not around in earlier days.
AKDejaVu
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You asked "what was the first official pursuit car"
That is exactly it.
Ok..........
I explained best I could above but I`ll give it one more try.
Take a 1987 Buick T-Type Regal. (basicly same as a Grand National)
The Pittsburgh Police recieved 10 of them when them came out. They used them as pursuit cars for 7 years. They were 2 doors, fast, and their sole purpose was to run down speeders. When sold 7 years later, if you bought one at the auction, that car is no different than the one in my garage. The police using it for 7 years means nothing.
Now, that fits exactly into what your saying about a 30s or 40s car. I agree. A hot-rod pursuit car the police used for that purpose.
But, those turbo regals are no different than any other turbo regals sold new or used.
"official" pursuit cars, or sometimes called police interceptors are ones that are built from the factory. Reguardless of options, or what was done to them, they were "labeled" from the factory when new and remain that status for life reguardless who owns them.
They have special plates and codes from the factory seperating them from their sister models.
I can take a 1992 Mustang 2 door coupe notchback and buy every single thing that went on a Special Service Package Mustang, add all the police trimmings, and it will be an identical clone. But its not a real police interceptor.
You can take a 69 GTO and make a Judge out of it, but its not a real Judge.
What I`m trying to say is, the eariler model 2 door pursuit cars you speak of police used, reguardless of what options they were ordered with, and what was done to them for law enforcment purposes, were not "official" pursuit cars built from the factory and "labeled" that status from day one.
An "official" pursuit car is brand at birth same as a "official" GTO Judge.
Being a hobby of mine, I have never come across any information indicating that their was an "official" police pursuit car built from the factory before that 1971 AMX.
If you find and info indicating otherwise, please post it. Always looking to learn more about them.
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were not "official" pursuit cars built from the factory and "labeled" that status from day one.
You see sky_bax, what you are doing is re-wording the question. You now are specifying what makes it official or not official.
Some might think that a car that is bought by the state for use by the police would be "official". Others would think that the car company has to label them to become "official".
Like I said.. the claim is on paper at best.
AKDejaVu
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Well, don`t know what else to tell ya.
I`m not making the decision, it either is or isn`t official. That`s not for me or you to decide.
Some might think that a car that is bought by the state for use by the police would be "official".
Some might think. But there are official pursuit cars, and then there are just cars that police buy and use.
(see above about Pittsburgh T-Types)
If your GS, Yenko Camero, SS, Judge, or Police Interceptor Mustang has all the codes, paper work, and body tags that was an actual factory produced car then its as official as it gets.
Others would think that the car company has to label them to become "official".
He he
If I buy a ZR1 Vette, LS6 Chevelle SS, or Police Interceptor Mustang it damn well better be labeled making it official or I`m taking it back! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
Look at it any way you like AKDejaVu, it either has the codes or it don`t.
Its the real deal, or its just another model.
Its an official pursuit vehicle, or its just another car.
Official means official.
Nice chatting with ya.
Congrats on getting 2 out of 5 answers. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
PS: Jimdandy, be sure and let me know if you run across anything on a Bobcat GP.
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define MASS PRODUCED wasn't there an exact figure for what would be defined as "mass produced" I can'T remember the axact number.
The turbo charged national wasn't mass produced. avalable to the public, YES,,, mass produced I would have to disagree.
NUTTZ
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"The turbo charged national wasn't mass produced. avalable to the public, YES,,, mass produced I would have to disagree."
That would be incorrect,
20,194 Grand Nationals produced in 1987.
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You might be thinking of the special Grand National package X.
Or known as the GNX. Only 547 made.
http://www.tctc.com/~avblefty/87gnx.htm (http://www.tctc.com/~avblefty/87gnx.htm)
(a spin off of the Buick GS to GSX of the early 1970s)
Equipped with a few more modifications, different wheels (GNX wheels are on that GN picture above), fender louvers, series # on dash plate, Stewart Warner gauges and so on. Random GNs were pulled off the assembly line and transformed into a GNX at a different location.
Each GNX buyer recieved an hardbound GNX book and certificate.
[This message has been edited by sky_bax (edited 02-17-2001).]