Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: JB88 on May 14, 2007, 02:28:00 PM
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okay...so i finally get logged into the orange arena where all of the people are at and the fights can be found (after 6 attempts) and i fly for a bit and i get shot down and try to re-up, but the ENY is suddenly through the roof and so now i get stuck with early war planes in a late war arena. again.
i go to the other arena. same day. same color. same map.
go to the midwar. same day. same color. yesterday's map. no fights to be found...sigh.
i know. same complaint. different day. talk to the hand right?
fine. but i feel a need to express it anyway sorry.
i think a large percentage of us feel this way and i wish that we could convince the folks in grapevine that it's really putting a major bump in the road of enjoyment for so many of us.
i am not the most diplomatic guy in the planet so i am asking those of you who are to add some thoughtful words that might sway them to improve upon these stumbling blocks without further ado.
there must be somebody out there who frame it just "so"
help me obie wan community, youre my only hope.
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Or you could just have:
CHANGED THE COUNTRY!
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i was already in a country sir. i had been flying with some folks and having a swell time thank you very much.
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Originally posted by JB88
okay...so i finally get logged into the orange arena where all of the people are at and the fights can be found (after 6 attempts) and i fly for a bit and i get shot down and try to re-up, but the ENY is suddenly through the roof and so now i get stuck with early war planes in a late war arena. again.
In an effort to aid numbers balancing, I always fly on the team w/ the fewest numbers(bish lately). As a result I never encounter the ENY monster. Try it, the weakest side always needs the help and you could have your squaddies/friends come over and really help even things out.
Some people have lackofhordeaphobia, which is fear of flying outside the protection of the horde. If you are not one of these, switch sides and enjoy a target rich environment!
Steve
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okay. i'll try it.
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Many of us have the same concerns but we keep being told to STFU and get used to it... blah blah
I guess in order to play the game you need to have no loyalty to your squad, no loyalty to your country, but remain 100% loyal to Hitech.
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Originally posted by gpa3
Many of us have the same concerns but we keep being told to STFU and get used to it... blah blah
I guess in order to play the game you need to have no loyalty to your squad, no loyalty to your country, but remain 100% loyal to Hitech.
LOL! Victims everywhere!
It's just a game! No one is dying, no countries are being overthrown! You can BS all you want with your squad buddies regardless of what country you are in. Squad channel is a wonderous thing!
Have some fun for heaven's sake :)
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okay. tried it.
nice folks the bish.
so are the folks that i was flying with and the squad that i attach to.
no sir. don't think i should have to do that. just don't.
but thanks for the suggestion. it was well stated.
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Originally posted by JB88
i was already in a country sir. i had been flying with some folks and having a swell time thank you very much.
As long as you can fly what you want....
You tried changing arenas. Couldn't find a fight.
You tried changing countries. Couldn't find your virtual friends?
With the lower numbers, you could fly your LA -and- kill your friends.
I don't get it.
It appears that numbers in the arenas are up. (Summertime). Same complaint over and over and over.
Gimme gimme gimme what -I- want. NOW. You certainly don't expect -me- to do anything to remedy -my- problem, do you???
I want different maps!! Learn to make maps and submit them ti HiTech.
I want to fly what I want to fly!! Switch countries. Switch arenas.
I want to fly with who I want to fly with!! Maybe you can't fly that LA7....
Remember when gratification wasn't instant? You had to try and do things for yourself....
Guess not.
Contribute to the solution, not the problem.
wrngway
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Look that the post times from "I'll try it" to "nope, that sucks". 10 whole minutes. what a trooper.
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Originally posted by AWwrgwy
As long as you can fly what you want....
You tried changing arenas. Couldn't find a fight.
You tried changing countries. Couldn't find your virtual friends?
With the lower numbers, you could fly your LA -and- kill your friends.
I don't get it.
It appears that numbers in the arenas are up. (Summertime). Same complaint over and over and over.
Gimme gimme gimme what -I- want. NOW. You certainly don't expect -me- to do anything to remedy -my- problem, do you???
I want different maps!! Learn to make maps and submit them ti HiTech.
I want to fly what I want to fly!! Switch countries. Switch arenas.
I want to fly with who I want to fly with!! Maybe you can't fly that LA7....
Remember when gratification wasn't instant? You had to try and do things for yourself....
Guess not.
Contribute to the solution, not the problem.
wrngway
funny. i don't recall saying i want it NOW anywhere in that post.
the plane i wanted to fly was a spit 9 not an LA7. i don't fly them.
sometimes i like flying with people who i am familiar with because as we fly together our efficiency increases. in real life combat pilots would learn each others tactics and improve with each other.
the numbers may be up, but the arena system is stuck. i am not the only person to believe this so i won't hang on the whiner cross you'd like to put me on.
further, while you've managed to make a rousing critique of me personally, you seem to have done very little in the way of helping to solve the problem that you seem to have with people who would like to see this fixed.
i wouldnt call waiting months and months before finally chiming in on the subject the kind of instant gratification problem that you seem to think it is.
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Originally posted by gpa3
Many of us have the same concerns but we keep being told to STFU and get used to it... blah blah
I guess in order to play the game you need to have no loyalty to your squad, no loyalty to your country, but remain 100% loyal to Hitech.
Having friends is bad.....Mmmmmmmmmkay.
And don't fly to close to others or in the same general direction. You might be called a horde.
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Originally posted by hubsonfire
Look that the post times from "I'll try it" to "nope, that sucks". 10 whole minutes. what a trooper.
actually, i flew with the bish for a while and just logged off a little bit ago.
had a nice time as i usually do.
i just don't think it should be the default way to handle the problem.
anywho...
bring on the next automated response.
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JB88
I've been engaged in a polite email conversation about the Late War Arena caps and the ENY.
In short: HTC won't remove the arena caps. ENY is another no go
My point has been that its unfair to ask people who fly together or are in a squad to "change sides" in an arena they cant even get into
While I politely disagree with HTC's decision, I would encourage you to contact support directly and let them know your ideas, etc.
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Originally posted by JB88
further, while you've managed to make a rousing critique of me personally, you seem to have done very little in the way of helping to solve the problem that you seem to have with people who would like to see this fixed.
What you define as the problem, the rest of us look at as part of the solution. The problem isn't that ENY keeps people out of certain planes; the problem is that those people are inflexible and intolerant of anything which limits their ability to engage in the types of behaviors that resulted in the limits being installed in the first place.
So, actually, those of us who fly for the underdogs, or suggest that you do the same, or encourage others to, at the very least, get accustomed to high ENY planes only, are actually working to promote a compromise or acceptance of the current solution, while people such as yourself or gpa keep insisting that the game is broken, not your behaviors or decisions.
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Originally posted by hubsonfire
What you define as the problem, the rest of us look at as part of the solution. The problem isn't that ENY keeps people out of certain planes; the problem is that those people are inflexible and intolerant of anything which limits their ability to engage in the types of behaviors that resulted in the limits being installed in the first place.
So, actually, those of us who fly for the underdogs, or suggest that you do the same, or encourage others to, at the very least, get accustomed to high ENY planes only, are actually working to promote a compromise, while people such as yourself or gpa keep insisting that the game is broken, not your behaviors or decisions.
so, you think this is optimum?
:confused:
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if your squad loved you, they would switch sides with you.
;)
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and since when have nits not been underdogs?
:huh
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Originally posted by FBplmmr
if your squad loved you, they would switch sides with you.
;)
lol.
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It's damn sure a better idea than letting the horde have unlimited plane choice again. You've got options, the same options everyone does. The difference between you and me, is that aren't looking at this from anyone's perspective but your own.
Consider this from HT's standpoint, or that of the guys who are "loyal" to the underdog country. Shouldn't there be something in place to at least try to create a more balanced playing field?
Edit: almost forgot. No, I don't consider it optimum; I consider it a perfectly acceptable compromise. To be optimal in my mind, flight would be flat out restricted, not this limp-wristed ENY that kicks in at 0.1, while plane/gv ENY values start at 5. I'd change the values to run all the way down to 1.0, and I'd restrict flight when ENY hit 20.
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I don't care what fighter, country or arena I end up in, as long I can fly with my squad.
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Your not a Princess!
...I feel cheated. :eek:
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JB,
I would be lying if I said I would rather switch sides than fly with my squad. I do fly solo most of the time I have to fly so switching sides to get a better airplane or help an underdog "country" is not a big deal to me. I enjoy people from all the different chess pieces. On squad night, when I can make it, we do try to fly together as much as possible. We have all switched sides and arenas to try to get everyone together but I would not expect them to switch just for me.
To me the whole thing is not that big a deal. I'm not too serious about the game, it doesn't make my day bad when things don't go really well. It's just a game.
I can see why limits and eny were added and it makes sense to me. If we had all been willing to switch sides and keep things even on our own this never would have happened.
Word.
Mark
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As someone with no loyalty to any particular country, who generally flies for the country with less people, in a midrange (15-25) ENY aircraft, and who has friends in all three countries, I really don't care one way or another what the heck HTC does, because I won't let it affect me.
But I do have to say, I don't see any real difference since the country split in the way the game is played. Regardless of which arena you're in, there's still a country in every arena that's getting ganged. This split has not balanced anything, and I don't think there's anything short of turning HTC into a police state that's going to fix the imbalance.
So basically, although it was a neat idea, the arenas are not getting balanced by it. At least not from what I've seen.
However, there might be other good reasons for splitting the LWA's up. Such as maps/servers/whatever that can't handle the growing number of customers. If that's the case, well, then good, keep them split. Make more money, get more planes (Boomerang!), have more targets, have more fun.
I know I'm on thin ice here and I'm not trying to pick a fight, I'm just calling it as I see it.
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you suck anyway 88 :aok no matter which side or what plane you fly.:p
btw what is your handle ingame?
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Recently, the bishops won the war. all the noobs switched sides to bishop and refused to leave. i didnt get my F4U. I told them if you press Alt F4 and wait 3 hours out of the game you win the war again. 10 people left the room.
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The arenas were split due to the Huge hordes that had developed. It took away from game play to the point that there were 3 hodes all circling the map, but never running into each other. Those that tried to fight the hordes were disgrunteld because it was always a loosing battle with 50+ guys diving on a base defended by 5-10 people. All in all it was not a great atmospher to build a gaming company on, so HTC changed it.
Yes there are still hordes, and ganging of one country, but the hordes are smaller and easier to break up, and once the "gangers" figure out that running a country down to its 3 uncapturable bases isn't going to win the war, they may start looking at fighting a "smart" battle to capture 40% of each contry while maintaining 90% of their own.
As far as the subject of this post, I don't switch countries much. I find its very easy to find something to do as a Rook in which ever LW arena I'm in. bombing, fighters, GV's, its all fun.
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Originally posted by LePaul
JB88
I've been engaged in a polite email conversation about the Late War Arena caps and the ENY.
In short: HTC won't remove the arena caps. ENY is another no go
My point has been that its unfair to ask people who fly together or are in a squad to "change sides" in an arena they cant even get into
While I politely disagree with HTC's decision, I would encourage you to contact support directly and let them know your ideas, etc.
Guess I call my lawyer now!
:rofl :rofl :rofl
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basically, it's broke..and nobody knows how to fix it!
But don't make any suggestions cause hub willl get mad cause he didn't think of it and he will say bad things about you and then the minions will come in and post "yeah! what he said poopyhead!" and then the thread gets locked and 3 more open and get locked. and then!...and then!
:noid ok goose...now check yer drag...easy easy! WHAM!
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What exactly is broke? That you can't be on the side with the highest numbers and have all the best planes and vehicles?
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Originally posted by megadud
you suck anyway 88 :aok no matter which side or what plane you fly.:p
btw what is your handle ingame?
megapwn.
duh.
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help me obie wan community, youre my only hope.
I guess in order to play the game you need to have no loyalty to your squad, no loyalty to your country, but remain 100% loyal to Hitech.
In a Flight Sim long, long ago.....
" I am a Bz and I will always be a B lander!"
Thinking back to my Air Warrior days... as a rule we didn't jump sides alot, Did we? Sqdn's moved around some but it was a long term move, weeks, months, years.... I can't think of anyone who would move from side to side for a hour or two at a time. (Odds are their was someone who did... just can't think of a player who did right now)
When did side loyalty become a bad thing? From 1994 when I started playing AW till the day EA. killed AirWarrior I was a Bz flying FR.
CAVALRY....... <--------- missing the Good Old Days.
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Yeah! What he said poopyhead!
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When that loyalty gets in the way of trying to improve gameplay, it becomes problematic, and that's pretty much what we've got here, isn't it?
Having discarded my single-minded loyalty back when there were no enemies who would suffer logging in, I can say the grass is just as green on the other side. I just don't see this great evil in not flying with your cartoon squadmates for the same cartoon icon every single night, even if there's no one to fly against. Is pretending to be a patriot for a make-believe country in a game more important than the game itself?
That just seems odd to me.
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Originally posted by Mark Luper
JB,
Word.
Mark
lol
:D
(see below)
i see your point mark, i even agree with parts of it. i am not even in a squad, i just attach myself to them from time to time...so it's not really that.(sp?)
i don't usually fly uber planes either. i like the spit 8 and 9 most of all, and those have plenty of competitors...but to be flying a spit 9 one minute and have to switch to a a6m2 suddenly because five people joined in the fight, it's a bit much...perhaps i am being dramatic. it may have been 6 or 7...i don't know. it's usually during the daytime that i notice the largest degree of disparity. @ night, once the two arenas have started to balance out i can sometimes get into the arena i want to right away...but until that point, i get a choice between.
early war -4
midwar - 8 (pretty big map for a head to head room)
late war orange - 120/120 (can't get into here)
late war blue - 19/120 (still can't find a decent fight in here)
same maps in both LW arenas.
when i get to come on in the afternoons, i only get little windows to fly in. when i have to struggle to get into it, or have to wait to get into an arena where i wont waste that time looking for i fight... i waste precious time (when i post here, i am usually working on other things and only popping in briefly...so it probably seems like i am here more than i am.)
what you say is true ... it's not that big of a deal in the grand scheme of things...but it sure throws a wrench in this one little pleasure of mine.
so here's what i say:
push to shove, i don't think the arena split is effective or workable in its current configuration. does anyone really think that it is? really?
i disagree with your notion that this a good compromise hubs. it really isnt. when numbers are that small and the slightest burp sends ENY out into orbit it makes it difficult to just get in and play...not instant gratification type of play, but play without hassle...within my little windows.
call me a whiner or a cynic or whatever you wish...i am certainly not the only one that feels this way.
i think that the two LW arenas and tightly wired ENY shifts are harmful to gameplay and might greatly benefit from a reconsideration. 3 would probably be better...if only because it would remove the 1st place, second place hierarchy of the arenas and allow for a better flow when using an odd number of countries.
id rather just have one of each.
it's not JUST about wanting this and that...it's wanting a relative consistancy.
it's about not wanting to have to hassle with things just to get up and go.
its about freedom really. when it comes down to it.
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Put me in the "don't care, would never affect me" category.
I'll switch to the low side in a heartbeat if there's a good fight going on at close bases, including a CV. I'll fly whatever I can get; I rarely pick anything popular, so I'm not even cognizant of ENY 95% of the time. I'll cheerfully fly the Zeke-2 if the action is hot. I like the Hurri I as well but you REALLY need close fights for that thing. Seems like it gets passed by hot air balloons.
As for picking an arena, I usually start with EW and progress thru MW and the two LW's simply looking for a couple of close bases with a modicum of action. Heck, if you get 2-3 guys on each side that want to fight... what else to do you need in any arena?
Simple pleasures for a simple man, I guess.
The fight's the thing. Everything else is just icing on the cake.
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Originally posted by croduh
Or you could just have:
CHANGED THE COUNTRY!
let me say this in regards to that.
1) i change countrys. so its ok for me.
2) Not everyone does change countrys. so, not ok for them.
Stop giving the same tired *** coments, it's boring and all you people that do it sound really stupid after a while.
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lol, dorks!
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ENY?!? BAH idk what that is, i fly and fight in mah SBD o' doom!
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Originally posted by The Fugitive
The arenas were split due to the Huge hordes that had developed.
LOL :lol
:rolleyes:
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Don't confuse chess piece loyalty with the fact that sometimes a squad may try to meet together and try to enjoy some models their historical squad flew.
Well the 56th doesn't hold a policy of trying to force members to stay on a team, so somtimes people switch at the last minute and hence can't switch to another team.....
On thing we get annoyed with is that we fly p47's and though rare, i have experianced occasions where we can't even fly a p47 due to ENY limits. These used to be resonably set ENY planes of 30 + excepting the November...which is uber.
When you can't even fly a d11 or d25 in MA late war, and mid-war is near empty, the other late war arena is full, and switching teams means abandoning squad mates.... it's just not a good choice.... this has been rare, but it is frustrateing.
You should be able to fly at least some P47 in late war MA. Most 25 ENY planes seem too low, and too easily limited.
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help me obie wan community, youre my only hope.
Use the force!:D
Obie:aok
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Originally posted by hubsonfire
It's damn sure a better idea than letting the horde have unlimited plane choice again. You've got options, the same options everyone does. The difference between you and me, is that aren't looking at this from anyone's perspective but your own.
Consider this from HT's standpoint, or that of the guys who are "loyal" to the underdog country. Shouldn't there be something in place to at least try to create a more balanced playing field?
Edit: almost forgot. No, I don't consider it optimum; I consider it a perfectly acceptable compromise. To be optimal in my mind, flight would be flat out restricted, not this limp-wristed ENY that kicks in at 0.1, while plane/gv ENY values start at 5. I'd change the values to run all the way down to 1.0, and I'd restrict flight when ENY hit 20.
Reason ENY starts at 5 -
Because of the way it is calculated there is always an ENY value, even if the country numbers difference is only 1
The 5 provides a buffer to a point where there is a big enough difference.
Without it and assuming your idea -
As soon as 1 country gets 1 more player, ENY starts restricting planes.
So at least you now know why the 5 is there and why your idea is el-toro-poopoo.
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KTM 520'S got great holeshots back in the day. I had to say that.
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Originally posted by Stang
Yeah! What he said poopyhead!
:lol
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Originally posted by Kev367th
Reason ENY starts at 5 -
Because of the way it is calculated there is always an ENY value, even if the country numbers difference is only 1
This is not true.
(http://img518.imageshack.us/img518/4031/ahss21nx2.jpg)
Only when one side starts to get a more considerable bigger number of players, ENY starts to move. When difference is only 1, ENY is still 0.
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My squad doesn't force us to stay loyal to a country but we are loyal to each other so we stay knight, just as we were always Cz in AW. Sometimes we're outnumbered, sometimes we're not, but we're always ganged by the bish/rooks. It all evens itself out.
What's broke: ENY doesn't take into consideration 2 countries piling on to the 3rd country who by the numbers has, for example, 110 players, while the other 2 have 80 each. That makes it roughly 110 to 160 admitting there may be some skirmishes between the other 2 countries. So now the country getting ganged has a very limited planeset to combat a horde on both fronts....really the only time I hear much griping about ENY anymore.
Now what really is frustrating many is that they can't log in at prime time and get into the arena that their squadmates are flying in.
I personally have a plane or 2 at every ENY level that I am perfectly happy flying no matter how many LA, P51, Spixteen dweebs are around. But I know it forces more people to quit flying for the night then it does to change sides.
So with all the great intentions, I don't think it's working as intended.
Criticize me, my squad or others who have a similar opinion all you want. Your opinion matters to me as much as mine does to you. But we are all paying customers.
I don't know the answer so I will leave it up to HTC as they continue to do well by us all and never seem to stop trying to improve gameplay for us all.
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Originally posted by Lusche
This is not true.
(http://img518.imageshack.us/img518/4031/ahss21nx2.jpg)
Only when one side starts to get a more considerable bigger number of players, ENY starts to move. When difference is only 1, ENY is still 0.
As said - the reason they start at 5 is to provide a buffer.
There's a thread from way back where HT explains it.
If you also check way back the formula for how ENY is calculated is posted, then you realise there is always a number, even if it is 0.000000001, or 0.0 on the clipboard.
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I can accept that there's always a value, but I know .0000001 isn't 1, and I really don't think HT is incapable of writing software that rounds down.
Anyway, I described what I would consider optimal. While the values I listed may not work in the current setup, they could be made to work. I don't think that's BS.
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no excuse. stop being a child, if you dont like geing constrained by ENY go to the least numbered side and meet some new people. stop being a tard.
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Originally posted by Yeager
no excuse. stop being a child, if you dont like geing constrained by ENY go to the least numbered side and meet some new people. stop being a tard.
um. nevermind.
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Sometimes we're outnumbered, sometimes we're not, but we're always ganged by the bish/rooks. It all evens itself out.
Gimme a break. Nits aren't ganged any more, or less, than any other chess piece. I can't believe you would seriously consider this Goose. All sides get ganged now and then, nits aren't special.
Numbers wise, it's the bish in the bucket lately. Before that it was nits. I remember a couple of years back it was the rooks who were always outnumbered, now they regularly have a significant numbers advantage.
Sunday afternoon the rooks had 164 logged in and the bish had 92. The rooks were hording big time over A30. Yup, the rook horldings were well represented.
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The whiners complaining about the Horde got the ENY instated. They are now happy because they don't get gang banged. They cannot give up the precious ENY for fear of the horde returning. Funny how they are quick to call whiner when somebody questions ENY.
So instead of going somewhere else on the map and fly where the horde wasn't we have ENY.
So i'm confused... it's okay to switch countries, but it wasn't okay to move to another area of the map?
I still pay for AH (why I don't know) I haven't logged in since the last time ENY pissed me off. This is a 'chicken before the egg argument' aint a single person has the answer to the riddle. I just felt the need to put in my two cents.
JB, I must commend you on maintaining composure throughout the thread.... rare in this community. I would have snapped by now
:aok
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One could perhaps split the plane set into 3rds, equally distributing the uber factor. Place the sets on 4 hour rotations and let the chips fall where they may at ones playing time slot. At least as much as I play, I would hit my "favorite" bird for a period of time and perhaps learn to love some of the other less "desirable" planes. Just a thought.
wnt2
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Originally posted by skernsk
The whiners complaining about the Horde got the ENY instated. They are now happy because they don't get gang banged. They cannot give up the precious ENY for fear of the horde returning.
You say you haven't logged in for a while. No offense but it shows. The hordes are as prevelant as ever,
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Hordes are just swarms of squeaking targets.
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Originally posted by SteveBailey
You say you haven't logged in for a while. No offense but it shows. The hordes are as prevelant as ever,
No I have not flown in well over a month. But if the hordes are as prevelant as ever.... what exactly is the purpose of ENY? I thought it was to make the sides even so that no bases could be taken or so that the fighting was even accross the map.... just like in real war.
:lol
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Why do people keep comparing this to "the war"??? Its a game !!
The idea behind ENY isn't so much to make people switch sides, tho it is a by-product. The idea behind ENY is that if you want to fight on the team with superior numbers, then you would get less superior equipment, just to even up the ODDS, not the numbers.
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I think it might be more accurate to say that now there's an incentive to improve the numerical situation, and a penalty for refusing to do so.
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Originally posted by hubsonfire
I think it might be more accurate to say that now there's an incentive to improve the numerical situation, and a penalty for refusing to do so.
well at least that opinion is civil.
good for you.
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Originally posted by JB88
well at least that opinion is civil.
good for you.
Dammit JB88 after Months and Months of seeing yer avatar I finally realized who it is...
Basstard LOL... and all the money I spent on rehab....
:aok
Mac