Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Bronk on December 12, 2006, 01:02:46 AM
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http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2006/12/09/nmulti09.xml
LOL where has all the tolerance gone.:O
I just wish a politician here had the stones to say the same.
:t
Bronk
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Waiting...
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Originally posted by Wolfala
Waiting...
Christmas is not for another two weeks....;)
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Holy watermelon thats awesome. My sister lives in Denmark and she says many people thre too are tired of traditional liberal "multiculturalism" and the results it has brought.
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Could not agree more.
They need to integrate, follow the laws and respect our culture or get the hell out on the next raft. Its not the locals that need to bow to those comming here seeking a better life or shelter from tyrants in their home land. They need to friggin be very happy they were even allowed to seek refuge here in the first place. I would not even dream of telling the people and countires that helped me how to treat me and behave around me. Its not like they are paying tourists.
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I don't think its going to change things much
Sorry to say, but it's just a belated enoch powellism from a political dead duck
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nice words, the proof of true resolve will be when the brits start shutting down mosques. what england needs is another tudor with an axe.
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Blair is just recycling the new mantra from another one of the faithfull...
Migrant test not racist policy (http://theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,20867,20915852-601,00.html)
Tronsky
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Best speech I have read in decades ......
USA is being flushed down the chitter , same as was done in England ..
:mad:
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http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/295372_xmas10.html
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Originally posted by Sixpence
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/295372_xmas10.html
Rabbi Elazar Bogomilsky, who made his request weeks ago, said he was appalled by the decision. He had hired a lawyer and threatened to sue if the Port of Seattle didn't add the menorah next to the trees, which had been festooned with red ribbons and bows.
"Everyone should have their spirit of the holiday," said Bogomilsky, who works in Seattle at the regional headquarters for Chabad Lubavitch, a Jewish education foundation.
Lawsuits, the spirit of the holidays. :rofl :rofl
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great post bronk, nice words tony.
im on the fence still as to TB's big talk is a 'belated enoch powellism from a political dead duck' (quote excel, i love that wording mate :)) or 'Best speech I have read in decades ' (quote checkers)
one thing i do know is, when the ethnic influx in your home country start having rights to the point that become rascist towards the white natives, something needs to change.
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WTG Blair
He's only saying what alot of us are already thinking but most of us dont due to political correctness
:aok :aok
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I heard the rabbi say that it was a mistake and that he was sorry that he filed the suit.
I am going to write every one of my reprentitives and tell them that I agree with what blair said in his speech about adopting the values of the country you come to.
lazs
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I hate multiculturalism... bring back Ellis Island!
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the most horrendous part of multiculturalism is that governments try to convince us we're all the same and that to think there is any difference between races is wrong and against the law. of course there is bloody difference, this guy is a different freakin colour to me, and this guy is only 4 feet tall.
when we learn to accept that there is a big difference between every person and individual, let alone between different races, but that it doesnt mean we cant still co-exist, then we might start being on the right track.
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Kudos to Blair, sadly most of the posters here missed the point :)
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Originally posted by Red Tail 444
Actually, he's talking about integration, not assimilation, two very distinct differences there.
Sounded to me that Blair respects people and their right to be different, so long as they represent peaceful and law abiding values. Americans want everyone to be "just like me" and forego their differences, which sounds awfully socialist to me. If you sound like me, talk like me, act like me, dress like me, think like me, and be like me, I don't have to deal with my own issues about difference. the ultimate duck-and cover.
(http://www.utdallas.edu/~ctf031000/books/win%20friends%20&%20assimilate%20people.jpg)
These included "equality of respect" - especially better treatment of women by Muslim men - allegiance to the rule of law and a command of English.
So thats not assimilating? Good to know. Now I won't be call an insensitive right wing nut when I ask people to learn English.
Remember this is just integration not assimilation.
"If you come here lawfully, we welcome you. If you are permitted to stay here permanently, you become an equal member of our community and become one of us. The right to be different. The duty to integrate. That is what being British means."
Even better now we can call the illegals , Illegals. Not the PC undocumented workers.
And now I'm not a right wing nut when i say "If they came here illegally, round em up and ship em out.". Because i have no problem with legal immigration.
When it comes to our essential values, the belief in democracy, the rule of law, tolerance, equal treatment for all, respect for this country and its shared heritage — then that is where we come together, it is what gives us what we hold in common; it is what givesright to call ourselves British,"
Brilliant then we can do away with the hate crime laws.
We are all equal right?
Equal crime equal punishment.
Remember integration not assimilation.
Thank you Tony Blair for validating some of my beliefs.
:rofl
Bronk
Edit: Great I caught red's post before he changed it .:D
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Originally posted by Red Tail 444
Americans want everyone to be "just like me" and forego their differences, which sounds awfully socialist to me. If you sound like me, talk like me, act like me, dress like me, think like me, and be like me, I don't have to deal with my own issues about difference. the ultimate duck-and cover.
Ummm. Not. No one could care less about most of that. Matter of fact, Americans quite often pride themselves on the various dialects that color our language. Accents are fine. Dialect is fine, even encourages sometimes. As long as
1. You CAN speak proper English if called upon to do so.
2. You ARE a citizen, or are at least working towards becoming one. America offers alot to the immigrant, its only fair you give your loyalty in return. If you cant, go home.
3. There is nothing wrong with knowing and being proud of your family's cultural history, as long as you celebrate the American culture you are part of now. What people are calling "multiculturalism" really is not. There are people who prey on the immigrants' fears of what is different, try to purposely keep them separated from the rest of society and integrated with each other, taking control of these groups and getting power from them. To be "multicultural" you have to embrace more than once culture simultaneously. These people are being told they not only can live in America but dont have to become Americans, they are told they DESERVE it. There are no laws to force cultural integration, because no one ever thought that people would come to America and not want to be Americans. Because of our traditional policy of acceptance, we have been slow to adopt such laws. Its past time to do so.
Asking for loyalty, and integration and contribution to society.......thats not socialism, thats good policy and common sense.
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Originally posted by Red Tail 444
Kudos to Blair, sadly most of the posters here missed the point :)
I didn't miss it,
I copied his speech, printed it and mailed it to every member of the house of representives in California ....
Bravo Blair ...:aok
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its just been announced as from 2007 there will be no different cultures or colour or creed.
Everyone in england will become greens
just remember the dark greens will get all the state had outs while the light greens will get sod all
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as usual... red bottom doesn't get it.
Blair said "adopt the values" of the country. that does not mean you can't open a mexican resteraunt tho for instance. It doesn't mean that you can never speak spanish either but it does mean that you should know how to speak english.
It also means that even if your religion calls for you to stone women in public who show an ankle or their face... you don't get to do it.
lazs
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Originally posted by Bodhi
I hate multiculturalism... bring back Ellis Island!
hey you wanna buy some soap? your squaddies think you stink, c'mon buy some soap. call me.
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I dont know what there is to not get about this speech. I think its very straight forward...Pretty much, if you come to the UK, and love her as your home, you will be one of us. If you come here and pretend you're in mini pakistan, and cant sing the freaking national anthem, or drink a gawddamn cup of tea, then get the hell out, ya sallys. Right?
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Originally posted by Red Tail 444
Kudos to Blair, sadly most of the posters here missed the point :)
Not you, of course. :)
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I dont know what there is to not get about this speech. I think its very straight forward...Pretty much, if you come to the UK, and love her as your home, you will be one of us.
Which is of course Tebbit's "cricket test", for which the Labour party called him a racist.
It would have been better if Blair had realised all this before he instituted the largest wave of immigration Britain has ever seen. But then Blair is good at being wise after the fact, even though he never actually takes steps to remedy his mistakes.
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Its brilliant if you ask me. I see not a single reason why ... if you move to a new country & plan on living, working & becoming a part of that society, you should not be expected to - at a minimum - learn the bloody language.
I work the for the New York State Tax Dept (ducks) ... I can tell you that I have spoken with - or attempted to speak to - people that spoke Spanish, German, French ... what I believe to have been russain ... chinese (japanese - korean?) ... and all they know how to say ... no speak english!
And then there are the countries the US has "treaties" with. Their citizens can come here ... go to school here ... work here, and they do it tax free. Now thats crap.
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england just got some points with me :aok good call mr blair
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Spiked, what countries are those?
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Originally posted by Spiked
I work the for the New York State Tax Dept (ducks) ... I can tell you that I have spoken with - or attempted to speak to - people that spoke Spanish, German, French ... what I believe to have been russain ... chinese (japanese - korean?) ... and all they know how to say ... no speak english!
/B]
Ahh look where you work. I would pretend I couldn't speak English too:lol
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for once I think nashwan is accurate in an assesment.
Blair is a 20/15 or better hindsighter and one of the best speach makers ever. He is also a socialist of the reddest kind and he is usualy the one making the problem he makes the speach about.
I also agree that, like our politicians... he says the right things but does nothing about em... doesn't even make the attempt.
I have no idea why any of this bothers nashwan tho. Perhaps he just hates "immigrants"?
lazs
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Blair is forced to step down from his place and suddenly grows a pair? Surprising!
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To the guys in the UK- do you think Blair/The Labour party will scrape the next election? or do you think the Labour party is dead man walking?
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lol well if conservitives get in i know for sure my job is gone.
if lbour stay in ill still have a job although it will be harder.
as for the other lot not a chance.
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I have no idea why any of this bothers nashwan tho. Perhaps he just hates "immigrants"?
No, I just hate Blair and his pack of socialists. I actually have more respect for the old Labour party, which at least said what it thought and what it was going to do, and then did it. Blair is the most twisted and devious politician Britain has seen. He pretends to be right wing whilst actually being one of the most ardent socialist PMs Britain has ever had. Sadly, people confuse authoritarianism with "right wing", when they are very different things.
lol well if conservitives get in i know for sure my job is gone.
Mind if I ask what your job is?
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...when the ethnic influx in your home country start having rights to the point that become rascist towards the white natives, something needs to change.
What have rights and racism got to do with anything? The more rights you have, the more racist you get?
Absolute tosh. The white South Africans had all the rights and they weren't a bit racist... err...
The truth is Blair is actually making sense for the first time in his political career, and definitely for the first time since he became the straight man in the Bush-Blair double act.
He perhaps should even be commended for his sensible policy U-turn. Unlike the racist bigots who would 'shut mosques down'.
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I agree with Nashwan. I come from a working class background, from a traditional Labour heartland, but have never liked the 'dishonest' variant of socialism that is New Labour. Dragging us into a war we cannot win or afford, a blind faith in a buffoon like George Bush et al, raiding pensions, stealth taxation set my mind against the current government long ago.
Gordon Brown (Labour PM in waiting) will never get my vote either. Far too tax and spend, without the honesty to do it through income tax.
The conservatives may get my vote. But my girlfriend works for NHS and they properly ****ed that up last time they were in charge. Besides Maggie isn't dead yet, and I doubt I can bring myself to vote conservative until she is dead and buried.
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one can hardly be considered a "racist" for merely pointing out that mosques in the western countries are nothing other than breeding grounds for terrorist activities within the host state, that in moslem countries they are places where hatred of the west and particularly Americans is taught and that they are commonly used as places to stockpile munitions and from which cowardly combatants snipe our troops.
One cannot be considered a racist for stating that all terrorist activity in the United States can be traced back directly to moslem arabs. we have a problem in the west, that problem is the moslem religion. if they want to practice their hatred in their countries all well and good, we can bomb them into line there. if they want to practice their hatred in my neighborhood, I don't think so. it's time to send a clear message from a unified western front. the message is simple you will conform to our ways or we will boot you. if you practice terrorism from these places of hate we will shut them down. if you hurt our people and we catch you, you will live in a cage in some hell hole concentration camp.
call it what you will I call it self preservation.
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When Blair was elected I assumed he was a Brit version of Bill Clinton (I think a few Clinton folks even worked on his campaign) The last few years he seems to have grown some stones and actually said/did what he THINKS to be the right thing to do, regardless of the polls, a rare thing in the political world. His popularity in Britain would have stayed far higher had he ignored the Iraq foray and condemmed the cowboy president, but he believed it to be the right thing to do, as was making this speech, which likely wouldnt have been heard from anyone else in Labour. (Or any of what passes for Conservatives over there anymore either) Being 5 time zones away, there is far more I DON'T know about him than what I do, but the man has my admiration:aok
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When Blair was elected I assumed he was a Brit version of Bill Clinton
When Blair was elected he made a lot of promises. He had the best spin doctors Britain had ever seen, and he kept his party "on message". He was also running against a Conservative government that had been in power for 18 years, so people wanted a change.
The last few years he seems to have grown some stones and actually said/did what he THINKS to be the right thing to do,
The last few years in Iraq he seems to have become interested in his "legacy". Lacking any clear vision of how to improve Britain (because everything he's done here has been disasterous) he's been looking for a cause that will elevate him to greatness and make people overlook the mess he's made of Britain.
As is usual for Blair, though, he got it wrong again.
Being 5 time zones away, there is far more I DON'T know about him than what I do, but the man has my admiration
Here's just one thing that should tell you all you need to know about Blair. He's committed Britain to 2 simultaneous wars, in Iraq and Afghanistan. At the same time, he's been reducing the military budget, which is now lower in real terms than it was when he came to office in 1997 (which was at the height of the peace dividend)
This week, the former head of the army (until earlier this year), said that the government is refusing to give the army the resources necessary for the jobs they are asking them to do.
How can you admire a man who sends troops into battle without funding them properly? It's not even as if money is tight, his government has vastly increased public spending.
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interesting... To me, the most conservative brits are socialists yet nashwan seems to hate socialism as much as I do... yet... he is against individual rights like the right to fight back and to bear arms... fundamental rights for individuals.
Perhaps I have the terms wrong as they apply to england... maybe england is so far gone that socialism has a different meaning there.
lazs
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so does "fanny"
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Originally posted by Dowding
I agree with Nashwan. I come from a working class background, from a traditional Labour heartland, but have never liked the 'dishonest' variant of socialism that is New Labour. Dragging us into a war we cannot win or afford, a blind faith in a buffoon like George Bush et al, raiding pensions, stealth taxation set my mind against the current government long ago.
Gordon Brown (Labour PM in waiting) will never get my vote either. Far too tax and spend, without the honesty to do it through income tax.
The conservatives may get my vote. But my girlfriend works for NHS and they properly ****ed that up last time they were in charge. Besides Maggie isn't dead yet, and I doubt I can bring myself to vote conservative until she is dead and buried.
You'll be glad to hear that she was blocked from being awarded the congressional order medal by some influential members of Congress, She done zip to further peace in places like Ireland, but the people who came after did, they should be the ones getting awards.
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Originally posted by lazs2
Perhaps I have the terms wrong as they apply to england... maybe england is so far gone that socialism has a different meaning there.
lazs
Maybe it means just a little bit more.....
(http://web.mit.edu/jonb/www/animate/grinch.gif)
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She done zip to further peace in places like Ireland, but the people who came after did, they should be the ones getting awards.
Anglo Irish Agreement (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anglo-Irish_Agreement)
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Originally posted by Nashwan
Anglo Irish Agreement (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anglo-Irish_Agreement)
No mention of the hunger strikes also ?
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What about them? Convicted terrorists refusing to eat. What has that got to do with the government?
You're not suggesting the government should have given in to terrorism, are you? If a convicted terrorist in America goes on hunger strike, should the government negotiate with him?
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Originally posted by Nashwan
What about them? Convicted terrorists refusing to eat. What has that got to do with the government?
You're not suggesting the government should have given in to terrorism, are you? If a convicted terrorist in America goes on hunger strike, should the government negotiate with him?
why were they on hunger strike in the first place? Not because of an illegal occupation by Britian was it? Anyway, we shouldn't go hijacking threads and so lets agree to disagree and leave it for another day. (apologies for the partial hijack thing)
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They were on hunger strike because they wanted to be treated as "political prisoners". They were in prisons for robberies, bombings and murders.
Not because of an illegal occupation by Britian was it?
No, NI is part of the UK, by the democratic wish of it's population. As it is an integral part of the UK, with the same political and legal rights as the rest of the UK, it cannot by definition be "occupied". There are no countries or major international bodies that consider Northern Ireland to be "occupied".
Anyway, we shouldn't go hijacking threads and so lets agree to disagree and leave it for another day.
Agreed. You made your point, I refuted it, it should stop there, unless you want to start another thread on the topic.
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Originally posted by Nashwan
They were on hunger strike because they wanted to be treated as "political prisoners". They were in prisons for robberies, bombings and murders.
No, NI is part of the UK, by the democratic wish of it's population. As it is an integral part of the UK, with the same political and legal rights as the rest of the UK, it cannot by definition be "occupied". There are no countries or major international bodies that consider Northern Ireland to be "occupied".
Agreed. You made your point, I refuted it, it should stop there, unless you want to start another thread on the topic.
We can start another one next week if you like ?, I have to keep the wheels of commerce turning here and so I'll be a bit busy lol I do strongly dissagree with what your version of NI is and I look forward to debating this with you and anyone else who would like to contribute to the debate.