Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: SlapShot on September 21, 2006, 10:24:50 AM
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Let's say that the arena max population is 300 in LW1 for example.
Current counts ...
Rooks have 150
Bish have 80
Knights have 70
So if I choose LW1 I am presented with a popup that provides me a selective choice to join either the Bish or the Knights ... Rooks are not available due to their superior numbers.
Would this not help some people who want to fly in that arena, who really don't care what country that they fly for and at the same time direct people to help create a balance ... if they want to fly in that particular arena ?
This would allow the arena max to be surpassed, but also persuade others to balance.
So when someone chooses the arena you do ...
If current_arena_pop >= arena_max ... display country choice panel
The country choice panel would display, in this case, Bish or Knights.
Now in the instance when all countries have equal numbers or equality in numbers with say +/- 10 people ... then the popup would not appear and they would go to the country that they last flew for in the arena.
Rooks have 110
Bish have 90
Knights have 100
This would not produce the popup and the player would just directly join the last country that they flew for.
Would this not make the joining of a particular arena fluid and dynamic and at the same time allow the population max to dynamically change if people choose to do the right thing ?
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would be nice. as long as we could add a pop-up blocker too :D
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I think that sounds great Slap, not sure how much trouble that would entail on HTC's end to create but I think it would help with the overpopulation of one side over the others.
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if you made it so a third choice would be "try another arena", it would not be so bad i think.
I think the squad I used to fly with would want to fly "together", and I am guessing with a smaller squad like that (10 players max online @ 1 time) 1 or 2 would log into another arena, mention they couldn't get into arean XXX and the others would leave and join them somewhere else
at least therotically... knowing 42 he'd be up for doing something like that... LW (luftwaffe) planes are LW planes in all arenas.
I am not speakign for him per say, but thats just a guess.
you know me personally slappy, and all I won't do is fly bish, otherwise I prefer knights, but have flown rook.
this whole thing with the arenas though does disrupt one thing... things like RJO. now some didn't like that, others did. one thing it did do was bring a the community together a bit, and helped the rooks overcome their low numbers before it was started. it is a shame soemthign like that can no longer realistically function. i kind of liked being one of the defense people in that, when the knights / bish tried to backdoor the horde there were certain people who's job it was to defend even while outnumbered the back lines.
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Originally posted by Mustaine
if you made it so a third choice would be "try another arena", it would not be so bad i think.
I think the squad I used to fly with would want to fly "together", and I am guessing with a smaller squad like that (10 players max online @ 1 time) 1 or 2 would log into another arena, mention they couldn't get into arean XXX and the others would leave and join them somewhere else
at least therotically... knowing 42 he'd be up for doing something like that... LW (luftwaffe) planes are LW planes in all arenas.
I am not speakign for him per say, but thats just a guess.
you know me personally slappy, and all I won't do is fly bish, otherwise I prefer knights, but have flown rook.
this whole thing with the arenas though does disrupt one thing... things like RJO. now some didn't like that, others did. one thing it did do was bring a the community together a bit, and helped the rooks overcome their low numbers before it was started. it is a shame soemthign like that can no longer realistically function. i kind of liked being one of the defense people in that, when the knights / bish tried to backdoor the horde there were certain people who's job it was to defend even while outnumbered the back lines.
Yup ... know you personally and had a blast with you and 42 at the con.
Well ... the idea provides "choice" ... and it's your choice to do what you or your squad wants to do. Others would also have the same choice and if the parameters of the choice(s) suited them, then they could join the arena ... else go look elsewhere at other arena choices.
What I have seen is that there are individuals (those that don't belong to squads) that want to join an arena ... but can't because the max population has been met ... this idea would allow them to join the arena ... but under certain conditions ... they would not summarily be denied like they are now.
Now ... I hope that the discussion(s) in this thread are about the merits of my idea and not what was in the past ... there are numerous threads already that are covering that subject ... this idea is trying to move towards the future and forget the past.
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Originally posted by DaPup
I think that sounds great Slap, not sure how much trouble that would entail on HTC's end to create but I think it would help with the overpopulation of one side over the others.
If HT were to think that this idea or a derivative of it is viable, then he probably wouldn't care what trouble it would entail for him coading it ... but rather would it solve a problem without causing/creating another problem.
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I'm not sure, would have to think about it some more, but creative thinking and adaptation (like you have shown) are definitely part of the solution to what so many folks see as a problem.
Speaking just for myself...I would not like to be restricted from joining any country. I would see that as what many folks who are complaining say it is, limiting my choice of playing where/what/how I want to play. As long as someone, in your scenario, is willing to suffer the ENY then who's to say they cannot join rooks?
Now of course in your scenario those already playing rooks would be penalised for the new guy joining the side with the numbers, As long as they were allowed to switch at will I would not think this to be a problem. When you land and exit your La7 and find the ENY kicked in while you were on sortie and you cannot reup in another one, you should be allowed, in my opinion, to switch sides and fly the La7 for another chesspeice.
I have heard that unlimited or loosely limited side-switching will lead to espionage, but don't kid yourself, spies are rampant already and will continue to be so even if side switching were limited to once per tour.
I don't know the solution, but I think that given enough time the current mechanics will work themselves out. I mean everything folks are complaining about, EVERYTHING that is perceived as affecting them negatively, is only doing so because of their own personal choice. If you have some sort of rabid loyalty to one of the chesspeices that prevents you from switching sides when your team outnumbers all opponents, then it is YOUR choice to only be able to fly the P40. If you are afraid to join a side that is outnumbered, or are afriad of not being on the side with numerical superiority, then it is YOUR choice to be restricted from flying the uber-ride you want.
Once it sinks in that personal choice is the root cause of all these perceived injustices I expect the whining to die down to normal levels.
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...so you were a MAW eh? that splains a lot....lol...Hubs was a BOP once too...
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Thanks for the reply Ed.
The idea revolves around "balance", which I believe from reading numerous post as of late, is what HT is trying to strive for the most, along with trying to get arenas above and beyond the CAP limit, but with control and balance.
ENY formulas and side-switching limits are still maintained as they already are, but in my example above, I believe that that Rooks would be facing an ENY restriction ... now if more people joined the arena under my conditions, the Rooks ENY restrictions would probably disappear quite quickly ... so a by-product would probably result in the ENY formula not being implemented so often or for long periods of time.
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Originally posted by DadRabit
would be nice. as long as we could add a pop-up blocker too :D
:aok :D
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Originally posted by Jackal1
:aok :D
Only a chigga-flicker would find that funny ... :p
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SlapShot:
My thoughts.
I would change one thing, I wouldn't do it only at max, but wrather anytime ENY is 5 or above.
Im fairly certain the idea would work to maintain balanced sides.
It is also more restrictive than the current system.
Im fairly sure even more would complain about it vs the current system.
One thing to rember about the ENY system.
If you rember when it was implemented, it took a while for things to balance out, I view it as a wave dampener, with the change we did last week we threw one big rock in a pool,and waves are bouncing back and forth from the sides,it is going to take a while for the waves to disipate.
I.E. Im not realy sure anything needs to change yet, just need to wait for the waves to become very small riples.
HiTech
HiTech
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Applying the logic to ENY and/or MAX ... wouldn't that make it more restrictive ?
No need to apply it to ENY. Giving people the choice to join the less populated countries would, by default, fix the ENY as numbers approached "balance".
Why would this be more restrictive ? ... One of the goals is to surpass the MAX parameter that is currently being used, which is what I have seen/hear from alot of the posts that I have read is a restriction causing much angst ... lots want into the LW arena, but are being refused because MAX has been reached ... with this, MAX can be surpassed dynamically, as long as balance (within a +/-) is maintained ... which is less restrictive I would think ... no ?
I understand the concept of the big rock in the pond thing ... as I too develop a software product and have thrown quite a few rocks too.
I didn't spend hours thinking about it ... it just hit me and considering whats going on at the moment I briefly fleshed it out as I wrote it (just like writing coad).
Maybe as the waves decrease in size, it might not be appropriate ... just trying to help.
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Yes, my only problem with the change has been the fact that when I am on LW is normally full so no choice is really available to me. I also don't care what side I am flying on or my squaddies (alot of people do) but I would have no problems joining the lower numbered side to help balance it out as long as I could get into the arena that I like.
I also agree with you HiTech that it might be best to let the "ripples" die down some before new changes are made lol.
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I can see where both HT and slap are coming from.. there needs to be some balance and it needs to be some combo of carrot/stick.
reward good behavior (change sides for balance) and punish bad (mega squad with no changing countries internal rules).
lazs
Public Relations Officer for the BK's
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Originally posted by lazs2
I can see where both HT and slap are coming from.. there needs to be some balance and it needs to be some combo of carrot/stick.
reward good behavior (change sides for balance) and punish bad (mega squad with no changing countries internal rules).
lazs
Public Relations Officer for the BK's
The idea stemmed from the angst of a hard-coded arena MAX. Current solution is when an arena is MAXed out ... another arena for the same type is created ... which usually is not populated enough to have fun (from what I have read)
So ... If I wanted to go the the EW Arena (or any arena) and the MAX had been reached and I couldn't get in ... I would be pissed and I think you might too ... but I would then maybe try another arena ... or log.
This idea allows the MAX to be dynamic ... as long as those joining the arena are will to participate in balancing the arena (carrot/stick) ... if needed. If balance is maintained within a + or - range ... then people would not need to choose ... they would enter the country they last flew for and the population would still be able to increase.
Also, if the balance in an arena is skewed ... a free by-product of this idea will also help eliminate (if active) any ENY restrictions by people joining the lesser populated countries.
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Originally posted by Mustaine
this whole thing with the arenas though does disrupt one thing... things like RJO. now some didn't like that, others did. one thing it did do was bring a the community together a bit, and helped the rooks overcome their low numbers before it was started. it is a shame soemthign like that can no longer realistically function. i kind of liked being one of the defense people in that, when the knights / bish tried to backdoor the horde there were certain people who's job it was to defend even while outnumbered the back lines.
Having been on both sides of the RJO, it seems to me that part of what was attractive was that the RJO encouraged a sense of community that was otherwise lacking, ie squads cooperating, large well organized groups (not the mindless hordes, but still not something I would like to see every 15 minutes, mind you), lots of chatter between groups that didn't often communicate. It just made the cartoon world seem a bit smaller, and a bit friendlier. Anyway, it's only my opinion, but I can't help but think there would never have been any need for something like that in a smaller arena.
The only real issue I see with slap's idea is that country changing, for balance or whatever reasons, is antithetical to many people (even I was that naive in the past, but a few tours on the other 2 chesspieces cured me of that), and I'm not sure how many would tolerate being told, effectively, that their ideas of right and wrong and fair would no longer be accepted as valid. Considering how many are upset now, I think HT's right. There would be a great deal more unhappiness than there is now.
But yeah, it would definitely force some balance, and would make some sort of adjustment to the new world a necessity, and not an option, which is one benefit of the new system over what you suggest.
Personally, I like it, but I'm a little more flexible when it comes to this type of thing. I don't care who I get to shoot at. ;)
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Hub ... people don't have a choice now if the arena is MAXed ... and it really wasn't intended to allieviate the angst that large squads have of not changing sides ... so in the long run, this idea should not piss off anymore people than are already pissed off.
What it would do is not piss off those people who don't care for what chess piece that they fly for ... just as long as they can get into the arena that they want to ... the free by-product is a balanced arena ... probably no ENY ... and the arena does not have a hard-coaded MAX.
The larger squads have to figure out what they are going to do no matter what ... the change has been made ... it's up to them to figure it out how to adapt.
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For the past year Ive been amazed at how close the 3 countries have stayed for the most part. There may be an odd night one team had 50 extra guys on, but normally they have been with 10-20.
For me, whether its my country or an enemy's, when a bunch of guys come on, its fun either trying to stop them, or working with them to do big missions.
Does this bother more people than I think it does?
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Originally posted by FiLtH
For the past year Ive been amazed at how close the 3 countries have stayed for the most part. There may be an odd night one team had 50 extra guys on, but normally they have been with 10-20.
For me, whether its my country or an enemy's, when a bunch of guys come on, its fun either trying to stop them, or working with them to do big missions.
Does this bother more people than I think it does?
It did even out for awhile but got out of hand again.
I think, and hope, that your question would/could be answered in another thread (no offense) ... I would like this thread to discuss the merits of the idea and hopefully not go off on some other tangent.
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Originally posted by SlapShot
Hub ... people don't have a choice now if the arena is MAXed ... and it really wasn't intended to allieviate the angst that large squads have of not changing sides ... so in the long run, this idea should not piss off anymore people than are already pissed off.
What it would do is not piss off those people who don't care for what chess piece that they fly for ... just as long as they can get into the arena that they want to ... the free by-product is a balanced arena ... probably no ENY ... and the arena does not have a hard-coaded MAX.
The larger squads have to figure out what they are going to do no matter what ... the change has been made ... it's up to them to figure it out how to adapt.
True enough, I guess it's a bit late to start worrying about that. I was thinking that the larger groups wouldn't be able to fly together in a particular arena as it maxes or ENY kicks in, but I guess we're already seeing people running into this with the smaller caps.
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I think that other than moderate tweaks I'm with Dale, let the hubub die to to more normal whine levels before doing anything drastic. Once TOD comes out I doubt any of the EW/MW/LW arenas will max out, at least for a while.
But...after more consideration....if you want to consider short-term fixes...maybe there could be at 100 player limit for any one team, with a 300-player cap in each arena it ensures the arena will never get maxed out AND have unbalanced teams. If there are unbalanced teams in a non-maxed arena then the players only have themselves to blame.
...just another thought.
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Originally posted by Edbert
I think that other than moderate tweaks I'm with Dale, let the hubub die to to more normal whine levels before doing anything drastic. Once TOD comes out I doubt any of the EW/MW/LW arenas will max out, at least for a while.
But...after more consideration....if you want to consider short-term fixes...maybe there could be at 100 player limit for any one team, with a 300-player cap in each arena it ensures the arena will never get maxed out AND have unbalanced teams. If there are unbalanced teams in a non-maxed arena then the players only have themselves to blame.
...just another thought.
Yours is just another angle and that is what my idea would boil down to ... even and balanced sides ... but mine differs with the addition of the MAX being dynamic and allowing it to be surpassed if balance was maintained within a range.
Object here is to let people join (balanced) arenas ... and not be shut out by a hard-coaded MAX of 300.
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Originally posted by SlapShot
Would this not help some people who want to fly in that arena, who really don't care what country that they fly for and at the same time direct people to help create a balance ... if they want to fly in that particular arena ?
Actually I kind of agree with the parameters Slap posted originally that it would be less restrictive.
You could fly in the chosen arena, but only if you're willing to pitch in to balance the numbers for at least the time limit for country switching. It would kill two birds with one stone. The issue of being locked out of a maxed arena, and the issue of number balancing. Maybe I'm missing something when considering the 'big picture', but it seems like it could quell more complaints that it would spawn.
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Originally posted by SlapShot
Let's say that the arena max population is 300 in LW1 for example.
Current counts ...
Rooks have 150
Bish have 80
Knights have 70
So if I choose LW1 I am presented with a popup that provides me a selective choice to join either the Bish or the Knights ... Rooks are not available due to their superior numbers.
Would this not help some people who want to fly in that arena, who really don't care what country that they fly for and at the same time direct people to help create a balance ... if they want to fly in that particular arena ?
This would allow the arena max to be surpassed, but also persuade others to balance.
So when someone chooses the arena you do ...
If current_arena_pop >= arena_max ... display country choice panel
The country choice panel would display, in this case, Bish or Knights.
Now in the instance when all countries have equal numbers or equality in numbers with say +/- 10 people ... then the popup would not appear and they would go to the country that they last flew for in the arena.
Rooks have 110
Bish have 90
Knights have 100
This would not produce the popup and the player would just directly join the last country that they flew for.
Would this not make the joining of a particular arena fluid and dynamic and at the same time allow the population max to dynamically change if people choose to do the right thing ?
Hmm persuade - "To induce to undertake a course of action or embrace a point of view by means of argument, reasoning, or entreaty"
Persuade my ****, it's limiting choices YET AGAIN.
Guess you won't be happy till everyone either plays the game the way YOU WANT IT. or as Laz suggests, quits.
How about HT gives you your own arena to play in (invitation only) then you don't have to slum it with us others?
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Originally posted by Kev367th
Hmm persuade - "To induce to undertake a course of action or embrace a point of view by means of argument, reasoning, or entreaty"
Persuade my ****, it's limiting choices YET AGAIN.
Guess you won't be happy till everyone either plays the game the way YOU WANT IT. or as Laz suggests, quits.
How about HT gives you your own arena to play in (invitation only) then you don't have to slum it with us others?
Please point out how its limiting choices YET AGAIN.
Currently when an arena is MAXed out ... you have no choice ... with this you do at least have a choice ... it may not be the one you want, but nevertheless it's still a choice, and when taken, it would also help balance an arena.
It's a choice that I believe that alot of people would like to have at the moment, because currently they don't have a choice. Arena MAXed ... no soup for you.
If you and all the others that all those who are holding their collective breaths and turning blue thinking that HT will undo what is done ... it ain't gonna happen.
Yeah ... it's all the BKs fault ... HT is easily led by the nose ... I can tell that you have never met with and talked to HT.
Thanks for your constructive input tho.
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Originally posted by Kev367th
Hmm persuade - "To induce to undertake a course of action or embrace a point of view by means of argument, reasoning, or entreaty"
Persuade my ****, it's limiting choices YET AGAIN.
Guess you won't be happy till everyone either plays the game the way YOU WANT IT. or as Laz suggests, quits.
How about HT gives you your own arena to play in (invitation only) then you don't have to slum it with us others?
You really should stop yer grousing and just give it a rest.
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Personally I think it takes care of 2 problems of mine right off the bat, the inability to fly in the arena of my choice and the small cap numbers.
How couldn't this only benefit everyone. It balances the arena, which HTC wants, and allows me to fly in the arena of choice, which I want. This has nothing to do with squads which is a issue I don't have so I don't see it as really limiting anything more than what is limited now.
What will happen friday and saturday night in the LW? It will max out and there will be 25-50 people in LW2, this could alleviate that problem. As arena numbers fluctuate you could always relog into the side your squad is on..
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As arena numbers fluctuate you could always relog into the side your squad is on..
Even simpler ... once inside the arena and once your 1 hour time limit is up ... you dont have to log, you just switch sides.
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Originally posted by SlapShot
Even simpler ... once inside the arena and once your 1 hour time limit is up ... you dont have to log, you just switch sides.
lol, I forgot you change in o' club
But you get the idea, numbers will change constantly and offer opportunities for everyone, after an hour, to go to another side to find friends, squaddies or just to jump into the lower players country.
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Yeah, exactly. Once you meet a few criteria, you're turned loose. Numbers get to close, someone moves to another side to wing up with friends, this creates an opening for someone else to do the same, etc. after a while, chances are you'll know most of the folks in your time slot, still get to fly with your group, or lone wolf, or whatever. Everybody gives something, and they get the same in return. Sounds awful, eh? ;)
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Originally posted by SlapShot
Please point out how its limiting choices YET AGAIN.
Currently when an arena is MAXed out ... you have no choice ... with this you do at least have a choice ... it may not be the one you want, but nevertheless it's still a choice, and when taken, it would also help balance an arena.
It's a choice that I believe that alot of people would like to have at the moment, because currently they don't have a choice. Arena MAXed ... no soup for you.
If you and all the others that all those who are holding their collective breaths and turning blue thinking that HT will undo what is done ... it ain't gonna happen.
Yeah ... it's all the BKs fault ... HT is easily led by the nose ... I can tell that you have never met with and talked to HT.
Thanks for your constructive input tho.
Think about the main criticism at the moment -
The inability to fly with your squad
Your idea would only make it worse, and has HT has pointed out lead to more 'unrest'.
Until you can accept that "a lot" of people like to fly with their squad you'll never get the gist of the whole problem.
So no I don't agree "a lot" of people would be happy with your idea, in fact I would bet more than "a lot" would be extremely unhappy.
Arena maxxed - There is a choice, your wrong, LW1, LW2 etc.
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Originally posted by Kev367th
Think about the main criticism at the moment -
The inability to fly with your squad
Your idea would only make it worse, and has HT has pointed out lead to more 'unrest'.
Until you can accept that "a lot" of people like to fly with their squad you'll never get the gist of the whole problem.
So no I don't agree "a lot" of people would be happy with your idea, in fact I would bet more than "a lot" would be extremely unhappy.
Arena maxxed - There is a choice, your wrong, LW1, LW2 etc.
Kev ... there is nothing you or anybody can tell me about flying with a squad ... I flew with one of the largest and best squads in the history of AH ... so I know all about it ...
BUT ....
there is nothing that is gonna solve ... I want to fly with my squad of 32 or more anywhere I want ... without HT reversing what he has already done ... and guess what ... if I were a betting man ... I would bet the ranch that it ain't going back to where it was.
I would also bet that my idea would make a lot of people happy. From what I have read ... LW2 ... LW3 ... some people don't like it and most hate it ... LW2 is usually the leftovers from LW1 with a max of 25 or more people ... sounds like great fun for an LW arena.
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"
The inability to fly with your squad
Your idea would only make it worse, and has HT has pointed out lead to more 'unrest'.
Until you can accept that "a lot" of people like to fly with their squad you'll never get the gist of the whole problem.
So no I don't agree "a lot" of people would be happy with your idea, in fact I would bet more than "a lot" would be extremely unhappy."
so, you'll be unable to fly on the same team as your squad for a hour...better than being stuck in a different arena waiting for someone else to log off.
"
Guess you won't be happy till everyone either plays the game the way YOU WANT IT. "
this idea doesnt make you play the game any differently, just on a different team for a hour. just think of yourself as caught behind enemy lines if it matters that much...
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One of the problems with the current setup is that the low cap numbers and the dividing of the player base among many different arenas, make it extremely difficullt to balance sides.
If a squad logs on enmasse, even a small squad of 10-15 people (About the size of the squad I belong to) it has a big impact on an arena that might only have 125 folks playing. People can change sides, but then if a squad logs off enmasse, as someone mentioned in one of the many posts on the new system, things are thrown off balance again and the people willing to switch can't do it again to immediately balance sides.
Add to that the churn factor, people logging on in hopes of finding a fight, finding that the 25 folks on side A are happily battling the 30 folks from side B with both totally ignoring the poor saps on side C, and logging off and going somewhere else in hopes of finding some action, and you can see the difficulty.
I like the idea of being able to choose your country, particularly if you could see what countries other folks who are logged in have already selected. This way you can join up with squaddies.
I also would suggest doing away with the chess piece names, coming up with something totally different, so people have no particular loyalty and might be willing to give switching sides a try.
As for waiting for the waves to settle down, I would just observe that with more than a thousand posts generated by this new system, we are not looking at "waves" but at a tsunami.
I don't know if anything can be done now to help the situation, but I don't see it ending soon.
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Why not make it simple. Say arena size is 300 for example (wish it was 350-400) just make each side have a max number of 100. If the country u want is full you either join another or wait till someone on that country logs off. Seems to be the simple solution. Is it perfect..No. But no system is.
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Originally posted by SFCHONDO
Why not make it simple. Say arena size is 300 for example (wish it was 350-400) just make each side have a max number of 100. If the country u want is full you either join another or wait till someone on that country logs off. Seems to be the simple solution. Is it perfect..No. But no system is.
Now what do you do if ALL sides are full ? ... sit and wait till someone logs and hope to hell you log in before someone steals the slot ? ... how many times will you do that before you say just F-it and turn the computer off ? ... have you ever tried to log into a popular H2H room ? ... if you have, you will know what I am talking about.
This idea would still allow you to log in.
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I also would suggest doing away with the chess piece names, coming up with something totally different, so people have no particular loyalty and might be willing to give switching sides a try.
Change the name to apples, oranges, and peaches ... you will still get someone saying ... I started as an apple and will always be an apple no matter what ... the names have nothing to do with the problem.
But what does any of this have to do with balance and arena caps and how to allieviate some of the problems that those bring to the table ?
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Here is my two cents. In another sim that I fly, my squadron when they get together, looks at the numbers and the one with the lowest numbers is the country we fly with. Since the MA is dead, country loyalty is not important anymore. The fighting is just as fun, and you get to know more people then just the ones in one country alone. Flying with squads that you've fought for years is rather fun to say the least. If squads would look at the numbers and fly that night with the few, game balance would not be a problem. Since furballing seems to be the norm now, what difference does it make? Just my two cents worth.
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I think maybe some are missing what Slap is trying to propose in it's entirety.
With his plan, the Arena "CAP" would be "fluid" so long as additional players wanting to enter would be accepting to the premise that they will be offset to one of the countries that were outnumbered at the time of their log on.
It would let the cap grow lenierly beoynd its "default cap"
His math 150 = 80 = 70 =300. the arena would be a full by a default per sey.
Now if anyone wanted to join said maxed arena…they would be allowed to only if they were willing to go to whatever country was out numbered.
I’m not sure if I am for or against the idea just yet.
I might be for it, if the logistics could be worked out.
Might be tricky.
But I think HT is prolly right. Even if it is a good idea…it prolly wouldn’t be viewed as such. Could be a bad move at the moment.
But then again, a well thought out marketing strategy could go a long ways towards it success.
hmmmmm
PS. This whole "chess peice" propaganda BS is getting really old.
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Originally posted by SlapShot
Now what do you do if ALL sides are full ? ... sit and wait till someone logs and hope to hell you log in before someone steals the slot ? ... how many times will you do that before you say just F-it and turn the computer off ? ... have you ever tried to log into a popular H2H room ? ... if you have, you will know what I am talking about.
This idea would still allow you to log in.
Whats the differance if the freaking arena is full, my way or your way....A full arena is FULL....You still have to wait. Is that really that hard to understand?
Mugzee that's all fine, but HT doesn't seem to want big arenas anymore. he wants a cap on it.
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Yeah i understand that Hondo :(
And to quote someone else
"I dont like it sir"
That being said. My reference to "Logistics" was in regards in part to Arena Caps. I still think 300 would be too low.
But all in all i think the proposed plan has some merit for the odd man out.
But i would only be hep on the idea if the arena caps were reasonable, and i think 300 for LW is unreasonable. But i dont think Slap was actually implying that 300 would be acceptable for the LW arena.
Now if the idea were to be implimented and the Cap of 300 in an arena stay in place? You would hear me screeming like i have about the current setup.
I dont care how much ridicule i may receive here by the few...They will continue to say "Paly it my way" i will continue to say "Play it my way"
But "they" cant seem to understand that it sounds no different from either side of the fench you sit on. The only real difference is that HT is basically on their side on this issue or they on his. And no HT doesnt have to Pick a side to actually be on one.
Finally i say...the idea that Slap proposes might have merit is properly implimented. We will just have to sit and watch it play out.
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Originally posted by SFCHONDO
Why not make it simple. Say arena size is 300 for example (wish it was 350-400) just make each side have a max number of 100. If the country u want is full you either join another or wait till someone on that country logs off. Seems to be the simple solution. Is it perfect..No. But no system is.
Originally posted by Edbert
...maybe there could be a 100 player limit for any one team, with a 300-player cap in each arena it ensures the arena will never get maxed out AND have unbalanced teams. If there are unbalanced teams in a non-maxed arena then the players only have themselves to blame.
:D
Edit (not directed at any individual or squad):
Ya know, back in another sim, I flew for a squad that was deep into the country loyalty thing. We flew for the glory of "Goldlandia" against the unwashed scum of the Barneys the Kermits and the Tampons, seemed fun and natural at the time, but seems really silly and downright childish now.
When we moved to AH-Beta we decided we would rotate among the chesspeices each tour, got to meet a lot of great people and squads that way. Both fighting WITH them and later AGAINST them, it was not personal...it was fun, it was not a war...it was a game. We did that for over 5 years, also found out that basically all the countries sucked, they all stole kills, they all failed to give 6 calls using you as bait, they all had fun-police on them, they all hid the carriers, they all....I digress.
Now I am in a squad where we often fly for 2 or three "countries" simultaneously, and hunt each other. Makes for some really entertaining squad nights, if we had them that is...LOL.
Bottom line here is don't get so caught up in "the war" thing, this is a game, it is only here so we can have fun while "pretend fighting" not REALLY fighting.
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that won't work with......
THE RULE
The rule says that anyone leaving the hallowed dildo shaped chess piece will be thrown from the squad in rags....
Soooo... you will still get the whines when one country has 80 players and 21 squaddies and life partners are not able to get into that arena in a clump.
lazs
Public Relations Officer for the BK's
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Originally posted by SFCHONDO
Whats the differance if the freaking arena is full, my way or your way....A full arena is FULL....You still have to wait. Is that really that hard to understand?
Mugzee that's all fine, but HT doesn't seem to want big arenas anymore. he wants a cap on it.
I guess you really aren't understanding my point ... with my idea, the arena will never be MAXed (full) and people can still get it ... if they accept the choices given to them. If they don't like the choices, then they will have to go elsewhere ... but at least those who are willing to accept the choices ... can get in.
With your idea, once the arena reaches the MAX (300 in this instance) ... no one gets in to the arena and must now choose LW2 ... which from what I have read, usually has around 25 or so players and really is no fun for those who would want to participate in an LW arena.
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Originally posted by lazs2
that won't work with......
THE RULE
The rule says that anyone leaving the hallowed dildo shaped chess piece will be thrown from the squad in rags....
Soooo... you will still get the whines when one country has 80 players and 21 squaddies and life partners are not able to get into that arena in a clump.
lazs
Public Relations Officer for the BK's
Your right ... in most instances it won't work for squads that have that "rule" ... this idea is not intended to help/save those that live by the "rule" ... it is intended to allow those who DON'T live by the "rule" the ability to get into an arena that would otherwise be closed ... if they choose to fly for one of the under-populated countries.
There is no solution, that I can think of, to alleiviate the problem of those who live by the "rule" ... why should those, who are willing to switch countries to help balance, be punished ? ... I can't think of any reason why.
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Oh.. I agree that something like this would be good gameplay... just that the tears would not stop flowing.
lazs
Public Relations Officer for the BK's
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Slap, I understood your idea. My idea (using 300 was just an example, I would rather it be a lot more) was a simple idea based on HT wanting smaller arenas. If you can have tons of people in the arena, then your idea might work. If we are stuck with 200 - 300 I think mine would be better. Just my opinion. But I have no problem with sides being unbalanced for the most part. I actually like it when my country is outnumbered. It's a war game and rearly does everyone fight at 2 bases. Even with sides totally even you will have your hordes going to undefended bases. Anyway it was just another idea thrown out there that HT won't use anyway, so don't get excited. :D
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fightertown rules :)
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Originally posted by lazs2
that won't work with......
THE RULE
The rule says that anyone leaving the hallowed dildo shaped chess piece will be thrown from the squad in rags....
Soooo... you will still get the whines when one country has 80 players and 21 squaddies and life partners are not able to get into that arena in a clump.
lazs
Public Relations Officer for the BK's
Aside from your inflamatory and baited BS remark's about a "rule". Lets get back to rational discussion.
This is about not punishing anyone for style of play, no matter how bad each side wants it to be. I also see this rule making it possible for entire squads to join an unbalanced arena. Even in Slaps example, a squad of 30 or even 40 members could all join up on one country. (Of course the code would have to try to digest the details to make it possible.
The more i think about it i am starting to see some promise to it.
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Originally posted by SFCHONDO
Even with sides totally even you will have your hordes going to undefended bases. Anyway it was just another idea thrown out there that HT won't use anyway, so don't get excited. :D
Your are very correct here. But wouldnt this be a seperate issue for HT to deal with.
I think Slaps idea adresses the "Lockout" problem that many face, better than we might realize.
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Would there need to be a threshold % of imbalance before the "Soft Caped" arena would open up for Balancing intendees?
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Originally posted by Mugzeee
Would there need to be a threshold % of imbalance before the "Soft Caped" arena would open up for Balancing intendees?
Yes ... that can be a setting. In my example, the "SoftCap" balancing doesn't kick in until the total population reaches 300 ... in theory, it could be set to any number ... higher or lower.
So ... prior to the total population reaching the MAX (in this case 300), you can go where ever your little heart "last" desired to go in that arena ...
Also, once inside the arena, if you have satisfied the time limit, you could switch sides. That means, that if I were Bish the last time I logged in, but at entry had to choose between Rooks or Knights (and I chose Rooks), as soon as I satisfy the time limit of side switching (1 hour) ... I can then jump to another country.
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Originally posted by SlapShot
Only a chigga-flicker would find that funny ... :p
I R Teh supreme Chigga Flika. :)
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Originally posted by SlapShot
I also would suggest doing away with the chess piece names, coming up with something totally different, so people have no particular loyalty and might be willing to give switching sides a try.
Beat me to it. I 100% concur. This "Chesspiece Loyalty" has outlived it's usefulness. Why should many squads shift, when other's have already stated "Nope".
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How about just 2 arenas and have them do different times and different maps each reset. Set the cap to 300 and dial down EMI. It would add an extra quark and give incentive to all, to get use to the different equipment. Perhaps even do reigns so Mid W Asia, Lat W Europe, Erl W Europe, Erl W Asia, and so on. Always a random shot and thus really mix it up. I know the equipment issues would be trouble,, they are now any way though.