Aces High Bulletin Board

General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: BlueJ1 on July 28, 2006, 01:54:41 PM

Title: Plastic models
Post by: BlueJ1 on July 28, 2006, 01:54:41 PM: Today I pickup up a 1:48 scale Tornado ECR. Boy is it purty.

Anyway, has anyone ever seen a plasic model of the German aircraft carrier that they didnt finish? Believe its called the Graf Zeppelin. Id really like to build one and add it next to my other cvs.
Title: Plastic models
Post by: Tarmac on July 28, 2006, 02:12:48 PM: I know Revell makes/made one; I'd bet Airfix does too as they have a good lineup of German ships.
Title: Plastic models
Post by: xrtoronto on July 28, 2006, 02:18:01 PM: (http://www.bismarck-class.dk/shipmodels/german_models/pictures/grafzeppelinlavender/graf_zeppelin_lavender_01.jpg)

Jay, if you google 'graf zepplin model' you can find a bunch of leads that may help...
Title: Plastic models
Post by: BlueJ1 on July 28, 2006, 02:27:22 PM: Thanks guys.
Title: Plastic models
Post by: xrtoronto on July 28, 2006, 02:30:52 PM: Jay, I came across this...not a kit you can buy, but check out the work this guy did (very impressive):

graffzepplin (http://www.bismarck-class.dk/shipmodels/german_models/grafzeppelinliedtke.html)
Title: Plastic models
Post by: BlueJ1 on July 28, 2006, 02:33:49 PM: Wow, thats amazing. I'll use the pictures I find online to help me paint it.
Title: Plastic models
Post by: Dux on July 28, 2006, 03:22:38 PM: You know, with all the news about the Graf Zeppelin lately, I'm left wondering what aircraft would have been deployed on it.

Navalized 109s?
Title: Plastic models
Post by: BlueJ1 on July 28, 2006, 03:29:30 PM: Rocket engine aircraft? Jets?
Title: Plastic models
Post by: Tarmac on July 28, 2006, 03:35:51 PM: Quote
Originally posted by Dux
You know, with all the news about the Graf Zeppelin lately, I'm left wondering what aircraft would have been deployed on it.

Navalized 109s?

Bf 109T, a navalized version of the 109E-3. They were de-naval-ized and sent to Norway when the Graf Zeppelin was cancelled.
Title: Plastic models
Post by: BlueJ1 on July 28, 2006, 04:57:08 PM: Hmm...having trouble locating one for sale online. Gona go to my hobbystore tomorrow and ask the owner if he can find one for me.
Title: Plastic models
Post by: DiabloTX on July 28, 2006, 07:10:53 PM: Can someone explain the very odd catapults on that birdfarm?
Title: Plastic models
Post by: gunnss on July 29, 2006, 07:33:33 AM: Found this....

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060727/ap_on_re_eu/poland_graf_zeppelin

Gunns
Title: Plastic models
Post by: Furball on July 29, 2006, 07:49:24 AM: wish the germans had used it, would love to have seen the effect of a few RAF Tallboy bombs hitting a nazi carrier.
Title: Plastic models
Post by: BlueJ1 on July 29, 2006, 09:35:02 AM: I had no idea it even existed until a few days ago. I always wondered why the Nazis had never built a real fleet with a aircraft carrier.
Title: Plastic models
Post by: Widewing on July 29, 2006, 09:57:43 AM: Quote
Originally posted by BlueJ1
I had no idea it even existed until a few days ago. I always wondered why the Nazis had never built a real fleet with a aircraft carrier.

Two reasons:

Geography and the Royal Navy.

My regards,

Widewing
Title: Plastic models
Post by: BlueJ1 on July 29, 2006, 10:08:20 AM: The Royal Navy?

If I remember right they had trouble with Germany's few battleships.
Title: Plastic models
Post by: Widewing on July 29, 2006, 10:16:56 AM: Apparently, Polish divers have just found the scuttled wreck of the Graf Zeppelin. (http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,13509-2287104,00.html)

Check out the article in Der Spiegel and click on the photo gallery for some very interesting images. (http://service.spiegel.de/cache/international/0,1518,428857,00.html)

Notice: Large image files....

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c6/Graf_zeppelin_flugzeugtraeger_modell_02.jpg)

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1d/Graf_zeppelin_flugzeugtraeger_modell_01.jpg)

The 109Ts were to eventually be replaced with a highly modified derivative of the 109 airframe:
"The Messerschmitt company submitted the Me 155, which was basically a navalized Bf 109G. It had a fuselage basically similar to that of the standard Bf 109G, but with an entirely new wing. The undercarriage retracted inwards into wing wells, providing the wider track required for safe carrier landings. Standard naval equipment such as folding wings, catapult spools, and arrester hooks were fitted. The powerplant was a 1475 hp Daimler-Benz DB 605A-1 liquid-cooled engine. Armament was to be one engine-mounted 20-mm MG 151 cannon and two 20-mm MG 151 cannon and two 13-mm MG 131 machine guns in the wings. Estimated maximum speed was 403 mph."

My regards,

Widewing
Title: Plastic models
Post by: Widewing on July 29, 2006, 10:37:43 AM: Quote
Originally posted by BlueJ1
The Royal Navy?

If I remember right they had trouble with Germany's few battleships.

Not as much trouble as the Germany had with the Royal Navy.

Take some time and read about the issues that faced Germany's fleet in WWI. That experience shows that building a fleet is one thing, being able to operate it is another. Single ships, or pairs of ships can sometimes slip through a naval blockade. Thus, commerce raiders can often do some harm. However, eventually they will need to refuel, rearm and refit. Also, they will be hunted by vastly superior forces.

A carrier cannot operate alone. Moreover, it has no viable defense beyond its aircraft. Inasmuch as the Brits had many more carriers and a vast array of battleships, fast battleships, battlecruisers and cruisers, a German carrier would require a considerable force of screening warships. As well as support ships, such as oilers. Such a force WILL be detected and will not be able to avoid being engaged by any and all forces available.

The chances of such a task force sailing past Kristiansand (Norway) and not being detected by the Norwegian coast watchers was virtually nil. The Brits would have known of the task force's passage within an hour and the Royal Navy would have sortied from Scapa Flow in force, with Coastal Command and Bomber Command preparing both a search and strike missions.

My regards,

Widewing
Title: Plastic models
Post by: BlueJ1 on July 29, 2006, 10:45:36 AM: Very true. Thankyou.
Title: Plastic models
Post by: Widewing on July 29, 2006, 11:06:01 AM: By the way BlueJ1, if you don't have an American CVE in your carrier collection, Tamiya makes a nice 1/700 scale model of a Bogue class CVE, about $21 via web purchase.

(http://tamiya.com/english/waterline/img/31711_m.jpg)

My regards,

Widewing