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General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Mak333 on May 22, 2007, 04:03:30 AM

Title: Ju-88
Post by: Mak333 on May 22, 2007, 04:03:30 AM
A few weeks ago I took up a Ju-88 to have "fun", with no real intention to complete an objective.  I stumbled across a small airfield, took out 3 FH's and a VH in two passes.  

Up until now I did not realize how effective the Ju-88 was.  I upped a set of B17's and tried the same thing.  It took two drops of 1000 lbs bombs (6000 lbs total) to take down one hanger.  The B17 only holds 6000 per plane so I could only take out 3 FH's.  I don't know why I wasn't able to knock down hangers in the B17 with only 3000 lbs.  Is the B17 bomber formation spread too large, unlike the Ju-88?  Is it because of the Pound to Kilogram ratio?  

In any case, I found out that the Ju-88 is an excellent level bomber, but also versatile unlike other level bombers.  It has the same clime rate as B17's, higher clime rate than lancasters or B24's and yet it's more effective than all.  

If you are great a precision bomber and have overlooked the Ju-88, look again.  This twin engine bomber may have a serious impact for you.

My two questions still stand though.  Do smaller formation bombers have less of a formation span, creating a smaller spread of bombs?  Or was I noticing the extra 100 pounds due to the kilogram to pound ratio when comparing it to B17's or B24's?
Title: Ju-88
Post by: Larry on May 22, 2007, 05:45:05 AM
12x500lb Drop two sets one right before the hanger one right after takes them down everytime. The Ju88 is a great bomber when you dont fly into fighters B17 is better with its guns.
Title: Ju-88
Post by: Jonny boy 8 on May 22, 2007, 11:22:15 AM
true, but i thought the ju88 was also a diver bomber?

p51srule:aok
Title: Ju-88
Post by: tedrbr on May 22, 2007, 11:27:46 AM
JU-88 was designed to be used as a dive bomber as well as level bomber.  Germans designed most of their bombers with that intention.

JU-88 is a great bomb platform, just very defensively weak.  

If you are an Arado fan and want bomber perks, or bomber jockey trying to improve your skill with damage points inflicted, the JU-88 is a good choice to run.
Title: Ju-88
Post by: Mak333 on May 22, 2007, 01:05:50 PM
Quote
Originally posted by Larry
12x500lb Drop two sets one right before the hanger one right after takes them down everytime. The Ju88 is a great bomber when you dont fly into fighters B17 is better with its guns.


I'll have to try this Larry.  I am kind of skeptical about it since only 3,000 lbs are being dropped and they aren't exactly landing on the target...  The bomb radius of a 500lbs bomb would seem to have much less effectiveness than a 1000lbs bomb.  Thanks for the suggestion, I'll try this out.

I do like the Ju-88 though.  Since it's ENY is 35, you get massive perks points for bombing.
Title: Ju-88
Post by: Husky01 on May 22, 2007, 01:23:49 PM
3 x 500 = 1,500

1,500 x 3  = 4,500lb of ord on the target when using salvo of 3 500lbs from b24s or 17s
Title: Ju-88
Post by: tedrbr on May 22, 2007, 01:41:31 PM
JU 88 carries bombs in:
500 kg  (1,102 lbs)
250kg  (551 lbs)
50 kg  (110 lbs)

3 X 500kg = 1,500kg = 3,306 lbs  --- that's salvo 1 from a flight of 3 JU-88's, and enough to drop 1 hangar if you are accurate.  

The 50 kg's need to hit on target, as they have very limited blast radius. Need a lot of them for hangars, but only a few for each building or strat target you go after.  They are also useful for hitting 'soft' hangars.

Best way for accuracy is to fly level, fly at a throttle setting that keeps the plane at consistent altitude.  Most bombers flying level at full power still tend to gain altitude, which throws off your bomb site calibration.  About 70-80% power in level flight on the run into the target is about right.  Do it early to let the speed settle down.  Do a long calibration when possible once you are on target and level.  External view from the rear, or 'look up' from bomb site can help you line up on target before it is visible in bomb site itself.  Use L and J keys for course corrections on bomb run.
Title: Ju-88
Post by: Roscoroo on May 22, 2007, 01:50:38 PM
the ju-88 has a secret too .... (awaits the ussual bribe's)


Did you know it can be flown in Attack mode too . this adds the earned perks to your fighter perks instead of bomber perks (bomber mode).

I fly it quite alot and its best to have a wingy come with in a good fighter to help protect you .  the Ju-88 can be a pretty good turner too once you lose the drones  or fly with out them.
Title: Ju-88
Post by: Lusche on May 22, 2007, 01:50:38 PM
Quote
Originally posted by tedrbr

Best way for accuracy is to fly level, fly at a throttle setting that keeps the plane at consistent altitude.  Most bombers flying level at full power still tend to gain altitude, which throws off your bomb site calibration.  


There is a trick to counter that. A few seconds before drop, recalibrate altitude only by hitting U twice. No need to go through the whole calibration routine. Entering calibration mode and leaving it immedeately is sufficient.
Title: Ju-88
Post by: Lusche on May 22, 2007, 01:52:06 PM
Quote
Originally posted by Roscoroo
the ju-88 has a secret too .... (awaits the ussual bribe's)


Did you know it can be flown in Attack mode too . this adds the earned perks to your fighter perks instead of bomber perks (bomber mode).
 


Actually they DO add to bomber score even when flying in attack mode.

Most of my bomber perks do come from my "attack mode" il-2 sorties...
Title: Ju-88
Post by: Krusty on May 22, 2007, 01:52:38 PM
For buildings or strat or whatever, you need to salvo 2 (bare minimum) to destroy anything. I've tested this out.

I was over a city strat and had the internal bombs. I was dive bombing, so no formation. I dropped 1x 50kg directly onto a target. Nothing. So I came back and dropped another on the same... nothing. You need to drop 2 together, because the blast radii reinforce each other.



P.S. salvo 1 with a 1000lb bomb kills hangars just fine in B17s. If you land them on target.
Title: Ju-88
Post by: Krusty on May 22, 2007, 01:53:40 PM
Quote
Originally posted by Lusche
Actually they DO add to bomber score even when flying in attack mode.

Most of my bomber perks do come from my "attack mode" il-2 sorties...


Yup! It rolls from the bomber hangar, all the perks go to bombers. The attack/bomber is only how the stats are recorded, not where the perkies go towards!
Title: Ju-88
Post by: Brooke on May 22, 2007, 03:53:09 PM
Mak333, the upcoming special-event scenario Operation Husky is running in June.  We have spots available for Ju 88 pilots in that one, and I'm expecting it to be a lot of fun.  It's based on the 1943 invasion of Sicily.  If you register for axis and put Ju 88's as your preference to fly, you will get a Ju 88 spot.

Here's info on the scenario with links to registration:

http://ahevents.org/pacific-theatre/current-or-next-scenario-2.html

For more information on scenarios in general, click on the link in my signature line.

Hope to see you in the skies over Sicily.
Title: Ju-88
Post by: Masherbrum on May 22, 2007, 04:17:40 PM
Ablout 5 months ago I was always in a Ju-88.   A few scattered Rooks were trying to take a base and I got there and dropped the VH, and 1 FH with the Main Ord.   I still had the little bombs and some were saying over range, we may not get it because only 1 was vulching.    I was able to vulch 6 kills with the salvo set to 1.   We got the field and I landed with 14x3 of the little bombs.

The Ju-88 is a VERY EFFECTIVE bomber/dive bomber.
Title: Ju-88
Post by: Krusty on May 22, 2007, 04:28:48 PM
You forgot "/vulcher" :aok
Title: Ju-88
Post by: Fulmar on May 22, 2007, 06:07:25 PM
More often than not I find myself encountering JU88s flying into furballs around 5000 ft near a base.  I mean seriously, with the lack of protection that JU88s have, it amazes me how many fighters respond to knock it out.
Title: Ju-88
Post by: 68ROX on May 22, 2007, 06:09:41 PM
Yes, the 88's are an "unrecognized" bomber.

I have seen my squaddie 68DONKEY drop a vehicle base in no time with a set....ack and hangars MANY TIMES.

68ROX
Title: Ju-88
Post by: Brooke on May 22, 2007, 07:26:19 PM
We want these Ju 88 pilots in the axis team for Operation Husky!  It is perfect for such action.  Come join us, folks! :)

http://ahevents.org/pacific-theatre/current-or-next-scenario-2.html
Title: Ju-88
Post by: Virage on May 22, 2007, 07:34:22 PM
Ju88 is a great bomber.  It really shines without ext ord. using the 50kgrs to take out ord and towns.

The 4x1000kg bombs are only practically useful vs. 2 hngrs.  If you come in low and have an accurate calibration, you can take out 4 if you live long enough.  

As all serious buffers know: with the drop dispersion at alt, you need to use a salvo of 2 in a formation to assure a hngr kill.

The only drawback is the def guns.  They are pretty much worthless.  A big problem is the convergence setting of the formation.  At 400yds the 7.9 mm don't do enough damage.  At the damage range of the guns (<250 yds) the outer 2 plane's guns in formation are shooting behind your target.

Aim for wings instead of center mass.  I also read on these boards somewhere that slowing down helps with the lethality.  The increase in relative bullet velocity makes sense, but I haven't tried it online.  And a fast dive to help is probably a better tactic than a slow trip out of dodge.
Title: Ju-88
Post by: Husky01 on May 22, 2007, 07:46:09 PM
Operation Husky is looking for Boston Pilots :) There kinda like Ju88s lol not sure how but they are.
Title: Ju-88
Post by: Mak333 on May 22, 2007, 11:33:02 PM
Quote
Originally posted by Krusty
P.S. salvo 1 with a 1000lb bomb kills hangars just fine in B17s. If you land them on target.


Interesting.  This may work with a relatively low altitude.  I took B17's up to test this out.  I set salvo to 1, which would let me drop one 1,000lbs bomb from each bomber, making it 3,000lbs total.  The bomb spread was ridiculous.  Not only did I fail to knock down the hanger, but the bombs did not appear to land where they were dropped.  I took a Ju-88 and did the same, knocked down the hanger with THREE 500kg bombs.  This might be because of the the slightly larger weight in the bombs, but it might also have to do with how they fall, or even how close the formation is.  Has anyone ever compared the distance between level bombers in a formation to different level bombers?  Being the B17 is a larger plane, it might have a larger bomb spread because the planes may be further apart when flying in the formation.
Title: Ju-88
Post by: Mak333 on May 22, 2007, 11:34:02 PM
Quote
Originally posted by Brooke
Mak333, the upcoming special-event scenario Operation Husky is running in June.  We have spots available for Ju 88 pilots in that one, and I'm expecting it to be a lot of fun.  It's based on the 1943 invasion of Sicily.  If you register for axis and put Ju 88's as your preference to fly, you will get a Ju 88 spot.

Here's info on the scenario with links to registration:

http://ahevents.org/pacific-theatre/current-or-next-scenario-2.html

For more information on scenarios in general, click on the link in my signature line.

Hope to see you in the skies over Sicily.


Brooke, thank you for the information and link.  I will definitely look into this.
Title: sinking cv
Post by: hoovers on May 23, 2007, 01:43:01 AM
I was surprised the other Night when I sunk a CV with the 20 50kg bombs in formation.  Great bomber.

:cool:

Hoovers
Title: Re: sinking cv
Post by: Mak333 on May 23, 2007, 01:53:56 AM
Quote
Originally posted by hoovers
I was surprised the other Night when I sunk a CV with the 20 50kg bombs in formation.  Great bomber.

:cool:

Hoovers


Yes, I found out that they were very well against GV's too!
Title: Ju-88
Post by: tedrbr on May 23, 2007, 01:52:48 PM
Quote
Originally posted by Mak333
Interesting.  This may work with a relatively low altitude.  I took B17's up to test this out.  I set salvo to 1, which would let me drop one 1,000lbs bomb from each bomber, making it 3,000lbs total.  The bomb spread was ridiculous.  Not only did I fail to knock down the hanger, but the bombs did not appear to land where they were dropped.....


I've knocked out hangars consistently from 15K with salvo 1.  Running level, 80% power, level and lined up well in advance, minor course corrections with J and L, combat trim used, long calibrations.   With 500's, I can hit a strat from up to 25K to 30K about 9 times out of 10.  

So long as you've got a good technique going for you, you can make very economical use of your bomb load and the hyper accurate bomb sight.

If you are make late final course corrections, your drones drop will be off.  If running flat out at full power, you risk the plane gaining altitude, even in level flight.  

Best to start with salvo 3's with a reasonably close delay (0.07 to 0.10). As you get better, you will be able to use salvo 2's, then finally salvo 1's against targets.
Title: Ju-88
Post by: Ghastly on May 23, 2007, 03:28:11 PM
The JU-88 was in some respects the "Mossie of the LW" - used in just about every role possible during the war, in real life.  It has always been my favorite of the German bombers.

Title: Ju-88
Post by: Mak333 on May 23, 2007, 03:28:31 PM
Quote
Originally posted by tedrbr
I've knocked out hangars consistently from 15K with salvo 1.  Running level, 80% power, level and lined up well in advance, minor course corrections with J and L, combat trim used, long calibrations.   With 500's, I can hit a strat from up to 25K to 30K about 9 times out of 10.  

So long as you've got a good technique going for you, you can make very economical use of your bomb load and the hyper accurate bomb sight.

If you are make late final course corrections, your drones drop will be off.  If running flat out at full power, you risk the plane gaining altitude, even in level flight.  

Best to start with salvo 3's with a reasonably close delay (0.07 to 0.10). As you get better, you will be able to use salvo 2's, then finally salvo 1's against targets.


I can take down a hanger with salvo 1 in a Ju88 every time.  But I'll have to up another B17 with thousand pounders, because something must have been off then.  I am pretty precise when it comes to level bombing.  Thank you for the suggestions.
Title: Ju-88
Post by: airspro on May 23, 2007, 03:34:55 PM
Are we ever gonna get a night fighter verison . What I mean a cannon version ?
Title: Ju-88
Post by: Nilsen on May 23, 2007, 03:44:05 PM
Twice this tour ive been owned by ju88s.

It happened like this both times:

1. Chase ju88s...

2. their pigs take out my K4 engine's oil...

3. i turn and head for home...

4. afew mins later the engine dies...

5. I try to find an open space to ditch on...

6. land and almost stop...

7. PING PING PING PING...

8. BOOM..

9. Im in tower after remaining Ju88 has followed me and shot me down, and im like WTF!!!

:D


PWNED!
Title: Ju-88
Post by: tedrbr on May 23, 2007, 05:02:54 PM
One of my all time favorite fights was me in a flight of Ju88's returning from a strat run coming across a flight of Ki-67's coming back from a run.  

I got out with two shot up planes, he retired with 1 Ki-67 remaining.  I figure flak had shot him up before I got to him, or I should have been dead meat.  

Sure wish I'd have recorded that one.
Title: Ju-88
Post by: OOZ662 on May 23, 2007, 09:50:48 PM
Quote
Originally posted by Mak333
Since it's ENY is 35, you get massive perks points for bombing.


ENY determines perks in Player vs Player situations. OBJ determines perks in Player vs Object situations.

Quote
Originally posted by Krusty
I was over a city strat and had the internal bombs. I was dive bombing, so no formation. I dropped 1x 50kg directly onto a target. Nothing. So I came back and dropped another on the same... nothing.


You just dropped 220lbs on a 250lb hardness target.
Title: Ju-88
Post by: Vulcan on May 24, 2007, 12:34:04 AM
Quote
Originally posted by Jonny boy 8
true, but i thought the ju88 was also a diver bomber?

p51srule:aok


JU-88 was also used heavily as a night fighter.