Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Wishlist => Topic started by: SShot on May 05, 2007, 06:29:00 PM
-
As we all,.....most..... know, after you bail out and hit the ground, there isnt much else to do but "end sorite". I was thinking you could *caughs* barrow an enemy's jeep and rtb, or maybe someone in a C-47 could land in a clearing and pick you up? I'm just spitballing, so any other ideas are welcome. Or if this is completely stupid, ingore it, but i mean, dosent hurt to ask, does it?
SShot
-
Why do you bother floating down at all?
I don't even bother opening my chute.
(opens radio window)
<.ef>
Back in tower and ready to relaunch -- quicker even than riding it down. :aok
-
i like jeep idea like at a vbase if you bail there is really a oarking lot beside contral tower (this is true) there will be jeeps and you can get in one and use in to escape and make somebody have a really bad day.:aok
-
This isnt grand theft auto or some FPS its Aces HIgh. When you bail you goto the tower and up again.
-
(http://www.dreamwork.dk/goodideapolice.jpg)
:rolleyes: yea lets have the ability to steal jeeps. the jeep drivers will be too busy trying to jack each others **** to see those lancasters:rolleyes:
-
Ok, so it was a bad idea, jeez. It dosen't hurt to ask does it?
-
Don't be upset SShot, there has been alot of threads asking for this idea (SAR and such) and some people are getting sick of reading the same request each time!
If you use the 'searchbutton' next time, you can see if your idea was as unique as you thought :)
-
In the future, it may behoove responders to check on the number of posts the thread originator has to his credit.
(http://www.thesmilies.com/smilies/sports/fishing.gif) (http://www.thesmilies.com) (http://www.thesmilies.com/smilies/sports/fishing.gif) (http://www.thesmilies.com) (http://www.thesmilies.com/smilies/sports/fishing.gif) (http://www.thesmilies.com)
This is getting to be a pandemic on these boards.
(or skoolllzzzz ouuuutttt foooorrrrr summmeerrrrr )
-
I did search, with words like rescue, but i didnr get anything.
I'm not new to fourms, just to this one. I know too search for my topic before i post, I guess i just used the wrong keywords:D.
-
From a post I had in a different forum:
Fun with .45's:
Stand in the map room and kill loads of troops while also scoring proxie kills on awsome LW planes (I had 6 one night).
Kill the manned ack at any field.
Stand on an enemy runway in front of where the planes spawn placing a single shot into the engine area. High likelyhood of watching a smoker leave the runway and a possible kill if patient.
Stand on an enemy runway NEXT to where the planes spawn. Aim directly for the pilot's head giving him a pilot wound before he even gets rolling (this one is particularily fun). If he actually takes off a kill is almost guaranteed.
Why have a .45 in hand if you can't have some fun with it?
-
Originally posted by E25280
Why do you bother floating down at all?
I don't even bother opening my chute.
(opens radio window)
<.ef>
Back in tower and ready to relaunch -- quicker even than riding it down. :aok
they ought toget rid of this if you bail you have to open it and ride it down.Then you will have something to do. Get shot by me. Oh the whines. me.:t :rofl
him :mad: :furious :mad: :cry
-
I need some tips on getting kills with the 45.
Most of the time I just get a new plane but some time ago i bailed over an enemy field. I walked into the bomber hangar and an il2 spawned in.
I put a whole clip into his cockpit and he flew off unharmed.
What are the best ways to kill a spawning plane with it?
Do you have to stand Inside the plane?
Bruv
~S~
-
I get right on the runway and wait for someone to spawn. Shoot him the it head of the pilot as many times as you can. If you dont kill him he'll have a PW. and youll get the kill if someone else vulches him.
-
Originally posted by Larry
This isnt grand theft auto
:D
-
well, I think should happen is if u bail u have to ride it out. I mean the chute should open up automatically. Reason, to get rid of the bombers who drop there bombs on a target and then bail out just say they can reup again. To me that is gaming the game and I seeing it happen more often then ever. Fighters go up to get the bomber just to have the bomber bail out before they get to him and don't even get a kill on him. That bothers me, lol.
-
Originally posted by AKDogg
well, I think should happen is if u bail u have to ride it out. I mean the chute should open up automatically. Reason, to get rid of the bombers who drop there bombs on a target and then bail out just say they can reup again. To me that is gaming the game and I seeing it happen more often then ever. Fighters go up to get the bomber just to have the bomber bail out before they get to him and don't even get a kill on him. That bothers me, lol.
Please no. I remember the days of AW. If you opened your chute too early by accident from 20K it would take 30+ minutes to get to the ground. I doubt many would have the patience for that.
I do agree the drop and bail bombers are a problem though and one that's gotten out of hand.
To kill with a .45 you have to be beside the enemy aircraft, use zoom to get a clear aim on the pilots head, aim and fire. You probably won't kill him on the spot but be patient while the pilot wound catches up with him. When on the side of the runway I take just 1 shot per plane and most either die shortly after take-off or end sortie right away to get another plane but I do miss a few too.
-
Originally posted by SShot
As we all,.....most..... know, after you bail out and hit the ground, there isnt much else to do but "end sorite". I was thinking you could *caughs* barrow an enemy's jeep and rtb, or maybe someone in a C-47 could land in a clearing and pick you up? I'm just spitballing, so any other ideas are welcome. Or if this is completely stupid, ingore it, but i mean, dosent hurt to ask, does it?
SShot
so u want aces high 2 turned into Grand theft auto. that is a very stupid idea, this is ww2 simulatior not jack peoples jeeps or tanks. :mad:
p51srule:aok
-
Originally posted by AKDogg
well, I think should happen is if u bail u have to ride it out. I mean the chute should open up automatically. Reason, to get rid of the bombers who drop there bombs on a target and then bail out just say they can reup again. To me that is gaming the game and I seeing it happen more often then ever. Fighters go up to get the bomber just to have the bomber bail out before they get to him and don't even get a kill on him. That bothers me, lol.
No solution there. If I know I'll be stuck in my chute, I'll just Kamikaze instead. Simple.
"Bomb and Bail" has been brought up before, but it comes down to the time invested in running buffs, and the reward you get for landing them again. To operate buffs takes a much higher investment of play time than the fighters. And you don't have to "bail", you can Kamikaze, Ditch, Run into a furball and try to get kills before being shot down, strafe and vulch.... lot's of ways to suicide in buffs to avoid the long flight back to base.
Why would most buff drivers bother running the buffs all the way back to base? For buff perks? Maybe if they've got a few kills to land and get their name in lights. As far as rankings, so long as you are getting damage points and some kills, the more missions you fly by bailing and upping again will make up for not landing any missions at all, if you looking for a better bomber or overall score.
Unless you like Arados, there is no real reason to collect bomber perk points. Last I checked, I had well over 2,500 buff perks.... and that's after blowing some of 3-plane flights of Arados that I ended up losing some or all on. Very rare for me to lift an Arado, as I prefer the Ki-67 to it for similar missions.
I supported the A-26 Invader (best perkable buff ride that we could reasonably see added to this game, all things considered) so hard in the popular vote, because I know that bomber pilots need other perk rides if we want to see fewer "bomb and bail" tactics used, but that effort failed.
In short. Unless there is more incentive for buff drivers to land their planes, you will continue to see more "bomb and bail" tactics. Mandatory chute to the ground in bail (especially from 25K alt?!) --- we just won't bail. Simple.
-
yea but at least the fighter close to u will get the kill if u auger. When they bail u don't unless u hit them.
-
There was a discussion a while back. The idea was that if you bail and land then someone could rescue you in a PT boat, Jeep, Grasshopper, Storch or Lysander and take you home. You get to claim any kills that you'd otherwise have lost.
The downside is that the rescuer doesn't get to earn anything.
-
Now that might be a good idea but only if you were behind enemy lines. And when you get back it says:
SYSTEM: "CPID" has been rescued by "CPID" and has landed ?? kills.
But they dont get the "in a "P-51D" because they lost it, and the perks are split between the two people downed pilot and the guy who rescued him. But I dont think alot of people will do it.
-
Teens are the problem. Teens.
Help us, Silat!
:furious
-
By johnny boy 8
so u want aces high 2 turned into Grand theft auto. that is a very stupid idea, this is ww2 simulatior not jack peoples jeeps or tanks.
Ok are you blind? read the last sentence of my original post. It says that if it's stupid ignore it .Now i got the picture that this has already been posted before so you dont have to rant. I already said i searched it and found no results. Jeez, i'm sorry. You guys dont have to unload just because someone brought up the same old topic! I'm part of another forums and when that person brings up an old topic, i try to give him help and direct him to the post that covered the issuse. I dont just go "not agian" or "you noob" or any of this crap that you guys are basicly saying. And I've heard in-game and here, that teens are the the problem. Just because we play differnetly then you 40 year olds doent't make us different. Theres a stereotype that all teens are bad an are stupid. This isnt the case. At school, alot of my classmates get very good grades. Now, if you dont have anything new to add, then please dont. I hate threads that go on for 3 pages of people saying "omg what stupid noob" and just being mean. Does that acomplish anything? If you guys are as smart as you think you are, you should know the answer.
-
Don't take it bad SShot - happens to all of us. I've put forward ideas only to be laughed at, but someone else put a similar idea forward and everyone thought it was really cool. Happens to everyone. It's just luck as to who answers your posts.
We've had lots of ideas and discussion on this BBS - like submarines, controllable vessels (E-boats and Vospers), artillery, balanced vehicle/plane sets, infantry, extra effects etc. etc. sometimes people listen, but often they don't really care, however they can be really funny when they rant on about how stupid you are.
I feel sorry for HTC because few people actually give them thanks for improving something or when they manage to add some cool effects - like a tank blowing up.
-
i killed a b17 with a 45. it took all my ammo into the pilots head but THAN KAMBOOM i also kill ack with 45.
-
Yeah, martyn, i agree, HTC dosent get enough credit for their games. But also i want to apologize to everyone about my last post, I guess i let my feeling get the the best of me. I have a big school project due in two days, so that puts pressure on.
-
Originally posted by Jonny boy 8
so u want aces high 2 turned into Grand theft auto. that is a very stupid idea, this is ww2 simulatior not jack peoples jeeps or tanks. :mad:
p51srule:aok
Geeesh ... you shouldn't be slamming anybody or calling any of their ideas stupid ... your double mis-spelled "sesons" and "seasons" posts are the reason why.
-
Yes, in the implimentation of L4 Aircraft or even C47's there is an intention to escape and evade while bailing out of aircraft. Not only does it display captures, and deaths when someone kills you, but not only that it drops your rank every time you Bail, and get killed / captured.
Successful bails, i dont know what they do to rank, but nobody likes seeing people getting all shot up and their rank dropping, (well, at least not your squaddies, or countrymen)
The implimentaiton of L4 aircraft would benifit this by being able to pick up the people and drive them home, Or even giving a lift on a tank, or being able to join another person while you are landed or on the ground as long as they are in a GV and you are within a certain range of the person. From there you can bail out or RTB once you get into the reach of your own radar.
When bailing out over an enemy base, it is not very wise to drop chute until you have gotten about 200ft from the ground. Doing so will give the enemy less of a target to pop the balloon on you and you go Flailing to the earth in a pile of blood and guts.
It would be better to get a plane or at least a rescue type scenario where someone can just do rescues, and therefore get perk points on rescue missions as well as those points would be added to their overall points score in every category, so in other words, if you start your rescue mission in a C47 or even an L4 observation plane then you can choose where you want your points to go, attack, fighter, bomber, or vehicle.
Each sortie where you successfully rescue a downed pilot you could get 5 to 10 perk points added. The rescued person would also get a couple of perk points and retain their kills for the mission as well as all of the points that they had gotten while flying that mission. It is a win win situation.
So the writeup is as follows
Introduction of Spotter Planes to use with artillary and air strikes
Such as the L4 aircraft
The spotter planes could be armed with the following
4 bazookas
4 smoke rockets
7.62 Cal Machine Gun Mounted to wings w/100 Rd clip
The ability to rescue troops could be programmed as follows
Persons have to be within 100ft of the plane.
The plane must have airspeed of 0, and must be greater than or equal to altitutde of 100ft of pilot that is being rescued. The pilot then can type a command to be rescue such as .board or .getin and the pilots call sign
The pilot then can take the rescued pilot back to base.
The points issue and rank could be as follows.
For the rescuing pilot. Perk points and rank points would have to be authorized as well as be able to assign the points to specific categories, I.E. 1 pilot rescued would =3 perk points and mission points of determined successful sorties. the pilot would be able to assign the perk points at the start of the sortie to classify which category they would like their perk points to be assigned to I.E. the 3 perk points would go to either vehicle, aircraft, or bombers.
The pilot that is being rescued
the pilot that is being rescued would be classified as a successful bail out, however they would not be captured as they have been flown back to base and they would have no control over the aircraft in question, they would merely sit in the back and wait until they get back to a friendly airfield.
Perk points rank points and other things
The pilot would still be fined the points on their rank however by 1/2.
They should retain the perk points as they have been rescued, and they should also have their kills still count, as well as all other things that are entailed.
How this could be implimented, by either copying the join function and editing it, or just straight editing of the join function for the spotter/ rescue planes that states that the planes cannot be joined unless they are at a stop, airspeed of 0, and the person joining must be within the range of 100ft of the plane.
-
Originally posted by AKDogg
well, I think should happen is if u bail u have to ride it out. I mean the chute should open up automatically. Reason, to get rid of the bombers who drop there bombs on a target and then bail out just say they can reup again. To me that is gaming the game and I seeing it happen more often then ever. Fighters go up to get the bomber just to have the bomber bail out before they get to him and don't even get a kill on him. That bothers me, lol.
Please no. The second my plane is uncontrollable I'm in the silk. It's bad enough getting shot down, don't make me wait for my wingless bird to spin all the way into the ground :)
If you're asking for proxies when someone bails, I can deal with that.
-
Every downed airman had some other people searching for him.
PERIOD.
If we can have a little "load" button by supply,whats sayin' we can turn a "pilot" into a supply that can move itself,and be picked up.
Treat it like a "auto join" if they click the "load" button the game puts you two together and ya'll drive off to go back to base. "like how bombers treat gunners"
Do you see any cop cars?
Do you see people runing around with m16's and bazookas?
Do you see massive MODERN citys to buzz around?
Do you see hundreds of cops trying to stop you?
no.
So how in the heck can you even compare such an idea to GTO, morons.
and even so,tell me the last time someone came to pick you up even in GTO.
What we are talking about is someone taking there time/effort not for themselfs, but to make sure another man makes it home alive & safe.
Imagine you just flew a 8 kill sortie, your fules low your ammos out,your not going to make it all the way home.
You ask for help, two team mates or squaddies roll out to intercept jeep to your crash landing spot.
Many things can happen,you could be straffed "CHUTE" your jeep could be straffed, after they pick you up you could bolth be killed.
Is this not team play?
But nooooo..my god dont allow a man to help another man because they are on the ground,oh noes!
what a mind blower.
I mean hell if driving a jeep to resupply some TANK some fifteen+ minutes away,why wouldnt i want to take the same time to drive out and help a fellow airman back to base.
"its not the fighter pilot that is the hero, nor the bombadeer, nor is it the men who send us out on such missions, when things go wrong and we end up on the ground, its the grunt the medics the underground resistance, that risk everything for our safety."
So why wouldnt we be given the same chance?
Treat downed pilots like "supplys" when you click "get in" it just automaticly joins you with the driver of that Gv. Then you be his gunner/cargo or whatever.
-
Interesting thread.
It reminds me alot of Col. Bruce Carr, whom I met at the 1996 AW convention.
While in a P-51 Mustang, he was shot down by AAA near a luftwaffe base in Czechoslovakia.
Cold and very hungry after hiding out for a number of days, he decided to turn himself in at the airfield.
While surveying his approach from the woods he saw a ground crew preflighting a FW-190 nearby.
After the ground crew left that evening he snuck up th the aircraft and spent the night hiding in the cockpit.
Col. Carr was able to figure out how to work the inertia starter, start the aircraft and take off.
Flying a low as possible, Col. Carr was able to make it back to his home base and make a gear-up landing (he couldn't figure out how to unlock the gear....and everyone was shootiing at him).
Because of my father and his various assignments during his USAF career, I have been privelaged to meet and speak with many fighter and bomber combat veterans from WW2 through the Vietnam era. One thing that strck me was that many of them were nothing short of audacious when it came to flying and surviving whatever situation they found themselves in.
If an enemy plane, boat or vehicle would facilitate a way escape they would all do it in a heartbeat and I think it would be appropriate to have it as a feature in AH.
-
Originally posted by SShot
As we all,.....most..... know, after you bail out and hit the ground, there isnt much else to do but "end sorite". I was thinking you could *caughs* barrow an enemy's jeep and rtb, or maybe someone in a C-47 could land in a clearing and pick you up? I'm just spitballing, so any other ideas are welcome. Or if this is completely stupid, ingore it, but i mean, dosent hurt to ask, does it?
SShot
I really wish folks like this would stick to console gaming.
-
if you would have had more than 1,000 posts i bet everyone would have liked the idea... it seems thats the way forums work on aces high
-
There are so many different mission profiles currently supported in AH - a rescue mission would be a nice, fun, addition.
-
Originally posted by folkwufe
if you would have had more than 1,000 posts i bet everyone would have liked the idea... it seems thats the way forums work on aces high
No I bet it would be the same outcome.
-
I didn't even look at the post count and I can tell the idea's already moronic.
Oh, and as for "not like GTA" -- you didn't read the part about flying around in scout planes with bazookas, 7.6mm MGs with 100-round clips (as if you'd get more than one?) and smoke rockets.
Sounds rather GTA to me.
You want that, place WW2OL. I can say, if I dare speak for the majority here, we don't want that.
EDIT: Let me clarify. What you want is a first-person shooter game. This game is as far removed from that as you can possibly get. It's not even in the same class of genre! If you do like sneaking around and evading capture stuff, I would recommend the original MOH:AA and perhaps AA:O (special forces offline training has something right up your alley).
-
Originally posted by folkwufe
if you would have had more than 1,000 posts i bet everyone would have liked the idea... it seems thats the way forums work on aces high
More like ...
If you had more than 1000 posts ... You might have been around the game long enough to know that "rescue" idea has been hashed over many times ... for a long time.
If you had more than 1000 posts ... you might have used the "search" facility first.
-
(http://www.thesmilies.com/smilies/confused0003.gif) (http://www.thesmilies.com)
You can't get people to give check six calls, that use fellow pilots (especially those in goons) as bait in order to pick enemy planes, that complain over ch200 for spite and spleen, who will repeatedly up and ho, up and ho to defend a field, who more often than not shun missions.....
.... and there is serious thought to having a pilot sit around in the woods waiting for a friendly pilot to come by, pick him up, and carry him home.
That seems like a lot of coding for something that will only be done once in a blue moon.
or, jack a jeep and drive to a friendly base.... there's a night's entertainment.... a long night. You could invest an hour or two in that easily, providing you don't roll the jeep.
Aces High II: Iron Eagle Edition!
-
If the pilot kept his perks when rescued - and maybe the rescuer earns some too - there'd be at least a small incentive for some to rescue others. Particularly for team/squad mates. It just has to be fun to try to evade the enemy.
Would this mission be common place? No. But there are those that fly maritime recce missions to locate enemy fleets - not often, but sometimes. Particularly when the wife insists you do the washing up, you don't want to, you're playing the game, so you up some buffs - turn the sound up and put the apron on...
errr...
Anyway, whether it's first person or not is immaterial. It seems to me (at least from where I'm sitting - I may be wrong) that it's not a major change to the game. Frame rate won't be hit, server performance won't change either. So it seems, on the surface at any rate, quite feasible.
-
Originally posted by Martyn
Anyway, whether it's first person or not is immaterial. It seems to me (at least from where I'm sitting - I may be wrong) that it's not a major change to the game. Frame rate won't be hit, server performance won't change either. So it seems, on the surface at any rate, quite feasible.
Time..... thats the big issue, time HTC could spend coeding more important things like ummm ToD for one more planes another. Spending weeks or months coeding something that will be used about 500 times in the first few weeks the about 5 times a year isnt what they should be doing. There is no "enemy" to evade when your in a chute. Theres no little germans running around in the woods looking for down airmen to put in POW camps. If they did model it then they would have to put POW camps in just if you get cought, and no more .ef ing when you plane gets shot down. If you get shot down you run back to base or wait 30mins if you die. Now if they did that I would bet 60% or more people would quit because I know I dont pay $16/mo to run around with my .45 I pay to fly and kill.
-
Originally posted by Larry
Time..... thats the big issue, time HTC could spend coeding more important things like ummm ToD for one more planes another. Spending weeks or months coeding something that will be used about 500 times in the first few weeks the about 5 times a year isnt what they should be doing. There is no "enemy" to evade when your in a chute. Theres no little germans running around in the woods looking for down airmen to put in POW camps. If they did model it then they would have to put POW camps in just if you get cought, and no more .ef ing when you plane gets shot down. If you get shot down you run back to base or wait 30mins if you die. Now if they did that I would bet 60% or more people would quit because I know I dont pay $16/mo to run around with my .45 I pay to fly and kill.
Ahhh - I see you believe you can tell HTC which is 'more important' and what they 'should' be doing. I think it's their call however.
It shouldn't take weeks or months to code either - if it does then maybe it's a non-economic. I think we already have most of the programming elements though.
There are indeed 'no little germans running around in the woods' (why Germans?) - there are however Rooks, Bishops and Knights flying planes and driving vehicles. Several times I've been hunted as a downed pilot and it's been fun running through woods (trying) to get away/hide from them. They HAVE hunted me - usually successfully I'm sorry to say.
We don't need POW camps.
You can still .ef - evasion won't be compulsory.
It's a simple addition to the game: -
IF you bailed successfully and then IF someone else wants to, then they can try to collect you and return you to base/spawn point. That is it! Nothing more.
-
Originally posted by Martyn
Ahhh - I see you believe you can tell HTC which is 'more important' and what they 'should' be doing. I think it's their call however.
It shouldn't take weeks or months to code either - if it does then maybe it's a non-economic. I think we already have most of the programming elements though.
There are indeed 'no little germans running around in the woods' (why Germans?) - there are however Rooks, Bishops and Knights flying planes and driving vehicles.
Where did I say I tell HTC what to do? HTC does have better things to do then this. People have been waiting for YEARS for ToD to come out and dont think they would want this before ToD. Last time I looked most pilots were down over german held territory thats why I said germans. The only time I kill a chute is if its running around on our field makeing ack shoot at it instead of the planes. The idea of rescuing downed pilots has been around for a long time and is in the subs and nook category. Dont see any reason why HTC would model any of them.
-
Originally posted by Larry
Where did I say I tell HTC what to do? HTC does have better things to do then this. People have been waiting for YEARS for ToD to come out and dont think they would want this before ToD. Last time I looked most pilots were down over german held territory thats why I said germans. The only time I kill a chute is if its running around on our field makeing ack shoot at it instead of the planes. The idea of rescuing downed pilots has been around for a long time and is in the subs and nook category. Dont see any reason why HTC would model any of them.
Clearly this feature would not be for you.
'Where did I say I tell HTC what to do? HTC does have better things to do then this.' Oh, do they? You're 'not' telling them they 'have better things to do' then? You'd know this would you? LOL. As I said - it's their call. I'm just saying it's a feature I'd use every now and then - they'll decide if/when it's a 'better thing to do'.
Maybe this idea isn't a mainstream selling point - but it might be useful for marketing purposes - an advert could carry the line about fighting the enemy and then evading them and being rescued by your mates. The economic justification 'may' be enough for it's inclusion in the game. HTC's call.
'Last time I looked most pilots were down over german held territory' - You looked did you? What about the German pilots? They also evaded 'little germans'?
You seem to forget there were other theatres - and the Russian front was a lot larger than the west. There were even Japanese trying to evade Australian, British, Indian and other troops. Like a lot of people your understanding of WW2 is very limited. One reason I like AH is that you can actually learn a little history. I'm still learning.
And as for 'little germans' - LOL. All of those I've met are just the same size as other people. Funny that.
-
First of all none of us know how hard it would be to code. It could be the simplest of things and not really take time away from other development or it might be the hardest thing and delay other development significantly.
If it fit into the former it would be a neat addition to the game (getting rescued by a Jeep to save your kills/perks... maybe split them between the pilot and rescuer plus provide a reason to get the Jeep more activly involved in the game).
I was going to say this would be the "hanger queen" of missions but I could see it being used pretty often around bases that were being defended against heavy attack or near furballs close to home.
-
Originally posted by Martyn
Clearly this feature would not be for you.
'Where did I say I tell HTC what to do? HTC does have better things to do then this.' Oh, do they? You're 'not' telling them they 'have better things to do' then? You'd know this would you? LOL. As I said - it's their call. I'm just saying it's a feature I'd use every now and then - they'll decide if/when it's a 'better thing to do'.
Maybe this idea isn't a mainstream selling point - but it might be useful for marketing purposes - an advert could carry the line about fighting the enemy and then evading them and being rescued by your mates. The economic justification 'may' be enough for it's inclusion in the game. HTC's call.
'Last time I looked most pilots were down over german held territory' - You looked did you? What about the German pilots? They also evaded 'little germans'?
You seem to forget there were other theatres - and the Russian front was a lot larger than the west. There were even Japanese trying to evade Australian, British, Indian and other troops. Like a lot of people your understanding of WW2 is very limited. One reason I like AH is that you can actually learn a little history. I'm still learning.
And as for 'little germans' - LOL. All of those I've met are just the same size as other people. Funny that.
What are you 12? So you think ToD and and new planes arent more important then this? Yes I have "looked" at alot of WWII history and ALOT of planes were shot down over german held territory. Hell a B17 or B24 had ten people in each one. Now your telling me that the eastern front had more downed pilots? I dont think so.
-
why does everyone get so mad because someone has an idea!?!? if you dont like you coul post somethin like "i dont like it", plain and simple... not rip the poor guy apart. And if your the 30th guy to post something negative, try to refrain from doing so... the thread maker has already got the message.
-
I agree Folkwufe,
Seems that the senior posters have no time for ideas from
a person with 3 posts, when it could be a simple case of only posting
when you have something intelligent to offer, instead of jumping on
the keyboard to trash someone everytime they don't like what they read
or want to argue with someone. That will get you up to 9500 posts fast in this place.
BTW everyone...I like the Rescue idea.
-
Or mabey you guys that have less then 5 posts think and use the search button before you post. Stop posting every stupid idea that pops into your head. If you don't know this Aces High is a WWII combat sim that is mostly air combat not some FPS.
-
I feel that the most that people would like, is the ability to get into a friedlies vehicle, or even an aircraft that is capable of picking one up if they are shot down.
It would enhance the game as well as provide the user with a choice of what to do after bailing out.
1. End Mission
2. Bail out, and hit the ground, and spot targets or bring in arty from Cruiser
3. Bail out, in hopes of being rescued, and evade the enemy.
The reality is, is that people do like the idea, and it is not inteded to become a first person shooter game, but to allow the person to choose, as well as squaddies and other friendlies to perform rescue missions, as well as fight for your fellow teammates.
Right now, if someone gets shot down, everyone around that person, are like end mission ASAP, and re-up. But if you were on the ground, and the enemy knew it. it makes the fight more interesting then becuase Enemy GV's as well as aircraft will watch to see you bail, and then the fight goes over you.
In other words, a person bails and requests rescue, enemy GV's and Aircraft move to intercept and take out the forces that are trying to protect their own. It makes for a really great fight.
even though it has already been stated that people sit in the runway and shoot aircraft in the cockpit with the .45 that you have when you bail.
And as far as all of the posters trashing this idea, think about this.
Didnt your mamma ever tell you, that if you dont have anything nice to say then dont say nothin.
Dont trash someone just becuase they have an idea, instead make concise gestures in why it would be a bad idea, in your opinion, and we all have them.
Who knows, you may even like the idea of being rescued, as well as it
-
There are problems with this Rescue Me idea addition to the game.
#1: Abuse and Grief. The guy that claims he needs rescued, but in reality is just pulling your leg to have you run around uselessly for a while. You go out and no one is there, or worse, the 'downed' pilot is a shade account and he's just set up up for his 'prime' account.
#2: Historical accuracy. HTC tries to stay within shouting distance of WWII history, and simple fact is, you did not have pilots being rescued by other pilots generally. They were picked up by GROUND TROOPS, either friendly (send them back to the rear) or enemy (send them to POW camp), or occasionally by members of the resistance and smuggled out. The kind of Air Rescues you folks are arguing for didn't start becoming common until the Korean War and introduction of the helicopter, and even more common and famous in Vietnam. AHII is a game representation of WW2, not the game version of BAT21 or Bridges of Toko Ri . There was no big effort to recover downed pilots behind enemy lines in WWII. It was up to the officers to escape, evade, and return to friendly lines.
#3 "People want it" argument. There are people that want fission bombs in the game, doesn't make it a good idea. There are those that want to get rid of ENY and perk costs for planes too.
#4 "Save points argument". You want those points bad enough, get back to base and put it on the runway. Earn them, don't depend on others to get you back when you screw up. You get partial points for bails, ditches, and so forth. You want all the points and the bonus; get back to base.
#5 Endless whining on Country Channel to "pick me up!" The Gunnery calls are bad enough, this would get ridiculous, which would be compounded by point #1 above.
-
Originally posted by AKDogg
well, I think should happen is if u bail u have to ride it out. I mean the chute should open up automatically. Reason, to get rid of the bombers who drop there bombs on a target and then bail out just say they can reup again. To me that is gaming the game and I seeing it happen more often then ever. Fighters go up to get the bomber just to have the bomber bail out before they get to him and don't even get a kill on him. That bothers me, lol.
The problem here is that there is absolutly NO perk bomber worth saving points for. The Arado is practically useless, might as well take a Boston III up and save the points. Hitech give us something worth while to spend bomber perks on, otherwise the bomb and bail crowd will grow larger.
-
Originally posted by tedrbr
#2: Historical accuracy. HTC tries to stay within shouting distance of WWII history, and simple fact is, you did not have pilots being rescued by other pilots generally. They were picked up by GROUND TROOPS, either friendly (send them back to the rear) or enemy (send them to POW camp), or occasionally by members of the resistance and smuggled out. The kind of Air Rescues you folks are arguing for didn't start becoming common until the Korean War and introduction of the helicopter, and even more common and famous in Vietnam. AHII is a game representation of WW2, not the game version of BAT21 or Bridges of Toko Ri . There was no big effort to recover downed pilots behind enemy lines in WWII. It was up to the officers to escape, evade, and return to friendly lines.
Are you so sure tedrbr ?
Granted that most rescues were for pilots downed at sea or in theaters other than Europe, but they were carried out by any means possible.....
And why would you care if there were players who wanted to do rescue or artillery spotting/recon....or for that matter, why care about more GV'ers or boaters or people who just want to run around with a rifle? They are just more targets to shoot up.....and they could very well mean more paying customers to keep your favorite sim in operation for years to come.
A quick search on the web found plenty of evidence that rescuing downed pilots both on land and at sea was a priority in World War 2:
http://www.usaaf.net/ww/vol4/vol4pg15.htm
"From D-day to D plus 9 a very cooperative and effective air-sea rescue service was maintained. Two corridors were established from D-day to D plus 2, and despite the fact that short notice was given for changes of time and route, this service provided facilities which resulted in the rescue of many of our personnel.
Naval control.--Naval equipment consisted of "R" motor launches, high-speed launches, and motor torpedo boats. It had been the common practice before narrow air corridors were adopted for air-sea rescue launches to carry out short patrols near their home bases, so as to be on immediate call for any emergency. This had proved efficient in the case of bombers returning from missions over the Continent, when they were not flying a predetermined course and were returning sporadically. However, before the airborne attack the suggestion was made to the naval authorities that, with 2 air corridors established, air-sea rescue launches be placed at irregular intervals along these routes. This idea was concurred in, and in the northern corridor alone 17 launches were so placed, with 10 in the much shorter southern lane.
The wisdom of this move was well demonstrated when the entire crew of a C-47 was forced to ditch on the return from Holland, and was picked up even before the aircraft had submerged. Because crews had been briefed that the air-sea rescue launches would be spaced along the corridors, they were able to ditch at points where rescue could quickly be effected. ON D plus 2, when weather over the sea was very bad and fog reduced visibility to about 1 mile, the plan again proved itself. Gliders were breaking tows in large numbers, yet one motor launch, stationed some 40 miles from the English coast, was able to pick up the entire crews of five gliders.
High-speed launches of air-sea rescue service spent 1,243 hours at sea.
Air Control.--Aircraft used in air-sea rescue included Spitfires and Walruses of ADGB, Hudsons and Warwicks of Coastal Command, and Thunderbolts of USAAF. Because of their long range and durability, the Warwicks and Hudsons were very usefully employed in flying alongside serials on their route out. They were thus able to plot and report the exact position of aircraft ditching, and to go to the crews' assistance when there were no rescue launches in the vicinity.. On the way back, with aircraft more spread out, this plan was less effective; it was at this stage that the Thunderbolts and Spitfires, able to cover a larger area in less time, proved of great value.
During the operation, 205 men were rescued from ditched aircraft and gliders.
The following figures give a summary of the patrols carried out by air-sea rescue service:
Sorties by Spitfires and Walruses of ADGB 148
Long-range sorties by Warwicks and Hudsons of Coastal Command 20
Sorties by Thunderbolts of USAAF 83
Total air sorties 251 "
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westland_Lysander
"In August 1941, a new squadron, No. 138 (Special Duties), was formed to undertake missions for the Special Operations Executive to maintain contact with the French Resistance. Among its aircraft were Lysander IIIs, which would fly over and land in France. While general supply drops could be left to the rest of No. 138's aircraft, the Lysander could insert agents on and off the continent, or bring back any downed allied aircrew who had been sheltered by the French. In this role, the Lysander proved to be outstanding"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_Force_Pararescue
"World War II
During the opening months of the war, there was very little need for air rescue. American forces were in retreat or consolidating their positions and most long-range flying was limited. As the war progressed and American airmen began flying missions that would cover hundreds - and sometimes thousands - of miles, air rescue began to play a key role.
Rescue units were formed around the globe under the operational control of local commanders. While training, techniques and equipment varied, one rule was constant: "Rescue forces must presume survivors in each crash until proved otherwise."
Search and rescue of downed aviators in the continental United States fell primarily to the Civil Air Patrol, a civilian aviation group under the command of the Army Air Corps. The CAP would usually send in ground crews after locating a crash site; however, they would sometimes land small aircraft and they did experiment with parachute rescue teams.
In the European Theater, there was very little opportunity for ground rescue. Most flights were over enemy-occupied territory, where a landing meant immediate capture. In the UK area of the European Theatre, the British military was at the time creating its own Royal Air Force Mountain Rescue Service (United Kingdom) which would be based largely on civilian mountain rescue doctrine. The RAFMRS has rescued many American aircrew, or recovered remains, from USAF crashes over its UK territory. Crashes during over-water flights created a great many casualties, the Eighth Air Force initiated a 'sea rescue' group. From its creation in 1943 until the end of the war, the recovery rate of aircrews downed at sea rose from less than five percent to over forty percent.
In the vast reaches of the Pacific Theater, a plane crash meant almost certain death from exposure to the elements. The Army formed several squadrons in theater specifically to aid and rescue downed flyers - both at sea and on islands - with great success."
http://nobadlie.tripod.com/asr.htm
"The history of air rescue began in World War II. Prior to the
advent of large bomber and fighter fleets, little consideration had
been given to the search for and, retrieving of, missing or crashed
airmen. The distressed aviator was searched for in a haphazard
fashion, utilizing the means available with little thought to organized
protection such as mariners then enjoyed. *(l)
The enemy in Europe could first be reached only by over-water
flight. The air war in the Pacific presented a similar situation in
exaggerated form. Accelerated training; in the Zone of Interior,
over-water flights by tactical aircraft en route to the theaters of
war, transportation of personnel and supplies by air, antisubmarine
activity, convey defense, and patrol duty were additional factors
creating; a need for a world wide air-sea rescue service. *(2)
Under the personal guidance of General. H. H. Arnold, a rescue
program was initiated, crews trained, equipment procured, and rescue
squadrons activated."
-
Originally posted by StuB
Are you so sure tedrbr ?
I'm fairly certain that the majority of downed pilots in Europe were picked up by ground forces and ships in the Med and the Channel. I am also pretty sure that in the Pacific it was primarily submarines on "lifeguard duty", ships, and seaplanes doing the rescuing, although others may have spotted the downed pilot.
I am fairly positive that C-47's did not go flying over enemy territory looking to spot downed fliers, land in an unprepared field, and return the pilot to friendly territory. And to do this in game to save a couple perk points, when you get a percentage of them for successfully bailing, ditching, or being captured anyways??
So, to be accurate, I suppose we can add light, unarmed recon planes and float planes. But, how do you plan to avoid the intentional griefs under my point #1? And do we really want the limited amount or coding and testing time at HTC being put into S&R?
Its just a very marginal piece of added game content.
-
Your question #1 is quite a stretch.
You say it would be just "a very marginal piece of added game content" because.....you know for a fact that nobody would wan't to do it? Because you have experienced another MMOG WW2 flight sim that implemented this with terrible results?
For the rescue aspect, all they would need to do is make it so if a pilot bails in enemy territory, as long as they .ef near a landed rescue a/c they are considered rescued (i.e. not captured). This would be great for scenarios where each player pilot has limited lives, like Operation Husky, for instance where a capture uses one of your 2 lives.
But it's not just about Search and Rescue.
How many times have you had GV's coming in towards one of your bases and needed someone to loiter above them to direct in attack a/c? Most of the a/c currently in AH are too fast or don't give enough visibility.
Also, when your own GV's are trying to shoot at long range they have a harder time judging where their rounds are landing. Any of the three a/c I've listed below could do a heck of a job directing fire onto them.....and they don't nevcessarily need to be unarmed:
The Westland Lysander III
General characteristics
Crew: One, pilot
Capacity: 1 passenger (or observer)
Length: 30 ft 6 in (9.29 m)
Wingspan: 50 ft 0 in (15.24 m)
Height: 11 ft 6 in (3.50 m)
Wing area: 260 ft² (24.2 m²)
Empty weight: 4,044 lb (1,834 kg)
Loaded weight: 5,833 lb (2,645 kg)
Max takeoff weight: 6,305 lb (2,866 kg)
Powerplant: 1× Bristol Mercury XX radial engine, 870 hp (649 kW)
Performance
Maximum speed: 212 mph (341 km/h)
Range: 600 miles (966 km)
Service ceiling: 21,500 ft (6,550 m)
Rate of climb: 1,410 ft/min (7.2 m/s)
Wing loading: 22 lb/ft² (109 kg/m²)
Power/mass: 0.15 hp/lb (250 W/kg)
Armament
Two forward-firing .303 in (7.7-mm) Browning machine guns in wheel fairings
Two .303 Lewis guns for the observer
Four 20 lb (9 kg) bombs under rear fuselage.
Stub wings, if fitted, can carry 500 lb (227 kg) of bombs.
The first Lysanders entered service in June 1938 equipping squadrons for "Army Co-operation" and were initially used for message-dropping and artillery spotting. When war broke out in Europe, the earlier Mk Is had been largely replaced by Mk IIs, the older machines heading for the Middle East. Four regular squadrons equipped with Lysanders accompanied the British Expeditionary Force to France. These were put into action as spotters and light bombers. In spite of occasional victories against German aircraft, they made very easy targets for the Luftwaffe unless escorted by Hurricanes. Almost half the Lysanders operating in and over France were lost and, with the fall of France, the type was quickly withdrawn from its army co-operation role. Back in England some went to work operating air-sea rescue for RAF pilots in the English Channel. Fourteen squadrons and flights were formed for this work during 1940/1941, dropping dinghies to downed pilots.
In August 1941, a new squadron, No. 138 (Special Duties), was formed to undertake missions for the Special Operations Executive to maintain contact with the French Resistance. Among its aircraft were Lysander IIIs, which would fly over and land in France. While general supply drops could be left to the rest of No. 138's aircraft, the Lysander could insert agents on and off the continent, or bring back any downed allied aircrew who had been sheltered by the French. In this role, the Lysander proved to be outstanding, and it continued in this role until the liberation of France in 1944. Flying on moonless nights and without any navigation equipment other than a map and compass, Lysanders would land on short strips of land in country fields, marked out by a couple of torches. In this manner, the pilots of No. 138 and later No. 161 Squadron delivered 101 and recovered 128 agents from Nazi occupied Europe.[2] The Lysanders were painted matt black and flew from secret airfields at Newmarket and Tempsford but used regular RAF stations to fuel up for the actual crossing.
Piper J-3
General characteristics
Crew: one pilot
Capacity: one passenger
Length: 22 ft 5 in (6.83 m)
Wingspan: 35 ft 3 in (10.74 m)
Height: 6 ft 8 in (2.03 m)
Wing area: 178.5 ft² (16.58 m²)
Empty weight: 765 lb (345 kg)
Useful load: 455 lb (205 kg)
Max takeoff weight: 1,220 lb (550 kg)
Powerplant: 1× Continental A-65-8 air-cooled flat four, 65 hp (48 kW) @ 2350 RPM
Performance
Maximum speed: 76 knots (87 mph, 140 km/h)
Cruise speed: 65 knots (75 mph, 121 km/h)
Range: 191 nm (220 mi, 354 km)
Service ceiling: 11,500 ft (3,500 m)
Rate of climb: 450 ft/min (2.3 m/s)
Wing loading: 6.84 lb/ft² (33.4 kg/m²)
Power/mass: 18.75 lb/hp (11.35 kg/kW)
Piper developed a military variant ("All we had to do," Bill Jr. is quoted as saying, "was paint the Cub olive drab to produce a military airplane"), [2] variously designated as the L-4, O-59 and NE-1. The variety of models were collectively nicknamed “Grasshoppers” and were used extensively in World War II for reconnaissance, transporting supplies and medical evacuation.[3] L-4s were also sometimes equipped with lashed-on infantry bazookas for ground attack. Mechanically identical to the J-3, the military versions were equipped with large Plexiglas windows extending over the top of the wing and behind the rear-seat passenger, and the side windows were enlarged. The Grasshopper was so influential to ground battles and the war that the Luftwaffe awarded twice as many "points" towards combat medals for Cub kills as they did for Allied fighter aircraft.[2]
In Europe, the final dogfight of WWII occurred between an L-4 and a German Fi-156 Storch. The pilot and co-pilot of the L-4, Lts. Duane Francis and Bill Martin, opened fire on the Storch with their .45 caliber pistols, forcing the German plane to land. This was also the only known instance of an aircraft being downed by pistol fire during the war
Henschel Hs 126
General characteristics
Crew: Two (pilot and observer/gunner)
Length: 10.9 m (35 ft 7 in)
Wingspan: 14.5 m (47 ft 7 in)
Height: 3.8 m (12 ft 4 in)
Wing area: 31.6 m² (340 ft²)
Empty weight: 2,030 kg (4,480 lb)
Loaded weight: 6,820 lb (3,090 kg)
Powerplant: 1× BMW 132 9-cylinder radial engine, 650 kW (870 hp)
Performance
Maximum speed: 356 km/h at 3,000 m (221 mph at 9,850 ft)
Combat radius: 998 km (620 mi)
Service ceiling: 8,530 m (28,000 ft)
Rate of climb: 550 m/min (1,800 ft/min)
Wing loading: 97.8 kg/m² (20.1 lb/ft²)
Power/mass: 0.21 kW/kg (0.13 hp/lb)
Armament
1 × forward-firing 7.92 mm MG 17 machine gun
1 × flexible 7.92 mm MG 15 machine gun in the observer/gunner
Up to 50 kg (110 lb) of bombs
The Henschel Hs 126 was a Luftwaffe (air force) aircraft of World War II. Produced in two models (A and B). Although primarily a reconnaissance aircraft, it could carry up to 50 kg of bombs and was equipped with two 7.92 mm machine guns, a forward firing MG 17 and a flexible MG 15 in the observer/gunner position. Late in the war, it was used in glider tug and night ground attack roles.
Originally posted by tedrbr
".... I suppose we can add light, unarmed recon planes and float planes. But, how do you plan to avoid the intentional griefs under my point #1? And do we really want the limited amount or coding and testing time at HTC being put into S&R?
Its just a very marginal piece of added game content. [/B]
-
Originally posted by StuB
But it's not just about Search and Rescue.
How many times have you had GV's coming in towards one of your bases and needed someone to loiter above them to direct in attack a/c? Most of the a/c currently in AH are too fast or don't give enough visibility.
Also, when your own GV's are trying to shoot at long range they have a harder time judging where their rounds are landing. Any of the three a/c I've listed below could do a heck of a job directing fire onto them.....and they don't nevcessarily need to be unarmed:
You don't need to add spotter aircraft to the game to accomplish these non-S&R missions. There are planes in the game that can do these kinds of jobs, you just don't see it being done all that often by the players. Adding more mission specific airplanes will not get the players to start doing those kinds of specific mission.
You want a slow spotter aircraft to help direct attack planes and ground forces to enemy GV's, or help them in ranging on an enemy? I suggest the Stuka, Val, Kate, A-20, Boston, SBD-5, TBM-3 and IL-2. Make use of that external view for visibility. Turn your tracers on before flight. Take rockets if available to mark targets. I've done it many times, especially on maps that featured a lot of GV action (outside of the TT arrangement).
You don't really need a slow bomber or attack plane either, I've made use of Ki-61's, Yaks, and Ki-84's in spotter role before. A P-40B, Hurri Mk1, Spit-I, or A6M2 will work well in lieu of a Piper if you prefer.
So, we are back to it being just about Search and Rescue again.
-
Originally posted by SShot
As we all,.....most..... know, after you bail out and hit the ground, there isnt much else to do but "end sorite". I was thinking you could *caughs* barrow an enemy's jeep and rtb, or maybe someone in a C-47 could land in a clearing and pick you up? I'm just spitballing, so any other ideas are welcome. Or if this is completely stupid, ingore it, but i mean, dosent hurt to ask, does it?
SShot
The Search function is your friend you know.
-
Perhaps players haven't been performing target spotting because there aren't any good a/c to do it in?
Most of the a/c you mention do indeed fly slow, but they don't turn well enough to stay right over a target.
I have done FAC duty whenever it was necessary.....back in AW as well as in AH. It's always been a problem to stay above and keep a constant eye on the target because there have never been any a/c that were slow and manouverable enough to do it.
It's not something you want....fine. But there really wouldn't be any REAL problem if AH had them, now would there? (that was rhetorical, of course YOU personally have a problem with it :p )
Now were back at having it be about both SAR/FAC again.
Originally posted by tedrbr
You don't need to add spotter aircraft to the game to accomplish these non-S&R missions. There are planes in the game that can do these kinds of jobs, you just don't see it being done all that often by the players. Adding more mission specific airplanes will not get the players to start doing those kinds of specific mission.
You want a slow spotter aircraft to help direct attack planes and ground forces to enemy GV's, or help them in ranging on an enemy? I suggest the Stuka, Val, Kate, A-20, Boston, SBD-5, TBM-3 and IL-2. Make use of that external view for visibility. Turn your tracers on before flight. Take rockets if available to mark targets. I've done it many times, especially on maps that featured a lot of GV action (outside of the TT arrangement).
You don't really need a slow bomber or attack plane either, I've made use of Ki-61's, Yaks, and Ki-84's in spotter role before. A P-40B, Hurri Mk1, Spit-I, or A6M2 will work well in lieu of a Piper if you prefer.
So, we are back to it being just about Search and Rescue again.
-
You find yourself going THAT slow over a enemy GV attack,.... say, from the Bish,.... led by LTARs,.... with an Ostie or two amongst them..... you are not going to be FAC for very long in this game.
-
For the simplest rescue scenario, all we'd need is the ability of an empty jeep (driven by a colleague) to pick up a downed pilot, return him to base/spawn point and the pilot to then obtain his perks as if he'd landed OK.
Giving the PT boat and/or any airplanes the ability to rescue would be nice but these might not come until later.
-
I agree, it wouldn't be easy against Ostie's or even M-16's.
The SAR/FAC a/c would be slower but they would also be much more manuverable. They would have to stay down on the deck and hide in the trees.
Originally posted by tedrbr
You find yourself going THAT slow over a enemy GV attack,.... say, from the Bish,.... led by LTARs,.... with an Ostie or two amongst them..... you are not going to be FAC for very long in this game.
-
All they would need to do is make it so that if you bail over enemy territory or in the water and a friendly SAR enabled vehicle was close by (maybe within d200?)you could end sortie and it would be considered a successful bail and you aren't captured.
Maybe it could be similar to a ressuply sortie?
Originally posted by Martyn
For the simplest rescue scenario, all we'd need is the ability of an empty jeep (driven by a colleague) to pick up a downed pilot, return him to base/spawn point and the pilot to then obtain his perks as if he'd landed OK.
Giving the PT boat and/or any airplanes the ability to rescue would be nice but these might not come until later.