Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Vermillion on May 15, 2000, 07:27:00 AM
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Would you really like to see? I mean outside of the standard staples of WWII sims and regardless of whether it saw combat in WWII.
This is the same question Pyro asked, but lets limit this one to bombers.
After the Lancaster and Ju-88 they're working on currently, I haven't heard anything about more bombers, so lets give Pyro some ideas.
And please limit your ansers to ONE (1) Bomber !!!! Do not post your top 10.
I repeat ONE only please
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Vermillion
**MOL**, Men of Leisure
"Real Men fly Radials, Nancy Boys fly Spitfires"
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B-29
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Here is my choice.
With the advent of the Navy in 1.04, I think we should go with a nautical theme.
My choice:
PB4Y-2 Privateer
Yes its another American Bomber, but its quite different and never been seen before in a Sim. It was based on a highly modified B-24, built for Naval Patrol and Attack work.
(http://www.navylib.com/ContributedPics/S.Hawley/MonCheri.jpg)
For more information look here, a really neat plane:
http://www.history.navy.mil/branches/hist-ac/pb4y-2.pdf (http://www.history.navy.mil/branches/hist-ac/pb4y-2.pdf)
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Vermillion
**MOL**, Men of Leisure
"Real Men fly Radials, Nancy Boys fly Spitfires"
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a "ONE" question again? <sigh>
HE-177 for me then.
-Westy
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or He-111
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HE 111
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IL-2
Hooligan
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A-20
It fought in every theatre from start to finish, served with all the Allies, and performed stellar service. It's never been modeled before, either. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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Do-17, 'cuz nobody has modeled one since the old BOB game (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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pzvg- "5 years and I still can't shoot"
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What was that US dive bomber used in the Pacific ? Can't remember the name right now...
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B-29
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There were really only two, Saintaw.
SBD Dauntless
Curtiss SB2C Helldiver (think that is the right prefix)
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H8K2 Kawanishi "Emily"
(http://www.j-aircraft.com/walk/hiroyuki%20_takeuchi/h8k21.jpg)
(http://www.j-aircraft.com/walk/ken_glass/h8k-3.jpg)
Sisu
[This message has been edited by Karnak (edited 05-15-2000).]
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Hmmm, what was the name of that british bomber that didnt have any guns? I vote for that one! hehee
JagdNine(for jump lessons call-1800-bailout)
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(http://www.user.shentel.net/vonz/mskt.jpg)
[This message has been edited by NineZ (edited 05-15-2000).]
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There's another American medium bomber that saw action in every theater of the war. Unlike the others; it was good enuff to continue service clear thru the Vietnam war; and is right now, today; flying in active service fighting fires. No other WWII aircraft has had such a long and distinguised service life. This bird is in fact a refinement of the A20 Havoc.
The Invader.
(http://www.military.cz/usa/air/war/bomber/a26/a26_2.jpg)
The culmination of a dream of aeronautical engineer and designer, Ed Heinemann of Douglas Aircraft, the A-26 incorporated most of the then "state of the art" technological advances, primarily the new laminar flow wing. Other innovations regarding power plants and armament caused it to be labeled by some as "the fastest and most potent and heavily armed aircraft to emerge from WW II".
With a maximum diving speed of 420 MPH and a three ton load of various armaments, (i.e., 500 lb. bombs, napalm, firebombs, rockets, etc.) a talented and dedicated crew (pilot, navigator and gunner) could cause to come to pass the very purpose of war, which is, on the most basic level - "to kill people and break things".
There's eight 50 caliber machine guns mounted in two vertical rows of four each, three in each wing outside of the engines, and two more in a rear top turret that could be remoted to his control, the pilot had available at his fingertip trigger some sixteen guns firing at the same instant. The rear gunner usually had two each in his two remote turrets.
To couch that lethal potential in very simple terms: You could put sixteen forward firing 50 caliber guns, with some five to six thousand rounds of armor piercing ammunition into a single target in about sixty seconds. It was the personification of WWII "firepower", something the USAF would not be able to duplicate till the Warthog showed up 25 years later. (that'll put the binders on the cannon-hawgs! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Powered by two 2,000 horsepower Pratt & Whitney R-2800 air-cooled radial engines, its substantial bomb load and firepower (which, at one time included a 75 mm canon in the nose), the Invader could waltz away from most fighters at well beyond 350 MPH at sea level.
Just the ticket for fast attacks on AH fields; this 'buff' would be able to turn and fight rather than run and gun.
Yes; I know this one has been done (poorly) in another sim... but this plane NEEDS to be here. This one will be a welcome relief for fighter pilots that can't stand the thought of driving a 'conventional' bomber to help the cause; and it's a good transition plane for bomber pilots who profess to 'suck' in fighters.
Hang
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Arado Ar234. It was operational, it flew a lot of sorties,and it was awesome.
It is a jet, yes, but it can be catched by a diving plane, more or less easily. It carried mroe or less light payload...so it is a bomber that wont unbalance the planeset too much...
Ar234. Ar234, Ar234!! RARARA!! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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TBF Avenger.
Yes, you heard me right! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
-- Todd/DMF
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Emily
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daddog
332nd Flying Mongrels (http://www.ropescourse.org/flying.htm)
Snapshots (http://www.ropescourse.org/snapshot.htm)
(http://www.ropescourse.org/cdaddog.jpg)
Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in his shoes.
That way, if he gets angry, he'll be a mile away - and barefoot.
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I hate to not vote for the A-26, but it's been done.
Tupolev Tu-2. Looks kind of like a Pe-2 but bigger. 375 mph with a 6000 lb bomb load!
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He 177
Az
(http://www.link-goe.de/~m.henze/images/177k.gif)
II.(K)/JG2
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HE-111
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(http://home.sol.no/~laerga/lassel.gif)
The Wild Vikings
Commanding Officer
lasse-
[This message has been edited by lasse (edited 05-15-2000).]
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Double post.
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(http://home.sol.no/~laerga/lassel.gif)
The Wild Vikings
Commanding Officer
lasse-
[This message has been edited by lasse (edited 05-15-2000).]
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Hmm Kieren that's a great point about the A-20. That gives you a USSR, USA, or RAF medium bomber for scenarios with just one plane type. Also it was versatile. With variants you get a level bomber, attack (strafer) plane, and night-fighter.
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Well with the Lancaster already on the drawing board very soon,
ill vote for HE-111
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A-26
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Rendar
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HE-111
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Right, funked. And if you stretch the imagination a teeny-weeny bit, you get a DB-7, used by the French in the very early days of the war.
It was maneuverable, not overly fast, but could do it all. I think it would be cool, anyway. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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I think the Dutch flew those too Kieren. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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He-177 (minus all the fires, bugs , and problems the real planes encountered!)
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A-26 Invader would rock! But When did it enter service??? You say it saw action in every theatre in ww2? I have never seen a photo of one without the post ww2 U.S. insignia...
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Never mind, just answered my own question, It entered service in 1944 per this source http://www.seagifts.com/seagifts/26inwhissmot.html (http://www.seagifts.com/seagifts/26inwhissmot.html)
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A-26.
Though I've got half a mind to vote for the He-111, watch it get modeled, and watch no one fly it because it is easy to kill.
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SnakeEyes
o-o-o-
=4th Fighter Group=
[This message has been edited by SnakeEyes (edited 05-15-2000).]
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He 177
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A20 is my fav but would be chewed alive here and wouldnt be used outside scenarios. A26 fits the uber era of aces high. But we can always hope. I for one would only fly the a20 if made.
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Dnil
JG-2
Part time aircraft restorer. www.kingwoodcable.com/jheuer (http://www.kingwoodcable.com/jheuer)
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let me vote for HE-111 once again 'cuz RAF killed lotsa of it (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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bikekil
308 (Polish) Squadron RAF "City of Cracow"
(http://www.raf303.org/308/308banner.gif)
[This message has been edited by bike killa (edited 05-16-2000).]
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Hehehe Dnil, I agree. If the A-26B or C had been modeled in AH instead of the B-26, I'd probably be running a US 9th AF squad instead of an RAF squad. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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A-26, would love to fly this mother. You just gotta love all those .50's (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
[This message has been edited by firbal (edited 05-16-2000).]
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I have not counted, but it looks like the HE-111 got most votes (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
A-26 in second place, still, if anyone count the suggestions the result may be different.
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(http://home.sol.no/~laerga/lassel.gif)
The Wild Vikings
Commanding Officer
lasse-
[This message has been edited by lasse (edited 05-16-2000).]
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Since I know the A26 is coming...
HE-111
There HAS to be a reason the Germans stuck with it for so long...
IF we ever start seeing fantasy aircraft, however (like the 51H, Bearcat, etc), I'll change my vote to the Horten Wing.
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NO MORE AMERICAN, BRITISH OR GERMAN STUFF!!!!
At least until the other nations have had their plane sets padded a bit.
Lets get some Russian, Italian and Japanese aircraft.
The Germans have the Ju88 coming and the Brits have the Lanc on the way. The Americans already have more airframes than any other nation. The Germans have more aircraft than any other nation. I don't want USA vs. Germany High.
Sisu
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Voss-
How do you KNOW the A26 is coming? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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That's not the way to play Karnak. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
Here is how it is done...
I think the Ilyushin Il-10 would be way better than any attack aircraft we have in the game.
Karnak
See? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
Sorry, it wasn't a question about play balance, it was about what people wanted to see...
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A26 a26 a26 (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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he 177, what else!!!!!!!!
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(http://saintaw.tripod.com/habicht.jpg)
JG2 "Richthofen" (http://www.busprod.com/weazel2/)
[This message has been edited by HABICHT (edited 05-16-2000).]
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Kieren, you're right of course. I'm just frusterated because all anybody seems to want is the same old US and German junk. I'm just really bored by US and German aircraft. I know they SO much better than anybody elses (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif), but we've all seen all of them before.
Sisu
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Hehe Karnak-
FWIW, I would love to see more Russian/Japanese/Italian bombers myself. It's just that for me the A20 is a plane that "fits" me better. It is good, but not too good. It has mult-role capability. It served many different nations. It was active the whole war. That is what I based my call on, I tried to keep the rest of the concerns out.
Yes, the Japanese selection is sure thin right now, as is Russian, Italian... (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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Careful Sisu, someone might mistake you for me (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
The Emily would be my second choice, just something stragely appealing to me in the Privateer.
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Vermillion
**MOL**, Men of Leisure
"Real Men fly Radials, Nancy Boys fly Spitfires"
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LOL..
All you guys wantin an He111.. u gonna fly it?? Mission: Punch tru defenders; attack and destroy the field acks; defend yourself; attack via strafing tracks and buildings; defend yourself; egress; defend yourself; return to base. Alive.
You wanna A26; or the He111?
Is this like the typhie???.. everybody wants one; but when they find out it don't do anything better than a cannon hawg; it's left in the hanger. It'll be the same with the He111; the current Martin B26 is a far better aircraft for the missions we fly than an He111. Gettin an He111; the kawasaki's or the TBF/SBD's will be great for scenarios.. won't play well at all in the main.
I'd rather see new A/C introduced that will play well in the main where we all fly most of the time... standards for survival in that enviornment are high. The A26 Invader is the right tool for the job.
When we get an HA, well then; spin out some neato early war crud like the He111 and Vindicators and Nakijima biplanes and Brewsters; P40's and Caudrons... but not now. We need A/C to finish fillin in the main!
Hang
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Hangtime, the H8K2 "Emily" was reputed to be the toughest plane in the Pacific Theatre, on either side. Of course, given how big planes can't absorb damage now, that might not mean anything.
Vermillion, my handle is Karnak. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Sisu is a Finnish word that translates roughly as "What must be done, will be done, regardless of the cost". E.g. We WILL get through to the target.
Sisu
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Very good translate Karnak (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Put another Vote on for the...
A26
16 forward firing .50's! WOOHOO!
Terror
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Couldn't say it better hang....no other plane comes close with regard to overall impact and versitility. only point you didn't mention is that the vader had a ratio of better than 1 to 1 in air combat vs enemy fighters. If you only had 1 bomber in a tactical ww2 enviornment...this is the one
Bring on the Vader
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Thank you Staga.
Sisu
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i vote for the
HE-177
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HE-177A-5 or A-7 with ability to launch the PC 1400 FX, Hs 293 or Hs 294 radio controlled glider bombs. Now thats not asking for to much is it?
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Karnak.. that big flying boat is beautiful. I'm not entirely familiar with it's load out or aramament, Tho I suspect it would fall as easy prey to most of the late war stuff in the main arena.. hell; I'd probably try to attack it with an martin marauder. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
As for flying boats; nothing was prettier than the big Martins and Grummans Amphibs... legends of strength and range in their own right. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Salute; Sir!!
Hang
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How many 20mm guns did that Emily carry? I know at least one for the tail...
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Kawanishi H8K "Emily"
Defensive Armament:
20mm Type 99 Cannon mounted in bow, dorsal, and tail turrets, and two beam hatches
Type 92 7.7mm MG's in ventral, port, and starboard fuselage sides and cockpit hatches
Payload:
Two 800kg Torpedoes (1,764lbs each)
or
8 250kg (551 lbs)bombs
or
16 60kg bombs or depth charges
Not bad in either respect for a Japanese Bomber, not bad at all.
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Vermillion
**MOL**, Men of Leisure
"Real Men fly Radials, Nancy Boys fly Spitfires"
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Vermillion, thanks for supplying that info. I don't have access to it my self.
Hangtime, I've always been partial to the PBY Flying Catalinas. Nice workhorses.
Sisu
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Ok so you have a problem with german craftsmanship (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif) how about Br20?
And Hang, ever stop to consider that if folks would stop dragging in all that late war stuff that can even make a dweeb look good(no reference to you btw) and we had to use planes that were full of faults, in overcoming those faults we would really begin to seperate the wheat from the chaff
(I think i'm probably chaff, but I like high fiber) (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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pzvg- "5 years and I still can't shoot"
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Brand loyalty?? LOL.. yah; I guess I'm a rabid flag salutin' American Patriot. No bones about it... but I let my wife buy a Volvo.. not a Buick. The Volvo was a just plain better, safer car for my wifes needs.
Hell I'd fly a 190 or Me109 if it was a better plane than my Mustang. But it ain't.
Hey; I wanna get the job done; and get out alive. You expect me to ask for or vote for something LESS than the very best to do that job, accomplish that mission??
No way. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Hang