Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Nash on September 29, 2006, 11:29:32 PM
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[colbert]Why do you want to destroy America?[/colbert]
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I'm sorry. I'm seeing the words on the page, all I'm reading though is:
(http://crystal.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/crybaby.jpg)
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Nash is canadian. Though it's hard for him to consider that the terrorists were going to attack him and his countrymen in toronto (believe it was toronto that the cell got nabbed, could be wrong).
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Originally posted by Nash
See Rule #4[/i]
What are you talking about?
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Habeus Corpus is the right to a trial by jury. I think he's eluding to the Torture bill being moved through right now.
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Moved through? You mean passed.
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Well, it does confirm that it was what you were talking about. But I missed the passed part.
I've been sleeping, working on projects and going to class since noon on sunday. Only occasionally does food go in anywhere there. This is my first night of rest and relaxation. I'm about to drop, gotta head to bed soon.
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Laser I was referring to the treatment of detainees....But my point is in complete correlation with the habeas corpus ruling for terrorist...We are either going to be serious about winning this war, or were just going to sit back and take it in the ***...Nash- If you really do get so worked up, and feel so sympathetic for the enemy then al qaeda was right...we are weak, and we are soft...
luckily, you live in Canada
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Amazing comments from a guy (nash) proven wrong in his comments repeatadly, who also by the way all but assured us Kerry would easily win the presidential election.
IN
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Originally posted by Dago
Amazing comments from a guy (nash) proven wrong in his comments repeatadly, who also by the way all but assured us Kerry would easily win the presidential election.
IN
As well as Rove being reaponsible for the Plame leak.
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Lol... You guys crack me up.
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Last time I checked, Habeus Corpus was for US citizens...not terrorist detainees.
What's been passed in relation to Habeus Corpus? Isit totally repealed?
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Yup. American Rights only apply to American Citizens. But some people disagree.
See Iraqi Prisoners of War
See Illegal Hispanic Crossings
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Originally posted by Nash
Lol... You guys crack me up.
That all you can say when faced with facts?
Sad.
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"American Rights"
I'm not sure I've ever heard of them....
Please, fill us in on these "American Rights."
Thanks buddy!
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Originally posted by Nash
Lol... You guys crack me up.
GET OFF THE LINE YA BIG DOPE! - Mark Levin =)
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Donzo?
Say something I'll be interested in responding to, and I'll respond to it.
In the meantime, settle down.
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Originally posted by Nash
"American Rights"
I'm not sure I've ever heard of them....
Please, fill us in on these "American Rights."
Thanks buddy!
http://www.usconstitution.net/
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Originally posted by Nash
Donzo?
Say something I'll be interested in responding to, and I'll respond to it.
In the meantime, settle down.
I did you must have missed it.
Anyway...
Habeus Corpus is an American writ that applies to Americans. We have rights here in America that apply to American citizens.
What's not to understand.
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See Rule #5
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Just wondering...
If P'sOW are held regardless of trial until the end of the conflict or a prisoner exchange is negotiated, does habeas corpus apply?
No legal proceedings are held for prisoners... no need for habeas corpus. Just declare who you have to the Red Cross and all is OK.
Perhaps that is why when word searching the 1949 Geneva convention, the words 'habeas corpus' do not appear.
I guess they are 'enemy combatants'... perhaps we should declare them P'sOW.
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Way to go Holden. You just lost them.
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Originally posted by Nash
Way to go Holden. You just lost them.
Are you on medication?
I mean, seriously.
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I PRISONER OF WAR is a detained person as defined in Articles 4 and 5 of the Geneva Convention Relative to the Treatment of Prisoners of War of August 12, 1949. In particular, one who, while engaged in combat under orders of his or her government, is captured by the armed forces of the enemy.
“Enemy combatant” is a general category that subsumes two sub-categories: lawful and unlawful combatants. See Quirin, 317 U.S. at 37-38. Lawful combatants receive prisoner of war (POW) status and the protections of the Third Geneva Convention. Unlawful combatants do not receive POW status and do not receive the full protections of the Third Geneva Convention.
The President has determined that al Qaida members are unlawful combatants because (among other reasons) they are members of a non-state actor terrorist group that does not receive the protections of the Third Geneva Convention. He additionally determined that the Taliban detainees are unlawful combatants because they do not satisfy the criteria for POW status set out in Article 4 of the Third Geneva Convention.
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Nash,
Strange you seem, okay you are?
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Originally posted by Nash
Way to go cav...you just lost me.
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Nash? Why do you through out such bold rhetoric, and then depend on others to argue for you?
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I think it would be a lot easier if we just declared them prisoners of war. As I read the GC, we could do about all that is now being done in Gitmo if they were declared P'sOW, and we would have a lot better PR in the world opinion.
That being said, did you read this?
Senate Wins Fight To Lower Allowable Amperage Levels On Detainees' Testicles
September 29, 2006
WASHINGTON, DC—Led by a bipartisan group of senators critical of White House policy on suspected terrorists, the Senate passed a bill Thursday that prohibits interrogators from exceeding 100 amps per testicle when questioning detainees. "Even in times of war, it is counterproductive and wrong to employ certain inhumane interrogation techniques, and using three-digit amperage levels on the testicles of captives constitutes torture," said Sen. John Warner (R-VA), who has also supported reducing the size of attack dogs and the height of nude pyramids. "Using amperages of 99 and lower, with approved surge protectors on the jumper-cable clamps, are the hallmarks of a civilized society." The legislation did not address amperage restrictions on suspected terrorists' labia.
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Nash, I don't know whether you can edit thread titles, but you might want to try. I'd hate to see you banned over something as useless as that. We've already lost several personalities, and it'd be a shame if this BBS were to become wholly one-sided. It's pretty clear you feel pretty strongly on this matter. Granted you can't do much good over an internet BBS, but you won't help anything if you get yourself muzzled.
I think the problem with the POW aspect is no war has been declared (that's something I'm sore about). The 'enemy combatants' seem as though they're in a sort of legal limbo, and perhaps that's not a great direction for the US to take things. We've done worse in the past, but normally we should seek to improve past mistakes, not repeat them.
The "it can't happen here" attitude, the "I've got mine so who cares about anyone who doesn't" attitude.....that stuff is endemic to the baby boomer generation. I think we're stuck with it until they finally die off in another few decades. Hopefully by then this country isn't so messed up that it can't be fixed.
J_A_B
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Doesn't it make you just cringe Holden?
Really....
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Ah so I wasn't having a nightmare or seeing things after all!
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There's a time when the best thing you can do is just fade into the background, Nash. The people that are such negative influences won't change anyway. They'll just turn every thread into... this.
So, take the intelligent conversation to that other bulletin board... the one with the "roll call" thread. This BB is a place for keeping in touch with those old faces that one likes even though one doesn't always agree. Now there are so many here that I dislike even when I do agree.
I have to take issue with your jab at Seagoon though; I find him to be one of the most well-reasoned, well-informed posters on this BB. Even though I only agree with his conclusions half of the time, I still find his posts thought provoking and worthy of discussion.
Don't let the 75% crap ruin the 25% good stuff, bud.
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Hey Tarmac - what's the other BBS?
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I think this one will suit you Nash: http://www.cpusa.org/
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Originally posted by Donzo
Last time I checked, Habeus Corpus was for US citizens...not terrorist detainees.
What's been passed in relation to Habeus Corpus? Isit totally repealed?
No, the right to writ of habeus corpus has existed in common law for centuries. It is a fundamental principle of what we consider to be just.
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You know, the roll call thread today. You post there, i lurk there and occasionally post. I hesitate to call it by name, as it's the last bastion of the non-retarded internet (well, it has one or two retards).
I'm always floored by the quality of discussion over there... so much so that I feel out of my league arguing with them about many things. But I lurk and absorb and learn... that's all I want from this whole intardnet anyhow.
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Originally posted by cav58d
See Rules ....
And the Surpreme Court of the United States has already ruled that the President's determination is a pile of ****.
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Originally posted by cav58d
See Rules......
Oh now we are talking about Ludacris? Where did that come from? WTF is the relavancy of rap and the whole hip-hop culture to this thread? Jeesis cav, you do need to get some sleep.
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Originally posted by Tarmac
You know, the roll call thread today. You post there, i lurk there and occasionally post. I hesitate to call it by name, as it's the last bastion of the non-retarded internet (well, it has one or two retards).
I'm always floored by the quality of discussion over there... so much so that I feel out of my league arguing with them about many things. But I lurk and absorb and learn... that's all I want from this whole intardnet anyhow.
Believe it not Tarmac, the -nash- over there is totally different nash that also happens to be a Canadian. No kidding.
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Nash, you're doing it too.. the reason no one thoroughly argues here, is that they don't want to. Nor do they want to get in the other arguers' shoes, to ensure they understand what those other participants' point of view really is.
It's a lot easier to see and react to what you want to see and react to, or are used to, anyway, rather than thoroughly replace everything that composes your own point of view with someone or something else's, for the duration of the argument.
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Originally posted by Thrawn
Believe it not Tarmac, the -nash- over there is totally different nash that also happens to be a Canadian. No kidding.
Yeah - that's not me.
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Originally posted by nirvana
I really just don't get your constant monitoring of American news.
The USA is to the world what California is to the USA.
I pay attention to what happens in California, because the reverb will be felt in the other 49.
Nash pays attention to the 800# gorilla next door, because it is reasonable to do so.
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Originally posted by nirvana
Totally off topic, but i've wondered this for awhile. Nash, why do you care so much about us Americans if you're living in Candyland up north there? Are you perhaps scared if the mighty Americans are defeated, you'll be next? I really just don't get your constant monitoring of American news.
Can's speak for Nash but cripes, you try living in a massively resource rich nation, next to a nuclear power, with 10x the population you do and the most powerful military in the world..
That has also recently had a penchant for starting wars for the flimsiest excuses, and is currently chocking up so much debt it won't be able buy the resources it needs to exist. And it will probably become use it or lose it time for it's military soon.
Maybe you might care if they apparently start going nuts and pissing on all the good and noble things they once stood for.
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Frequently calling people stupid does little to engender "intelligent" conversation imo.
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"The USA is to the world what California is to the USA."
That analogy might be more accurate than we like. Most of the rest of the USA thinks of California as a hive of looney self-centered cretins. Perhaps it's not inaccurate to think the world at large views the USA in a similar light.
For their part, I frequently see Cali residents say how they don't need the rest of us anyway.
J_A_B
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lukster, it takes two..
If you understand why someone calls you stupid, and point it and its relevance to the conversation in a sufficiently transparent and articulate manner, the conversation won't go stupid.
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Originally posted by Thrawn
That has also recently had a penchant for starting wars for the flimsiest excuses,
One war... one lousy little war, and now we have a penchant?
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Originally posted by Holden McGroin
The USA is to the world what California is to the USA.
I pay attention to what happens in California, because the reverb will be felt in the other 49.
Nash pays attention to the 800# gorilla next door, because it is reasonable to do so.
:furious :furious :mad: zOMG stop calling me a gorilla!!!11:mad: :mad: :furious
im a sasquatch
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omfg this flame war has turned into a napalm carpet bombing!:eek: :O :O :eek:
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Originally posted by straffo
Isn't habeas corpus suposed to be british ?
I believe it's Latin.
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Originally posted by Kurt
See Rules.....
Guess I have to disagree Kurt.....and sweeping generalizations such as this because you disagree with one Canadian kinda helps nash prove his point.
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Okay here's a new one... Now Al-Zawahri is pissed about this...
Yahoo News (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060930/ap_on_re_mi_ea/al_qaida_tape) Al-Zawahri also criticized Bush for continuing to imprison al-Qaida leaders in prisons, including al-Qaida No. 3 Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, the alleged Sept. 11 mastermind who was captured in Pakistan in March 2003.
Just where does he want us to imprison folks if not in prison? There is just no pleasing this guy....
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Originally posted by Holden McGroin
I believe it's Latin.
no it's history http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Habeas_Corpus_Act_1679
you troll !!! :)
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I dont post all that much when it comes to politics or when debates come up over the war and the like. But when people start saying
"I too get sick to the stomach when thinking about what's happening in the US now. To watch a country I admired and looked up to flush its values down the drain faster than 1930's Europe is horrible." (Sorry viking for picking your words but many many on the BBS think the same) I wonder if I am living in the same country.
I am going to use some examples here that may or will offend many but well too bad. Hunting season has or will be starting for most of us here in the USA. We are able to go out and enjoy our freedoms unlike most Europian countries that have extremly strict laws on hunting (exception is Canada).
We are all able to walk out of our homes without fearing a car bomb, or some twisted suicide bomber may take your or your families life that day.
I dont believe any of you need to stand in a food line or depend on charity workers to feed you when your hungery.
For all of you here that talk bad about what is happening to America, have you ever been in the military? Would you know how to defend this countries freedom if it slapped you in the face. I dont think so.
Being ex-military it makes me sad to know you think this way and I was one of the few who made sure that your lives were a little better.
You can talk all you want about republican this or democrate that, it boils down to doing the right thing. That is what we are doing right here right now. Trying to make the world a better place.
Most of you, and you know who you are, will laugh at this. More then likely you will say I am a blind follower of a poorly run administration. Well you know what? Your absolutly correct!!!! I believe in the direction this country is going, and I am not alone.
So before I say something I shouldnt and get Skuzzified :-) You all have a great weekend!!!
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I have no intention of joining this thread, but I just could not wrap my brain around this one :D
Originally posted by asilvia
Europian countries that have extremly strict laws on hunting (exception is Canada).
Have a nice weekend yourself :)
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What... you don't think Canada is in Europe?
Geez, Nilsen.... look at a map.
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Yeah I guess I goofed that one....but heck its 6:44am and been at work all night with no sleep the day before. Yes I know Canada is not in Europe. Like I said pick me apart!!!
:rofl :rofl :rofl
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Originally posted by Holden McGroin
What... you don't think Canada is in Europe?
Geez, Nilsen.... look at a map.
I am.. all i can find is Rook, Bish and Knit :confused:
what is this "Europe"?
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Just see the rules.....
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See Rule #4, #5, #2
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I am going to use some examples here that may or will offend many but well too bad. Hunting season has or will be starting for most of us here in the USA. We are able to go out and enjoy our freedoms unlike most Europian countries that have extremly strict laws on hunting (exception is Canada).
We are all able to walk out of our homes without fearing a car bomb, or some twisted suicide bomber may take your or your families life that day.
I dont believe any of you need to stand in a food line or depend on charity workers to feed you when your hungery.
For all of you here that talk bad about what is happening to America, have you ever been in the military? Would you know how to defend this countries freedom if it slapped you in the face. I dont think so.
You shouldn't really talk about subjects you know little to nothing about.
Example 1: in Finland, hunting is a very popular sport starting from small game up to moose and bear hunting. But to the horror of the conspiracy / gun-nut-jobs you actually have to study biology and prove you can recognize animals and pass a shooting test to prove you won't just maim your target or end up shooting the wrong species out of season. Despite that hunting is extremely popular everywhere outside the urban area.
Example 2: In many southern european countries wildlife areas are scarce and protected with little to no chance of active hunting sport. In mid and nothern europe hunting is very common and is fully allowed by the government.
Example 3: Every finnish male is obliged to serve in the army for a period of time depending on the rank you're going for. In countries like Greece or Italy for example you're obliged to serve 2-3 years - yes that's mandatory for everyone. In Switzerland each man holds and stores his assault rifle at home after service for christs sakes.
Some of you are so quick to jump into conclusions and state things with very limited knowledge.
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Originally posted by asilvia
I dont post all that much when it comes to politics or when debates come up over the war and the like. But when people start saying
"I too get sick to the stomach when thinking about what's happening in the US now. To watch a country I admired and looked up to flush its values down the drain faster than 1930's Europe is horrible." (Sorry viking for picking your words but many many on the BBS think the same) I wonder if I am living in the same country.
That's quite all right. I don't mind being quoted. :)
Originally posted by asilvia
I am going to use some examples here that may or will offend many but well too bad. Hunting season has or will be starting for most of us here in the USA. We are able to go out and enjoy our freedoms unlike most Europian countries that have extremly strict laws on hunting (exception is Canada).
I think you got the wrong idea about guns, hunting and Europe. As you might have construed from my "Location" I'm from Norway; a small country in northern Europe. I used to be an avid hunter, but now I can't really find the time for it. I sold my Mauser and gave the side-by-side 12 gauge to my dad (who still hunts despite being close to 1000 years old ;)). Now I own these guns:
(http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/1022_1159617607_photo-0004.jpg)
First I have to apologize for the bad quality of the picture; my phonecam isn't very good. Second I have to admit that the AG-3 (the assault rifle) isn't really mine, but is my service rifle. Me being in the territorial army (air force part of it), I get to keep the rifle at home between exercises. The MP-5k with the suppressor kit and the Wilson Combat in .45 APC are mine. While I can't find the time to hunt anymore I do take time to have some fun at the range. :)
Originally posted by asilvia
We are all able to walk out of our homes without fearing a car bomb, or some twisted suicide bomber may take your or your families life that day.
I dont believe any of you need to stand in a food line or depend on charity workers to feed you when your hungery.
I'm not sure I understand what you mean here.
Originally posted by asilvia
For all of you here that talk bad about what is happening to America, have you ever been in the military? Would you know how to defend this countries freedom if it slapped you in the face. I dont think so.
I'm military myself. In fact I'm one of the guys doing force protection on USAF planes when they visit the local air base here. Yup, I'm protecting your guys.
Originally posted by asilvia
Being ex-military it makes me sad to know you think this way and I was one of the few who made sure that your lives were a little better.
You can talk all you want about republican this or democrate that, it boils down to doing the right thing. That is what we are doing right here right now. Trying to make the world a better place.
"Trying" is indeed the correct word in my opinion. Some people would use the word "failing" instead.
Originally posted by asilvia
Most of you, and you know who you are, will laugh at this. More then likely you will say I am a blind follower of a poorly run administration. Well you know what? Your absolutly correct!!!! I believe in the direction this country is going, and I am not alone.
No you are not alone, and that is the disappointing part. It's also very frightening.
Originally posted by asilvia
So before I say something I shouldnt and get Skuzzified :-) You all have a great weekend!!!
You too Sir! And thank you for your thoughts. :)
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The Ragin' Canadien has returned! Welcome back Nash, tho I fear your stay with us will be brief. Where ya been?
Made the mistake of leaving my pc on last night when I went to bed. Was awakened by a lot of shouting and screeching. Said to myself, "Self...that sounds like Nash." Checked the bbs just to make sure. Yep...sho nuff.
Ya know bud, I've seen you use both reasoned debate and insults to make your point, and in my opinion you're at your best when you use the former and not the latter. I hate to see you go completely off the deep end.
In the thread about Valerie Plame you went into Johnny Storm mode, blasting anyone who opposed your viewpoint and questioning their intelligence. You got pretty ugly there my friend. Yet, later developments upheld their viewpoint and not yours.
Have you been man enough to publicly state here that you were wrong? If you did I missed it. That's the problem with taking the low-road in political discourse. One can say too much....leaving no avenue of honorable retreat.
As to the torture of detainees thing...that will be, and is in the process of being, sorted out. That's the beauty of the democratic justice system...injustices don't last long when they are exposed to the light of public scrutiny...especially when the public is made up of decent, rational people. Sakes, I hate to think how worked up you would get if we were actually cutting some heads off.
Regards, Shuckins