Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Speed55 on April 09, 2007, 09:23:13 AM
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I was wondering if it would be possible to add map rooms to individual strat factories and make them capturable by an enemy team.
For instance, if the ammo factory is captured, then the country that captured it gets a higher re-supply rate, (less down time), for it's dead ord bunkers. The team that lost it, would have to manually (goons, mp3's) re-supply a field in that strat zone with dead ord.
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That would mean that the factories would get defended and the strat killers (score dweebs) wouldn't have anything to play for. So No, It's not possible.:aok
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Originally posted by Speed55
I was wondering if it would be possible to add map rooms to individual strat factories and make them capturable by an enemy team.
For instance, if the ammo factory is captured, then the country that captured it gets a higher re-supply rate, (less down time), for it's dead ord bunkers. The team that lost it, would have to manually (goons, mp3's) re-supply a field in that strat zone with dead ord.
On the "real" maps they are. If you cap the zone base all the zone strat changes sides. We're still running small maps while the new arenas get flushed out.
Hopefully we'll get the new strat system back in the late war arenas some day. Maybe not as big a map, but a couple zones per country anyway.
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Originally posted by Puck
On the "real" maps they are. If you cap the zone base all the zone strat changes sides.
Yeah, i remember that, and it was pretty cool... I think it would be good to take it a step further and make each strat factory capturable, so it could even work on the small maps.
It might even create mini slugfest furballs over the strat field, where either numbers, or the better pilots win, since you can't just re-up an uber ride from the strat field once your killed.
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Don't think it would work.
Maproom without a base in the immediate area means that the "sneaking" attacker has an insurmountable advantage. It would be a one mission instant capture....
But I agree that the game might benefit from a strat system that had more immediate effects.
As things stand, if you have enough players to seriously hurt the strat system, you have enough that the strat system doesnt matter.
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Originally posted by Simaril
Don't think it would work.
Maproom without a base in the immediate area means that the "sneaking" attacker has an insurmountable advantage. It would be a one mission instant capture....
As things stand, if you have enough players to seriously hurt the strat system, you have enough that the strat system doesnt matter.
True, and true.
Maybe a solution would be to add two vh's somewhere on the "strat tile?" Only spawnable vehicles would be the osti, and m16, and they could only spawn out of the vh's, and not to other fields?
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Man and with that how about a couple of plane factory's like in AW...
It would be sweet to take away their Spit's and LALA's.....
I dare to dream.....
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Thats' a good idea, even if it comes from a gator fan. :p
Go Vols!!!
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Any of these ideas are good. Anything to give AH more depth.
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Strategery... that's the ticket.....
My son is going to UT this fall
this Gator has a problem
:O
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Great ideas but the furballing community will never allow it. That's the problem. I mean can't you just see the wines already; "I want to fly the Spit 16, why can't I fly any plane I want , I paid my money, I want, I want, I want". "dam toolsheders".
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That's why I fly the Corsair....
I get the best of all worlds: I can fly Strat Missions, or Furball, or hunt the high stratosphere for Bombers, or surgically strike an airfield. I can take off and land on a CV, or drop 3,000 pounds of ordnance upon one...or sink the Cruiser should I choose.
Eny values seldom keep me from flying a Corsair.
The Corsair....my Strat plane of choice.
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Originally posted by Patches1
That's why I fly the Corsair....
I get the best of all worlds: I can fly Strat Missions, or Furball, or hunt the high stratosphere for Bombers, or surgically strike an airfield. I can take off and land on a CV, or drop 3,000 pounds of ordnance upon one...or sink the Cruiser should I choose.
Eny values seldom keep me from flying a Corsair.
The Corsair....my Strat plane of choice.
I love my Corsair, too!
About the strategy component -- Be careful here, guys. Remember that HT's formula (as he's posted before) is "The maximum fun for the maximum number of people." He's also shown persistent and consistent patterns that stress players of different styles being able to play along side each other, to maximize the fun for each. (For example, look at the difference between the tank town we have -- where at any given moment you might see bombers, GV, fighters, and attackers all doing their thing on the same real estate -- compared with the Donut's "Only Fighters Welcome Here." HT likes what we have, but said he made a mistake letting donut in the first time.)
So -
1) The furballers don't get to decide anything for anybody. In fact, when all factions complain equally, it generally means that karma has been balanced! HT makes the calls, and he does what HE thinks is best for the game.
2) There's a lot of sense in "go with the one that brought you here." Remember that the games you remember (and their strategy models) are gone for reasons that matter -- and HT made better decisions than they did. Those better decisions may include a deliberately simple strat system.
And AH is, for better or worse, a flight sim with a strategic component. It is definitely NOT a strategy game with a simulator compenent. HT's formula has been successful so far, and it doesnt seem likely that he'll abandon it for what you or I have to say.
3) Therefore, as you consider the strat system, try to avoid suggestions that TAKE AWAY people's ability to play. Fuel restrictions are limited, hordes are discouraged, and hangar down times are low, for that very reason.
For example, dont expect to get far suggesting factory/plane restricitions. It's been done before, and AFAIK HiTech was there when they did it. He knows the concept, he's seen it in place, and he decided to reject it. (Same as he rejected a pure fightertown, BTW) On the other hand, you might get somewehere developing an idea that ties intact strat systems to the ability to capture, or to have heavy (1000lb plus) bombs.
You get the idea.
HT is very open to player suggestions, when they make sense to him. Remember that HE'S the professional game designer, and we're just enthusiastic amateurs -- but umlike many professionals, HT has no problem taking a good idea and running with it. There's a long list of examples...
....and hopefully, a more robust strat system will prove to be another one!
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All I know is, time and again my brother (Flayd) has made trips to pork (on most occasions) city and troop strat factories in the hopes that barracks on the fronts would get porked soon after.
Time and again, it would turn out to be a very boring and wasted trip. Rarely an enemy to defend any of those factories, except when they are in proximity to HQ. Rarely any cooperation when requested to pork front bases soon after city/troop strat has been bombed.
Add to that that ONE lousy flight of B17's at 20-30K can blast strat to almost nothing (except the white building, of course). Should not the factories be much more fortified? Must they be totally defended by AI guns, or can HT incorperate man-able puff-acks? Factory automated defense is an absolute joke, especially to high alt cruising bombers, compared to the loads of flack seen in old recorded films of bomber missions.
In my estimation, what those factories produce is not tangible enough for any side to care about, therefore no good reason to posess or defend it.
Either improve on strat somehow, or get rid of it altogether. I wish I
had a good idea for it, but I simply don't play near as much anymore as I used to.
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Strategic warfare in AHII needs coordinated efforts, and those are very hard to put together with 2 LW arenas and arena caps in place. Otherwise, the effort is wasted. Only a small fraction of players interested in this part of the game, and finding a number of them in one country in the same arena at any one time is unlikely.
Not even worth doing solo for points, since only the Arado is a perk buff, and there are reasons it is the least flown plane in the game.
For strategic attacks to have any real effect, you have to hit the strat factories, the cities, and the strat targets at bases. You also have to hit all those troop/supply barracks in a zone to make the effect last. So many barracks now at bases.
Cities resuppy factories and HQ, and must be knocked under 50% to reduce resuppy effect to 1/6th total.
Factories resuppy the Airfields and Bases; must be knocked down under 50% to reduce resuppy effect to 1/6th total.
You can hit a strat at a field, and it's down time is listed as 2 hours. But with strat factories up, and depending on distance the drone convoy must travel each trip, the actual time it is down is about 45 minutes without player resupply.
HQ out of commission time is 3 hours, but if the city is up, it might stay down an hour, without player resupply efforts.
For the time involved in taking a flight of heavy bombers out, hit a strat, and up again for another target...... it takes a lot of time invested, and usually no one at the front takes advantage of it against base strat targets.
On the old maps, with fewer barracks, many zones, and many more players per country online, strategic warfare could be conducted to a point. With the current situation, strategic warfare is rarely seen.
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Originally posted by tedrbr
You can hit a strat at a field, and it's down time is listed as 2 hours. But with strat factories up, and depending on distance the drone convoy must travel each trip, the actual time it is down is about 45 minutes without player resupply.
Correct me if I'm mistaken, but didn't the normal barracks downtime get changed to only 15 minutes per the last update (along with lots more barracks added to fields)? Hence the feeling of futility amongst players to even consider porkage anymore?
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Originally posted by Gatr
Man and with that how about a couple of plane factory's like in AW...
It would be sweet to take away their Spit's and LALA's.....
I dare to dream.....
You are making me drool! :t
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What if it's a non-union factory?
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Originally posted by Traveler
Great ideas but the furballing community will never allow it. That's the problem. I mean can't you just see the wines already; "I want to fly the Spit 16, why can't I fly any plane I want , I paid my money, I want, I want, I want". "dam toolsheders".
So instead we could put in the Staples "Easy" button for strat monkeys?
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I'd personally like to see some effect from hitting less than all of one type of building at a field.
ie. Taking down 3 out of 4 fighter hangars should have some kind of affect rather than having to get all 4 down which just totally disables fighters.
Not sure what could happen though. I guess one option would be to limit how many planes can take off from that field at once. So say, for example, i knock down 2 hangars, now only (e.g.) 10 planes can take off from that field and be in the air at the same time. Once one of those planes is shot down, crashes or lands then another can take off. If another hangar is dropped the number goes down, if a hanger pops, then the number goes up.
Or maybe dropping 1 of 4 hangars would randomly disable 1/4 of the available aircraft types? So you could get lucky and knock out the LA7 and spit 16, or maybe you'll just knock out a bunch of hangar queens. Or maybe it doesnt have to be random - could make it set planes per hangar, i dunno.
Similar rules could apply to other building types (ord, troops etc)
Sounds good to me but reading the above speils, i can see the complaints that would herald. Just a thought.
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Ooh just had another idea. Some people arent gonna like this though:
Introduce a wait period between sorties - not long, like 20 seconds or something. So when you get shot down, you need to wait just a little bit before reupping. As FH's get destroyed the wait time increases slightly up to, say, a minute.
Maybe make it if you land succesfully you dont have to wait.
That could work... maybe...
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Originally posted by brucerer
Ooh just had another idea. Some people arent gonna like this though:
Introduce a wait period between sorties - not long, like 20 seconds or something. So when you get shot down, you need to wait just a little bit before reupping. As FH's get destroyed the wait time increases slightly up to, say, a minute.
Maybe make it if you land succesfully you dont have to wait.
That could work... maybe...
I would love to see the OFFICIAL HTC position on making the "STRAT" part of the game more a part of the game...
I know I know.... this is called ACES HIGH.... not Toolsheding-o-RAMA....
I mean runnin Trains for resupply... see there I go again....
Every big kid loves trains.....? RITE... ok it's not called "TRAINS HIGH"
BABBLE BABBLE.....
:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
I'm just GOOFIE I guess