Aces High Bulletin Board
Help and Support Forums => Help and Training => Topic started by: titanic3 on February 20, 2007, 02:40:28 PM
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i'm having a bit trouble with atking b24 and b17 bomber formations. when i do HO's on them, they shoot my pilot,engine,oil,or radiator. atk from above and i lose a wing. atk from below i lose landing, and eventually can't land. (sumtimes i can, mostly miss the runway or burn to death.)
after all these trials, i tried shooting from the sides. either i'm going to fast or i can't turn quick enough and collide. so any of guys can tell me the best angle of atk? thx
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U should stay away from bomber pilots.:aok
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I had a lot of trouble with this until recently when I witnessed a P-51 take out 3 B-24's without losing any parts himself.
Attack from above and to one side. Dive at about a 45 degree angle & let them come across your field of view from left to right or right to left. This keeps the target in view & not lost under the nose of your fighter.
Start firing in front of the target at d8 or d1000 depending on your ammo load & when the tracers start hitting use rudder to keep the rounds landing in the same spot. Ideally this is the cockpit, but no matter - just keep them in one spot & something important will come off.
Attacking head on from slightly below is usually a good angle. Make sure to arc in from one side slightly so that the gunner(s) can't get a good bead. Put rounds in the cockpit & corkscrew on the exit run.
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best advice i can offer........BE CAREFUL around 17's and 24's.......they're the most heavily armed bombers. KEEP MOVING!! DO NOT FLY STRAIGHT AT ANY TIME DURING YOUR ATTACK. any skilled bomber pilot can VERY easily jump around the gunner positions quickly. he may also have gunners onboard........and if one shoots at ya, all 3 bombers guns are shooting at ya.i fly JU88's a lot........and virtually EVERYBODY under-estimates the guns.....they fly straight into my guns....i kilt a guy that came within 100 yards before firing a shot. and that was ALL he fired. lancs, and 8's vunerable from directly underneath.........a lot of gunners can't hit a fighter if its comming straight down at em...biggest thing is to bob n weave.....zig n zag.........keep ur nose on target, but don't hold still for them......keep speed up too.....there was a spit i wish i woulda filmed...it was dimebag2....he was a VERY hard target.......almost shot me down......because he kept moving around, and making himself a hard target.....if you're gonna go after 24's and 17's.....use something with cannons, and try to stay out of range of their guns......thats all i know about them, as i avoid em.....they hurt me:eek:
god luck!!
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For successfull bomber busting you need:
- Speed.
- Angles. Both horizontal as well as vertical. Also always attack the drones first.
- Guns. Cannon armament preferred (but you have to use what you got).
- Patience. Don't press the attack if your position is not favorable.
- Aim. Preferably aim for cockpit, or wingroots/ inner engines. Don't rake the bomber. Concentrate your fire.
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But if any bomber pilots are readiing this. Do not be discouraged. Yes it is true that these slashing type of attacks are painful, they are not without a defense. SO on that note I shall let you on a little secret. If you have a twisty stick use it. Use it alot. Get used to using it when firing. Not only is your target trying to avoid being shot at so are you. You have an advantage when you have 2 drones with you but guarentee that if you run into one of these attacks your gonna loose one. Then the fight is about fair. The key is to inflict as much damage that first pass, to avoid a second attack. Also keep your speed up as much as possible. SLight down angle if you have bombs. I keep the hard deck around 10k, and will not cross it if i have bombs left. Otherwise Ill go to 6k if out. Make a beeline for the nearest safest haven if you can. If its gonna be a fight take it on your terms. Remember to lead your shots too. Hes probable attacking at you at close to 500 mph, thats very fast and hard to hit. But you got alot of lead flying so odds are you will get some hits, and at that velocity a little goes along way. BTW noobs should learn the approach on a bomber before you get on my six. Ill have you down before you could even go to the video tape on what just happened. As you were.
:D
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I won't even mess with 17's unless I've been looking for something to fight for awhile, and they're the first things I see.
With 24's, I attack from above and dive through the formation. Aim for the wing root area and set in on fire. Then just stay out of range until the burning one dies, and go back in to set another on fire. When that one dies, kill the last one.
Don't stay within guns range for any longer than you have to. Get in, make a pass, and get out.
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^^^^ what he said.
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Don't stay within guns range for any longer than you have to. Get in, make a pass, and get out.
i have to aggree with fianna on this point:aok ...........i kill a LOT of fighter pilots who insist on staying in my gun range,,,,,and they also allow their speed to bleed off to the point they can only attack from underneath me, which makes them even easier to hit.
something i do sometimes is to go into a very shallow climb when i see this.....they slow even more, and sometimes can't get back up to me......i only tried that in 88's so far, and have no clue if it works on the bigger buffs. i still think the 88's are really a bit better......smaller, a bit faster, and carry a LOT of bombs......drawback....weak defense.
:aok
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A few more points:
Attack:
Prefered approach, as suggested is a steep dive from above. It is best not to align yourself with the bombers and attack from high 6, but to have some angles off.
Egress:
Don't pull up right away, you are not trying to rope them. Instead, follow through under the bombers and continue ahead slightly lower then them at high speed. They have less guns to aim low forward and the high speed will get you out of rage quickly. Again, don't flight straight ahead of the bombers - take 30 deg off and fly to his 1 or 11 oclock to add some deflection to his aim.
Re-engage:
Once passed 800-1000 yards ahead and a little to the side, start a zoom climb. While you zoom, the slow bomber will start to come under you. Don't turn toward the bombers, let them come to you while you use the tim to build E. Plan it so you reach at least 3000 feet above it (~900 yards) before it is under you again.
Use the sun:
especially on the attack, or while you loiter above it, put yourself between the bombers and the sun. It would be annoying for him to keep watching your while blinded, not to mention the aim.
Wear him out:
If he is ready for you, don't attack right away. Hover above it without engaging for a little while. His alertness will go down and he'll be busy with other things such as getting ready for his attack run or watching out of other fighters around. Works wonders if you use the sun.
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Bring friends and cannons.
Unlike real life where a bomber would have multiple gunners, our AH bombers have only one gunner. If you attack bombers with a friend in a coordinated effort, one of you will be a target and the other gets target practice.
Working as a team makes it a cake walk as the defender can only be at one gun position at a time.
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:D :aok
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Unlike real life where a bomber would have multiple gunners, our AH bombers have only one gunner. If you attack bombers with a friend in a coordinated effort, one of you will be a target and the other gets target practice
does this also hold true if you have other players joined in your plane as gunners? i remember in AW2, you could carry as many gunners as there were positions??
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Originally posted by CAP1
does this also hold true if you have other players joined in your plane as gunners? i remember in AW2, you could carry as many gunners as there were positions??
only allowed 1 gunner besides the pilot.........
be nice if they would change it though...........
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high 12 oclock aiming for cockpits.. fester and (dare i say it) voss were some of the best at it.. kill pilot and plane instantly blows up and sometimes you get a drone or 2 with it for your efforts.
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The key for me is patience. Typically I'm getting to the bombers after they have dropped, so they only have me (and my friends to worry about). Take your time, I go above and to the right of the formation, turn in and aim my dive in front of the bombers flight path. I stick to my dive, dont make any huge corrections, if I miss, I miss .... zoom back up and try again.
On the other side of the coin, when I am flying buffs and am being attacked(after bomb release), I dive straight for the deck, get as absolutely low as possible. This, in my opinion, limits what the fighters can do. The have to attack from above. I have cut in half the amount of sky I have to protect. They can no longer swoop down, take their shots and continue down, they have to pull up, usually well within range of my guns.
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Some bomber pilots are much tougher because they're more disciplined with the guns and know how to lead better. If the guy opens up on me at 1.5K as I run in at 450 IAS, I know I'm in the chute, and will whack him. If I'm closing to 800 before he opens up, I know I'll have a hard time. To avoid the guns, you want maximum rate of closure between you and the bomber. A head on attack is ideal here, but limits your firing time and increases the chance you'll collide. If you're in a heavy cannon plane, no problem. Open up much earlier because with a lot of closure, you can shoot at longer range. For me, I'm almost always in a Jug, and don't have the cannon. In most cases, you'll find me tipping in from just above. I try to line the bombers up, then let them pass under my nose, out of sight. This allows the engine to protect you from pilot wounds. I try to anticipate where they are and begin pushing the nose down at around 1.0K and open up, leading the nose of the bomber with my rounds. I continue to lead the nose the entire attack, and dive underneath without ever leveling out behind them. Use small pitch changes to walk the rounds into the part of the plane you want to hit, or maybe a little rudder against Lancs. If you do this, you'll almost always lay a lot of rounds on them without risk of collision. After this pass, extend away like Bozon said, using my speed to get about 1K in front of them and then pull up hard and zoom climb to about 2.5 to 3K above them (icon range). This pass and zoom should put you a bit in front of them and high. I always attack the left drone first. Against B-24's, always aim for the wing root. They catch on fire almost as easily as Zero's. Against Lancs I always aim for the outboard wingtip. Against B-17's, I always aim for the tail assembly. B-17's are the toughest to attack without a doubt, as they absorb damage better than any other. If I do get hit, typically its an oil hit and maybe a gun. Plan on getting dinged, especially against the better pilots, just make sure you manage where you take damage. I can always fly away and make the closest base with an oil hit. Just don't linger on their 6 o'clock or they will tear you up. Speed is the key. If you're not getting close to compressing, you're not going fast enough. Use WEP in the dive to accelerate as fast as possible. It takes some practice learning how you want to set up your passes. Film your attacks to determine what you did right or wrong. Then go up and try it again. The good news is that there are always bomber pilots that do not take advantage of altitude and will drone into a base at 10-15K, so you will always be able to find opportunities to practice. When I first started, I used to take a P-47N with max fuel and drop tanks, climb up to 20-25K or so and just drone around looking for bombers to attack. Watch the DarBar and see if you can see guys taking off 3-4 sectors behind the fight and put yourself in position to pick them up.
Good Luck. I always like to see people attack bombers well. My personal philosophy is that unescorted bombers in this game are lambs for the slaughter, if you're patient, smart, and follow some of the advice posted in this thread.
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You can have 1 person join your plane as a gunner.
He can gun and so can you as long as you have more than 1 plane.