Aces High Bulletin Board

General Forums => Aircraft and Vehicles => Topic started by: toonces3 on July 18, 2007, 02:45:05 PM

Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: toonces3 on July 18, 2007, 02:45:05 PM: Sure this has been asked before....

What's the deal with the discrepancy?

I believe on 'Dogfights' the referred to it as the Me109, and I just got a new boardgame called 'Luftwaffe' that also uses Me109 vice Bf109.
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: Krusty on July 18, 2007, 02:50:01 PM: 100% interchangable. Me stands for Messerschmitt, the name of the company that designed it and probably the true name. Bf stands for Bayerish (something like that) Flugzeugwerke, the company/factory that actually built them and assembled them. Even on official documents, one part of a page will say Me and another part of the same page will say bf, so they're interchangable.
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: Serenity on July 18, 2007, 02:59:12 PM: Quote
Originally posted by Krusty
Bayerish (something like that) Flugzeugwerke

IIRC, its Bavarian. Like in BMW.
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: Krusty on July 18, 2007, 03:30:30 PM: I did a quick google search:

"Bayerische Flugzeugwerk (Bavarian Aircraft Manufacturers, or BFW)"
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: Serenity on July 18, 2007, 03:35:37 PM: Quote
Originally posted by Krusty
I did a quick google search:

"Bayerische Flugzeugwerk (Bavarian Aircraft Manufacturers, or BFW)"

lol. So I got the English translation mixed with the original. Thanks for the correction Krusty!
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: Lusche on July 18, 2007, 03:44:41 PM: Quote
Originally posted by Krusty
100% interchangable. Me stands for Messerschmitt, the name of the company that designed it and probably the true name. Bf stands for Bayerish (something like that) Flugzeugwerke, the company/factory that actually built them and assembled them.

Wrong.

It's basically the same company.

Messerschmitt was working for the Bayerische Flugzeugwerke (since 1927), when he designed the 109. Hence the "Bf".
In 1938, the company was reconstituted as the Messerschmidt AG, with Willy Messerschmidt as chairman and managing director.
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: Krusty on July 18, 2007, 03:47:43 PM: Well I got the detail wrong, but the name was interchangable. I don't know if this is from 109-lair.com or some other website, but it's been discussed on several webpages, and pointed out that on official documents that BF and ME were used in different places on the same pages. It was whatever-you-wanted-to-write
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: Movie on July 18, 2007, 04:01:41 PM: same difference
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: Serenity on July 18, 2007, 04:05:01 PM: Quote
Originally posted by Movie
same difference

Nuh-UH!!! Bf-109 just LOOKS better then Me-109. Bf-110 and Me-110 are the same. But when PRONOUNCED, Em-Ee-One-Oh-Nine sounds better than Bee-Ef-One-Oh-Nine. Same for Em-Ee-One-One-Oh.
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: Krusty on July 18, 2007, 04:07:33 PM: Please don't panic. Men in white coats are being sent to pick you up.

:D
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: Serenity on July 18, 2007, 04:08:53 PM: Quote
Originally posted by Krusty
Please don't panic. Men in white coats are being sent to pick you up.

:D

lol. You gotta admit though. Try pronouncing both Bf and Me, and which sounds better?
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: Movie on July 18, 2007, 04:09:16 PM: :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: BlauK on July 18, 2007, 04:16:29 PM: Why don't you guys just say "Mersu" like we do ;)
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: Krusty on July 18, 2007, 04:16:52 PM: Because we're not from Helsinki :D
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: Movie on July 18, 2007, 04:27:38 PM: :lol
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: DaddyAck on July 18, 2007, 10:07:21 PM: Quote
Originally posted by Lusche
Wrong.

It's basically the same company.

Messerschmitt was working for the Bayerische Flugzeugwerke (since 1927), when he designed the 109. Hence the "Bf".
In 1938, the company was reconstituted as the Messerschmidt AG, with Willy Messerschmidt as chairman and managing director.

Pretty much, and now I believe whats left of Messerschmitt AG, later became Messerschmitt-Bölkow-Blohm (MBB) which became/ bought by DaimlerChrysler Aerospace AG (DASA) then lastly becoming part of European Aeronautic Defence and Space Company EADS N.V. (EADS)
So yeah there is the life cyle of the company ina nut shell.
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: Benny Moore on July 18, 2007, 10:16:52 PM: Germans pronounced the letters "may hundertneun." Some Germans have objected to my phonetic spelling of this and have told me that it should be "meh hundertneun," but to the Northern American ear it sounds like "may." The Allies pronounced the "M and E" seperately, "em ee one oh nine." The Me-110 would most likely be "em ee one ten." I'm not sure what the Germans would call that.
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: Serenity on July 18, 2007, 10:51:24 PM: Quote
Originally posted by Benny Moore
Germans pronounced the letters "may hundertneun." Some Germans have objected to my phonetic spelling of this and have told me that it should be "meh hundertneun," but to the Northern American ear it sounds like "may." The Allies pronounced the "M and E" seperately, "em ee one oh nine." The Me-110 would most likely be "em ee one ten." I'm not sure what the Germans would call that.

The Bf-110 was 'Em-Ee-One-One-Oh' according to Robert Stanford Tuck, 'Sailor' Malan, and several other RAF aces.
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: Benny Moore on July 19, 2007, 12:54:12 AM: Quote
Originally posted by Serenity
The Me-110 was 'Em-Ee-One-One-Oh' according to Robert Stanford Tuck, 'Sailor' Malan, and several other RAF aces.

I fixed your post.
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: BaldEagl on July 19, 2007, 12:59:44 AM: BF........................... ............................. ............................. ..........................D

Who cares?
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: Serenity on July 19, 2007, 01:01:24 AM: Quote
Originally posted by Benny Moore
I fixed your post.

No, written, its Bf to me, always. But as was already stated, the two are interchangeable
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: Keiler on July 19, 2007, 01:06:08 AM: Quote
Originally posted by Benny Moore
snip*
The Me-110 would most likely be "em ee one ten." I'm not sure what the Germans would call that.

"Meh hundertzehn" :)

Matt
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: Denniss on July 19, 2007, 06:24:10 AM: The Bf prefix was assigned by the RLM to aircraft types developed under the Bayerische Flugzeugwerke company name. This prefix did not change just because Willy bought the company not firming under Messerschmitt AG. The prefix Me was assigned by the RLM for new aircraft developed under the Messerschmitt AG company name, the first to officially carry this prefix was the Me 210.

In almost all official documentation from Messerschmitt for the RLM/Luftwaffe you will only find Bf, sometimes the RLM was ordered to not accept documents with Me prefix instead of Bf. Me was several times used as prefix for export versions of the Bf 109.
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: toonces3 on July 19, 2007, 11:24:11 AM: Thanks for the clarification all.

I think I knew part of the story, but now I understand it much better.

I'll just split the difference and call them "MF-109" (tm) from now on.

Your friend,
Toonces
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: Wes14 on July 19, 2007, 12:26:20 PM: Quote
Originally posted by toonces3
"MF-109" (tm)

can i guess what the MF means? :)

and heres a tm symbol ™ :p
(if it showed up on your 'puter)
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: Krusty on July 19, 2007, 12:35:41 PM: "Mofo 109s inbound, 2 oclock!"

Yeah, that works! :aok
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: Wes14 on July 19, 2007, 12:41:30 PM: :rofl
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: Serenity on July 19, 2007, 01:24:00 PM: Quote
Originally posted by toonces3
"MF-109"

I love it! Thats what theyre probably thinking ANYWAY...
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: Movie on July 19, 2007, 01:24:36 PM: Quote
Originally posted by Krusty
"Mofo 109s inbound, 2 oclock!"

Yeah, that works! :aok

:rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: Nilsen on July 20, 2007, 05:25:02 AM: Quote
Originally posted by Serenity
IIRC, its Bavarian. Like in BMW.

Use Bayerische Flugzeugwerke.

Translating names is a bad habbit imo, unless you have to because the alphabet is different.
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: Angus on July 20, 2007, 10:34:49 AM: MF-109???
MF=MASSEY-FERGUSON. Tractors with a Perkins engine normally. They would be more like the Spitfire and merlin of tractors while the 109 is...Deutz?
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: Movie on July 20, 2007, 01:29:23 PM: wtf?
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: Serenity on July 20, 2007, 09:09:19 PM: Quote
Originally posted by Nilsen
Use Bayerische Flugzeugwerke.

Translating names is a bad habbit imo, unless you have to because the alphabet is different.

It was an unintentional translation, lol. I was trying to recall an article id read months ago, and was too lazy to re-read, lol.
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: Lusche on July 20, 2007, 09:31:49 PM: Quote
Originally posted by Angus
MF-109???
MF=MASSEY-FERGUSON. Tractors with a Perkins engine normally. They would be more like the Spitfire and merlin of tractors while the 109 is...Deutz?

Considering the timeframe and the numbers produced, it would more likely be Lanz.
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: PanzerIV on July 21, 2007, 03:48:07 AM: can I call the Ta 152 "Fw 152"?
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: Benny Moore on July 21, 2007, 05:49:41 AM: If you can find a greal load of documents from both sides referring to it as that, and if you can find thousands of pilots on both sides who called it that, then go right ahead.
Title: Me109 vs. Bf109
Post by: Serenity on July 21, 2007, 12:36:18 PM: Quote
Originally posted by PanzerIV
can I call the Ta 152 "Fw 152"?

No. The official German Designation was Ta.