Aces High Bulletin Board
Help and Support Forums => Help and Training => Topic started by: Reynolds on August 24, 2006, 01:53:14 AM
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Hey, any trainers out there good in a 109 (Preferably the E) willing to help a 'tard learn?
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And I thought id mention, offensive attacks are okay for me, but what I really need help with is defensive maneuvers.
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scissor the crap outta them.:D
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No, that normally works. Its when I have a pony or a spit at 800 meters that I die. Hes not close enought to cut throttle and scissor, but not far enough to climb. I try a climbing turn to port, but they or someone else comes in and finishes me! (Note by the time I enter the climbing turn theyve always taken out an aileron or something) I need the rapid advanced maneuvers that do NOT require FINE TUNED RUDDER MOVEMENTS. I have to say this in bold because my current joystick(s) cannot move the rudder in increments. Its all or nothing.
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was fun flying with ya last night reynolds :)
i'd be happy to try a few training sorties with you in the TA later today if you like?
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Um. Negative. Not until monday will I be near a relaible computer. Until then, i will get discoed every 3.275 minutes. And yes it was great flying with you too!
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Reynolds your not a tard(although the furball incident was funny;) ), it just takes awhile to get "good" at this game. Asking for a trainers help is a great step to take. Also you have unofficial trainers like biggles and schatzi who will help you almost, if not as much, as the trainers. You just gotta put in your time and your lumps. Heck I bet if you ever got the chance to meet up with Furball, he's help you too.
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The 109 is not an intuitive plane to learn on, especially the E. I suggest you fly the F4 or G14 for a while.
In general, though, you turn before they get to 800 (if you can). just turn high or low but not too vertical (you want it to be more of a turn than a climb or dive). Come around. You can out turn a p51 and in some circumstances spitties. It's just a matter of comfort and confidence.
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pray tell, what was 'the furball incident' ?
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Reynolds, krusty is right you have to be confident in your ride. Be aggressive, turn into the con. Turn your defensive position into and attacking one, make him react to you. Lastly never give up and concede that you going to die.
Shame about your stick hope you get a better one, it'll really help you. I would not recommend going nose high initially when you have been bounced, it'll present a large target. My preference is to go nose low, you'll increase your airspeed + his, making his shot more difficult. Then whilst performing a break turn, turn it into a barrel roll or reverse the turn into him breaking high.
Here's one of my latest films to show what i mean. I die in the end, but if my aim was a little better that day i would have shot him down. I've plenty more films if you want to view more.
109vspitty (http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/87_1156590040_109g14spitdefenceahf.ahf)
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Dueling is the best way to learn, learning on the fly in the MA isn't going to work. In the MA you'll get (at best) 1 minute of dogfighting where in the TA or the DA you'll get almost constant dogfighting with little time spent reupping and traveling back to the fight. You can use 'Fightertown' in donut almost as well, but don't expect anyone to actually help you train to kill them.
Here is a list of rules I'd strongly urge you follow.
1. Don't be afraid to die; sometimes dying is the best way to learn.
2. Record film of all your fights, including the ones you win. Just because you may have killed someone, it doesn't mean there isn't room for improvement.
3. Turn tracers off as soon as you feel comfortable with shooting down targets (this is a non priority and can wait a couple months or so).
4. Do NOT, under ANY circumstances fly with stall limiter on. You will never, ever improve and you'll find that stuff that shouldn't out turn your plane will be able to, and quite easily.
5. You can fly with combat trim, but be aware enough and often trim the plane yourself if you have free time (ie going to or from the fight).
6. Keep a good attitude, no matter how good you are eventually you will get shot down. No one is willing to teach someone who constantly flames individuals on channel 200.
7. You can always improve your acm skill, but not your attitude. Unfortunately for some of the arena the reverse is not true and more often than not as one improves the other decreases.
8. Fly one aircraft you really like (and hopefully not the Niki, La7, or Spit16) stick with until you can really rock 'n roll in it. Only then move on to another aircraft. Sticking to one aircraft will make the learning process a little easier...
I'd be willing to work with you if you want, even tho I am the worst stick in the game. I am primarily a P38 stick however, it is a great plane... easy to fly and tough to master.
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Just so ya know- If the con is behind you 800 on your FE, on his FE you are @ 400.
"Things in the mirror are closer then they appear"
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Delirium offers some excellent advice that every player, both new and veteran can benefit from.
Likewise, Thrila make some great points. Especially about turning into an enemy attack. This is a must... If at an initial disadvantage, your thoughts should never be on simply saving your skin, but rather be focused on killing the attacker. Shoot the bugger down and you haved saved your skin.
Reynolds, remember this: Always turn into an attack. Put the attacker into jeopardy immediately. Work at equalizing energy states, while conserving or banking your own E. Maintain visual contact at all times. Know the absolute limits of your fighter and that of the enemy, and have develop the skills to fly your fighter to the edge of its capability and stay on that edge forever if need be. Don't fight to the other guy's strengths, but force him to meet your strengths.
If you don't discover the enemy until he's 800 yards off of your tail, you have suffered a breakdown of your SA. Know where every enemy fighter is at all times. Learn to judge E states. Don't waste brain cells worrying about what the other guy is going to do to you. Instead, concentrate on what you are going to do to him. Let the other guy do the worrying.
Go the TA and fly duels with any veteran pilots you can find. Fight two on one, even three on one. Challenge the horde of noobs to meet you at another field and try to shoot all of them while avoiding even a single ping. It's good training for you and for the noobs as well. I prefer the TA to the DA because no time is wasted getting another plane. You fight until ammo is exhausted or one augers. Film everything.
Work with the Trainers. Badboy and Murdr as good 1v1 as any playing this game. TC, Ren, Hammer, Drano, Soda and Whels are damn good as well and all are excellent instructors.
There's also a large cadre' of excellent pilots who come to the TA to teach others or simply practice. Take any opportunity to fly with these folks, such as Creton, Sonic23 and Schatzi to name but three of the more talented pilots.
In the MA, be aggressive without being dumb. Audacity has many hidden rewards. You may never know it, but when the enemy's country text starts showing messages that state, "so-and-so is in this sector, so watch out", you've hit the big time.
Buy the best flight hardware you can afford. You will never be better than your hardware. Nothing is as good as CH Products... I've tried most of the others. Nothing else is as precise and precision is a qualitative factor that is often overlooked. The best pilots usually have the best gear.
My regards,
Widewing
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The 109E is really hard to fly in the MA since most planes you meet in the MA have more climb, firepower, speed. Also better view and handling. Some have better turn and roll, but not all.
I think when you fly with the 109E you should not be disappointed when getting shot down all the time, mostly still an achievement to survive longer than the merge.
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I dont know how, but the last day, kills in the Emil just came naturally! I know im not beyond help, but as long as I can avoid someone getting behind me, im golden. My thing is, I need people to teach me defensive maneuvers, because, I will say, I never give up. Even when I have lost a whole wing, you will still see me try to level out and RTB before I consider bailing. Ive RTBed with only one aileron and one elevator. I just need to know the maneuvers. And I have started to record engagements (But I cannot record many, my computer memory isnt enough) and I have learned a few pointers from that.
And the "Furball Incident" was that he decided that I only flew 109s because I though it was cool. He figured the only way I could prove otherwise is by fighting him. (I dont see the point in this, because regardless of WHY I fly a plane, I may still suck at it.) and of course, as I expected, I lost. But the last fight was incredibly embarassing, because I took a 109 G14 I beleive, and he owned me in a TBM.
And as far as picking one plane I love, I have done that. I have almost never flown any fighter other than the 109. While the model of 109 I chose has veried, I DID start with the G14, then went to K, then down to G-2, then E, then G-14, then K, then G-6, and now, permanently, Emil.
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Originally posted by Reynolds
I dont know how, but the last day, kills in the Emil just came naturally! I know im not beyond help, but as long as I can avoid someone getting behind me, im golden. My thing is, I need people to teach me defensive maneuvers, because, I will say, I never give up. Even when I have lost a whole wing, you will still see me try to level out and RTB before I consider bailing. Ive RTBed with only one aileron and one elevator. I just need to know the maneuvers. And I have started to record engagements (But I cannot record many, my computer memory isnt enough) and I have learned a few pointers from that.
And the "Furball Incident" was that he decided that I only flew 109s because I though it was cool. He figured the only way I could prove otherwise is by fighting him. (I dont see the point in this, because regardless of WHY I fly a plane, I may still suck at it.) and of course, as I expected, I lost. But the last fight was incredibly embarassing, because I took a 109 G14 I beleive, and he owned me in a TBM.
And as far as picking one plane I love, I have done that. I have almost never flown any fighter other than the 109. While the model of 109 I chose has veried, I DID start with the G14, then went to K, then down to G-2, then E, then G-14, then K, then G-6, and now, permanently, Emil.
Reynolds, flying the plane you love is ALWAYS ok! NEVER let anyone convince you otherwise. After all, its about having FUN what you do... not about who gets the kill.
As for Furby.... hes just a VERY good virtual pilot... no matter the plane. Keep challenging him and ASK him how he did it - hes a good guy and most times willing to help/teach. I learned a lot from him.
As for defensive maneuvers: The *best* one is your SA - never let the opponent on your tail in the first place.
Apart from that: do a search on "overshoot", "side slip", "flat scissors" "rolling scissors" and "break turn". Always keep in mind that for every move in the book, theres a counter move.
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Originally posted by Reynolds
And the "Furball Incident" was that he decided that I only flew 109s because I though it was cool. He figured the only way I could prove otherwise is by fighting him. (I dont see the point in this, because regardless of WHY I fly a plane, I may still suck at it.) and of course, as I expected, I lost. But the last fight was incredibly embarassing, because I took a 109 G14 I beleive, and he owned me in a TBM.
lol, he is an awesome pilot.
if i can give you my best piece of advice, it is to never underestimate a plane. sometimes when im bored i'll go into FT in donut in an SBD just to hear the whines 'you dweeb, using a bomber as a fighter is cheating!' :D
infact, if you ever get the chance, try a few duels in an SBD or TBM, they turn very well, and 2 50s can do more damage than you expect hehe.
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If the guy is BnZ style and gets on your 6 in a dive go full wep and dive hard. If he bites and follows you he is wasteing alt and E and once he gets 600to800 back or if you see he starts firing at you just pull up hard and immediatly go into a climbing turn. He should not be able to follow you and if he does hit you he did blacked out and is a good shot once you are 180 roll back fast and contiune on your present course. Only way he can hit ya is if he knows what your gunna do and fires blacked out which is a dang good shot :cool:. Or if you don't have enough E go into a hard flat turn as soon as he pulls lead on you. Slam hard forward on the stick and hold the Negative G turn until he i done. If performed just as you disappear under his nose for the lead shot he will miss. This is just some tactics I use against BnZ'ers. Also, if they try to manuver you into a dogfight you should be able to get on their 6 since they passed you up.
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Thanks!
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The *Best Defense*...is a good offense...and that is why SA is so very important. Pick your target, pick your fight, fight to win. Don't fly defensively...fly offensively.
Someone on this BBS once posted...." a con on your six is better than no con at all...! " This, in my opinion, is flying offensively. This requires that you have good SA, have picked your target (yes, he is behind you...you wanted him there, didn't you? If not, then he picked the fight, not you...) and you picked this particular fight...and now you are going to win by luring him in close enough to let him think he has an easy kill...and then you do all of those ACMs you think are defensive moves...to get him to co-energy states, or force the overshoot to put you on his six...and kill him. Easy? No. It takes practice to learn the timing and the manuvers. Where best to learn these skills than in the TA?
One more thing...attitude. Attack! Attack! Attack! Keep your opponent reeling from your onslaught. Make him think defense...make him think escape...make him fear you through good SA, aircraft management and a harrowing offense! Make him wonder just how the heck you did what you did when he had all of the advantage, or thought he did.
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My thing is, I seem to fly too offensively. I get so focused on bringing one guy to the ground, when the 4 others show up and start shooting...
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There's a point to break off the attack. Situational awareness helps find this point.
When you're in a slower plane, the point to break off comes sooner (as you know you'll never catch the guy anyways). If you have 1 or more cons coming in toward you and you're chasing a guy you can never catch, NOW would be the time to break off and manuver for the incoming cons. If the other guy turns back, well that's another matter. You can break, manuver, spot the other guy coming back, break manuver, repeat ad nauseum sometimes. However it's the price you pay for flying an earlier plane. You have to develop that sense that tells you when to leave the target in front of you and dodge the one behind you. Sometimes you can ignore the one behind you for just long enough to finish the kill in front of you -- but this is the advanced stage of this skill :)
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I am SSSOOOOOOOOO disappointed in myself. I have discovered the other day, after I seemed to have sudden success, that my stall limiter had somehow been turned on :cry im so upset in that I actually thought I was getting good. I am anxious to get back to my Aces High computer and try out a dogfight to see if I am just as good without stall limiter again. :cry
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You'll find that after the initial shock, you're 190% more effective as a pilot WITHOUT the stall limiter.
Trust me on this. Stall limiter actually takes the input you're giving and says "Okay, I'm going to stop working right abouuuuut... here!" and this takes away your personal control over your craft.
Once you learn how far you can push your ride, you'll be able to perfectly control it, as an extension of yourself.
With stall limiter on, you're "riding in" the plane. With it off you're "in control of" the plane.
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Yeah, i started with no stall limiter and sucked, and I still dont know how, but somehow limiter got turned on, and suddenly i ROCKED!!! But no, I turned it off as soon as I saw it.
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Originally posted by Reynolds
Yeah, i started with no stall limiter and sucked, and I still dont know how, but somehow limiter got turned on, and suddenly i ROCKED!!! But no, I turned it off as soon as I saw it.
Stall Limiter is on by default. Maybe you reinstalled the game or deleted a setting?
Any ways: Flying without stall limiter means youll have to *control* yourself and your inputs. Stall limiter smoothes out your inputs, and - if they are too abrupt or dangerous to airflow - it ignores the input.
Youll need to learn to have a "light hand" when flying. Smooth inputs, no jerky movements. I know its hard sometimes and excitement can carry you away, but its something thatll just need practice. Just always remeber: Be very gentle with that stick of yours! :D.
You can practice your maneuvering skills by flying aerobatics. Turns, loops, wingovers, straight up, stall out and catch her before you hit the gound, snap rolls (level and vertical), flying through hangars in all positions available (upright, sideways, upside down....). Be creative :).
Some times it helps a lot to fly/practice in a non-battle enviroment.
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I concur with Schatzi about flying in a non-combat environment to get to know your aircraft. And hangars are fun to fly through as well as using them to build up your SA. Try flying through a hangar and do a loop, always keeping the hangar in sight and see how many times you can loop through the same hangar without losing sight of it. It's challenging.
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Originally posted by Schatzi
flying through hangars in all positions available (upright, sideways, upside down....)
Thats my favorite defensive trick... but the enemy always flies over... :(
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Flying through hangars isn't a defensive trick. In fact it'll just get you killed. You're better off pulling a hard turn or a barrel roll or hell even a vertical yo-yo or something.
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Actually, the only time i have ever crashed flying through a VH upside down... :)