Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Wishlist => Topic started by: Knegel on May 04, 2007, 12:45:11 AM
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Hi,
long time the P38, F4U and P51 flaps(specaly full flap setting) got complained, but instead of adjusting this planes, most other planes got this kind of "hoover flaps" as well.
This flaps are far outside of the physical law, they work rather like big baloons than flaps.
Even while 80° banks close to stallspeed this flaps keep the plane up, but its new to me that flaps create a sideward lift and while a rolls at slow speed the plane dont lose the expected altitude when its head over.
Greetings,
Knegel
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This flaps are far outside of the physical law, they work rather like big baloons than flaps.
You might wish to do some studding on this statement, because you are incorrect.
HiTech
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When will the 109 and 190 flaps be reworked?
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109 flaps deploy at 200mph now. Rarely use 'em in the 190, couldn't say.
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Originally posted by Krusty
109 flaps deploy at 200mph now. Rarely use 'em in the 190, couldn't say.
Don't remember the specific but crumpp has posted many pages that shows they can deply at a faster speed. I used them alot in a 109G2 when turnfighting.
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Automatic retraction of flaps didn't happen in WWII. But damage to flaps that were not retracted soon enough or as a result of deployment at to fast an airspeed did occur all the time. Would make a nice addition to aircraft damage model.
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Originally posted by Larry
Don't remember the specific but crumpp has posted many pages that shows they can deply at a faster speed. I used them alot in a 109G2 when turnfighting.
Yes he was always very good at selective realism.
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Originally posted by hitech
You might wish to do some studding on this statement, because you are incorrect.
HiTech
Hi,
actually i made researches.
According to my datas the full extracted flaps decrease the turnrate and rolling manouvers with full flaps close above stall speed result in a very big barrel roll with plenty of altitude lost, not so in AH.
According to my datas, flaps tend to decrease the max AOA, they shift the speed of max lift to a slower speed, for the price of MUCH drag. In most cases also the cog get shifted, so the plane get nose or tail heavy. Full extracted Flaps in general have a very bad airfoil with much drag as result , which in general dont cover the whole wing.
Often the stall speed with full extracted flaps is higher than with only a bit extracted flaps!!
This is the reult of full extracted flaps:
-less good climb
-higher sink rate
-more steep glidepath
-smaler min speed(stall speed)
-higher stall risk
-at higher speeds or a while enabling full power, often turbolences behind the flaps, which reach the tail wing and suck it down, have a nose up movement as result(this isnt caused by more lift!!).
Since already around 5° extracted flaps gain 90% of the speed reduction(with 5° flaps the min stall speed is almost reached), extracting to a higher angle mainly cause drag and change the AoA to provide a better sight.
Afaik wrong in AH is:
1. full flaps have to much lift as result.
2. the handling with full flaps is much to good.
3. the turnrate is to good.
The manouver flap setting should be the most effective flap setting while sustained turns with flaps(best turnrate), without flaps the turnrate, same like the sink rate should be the best!!
The manouver flap setting of the Fowler flaps should probably provide a better turnrate, while a sistained turn, than without flaps.
Also for flaps count: Double lift = 4 x drag!! (fowler flaps are a exception).
As result the turrate have to go down!
Greetings,
Knegel
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Originally posted by hitech
Yes he was always very good at selective realism.
If all the pages that he photo copied from the smithsonian were right then is there a reason why they havent been reworked or are you saying that he was wrong? Not trying to be an arse just would like to know if the pages he posted were right or wrong.
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Originally posted by hitech
Yes he was always very good at selective realism.
:noid :noid :noid
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Originally posted by Traveler
Automatic retraction of flaps didn't happen in WWII. But damage to flaps that were not retracted soon enough or as a result of deployment at to fast an airspeed did occur all the time. Would make a nice addition to aircraft damage model.
This has already been beaten to death as well. HiTech will not remove the auto-retracting flaps from the game for those planes that didn't have this feature in real life. It's been a bane of Lightning drivers in this game since the P-38 was added.
ack-ack
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Originally posted by Knegel
Hi,
long time the P38, F4U and P51 flaps(specaly full flap setting) got complained, but instead of adjusting this planes, most other planes got this kind of "hoover flaps" as well.
This flaps are far outside of the physical law, they work rather like big baloons than flaps.
Even while 80° banks close to stallspeed this flaps keep the plane up, but its new to me that flaps create a sideward lift and while a rolls at slow speed the plane dont lose the expected altitude when its head over.
Greetings,
Knegel
as artie lang would say Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
(http://www.playboy.com/sex/d12/artielange/imx/image1.jpg)
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Originally posted by hitech
Yes he was always very good at selective realism.
:aok :aok :aok :D :rofl :rofl
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Originally posted by Ack-Ack
This has already been beaten to death as well. HiTech will not remove the auto-retracting flaps from the game for those planes that didn't have this feature in real life. It's been a bane of Lightning drivers in this game since the P-38 was added.
ack-ack
If the flaps would get modeled right, the P38 fowler flaps would bring the realistic advantage over the other flap systems. Currently the F4U, 109 and Spit seems to take more benefit by using full flaps, than the P38 by using the manouver flap setting, where they still did work as real fowler flaps.
At least the 109 flaps could get moved without steps and could get used as manouverflaps, even at higher speeds, though the E-bleeding habbit and the all over changed handling with flaps stopped most pilots to use them while combat!!
At the 2nd and 3rd step (in AH) the flaps should get damaged if the plane gets to fast.
Greetings,
Knegel