Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: COndor06 on October 22, 2006, 02:49:18 AM
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We were told that their would be an arena (after the last change) for all of the guys who wanted to fly in the original games traditional fashion. This was LW1. When the arena split was cut into eight different arenas did anyone at Hitech even notice that the vast majority was again flying in LW1? Why do you promote the formation of squads (which is the single most customer cohesive aspect of your game) but continue to try and control the amount of people flying in ANY arena? This isn't some unique and exciting marketing skill, it’s just ignorant. The majority of your customers subscribe to your game to fight other people. Their is no greater attraction to the game. This game is about air combat, vehicle combat, and taking other peoples bases. THATS IT. If you can't stand the heat then take up knitting. Why does Hitech ignore the facts and continue to cater to the minority who want to whine about the way in which the game (and all games on the net) were intentionally designed. Head-to-head competition. If you are looking for a flying game, purchase Microsoft Flight Sim and leave us alone. I spend my money to play the game that was sold to me in the first place. I am not interested in being nursemaided by Hitech to what they perceive to be their idea of fair, good, or dynamic game play. If you want to give the minority their own game then do it, but don't limit the number of people in the arena. We want our own arena where the best squad, the best flyers, the best teams, are the ones to beat. I am about done with flying around on a tank of fuel hoping to find a single encounter for the sake of someones idea of fair play or not being able to fly with my squad or other buddys because we have now cut the LW1 population in half. The only leapfrogging I can see is the way in which I am being told by Hitech on how, when, and where, I can fly and how many I can fly with AFTER I purchased my subscription.
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:rofl This is the best one yet.
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Originally posted by hubsonfire
:rofl This is the best one yet.
Best what?
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Havent seen the dynamic caps at work yet because in my time they are never full up anyway.....
But if lw1 reaches near capacity the cap goes up in lw2 giving a chance for squaddies to all jump in there then when that gets nearly full LW1 cap will go up allowing more people in. So i dont see how the new setup interfers with your squad.
I do hope HT adds more roster options as posted by others in a diff thread.
So you can see where your m8's are.
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If you have a large squad and want to fly in LW1, it will take you hours to get them all in. You can't all just jump everyone into LW1. You will be split up between the two arenas. If you have 200 people flying in LW (which would give you a pretty decent enemy ratio) it’s now cut in half so you have 100 in each. Maybe it's just me and I don't understand it but it is the way I see it. Am I missing something? I would like to think that I am wrong here (wouldn't be the first time) but I am frustrated on the idea of Hitech modifying the LW arena and seemingly controlling game play. As for me it just doesn't make sense and I obviously don't like the segregation. I am not (by a long shot) the best player in the house and get my arse shot off more than I land but its ok. It makes me want to fly more, try harder, and overcome the better pilots. I like to see enemy squads attacking with fifteen planes and trying to defend against it as much as I like doing it with my squad. In my humble opinion, unless Hitech expects to double their customer base, you won't see much of that kind of action again for some time now and even if you do it will only be half the LW population. Again, am I missing something? I don't see us getting our squad together for future fights in LW1 or 2 without a few hours of work.
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Originally posted by hubsonfire
:rofl This is the best one yet.
best one to happen since you have left.
wish you could have been here.
;)
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Originally posted by hubsonfire
:rofl This is the best one yet.
umm remarkable... and why was it you threw your teddy out the pram and left ?
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Originally posted by LYNX
umm remarkable... and why was it you threw your teddy out the pram and left ?
:rofl
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Maybe this will answer all your questions ... this is a post from Pyro.
Why did you make this change?
We made this change because it will allow us to support an unlimited amount of players in a much healthier online environment that gives us better long-term growth. The single MA has grown to the point of being unhealthy. This is not a subjective evaluation, it is quantifiable and they are numbers that we look at every day. It's obvious that we simply cannot keep pumping more players into a single arena without hitting a stagnation point.
Why are you doing this now?
There's a convergence of factors such as current arena health, player mass, time of year and a couple of things in the pipeline that we believe will provide an influx of players. Taken together, we believe this is the best time to make this transition.
Is this being done for technical reasons?
No. While some people on lower end machines may see some performance benefit, it's not for technical reasons that the change is being made.
This is going to fracture the community.
We disagree. Communities grow and healthy growth requires structure. Just packing in as many people as possible creates a slum, not a community. We now have multiple neighborhoods in our community, but they are all connected.
The caps need to be adjusted.
The cap numbers as well as the numbers of arenas will undergo adjustment as needed. During the transition, we feel its important not to make them too large in order to overcome habit and herding behavior. Things will change as we move through the transition period and people begin to regain their comfort level.
We need better tools to find or communicate with people across the different arenas.
We agree. We have some host side changes that will be coming out shortly that will facilitate cross arena communication and hooking up with your squad mates and we'll continue to develop more things that will help in this area.
Are you crazy?
No, we are rational and unemotional about this. We don't undertake a major change because we're masochists; we make the change because we believe that it is ultimately what's best for the game.
Why didn't you take a poll or announce it earlier?
It wouldn't be useful to us for this change. We know it's going to be controversial. The real test is not whether people think they're going to like it or dislike it, it's what happens after we make the transition and things are settled. I didn't like beer the first time I tried it but I've grown quite fond of it since then. The transition is the worst part and we have no interest in dragging that out opening up a conflict of speculation before it even starts. We ultimately have to do what we think is best for the game.
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Pyro spells lots better than Skuzzy or Hitech:aok
(As I've said in this board at least a dozen times, They WOULDN'T have made the change had they not concluded growth was stagnating---they are BUSINESS people)
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I am not a market economist, annalist, or game programmer and I am obviously not qualified to debate Hitech on their reasoning behind these changes. I am just one guy looking for a combat simulation that will give me an opportunity to do what I came here for. Fight and interact with other people. Stagnation? You have lost me here. My definition would be
100 people x A(the map size) x B(the aircraft speed) x C(the amount of bases to operate from) = Stagnation.
250-300 people. Guarantees a night of great head-to-head action with something going on all over the map. These are the nights I decide to stop at midnight but the next time I look up from my monitor, I see the sun peaking in through my door crack and my wife and kids contact Aces High Anonymous for an intervention. Then the cops show up and I barricade my door and it starts to turn into a David Koresh kind of thing but we won’t go there.
400-600 people. Starts to look like nothing more than a free for all.
Yes, I believe that there is a magic number to operate an arena from but 100-150 isn’t it. What could be unhealthy about 250 people in one arena? Its just my guess but I don’t think Hitech will double their enrollments over the next few months to produce numbers that will support two LW1 arenas with the game play we have come to expect. At the end of the day, the numbers I am seeing because of the LW1 split are 100-150. These kind of player numbers won’t keep me interested enough to continue. Just my opinion.
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I am not a market economist, annalist, or game programmer and I am obviously not qualified to debate Hitech on their reasoning behind these changes. I am just one guy looking for a combat simulation that will give me an opportunity to do what I came here for. Fight and interact with other people. Stagnation? You have lost me here. My definition would be
100 people x A(the map size) x B(the aircraft speed) x C(the amount of bases to operate from) = Stagnation.
Ok I'll buy that, you didn't get a degree in economics---you (like most folks) dont look beyond your windscreen on whatever plane you are flying, but HT is looking YEARS down the road, and NO business that doesnt increase sales continues to exist (except for US car companies)
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It was Guppy35's idea. He is single handedly ruining Aces High.
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Hmmm. Uber-Horde squad that would fill an entire arena by itself cant fly together so it has to be split up.
Sounds fair to me.
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Originally posted by Raptor
It was Guppy35's idea. He is single handedly ruining Aces High.
Agreed.
I think he admitted as much in a different thread.
- oldman (still getting a kick out of the notion that people can't find a fight when there are six people in an arena)
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Originally posted by SlapShot
Maybe this will answer all your questions ... this is a post from Pyro.
Why did you make this change?
We made this change because it will allow us to support an unlimited amount of players in a much healthier online environment that gives us better long-term growth. The single MA has grown to the point of being unhealthy. This is not a subjective evaluation, it is quantifiable and they are numbers that we look at every day. It's obvious that we simply cannot keep pumping more players into a single arena without hitting a stagnation point.
thing is though, its gone from 700 players (150ish off peak) to 200 players, and 4 players off peak (unless you are lucky to get into LW1) why did such a massive change be needed.
the 2nd change would have perhaps have been a better overall single change... create two MA's with a rolling cap.
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the 2nd change would have perhaps have been a better overall single change... create two MA's with a rolling cap.
Hindsight is 20:20.
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Bj229, Nothing personal but I am not a stockholder of Hitech. You got me figured out up front. I don’t care to do anything but look through my windscreen. You are 100% accurate in your assumption. I am nothing more than a customer and have no illusions of being anything but. The ONLY benefit I will receive from my subscription is the opportunity to play a game. I can only comment on what has happened to the game in the last few months. Hitech wanted to spread out its customer base to additional arenas for what ever reason they found may be detrimental to their bottom line, game play, ect. Ok, I’m in. But what happened? After about a week of an 8 arena format the VAST majority gravitated to what? LW1. They had to up the cap to accommodate everyone in LW1 because of the complaints of not being able to get in. Well this didn’t work out the way they thought it would so now we will divide the more popular arena to get the result we thought would be self righting in the first place. I would be willing to bet you that if Hitech created a LW1 and (for lack of a better idea) LW1 light, you will find out that, again, everyone (or the majority) will gravitate to the more populated arena. Why would Hitech make a decision to the point that they force the issue (via splitting LW1) that is contradictory to the obvious request of the majority of their customer base? Just who is paying the bill right now? The future customer base or the present. And now I am to believe that this is a marketing strategy based on corporate projections or future earnings. As we speak you have had more customers leaving than you do joining over the last several weeks. I think all this talk about projections, stagnation, long term overgrowth, and neighborhood’s is a smoke screen. I think the real problem is the cost effectiveness of expanding their current server’s, work force, tech support, customer service, ect to accommodate their current customer base and the potential of expanding. Now that is a problem I could understand and would make sense with the current changes we have seen. And you know what. That’s Ok too. If it takes more money to provide the game we want, I would be more than willing to up my subscription rate and I think the game is good enough to stand on its own even if the rate were a little more. Where could you get this much entertainment for that kind of money. Or give us an additional server for just the war mongers and let us pay the rate for our heavily populated area and let the less guns and guts guys have their own place. You could have a standard membership for what we have now or for an additional X amount you could have an Ace membership that would come with 500 perk points across the board. Then you would give the noob a free two weeks to an Ace membership before they decide what level they want. What do you think?
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S!
well said condor
S!
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Paragraphs are cool!
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:rofl
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Originally posted by SlapShot
the 2nd change would have perhaps have been a better overall single change... create two MA's with a rolling cap.
Hindsight is 20:20.
aye, and they cant go back on change1 because it would upset EW/MW guys (and rightly so)
I think the 2nd change on itself is a good one though. Really needs to be tweaked so it starts at 60 though, and not 120
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Rule #1:Do not piss off more than 50% of current customers based on a projection of what may occur in the future.
Rule #2:If you loose enough customers,you have to go back and reevaluate your projections with the current numbers,not go blindly ahead with previous projection.
Rule #3:When at some point you realize that your great idea is not working,either come up with something else or go back to what worked in the first place.
Projection:Your overall customer base is going to shrink whether you have that really bad looking add on military channel or not.
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Originally posted by HawkFive
Rule #1:Do not piss off more than 50% of current customers based on a projection of what may occur in the future.
Rule #2:If you loose enough customers,you have to go back and reevaluate your projections with the current numbers,not go blindly ahead with previous projection.
Rule #3:When at some point you realize that your great idea is not working,either come up with something else or go back to what worked in the first place.
Projection:Your overall customer base is going to shrink whether you have that really bad looking add on military channel or not.
pissing off and on your current paying, loyal customers, is not a good, hoping to get a few new players. bad business.
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Originally posted by Overlag
aye, and they cant go back on change1 because it would upset EW/MW guys (and rightly so)
I think the 2nd change on itself is a good one though. Really needs to be tweaked so it starts at 60 though, and not 120
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HT said that he is looking at lowering the percentage threshold, which I think would accomplish the same thing ... time will tell.
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Originally posted by HawkFive
Rule #1:Do not piss off more than 50% of current customers based on a projection of what may occur in the future.
Rule #2:If you loose enough customers,you have to go back and reevaluate your projections with the current numbers,not go blindly ahead with previous projection.
Rule #3:When at some point you realize that your great idea is not working,either come up with something else or go back to what worked in the first place.
Projection:Your overall customer base is going to shrink whether you have that really bad looking add on military channel or not.
lol, just leave then. quit whining and go...
if you dont want to leave, then shut up and leave the business decisions to HTC.
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i wonder how many more of these threads are gonna be put up. here's a clue.......
[SIZE=8]GET OVER IT!!![/SIZE]
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Wasn't that profound
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Originally posted by SlapShot
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HT said that he is looking at lowering the percentage threshold, which I think would accomplish the same thing ... time will tell.
lowering the percentage will just increase the 2nd arena cap earlier?
that wont really help because the "horde" will still goto 1st arena untill its full.
my reasoning on the 60-80 player start cap is that the min players never goes under 120ish??? that way at off peak you would have 2 servers, one probably full at 80, and a 2nd at 50... much better than 120 and 5?
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Originally posted by moneyguy
i wonder how many more of these threads are gonna be put up. here's a clue.......
[SIZE=8]GET OVER IT!!![/SIZE]
this sort of post is almost as bad as my whining..... :furious
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Remember what HT said not long ago...
AH is now growing fine, and in fact the totals logged on are UP, not DOWN. Last Thursday had the highest totals in 3 months, according to HT -- BETTER than before the changes you guys are saying will kill the game.
You are in the minority position. Most people are playing and having fun.
It might be wise to acknowledge the FACT that the "old way of doing things" has gone and will not be back, because this way is working better for most people. Have fun the way it is -- you guys are starting to sound like the LuftWhiners of old, right down to the conspiracy theory crap.
PS I agree that soda tastes better in glass bottles.
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Originally posted by Simaril
[B.
It might be wise to acknowledge the FACT that the "old way of doing things" has gone and will not be back, because this way is working better for most people.
[/B]
What's working better!?
in LW1--- are 90 bish/40knits/60 rooks, Bish are vulching and grab land,reset the out# team/map 3 times/day
in the same time in LW2, 30 bish /40 knits/90 rooks, rooks are vulching all fronts, reset map and out#team,3 times/day
Mw,and EW, who cares what's going on, cuz are soo unbalanced, just unplayable,
Still in LW arena can find some balanced gaming, sometimes
The "old way of doing things", is still here and it will never die unless the bases became uncapturable and war can't be won
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ghi is correct, the game hasnt, and will not change ONE bit with these changes because people will ALWAYS find the path of least resistance to take bases.
the only problem with these changes is you are so limited on where you can fly.
players PER base/sector is the exact same as it was with the large maps. now we are limited to fights over 20-40 bases, instead of over 200 different bases per map
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COndor...ever hear the expression "Wall of Text"?
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AH is now growing fine, and in fact the totals logged on are UP, not DOWN. Last Thursday had the highest totals in 3 months, according to HT -- BETTER than before the changes you guys are saying will kill the game.
There is only one problem with this, Sim.
Because of the way that HTC has been moderating the boards since the change, and the way that they've been making the changes, Not many actually take anything that HTC has said for granted. Alot of people don't even trust them much anymore(This is based on conversations heard and seen on text in-game.) Unless Dale was to make his Business data open to everyone, and you know he won't, people are gonna assume that things are actually going downhill. When you see people posting screenshots that show lower overall totals than what we used to have, that makes for more evidence contrary to what you claim.
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Wow... All of this has been going on? I guess it really was a good idea to stop making my sound packs.
Maybe I have ESP. :p
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The brainiac who did this is now the "Robert S. Mcnamara" of Aces High. My squad is fractured because of this change and squad unity is the only reason the 29 of us stay here... More than likely we will move back to Warbirds as a few others have done already.
I hope this is just a temporary illness here like the "New Coke" and other debacles and blunders throughout history.
In the past all of the people here resisted splitting arenas for the very reason i cited.
If you want to make the split work guys, this is how you do it:
Create a furball or FT arena and a GV arena. this will take those dedicated furballers out of the mix, make them happy so they can furball without fear of base capture, etc. The strict GV guys can have a tank town without bombers...
and those of us who like to win the war the way the game is designed can have the large scale battle we crave. The game (as designed) should be all about squads operating together to defend or capture bases and the greater the numbers in the arena, the more options you have to make that happen.
hey, just because i am a 'win the war' guy doesnt mean that i think you all need to play it my way. I want the furballers happy too and think they need their own arena, but not 4 arenas as they have it now. EW and MW are strictly furball arenas... LW is so restricted in numbers that I doubt seriously that you will see a 40 formation bomber mission with 25+ escorts.
I loved those missions... participating in them and defending against them! I am a FW190A8 pilot primarily, my diet consists of B17s, B24s and Lancs for the most part... The changes to the game are starving me! In LW the focus is primarily on the fighter because of LOW numbers, it's a question of survival, today I saw ONE decent bomber raid - 5 formations sadly i was unprepared for them because my A8 is so terribly outclassed in the LW arena I had to opt for a faster, lighter armed plane.
If we are going to split the community then lets do it according to player style and not through such drastic, unnecessary means. For those who are marching in lockstep with anything coming out of grapevine, you know who you are, consider my points on this... If you have made a decision to divide us then why not split us based on player style and preference rather than force us to fly without all of our friends who want to play the way we do? I like this game BECAUSE of my SQUAD... we liked the game as a group because of the large numbers in the arena. As the game is set up now, it is very dull by comparison with gameplay a few months ago.
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short term you are going to have larger numbers because of curiosity and people are going to try all of the arenas... long term splits like this that are forced are bad.
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Relax already... Have fun... don't worry... BE HAPPY! CT will be out (sometime this millenium)
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I have no desire to play CT either LOL. I work for a living, I don't want to login to a game and be told to go bomb an aspirin factory 6 sectors away with half a dozen waypoints... no thanks... I want to login, talk to my squaddies.... maybe make a little trouble somewhere and then call it a night.
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Originally posted by Simaril
Remember what HT said not long ago...
AH is now growing fine, and in fact the totals logged on are UP, not DOWN. Last Thursday had the highest totals in 3 months, according to HT -- BETTER than before the changes you guys are saying will kill the game.
You are in the minority position. Most people are playing and having fun.
It might be wise to acknowledge the FACT that the "old way of doing things" has gone and will not be back, because this way is working better for most people. Have fun the way it is -- you guys are starting to sound like the LuftWhiners of old, right down to the conspiracy theory crap.
WTF are you talking about??? Quit towing the company line and look at the numbers...
Used to be I could find 700 plus people flying between 6-9 est on any given night (including my own damn squad without wasting 30 minutes gathering them in same arena...) Now I log on and am shocked and saddened to find less then 400 on most weeknights flying and thats on PEAK times its a little better on weekends but not much...
AH will die if it succumbs to the asskissing
"WOW THINGS ARE GREAT I CAN FIND A FAIR FIGHT IN MY SPIT1 NOW! KEEP UP THE GREAT WORK DALE, CAN I POLISH YOUR JOYSTICK SIR???"
mega posting no life crowd....some people fly for the hordes, smack talk, squad interaction and alliances and rolling hordes and if they are not happy they will leave... I like the concept and most of the changes dont get me wrong, if you 30 to 40 ppl want to fly in EW or MW arena God love ya, have fun, but leave my horde alone!!!!!!
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"As we speak you have had more customers leaving than you do joining over the last several weeks. "
How do you know this, Condor?
Is there a link where I can look this info up?
Regards,
Sun
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Wonder how many of the log ins are like I've been doing last few weeks, log in & out a dozen time because I'm sent to a area with only 5-10 people in it. This is in morning times (EST). Evens are not to bad with the high numbers in both LW areas. Maps as or an issuse, If no GV play I'll fly some then leave and the new maps are very bad for GV's.
one comment about people leaving, we don't have the imfo that HT has but I will say that I see alot of people missing that I played with, people that use to play everyday so I will say the changes have drive away some.
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Originally posted by Mr No Name
The brainiac who did this is now the "Robert S. Mcnamara" of Aces High. My squad is fractured because of this change and squad unity is the only reason the 29 of us stay here... More than likely we will move back to Warbirds as a few others have done already.
I hope this is just a temporary illness here like the "New Coke" and other debacles and blunders throughout history.
In the past all of the people here resisted splitting arenas for the very reason i cited.
If you want to make the split work guys, this is how you do it:
Create a furball or FT arena and a GV arena. this will take those dedicated furballers out of the mix, make them happy so they can furball without fear of base capture, etc. The strict GV guys can have a tank town without bombers...
Im against this. Furballers can find a fight anywhere, but they dont want that, they want a furball on the deck, without risk of dying. The whole map can be a FT if they choose to fight. But they dont, they moan about hordes takening defenceless bases... well they are the defenders and they arnt fighting... Thats the problem.
GV's i feel for. Only 3 maps cater for them. Other than that theres nothing. These small maps that we thought we would never see again when AHII came out need to be tweaked... they need GV spawn points, so GV'ers arnt left out. Still i disagree that there should be a TT also, if the maps was designed for it properly there wouldnt be any need.
We have lost some fantastic big maps, without any good reasoning. We used to have 700 people per 512x512 map, now we have 250-270 per 256x256 map, almost the exact same people per base as before.....
Originally posted by Mr No Name
and those of us who like to win the war the way the game is designed can have the large scale battle we crave. The game (as designed) should be all about squads operating together to defend or capture bases and the greater the numbers in the arena, the more options you have to make that happen.
hey, just because i am a 'win the war' guy doesnt mean that i think you all need to play it my way. I want the furballers happy too and think they need their own arena, but not 4 arenas as they have it now. EW and MW are strictly furball arenas... LW is so restricted in numbers that I doubt seriously that you will see a 40 formation bomber mission with 25+ escorts.
I loved those missions... participating in them and defending against them! I am a FW190A8 pilot primarily, my diet consists of B17s, B24s and Lancs for the most part... The changes to the game are starving me! In LW the focus is primarily on the fighter because of LOW numbers, it's a question of survival, today I saw ONE decent bomber raid - 5 formations sadly i was unprepared for them because my A8 is so terribly outclassed in the LW arena I had to opt for a faster, lighter armed plane.
Exactly what i said in another thread while bein calm...
this "massive" multiplayer game has lost SO much, no longer will huge bomber missions happen, no longer will the escorts have fun, no longer will the bomber hunters have fun, more fights/fun gone out the window... Even though thats what we are trying to create here... more fights. hmm.....
Originally posted by Mr No Name
If we are going to split the community then lets do it according to player style and not through such drastic, unnecessary means. For those who are marching in lockstep with anything coming out of grapevine, you know who you are, consider my points on this... If you have made a decision to divide us then why not split us based on player style and preference rather than force us to fly without all of our friends who want to play the way we do? I like this game BECAUSE of my SQUAD... we liked the game as a group because of the large numbers in the arena. As the game is set up now, it is very dull by comparison with gameplay a few months ago.
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I say things aren't that bad till the strat-weenies voices go up at
least one more octave :D Heaven forfend you might need to expend
some effort to rule the AH world.
Some folks have gotten lazy with the 15 buff formation/35 Jabo raid
to flatten a vehicle base thing :lol
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I think that what some of you are missing is that to the guys that like air combat and early planes...
This has been the best change ever. As for you leaving? really... you whorders.. you are really only one person to us with a couple hundred heads. Will we miss you? Not in the least... never interacted with you anyway except for you negatively affecting our gameplay.
So if the borg leaves that would be great... I don't care to ever see that one of 6 lone suicide porker hitting the radar in preperation for all the whorde clowns "secretly gathering for a misssunzzzz"
I don't care if I ever see 500 people on one map again without one decent fight going on and three countries all circle jerking field capture on each others undefended fields...
I hope the guys that replace you don't have any mega squad that will recruit them and teach em the slum behavior we have come to expect.
Now that something is being done.... the whorders are all coming up with "solutions" that will help us poor furballers and early war aficianados... When before... they were simply arrogant and unbending... They seemed to revel in destroying any solution such as.... taking bases in FT.... simple griefers expossed.
community is not never changing sides to help gameplay because you are afraid to get out of your little squad comfort zone. Not ever talking to 2/3 of the players on vox or checking/clearing their 6...gameplay is not milkrunning... the strat is a means to a fight not an end to fights.
If you leave it will be a blessing. WWII online is probly where you should have went... it allmost perfectly matches your idea of online gameplay.
lazs
Public Relations Officer for the BK's
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There is a minority of folks in here who want a fight between closely matched foes, and then you have the other types. It doesnt matter what you do. If you get a group together to go attack something, someone is going to whine. If you make a mission and alert the other side, something which we have done in the past, what does the enemy do? Get planes that are a good match to make a good battle? No..they all hop in 262s.
Events and FSOS have become less about the fight, and more about sneaking around avoiding fights. Maybe the arena changes should have been as simple as a war arena, where you fight for captures, and a battle arena where you have dogfights, or bomber intercepts, where the bomber targets are simple targets, simply there for the setup of the battle, but won't hinder flight.
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Originally posted by Sundowner
"As we speak you have had more customers leaving than you do joining over the last several weeks. "
How do you know this, Condor?
I must admit, I don't have an inside track or guaranteed knowledge of that fact. I can only go by the people I personally know that have left the game, the communication I have with players in other squads on their attrition rate, and the numbers we are flying with on a nightly basis. If new people are signing up at a rate or higher in which we are loosing members, where are they? If you spend time playing this game it’s not very difficult to find the new guys. Sure, I could be wrong but it’s not the general consensus. I contacted Hitech a month ago about some problems I was having in regards to a computer glitch and asked them how many members were registered with AH. The answer I got was that it was classified. I don’t know why this would be top secret information because most companies would opt to use the info for marketing or recruiting opportunities if the information was beneficial. Does this mean that Hitech’s information is kept secret because it’s negative information? No. Not to mention that Hitech has the right to keep their information private and without any explanation to me or you. I respect that. The problem is you are left to your own ideas based on the facts that you do know. (notice how I so cleverly darted around using the word assumption ha I knew that one was going to come back and bite me) So to answer your question truthfully, No, I don’t have first hand knowledge of the fact. Don’t think for a second that I wouldn’t love to be wrong. More players = better game play (for me anyway) and like I said before, it’s just my opinion.
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the mega griefers will be crashing the EW/MW scene within the next few days if not weeks. I have been alerted of this heinous scheme by one of my deeply planted MI-5 types that is actually a member of one the larger squads but is becoming a furballer at heart and is trying to break the toolshedding habit. I have him on small doses of furballdone but for the time being he will remain in the megagrieferskwad, carefully and discreetly leak information regarding the "planned mishuns" by the cartoon politbureau of this mega squad as they attempt to snuff out freedom in AHland.
be armed, be prepared your services may be needed upon a minute's notice.
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It was my idea and I held a gun to Hitech's head to get the change. I don't know how to drop bombs or destroy buildings and it was getting embarrasing for me so I needed a change.
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Originally posted by Lazs2:
This has been the best change ever.
Yet you still dont play very much? hmmmmmmmmmmmm :noid
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We know that Guppy and we are coming for you. You started all of this and we also know that you had something to do with that Alien thing down in Roswell. We are watching you.
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Originally posted by Hammy
Yet you still dont play very much? hmmmmmmmmmmmm :noid
Sure was easy to see your point on that one.
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but I am frustrated on the idea of Hitech modifying the LW arena and seemingly controlling game play
You must be getting realy frustrated, because we have been controling game play since the day I wrote the first line of AH.
But my guess would be you tend to ignore all the game play controls in place that you happen to agree with, and you only see it as control when you disagree with it.
HiTech
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:rofl :aok
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Well, if this arena splitting is really pissing off (I mean peple thinking about quitting for some time) even only 20% of the customers base then it is plain suicidal.
Judging from what is happening in my squad (not a late war one) I'd say that we are way above that 20%: I'm pretty sure that if things wont change we'll loose about 50% of the squad. I know they are not big numbers since we are only 6-8 but ...
Since (usually) company' managers dont do strange or suicidal moves I'd think that there is something else we dont know.
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As you see, I don't post much but I have been around this game since it was free and had two airplanes. I'm not trying to claim that this gives me any special wisdom but I have seen the game from the beginning to the present. When I first learned of the decision to splt the MA into EWA, MWA, and LWA, I thought it was a good idea. I still do. I thought it a very good idea to provide an arena for Laz et al as they have been vocal about getting rid of the whordes for a long time. But, they appear to be in the minority judging from the attendance in the EWA and MWA. What I don't get however is the desire to keep the numbers down in the LWA. I know the "answer" to that is to cut down the whordes and this "slum" concept but it seems to me that the guys who have a problem with the "land grabbing whordes" are all in the EWA and MWA now anyway. No? If so, why do they care and why does it matter what goes on in the LWA? I really don't get what's wrong with allowing the LWA to get as big as it wants to (within reason I guess). After all, the anti-whorde crowd is not going to come into the LWA anyway!!??
The latest idea to have LWA1 automatically kick you into LWA2 just kills the notion of the squadron. To me, the concept of a squad is fundamental to AH and it certainly gives the appearance that HT wants to do away with the squad which, of course, I don't believe. I honestly don't get why HT would want to tamper with the squad either consciously or inadvertently.
We have a whopping 15-member "mega-squad" and we had a devil of a time getting everyone into LWA1 for squad night last night. Half of us kept getting bumped into LWA2. When we finally got in, we have 120 guys flying on a gigantic map designed for several hundreds. I don't have to tell you that was not quite the exciting experience it has been in the past.
I am certainly willing to wait this out as things settle but I certainly hope more changes are in the works because last night was just not a squad night to remember.
I am confident that a few of you are going to clear this up for me. :D
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Originally posted by hitech
You must be getting realy frustrated, because we have been controling game play since the day I wrote the first line of AH.
HiTech
You know, it would be real easy for me to take the same cheap shot here (like you did) with a comment like (Hey, thanks for making my point) based on your post. It would be out of context (just like yours is) and not beneficial to anything but an argument. Let alone the little minded cronies that have nothing to say but are just looking for yet another opportunity to find a place to post there smiley’s to whatever you may post. That’s too bad. I think you let a brilliant opportunity slip through your fingers but hey, no one here ever accused you of caring in the first place. I guess that will be the point that is carried on throughout this forum. That’s disappointing.
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The latest idea to have LWA1 automatically kick you into LWA2
This isn't the idea at all, and it only happens when the arena is showing completly full on you arena list.
When we do a new client release you will simply get the message that the arena is full.
(within reason I guess)
And this is the real key, it had gone past the with in reason in my opionion.
What is happening at the moment is a reseting of the mind set of our current players. It is my beliefe that in time some squads will play in LW1, and some others in LW2. Once this is the norm then both arenas will have a sustained population, and flying with your squad will not be a problem.
But right now we are going threw the pains of forcing the arena split. I wish there was a way to make the split not painfull. But havn't seen a lot of other ideas on how to make it acheviable. The last change was to make it less painfull. And it apears once the 2nd arena bumps the first past 120 both arenas typicly have room to fly in.
HiTech
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I am not interested in being nursemaided by Hitech to what they perceive to be their idea of fair, good, or dynamic game play
COndor06: I realy do not belive mine is a cheap shot, after you post like this. I know you wish things were different. But when you start refereing to game design as "nursemaided" exatly where did the cheap shots come from?
I think the real problem is the cost effectiveness of expanding their current server’s, work force, tech support, customer service, ect to accommodate their current customer base and the potential of expanding
We have multiple times tried to state as clearly as we can why we made the change. And yet you basicly call me a liar with the above statment.
And even after we state precisly why. Players still do not belive what we say our intentions and resones are. Do you realy belive if we would publish any of our data that people would belive our data is correct?
I even state that we have been growing nicly since the change in an other post. Yet in yours you contradict me saying we have less players now than when we begain this change. Well your guess is just completly wrong.
HiTech
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Originally posted by lazs2
I think that what some of you are missing is that to the guys that like air combat and early planes...
This has been the best change ever. As for you leaving? really... you whorders.. you are really only one person to us with a couple hundred heads. Will we miss you? Not in the least... never interacted with you anyway except for you negatively affecting our gameplay.
So if the borg leaves that would be great... I don't care to ever see that one of 6 lone suicide porker hitting the radar in preperation for all the whorde clowns "secretly gathering for a misssunzzzz"
I don't care if I ever see 500 people on one map again without one decent fight going on and three countries all circle jerking field capture on each others undefended fields...
I hope the guys that replace you don't have any mega squad that will recruit them and teach em the slum behavior we have come to expect.
Now that something is being done.... the whorders are all coming up with "solutions" that will help us poor furballers and early war aficianados... When before... they were simply arrogant and unbending... They seemed to revel in destroying any solution such as.... taking bases in FT.... simple griefers expossed.
community is not never changing sides to help gameplay because you are afraid to get out of your little squad comfort zone. Not ever talking to 2/3 of the players on vox or checking/clearing their 6...gameplay is not milkrunning... the strat is a means to a fight not an end to fights.
If you leave it will be a blessing. WWII online is probly where you should have went... it allmost perfectly matches your idea of online gameplay.
lazs
Public Relations Officer for the BK's
Leave it Lazs to yet again post his narrow minded opinion. If this game was meant to cater to just the people who wanted to dogfight then why the bombers, tanks, base captures, GV bases etc etc. The game it seems to me was meant to cater to people who want to do ALL or most of those things.
It seems the ONLY way to make everyone happy is to have a MA for the MAJORITY of us and a EW/MW for the furballers.
And I don't think anyone would lose sleep if Lazs didn't like it or left either.
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Originally posted by hitech
It is my beliefe that in time some squads will play in LW1, and some others in LW2. Once this is the norm then both arenas will have a sustained population, and flying with your squad will not be a problem.
IMHO, it might help if these 2 arenas were not similar. People or squads could get attached to some theme or type of map etc.. one being ETO and the other PTO or something like that.
To get attached to a number (1 or 2) may not be so obvious or strong... and they would still all go after the larger amount of players :(
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Originally posted by 68Ripper
It seems the ONLY way to make everyone happy is to have a MA for the MAJORITY of us and a EW/MW for the furballers.
Well....hasn't it sort of devolved to this? When I log on, at least, the majority of people are in the MA, and the air-to-air combat afficionados are in the other two arenas. Everyone should be happy, seems to me.
- oldman
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Originally posted by hitech
It is my beliefe that in time some squads will play in LW1, and some others in LW2. Once this is the norm then both arenas will have a sustained population, and flying with your squad will not be a problem.
Here's an idea. Since you know ahead of time who the squads are and who the members are, why not assign squads to one of the two (or more) LW arenas? You could even use a random selection algorithm at the start of a campaign that does the divying up. That way, when I go to log onto the LW arena, I will be kicked to which ever arena my squad has been assigned to. Guys who are not members of a squad will just be placed in which ever arena that the balancing utility decides to put them. This idea makes the squad the fundamental element in the "numbers game" rather than the individual player. Even better than that, when you go to enter the LWA, you get this pop up window:
Do you wish to join your squad?
If you answer "No", you will be allowed to enter whichever LW arena you like unless it is full; in which case you will be automatically placed in the less populated one.
Ahh, it's a stupid idea. :rolleyes: Blast away!
BTW, if we are looking at 120 in an arena, can't we at least have a map designed for 120 and not 620?
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homeboy... I am not understanding you.. why is it that a lousy 15 guys can't get on?
and... also to the point.. Why do you have to be in LW1? It sure seems that the whorders only want to play one type of game... the one where they have late war equipment against the enemies early war stuff.
or... maybe it is that you want to play with likeminded players... to "field capture" win the war and the hawiian vacation? Maybe you don't want to ruin the fun of the early and mid war players?
If it is the latter... Thank you... please continue to do so. If there is another reason tho, I can't imagine what it would be.
lazs
Public Relations Officer for the BK's
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Originally posted by lazs2
homeboy... I am not understanding you.. why is it that a lousy 15 guys can't get on?
Mr Public Relations Officer, [too funny!]
I can't imagine that you don't understand,,,,, but, ok, I'll bite...
Four of us whorders were not able to get into LW1 where our squad members were and we ended up in LW2. We had to continually exit and retry. Two of us finally made it, the other two gave up. Got it now?
and... also to the point.. Why do you have to be in LW1?
Again, I'm guessing this is some sort of dig but again, I'll take you seriously here...
We didn't care which LW arena we were in. We just wanted to all be together so we could potatod and pillage as a squad in our P-51Ds. It was LW1 that we were trying to get in because there were already five or six in there and it didn't make sense to ask them to exit and join us. Ok?
Maybe you don't want to ruin the fun of the early and mid war players?
Speaking for myself anyway, I do want to seperate your crowd from the rest of us. I love the concept of the EWA and MWA. I made that point and will again! As far as I'm concerned, this discussion is none of your concern since your "problem" is already solved. There is no limit problem with EWA or MWA nor does it appear likely to be. The problem is with how to deal with an overflowing LW which should cause you et al to have no desire to involve yourself. That is assuming that you're not just wanting to be a butt-hole and stir up trouble. Hmmmm.
Hope that answers your questions. I honestly hate to be such a smart alec with you but I just can't help it; and you deserve it. :p
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Allow me to repost something here Hitech. Maybe I am being a bit of a smartass and it doesn’t help the problem. It’s not my intent. Yes, you are right. I am frustrated and maybe a little to cavalier in my postings. First off, if I didn’t have such a fascination with the game, I really wouldn’t care. Second, I don’t think (and neither does anyone else here) that you’re a liar. Quite the contrary. That’s why my post included, (This is just my opinion) We are trying to come up with reasons as to why such a change would take place. We realize that you don’t have to give us any reasons for your decisions. I could think of a lot worst problems to have as the owner of a successful business. So much so that everyone wants to know your business. I mean, you have to ask yourself, how can a GAME become so important to us to generate discussion threads like this. What, are we insane. Everyone here obviously loves the game. We all have our likes and dislikes and you certainly aren’t going to please everyone. With that being said, is there a future place for a combat arena that would satisfy the (whatever you want to call them) Hordes, Squad Junkies, Furballers, Ect. When we (I) talk about you controlling game play we are specifically talking about controlling the population in a given arena or splitting the same population into two. We don’t like it. That’s the bottom line. We see our squads and other relationships that have been forged being separated and for us it’s one of the largest reasons we like the game. Being involved in these forums subjects you to all types of banter and if I have made mistakes in my assessment then I am wrong. But at the end of the day, I, we, the Hordes, Squad Junkies, Furballers, Ect want our arena back. We don’t want to be governed by Hitech as to our arena population within reason. We need enough people and map area to continue the game play we have grown accustomed to and again, within reason. Help us here. Is the problem irresolvable or is their an opportunity for compromise? Maybe you feel like the problem is resolved and we just don’t get it. Maybe it’s just the difference between the way you see the change as a positive thing but our perception is wrong or maybe you don’t see this as a problem at all. I know I would really appreciate your input and ideas as will everyone else here.
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Its not a matter of EW, MW or LW. Most people want to play where the majority of players are. No matter what arena they are in. Its so difficult to understand?
Close the LW and people will go where the majority is. Close the MW too and everybody will be happy in the so called EW. This LW-addicted thing, togheter with uber planes, runners and cherrypickers to justify the split is simply bulls*it.
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COndor06:
I would tend to see it as "you do not see the problem", regardless of what you think of the current solution.
The basic problem is all about the same thing you wish to promote, Having fun with friends.
My view is we had crossed a point where it became very difficult for a new person entering the game to make new friends.
Please do a search as for detailed resones I think this was so. But in a nut shell it amounts to ....
When you have to many people in 1 place pier presure no longer is a control on peoples behavior. Once pier pressure is no longer a control, people will start to exibit hostill behavior to eachother, (in esence overcrowding).
Because of the over crowding we had been forced to implement at lot of game changes (more police type force) to try to control the over crowding.
The arena became much less of a fun social place, then it had at other times.
The current change is an attempt at removing the over crowding and letting pier pressure back into the system.
With some time people will change there behavior back to a more social friendly enviorment.
If you understand the above, then the question becomes.
How do you spit a group of people while letting them maitain there current set of friends.
Our first attempt was as follows.
Lower arena caps,make arenas of slightly different game play (I.E EW/MW/LW) to see if people can be drawn off the old main population.
The first itteration drew some people to other arenas, but the force of wanting to go to the arena with the most players was to great. And hence to make 2 sustained 250 peek time arenas was not working, because no one wated to be the first into the empty arena.
While we contemplated a new solution we raised the caps back to 390. This still was not large enof to handle the people still wanting to go to the big arena.
So the current emplemtation is designed toward minimizing the time the 2nd arena is below critical mass.
I had hoped that also by always bumping the limit on the lower arena, people would relize that if the numbers were close to equal, the lower populated arena would be where they would next have the most people.
This at times keeps both arneas in a non full state, and hence, as you wish , you could always fly with your squad.
Also understand that peoples behavior will only change over time. And in a few weeks it is well possible, that both arenas will allways have space to go play with your squad.
HiTech
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Well, during euro time, with about 300-400 players, I'vent seen anything resembling a cornered rat syndrome. Thats why I cannot understand and dont like whats happening. We euro players have been hit badly by this new split system but we are not enuff to make things different.
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Originally posted by hitech
COndor06:
(((My view is we had crossed a point where it became very difficult for a new person entering the game to make new friends.)))
(((When you have to many people in 1 place pier presure no longer is a control on peoples behavior. Once pier pressure is no longer a control, people will start to exibit hostill behavior to eachother, (in esence overcrowding))).
I have to admit that this was never a consideration I thought of. I have seen exhibits of unnecessary aggression in other games but not in AH. Probably because I usually fly 1-4 am est. Hmmmmm. I guess the answers don’t come as easily as anyone would like. As much as I would like to disagree with you, it does make sense. Maybe if the bases were a little closer together with a smaller population it would still give the same effect game play wise. Who knows? It’s not a problem I wish to tackle but it does give us an idea what you are faced with in deciding how to structure customer play. I realize that you are all over the boards answering the same questions over and over but your response is appreciated. We don’t all have the time to cover every post and miss a lot valuable information. I guess in all my aggression I never thought of this. Does this mean my wife and kids need to keep an eye on me? I mean I have had thoughts of HOing a small Italian car with my truck but I drive a Dodge Ram so that could be something completely different. (just kiddin) Thanks for clearing up a few things
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Originally posted by hitech
This isn't the idea at all, and it only happens when the arena is showing completly full on you arena list.
When we do a new client release you will simply get the message that the arena is full.
And this is the real key, it had gone past the with in reason in my opionion.
What is happening at the moment is a reseting of the mind set of our current players. It is my beliefe that in time some squads will play in LW1, and some others in LW2. Once this is the norm then both arenas will have a sustained population, and flying with your squad will not be a problem.
But right now we are going threw the pains of forcing the arena split. I wish there was a way to make the split not painfull. But havn't seen a lot of other ideas on how to make it acheviable. The last change was to make it less painfull. And it apears once the 2nd arena bumps the first past 120 both arenas typicly have room to fly in.
HiTech
No it doesn't -
Just tried logging into LW1 or Orange arena or whatever it's called now -
Cap = 220
Player numbers = 150
Was dumped into LW2 or pink or purple whatever it is now.
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See Rules #4, #5
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Originally posted by gatt
Well, during euro time, with about 300-400 players, I'vent seen anything resembling a cornered rat syndrome. Thats why I cannot understand and dont like whats happening. We euro players have been hit badly by this new split system but we are not enuff to make things different.
You think things are bad in Europe, just try playing in the evening in Australia!
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The truth is simple as egg. There is no competitor for HTC now. Nobody even close to them. If WB or somebody else could provide at least 50% of what HTC does this change would cost HTC 50% of their customers.
But now they can do whatever they want. Eat what was served, and shut up.
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Originally posted by bj229r
Pyro spells lots better than Skuzzy or Hitech:aok
He only spells better because they bought him a spell check program. :)
Ren
The Damned (DAG)
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But now they can do whatever they want. Eat what was served, and shut up.
Bite the hand the feeds ya and ya stopped getting fed. Pure and simple :aok
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Originally posted by hitech
COndor06:
And even after we state precisly why. Players still do not belive what we say our intentions and resones are. Do you realy belive if we would publish any of our data that people would belive our data is correct?
HiTech
I see your point.
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even here in the states on the east coast in the morning I get to sign on around 9:30 and there are just enough on to kick me into the LW2 with 9 or 10 people. EW/MW are the same. You have to wait an hour before there are enough on to get something going. If everyone in one Arena could have fun, one on one is not what I'm here for. Like working with others for a goal, (base captures, defending). Have LW only say from 4AM EST till 12 noon.
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Originally posted by ghi
What's working better!?
in LW1--- are 90 bish/40knits/60 rooks, Bish are vulching and grab land,reset the out# team/map 3 times/day
in the same time in LW2, 30 bish /40 knits/90 rooks, rooks are vulching all fronts, reset map and out#team,3 times/day
Mw,and EW, who cares what's going on, cuz are soo unbalanced, just unplayable,
Still in LW arena can find some balanced gaming, sometimes
The "old way of doing things", is still here and it will never die unless the bases became uncapturable and war can't be won
Abso-friggin-lutely correct.
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My complaint about Mr Long Winded Can't Break Up His Complaint Into Easily Readable Paragraphs And Thinks He Knows The Secret To Aces High Nirvana
I would like to take a moment to set the stage so that my next letter will begin from a new and much higher level of influence. The points I plan to make in this letter will sound tediously familiar to everyone who wants to bring a fresh perspective and new ideas to the current debate. Nevertheless, some petty litterbugs are actually considering helping Mr Long Winded Can't Break Up His Complaint Into Easily Readable Paragraphs And Thinks He Knows The Secret To Aces High Nirvana make a mockery of our most fundamentally held beliefs. How quickly such people forget that they were lied to, made fun of, and ridiculed by Mr Long Winded Can't Break Up His Complaint Into Easily Readable Paragraphs And Thinks He Knows The Secret To Aces High Nirvana on numerous occasions. Mr Long Winded Can't Break Up His Complaint Into Easily Readable Paragraphs And Thinks He Knows The Secret To Aces High Nirvana can get away with lies (e.g., that it never engages in quasi-dishonest, primitive, or disingenuous politics) because the average person cannot imagine anyone lying so brazenly. Not one person in a hundred will actually check out the facts for himself and discover that Mr Long Winded Can't Break Up His Complaint Into Easily Readable Paragraphs And Thinks He Knows The Secret To Aces High Nirvana is lying.
The fact that one of Mr Long Winded Can't Break Up His Complaint Into Easily Readable Paragraphs And Thinks He Knows The Secret To Aces High Nirvana's unidimensional arguments is that individual worth is defined by race, ethnicity, religion, or national origin is particularly striking, since whatever your age, you now have only one choice. That choice is between a democratic, peace-loving regime that, you hope, may build a society in which people have a sense of permanence and stability, not chaos and uncertainty, and, as the alternative, the amoral and odious dirigisme currently being forced upon us by Mr Long Winded Can't Break Up His Complaint Into Easily Readable Paragraphs And Thinks He Knows The Secret To Aces High Nirvana. Choose carefully, because I want to give people more information about Mr Long Winded Can't Break Up His Complaint Into Easily Readable Paragraphs And Thinks He Knows The Secret To Aces High Nirvana, help them digest and assimilate and understand that information, and help them draw responsible conclusions from it. Here's one conclusion I undoubtedly hope people draw: Some people don't seem to mind that Mr Long Winded Can't Break Up His Complaint Into Easily Readable Paragraphs And Thinks He Knows The Secret To Aces High Nirvana likes to push the State towards greater influence, self-preservation, and totalitarianism and away from civic engagement, constituent choice, and independent thought. What a frowzy world we live in! We'd all be in grave danger if Mr Long Winded Can't Break Up His Complaint Into Easily Readable Paragraphs And Thinks He Knows The Secret To Aces High Nirvana continued to engage in its loud behavior.
You've heard me say that Mr Long Winded Can't Break Up His Complaint Into Easily Readable Paragraphs And Thinks He Knows The Secret To Aces High Nirvana's subordinates are all inerudite calumniators. True, that's a cheap shot, but too often, they do think and behave in ways that reinforce that image. If I had to choose the most illaudable specimen from Mr Long Winded Can't Break Up His Complaint Into Easily Readable Paragraphs And Thinks He Knows The Secret To Aces High Nirvana's welter of licentious gabble, it would have to be Mr Long Winded Can't Break Up His Complaint Into Easily Readable Paragraphs And Thinks He Knows The Secret To Aces High Nirvana's claim that its contrivances prevent smallpox. What do you think of this: Mr Long Winded Can't Break Up His Complaint Into Easily Readable Paragraphs And Thinks He Knows The Secret To Aces High Nirvana is an organization with more ambition than conviction? When I was little, my father would sometimes pick me up, put me on his knee, and say "I lost all respect for Mr Long Winded Can't Break Up His Complaint Into Easily Readable Paragraphs And Thinks He Knows The Secret To Aces High Nirvana when I heard it plans to rewrite and reword much of humanity's formative works to favor hooliganism." Finally, any mistakes in this letter are strictly my fault. But if you find any factual error or have more updated information on the subject of Mr Long Winded Can't Break Up His Complaint Into Easily Readable Paragraphs And Thinks He Knows The Secret To Aces High Nirvana, Mr Long Winded Can't Break Up His Complaint Into Easily Readable Paragraphs And Thinks He Knows The Secret To Aces High Nirvana-inspired versions of vandalism, etc., please tell me, so I can write an even stronger letter next time.
:D :aok :lol :t
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Damn Arlo!! If you hadn't hit the enter key 3 times...you might have created a legendary Great Wall 'O Text!!!!
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(Jedi mind trick) "You will be getting different maps........."
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Originally posted by NoBaddy
Damn Arlo!! If you hadn't hit the enter key 3 times...you might have created a legendary Great Wall 'O Text!!!!
I tried to autogenerate more to see if the text buffer was still rejecting too many characters. It is. ;)
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I think all that bull**** you typed might land you a job at the U.N.
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A job at the U.N.
Cool.
Do I bring my own mop?
;)
"swabby"
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from hiTech
When you have to many people in 1 place pier presure no longer is a control on peoples behavior. Once pier pressure is no longer a control, people will start to exibit hostill behavior to eachother, (in esence overcrowding).
Because of the over crowding we had been forced to implement at lot of game changes (more police type force) to try to control the over crowding.
The arena became much less of a fun social place, then it had at other times.
The current change is an attempt at removing the over crowding and letting pier pressure back into the system.
With some time people will change there behavior back to a more social friendly enviorment.
If you understand the above, then the question becomes. How do you spit a group of people while letting them maitain there current set of friends.
"If you understand the above". Sorry mate... I ain't following this. I don't get it. Slap me in the face with a kipper and call me a avacado but I'm slightly perplexed. Not trying to be arsey with you HTC but hey, call me a avacado if u must.
OK, I understand that an arena with 700+ players was / is detrementle to growth. I'm assuming a lower percentage of newbies didn't enlist as otherwise would have, in less populated arenas. Not wanting exact figures or forcasts but am I on the right track here ?
"Pier pressure" ! Is that to maintain order ? Not getting this part. My idea of peir pressure is telling some gamey so-n-so not to suicide dive bomb in bombers. Not to bial from his tiffy after dropping ords on a hanger. You get what I mean BUT what exactly do you mean ?
Hey man, forgive me for these next few lines. I'm hoping the School brake hasn't had any effect on your figures, assumptions and or projections. It's just a timming thing right? No smart arsed advert sales guru explaining why you should spend another gazzillion bucks with him.
If i could offer any input, advise, comment or avacadotering it's this... change "WEB PAGE HELP" to "INSTRUCTIONS".
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hammy... I play 20-30 hours a month since the change. I consider that a lot.. that is like fifty cents an hour.. a far cry from the 3-6 bucks an hour we used to all pay.
I think that many hours is quite a bit... I think hundreds is pretty sick. I mean.. how much of a life can you have with work and 100 or more hours of this every month? don't you have any friends or hobbies?
lazs
Public Relations Officer for the BK's
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Originally posted by lazs2
hammy... I play 20-30 hours a month since the change. I consider that a lot.. that is like fifty cents an hour.. a far cry from the 3-6 bucks an hour we used to all pay.
I think that many hours is quite a bit... I think hundreds is pretty sick. I mean.. how much of a life can you have with work and 100 or more hours of this every month? don't you have any friends or hobbies?
lazs
Public Relations Officer for the BK's
Hammy can answere for himself but man this is a bit rich. If you spend just 10 minutes on a post and thats a conservative 10 minutes. I've seen your post as long as a side of A4 then you average 30 hours just typing about the game each and every month.
You type more about the game than you actually use it. That right mate...you type it more than use it. Whats more your text is 90% the same topic. "some shedder bound to bomb me furball" blah blah.
Sick whats sick? Pucking up 9.75 poster per day 30 hours a month from the same out house with about as much usefull contents as said out house?
The guys in here are all AI.
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Originally posted by HomeBoy
BTW, if we are looking at 120 in an arena, can't we at least have a map designed for 120 and not 620?
What he said.
Spend an awful lot of time now-a-days flying in empty space looking for some action. Not really too much fun.
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See Rules #5, #4
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Deleted
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roflmao:noid
Not really too much fun.
This about sums the whole thing up now.
(respectfully yours Mr HT) :aok
ps. since when has quoting the forum rules, been against the forum rules??????
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Originally posted by hitech
My view is we had crossed a point where it became very difficult for a new person entering the game to make new friends.
Okay. That's easily one of the more retarded explanations I've heard yet.
You changed the entire arena system because you were afraid someone wouldn't be able to make e-friends?
Maybe you can write some code that will allow me to buy some friends with my perk points? Yipee!
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I fly under the name Siafu. I do it all. I am a GVer, a bomber and a fighter. How about this. like in football we log in as either one of the three. when you want to switch you have to relog. There is a cap for each group say 60. now your big squad can play at the same time. now lets same the same rules are for each country. now it 60 fighters limit for rooks, 60 for knights and same for bish. We are now at the 540 cap for one arena. if I cant get in the LW as a fighter then i will log in as a bomber or ground vehicle. It might be worth testing.
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Didn't think of that. Smooth move. I'll try it.:aok
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Originally posted by hitech
The basic problem is all about the same thing you wish to promote, Having fun with friends.
My view is we had crossed a point where it became very difficult for a new person entering the game to make new friends.
Please do a search as for detailed resones I think this was so. But in a nut shell it amounts to ....
When you have to many people in 1 place pier presure no longer is a control on peoples behavior. Once pier pressure is no longer a control, people will start to exibit hostill behavior to eachother, (in esence overcrowding).
Because of the over crowding we had been forced to implement at lot of game changes (more police type force) to try to control the over crowding.
The arena became much less of a fun social place, then it had at other times.
Thanks for this more detailed explanation HT.
I wonder, if this overcrowding (obviously of peek-times) could be still cured within one and single arena hosting a large map? .. or with 2 arenas at most?
What comes to my mind are e.g. limits of take-offs per base per time. That could help distributing people more evenly over the front lines. Still some larger missions could be started... e.g. from secondary line bases. This approach would prevent people from upping once in a while, but at least it would not be as dramatic as preventing entry to an arena.. or preventing play at arena with enough people.
Some visual info system could keep player from falling into "traps" in regard of "why cant I take off from this base right now".. just like the disabled hangars work now.
Participating in more even and smaller action could enhance that above mentioned "making new friends" experience.
I am interpreting the "overcrowding" as too many players at same area.. which means "hordes", kill stealing and less targets for everyone.. and leads eventually to milkrunning with hordes. I cannot see it as "too many players per arena", since all people at same arena simply dont and cannot interact with everyone else.. only with the people at their "range" or in their country at most. Please, correct me if I am wrong.
Or is this some chan 200 problem? If so, why not get rid of it completely. This is primarily a MMO flight sim after all, right, not an IRC software.
If the hardware issues are not any particularly big reason for overcrowding problems, could you possibly re-consider the possible means of curing the problem within one or two arenas. IMHO, the current drastic changes have huge negative effects (the squadrons and small communities simply suffer) on off-peek time zones .... where there might be more potential for growth (simply guessing)
I truly wish this all came out in a constructive manner :noid
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This is primarily a MMO flight sim after all, right, not an IRC software.
You realy can not seperate the 2 issues. Other wise you might as well be playing against AI in a box.
We always just think of it as a very violent chat room.
And it has nothing to do "as too many players at same area" , this realy isn't a PURE game play dynamic but rather a social one.
HiTech
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OK.. :)
Now I understand why I did not get the problem.
I never tune to chan 200 at MA. Why would I ... I log to play and to communicate with squad mates... not to read rants and accusations etc. Or is that something that is expected of players (tuning to 200) to be part of the "larger community"?
IMHO, the place for communication is right here. It does not have to be in the game.
Should I understand this so that the social dynamics (which all people do not even want to participate at larger scale) weigh more than the game play dynamics?
Howabout simply splitting the chan 200 to 4 different channels with player caps on them? They could be blue and red and yellow channels etc.
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Originally posted by hitech
The basic problem is all about the same thing you wish to promote, Having fun with friends.
My view is we had crossed a point where it became very difficult for a new person entering the game to make new friends.
Please do a search as for detailed resones I think this was so. But in a nut shell it amounts to ....
When you have to many people in 1 place pier presure no longer is a control on peoples behavior. Once pier pressure is no longer a control, people will start to exibit hostill behavior to eachother, (in esence overcrowding).
Because of the over crowding we had been forced to implement at lot of game changes (more police type force) to try to control the over crowding.
The arena became much less of a fun social place, then it had at other times.
thing is even 20 player online games can be hostile. I agree with the other points, but theres probably a very small minority that are "nasty" to each other, or to new people... Why "punish" everyone?
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The more people you have, the more hostile types you have. The more new players you add to the mix, seeing the vocal hostile types, the more newer players you have who will act the same way. Vicious cycle.
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I suggested a balance of all three facets of the game. Hitech says it not the technology but the trend of the game is, it wouldn"t have longevity. This is a war game. Once you balance the load and all else is equal it may become more fun but no ones wins. There are three countries, and three facets (ground, Bombs and fighters). Balance these and all error will cancel out. In actual fact with a large mission, 30% will be bombers, 15% may be gvs(if permitted) and the rest will be fighters. These limits imposed is on a "globle scale". Go MICRO "within the game". Force more subscribers to use the other factors in the game and still keep every one as a team. Hitech proved that a limit of 750 can be reached. Can it be done.
WE need spell check here lol
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Originally posted by emile
WE need spell check here lol
google toolbar!
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I sure hope this thing blows over sometime in the near future, because the MA was a lot of fun during the peak hours. Maybe not always so much for the people who only want to dogfight, but then, that's what the H2H and Dueling arenas were/are for.
I had some really good times flying with a good amount of other players, trying to take enemy bases (sometimes successful, sometimes not). I also had equally good times flying support over tank town. And then, there were the missions where over a hundred players would join and attempt to take out an enemy's headquarters (this rarely worked, but it was great to be intercepted by Me-163's, and flying bombers is exhilirating when P-47's come out of nowhere to attempt to take a chunk out of your tail)
There's just something "special" about having 400+ players in one arena. There are just so many possibilities that come along with such a large amount of players that just aren't there with only 120. You can whine about "whordes" or "vulch queens" all you want, but not being able to defend against a horde attack is more of a matter of poor strategic planning on the part of the team as a whole... And getting vulched constantly is pretty ridiculous, since it really only happens when people try to take off from fields that are being swarmed, rather than fields that are nearby where they could coordinate a counter-offensive.
Maybe in the not-too-distant future, AH will have enough planes for each country so that we can have a true rolling planeset for a single main arena (now now, people, this is just a dream/theory, not a suggestion, so please try to keep your flamethrowers concealed). This could possibly eliminate a lot of the source for whining... Hey, one can dream, right?
With all of this said, I guess I'll just have to see how things turn out, for better or worse.
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Fruda the higher caps did allow for more variety in gameplay by a longshot... I guess the game will regress into a haven for lonewolf cherrypickers again.
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Originally posted by Fruda
I sure hope this thing blows over sometime in the near future, because the MA was a lot of fun during the peak hours. Maybe not always so much for the people who only want to dogfight, but then, that's what the H2H and Dueling arenas were/are for.
I had some really good times flying with a good amount of other players, trying to take enemy bases (sometimes successful, sometimes not). I also had equally good times flying support over tank town. And then, there were the missions where over a hundred players would join and attempt to take out an enemy's headquarters (this rarely worked, but it was great to be intercepted by Me-163's, and flying bombers is exhilirating when P-47's come out of nowhere to attempt to take a chunk out of your tail)
There's just something "special" about having 400+ players in one arena. There are just so many possibilities that come along with such a large amount of players that just aren't there with only 120. You can whine about "whordes" or "vulch queens" all you want, but not being able to defend against a horde attack is more of a matter of poor strategic planning on the part of the team as a whole... And getting vulched constantly is pretty ridiculous, since it really only happens when people try to take off from fields that are being swarmed, rather than fields that are nearby where they could coordinate a counter-offensive.
Maybe in the not-too-distant future, AH will have enough planes for each country so that we can have a true rolling planeset for a single main arena (now now, people, this is just a dream/theory, not a suggestion, so please try to keep your flamethrowers concealed). This could possibly eliminate a lot of the source for whining... Hey, one can dream, right?
With all of this said, I guess I'll just have to see how things turn out, for better or worse.
Well said,
i think same way about the game, and so does most of the players, I still hope to see the massive multiplayer flavour back in game,
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Originally posted by Free
Okay. That's easily one of the more retarded explanations I've heard yet.
You changed the entire arena system because you were afraid someone wouldn't be able to make e-friends?
Maybe you can write some code that will allow me to buy some friends with my perk points? Yipee!
maybe they should get a myspace account.
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Originally posted by hitech
You realy can not seperate the 2 issues. Other wise you might as well be playing against AI in a box.
We always just think of it as a very violent chat room.
And it has nothing to do "as too many players at same area" , this realy isn't a PURE game play dynamic but rather a social one.
HiTech
If you can code an AI that emulates human skill / error and provide server hardware to give each AI a unique personality 700 times then you deserve a Nobel prize.
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Originally posted by Overlag
thing is even 20 player online games can be hostile. I agree with the other points, but theres probably a very small minority that are "nasty" to each other, or to new people... Why "punish" everyone?
There is no comparison between AH and a 16 player Counter Strike server. The voice chat on the CS server would make a sailor blush.
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Originally posted by COndor06
If you can't stand the heat then take up knitting.
I lol'd.
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Originally posted by hubsonfire
The more people you have, the more hostile types you have. The more new players you add to the mix, seeing the vocal hostile types, the more newer players you have who will act the same way. Vicious cycle.
You learned from the best, grasshoppa.