Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: crockett on July 04, 2007, 02:43:04 AM
-
I dunno why you were giving me crap tonight over something so stupid but here yea go..
KI-84 (http://www.hitechcreations.com/ahhelp/models/ki84.html)
Ki-61 (http://www.hitechcreations.com/ahhelp/models/ki611c.html)
At no alt will the Ki-61 out run a ki-84.
Top speed of the Ki-61 at 15k is a hair under 375 mph, probably about 365mph according to the graph. On the deck it's top speed is in the 310mph range.
The Ki-84 top speed at 15k is 375mph on the dot, but climb to 18k and it will do 390ish. On the Deck the Ki-84 is still faster as it will do roughly 340mph according to the chart.
Also as far as the turning, there are no stats, but assuming both pilots are equal, I still say no way a Ki-61 will out turn a ki-84 at the same speeds on the deck. If it will, I'll eat my words on that aspect, but I know for a fact a ki-84 is faster.
Even if the ki-61 did manage to out turn the ki-84, the ki-84 would still eat up the ki-61 because it has more power to recover and play with. The ki-61 is way under powered and IMO dogish on the deck with it's limited climb ability.
Aside from that both planes are two of my favorites in the game. In fact Japanese planes are my personal favorites overal, starting with the ki-84, A6m5 and the ki-61. A tour or two ago, those would have been the most common planes I flew. I've been trying to get better in the P38 so I've been flying the P38G as much as possible lately.
In no way am I saying the Ki-61 sucks but given equal pilots both skilled in each aircraft, I'd have to give the likely win to the Ki-84 in most cases.
As side note the only real complaint I have about either, is how easy it is to get pilot wounds due to no armor.
-
You see, how it works. My plot to get more and more guys flying 38Gs is surely taking hold now. Crockett is flying the G more and more.
Freezeman was in a G tonite. G drivers everywhere.
I will take over the AH world!
38G beats both the Tony and Frank btw :D
-
Originally posted by Guppy35
You see, how it works. My plot to get more and more guys flying 38Gs is surely taking hold now. Crockett is flying the G more and more.
Freezeman was in a G tonite. G drivers everywhere.
I will take over the AH world!
38G beats both the Tony and Frank btw :D
was i:noid
-
Originally posted by evenhaim
was i:noid
wtfg freez!!!!!
-
I'm flying the 38G quite often now:D
-
Originally posted by Guppy35
38G beats both the Tony and Frank btw :D
False statement! :noid
-
<------perfers the P38J
-
Originally posted by Guppy35
You see, how it works. My plot to get more and more guys flying 38Gs is surely taking hold now. Crockett is flying the G more and more.
Freezeman was in a G tonite. G drivers everywhere.
I will take over the AH world!
38G beats both the Tony and Frank btw :D
You need to teach me to fly it!!!
Please!!:aok
-
Originally posted by Gaidin
You need to teach me to fly it!!!
Please!!:aok
LOL yer asking the wrong guy.
Follow me some night and do everything I don't do. You'll live forever and land 50 kills.
In the meantime I'll be the guy in the shattered smoking 38G falling to pieces all over the arena, but enjoying every minute of it :)
-
Originally posted by Gianlupo
False statement! :noid
As if an avocado can fly................
-
Why not? If a brainless thing like a salad can do it.....
-
Originally posted by Guppy35
You see, how it works. My plot to get more and more guys flying 38Gs is surely taking hold now. Crockett is flying the G more and more.
Freezeman was in a G tonite. G drivers everywhere.
I will take over the AH world!
38G beats both the Tony and Frank btw :D
After flying all the planes in this game IMHO, for me the plane that presents the hardest challenge is the P-38-G.I have just about all the squaddies flying it now.Matter of fact it's all that i ever fly.
-
I think Freeze has my house bugged.
AKwoodee:confused: :confused:
-
Funny thing... thats all DG and I were flying today in the 38's :rofl
Damn you Guppy!! :D
-
Originally posted by crockett
I dunno why you were giving me crap tonight over something so stupid but here yea go..
KI-84 (http://www.hitechcreations.com/ahhelp/models/ki84.html)
Ki-61 (http://www.hitechcreations.com/ahhelp/models/ki611c.html)
At no alt will the Ki-61 out run a ki-84.
Top speed of the Ki-61 at 15k is a hair under 375 mph, probably about 365mph according to the graph. On the deck it's top speed is in the 310mph range.
The Ki-84 top speed at 15k is 375mph on the dot, but climb to 18k and it will do 390ish. On the Deck the Ki-84 is still faster as it will do roughly 340mph according to the chart.
Also as far as the turning, there are no stats, but assuming both pilots are equal, I still say no way a Ki-61 will out turn a ki-84 at the same speeds on the deck. If it will, I'll eat my words on that aspect, but I know for a fact a ki-84 is faster.
Even if the ki-61 did manage to out turn the ki-84, the ki-84 would still eat up the ki-61 because it has more power to recover and play with. The ki-61 is way under powered and IMO dogish on the deck with it's limited climb ability.
Aside from that both planes are two of my favorites in the game. In fact Japanese planes are my personal favorites overal, starting with the ki-84, A6m5 and the ki-61. A tour or two ago, those would have been the most common planes I flew. I've been trying to get better in the P38 so I've been flying the P38G as much as possible lately.
In no way am I saying the Ki-61 sucks but given equal pilots both skilled in each aircraft, I'd have to give the likely win to the Ki-84 in most cases.
As side note the only real complaint I have about either, is how easy it is to get pilot wounds due to no armor.
Again, I'm up to prove these numbers wrong as I do it often. Skills aside, you'd think the Bish and Knight folks that come across a Rook Ki61 wouldn't get cocky. But, they do and very often find themselves in the tower quickly. I applaud them for thinking like this, it makes my job even easier.
I'm sure the last two sentences will come across as arrogance as it has been common in the past. Folks will pile on my statements, and when defending myself, the accusations fly.
Now back on track. I RARELY am above 12k, my squaddies and friends in all countries will agree with this. I will use 12k worth of E in a fight, if I am on the deck, I will try and save some E. I DO NOT use flaps, and 90% of the time, rarely use them. I use throttle manipulation instead. It is more effective for my style of fighting. Climbing 8k more to me, is a waste of time and fuel. If I only fly to 20k and stay there at all costs, I am limiting my skills and restricting tactics even further. I WILL climb to 20k and knock someone off of that perch, and then dive back to altitude.
In the 5 years + of playing AH, I have shocked country mates by predicting Con maneuvers before they even happen. I can often with a degree of accuracy tell who I'm fighting.
Summary: Numbers and charts mean watermelon in a MA environment. The numbers are replaced by cockiness, laziness, and 2nd guesses. I have NO PROBLEMS turning with Spits and easier yet, Ki84's. I did it Monday night. I do it often. He even had altitude, but he made a fatal error, he misjudged my E, I was easily catching him in the ONLY plus the Ki84 has. He was caught going vertical, and had about 11k to plummet.
Strafing, you've always a problem with me for some reason as I've never done anything to you personally. I believe you are one who is younger than myself and carries a grudge over the most minuscule of dealings. I dropped the MA milk run baggage that you participated in over a year ago. The Rooks who were on last night would concur with this as well.
Look at my scores this Tour, and 2 Tours ago. You'll see what I mean.
Finally, if you want to get better, do not hesitate to see if I want to take you to the DA. I'd be happy to teach all that I know. Then again, "since Karaya sucks, I might be wasting my time."
<> Goth and Helm for teaching me the ways of the "POS Tony". ENY of 25 :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl
-
Originally posted by Guppy35
You see, how it works. My plot to get more and more guys flying 38Gs is surely taking hold now. Crockett is flying the G more and more.
Freezeman was in a G tonite. G drivers everywhere.
I will take over the AH world!
38G beats both the Tony and Frank btw :D
If I was worth mentioning..........nah I'm not. :aok
-
This one time I drove a goon on the ground 5 miles and took the port with 2 GVs still up at the port. :noid
-
Originally posted by Guppy35
You see, how it works. My plot to get more and more guys flying 38Gs is surely taking hold now. Crockett is flying the G more and more.
Freezeman was in a G tonite. G drivers everywhere.
I will take over the AH world!
38G beats both the Tony and Frank btw :D
lol well I always flew the J before, but it just didn't seem to work well for me, or not the way I like to fly. I always kept hearing the G was the better turner but I just couldn't get past that crappy view. :rolleyes:
I finally decided to just do it and after awhile the crappy view kinda seems to go away, to the point it's easy to ignore. Once I got over the bad view, the G seems to fit my flying style much better. I tend to get into most of my fights in the under 5k range so it seems to preform the best out of the three 38's in that range.
I also think flying the A6m with no WEP helped a lot, because you get broken from being a WEP addict flying that plane. With the G model I really don't miss the WEP at all other than when trying to run someone down.
-
Originally posted by Husky01
This one time I drove a goon on the ground 5 miles and took the port with 2 GVs still up at the port. :noid
LMFAO, that was mint! Wasn't it? I now realize what purpose spawncampers provide. An open back door. We'll have to do that again.
-
Originally posted by crockett
lol well I always flew the J before, but it just didn't seem to work well for me, or not the way I like to fly. I always kept hearing the G was the better turner but I just couldn't get past that crappy view. :rolleyes:
I finally decided to just do it and after awhile the crappy view kinda seems to go away, to the point it's easy to ignore. Once I got over the bad view, the G seems to fit my flying style much better. I tend to get into most of my fights in the under 5k range so it seems to preform the best out of the three 38's in that range.
I also think flying the A6m with no WEP helped a lot, because you get broken from being a WEP addict flying that plane. With the G model I really don't miss the WEP at all other than when trying to run someone down.
Exactly. Low and slow, turning on the deck. The only place for a 38G to be :)
-
Originally posted by Masherbrum
LMFAO, that was mint! Wasn't it? I now realize what purpose spawncampers provide. An open back door. We'll have to do that again.
Yes we will, but next time I think Ill fly the goon. Taxing 5 miles at 90mph is hard lol.
-
Originally posted by Masherbrum
Again, I'm up to prove these numbers wrong as I do it often. Skills aside, you'd think the Bish and Knight folks that come across a Rook Ki61 wouldn't get cocky. But, they do and very often find themselves in the tower quickly. I applaud them for thinking like this, it makes my job even easier.
I'm sure the last two sentences will come across as arrogance as it has been common in the past. Folks will pile on my statements, and when defending myself, the accusations fly.
Now back on track. I RARELY am above 12k, my squaddies and friends in all countries will agree with this. I will use 12k worth of E in a fight, if I am on the deck, I will try and save some E. I DO NOT use flaps, and 90% of the time, rarely use them. I use throttle manipulation instead. It is more effective for my style of fighting. Climbing 8k more to me, is a waste of time and fuel. If I only fly to 20k and stay there at all costs, I am limiting my skills and restricting tactics even further. I WILL climb to 20k and knock someone off of that perch, and then dive back to altitude.
In the 5 years + of playing AH, I have shocked country mates by predicting Con maneuvers before they even happen. I can often with a degree of accuracy tell who I'm fighting.
Summary: Numbers and charts mean watermelon in a MA environment. The numbers are replaced by cockiness, laziness, and 2nd guesses. I have NO PROBLEMS turning with Spits and easier yet, Ki84's. I did it Monday night. I do it often. He even had altitude, but he made a fatal error, he misjudged my E, I was easily catching him in the ONLY plus the Ki84 has. He was caught going vertical, and had about 11k to plummet.
Strafing, you've always a problem with me for some reason as I've never done anything to you personally. I believe you are one who is younger than myself and carries a grudge over the most minuscule of dealings. I dropped the MA milk run baggage that you participated in over a year ago. The Rooks who were on last night would concur with this as well.
Look at my scores this Tour, and 2 Tours ago. You'll see what I mean.
Finally, if you want to get better, do not hesitate to see if I want to take you to the DA. I'd be happy to teach all that I know. Then again, "since Karaya sucks, I might be wasting my time."
<> Goth and Helm for teaching me the ways of the "POS Tony". ENY of 25 :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl
Well again, I'm not saying a Ki-61 is a bad plane, I'm saying it's not the equal of a ki-84 in a equal setting. In the MA of course charts don't mean a thing, as one guys is likely to always have a advantage over the other for one reason or another.
It might be a E advantage, Alt or even a weight advantage. The ki-61 might be on his lat leg of his fuel tank while the Ki-84 might have just dropped his drop tanks. All sort of little things can add up to an advantage for one guy or the other.
I've killed quite a few guys in the Ki-61 myself, but it's not my primary ride but I know it's a great plane if flown well. Simply because a lot of guys under estimate it. Then again that can happen with a lot of planes, hell I had my but handed to me the other day in my 38G by a guy in a A20 of all planes. I know the A20 can be a killer but yea just tend to assume it's going to be a easy kill.. lol well I was wrong.
Much can be said the same with a Ki-61, a lot of guys will under estimate it which gives you an advantage. I honestly like the plane, at speed it seems to fly better than the ki-84 it just suffers from a horrible climb rate.
When I fly either of the KI's I also rarely ever use any flaps, in an attempt to keep my speed up. With A6m's I use flaps all the time, but it's a different style of plane and needs to be flown differently.
I'm' pretty sure we are in agreement that the 61 is a good plane, I was just saying if all things are equal the 84 is the better performer.
On the furballer vs toolsheaders I try not to get into that stuff anymore. I figure I fall right in the middle.. I like to capture bases and win wars but I also like a good fight.
I just tend to stay away from furballs, because I like to kill my own kills and not have 5 guys jump in on the kill I was working and only get an assist for my effort. (Assists tick me off it's a pet peve) So furballs over all annoy me, but it's not because of the win the war reasons.
That's why I tend to lean towards smaller fights or bases attacks, at least that way I know I don't have to worry about 5 guys jumping in on the con I was fighting.
-
Originally posted by Guppy35
Exactly. Low and slow, turning on the deck. The only place for a 38G to be :)
Yea that's the problem I was having before, I was trying to use the J on the deck too much. It can be done but not as good as the G does it.
-
Originally posted by Husky01
This one time I drove a goon on the ground 5 miles and took the port with 2 GVs still up at the port. :noid
"Lets kill that Mossie that just killed ALL the port ack":rofl :aok
Good times stealing the cookie! Had fun Lets do it again.:cool:
-
What is this Tony he speaketh of.....no such person.
Ssssh, don't ruin a good ride by publicizing it and letting the noobs think they can fly it.
-
Originally posted by WOOD1
I think Freeze has my house bugged.
AKwoodee:confused: :confused:
:rofl :noid :O
-
Originally posted by Masherbrum
Summary: Numbers and charts mean watermelon in a MA environment. The numbers are replaced by cockiness, laziness, and 2nd guesses.
True enough. You really don't disagree with Crockett, who is speaking of equal pilots in the two planes. He's right, so far as I'm concerned.
- oldman
-
I would have to agree. I'm no expert but I've flown both KIs more than a few times and had much success in both. Just because I can out turn a spit in a Ki61 (done it many times) does not mean the Ki turns better than a spit. It means I was slower, or lighter, or the other guy plum didn't see me.
Ki84 is way ahead of Ki61 in effectiveness, IMO.