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General Forums => Aircraft and Vehicles => Topic started by: 1K3 on April 20, 2007, 04:29:16 PM

Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: 1K3 on April 20, 2007, 04:29:16 PM
Can we have 1 more spit variant? :)

(http://www.aeroplaneart.com.au/Images/JSJ_PC_Supermarine_Spitfire_3.jpg)
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: Krusty on April 20, 2007, 04:36:21 PM
Hrm....


No.
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: Karnak on April 20, 2007, 04:50:35 PM
It isn't needed.  Clipping the wings wasn't common at all during the time the Spit V was the frontline RAF fighter.
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: Squire on April 20, 2007, 05:22:06 PM
You need a different engine to go with the wings.

That varient of the Spit V was the LF VB, with a Merlin 55M (+18 lbs boost) optimized for fighting under 10k.  Different animal entirely from a 1941 Vb.

...and you would hear the screams from the MA players by just rolling down your window. :lol
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: Jonny boy 8 on April 20, 2007, 05:31:55 PM
we already have a spit with clipped wings.

p51srule:aok
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: titanic3 on April 20, 2007, 05:45:42 PM
SPit-1
Spit-5
Spit-9
Spit-14
Spit-16
any other i might have missed...


ISN'T THAT ENOUGH????
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: 1K3 on April 20, 2007, 05:53:30 PM
Quote
Originally posted by titanic3
SPit-1
Spit-5
Spit-9
Spit-14
Spit-16
any other i might have missed...


ISN'T THAT ENOUGH????


spit 8 :)
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: Lusche on April 20, 2007, 05:59:51 PM
Quote
Originally posted by 1K3
spit 8 :)


And Seafire Mk II :)
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: 1K3 on April 20, 2007, 06:00:34 PM
Spit LF V (with +18 boost) would be nice to have because it's the spit 16 of mid-war era designed for low alt combat. :aok

Also, the Spit 9 of the mid war era would be the equivalent of spit 14 in lat war era, designed to fite @ hi alts.
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: Karnak on April 20, 2007, 07:27:26 PM
The Spit VIII we have is mid war and designed for low altitude combat.

We don't need a clipped LF.Mk V.
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: Viking on April 20, 2007, 07:46:34 PM
Oh yeah! :)


(http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/1022_1177116339_290_1108143023_spitv-clipped.jpg)
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: Jonny boy 8 on April 20, 2007, 09:11:08 PM
shut up about the spits im tired of them if u add another 1 all the noobs are sqweeling in their seats becuase we got another spit:furious

p51srule:aok
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: Wes14 on April 20, 2007, 10:14:02 PM
heres a good idea for a new Spit..the pre-wrecked spit:rofl
(http://www.rafweb.org/images/Project11.jpg)
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: DaChamp687 on April 20, 2007, 10:50:01 PM
Honestly I could careless I switch between Bf-109G-2  and Spit V or 16 depends on what I'm mostly coming up agaisnt althou it is nice to get in a P-38 or P-51  once in awhile.
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: 1K3 on April 20, 2007, 10:54:18 PM
Quote
Originally posted by Wes14
heres a good idea for a new Spit..the pre-wrecked spit:rofl
(http://www.rafweb.org/images/Project11.jpg)


Now that spit got "clipped"!:rofl
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: Spikes on April 20, 2007, 10:58:27 PM
Quote
Originally posted by 1K3
Now that spit got "clipped"!:rofl



Ummm...you need a harsher word than clipped...
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: gripen on April 20, 2007, 11:19:26 PM
Quote
Originally posted by Wes14
heres a good idea for a new Spit..the pre-wrecked spit:rofl
(http://www.rafweb.org/images/Project11.jpg)


Well, that "Spit" is a Hurri.
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: frank3 on April 21, 2007, 10:32:29 AM
They do well clipped too :D
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: Kev367th on April 21, 2007, 12:05:04 PM
Well we used to have the LF Vc.

At the time myself and most of the Spit fans were all for replacing it with the earlier F Vb during the remodel.

However -
For scenarios and MW arena it looks like we could really do with it coming back, and it could be clipped.

Also it's a reasonable stand-in for a Seafire L III, nothing else we have at the moment is.

So add the LF Vc, the XII (highest scoring sqn in 43 flew XII's) and the 1945 F.21 you basically have as much of a complete Spit lineup as anyone could want.

HT - Fix the Seafire IIc please.
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: Squire on April 21, 2007, 03:14:15 PM
Actually we used to have the 1942 Spit Vb (+16 lbs).

...The Spit LF Vb is a +18 lb boost machine with a low alt Merlin. It did @350 TAS at only 5k.
Title: Re: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: Movie on April 21, 2007, 03:18:00 PM
Quote
Originally posted by 1K3
Can we have 1 more spit variant? :)

(http://www.aeroplaneart.com.au/Images/JSJ_PC_Supermarine_Spitfire_3.jpg)

no,no and no. there is no god dang way another spit in needed.
Title: Re: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: Hoarach on April 21, 2007, 06:43:12 PM
Quote
Originally posted by 1K3
Can we have 1 more spit variant? :)

(http://www.aeroplaneart.com.au/Images/JSJ_PC_Supermarine_Spitfire_3.jpg)


Depends can we have more 38s? :t
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: Kev367th on April 21, 2007, 08:12:22 PM
Quote
Originally posted by Squire
Actually we used to have the 1942 Spit Vb (+16 lbs).

...The Spit LF Vb is a +18 lb boost machine with a low alt Merlin. It did @350 TAS at only 5k.


I think you'll find it was the Vc, I don't recall any Vb carrying 120 x 20mm rounds
Title: Re: Re: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: Viking on April 21, 2007, 08:42:12 PM
Quote
Originally posted by Hoarach
Depends can we have more 38s? :t


Sure! The more the merrier! More for everybody! :)
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: Squire on April 22, 2007, 04:56:30 PM
It was a "Spit V" generic, really, they redid the new one as a "Vb" specifically with the update, but as a "1941 Spit Vb" according to what PYRO said.  

They never claimed any specific sub type with the older AH Spit V, but it was in fact a "1942 Spit Vc"  by its armament and boost (120 rpg and +16 boost).

A Spitfire L.F. V was an +18 lb boost machine, with an "M" type Merlin, many with clipped wings, some without. We never had that in AH. The LF V was built for low level ops and was much faster than a Spit Vb or Spit Vc was down low.
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: Husky01 on April 22, 2007, 09:52:48 PM
We need more jugs! :t
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: Mister Fork on April 23, 2007, 12:46:44 AM
Sooo,

We got for allies
two 51s
three 38's
Four variants of the F4u and P-47's
SEVEN Spitties
aaaaaaaaand a  paaaaartrige in a pear treeeeeeeeee!


For Axis
6 types of Bf 109
4 types of the Fw
and... um... 2?   ... yeah two A6M types
Two Bf110
and um... umm.... hmmm...

hmmm... not much else. Either way, don't let the variant game let you get bogged down on semantics.  Even without 85% of the IJN/IJA variants, Germany is pretty much covered for fighters.  Japan's airforce was a joke except for Pearl Harbour and they had to sucker punch the US in order to get a jab in.  The real airwar was between Germany and the Allies.  But that's just my opinion.
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: Kev367th on April 23, 2007, 11:49:37 AM
Quote
Originally posted by Mister Fork
Sooo,

We got for allies
two 51s
three 38's
Four variants of the F4u and P-47's
SEVEN Spitties
aaaaaaaaand a  paaaaartrige in a pear treeeeeeeeee!


For Axis
6 types of Bf 109
4 types of the Fw
and... um... 2?   ... yeah two A6M types
Two Bf110
and um... umm.... hmmm...



Well unlike the U.S. and some other particpants in WWII Britain had neither the resources (hence the wooden Mossie) or manpower to build umpteen different kind of aircraft.

So it made sense to adapt/modify/upgrade what they had.
Therefore you would expect a lot of different Spits to represent the 6 years wartime development (in fact we have no 1945 Spit).

To fully represent the development 3 more Spits and 1 Seafire is needed -
LF Vc - for scenarios and MW arena
XII - First Griffon Spit, highest scoring Spit sqn in 1943 flew XII's
F.21 - 1945 Spit
L III - Highest numbered produced Seafire of WWII.

Let me turn it on its head -
The largest planeset in the game belongs to a country who didn't enter the war until over a year after it started.
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: Bruv119 on April 23, 2007, 11:55:25 AM
Good points Kev totally agree!

Did you see my question about the Temp's ammo loadout.

It is widely believed that it could carry 200 Rpg as max capacity.

The Niki has an option to load more rounds and the Tempest could do with the same option.

Time to appreciate how UBER British planes really were  :t
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: Kev367th on April 23, 2007, 12:10:19 PM
I didn't Bruv, and I don't know a lot about the Temp.

Yeah it's funny how the U.S. and German planesets are heavily biased to 44/45 yet the only two Spits are mid 44 (XVI is same as LF IXe).
We can't get a max boosted one, and we can't get a 1945 one.

To say 7 Spits (8 if you include the Seafire) is like saying we have something like 20 probably more U.S. fighters/jabos.

The only difference is Britain didn't have the resources to make different types of aircraft, so modified/upgraded what they had.

The Mossie was wooden because Geoffrey DeHavilland realised the only way it would get considered was if it didn't use raw materials destined for other purposes.

So I'll say yup we have 7 Spits, 3 Hurris, 1 Seafire, Tiff, and Temp, but we have over 20 U.S. fighters, which is more an apples to apples comparison.

To further show the absurdity -
The first P-47 missions weren't until April 43 yet we have FIVE or FOUR versions to represent 2 years.

By that yardstick we should have 10 or 12-13 Spits.
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: Laurie on April 23, 2007, 12:17:39 PM
Quote
Originally posted by Kev367th
I didn't Bruv, and I don't know a lot about the Temp.

Yeah it's funny how the U.S. and German planesets are heavily biased to 44/45 yet the only two Spits are mid 44 (XVI is same as LF IXe).
We can't get a max boosted one, and we can't get a 1945 one.

To say 7 Spits (8 if you include the Seafire) is like saying we have something like 20 probably more U.S. fighters/jabos.

The only difference is Britain didn't have the resources to make different types of aircraft, so modified/upgraded what they had.

The Mossie was wooden because Geoffrey DeHavilland realised the only way it would get considered was if it didn't use raw materials destined for other purposes.

So I'll say yup we have 7 Spits, 3 Hurris, 1 Seafire, Tiff, and Temp, but we have over 20 U.S. fighters, which is more an apples to apples comparison.


here,here

More brit planes at their best not turned dimmed to make others look brighter,

and why on god's earth is the pony 8 ENY?
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: Bruv119 on April 23, 2007, 12:25:24 PM
well there isnt much reference out their for the Temp but all accounts so far  indicate  150 RPG.

Back to the Clipped wing Spit-5  I have flown this in FA and its kinda like an under powered spit 16 which is obvious.  

Great fun to fly there though had many fights outnumbered against the japanese horde all trying to turn with me in it.
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: Squire on April 23, 2007, 04:38:12 PM
Well the Mossie, Tiff, Temp and Hurricane, and Lanc are waiting in the line to be redone, so, we dont yet know what new or different varients we may see yet. Im sure the RAF rides will get a few more before all is said and done.
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: 1K3 on April 23, 2007, 06:13:36 PM
It would be nice to have spit XII too.  It won't be as dweeby as the Spit 16.  It is slightly equal to Fw 190A-5

Speed
(http://www.spitfireperformance.com/dp845speed.gif)
(http://www.hitechcreations.com/ahhelp/models/charts/190a5spd.gif)

Climb
(http://www.spitfireperformance.com/dp845climb.gif)
(http://www.hitechcreations.com/ahhelp/models/charts/190a5clmb.gif)
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: MiloMorai on April 23, 2007, 07:11:17 PM
That would make Dan real happy. ;)
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: Kev367th on April 23, 2007, 07:21:16 PM
Never happen, and on the way off chance it did, it would get perked.
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: 1K3 on April 23, 2007, 08:56:13 PM
Quote
Originally posted by Kev367th
Never happen, and on the way off chance it did, it would get perked.


There goes that 'high mark #' syndrome.

XII was basically designed to mimic 190A-5's overall performance.
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: Widewing on April 23, 2007, 10:22:19 PM
Quote
Originally posted by gripen
Well, that "Spit" is a Hurri.


I scrolled down looking to see if anyone recognized that it was a Hurricane...

:aok

My regards,

Widewing
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: Kev367th on April 24, 2007, 08:22:51 AM
Quote
Originally posted by 1K3
There goes that 'high mark #' syndrome.

XII was basically designed to mimic 190A-5's overall performance.


Naw - It's a Spit with a Griffon and relatively good performance = PERK , falls under same category as the XIV.
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: 1K3 on April 24, 2007, 12:31:52 PM
But c'mon most late war planes will catch the XII.  It's got lower climb rate than AH spit 9.
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: SgtPappy on April 25, 2007, 06:52:33 PM
Actually the Spitfire XII hits close to 380 mph on the deck. That's what the Griffon was optimized for in the Spitfire XII (but you have to check what kind of Griffon it is; some 12's were powered by a lower rated Griffon). Plus it climbes very well with the Griffon VI as opposed to the Griffon IIB. Also, it only does well at really low alt. The Mk.XII has a wingloading equivalent to that of the F4U Corsair anyway, and pilots are already giving the Spit8/9/16's some trouble out there in the F4U - the Spit 12 will probably just get mauled.

At any rate, i love spits, but i have to agree there's already too many to put in something like an LF Vb. Its a tremendously specific subvariant and none of the other planes have the oppertunity to have something like that, so neither should the spitfire. Also, clipped wings did not define the Spitfire as an LF. the 'LF' prefix was there because the Merlin engines used had their supercharger blowers cropped in diameter in order to produce a +18 lb. boost at low altitude. The Spitfire LF VIII (which is in the game) and the XVI can match every performance figure by 2.5K while having much better tops speeds. The Spitfire LF V would eat Zekes alive, but against BnZ fihgters, the only thing that the LF V will do is exist - or cease to do so if attacked.

Yea btw, the Hispano cannons on the Tempest Mk.V (series I / II) are fitted with 150 rpg. The inboard cannon was fed through a belt that was even more inboard, while the outboard cannon was fed through an outboard, curved belt so as not to have any funky guns setups like seen on the spitfire which had both belts coming into their respective cannons from the same side.
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: 1K3 on April 25, 2007, 07:41:58 PM
I meant this Spit XII (~1943 with early Griffons)

(http://www.spitfireperformance.com/spitfire-XII.jpg)
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: Kev367th on April 25, 2007, 10:38:33 PM
Quote
Originally posted by 1K3
I meant this Spit XII (~1943 with early Griffons)

(http://www.spitfireperformance.com/spitfire-XII.jpg)


Oh yeah, lets make sure we can't get a Spit at max boost or performance, thats reserved for certain other planesets.
Title: Clipped Spitfire V
Post by: 1K3 on April 26, 2007, 12:17:57 AM
Quote
Originally posted by Kev367th
Oh yeah, lets make sure we can't get a Spit at max boost or performance, thats reserved for certain other planesets.


I think I'm lost at what you're saying.

The graph above IS the typical performance for limited production Mk XIIs that only saw action for 1 year.