Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: AquaShrimp on August 24, 2006, 08:33:58 PM
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Lets say for a moment that extraterrestial aliens exist. Its likely that they do, simply due to the massive amount of planets in the universe. Now lets say that these aliens eventually make contact with Earth.
Its most likely that aliens would be hostile. For two reasons, the need for resources, and self preservation. Earth is very valuable due to our moderate temperature ranges. Though the aliens would likely have very advanced technology, it would still require a tremendous amount of energy to heat or cool a planet to acceptable temperatures. The aliens would most likely be heterotrophic, meaning they eat other organisms (like we do). So for their own preservation, and the cultivation of food, they would need a planet like ours.
On Earth, whenever one organism invades the territory and resources of another, violence usually arrupts. We see this happening with exotic species. But we can also look at humans. We are a sort of 'advanced alien' compared to other animals. We exploit animals that are usefull to us, and we kill those that are not.
I believe the US Airforce ran an exercise in the 90s that simulated an alien contact.
So what are your opinions on alien contact?
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I'm cool with aliens as long as we don't have to submit to anal probes
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I want to believe...
(http://img.epochtimes.com/i5/4081513341198.jpg)
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Pure speculation, I'd assume that a race that had the capability of interstellar travel would have the tools and technology to construct essentially unlimited living and food production space. The advantages of having multi-mile wide food stations that could take advantage of round the clock sunshine clustered around stars blow the uncertainty of weather on a planet out of the water. The same applies to animal husbandry, etc.
At a certain point in technological development, I imagine a planet becomes a liability for food production and living space.
Fingers are crossed hoping that the folks who get here have hit that point already. :D
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Even if the aliens are not hostile due to the need for resources or whatever. They will want nothing with us. We have little to offer to a race that has mastered space travel.
I wonder how many of :noid we'll see in this thread.
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John Varley's Steel Beach book is interesting. Humanity exists on Luna and the rest of the planets/moons in the solar system, exclusing the Jupiter system. The reason? Aliens, who they refer to as "The Invaders", came in and, without any fuss or muss, exterminated humanity and its works on Earth, almost casually, then went to Jupiter. Humanity speculates that it has something to do with the whales, and evidence suggests that The Invaders have established a colony inside of Jupiter, but at no point is there any contact. It is as if humanity is insect-like in significance to them, and that they are so far advanced as to be beyond comprehension to the humans.
There's very little chance that actual alien contact will be like Star Trek, where the major races are at about the same technology. Look at what humanity did in 65 years, from first airplane to first moon landing. Now think about how the universe is billions of years old. If one culture just develops 1% faster than another... they're at "magic" level while the next guy is still learning that the trick is to bang the rocks together.
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Originally posted by Chairboy
There's very little chance that actual alien contact will be like Star Trek, where the major races are at about the same technology. Look at what humanity did in 65 years, from first airplane to first moon landing. Now think about how the universe is billions of years old. If one culture just develops 1% faster than another... they're at "magic" level while the next guy is still learning that the trick is to bang the rocks together.
And then look the years following the moon landing. *cricket cricket*
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Casual extermination, now theres a thought.
Humans didn't give much thought to exterminating species like the dodo.
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We're , uh, I mean they're probably not hostile. ;)
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I believe Arthur C. Clark's (science fiction author/dreamer) statement that
"Any sufficiently advanced technology will be indistinguishable from magic."
i.e., that if they can get here, they would be so far advanced that we would have no clue to their technology. We would be like simple bugs to them... or less.
We may never know....
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I read an old sci-fi book called "Gentle Giants of Gannimede". I just wish I still had it so I could read it again and post the gest of what the giant aliens percieved of humans evolution. They said something to the fact that it shouldnt have happened.
Anybody else read this book?
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Originally posted by Wolf14
I read an old sci-fi book called "Gentle Giants of Gannimede". I just wish I still had it so I could read it again and post the gest of what the giant aliens percieved of humans evolution. They said something to the fact that it shouldnt have happened.
Anybody else read this book?
Was part of a series. I much enjoyed most of Hogan's books.
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One of the main needs for interstellar travel is a good source of fuel.
Rocket fuel is nice and all, but take a look at the amount of rocket fuel it takes to get the shuttle in the air. You need something more efficient and powerful.
Either we haven't found that source yet, or we don't have it.
If we don't have it, why would they come here for it?
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Originally posted by AquaShrimp
Lets say for a moment that extraterrestial aliens exist. Its likely that they do, simply due to the massive amount of planets in the universe. Now lets say that these aliens eventually make contact with Earth.
Its most likely that aliens would be hostile. For two reasons, the need for resources, and self preservation. Earth is very valuable due to our moderate temperature ranges. Though the aliens would likely have very advanced technology, it would still require a tremendous amount of energy to heat or cool a planet to acceptable temperatures. The aliens would most likely be heterotrophic, meaning they eat other organisms (like we do). So for their own preservation, and the cultivation of food, they would need a planet like ours.
On Earth, whenever one organism invades the territory and resources of another, violence usually arrupts. We see this happening with exotic species. But we can also look at humans. We are a sort of 'advanced alien' compared to other animals. We exploit animals that are usefull to us, and we kill those that are not.
I believe the US Airforce ran an exercise in the 90s that simulated an alien contact.
So what are your opinions on alien contact?
Just get through watching 'Signs' ?
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Take me take me!
(http://home.att.net/~droboogie1/ENT_Orion_Slave1.jpg)
(anyone else have a fetish for green chicks?)
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Originally posted by lasersailor184
One of the main needs for interstellar travel is a good source of fuel.
Rocket fuel is nice and all, but take a look at the amount of rocket fuel it takes to get the shuttle in the air. You need something more efficient and powerful.
Either we haven't found that source yet, or we don't have it.
If we don't have it, why would they come here for it?
One of the cool things about the Orion Project was that it could concievably have been done with relatively low-tech materials. And lots of nukes.
We would have been to Mars already if it wasn't for the environmental Nazi's who put a stop to the project...
Geeesh a little radiation fallout and everyone goes crazy...
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did you say orion?
(http://home.att.net/~droboogie1/cars/orion1.jpg)
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Ok for one just beacuse we kill every thing we don't understand, doesn't mean an alien race would, second what if they come here to be friends not strip our resources? third, what if they're friendly? I wouldn't want to make a friendly alien mad that has mastered space flight, he has probally also mastered the cosmic death ray too.
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Originally posted by Wolf14
I read an old sci-fi book called "Gentle Giants of Gannimede". I just wish I still had it so I could read it again and post the gest of what the giant aliens percieved of humans evolution. They said something to the fact that it shouldnt have happened.
Anybody else read this book?
You got me rememberin'. I never read a work of fiction twice but I did enjoy that series a lot and it's been over 20 years since I read 'em. Might just have to try readin' 'em again.
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Originally posted by Vulcan
Take me take me!
(http://home.att.net/~droboogie1/ENT_Orion_Slave1.jpg)
(anyone else have a fetish for green chicks?)
What a weirdo:rolleyes:
Got a pic of her feet?:D
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DMF, just like any other person or living being we know of, the only reason they would go somewhere else (I.E. From their planet to ours) is if they need something or hope to gain something from the connection.
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Originally posted by lasersailor184
DMF, just like any other person or living being we know of, the only reason they would go somewhere else (I.E. From their planet to ours) is if they need something or hope to gain something from the connection.
Maybe they heard we have really good beer.
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The only two probable scenarios
If ‘aliens’ are hostile, all humans will die.
If not, then they will ignore earth until we are less technologically challenged.
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Who says they have to be advanced? Maybe at the moment we are the most advanced and next in line is a caveman world. Where they are about as aware of us, as they are a zebra type animal on another continent in their world.
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(http://www.gargaro.com/webpages/mad.jpg)
"Oh, this makes me so angry - VERY, VERY ANGRY!"
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Well, what if they somehow never invented the wheel??? What if they developed everything around a... a ... SQAURE!!! :confused: :noid :O :confused: :O :noid :confused:
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If the resource they need is water, we're screwed.
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Originally posted by AquaShrimp
Its most likely that aliens would be hostile.
So you are assuming that the aliens would be human?
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Originally posted by Reynolds
Well, what if they somehow never invented the wheel??? What if they developed everything around a... a ... SQAURE!!! :confused: :noid :O :confused: :O :noid :confused:
That would make them conservative aliens! The horror :D
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lol Nils.
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Originally posted by rpm
If the resource they need is water, we're screwed.
Its a proven fact that alien dont like flouride.
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you can also poor melted lead on them and then rapidly cool them with water
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Ok... let's say that they are friendly and that we have nothing that they have any need for.....
In that case... they would avoid us because we are nothing but trouble.
If they were not friendly but we didn't have anything they needed.. they would probly introduce some bug that would kill us off just to safeguard their future
If they were unfriendly and we had something they needed they would probly introcuce some bug that would kill off humans and then take whatever it was they needed.
In my opinion.. not seeing any aliens means that they are good aliens.
If we do see em... it is probly too late and we are doomed.
lazs
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Originally posted by Wolf14
I read an old sci-fi book called "Gentle Giants of Gannimede". I just wish I still had it so I could read it again and post the gest of what the giant aliens percieved of humans evolution. They said something to the fact that it shouldnt have happened.
Anybody else read this book?
I read that one still have it pretty good book.
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I am quite convinced that somewhere out there in the universe alien life exists, maybe even intelligent life, maybe even an advanced civilisation capable of space travel.
But I doubt if we will ever meet them and I'm sure they have never visited earth. The biggest problem is getting here. Unless 'warp factor' space travel, a la Star Trek has been invented somewhere and it becomes possible to traverse the Galaxy faster than light then it will never happen.
Every science fiction story needs that fictional device to work. Alien life and science fiction began when people looked at Mars or Venus and wondered if they were similar to Earth and had people on them too. That was not the case and now we realise that any possible life is too far away to reach us or for us to reach them.
We may not be the only life in the universe but we will never meet any others that's for sure.
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The bad news is that we probably taste like chicken. :(
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Originally posted by cpxxx
IWe may not be the only life in the universe but we will never meet any others that's for sure.
Such certainty!
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Ive always thought that the faster you go in space the more dangerous even the smallest particle of debris could be. Since you cant avoid every particle especially at great speed, they would have to find a way to convert matter (the ship) into light, and travel as a beam of energy.
Then have a way of re-structuring itself back into matter. Like Brundle-fly.
If we had that technology...what else would matter? We would be gods.
UPS would be out of a job for sure!
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Bussard suggested using interstellar debris instead of fighting it. Using large nets, charged to rigidity, you project an electromagnetic field ahead of your ship in the form of a funnel. You use a scanning electron beam to charge the particles of interstellar hydrogen so they react to the magnetic field and get pulled through the funnel to the center which is an inlet to a fusion reactor. Fuse it, convert it to energy, and blast it backwards as a rocket. It's an interstellar ramjet. The faster you go, the faster you accelerate. It would significantly reduce the fuel requirements for interstellar flight, by many orders or magnitude.
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Originally posted by Chairboy
Such certainty!
What, do you think he should be open to the possibility of something for which no proof exists? ;)
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Most biologists agree that extraterrestial life exists. The questions are whether they are more than microbes, and if they use DNA for replication.
But then again, maybe humans are the most advanced life forms in the Universe. Other planets might just be waiting for us to make contact with them.
What if we found semi-intelligent sea creatures on Jupiters moon? Say they were about as smart as dolphins. Lets also say that they fed on helium 3, a very potent fuel source that would solve the Earths energy needs. Would we have any qualms about killing them? Or at least taking away all their food? Nah.
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Originally posted by lukster
What, do you think he should be open to the possibility of something for which no proof exists? ;)
religion troll! :O
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Originally posted by Squire
The bad news is that we probably taste like chicken. :(
There could be an upside.................... The aliens could taste like chicken!:aok
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in open mind is all you need and an ablity to read.
http://www.serpo.org/
http://lucianarchy.proboards21.com/index.cgi
http://rense.com/
http://www.nuforc.org/
http://www.hbccufo.org/index.php
http://www.ufoconspiracy.com/
form your own opinion but at least read on the topic and understaND THE INFO AVAILABLE.
:noid
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I remain certain that we won't be seeing aliens in my lifetime anyway. Which is as long as I care about.:p Nor will the the world end or runaway global warming end life as we know it. Jesus won't return, the rapture won't happen. Elvis is dead and we'll never find out what happened to Amelia Earhart, well ok maybe we will.: :noid
We could be hit by a rock from space though. That at least is a possibility.
It is possible that we find proof that life exist out there or at least that is used to exist out there, Seti or microbes on comets, something like that.
It is also possible we find a way of travelling in space at close to light speed. I read about a possible propulsion system in Aviation Week and Space Technology some time ago.
But no aliens, of that I'm certain.
:noid
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What about a 'Predator' type alien, who's interest in Earth was purely recreational, he came here to hunt.
No interest in destroying the planet, or obtaining food or minerals, merely a challenging safari destination for the discerning interstellar outdoorsman.
Most definately could be clased as hostile though. (To mankind at least, probably a great 'Saviour from the Sky' for several species mankind's activities are pushing to the brink of extinction.
The movies were average at best, but I find the basic concept to be a very interesting one.
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Originally posted by Bluedog
What about a 'Predator' type alien, who's interest in Earth was purely recreational, he came here to hunt.
No interest in destroying the planet, or obtaining food or minerals, merely a challenging safari destination for the discerning interstellar outdoorsman.
Most definately could be clased as hostile though. (To mankind at least, probably a great 'Saviour from the Sky' for several species mankind's activities are pushing to the brink of extinction.
The movies were average at best, but I find the basic concept to be a very interesting one.
I loved how they writers connected the predators with the aliens. I thought it was a great idea brought out in a crappy movie. Would have been better in a book.
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Chair Id think eventually you would accerlate beyond the speed it would take to perform the conversion and start colliding.
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The faster you go, the more fuel you get, the more the thrust. At some point, you probably re-shape the magnetic field to be narrower and to give you just enough fuel to overcome friction while serving as a shield to keep the rest of the monatomic hydrogen away from your hull.
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Originally posted by AquaShrimp
Lets say for a moment that extraterrestial aliens exist. Its likely that they do, simply due to the massive amount of planets in the universe. Now lets say that these aliens eventually make contact with Earth.
Its most likely that aliens would be hostile. For two reasons, the need for resources, and self preservation. Earth is very valuable due to our moderate temperature ranges. Though the aliens would likely have very advanced technology, it would still require a tremendous amount of energy to heat or cool a planet to acceptable temperatures. The aliens would most likely be heterotrophic, meaning they eat other organisms (like we do). So for their own preservation, and the cultivation of food, they would need a planet like ours.
On Earth, whenever one organism invades the territory and resources of another, violence usually arrupts. We see this happening with exotic species. But we can also look at humans. We are a sort of 'advanced alien' compared to other animals. We exploit animals that are usefull to us, and we kill those that are not.
I believe the US Airforce ran an exercise in the 90s that simulated an alien contact.
So what are your opinions on alien contact?
Wow, what an entirely invalid thread... Its all based on VERY Earth-centric assumptions (Human-centric really). Lets break it down for the garbage it really is...
Its most likely that aliens would be hostile. For two reasons, the need for resources, and self preservation. Earth is very valuable due to our moderate temperature ranges.
No... You believe they would be hostile because that is the image you believe. When was the last time you were savagely attacked by a butterfly? There are all manner of creatures right here on earth that prove you wrong and as we move out into the cosmos, there are likely a lot more.
Why do you assume they need resources? And why do you assume earth is valuable to them? Oh... Because it is valuable to YOU... I think most spacefaring species would find Jupiter a lot for valuable... Great source of fuels... Or Saturn... Or Neptune.. Earth is a freakin rock home boy, space is littered with rocks. Get over yourself.
Moderate temperatures? Come now. Again Moderate to YOU! We have organisms right here on Earth that can survive climates you can't even imagine from frigid cold to furnace heat. Why assume that Aliens like 70 degrees Fahrenheit just like you?
Though the aliens would likely have very advanced technology, it would still require a tremendous amount of energy to heat or cool a planet to acceptable temperatures.
Back the truck up home boy... Didn't you just say they liked our 'moderate temperatures'? Why do they need to heat it or cool it (assuming we are sticking with your human-centric space termites). You just said it was paradise. If they wanted hotter they could have gone to Venus... If they wanted colder, then Mars or Pluto.
See how silly you are?
The aliens would most likely be heterotrophic, meaning they eat other organisms (like we do). So for their own preservation, and the cultivation of food, they would need a planet like ours.
Really? Suppose they were like apes (pretty human like) apes only like veggies and fruit... not meat... You're projecting your self-image onto the aliens... well, i've got news for you... The aliens think you suck... They don't want to be like you. They probably eat grass and leaves. :aok
Just kidding. Look at all the species around you that dont eat meat. How can you make this assumption with a straight face?
On Earth, whenever one organism invades the territory and resources of another, violence usually arrupts.
You answered that one all on your own... ON EARTH. You don't know squad about Alpha Centuri-5.
Discussion closed. All of you humans sleep tight. My kind won't be coming to eat you any time soon, you taste way too much like dolphin... We prefer strawberries.
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Originally posted by Kurt
No... You believe they would be hostile because that is the image you believe. When was the last time you were savagely attacked by a butterfly?
Of all the species on Earth, only one is known to be capable of the most basic space flight. And it ain't butterflys, it's one of the warlike ones.
Really? Suppose they were like apes (pretty human like) apes only like veggies and fruit... not meat... You're projecting your self-image onto the aliens... well, i've got news for you... The aliens think you suck... They don't want to be like you. They probably eat grass and leaves. :aok
Just kidding. Look at all the species around you that dont eat meat. How can you make this assumption with a straight face? <<<...edit...>>> We prefer strawberries.
[/b]
organism/ [awr-guh-niz-uhm]
–noun 1. a form of life composed of mutually interdependent parts that maintain various vital processes.
2. a form of life considered as an entity; an animal, plant, fungus, protistan, or moneran.
Grass, leaves and strawberries are organisms...
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Originally posted by Holden McGroin
Of all the species on Earth, only one is known to be capable of the most basic space flight. And it ain't butterflys, it's one of the warlike ones.
Yeah, On Earth.... You see the point yet? We aint talking about Earth and none of the stuff you believe plays on this stage.
You don't know squat, I don't know squat... They could be energy beings that are only interested in solar radiation. You just don't know.
Applying human needs and values to extraterrestrials is just narrowminded and absurd.
More importantly this whole discussion is SO Earth centric that it entirely skips the notion that humans are so far beneath the understandings or cares of these creatures that they could exterminate us accidentally the same way we step on ants.
Or that humans could be a virus to them... Nothing more than a health concern that they have vaccinations for... If you want to attack this whole notion you have to be ready to accept the fact that you could just be a germ.
We kill virus by the billions daily... not out of malice.
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So you're admitting defeat on the whole strawberries - organism thing?
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Originally posted by Holden McGroin
So you're admitting defeat on the whole strawberries - organism thing?
My superiors have recommended I not respond :noid
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I'm not applying just 'human-needs' to the hypothetical aliens. I'm applying the needs to maintain life.
Kurt, the larger the organism, the more complex it is, and the less tolerance it has to extreme temperatures. For example, extremophile archae bacteria can live in 212 celsius water. But name a large organism that can. Same for colder temps.
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I saw something weird one time out walking the dog in a cornfield. Suburban area outside Montgomery back in 75 - 76. First it looked like someone dropping a match from about 30 feet away amongst the cornstalks. Then about 5 minutes later there was a bright star looking object over the field. It was close enough to where I was scared and hit the deck...even held the dog down. It approached and I shined a flashlight at it and yelled and it stopped and rapidly moved away and then went up into the night sky and into space. Watched it for 20 minutes and it turned red and then looked like any other star.
What do you suppose that was?
Les
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Tequila
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Oh well. No, wasn't drinking. Had smoked a J tho. If that was a hallucination, it was the only one of its kind I've ever had. Someone else was with me and they saw it too. Though it's probably not worth bothering with trying to prove seeing something like that, just take my word for it, that's what I saw and how I remember it. As to what it was, who knows?:D
Les
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Why cant an alien race of hot space college babes come here to earth to learn how to love
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Originally posted by Leslie
What do you suppose that was?
My favorite response to this is the following, anyone recognize it?No other object has been more misidentified as a flying saucer than the planet Venus.
Even the former leader of your United States of America, James Earl Carter Junior, thought he saw a UFO once. But it's been proven he only saw the planet Venus.
Venus was at its peak brilliance late night. You probably thought you saw something up in the sky other than Venus, but I assure you, it was Venus. Your scientists have yet to discover how neural networks create self-consciousness, let alone how the human brain processes two-dimensional retinal images into the three-dimensional phenomenon known as perception, yet you somehow brazenly declare that seeing is believing!
Your scientific illiteracy makes me shudder, and I wouldn't flaunt your ignorance by telling anyone that you saw anything last night other than the planet Venus. Because if you do, you're a dead man.
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My dad actually knew Captain Mantell, a P-51 pilot who chased either a weather balloon or the planet Venus over Kentucky. Mantell unfortunately didn't have any oxygen on his plane, and passed out at 30,000 feet while chasing this object. He subsequently crashed.
I've noticed sometimes stars or planets seem to move if I just stand there and stare at them. Its like they are moving in random directions, a few inches each way. I can definately see how, in the closing days of WW2, that B-29 gunners fired at the planet Venus when it appeared extra bright low on the horizon.
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Originally posted by AquaShrimp
I'm not applying just 'human-needs' to the hypothetical aliens. I'm applying the needs to maintain life.
Kurt, the larger the organism, the more complex it is, and the less tolerance it has to extreme temperatures. For example, extremophile archae bacteria can live in 212 celsius water. But name a large organism that can. Same for colder temps.
Why do you assume that an organism needs to be large to be spacefaring or intelligent? More Earth based assumptions it seems...
Everything we know about biology is based on one single planet. If you're going to assume there are thousands of inhabited worlds then you are going to have to assume also that our knowledge of biology represents less than 1/1000th of the possibilities.
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Missed a point I meant to make Aqua... Cold is a lot more survivable than hot, on Earth anyhow, there are many large critters that handle cold very well, polar bears, whales, penguins etc.. So the size arguement really doesn't even completely hold water right here on earth.
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"
Why do you assume that an organism needs to be large to be spacefaring or intelligent? More Earth based assumptions it seems...
"
if its not large, wheres it going to hold its brain?
if it doesnt have opposable thumbs, how the hell will it hold tools to build things?
small organisms cant explore, they move to slow. even if there were a race of einsteins, they would never figure out there planet is round, or orbits around a sun, nor would they care - they'd be to busy building weapons to defend themselves against larger animals.
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Originally posted by vorticon
if it doesnt have opposable thumbs, how the hell will it hold tools to build things?
I don't recall saying anything about who did or did not have opposable thumbs. Besides, I bet spider monkeys wonder how you do so many things without a prehensile tail...
small organisms cant explore, they move to slow. even if there were a race of einsteins, they would never figure out there planet is round, or orbits around a sun, nor would they care - they'd be to busy building weapons to defend themselves against larger animals.
A lot of assumtions based once again on the knowledge of one biosphere.
You guys simply go on and on missing the point. You just cant wrap your brains around the idea that you can't make any assumptions about what the possibilites are. Every argument every post has simply been someone using examples from Earth. Since you have no examples from elsewhere there is no way you can make a blanket statement that a brain has to be a certain size, or that a creature can only live in a certain temperature etc. You just don't know.
The only difference between what I'm saying and what you guys keep trying to prove is that I'm smart enough to understand that this is something I do not understand... It seems many of you think you understand something you do not.
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Whats wrong with using examples from Earth?
We know how the atoms go together, we know what molecules and macromolecules make up organisms capable of life.
If you believe in evolution (like I do), then life on other planets probably evolved like life on Earth. We're still playing by the same rules, just on another planet.
The aliens could either use logic or emotion when contacting earth. Logic would have them utilizing Earth for its resources. Emotion (if they even have any) may cause them to be peaceful and empathetic.
So they could see us as a : Threat, a resource, or as simple animals.
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"
You guys simply go on and on missing the point. You just cant wrap your brains around the idea that you can't make any assumptions about what the possibilites are. "
we can, all theoretical science is making assumptions. yes we there will be all sorts of stuff cropping up that we didnt even think about, but we can safely make assumptions about certain things - like the presence of opposable thumbs on anything that manages to get into space. of course, what they use as cows or whatever (if they even have "cows") could be damn near anything...
sort of like if in 1250 the british knew north america existed, they could have assumed there would be trees.
"
If you believe in evolution (like I do), then life on other planets probably evolved like life on Earth. We're still playing by the same rules, just on another planet."
similar to earth in some aspects, it'll do whatever it wants to so it will survive in the different enviroment. australia for example.
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Just for giggles, there's a way to have intelligent life without a large creature.
For example, you have single cell critters where the cell contained the equivalent to a neuron plus the basic mechanisms needed for cell life. Whenever these single cell organisms cluster together, some chemical peculiarity to their environment allows the neurons to transmit from cell to cell. Perhaps at some point, these start functioning as some sort of hive mind or massively distributed intelligence.
The more of these guys that live in a place, the smarter they are. They do all their manipulation of their environment with cilia.
This is a common excercise for science fiction writers: Figure out something that would be POSSIBLE, then work from there.
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frikkin aliens, they prolly won't learn English either:mad:
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Originally posted by Chairboy
Just for giggles, there's a way to have intelligent life without a large creature.
For example, you have single cell critters where the cell contained the equivalent to a neuron plus the basic mechanisms needed for cell life. Whenever these single cell organisms cluster together, some chemical peculiarity to their environment allows the neurons to transmit from cell to cell. Perhaps at some point, these start functioning as some sort of hive mind or massively distributed intelligence.
The more of these guys that live in a place, the smarter they are. They do all their manipulation of their environment with cilia.
This is a common excercise for science fiction writers: Figure out something that would be POSSIBLE, then work from there.
just for giggles,
it might have the potential for intelligence, but unless something in its enviroment provoked it (lets say some badass 3 cell creatures eating them) it wouldnt fulfill that potential.
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Originally posted by Chairboy
Just for giggles, there's a way to have intelligent life without a large creature.
For example, you have single cell critters where the cell contained the equivalent to a neuron plus the basic mechanisms needed for cell life. Whenever these single cell organisms cluster together, some chemical peculiarity to their environment allows the neurons to transmit from cell to cell. Perhaps at some point, these start functioning as some sort of hive mind or massively distributed intelligence.
The more of these guys that live in a place, the smarter they are. They do all their manipulation of their environment with cilia.
This is a common excercise for science fiction writers: Figure out something that would be POSSIBLE, then work from there.
I think the intardnet disproves that theory. ;)
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Originally posted by bj229r
frikkin aliens, they prolly won't learn English either:mad:
So they will be illegal alien aliens?
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I think it was Arthur C. Clarke said it best:
The answer to the question of is there other intelligent life in the universe, whether it is yes or no, is frightening.
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What exactly do we mean when we refer to the "universe" anyhow? Do we believe that is all space/matter/energy within our "realm" of existence? By realm I mean do we believe that there is a specific reality that contains our universe and only that universe. Kinda unimaginative to believe we have an even semi complete grasp on our own reality. imo.
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Originally posted by Leslie
I saw something weird one time out walking the dog in a cornfield. Suburban area outside Montgomery back in 75 - 76. First it looked like someone dropping a match from about 30 feet away amongst the cornstalks. Then about 5 minutes later there was a bright star looking object over the field. It was close enough to where I was scared and hit the deck...even held the dog down. It approached and I shined a flashlight at it and yelled and it stopped and rapidly moved away and then went up into the night sky and into space. Watched it for 20 minutes and it turned red and then looked like any other star.
What do you suppose that was?
Les
I dunno, but do you think you could get it to walk my dog too?
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Originally posted by AquaShrimp
Whats wrong with using examples from Earth?
We know how the atoms go together, we know what molecules and macromolecules make up organisms capable of life.
If you believe in evolution (like I do), then life on other planets probably evolved like life on Earth. We're still playing by the same rules, just on another planet.
The aliens could either use logic or emotion when contacting earth. Logic would have them utilizing Earth for its resources. Emotion (if they even have any) may cause them to be peaceful and empathetic.
So they could see us as a : Threat, a resource, or as simple animals.
Ok, well, if you're gonna say that my arguement is invalid because you insist that Earth Biology is the only player on the table then I guess this will remain a narrow discussion.
Your original post didn't make clear that you had the right to change the rules as we go along to maintain that your position remains the only correct answer. I think your position is weak, and I think you are making assertions about evolution on other worlds that you most certainly cannot prove.
My argument is simply that none of us really knows (that means me too). But I can't believe you can believe in life on other planets, but you still insist that only humanoid life could be spacefaring. I hope you understand that this clearly indicates your understanding of spacefaring biology proves you to be a big StarTrek fan, but not really very imaginative.
If you believe in evolution (like I do), then life on other planets probably evolved like life on Earth. We're still playing by the same rules, just on another planet.
You may believe in evolution, but if you read the real workings of the theory you'd understand that there is NO reason to assume that life would arise on another world the same as it did on Earth... For that matter, there is no reason to assume that if you cleared Earth off and started the process from a blank slate it would do the same thing again... It most certainly would not.
I think my position stands, I understand that you can not accept it. But cold hard logic says that applying the 'earth' rules of biology to the rest of the universe is absurd.
The more this discussion fails to progress because you keep dragging us back to Earth, the more I am starting to think you are one of those guys who thinks Infinity is a number.
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Originally posted by Kurt
You may believe in evolution, but if you read the real workings of the theory you'd understand that there is NO reason to assume that life would arise on another world the same as it did on Earth... For that matter, there is no reason to assume that if you cleared Earth off and started the process from a blank slate it would do the same thing again... It most certainly would not.
i don't know that it would'nt kurt. it very well might.
when you boil water...it may not have the same number of bubbles, but it pretty much boils the same, espescially when viewed under exact conditions.
something makes that water boil the same.
does the thing that makes life act the same when faced with the same specific challenges? the continents might drift differently, would it change SO much as to invent an entirely new type of life...what is the seed. where is the spark.
either way, i don't imagine that there can be any certainty in anything as fuzzy as that which is so far from tips of our noses.
always interesting to guess...
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JB88, you have the eerie ability to show up at just the wrong moment.. :rolleyes:
The post was of course directed to Aqua Shrimp... who is asserting the opposite of your opinion.
But I thank you for your apparent support :aok
Gnite all.
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well goodnight then.
;)
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Originally posted by Wolf14
I read an old sci-fi book called "Gentle Giants of Gannimede". I just wish I still had it so I could read it again and post the gest of what the giant aliens percieved of humans evolution. They said something to the fact that it shouldnt have happened.
Anybody else read this book?
Inherit the Stars, the first of the trilogy, was just made free here: http://www.baen.com/library/
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You Earthlings are such a hoot ... what makes you think we're not already here?
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Originally posted by AquaShrimp
My dad actually knew Captain Mantell, a P-51 pilot who chased either a weather balloon or the planet Venus over Kentucky. Mantell unfortunately didn't have any oxygen on his plane, and passed out at 30,000 feet while chasing this object. He subsequently crashed.
Least he wasn't chasing Uranus.
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Originally posted by Vulcan
Take me take me!
(http://home.att.net/~droboogie1/ENT_Orion_Slave1.jpg)
(anyone else have a fetish for green chicks?)
Only ones that look like that
then I dont care what color they are LOL