Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aircraft and Vehicles => Topic started by: tedrbr on July 21, 2007, 03:46:55 PM
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For those that missed it, Waffle posted a short teaser about the upcoming addition here. (http://forums.hitechcreations.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=210477)
From an "analysis" of the video and comments in the above thread, it would appear that the new addition to AHII will be the:
B-25G Mitchell
First, from the video it is obvious you are getting a spud throwing G or H model. Widewing pointed out that the bomber had a co-pilot yoke visible in the video, and the H model did not have a co-pilot position. The G was a revised C/D model, so, a co pilot yoke and position would be expected.
Second, the ammo counter read 2800 for the forward firing guns and 98 for the HE rounds for the 75mm. Now, as the B-25G and H's carried 21 rounds of HE onboard, the test arena's PlaneGunAmmoMult has be obviously altered.
Now, if you suppose a PlaneGunAmmoMult of 7 is used, and only 1 forward firing .50 is modeled to far in the plane, and that .50 has 400 rpg typically, that works out to 2800 rds and 147 HE (we don't see the beginning of the sortie).
Now, why only 1 forward firing .50 modeled so far? Well, the C/D model only had 1 forward firing .50, so it is possible that work is being done on both concurrently, as the B-25G was a slight modification to the B-25C/D.
So, it seems you are getting the:
B-25G Mitchell
Top speed about 275 to 281 mph at 15,000 feet.
Onboard fuel 670 US gallons.
1 X 75mm X 21rpg with a ROF of 12 to 15 RPM
2 fixed forward firing .50's X 400 rpg
2 X .50's X 400 rpg in dorsal turret
2 X .50's X 350 rpg in ventral turret
with a normal ord load capacity of 3,000 to 3,200 pounds.
No massed forward firing .50s', no wing mounts (IIRC), probably no drones with G model.
And possibly the B-25C/D model, since the only real changes for the game would be:
1 forward firing .50 cal
1 forward flex mount .50 cal
1 norden bomb site
allowed drones
possibly a little lighter or better ord capacity, since additional armor for loader and HE rounds on G model not present.
And neither one spawnable from CV's outside of your own offline arena or special SEA event
Comments? Speculation? Complaints?
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It's the best call for all round use in both MA and scenarios.
MTO, PTO, ETO with the RAF, Aluetians, Soviets, you name it they got C/Ds.
The possibility of a solid nose D strafer covers all kinds of PTO stuff and the G model with the cannon covers MTO, PTO and CBI.
Throw in the USN and Marine versions of those birds and the skinners are gonna have a field day.
I'd guess that if we really get a G and a Strafer, those will get the most MA use or airfield attacks and GV shooting.
But I prefer earlier models to late models for most all the birds too :)
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Problem is, Guppy35, the C and D strafers your are alluding to were field modifications. HTC stays away from field mods in the plane set, probably because the can of worms it would open. Some G's had additional guns added in the field as well.
If you are getting the G, and possible the C/D models, neither is really a "strafer" the way the H and J models were.
But, yes, the skinners will be able to have a lot of fun with the G, even without the C/D because it was so similar to the C/D to work anyways.
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How about early war B-25s????????
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Originally posted by 1K3
How about early war B-25s????????
Looking at the video, and knowing the past release history of new planes, I'd have to say...... nope. U outta luck. Certainly no A's, no B's, no modified carrier spawned B's, and from the video, certainly not going to be a late-war J either.
G (possibly H), with a longshot of a C/D if what is shown is a G.
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Originally posted by tedrbr
Problem is, Guppy35, the C and D strafers your are alluding to were field modifications. HTC stays away from field mods in the plane set, probably because the can of worms it would open. Some G's had additional guns added in the field as well.
If you are getting the G, and possible the C/D models, neither is really a "strafer" the way the H and J models were.
But, yes, the skinners will be able to have a lot of fun with the G, even without the C/D because it was so similar to the C/D to work anyways.
Did you look closely at the video? It had HE rounds.
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I'm looking forward to this, though. One of a handful of planes that will ever get me out of my Hog. :D
The 75mm may not do much against tanks, but should be a good M-16/8/3 killer, and probably against the Ostwind as well (at the very least should be able to pop the turret at high enough angle). Good bird for working the town, too, and if HTC ever makes shipping/trucks worthwhile targets I can see this as being VERY effective against barges, convoys and trains.
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Originally posted by MotleyCH
Did you look closely at the video? It had HE rounds.
(http://www.thesmilies.com/smilies/confused0050.gif) (http://www.thesmilies.com)(http://www.thesmilies.com/smilies/confused0050.gif) (http://www.thesmilies.com)(http://www.thesmilies.com/smilies/confused0050.gif) (http://www.thesmilies.com)
yes....? And from the ammo counters, and probable PlaneGunAmmoMult used in the server, I'm betting the B-25 model being worked on is the G.... which had the earlier and heavier 75mm gun....which fired HE rounds.
The idea that the C/D may be in the works is due to the 2800 rounds for the forward firing .50's not working well for 2 X .50's with 300 to 400 rpg.... but it does work if there is only 1 .50 modeled so far, with 400 rpg and a multiplier of 7 being used in that server..... which would suggest...possibly....G and C/D being worked on concurrently.... but that is speculative.
Also, due to the HE count and 50 count, it seems the model is not the H, which had the lighter 75mm....firing HE rounds....plus having 8 forward firing .50's. If it were, one would expect a much higher ammo counter with the PlaneGunAmmoMulti adjusted to give the 75mm that much ammo (normally 75mm carried 21 rounds).
Or it could be the H, with 350 rpg, a PlaneGunAmmoMult setting of 1 in that arena, and Waffle has the on mount 75mm run up wayyy past what it could normally carry in a B-25H.... and there is a co-pilot yoke and position where there shouldn't be one.
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Originally posted by Saxman
I'm looking forward to this, though. One of a handful of planes that will ever get me out of my Hog. :D
The 75mm may not do much against tanks, but should be a good M-16/8/3 killer, and probably against the Ostwind as well (at the very least should be able to pop the turret at high enough angle). Good bird for working the town, too, and if HTC ever makes shipping/trucks worthwhile targets I can see this as being VERY effective against barges, convoys and trains.
Im afraid we don't have the right targets for this plane right now, until HTC fulfills your wish for more shipping/trucks. Especially barges & small supply ships could be a prime target for that gun.
Deacking Fields: Slow ROF, massive & slow target
Taking down towns: Low rof hurts again. With 2 rounds per building, you can take down 10 buildings with a good aim, but the ROF will cause you to do alot attack runs for this. Many planes can do this much more eficient, while being more survivable
Attacking light armored GVs: The problem could be actually hitting them. I have quite a bit of trouble hitting M8 with my Hurri D when they start to evade. And a Hurri is a much more nimble plane.
While the 75mm will pop Ostwind turret for sure, there is about no plane that isn't able to do that yet. mAnd most of them are much smaller targets and much faster too.
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tedrbr, I wouldn't read too much into the ammo count. The plane is obviously still only in testing. Why wouldn't they have the ammo count modified during testing?
It only takes a few keystrokes for them to change whatever ammo count they want for the 75mm.
Remember, the first views of the Firefly we got had a .50cal AA mount, not the .30cal we have in game -- so a preview/test version is not necessarily what we will end up with.
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Originally posted by tedrbr
Problem is, Guppy35, the C and D strafers your are alluding to were field modifications. HTC stays away from field mods in the plane set, probably because the can of worms it would open. Some G's had additional guns added in the field as well.
If you are getting the G, and possible the C/D models, neither is really a "strafer" the way the H and J models were.
But, yes, the skinners will be able to have a lot of fun with the G, even without the C/D because it was so similar to the C/D to work anyways.
The difference is, we're talking about an Air Force wide modification program. 25s coming to the 5th got the mod before they went to the units.
That's different then some crew chief deciding to do something locally. I believe it's very viable for HTC to do a glass nose C/D, a Strafer D and a G model all based off the same basic model C/D. it makes the most sense anyway.
With those three versions, you cover RAF, RAAF, USN, USAAF, Soviet versions and every theater of the war while giving the widest variety of options both for MA use and Scenario use.
May be wishful thinking but it makes sense to me anyway :)
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I'm a bit more optimistic. Just because Waffle showed us one variant doesn't mean thats all we are getting.
Why do i think this?
I think HT would want to get variants out of the way now. Rather than going back and revisiting them later. I envision c/d, g and j models being released.
Just like when all the negative Nancies said we wouldn't get the cannon variant.
I have more faith in HT and his team to deliver.
Bronk
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Originally posted by Bronk
I'm a bit more optimistic. Just because Waffle showed us one variant doesn't mean thats all we are getting.
Why do i think this?
I think HT would want to get variants out of the way now. Rather than going back and revisiting them later. I envision c/d, g and j models being released.
Just like when all the negative Nancies said we wouldn't get the cannon variant.
I have more faith in HT and his team to deliver.
Bronk
04/2007 ver 2.10 Added Sherman Firefly
11/2006 ver 2.09 Added F4UA1
03/2006 ver 2.07 Added the Jeep, B-17 updated
11/2005 ver 2.06 Spit and 109 lineup changes: Added Bf 109G-14, Spitfire XVI, Spitfire VIII. Changed the 109G-10 to a 109K-4. Changed the Spitfire Vc to a Vb
07/2005 ver 2.04 P47N (?)
01/2005 ver 2.02 Added P38 F (? later G) and J
11/2004 ver 2.01 Added B24J, T34, and Ki84
06/2004 ver 2.00
before that was Beta
Not sure if I'm missing something from that or not. 6/2006 ver 2.08 was new GUI and Mission Planner (and RV8?). Ver 2.03 in 3/2005 was new terrain.
History would seem to disagree with the assertion that we'll see more than 1 variant of the B-25 added. Except for the Spit/109 lineup change, and ver 2.01 back in 2004, additions come as singletons for the most part. If AHII does get more than 1 version, I'd expect only two: the C/D and the G, as they had the most similar FM among them all and be the easiest to model concurrently.
Always figured it would be the 75mm armed B-25. I just don't see the 75mm being an effective weapon in this particular game setting. Slow ROF, 21 X 75mm HE rounds only, a slow moving, un-maneuverable platform to fire from.
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On the other hand, if you consider some of the spud gun snipers we have in this game, I wouldn't be surprised if before too long the appearance of a B-25 has PT boats and other light vehicles soiling themselves.
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Originally posted by tedrbr
Except for the Spit/109 lineup change, and ver 2.01 back in 2004, additions come as singletons for the most part.
We got both versions of the P-40 at the same time. Could happen with the B-25.
- oldman
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Were 109 gondolas not "field mods"...............
............... and I agree with what Lusche said...............
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I wasn't too excited about the B25, cool that it gets that 75mm, now im looking forward to it a little more, but not looking forward to kids on CVs trying to be Ben Affleck.
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Just out of curiousity, who cares what other people do with their
aircraft?
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Originally posted by Rino
Just out of curiousity, who cares what other people do with their
aircraft?
When you own the aircraft, believe me - you care :)
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Thanks for the "analysis" ted, but I think the fact that the file is titled "B25ga.wmv" is a dead giveaway... :rolleyes:
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Originally posted by Treize69
Thanks for the "analysis" ted, but I think the fact that the file is titled "B25ga.wmv" is a dead giveaway... :rolleyes:
Not really.... B25ga = B25 "Ground Attack"."Windows Media Video file" .... could still be an H with more forward firing .50's added later, or a modification to 75mm ammo count.
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Whats the B-25's top speed, and turn radius? :D
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Originally posted by Wes14
Whats the B-25's top speed, and turn radius? :D
One website on the B-25G (if that is what it is) puts the top speed of a B-25G at 281 mph, but I'm not sure at what altitude that is.
Also, came across a reference that only 400 x B-25G's were purpose-built, most of the rest of the "G"s were factory refitted C/D models. Which could argue what Waffle posted was really an H, or a C/D with the option of the G's weapon's mix.
As to turn radius? No idea. Guess a little wider than a B-26 Maurader's, if speeds being even.
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Originally posted by tedrbr
As to turn radius? No idea. Guess a little wider than a B-26 Maurader's, if speeds being even.
Think it will turn slightly better than a B-26 but not as good as the Havoc.
ack-ack