Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Maverick on July 04, 2006, 03:36:40 PM
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Here is the link to the story off of the Yahoo headlines. No confirmation it was the one everyone was worried about last month or that the landing was actually "intended".
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060704/ap_on_re_as/nkorea_missile&printer=1;_ylt=AvsNr4OYN6C6ssyqABTDeav9xg8F;_ylu=X3oDMTA3MXN1bHE0BHNlYwN0bWE-
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Gee their first ICBM made it all the way to the sea of Japan. Forgive me if I laugh for a while.
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Originally posted by dmf
Gee their first ICBM made it all the way to the sea of Japan. Forgive me if I laugh for a while.
Again, look at the article. There is no information that it was the ICBM they had on the pad. It very well could have been a lesser missle. Interesting they chose today for the launch.
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Looks like they shot two Scuds into the SoJ.
Whoop-dee-diddle.
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3 missles according to CNN - 2 little ones and the tadpole :)
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Up to 4 now, still no confirmation that the ICBM was one of them.
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lol - you'd figure that after the first one didn't go - they go back and test some more before firing another...unlees it was an act of agression which failed.
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looks like charlie is getting wrestless.
their T2 lasted all of 30-50 seconds. WTG C man. :aok
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N. Korea is really asking for a licking.
Will this be a Japan, China, Russia, U.S. coalition if this leads to war?
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kinda early to talk about war.
talley is up to 6 now. 5 for sure, they are almost possitive its 6.
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FIZZZZZZZZ........POP
sounds more like a bottle rocket.
BREAKING NEWS, NORTH KOREA FIRES ICBM BOTTLE ROCKET INTO SEA OF JAPAN.
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What kind of range to they need to hit Seoul?
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By the range numbers, it seems they are testing hwasong-6?
http://www.fas.org/nuke/guide/dprk/missile/index.html
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Originally posted by Holden McGroin
What kind of range to they need to hit Seoul?
I think they can about hit Seoul with long range arty
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Unfortunately, some people had to work on the 4th of July.
(http://www.boeing.com/defense-space/military/abl/images/abl_DVD-1068-4_375x300.jpg)
Perhaps I've said enough. :noid
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lol, damn, scale that pic down
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Originally posted by Maverick
Again, look at the article. There is no information that it was the ICBM they had on the pad. It very well could have been a lesser missle. Interesting they chose today for the launch.
Don't have to read it again, I saw it on the news, it wasn't the big one.
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North Korean ICBM Launch Instructions
Light blue touch paper and stand well back :)
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Its just the fact that they have launched missiles. In '94 if i remember right, they only launched 1, and just today they launched 6+. I know its not a big deal that they landed in the Sea of Japan, but think if they had hit Japan, South Korea, or the US West Coast. Its just the fact that they launched the missiles in the first place. Dont forget the world turned its back on Hitler when he started to become aggressive, hope the world doesnt make the same mistake twice.
If war does come with North Korea, its gonna be something we havent seen in a long time. This wont be a 3 day war or 3 month war, this thing will last a long time. North Korea has the 4th largest army in the world. Not to mention some 200+ combat aircraft. They may seem like a 3rd world country, but their military is almost up there with Russia, GB, France, and such. Not necessarly in technology, but in man power and some technology. War with North Korea will be long and bloody!!
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Aint nothing like a psychotic dictator threatening armageddon and having his prize missile go "phhhht".
Is there an international idiot prize?
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Well, to put a very quick and pragmatic conclusion to all concerns voiced in this thread, I'd like to say the following:
I just saw Superman Returns, and I vote that we get Superman to lift North Korea out of the ground and set it down somewhere in the eastern Mediterranean, just in range of all our current camel-loving playmates. I think this should be well within his abilities, since North Korea's Kryptonite content should be close to 0%.
The Israelis should be able to take care of themselves and, well, as for all the others, let's just say that I'll be perfectly happy with 2.5% of all proceeeds from the ensuing pay-per-view special.
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I heard talking on CNN today in evening news , about "intercepting capabilities " . Are realy any reliable sistems able to intercept!?
Few months ago i've seen a documentary movie , made by Israel ,about Patriot failure in 1st Golf war. They said, reports on 80-90% hit/ intercept was only propaganda and "comercial" for Raytheon , cuz in reality the hit % was 0 (zer0) .Not a single Scud was shot down by Patriot .
The most intresting conlusion was that the Patriot has chances to intercepts the balistic at /low alt reentry in dense atmosfere, where the Scud were desintegrating, and have unpredictable trajectory at high relative speed
I did't belive , and i checked on internet, and are lot of reports about this, but who knows ,maybe were improved in last 15 years
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During the first gulf war the patriot system did not to a very well job, though it did shoot down some missiles, it also shot down a number of coalition aircraft. But in the 2nd gulf war, the patriot system did VERY well.
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Originally posted by ghi
I heard talking on CNN today in evening news , about "intercepting capabilities " . Are realy any reliable sistems able to intercept!?
Few months ago i've seen a documentary movie , made by Israel ,about Patriot failure in 1st Golf war. They said, reports on 80-90% hit/ intercept was only propaganda and "comercial" for Raytheon , cuz in reality the hit % was 0 (zer0) .Not a single Scud was shot down by Patriot .
The most intresting conlusion was that the Patriot has chances to intercepts the balistic at /low alt reentry in dense atmosfere, where the Scud were desintegrating, and have unpredictable trajectory at high relative speed
I did't belive , and i checked on internet, and are lot of reports about this, but who knows ,maybe were improved in last 15 years
PAC-2 didn't shoot down any SCUD's because there weren't any SCUD's in Iraq. There were, however Al Hussein's - which were modified from SCUD's, usually by extending the fuel tanks and adding necessities like a natural countermeasure of the missile breaking up upon re-entry creating lots of false targets.
PAC-2 software setup the intercept based on a SCUD profile - but if you look at how PAC-2 was designed from the outset, it was made for cruise missiles, fast movers, and as a last ditch, ballistic missile defense. But the warhead, isn't designed for the latter.
For example:
Lets say you have a warhead filled with tungsten balls which are focused out front like a shotgun - so you have a pattern much like a cone filled with metal. If you have a miss distance of 5 meters, you'll hit a lot, maybe something critical. But what if you double the miss distance - 15 meters? Maybe 50 meters? You'd be lucky if 2 or 3 of the balls even hit the fuselage.
But the PAC-2 software was designed so even a miss distance of 100 meters would be tallied as a probable kill. Clearly this wouldn't have been a kill, but the system as a whole was more deterrent then anything regarding TBM defense. And when they started falling on Tel Aviv, if they hadn't been rolled in and showed as doing something to protect Israel, it doesn't matter if they were effective or not - only the perception of them working was what mattered at the time.
PAC-3, is a hit to kill system - which doesn't rely on any warhead to destroy the RV. You either hit the damn thing or not - no 2 ways about it.
Wolf
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N. Korea launched another one this moring.
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Originally posted by BlueJ1
N. Korea launched another one this moring.
Now they only got 2 left?? I say its a sabre rattle.
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7 in total so far the media is saying.
Remember N Korea has at least 4 nukes ready to rumble soon as they have a delevery system. They've already proved they can eliminate Japan for the foreseable future.
What does that do to our econonmy?
If they get a decent ICBM working, Look out below USA!
Flatten em now while you still can. Drop the big one on their launch site/s.
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Originally posted by Ghosth
7 in total so far the media is saying.
Remember N Korea has at least 4 nukes ready to rumble soon as they have a delevery system. They've already proved they can eliminate Japan for the foreseable future.
What does that do to our econonmy?
If they get a decent ICBM working, Look out below USA!
Flatten em now while you still can. Drop the big one on their launch site/s.
Im not an expert, but i think there is a big difference between having nukes and being able to strap them on a ICBM fo delivery. Do we pill out of Iraq and go into N K? Or do we install the draft?
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gotta laugh at those that got their panties in a wad when the term "axis of evil (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/1796034.stm) " was first used ...
(http://news.bbc.co.uk/olmedia/1790000/images/_1793965_bush150ap.jpg)
looks like he knew what he was talking about all along ...
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Jusy heard on news the "Long Range" missile failed.
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They were laughing at Bush in 2000 when he restored funding to ballistic missile defense..things sure change fast-- I was wanting to see if they could manage to shoot it down
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Originally posted by Toad
Unfortunately, some people had to work on the 4th of July.
(http://www.boeing.com/defense-space/military/abl/images/abl_DVD-1068-4_375x300.jpg)
Perhaps I've said enough. :noid
Ya have to wonder which is better. Disable the missile secretely causing the North Koreans to doubt their program while not revealing your capability. Or, reveal your ability to disable their missile letting them know that their program is futile.
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Just curious if any noticed this... Was watching both CNN and FOX news yesterday and today. On CNN the only thing thtas being shown is about the missles..lol On fox- a blurb every now and again, but yesterday CNN seemed like it was the end of the world with continious coverage.
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I saw that too waffle. They made it seem that NK had launched all those missiles and they were heading toward the west coast.
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Originally posted by EagleEyes
I saw that too waffle. They made it seem that NK had launched all those missiles and they were heading toward the west coast.
they were hoping, wishful thinking on the left media part & their dim er dem brothers ..
they pray for an event that would crush this admin and open the flood gates for the dumbarsecrats return to power ... it hasn't happened yet and nov is just around the corner
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Flatten em now while you still can. Drop the big one on their launch sites
And drag us living in the South into full-scale war?
You are not the ones who will have to leave your home and family to themselves, and be conscripted to military defense in what some people estimate to be the most catastrophic war that has taken place since Vietnam, that will leave the entire country in ruins for decades.
If the North ever invades the South again, so be it. We'll have to take up arms and defend our homes - it's our given duty to do so. But I sure as hell don't want to be conscripted again and go fight a war which will concern our lives and our land, which neither the North nor the South started in the first place - one which broke loose by another one of your country's "premptive" strikes against a country which did not engage in any visible acts of war, but merely on grounds of your own "safety" and "world peace".
So next time you guys feel all belligerent about our corny lil' peninsula, try thinking about me, a fellow gamer and AH-lover, who'd probably end up dead within the first month of the war.
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K, you did use the verb "think," in your request. Might want to find a verb not quite so aggressive.
hap
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If the North ever invades the South again, so be it. We'll have to take up arms and defend our homes - it's our given duty to do so. But I sure as hell don't want to be conscripted again and go fight a war which will concern our lives and our land, which neither the North nor the South started in the first place - one which broke loose by another one of your country's "premptive" strikes against a country which did not engage in any visible acts of war, but merely on grounds of your own "safety" and "world peace".
Then maybe we should just pull all of our forces out of your country, since N. Korea poses no direct threat or concern to the US otherwise, and let you all work out your problems together. I mean, I can't imagine a N. Korean nuke strike on the US if we were not standing in the way of a potential Northern reunification of the South like we are now. Win Win.
Charon
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Charon, you maybe onto something. I find myself refelcting that Korea, Viet Nam, Iraq, and N Korea are more similar than dissimilar.
hap
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I just think it's really nice that they lit off a few of their biggest fireworks in honor of our independence day. Very thoughtful.
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its an interesting question: Given no outside support, which side would prevail in all out conflict?
South Korea?
North Korea?
I am all for removing US forces completely from Korea. Of all places on earth that NEED US support, South Korea is furthest from.
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USA destroyed there missles in flight "Ronald Reagans Star Wars"
We wont tell them..They wont say it..
Its perfect..."Intel Inside"
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I disagree... if we had, we would of announced it to not only ensure some type of agreement was drawn up at the UN Security Council but also to send a clear message to other countries that the Defense System works.
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Originally posted by Yeager
its an interesting question: Given no outside support, which side would prevail in all out conflict?
South Korea?
North Korea?
I am all for removing US forces completely from Korea. Of all places on earth that NEED US support, South Korea is furthest from.
For simple fact of man power, the North will win. Within the first 30 or so minutes of the war, Seoul will be destroyed. NK have enough artillery pieces by the dmz to completely destroy all the mines and stuff within the first day. But i do believe we will see another war like the first Korean war was. North will advace very far south, then we "alliance" will push them back and so forth. But im only a 19 year old student living in Minnesota whom has no extensive knowledge of the Korean confict except what i learned when i did a 20 page report for history class in my SR year in highschool.
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LOL... NK just proved what a pissant little country they are.
They're as much a threat to the U.S. as Iraq.
Let's invade.
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only difference is, the long range missile they tested yesterday has the range to hit the west coast of the US. As far as i know, and i could be wrong, Iraq didnt have anything like this. Cant tell if your being a smartarse or not, but just saying what ive heard.
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sea of japan = pwnd
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Originally posted by EagleEyes
only difference is, the long range missile they tested yesterday has the range to hit the west coast of the US. As far as i know, and i could be wrong, Iraq didnt have anything like this. Cant tell if your being a smartarse or not, but just saying what ive heard.
The long-range missile test failed. So far, they're 0-2 with the big sticks.
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Sandman is smart, not a smart ass.
There are plenty of countries capable of hitting the US with a variety of weapons. China has the warheads and delivery capability, and so do many of the former Soviet states, still with targeting info set for the US. Pakistan has nuclear weapons.
This game has been played on the Korean peninsula for half a century. It's just the way it is.
A state of war still exists and the demarcation lines on land and water are the place where strength of will and posturing to scare the bejeezus out of the guys on the other side of the fence are the rules. Make the other guy believe that you are the bigger, meaner mother with a hair trigger.
Incursions are made, shots are fired, people die - all part of the unique dance on the peninsula.
Of course the North Korean military is fanatical in their devotion to their cause. Isn't that what all military are, or strive to be? Fearless and invincible? Isn't that the political strategy for any leader of any country? Get the population waving the flag and defending the notion to fever pitch that they are a chosen nation filled with the smartest, bravest, most righteous people defending their way of life as the best on Earth.
The bone-headed "axis of evil" speech changed the dynamic of the peninsula and played right into the hand of Kim Jung Il. Here was a label on the world stage that singled out North Korea with Iraq and Iran. The first one on the list, Iraq, was invaded and the other two were handed a golden opportunity to claim that they would be next. Why wouldn't they be next? What the hell else could they do except further arm and defend themselves from invasion?
They were handed the opportunity to say to the world, "You threatened us and we will defend ourselves." They were given the opening to overtly declare their nuclear intentions and can easily say that they have every legal right to test missiles, or even test their nuclear devices. They can claim they have a moral obligation to defend themselves.
A two bit tyrant son of a tyrant was given the chance to elevate his stature in the world. A few years ago, North Korea was the nation most disliked and least trusted in surveys around the world. They were displaced by Iran last year as Iran began to assert itself in response to being on the evil list. Maybe they can work themselves into the top spot again.
Politicians from all countries involved or near will find a way to maximize fear out of this, with the press being a willing accomplice.
(By the way, Charon, US forces are not in any country because the US cares deeply about the people of that country. US forces are in every country they are in for the political self interest of being there. The "We are your Savior" card doesn't play well anywhere.)
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Since the United States military is an imperialistic destabilizing force on the world motivated strictly to serve the best interests of the United States alone, I should think having all overseas United States military return to the United States would have a purely stabilizing influence on the rest of the world.
National Isolationism leads to world peace.
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Blue, i love the aviator! lol :lol
And just because they are 0-2 doesnt mean they wont be 1-3.
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The "We are your Savior" card doesn't play well anywhere.
It played pretty dammed well in 1950. One Pusan away from reunification. Korea wasn't WW2 where you had Britain holding it alone at the start and the massive Soviet land army making their crucial contributions to victory. I think "Savior Card" was highly appropriate then, and would be in the immediate future.
By the way, Charon, US forces are not in any country because the US cares deeply about the people of that country. US forces are in every country they are in for the political self interest of being there.
The end of the Cold war eliminated much of the "self interest" founded on superpower regional influence. The self interest as mutual business partners has also waned post cold war, as the financial crisis of 1997 would indicate. Many Asisn economies offer better partnership opportunities today with more growth potential and lower labor costs. I think the Taiwanese have more to worry about where "self interest" is concerend (the lack there of), but frankly Korea may be sliding up there as well.
Furthermore, the younger folk in the South don't really want us there anymore (some legitimate gripes as well) and It's hard to see an absolute "need" to be there should S. Korea dramatically expand it's own defenses. Korea has plenty of economic strength relative to the dire threat to the North and warm bodies like Kweassa to man the DMZ.
So yeah, where our relationship with South Korea is concerend I feel that today it is one based more on honoring past commitments than self interest. In 1980 that would not have been the case.
Charon
BTW
Here's an interesting article I came across when truing to find the date of the Korean financial crisis. Interesting read on the state of the relationship.
http://www.jpri.org/publications/workingpapers/wp93.html
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I was wondering if they didn't launch duds just to throw us all off ...
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Originally posted by Eagler
I was wondering if they didn't launch duds just to throw us all off ...
Exactly! What a ruse! Almost as good as Hussein moving all of his really nasty weapons to Syria on the eve of the U.S. invasion.