Aces High Bulletin Board
Help and Support Forums => Help and Training => Topic started by: SAS_KID on September 20, 2006, 08:17:18 PM
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I need someone to help me with stall fighting 38 to 38 considering Murdr and fubble have whooped me 38 to 38.:D Also, some throttale tips will be helpful since i usually can't get the right adjustment and either burn to much or not lose enough E.
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Try Delirium, he wants to train people on the P-38. See his posting under "anyone need help":)
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Seems like you mentioned 2 good ones in your post :) If you catch me at the right time....
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I asked Del to do 38 to 38 fight he turned me down.:cry
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When did I say 'no'?
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I was in TA and asked you if you wanted to do 38vs38 fight. You said no I prefer not to fight against 38's.
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ROFL! I haven't been in the TA in weeks...
Sorry, but I think you have me confused with someone else.
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Saskid that was me. Different D. I always get creamed 38 to 38 so I hate flying against them. I like to fight against dissimilar planes so I can exploit some if any advantage. Granted I'm probably getting creamed because all the guys I know who arein 38's have been flying them FOR-E-VER!!
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I used to do P-38 training in Terrific Biters - I mean, Pacific Fighters. In that game (infinitely inferior to Aces High) I was considered just about the best P-38 pilot there. In Aces High, I am nothing of the sort. But I still know my way around the airplane and would be happy to pass on everything I know.
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O ya its was the other D:O ehehehe.:D Ok next time im on i'll ask to go to TA with ya.
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Alright SAS... not sure if I'll be on much tonight, however.
Benny, I'd be more than happy to work with you anytime you want. We don't have enough P38 sticks in here...
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we do need more guru's.:p
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Originally posted by Delirium
We don't have enough P38 sticks in here...
That's because the P-38 sucks.
ack-ack
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Originally posted by Ack-Ack
That's because the P-38 sucks.
ack-ack
I disagree.
Its a very good performer for a 2 engined bomber.
:t
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What's a P38?
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Originally posted by SuperDud
What's a P38?
It's a baby B-29
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Its a twin engined bomber duh!:rolleyes:
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Originally posted by 2bighorn
It's a baby B-29
w00t!
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Originally posted by 2bighorn
It's a baby B-29
:rofl
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Originally posted by Ack-Ack
That's because the P-38 sucks.
I hear you; it's not nearly as good in the game as it was in real life (horsepower, turn radius, dive acceleration, et cetera). However, it's significantly better than the one I was stuck with in Pacific Fighters. The reason why I was considered the best P-38 pilot in that pathetic game is because the plane was so miserable that only about a half dozen pilots flew it as a fighter. But in this respectable simulator, there are many greater P-38 pilots than me. And frankly, I like it better this way. I'm with you; it would be best to have a fully accurate P-38. But that's not ever going to happen in any simulator, and you know it. This is a reasonable representation, and that's the next best thing.
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Nice fight this afternoon Aerial! >S<
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Indeed it was! I look forward to some Hurricane duels; I'm sure to learn a few things, although probably painfully.
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Originally posted by Benny Moore
Indeed it was! I look forward to some Hurricane duels; I'm sure to learn a few things, although probably painfully.
Im all sweet and harmless, dont worry ;).
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Originally posted by Benny Moore
I hear you; it's not nearly as good in the game as it was in real life (horsepower, turn radius, dive acceleration, et cetera). However, it's significantly better than the one I was stuck with in Pacific Fighters. The reason why I was considered the best P-38 pilot in that pathetic game is because the plane was so miserable that only about a half dozen pilots flew it as a fighter. But in this respectable simulator, there are many greater P-38 pilots than me. And frankly, I like it better this way. I'm with you; it would be best to have a fully accurate P-38. But that's not ever going to happen in any simulator, and you know it. This is a reasonable representation, and that's the next best thing.
According to the game the data is probably as accurate as it gets they even said some WW2 38 pilots said it was every close except for elevator response.
Also, btw Ack-Ack is possibly one of the best or the best 38 pilot in the game.
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I know it's the most accurate P-38 I've seen in a simulator, but it's still not entirely accurate. For instance, the real Lockheed P-38 could pull a whopping four thousand horsepower at war emergency settings. The United States Army Air Force simply rated it lower, at three thousand two hundred horsepower (one thousand six hundred per engine). That didn't stop the crews and pilots from using the maximum power when they needed it. While in the simulator we are limited to sixty inches of manifold pressure (60 Hg. MAP.) and three thousand revolutions per minute (3000 R.P.M.) for a total of one thousand six hundred horsepower (1600 hp.), the real P-38L was able to pull 64, 66, 70, and even 75 Hg. MAP., and 3200 R.P.M., yielding approximately 1725, 1760, 1870, and 2000 hp., respectively. We the P-38 pilots, as well as the pilots of other American fighters (the North American P-51 for one), are getting stiffed in all simulators out there. There's not a single simulator that gives American fighters their true maximum power—the ratings used by the actual ground crews and pilots—instead of their limited official rating decided by a brass hat who never flew one.
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I would'nt mind some help in the 38. From anyone who really knows how to fly it. I am not bad in it but I am not a 38 Guru either.
Dave
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Originally posted by Benny Moore
I know it's the most accurate P-38 I've seen in a simulator, but it's still not entirely accurate. For instance, the real Lockheed P-38 could pull a whopping four thousand horsepower at war emergency settings. The United States Army Air Force simply rated it lower, at three thousand two hundred horsepower (one thousand six hundred per engine). That didn't stop the crews and pilots from using the maximum power when they needed it. While in the simulator we are limited to sixty inches of manifold pressure (60 Hg. MAP.) and three thousand revolutions per minute (3000 R.P.M.) for a total of one thousand six hundred horsepower (1600 hp.), the real P-38L was able to pull 64, 66, 70, and even 75 Hg. MAP., and 3200 R.P.M., yielding approximately 1725, 1760, 1870, and 2000 hp., respectively. We the P-38 pilots, as well as the pilots of other American fighters (the North American P-51 for one), are getting stiffed in all simulators out there. There's not a single simulator that gives American fighters their true maximum power—the ratings used by the actual ground crews and pilots—instead of their limited official rating decided by a brass hat who never flew one.
But also i doubt the original had *exactly* the same horsepower left and right, 2 engines of the same build will take power settings diffrent, i eaven recall reading under certain situations they will take throttle diffrent resulting in verry bad flight characteristics. You go from idle to full and left engine hesitates.... pretty dangerous.
Also i heard the fuel consumption was higher in reality until late in 44?
So while it might be a little low power for the late p38Ls it has some other advantages in game.
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Originally posted by Schutt
You go from idle to full and left engine hesitates.... pretty dangerous.
If they want to model engine difficulties, great... just make sure they model the difficulties they had with the Nik and the 109/190 as well.
Double edged sword.
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I love the 38 and delirium has been really helping me out, thanks
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Originally posted by Schutt
while it might be a little low power for the late p38Ls it has some other advantages in game.
You call approximately 75% of true maximum power "a little low"? I see you have little love for the P-38. It is a phenomenon we P-38 people are well aquainted with, to our grief. Tell me, how would you describe your favorite airplane if it was simulated with only three fourths of its actually utilized power? Ah, no matter; I am not here to argue for the improvement of the P-38 in this fine simulator. No, I am content with the reasonably accurate representation we have. My days of using reason and evidence to urge the improvement of P-38 flight models are over, I think.
However, I must point out that you are wrong in your information. The P-38 did not normally have tendencies for the engines to be running at different power settings, as a pilot uses the manifold pressure guages and not the throttles as a reference. Manifold pressure guages do not lie. The only times at which maintaining equal output was a problem were on the takeoff run (and there the problem was the propellers, not the throttles) and when the turbochargers switched stages at a certain altitude. They did not both switch at the same time, which was a problem when flying in close formation. It caused considerable yaw which the pilot would have to correct with rudder each time one of them switched. Being two stage superchargers, this yaw would only occur twice when passing between ten thousand and fifteen thousand feet.
In addition, the Allison V-1710F-30 did not posess, as far as I know, more efficient fuel consumption than the V-1710F-17. However, the later P-38s did carry more fuel with the addition of the wing tanks, beginning with one of the middle J production blocks (I think P-38J-10-LO). The P-38L ended up with a total of approximately four hundred and twenty gallons internal (420 gal.).
Saskid, you asked about power settings. My answer to you is to never throttle back in combat unless you are going over four hundred miles per hour and cannot pull out of your dive before hitting the ground. If you need to bleed speed, simply pull back on the yoke. This is a much more efficient way of ridding yourself of excess speed. I never, ever throttle down in combat unless I am fully compressing. Even in my stall fights - especially in my stall fights - I have as much power as I can muster, and to my ears the sound of my war emergency power failing is the knell of doom. If you want some training from me, look me up in early war or the duelling room. I go by "Aerial" in game; it's short for "Aerial Target," my name from Pacific Fighters. I warn you, however, that my trial period expires in a few days, after which I shall be forced to haunt the eight player servers. I cannot and never will be able to afford a subscription.
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Well that could be an area you need to improve in, throttle control.
Yanking back on the yoke gives an enemy trailing you a pretty big target to hit, chopping throttle and some heavy rudder slowes you but doesn't give them a bigger target. After an over shoot, firewall the throttles and she'll come back to life. Its a great maneuver that works on all but the best pilots.
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Originally posted by nick172
I love the 38 and delirium has been really helping me out, thanks
That made my day, Nick, thank you. Let me know if there is anything else I can do for you...
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Originally posted by Benny Moore
If you need to bleed speed, simply pull back on the yoke. This is a much more efficient way of ridding yourself of excess speed.
In AH, the best way to rid yourself of extra speed in the P38 is as they did historically; by using cross controls- full rudder port or starboard, ailerons 30% in the opposite direction with a little positive elevator.
I fly the P38J 99% of the time and I cannot rely on dive brakes, this works and is simple enough to do.
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Originally posted by The Fugitive
chopping throttle and some heavy rudder slowes you but doesn't give them a bigger target.
I'd recommend a roll to force them to overshoot, just make sure you always have your thin side view pointed at the enemy instead of the top down aspect. Start vertical and force them to pull too much G to get a shot, this is best initiated 600-800 out. The slower you are, the easier it is for you to take advantage of this...
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I haven't touched the dive flaps in Aces High, barring my first day when I tried them out to see how they were modelled. And the only time I use cross controls to slow down is when landing. I try to never lose energy unless I trade it for a very good angle. Instead of using drag to rid myself of energy in the form of excess speed, I prefer to trade the speed for altitude. In a stall fight, I pull back on the stick until I'm at about a hundred miles per hour and slowly scissors back and forth. It usually works if my opponent and I are at the same energy state. Here's a video clip of it in action. As you can see in the video, it's not at all a good idea when there are multiple enemies, but it works very well against one.
[Link] (http://users.adelphia.net/~j.r.engdahl/josh/P-38%20Stall%20Fight,%20Maximum%20Power.ahf)
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yea i need throttale control help its either off or firewalled in a fight. Plus, in those low and slow fights is what I really need help on is flap control I usually put all or nothing. I can handle spit16's and stuf and sometimes A6M2's but those dang hurri's give me trouble.:D
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Scroll down on this thread (http://www.hitechcreations.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=185576) and read my post. I give some tips that might help you get the hang of the flaps.
ack-ack
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Fly the 38G. It's the best of the bunch :)
OK so its my favorte anyway. Turns like a dream. Obviously not as fast, but in a low and slow fight on the deck, it does wonders.
Del, despite his claims to the contrary does wonders in the J as do any number of other 38 sticks. The other reason I fly the G is they're faster then me and I can hide behind em going into the fight :)
Agree with him on slowing down. No dive brakes in my G but a little cross controlling slows it right down.
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Originally posted by Delirium
I'd recommend a roll to force them to overshoot, just make sure you always have your thin side view pointed at the enemy instead of the top down aspect. Start vertical and force them to pull too much G to get a shot, this is best initiated 600-800 out. The slower you are, the easier it is for you to take advantage of this...
Agreed, but I was just using that as an example of one use of throttle usage. There are a bazillion manuvers that use throttle usage, but I really hate to type alot :D
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What's cross controlling?
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Forgive the cut and paste..
In AH, the best way to rid yourself of extra speed in the P38 is as they did historically; by using cross controls- full rudder port or starboard, ailerons 30% in the opposite direction with a little positive or negative elevator.
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Ahh. I may already be doing that. I'll practice it.
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hey del!
thank you so much for the 38 training on thursday! although i had trouble on the convergence stuff, you still made it simple and easy to understand. you saw the 4 kills that i landed in the late war but the missed the 4 other i landed in the p38g in the early war arena. i made enough perk points that run to replace to one i lost the next sortie after i got bounced by a 15k hurri (freakin hurries). i still learned alot and i noticed a considerable difference in the handling of the p38 from the training and advice you gave me. hell, it even helped me with my 109f4 piloting. ladies and gentleman, del is a great pilot and he is great in 38, but he can teach you so much more then just the 38. the taught me the 38 and how to stay alive in it, but he also made me a better pilot in the process. del, if the Navy paid me more i would pay you for your services but for now you'll just have to settle for a couple of beer after i turn 21 .
:aok
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I am very pleased that you benefited from the time, ScorpCH... feel free to look me up again when you've had some time in the P38.
Oh, and no need to pay me anything, the fact you had fun and you're serving this country is more than enough. :)
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i would like to echo what scorpch has posted. i appreciate the time delirium has worked with me in my sad attempts on riding the lightin. back to the TA with me.
and thank you.
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Del, when you gonna give me some help? flown with you for awhile and no help for me :cry
Good to see people are taking advantage of his offer. :aok
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Killn, Ill give you the spanking you need, any day of the week...
farkin' f4u weeny. :rolleyes: :lol :D