Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: halcyon on June 29, 2007, 02:26:34 AM
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Cutting straight to business.
Before I get flamed through the floor, I have no problem with the concept of ENY.
I may not like it sometimes, but in the end I don't personally have a problem with it being there.
THAT said...here is my gripe. (and yes this has been addressed but MAN it's still annoying)
(http://img184.imageshack.us/img184/2371/ah201wh0.jpg)
You have a breakdown of 65 Bish, 46 Knights, and 44 Rooks, making a total arena population of 155. Imagine 155 people standing in your backyard...that's a lot of people.
Of all those people, only 108 are actually playing the game. That means that 47 people are just sitting there...doing nothing. That's 30% of the arena population not doing squat.
Break it down further into inactive players for each side. Bish has 18 people not playing (27% of their pop), Knights 16 (34%), and Rooks 13 (29%).
Because of the 18 people (only one of the factors for ENY here) not doing anything except sitting in the tower on the Bish, they have an ENY of 5.7 which is disabling 13% of the vehicle list for the other 47 people that are actually playing.
Why? Why should afk people in the tower affect the ENY values? The whole concept of ENY is to restrict so-called "better" aircraft based on country populations...but what good are pilots if they sit in the tower.
What if out of the 65 Bish from that snapshot, 64 were in the tower and one guy was out there flying? He still has to deal with ENY restrictions, even if his plane is the ONLY one in the air.
Keep the ENY, okay fine...but jeez don't punish active pilots by including ones that forgot to set their alarm when mission time came in the total country population.
In that picture, the total country population should be the 47 Bish actually flying.
This was late at night when the arena pops were low, but it was a lot worse earlier on around 7-8pm CST. Almost 40% of the Knights were sitting in the hanger, doing nothing. And that's fine too...I don't care if pilots shuck their duty of fighting for their country, just DON'T count them as the fighting force.
The possible fix?
Log idle players out after a set amount of time. Maybe 10-15 minutes.
If you haven't moved your mouse or touched a key in 10-15 minutes then maybe you should have logged out before you went afk. Fortunately, such a said system would do this for you, keeping the ENY balance fair.
Okay I'm done.
*cringes from the incoming flames*
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If you count only ppl in flight, bish has 43.5% and had to be punished even more. Every country have more or less same relative number of inactive players, it dont affect ENY much.
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LOL try being a ROOK for a while, we deal wtih ENY on a regular basis.
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ENY only affects a handful of planes doesnt it?
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<<<<---in the percentage afk sitting in tower at the time..:aok
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Seeing as how they were Bish, they were probably sitting in the tower waiting for their horde mission to launch.
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Originally posted by Oleg
If you count only ppl in flight, bish has 43.5% and had to be punished even more. Every country have more or less same relative number of inactive players, it dont affect ENY much.
You completely missed the point of the post and focused only on the actual numbers in the screenshot.
Forget the numbers...they change. There are many days where a country has an in-flight number lower then the other two countries, yet has the highest total population. This is where ENY becomes a hamper for active pilots vs afk/inactive pilots.
Originally posted by Nilsen
ENY only affects a handful of planes doesnt it?
There are 87 planes, vehicles, and watercraft in the game.
The first 12 have an ENY value of 5, which is %13.
If ENY goes above 10 that's another large chunk out of the pool.
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Yeah but its just the dweeby planes.. tons of other good rides
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Originally posted by Nilsen
Yeah but its just the dweeby planes.. tons of other good rides
Unfortunately Nilsen over half the game population fly the "dweeby" planes, and the ENY affects them first. :)
There are lots of great rides between 5 and 10 that get locked out frequently from ENY, and some more between 10-15.
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bingo!
Conclusion: eny works :D
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Originally posted by Nilsen
bingo!
Conclusion: eny works :D
No! :D
I'm just upset when I can't up an F4U-1D, F6F-5, P-47-D40, or a Spit 8. These are the four that usually get locked out for me from ENY. I don't even touch the ENY 5 stuff.
Usually though I'm in a Ki-84, and when that gets locked out I have to go for my C.205. Of course, when the ENY hits 21 there goes that plus the Osti's.
All that I'm left with at that point is the P-47-D25, and when the ENY hits 23 I log out because the rest of the aircraft selection isn't enjoyable to me.
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Still lots of nice planes to choose from
When eny hits 30 you should start to worry ;)
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somthing about NIlsen's last 3 post make me laugh :lol
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Is that actually people just sitting in the tower doing nothing for extended periods of time, or is it the natural "churn" of guys getting shot down, selecting an airfield, aircraft, loadout, etc? They way guys furball until they die, it wouldn't surprise me if at any one time a big chunk of the player base is "dead" and in the process of launching again.
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Originally posted by Platano
somthing about NIlsen's last 3 post make me laugh :lol
:D
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You think the eny of 5.7 is bad check this out took it a few nights ago
:rolleyes:
(http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/997_1183110482_2.jpg)
Note the numbers of afks then the same night 2 hr later :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
(http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/997_1183110939_later2.jpg)
I was going to make a post about it, but seeing how things are dont think it would make any diff.
Just glad someone brought it up....
YEAH! ENY works just great awwww FUN TIMES.
:noid
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Originally posted by halcyon
You completely missed the point of the post and focused only on the actual numbers in the screenshot.
Forget the numbers...they change. There are many days where a country has an in-flight number lower then the other two countries, yet has the highest total population. This is where ENY becomes a hamper for active pilots vs afk/inactive pilots.
What for your screenshot when? You know nothing about how much ppl in twr actually afk and who leave computer for 1 min or just landed/killed and want to choose other plane/field or rest for dozen of secs or talk in 200 or wait for mission etc (i dont know too). Kicking ppl who inactive for 10 mins or more will change nothing in ENY, just because there are very few ppl who actually leave PC for long time, i beleive (it would open space for others if arena full, but its another story).
And once again, there are no reason to think what one country has more relative number of "inactive" ppl than others.
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Two changes could fix all of it -
1) If you click the AFK 'button' you are not counted in the overall population in regards to ENY, but you are also unable to up a plane or GV. (prevents gaming).
Should also be unable to join missions etc.
Unchecking the AFK 'button' puts you back into the ENY count and re-enables flight.
2) After a specified inactivity time limit you are automatically logged out.
That way for the most part only ACTIVE players are counted for ENY purposes.
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Base ENY on the number of Fields a country owns, not how many people are online. That way if say the Knights get a boost of players during prime time the ENY wouldn't go up unless we actually owned more of the map.
If the whole idea of ENY is to slow down land grabs, and help balance the game. Then tie it to fields, people are just too volatile, coming & going. Sitting in the tower drinking coffee or arguing with the missus.
That way ONLY the country that owns more of its share of the map gets punished. That way a large squadron could actually log into the Early or Midwar arena and be able to fly something other than the Val. Then if they started taking fields the Eny would GRADUALLY increase with each field taken.
No wild swings, but a much smoother control.
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Some people will not log out for fear of not being able to get back in because of the floating arena lock thingy.
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Originally posted by halcyon
Cutting straight to business.
Before I get flamed through the floor, I have no problem with the concept of ENY.
I may not like it sometimes, but in the end I don't personally have a problem with it being there.
THAT said..... WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAA
oh lord, yet another ENY whine thread.
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boot em after 20 minutes to make space for people who want to play. will not affect eny at all. learn new planes so you can be a successful horder and not have to log off when you outnumber everyone heavily.....it's easier than you think, and more respectable than crying:)
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Oye storch wats with the wildlife avi's?
FoSg's? :D
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Anything that disables the 5.0 planes I support.
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FoSGs=flock of seagulls=the non birds of prey. birds of prey don't flock the are solitary hunters. I don't know what imbecile selected that moniker for that squad but I do know this, the flock ergo they are not birds of prey.
the current avatard is called angry stork and he's pissed that the FoSGs think they are BoPs when clearly they are not.
acére mónina, ¿que volá cónsorte? :D
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Does the in flight counter include GVs?
If it does---why?
Would it be fair to not include GVs and towered players in the eny?
Just wondering,
Boner
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<--- coos at storch's birdie
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Originally posted by 1Boner
Does the in flight counter include GVs?
If it does---why?
Would it be fair to not include GVs and towered players in the eny?
Just wondering,
Boner
ENY takes into account everybody in the arena whether they are active / inactive / afk / passed out / fallen aseep / farting / picking nose etc etc etc.
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Originally posted by 1Boner
Does the in flight counter include GVs?
If it does---why?
Would it be fair to not include GVs and towered players in the eny?
Just wondering,
Boner
GVs should be counted in ... they are a threat the same as planes.
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Easy Fix:
FLY KNIGHTS!
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The only problem with ENY is it doesn't do ENOUGH and it doesn't do it FAST ENOUGH....
The problem is, the server adds up the sides, sees an imbalance, and the first thing it does is 0.5 or something stupid. Then it goes to 1.7, or 2.1, or 3.5....
It does jack all until it finally hits 5.1, when it FINALLY disables something on the over-balanced side.
By now it's far far past the "we could prevent this with a little ENY" stage.
The second the server sees an imbalance (where it normally starts an ENY limit of 0.2 or whatever) the lowest possible ENY limit should be 5.1, and it should only grow higher from there.
As-is it does nothing for a long, extended, period of time, allowing the high-numbered side to horde it up with impunity.
ENY isn't strict enough to work!
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Originally posted by halcyon
You completely missed the point of the post and focused only on the actual numbers in the screenshot.
Hey Numpty, switch sides. ENY problem over. Get out of the horde and fly against the numbers, you might have some fun and learn something in the process.
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Originally posted by halcyon
Unfortunately Nilsen over half the game population fly the "dweeby" planes, and the ENY affects them first. :)
There are lots of great rides between 5 and 10 that get locked out frequently from ENY, and some more between 10-15.
there are even better rides in the 15-30 ENY range
personally i think its funny to see la7,spit16,niki dweebs stuck in high eny planes
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If you can't up a -1D...you can surely up an F4U-1 !
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Originally posted by halcyon
I don't care if pilots shuck their duty of fighting for their country
:rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl
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Plenty of 109s and 190s to choose from to. The latter can be used for both HOing and ramming if skill is the issue :D
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My favorite ride of late has an ENY of 30.....
Not that knights have ENY problems very often, but it FARMS PERKS like 1,000 acres of delta bottomland and 500,000,000 tons O'fertilizer!
68ROX
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Originally posted by Krusty
The only problem with ENY is it doesn't do ENOUGH and it doesn't do it FAST ENOUGH....
The problem is, the server adds up the sides, sees an imbalance, and the first thing it does is 0.5 or something stupid. Then it goes to 1.7, or 2.1, or 3.5....
It does jack all until it finally hits 5.1, when it FINALLY disables something on the over-balanced side.
By now it's far far past the "we could prevent this with a little ENY" stage.
The second the server sees an imbalance (where it normally starts an ENY limit of 0.2 or whatever) the lowest possible ENY limit should be 5.1, and it should only grow higher from there.
As-is it does nothing for a long, extended, period of time, allowing the high-numbered side to horde it up with impunity.
ENY isn't strict enough to work!
Thers a reason for 0.1 > 4.9 ENY values.
Because of the way it is calculated without that buffer zone even a 1 player advange would start disabling planes.
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Originally posted by SteveBailey
Hey Numpty, switch sides. ENY problem over. Get out of the horde and fly against the numbers, you might have some fun and learn something in the process.
I have a number of friends on Knights, as well as my new squad, so no this isn't a solution.
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the sooner you figure out that HT cares nothing for your opinions on HIS game the sooner the boards can be cleared of all these ridiculous eny and map threads.
give it up!!:furious
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Kev: I disagree. The code itself already doesn't kick in (even to 0.1) until a certain threshold is passed.
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Originally posted by dedalos
:rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl
Cut the laughter Ded, and get out there and fly for your country. It's your duty!;)
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What I wonder is IF the system works, and it's based on total players logged in, then why was there NO ENY restriction on the Rooks in this instance?
Originally posted by DarkS1ar
(http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/997_1183110939_later2.jpg)
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Originally posted by BaldEagl
What I wonder is IF the system works, and it's based on total players logged in, then why was there NO ENY restriction on the Rooks in this instance?
Because most of the pilots belonging to S.A.P.P. are Rooks, and we have a deal with HTC :noid
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Originally posted by halcyon
Unfortunately Nilsen over half the game population fly the "dweeby" planes, and the ENY affects them first. :)
There are lots of great rides between 5 and 10 that get locked out frequently from ENY, and some more between 10-15.
So what you're skirting is that YOU are included in that "1/2 that fly a dweeby plane". Sweet whine, but I wish some here would use the Search function. The Bish and Knights asked for ENY, they now have it.
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Really sucks when ENY so bad you can't even get a bomber or carrier planes rolling. :huh
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Originally posted by jhookt
the sooner you figure out that HT cares nothing for your opinions on HIS game the sooner the boards can be cleared of all these ridiculous eny and map threads.
give it up!!:furious
:cry :cry :cry
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Originally posted by SteveBailey
:cry :cry :cry
lol is that your substitute for a compelling argument?
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1) I thought ENY was to help prevent hording by one side over the other. Tying it to fields owned wouldn't fix that at all.
2) Tying it to fields owned would be inclined to stagnate the arena and slow the resets, as the closer to reset a country gets the worse planes they can fly to finish the job. Forcing people to fly the same maps for longer periods of time probably isn't in the best interest of the game overall.
3) In my experience, the moment ENY goes above 5.0 the percentage of people sitting the tower begins to build like mad - half the reason half the people in the screenshots are in the tower is they are waiting for a chance to grab their ride again.
4) If you based it solely upon numbers in flight, large groups would game it by simul-launching.
5) The good thing about ENY is that ENY works - at least to some extent. (The bad is that there is lots of situations where it doesn't help, and even hinders).
6) It would work much better though if it were localized, limited based upon what's in the immediate sectors around your airfield/vehicle base and not upon the overall country players. It's very frustrating to be ENY constrained while being locally outnumbered, because most people on your country are trying to overwhelm a field on the other side of the map with sheer numbers.
In fact, in this situation, ENY reinforces the horde mentality. Your choices are to change sides and fly with the other horde, change fronts and fly with your own horde, or continue to get hammered by the overwhelming odds until you get tired and log.