Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: xrtoronto on August 17, 2006, 10:09:53 PM
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Do you remember where you were when O. J. Simpson was aquitted of murder charges in the criminal case?
This event ranks among the MOST shocking moments of all. I can recall exactly where I was to hear the verdict read.
Anyone have any ideas on how this all happened the way it did? Was it related to Rodney King beating? Was it the 12 dumbest jurors to ever have been picked? Was it Judge Eto's leniency over the proceedings? The glove that 'didn't' fit? Was it because of Johnnie Cochrane, "Mark Furhman is worse than Hitler". Or, does money buy 'justice'?
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I know! I was outraged, it's like the justice system didn't get the memo that he'd been convicted in the court of public opinion already and that the whole "due process" thing was just window dressing.
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Originally posted by Chairboy
I know! I was outraged, it's like the justice system didn't get the memo that he'd been convicted in the court of public opinion already and that the whole "due process" thing was just window dressing.
And all that old DNA window dressing - so gaudy. Us white guys just LOVE convicting innocent people.
That due process in the preposterous OJ trial plays as well as a refrain from "Those Were the Days."
But its always great that those who would love to see the USA crumble can never shut up. Its always easy to keep an eye on them :)
Not you Chairboy, of course, but those in media that actually affect things.
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I was in 6th grade... I had the same teacher for 3 classes, so not sure which subject it was, but I know it was Mrs. Reidy's class. They actually made an announcement over the school's PA system.
It's sad I remember that. Why couldn't I have remembered something more useful, like the capital of Botswana?
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Gaborone
Now, who's this OJ character you're all talking about?
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No, I don't remember, I was probably at work or on my way home..
OJ was not a life changing event..
Ask me where I was when Reagan was shot.. On the quad in 4th grade..
Or when Challenger Blew up... 9th grade in 2nd period Science.
Those were events.
OJ is just a blood fart.
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Strange, I was under the impression that it was the LAPD and Mark
Furman on trial. You mean they actually tried OJ too? :D
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i remember i was in a van full of hot coeds on the way to a palentology dig.
i was the only one happy about it & i couldnt contain myself (proof for me that with money you can do anything you want "to get rich is glorious!"), so i lost any chance of scoring with them.
i found a mamoth tooth that day & the best anyone else got was mouse bones & petrified owl droppings
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Originally posted by xrtoronto
Do you remember where you were when O. J. Simpson was aquitted of murder charges in the criminal case?
This event ranks among the MOST shocking moments of all. I can recall exactly where I was to hear the verdict read.
Anyone have any ideas on how this all happened the way it did? Was it related to Rodney King beating? Was it the 12 dumbest jurors to ever have been picked? Was it Judge Eto's leniency over the proceedings? The glove that 'didn't' fit? Was it because of Johnnie Cochrane, "Mark Furhman is worse than Hitler". Or, does money buy 'justice'?
I was at work. We were all so sure he'd be found guilty. It was surprising.
I think Vincent Bugliosi nailed it when he placed the blame for losing the trial squarely on the prosecution. Marcia Clark and Chris Darden dropped the ball.
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Originally posted by Debonair
i remember i was in a van full of hot coeds i lost any chance of scoring with them. the best anyone else got was mouse bones & petrified owl droppings
No, the best anyone else got was a hot co-ed... Stop trying to make your self feel good. A co-ed would have made you feel better.
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I was home during the final phases of my 6 months of chemo
With nothing better to do I followed the trial closely.
the verdict wasnt a real shock to me.
While I beleived then as I do now he was guilty as hell.
Based on the law I would have had to come down with the same verdict
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this is not a joke, i was panning for gold in the sierra nevada mountains and i walked into a resteraunt with my dad and some lady said "finally! those stupid news people can move onto something important."
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Originally posted by Sandman
I was at work. We were all so sure he'd be found guilty. It was surprising.
I think Vincent Bugliosi nailed it when he placed the blame for losing the trial squarely on the prosecution. Marcia Clark and Chris Darden dropped the ball.
I think the jury had something to do with it.
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Originally posted by lukster
I think the jury had something to do with it.
Yes but they only followed the law as it was explained to them.
The police and prosecution bungled the case throughout
From the contamination to the DNA evidence to not explaining to the jury that leather can shrink after its been wet. "If the glove doesnt fit"
Because of this. The defence was able to poke enough holes in the prosecutions case to create reasonable doubt however small.
Remember. The jury was only privy to what was shown inthe courtroom and not what was broadcast on national TV.
So there was alot that we saw in our homes and alot we heard discussed the jury wasnt able to.
Keeping that in mind. and following the law as it was explained to them. They had no alternative then to come back with the verdict they did.
I think many of the jurors beleived he was guilty also.
But they couldnt come back with a guilty verdict based on how they were allowed to rule by law
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It wasn't the trial so much but the aftermath...
All those blond people burning down the nicest sections of LA and san diego... it was horrible.
lazs
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I absolutely remember where I was. I was in Thermodynamics (I think it was Thermo, mighta been Engineering Mechanics) class at the FAMU-FSU College of Engineering. (Yup, Florida A&M and Florida State share the engineering school. One of the mission statements of the engineering college is to have 50% minorities and women, so having Florida A&M students allows the college to achieve that goal.)
Anyways, the students of one of the universities were running up and down the halls of the college, screaming wildly and cheering with joy and elation at the verdict.
That's the only reason I remember where I was.
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Originally posted by DREDIOCK
Yes but they only followed the law as it was explained to them.
Certainly that was the defense's case. I think the prosecution told them they should convict. They had and made a choice in the matter.
Presented to the jury: http://www.law.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/ftrials/Simpson/Dna.htm
Johnny Cochran proved his lack of character when he refuted dna evidence in this case yet had built other cases touting the virtue of dna evidence.
I know someone will ask for a source for my last statement so I'll be proactive here: http://www.nwitimes.com/articles/2006/08/10/news/lake_county/b49a5cb7e6841568862571c600089d87.txt
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when did that happen again?
maybe if i had a time in history it could jog a memory, but otherwise i have no clue.
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Originally posted by lazs2
All those blond people burning down the nicest sections of LA and san diego... it was horrible.
lazs
Is that kinda like all those black folks lynching the nice blonde people up until the late 1960s?
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Originally posted by lazs2
All those blond people burning down the nicest sections of LA and san diego... it was horrible.
lazs
reply Originally posted by Chairboy
Is that kinda like all those black folks lynching the nice blonde people up until the late 1960s?
Keep fanning the flames boys, helps with the understanding and healing.
I know it will take a lot more than just you two to stop the hate, but we have to start somewhere ... one person at a time ... care to be part of the solution or do you wish to remain part of the problem????
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Originally posted by MrBill
Keep fanning the flames boys, helps with the understanding and healing.
I know it will take a lot more than just you two to stop the hate, but we have to start somewhere ... one person at a time ... care to be part of the solution or do you wish to remain part of the problem????
Fair enough, I just get agitated when I see folks gloating over things like the riots because, and I'm guessing here, it validates their feelings that blacks are "inherently uncivilized" or somesuch nonsense. For some reason, it's more socially acceptable to have those thoughts about folks who are muslim too. Back in WWII, it was "the japs", as demonstrated in part by the acceptance of the internment camps for US CITIZENS who were of asian descent.
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Chairboy if you use this too much it will lose its Mint Condition status
(http://www.accesswave.ca/~thomson/Race%20Card.jpg)
Deboinar when in a van full of co-eds you will never score if you tell them you want to get rich just so you can whack blonde chicks with impunity. You tell them you are rich now, then you score.
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Pooh,
Question: When Lazs gloats about black people rioting, that's ok though?
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Originally posted by Chairboy
Pooh,
Question: When Lazs gloats about black people rioting, that's ok though?
I think he was doing more mocking than gloating. Or, he may have just been ridiculing the timidity of blondes. ;)
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From the contamination to the DNA evidence to not explaining to the jury that leather can shrink after its been wet. "If the glove doesnt fit"
Saw a forensics show on Discovery channel. The forensics expert got data on just how much shrinkage could be expected with that brand of glove. He then soaked the same brand of glove in blood and then measured how much it shrank when it dried. The amount of shrink fell within the manufacturers guidelines. IF that had been OJ's glove, it still would have fit him, albeit more tightly than it did before it shrank.
That same show showed how much of the evidence against OJ had been fabricated. IE....traces of blood preservative in the sock, blood stains on the front AND back of the sock, blood from the door of the white Bronco etc.
Amazes me how people try, convict and sentence alleged criminals in their own minds before a case even goes to court.
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I was walking by Kam's in Champaign. I stuck my head in the door and watched the verdict read on TV, then laughed my bellybutton off and went to class.
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Originally posted by Elfie
The amount of shrink fell within the manufacturers guidelines. IF that had been OJ's glove, it still would have fit him, albeit more tightly than it did before it shrank.
I watched him try on the glove. Looked like it fit to me, although tightly, and he was stretching his hand out as much as he could.
I also remember watching him lead the cops on a chase thorugh LA in his bronco. Not the sort of thing an innocent person does.
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Originally posted by lukster
I also remember watching him lead the cops on a chase thorugh LA in his bronco. Not the sort of thing an innocent person does.
Pretty liberal use of the word "chase".
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Originally posted by Chairboy
I know! I was outraged, it's like the justice system didn't get the memo that he'd been convicted in the court of public opinion already and that the whole "due process" thing was just window dressing.
Were you just as worried about Scott Peterson's bad rap?
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Originally posted by lukster
I watched him try on the glove. Looked like it fit to me, although tightly, and he was stretching his hand out as much as he could.
I also remember watching him lead the cops on a chase thorugh LA in his bronco. Not the sort of thing an innocent person does.
I too watched him try on the glove, it appeared to me that he was trying to wiggle his hand into the glove but it wouldnt go on all the way. /shrug
As far as the chase goes, stress causes us to do things we normally would not do. I'm sure murder charges or even the possibility of murder charges would cause most people tons of stress, guilty or not.
Regardless of guilt, the LAPD was very inept with the investigation imo. Ie....searching the Bronco multiple times before finding a blood spot on the outside under the door handle, searching his home multiple times before finding a sock in the middle of the floor with blood on it.
*edit* How do you stretch out your hand? You can spread your fingers and thumb, but the palm area of your hand doesnt spread out, at least I cant get mine to do that.
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Originally posted by Shifty
Were you just as worried about Scott Peterson's bad rap?
Mayhaps you read a different news story than I did, but I seem to recall he was found guilty.
Care to provide a link to the news that says he was found innocent?
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Like OJ he was found guilty by the media , and the court of public opinon before the legal system found him guilty. He didn't have a race card to play.
Personally I think he, and OJ should be cell mates.
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Originally posted by Elfie
*edit* How do you stretch out your hand? You can spread your fingers and thumb, but the palm area of your hand doesnt spread out, at least I cant get mine to do that.
Mine do. When I spread my fingers my palm expands all the way to my wrist. I can easily stretch a golf or raquetball glove by spreading my fingers.
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Originally posted by Shifty
Like OJ he was found guilty by the media , and the court of public opinon before the legal system found him guilty.
So, you're saying the media and public opinion always get it right and that it's the justice system that's vulnerable to manipulation? Ok, thanks for clarifying!
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You guys do know he was found responsible for the murders in civil court right?
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22, Nov. 1963...I was in the 5th grade when over the schools PA it was announced the Pres. Kennedy had been assassinated. Just before the morning recess, nobody played that day. I remember the silence in the playground was deafening.
9, Aug. 1974...I was measuring ingredients for a batch of dremel polishing discs at a manufacturing plant in Lindenwold, NJ. I wasn't very politcaly active nor did I care much beyond the issues surrounding the war. Shock and a feeling of 'this is a significant historical moment' is all I remember.
Those two were the ones I still remember details of until...the Challenger, I was in a darkroom processing a batch of Ektachrome I'd just shot for a breast implant print advert. I remember being stuck for 5 mins in the dark alone with my emotions. I could hear the customers and employees at the retail counter crying. I'll never forget that.
9/11/01 Unfortunatley, that ones too easy to remember because of the gravity of the situation.
There are others like the moon landing and Bobby Kennedys assassination, and even the attempt on Grorge Wallaces life, but those details are really fuzzy.
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I was tying my tie, on my way to my Godson's funeral.
He died from brain cancer
He was only 7.
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Do I remember where I was when the oj verdict was reported, nope. I figured he'd get off.
I do recall where I was when the berlin wall came down, the challenger loss and 9/11 however.
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Originally posted by lukster
You guys do know he was found responsible for the murders in civil court right?
The threshold for guilt vs innocence is FAR lower in a civil court vs a criminal court.
Imo, if you are found not guilty in a criminal court, you shouldn't then be subject to greedy relatives suing you in civil court for every penny you have.
Mine do. When I spread my fingers my palm expands all the way to my wrist. I can easily stretch a golf or raquetball glove by spreading my fingers.
I didnt understand what you were saying before, didnt really make sense to me.
I just used a tape measure to measure my palm before/after I spread my fingers. I can certainly make the base look wider by moving my thumb. About 3/8 inch wider. At the base of my fingers with my fingers spread as wide as I can, there is an increase of 3/8 inch again. The middle of my palm doesnt change at all. I think you have defective hands, better go see a doctor. :D
Seriously though, peoples perception of OJ pulling on that glove vary. You saw a man trying to make sure it didnt fit. I saw a man trying on a glove that looked 2 sizes to small. /shrug
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You saw him trying to put on a glove that had shrunk due to having gotten wet. You also saw him putting on a glove that would have fit tightly if it had not shrunk and would have fit had he not already been wearing plastic very loose fitting gloves. He had absolutely no reason to really put it on and took the oportunity to play to the cameras and put one over on the jury.
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Originally posted by Maverick
You saw him trying to put on a glove that had shrunk due to having gotten wet. You also saw him putting on a glove that would have fit tightly if it had not shrunk and would have fit had he not already been wearing plastic very loose fitting gloves. He had absolutely no reason to really put it on and took the oportunity to play to the cameras and put one over on the jury.
Read my post above about the show on Discovery channel ;)
If he was really innocent, then he had every reason to put on the glove.
The media and the coverage of the trial didnt convince me he was guilty. Not saying he is or isnt because not one of us knows if he killed Nicole and Ron, only OJ knows that for sure.
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OJ was in some kind of trouble?
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I figure it this way- he's only a few years from the day his daughter stares him coldly in the eye and states " I know exactly what you did." Nothing is going to protect him from that moment.
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Originally posted by Chairboy
So, you're saying the media and public opinion always get it right and that it's the justice system that's vulnerable to manipulation? Ok, thanks for clarifying!
I'm not saying public opinon or the media is always right. You bet your a** the justice system is vulverable , thats why you have judges legislating from the bench.
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Originally posted by BTW
I figure it this way- he's only a few years from the day his daughter stares him coldly in the eye and states " I know exactly what you did." Nothing is going to protect him from that moment.
Ooh. That gave me goosebumps. Yeah, it's innevitable.
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Yeah it might upset him enough to force him to go play another round of golf.
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Originally posted by xrtoronto
Do you remember where you were when O. J. Simpson was aquitted of murder charges in the criminal case?
hell no
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Originally posted by BTW
I figure it this way- he's only a few years from the day his daughter stares him coldly in the eye and states " I know exactly what you did." Nothing is going to protect him from that moment.
That's assuming she thinks he is guilty.
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Originally posted by Maverick
You saw him trying to put on a glove that had shrunk due to having gotten wet. You also saw him putting on a glove that would have fit tightly if it had not shrunk and would have fit had he not already been wearing plastic very loose fitting gloves. He had absolutely no reason to really put it on and took the oportunity to play to the cameras and put one over on the jury.
I remember when he put it on and it didnt fit. Even he sounded surprised it didnt fit.
And I will agree the glove didnt fit.
But also. those were driving type gloves. which typically ar a snug fit anyway. I used to have a similar pair
Wouldnt take much shrinkage for them to no longer fit at all.
Also
Is it possible he also gained weight when he was in jail?
Thus also making his hands larger? Would weight gain even do that
I know A guy who served several years in jail and he certainly came out heavier then when he went in. Is why I ask
If so.
The combination of weight gain. and the leather shrinking each by themselves. Assuming wirght gain could have that effect.
Would be more then enough for the glove to not fit
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Forget all that. Try putting a pair of driving gloves on over the top of rubber gloves. It was bull**** theatre and the defense should have called them on it.
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Originally posted by Elfie
I just used a tape measure to measure my palm before/after I spread my fingers. I can certainly make the base look wider by moving my thumb. About 3/8 inch wider. At the base of my fingers with my fingers spread as wide as I can, there is an increase of 3/8 inch again. The middle of my palm doesnt change at all. I think you have defective hands, better go see a doctor. :D
Wet leather gloves shrink considerably when they dry. Have you never worn a golf or other sport glove? Mine are always tight when I put them on but are easily stretched by "stretching" my hand.
Lotta controversy over whether the glove was planted or switched and the jury found him innocent so it's all meaningless anyhow. He will always be guilty of murder in my eyes and yes I do remember where I was when I watched the verdict read.
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Black tight fitting deer skin or goat skin leather gloves were a part of the uniform when I rode motorcycle at work. I still have one pair I use now and they shrink nicely after getting wet. They are also very hard to put on using a thin nylon (silk like) liner I have for cooler weather driving when I don't want a heavy winter glove. Like I said it was a bogus situation and I'm sure the defense team LOVED the oportunity to play a game and put it over on the jury. Keep in mind oj was an ACTOR, he's used to playing a role. He shoulda popped himself during the "chase".
Freaking waste of oxygen.
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Wet leather gloves shrink considerably when they dry.
While I do agree that leather does shrink after getting wet. The forensics expert I saw on Discovery used the same brand/style of glove that was supposedly OJ's. It was his finding that this particular brand/style of glove would still have fit OJ's hand assuming it fit in the first place. Wish I could recall the name of that show.
I also agree that wearing a rubber glove would make it more difficult to pull on a leather glove. I also found Drediock's question of weight gain interesting and a possibility
Lotta controversy over whether the glove was planted or switched and the jury found him innocent so it's all meaningless anyhow.
There is alot of controversy in the OJ case. How did the police find a knife that they tried to submit as the murder weapon AFTER going through the yard with a metal detector? How did they miss a blood spot on a WHITE vehicle multiple times? How did they miss a sock in the middle of the floor with blood on it multiple times, not to mention the blood stains on the front of the sock matched exactly to blood stains on the back of the sock. Where is the missing blood from the sample they took from OJ?
For these reasons and more, I refuse to consider OJ guilty. If new evidence arises and he is found guilty based on new evidence, then I will agree that he is guilty. Until then, only OJ knows for sure if he did in fact kill two people that night.
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And what has OJ done to find the "real" killers of his children's mother?
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Originally posted by BTW
And what has OJ done to find the "real" killers of his children's mother?
That's a question you should ask OJ, not us. ;)
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How much you wanna bet that when OJ was "trying" to put on the glove he was putting 2 fingers in one finger hole as he was pulling on the glove?
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Originally posted by Maverick
How much you wanna bet that when OJ was "trying" to put on the glove he was putting 2 fingers in one finger hole as he was pulling on the glove?
Unless you can find a video, with close ups, that is just speculation. :)
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comeon chair... you gotta admit that the riots are allways pretty darn entertaining and.... senseless. they are simply an excuse to loot and burn in every case.
I have no "hate". I simply think that it is funny and idiotic. I would have a strong dislike for any people who wanted to loot and burn in my neighborhood tho regardless of their color. I would not allow it... my neighbor would not allow it. It simply would not happen.
sooo... you wanna burn down a bunch of slums? No skin off my butt.... I find it very entertaining.
We never get any good riots around here.
lazs
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But that's not what you said. You quite clearly made it racial by sarcastically talking about "all the blonde people" rioting. I'm not tilting at windmills here, read your own message.
I think the riots were idiotic, stupid, and barbaric. What I don't think is that they somehow indicate some sort of "global truth" about people who are black.
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who said anything about global truth? Lots of poor white and mexican neighborhoods. no riots tho. draw your own conclussions. To deny that these things happen in black neighborhoods and not in white is pretty stupid.
To not see this as either trajic or funny is to not be human. To not notice that the "riots" are simply looting is naive.
I am saying that a portion of the colored population can be counted on to mask their looting with the pretense of riot.
I make no judgements as to why. Lots of reasons I suppose. None I would understand or care to. katrina made no sense to me other than barbarians looking for opportunity to loot and pillage.
So yeah.... I am making fun of the barbarians. sue me.
I am glad that you have found sweet baby jesus to guide you tho.
and comeon chair.... you don't think it is funny? You don't think the thought of blond people rioting over a verdict is funny?
Heck... we do see drunk kids rioting at sports events and such but it is to break things not to loot.
lazs
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Originally posted by Elfie
Unless you can find a video, with close ups, that is just speculation. :)
Unless you can find a video of the inside of the glove at the time he was "attempting" to put it on you cannot dispute it either.
So there. neener neener neener. :p
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Why can't I remember where I was when the OJ verdict was read?
Why can I remember where I was when the Challenger blew up?
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Originally posted by Maverick
Unless you can find a video of the inside of the glove at the time he was "attempting" to put it on you cannot dispute it either.
So there. neener neener neener. :p
Fair enough. I wasnt the one speculating in the first place though so the burden of proof doesnt lie with me, it lies with you sir. :p