Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Max on July 23, 2007, 06:00:14 PM
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Be it a Pony, Jug or Corsair (C-Hog excluded) my gunnery with 50 cals seems to result in as many assists as kills. My usual "saddle up" range varies between 400 to 500 yards. Any tips on convergence settings would be appreciated. My current default is 400.
Thanks
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I have mine "shotgunned" around 300 yards- on the P-51D, I have the inner pair at 275, middle pair at 300, and outer at 325.
Provides for a nice spread, and doesn't need to be at exact range.
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Except for .303s I put convergence on every plane no matter what gun type at 300. Planes with .303s only I set at 200.
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I think convergence is a personal thing. People fly with a convergence which suits their style of fighting and how they look for and execute their gun-shots.
Personally, i think 400 is too far out. I have mine all set at 320. For a 4-gun 50 cal setup, they're all at 300.
Think about at what average range band you are actually scoring hits when you fight. Most people think 400 is nice a close range to fire. But people often only think about dead-six shots. 400 is ok to start opening up at for a dead-six shot, but not so good for anything else. Most of your killing shots are closer to half that distance and almost never dead-six shots. Its all in the set up. I dont want to set mine to 200, as that would mean i will have trouble at longer distances (eg 400). So i compromise and go for around 300.
Remember, the closer you are to your target when you fire, the more damage each round will do as its velocity is higher and it carries more energy. With wing-mounted guns, the closer you are to convergence when you hit the more damage you will do due to concentration. The more concentrated any burst of fire is the more damage it will do. The closer someone is to your guns, the easier it is to hit.
With 50cals, you cant have the same mentality as you do with cannons. There will be no one-hit wonders (unless you score pilot kill). You can't just spray a bunch of rounds out there in the hope one will connect and take off a stabiliser or wing. You have to 'soak' a point on the aircraft with fire with 1/2 to 1 second bursts. Your trying to get dozens of hits sprites in one location - with the high ROF, its actually fairly easy if you know how to actually aim and sustain that aim. Master 50cals and shooting with hispanos is child's play.
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Maxy, try 300 in. You can still get a few hits on those long range shots. But, best results will be closer in.
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200 is saddling up, 500 is chasing!:aok
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I like to run planes with 6 x 50's at 500 yards. Gets a good concentration of fire, and can anihilate the enemy. This is really good for buff hunting.
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A pony tard once taught me to use 225|250|275| Outside in:aok
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Hi Max,
Here a few things to consider, in no particular order:
- Spreading 50 cal. convergence may get you a few more hits, but will not get you more kills. As Spatula said, it's kinetic energy, so closer and concentrated will do more damage, giving you the kill instead of the assist. We're competing for kills. ;)
- Icon distances are in 200 yard increments, so the instant you see the distance change from 600 to 400, the bogey is 599 yards, not 400.
- You may want to fine tune your aiming point. Fuselage hits don't do much damage, but wing, tail, pilot and engine hits do.
- Try some closer convergences - maybe 300-350 yards. Pull up a target - you can do it in the main arena (".target xxx" where xxx=yards) - and see where you're hitting at different distances, e.g 200, 400, 500, 600, 800, etc.
- You may just be getting 1/2 of your guns (right wing guns only) landing on a plane outside your convergence. Consider that your plane is not always trimmed perfectly and that flying at full power is applying torque that you have to counter with right rudder. Work that rudder.
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350 for all.
:aok
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most planes are runners so my guns are set at max range. they'll all hit the same spot at the same time. close in they'll saw the wings of. any closer the bullets will criss cross and go on thier merry seperate ways.how often do you get within 300' of a bog..not often. i've been flying the F4-D alot lately, and getting used to .50 cals just means a longer burst and not flying in a crowd.other wise the assist will mount.went back to the F4C this week and no more assist. man forgot how good cannons could feel. i'll bonce back and forth betweent the two..one for kill power the other to out fly.
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All 6 at 275
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Mine is set at default; usually flying the 51B, I generally don't pull the trigger until I'm < 200yds. It's amazing how much damage 4 .50s can do quickly at that range.
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I've generally been happy with the default settings, although I'll admit to switching my convergence, just recently, to 400 meters. That was on a plane with cowl mounted guns. Won't mention the type of plane here.
Seems to me, if the guns are nose mounted, convergence isn't so much of a problem. Why not make the convergence reach out there, in such cases?
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All 8 to 300 here.
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Originally posted by xtyger
Seems to me, if the guns are nose mounted, convergence isn't so much of a problem. Why not make the convergence reach out there, in such cases?
Guns also "harmonize." The barrels are elevated so the rounds drop to be at the gunsight pip at the convergence distance. For aircraft close to you, your rounds will land higher than the pip and perhaps go over the target. You may have to nose down to hit the target and negative g's add another complexity to the gun solution. As long as you realize that, there is no problem. ;)
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After a lot of tweaking with convergences depending on gun type, plane/expected targets, I settled on setting all guns in all planes to 350. Exception: Hurri I & Spit I & V convergence is at 200.
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All .50s are at 400. All Hispanos are at 400. All MG 151/20s are at 300. All MK 108s at 300. All MG-FF at 200. All .303s at 200. All ShVAK at 300. All Ho-5 at 300. All Type 99s at 300.
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Originally posted by Max
Be it a Pony, Jug or Corsair (C-Hog excluded) my gunnery with 50 cals seems to result in as many assists as kills. My usual "saddle up" range varies between 400 to 500 yards. Any tips on convergence settings would be appreciated. My current default is 400.
Thanks
Gotta go with Spatula and Rolex on this one. Maximum impact all in 1 spot. Mixing convergence leads to peppering rather than blowing big holes in stuff. Hit the darn nail on the head man. No need to mess about just put everything you have in 1 spot for 1/2 second and it'll shred them.
Also as pointed out the kinetic energy is greater closer in.
Perhaps you are evolving within the game but your old convergence isn't keeping up with you. You may be finding your merge speeds are quicker or cons can't shake you off their 6. You get more firing solutions and so on.
Try 300 yard convergence for the rest of this TOD. You can still fire a little over 400 if you must but as you merge closer with the con, the shot isn't lobbed over the target unless your chewing his rudder off with your prop.
It'll take a day or so to get used to the new lead. In a tight turn the con will be just on the tip of your nose or just under depending how hard a turn it is.
Good luck
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All 6 are set for 225. Really.
I rarely shoot past 200. Really.
-Llama
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set my convergence in the F4u to 300:aok
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Outside 275
Middle 300
Inside 325
i like them crossed up that way to make a couple different points of convergence, and anything within 400d gets roasted.
my kills are 1200 kills 240 assists, so i think it deals out the damage quit nicely when u get closer than 200 though u have to slip to the side a little to land your hits, if u stay right behind u may actually shoot around your target.
200-500 though is my firing range and i usually blow them out o the sky with my 50s.
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convergence is overrated.
aim, shoot, kill, then piss em off :aok
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All wing guns (.50cal and 20mm) set to 200yds.
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my ponys guns are set at as follows 300--275 outside in get a nice one bust kill with that directed firepower:aok
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I'm really new to this game but I've found for centerline guns I use max range and it works well. I don't have to pull lead nearly as much since my convergence is so high. It's also works well when on their six because I'm a little lower and harder for them to see. Just don't try to strafe like that lol.
As for wings I never go over 400 and usually use 300 since I really try to get my shots in when it goes from D400 to D200. If I'm in a tight fight w/ someone I can pepper them w/ the wing mg's and when they turn tighter hit the centerline cannons real quick for a couple tater shots.
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Max ...
The best piece of advise came from Spatula when using .50 cals ...
You have to soak the target with lead
If your main ride is a cannon ride, jumping into a .50 cal plane will lead to some frustration and lots of assists ... if you have a "cannon" mentality when pulling the trigger.
Most .50 cal planes have lots of bullets ... so use them. The FM2 holds 860 in each wing bank, and if things are right and all the moons align properly, I can get up to 7 or 8 kills with that load.
Convergence depends on how hard you want to work on getting as close to the target to where you have your convergence set ... for maximum effect.
I have mine set at 400 I believe ... that is where I like to saddle up before letting lose, but with that convergence, up to 600 you can still so some significant damage and at 800 ... well ... you can usually get them to turn.
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Thanks for all the advice and tips, gents. It seems the convergence settings vary widely, which I suppose depends on your style of flying, aim points and the amount of ammo ya'll squeeze at one particular time.
Having flown a Typhoon, primarily for the past 3-4 years, I suppose I've gotten used to letting the Hispanos do the work. Many of you stated the imprtance of getting in close...200 yds or less. I can never hold that distance more than a fleeting moment.
I'll try the various configurations and see what works; what doesn't. Meanwhile I guess it's time to get with a trainer and find a way to get in up close and personal :aok
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Many of you stated the imprtance of getting in close...200 yds or less.
Yes ... 200 or less would be nice ... but not necessary with .50 cals. 400 is a great kill zone. Remember ... the .50 cal will reach out and spank you ... much better than cannons at that range.
I like to get the job done at 400, cause most times trying to saddle up at 200 takes too much time, and getting the kill and getting out is very important in a .50 cal plane.
In this tour, I have 105 kills in the FM2 (23 deaths) and 86 kills (19 deaths) in the F6F ... that is almost a 5:1 kill ratio in .50 cal planes ... I know my .50 cals ... It took awhile tho.
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have all mine at 325 and I generally fire from 400 and in.
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Originally posted by SlapShot
In this tour, I have 105 kills in the FM2 (23 deaths) and 86 kills (19 deaths) in the F6F ... that is almost a 5:1 kill ratio in .50 cal planes ... I know my .50 cals ... It took awhile tho.
Quick question SlapShot...do you recall the 50 cals on the FM2, back in AH1, having more BANG vs the other 50 cal rides? Granted, all 50 cals back in AH1 had more punch but the FM2 seemed to tear the bejeezus out of everything within gun range.
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Originally posted by Max
Quick question SlapShot...do you recall the 50 cals on the FM2, back in AH1, having more BANG vs the other 50 cal rides? Granted, all 50 cals back in AH1 had more punch but the FM2 seemed to tear the bejeezus out of everything within gun range.
I have a hard time remembering what happened last week ... :D
I didn't fly .50 cal planes much back in AH1 and only jumped into the FM2 cause they neutered my Spit V ... but I think that the .50 cals that we have now ... if the target is at convergence ... they rip thru planes like a hot knife thru butter and +-100 within convergence ... they are still very deadly and damaging. Ya just got to lay the thick lead rope out there (squeeze and hold) and watch them work their magic.
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Originally posted by Max
Quick question SlapShot...do you recall the 50 cals on the FM2, back in AH1, having more BANG vs the other 50 cal rides? Granted, all 50 cals back in AH1 had more punch but the FM2 seemed to tear the bejeezus out of everything within gun range.
Yes Max, they nerfed em baaaad! If you check my stats I'm sure they would support you're theory. FM-2 was my primary ride back then. I may have to go look.
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Had to go look!
tour 46 I had 385 kills to 135 deaths in the FM-2 always in the furball :t
I had similar stats in it for many many tours. F6 was my number 2 ride.
Those guns made it almost surviveable in the furball since you had good odds at a one pass kill. I still fly it on occasion because I like it and all the Blue birds but it's not near what it used to be!
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Max,
I do not think it has anything to do with 50's being more powerful in one plane/gun platform vs another......I think it has to do with the gun platform itself.......
I love flying the F4U and F6f because of the way the gun platform is.......( aqnd I like navy planes ) I love flying the P-51D except the same gun package on a different platform does not privde me the same result.......
FM2 and P51B with 4 50's I am better with than the P51D.......
as far as convergence goes, I never have like harmonzing my primary & secondary guns, I prefer all set to same convergence, and I prefer all set to 350......I will extend the convergence for a mixed setup though, cannons I will extend 25 to 50 further out beyond the machine guns.so they all drop on same spot.......test it offline or in the TA.......you will see what I mean.or do a search for gun convergence in the Help/Training section....this has been discussed before a few many times ;)
convergence is a personal preference inregards to one players flying style.....
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Originally posted by TequilaChaser
Max,
I do not think it has anything to do with 50's being more powerful in one plane/gun platform vs another......I think it has to do with the gun platform itself.......
I love flying the F4U and F6f because of the way the gun platform is.......( aqnd I like navy planes ) I love flying the P-51D except the same gun package on a different platform does not privde me the same result.......
FM2 and P51B with 4 50's I am better with than the P51D.......
as far as convergence goes, I never have like harmonzing my primary & secondary guns, I prefer all set to same convergence, and I prefer all set to 350......I will extend the convergence for a mixed setup though, cannons I will extend 25 to 50 further out beyond the machine guns.so they all drop on same spot.......test it offline or in the TA.......you will see what I mean.or do a search for gun convergence in the Help/Training section....this has been discussed before a few many times ;)
convergence is a personal preference inregards to one players flying style.....
This just made me remember ... the FM2 fires ALL it guns at the same rate ... other .50 cal planes may or may not do this ... this is probably why the FM2 seems to have a bigger punch then some other .50 cal planes.
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Originally posted by Max
Quick question SlapShot...do you recall the 50 cals on the FM2, back in AH1, having more BANG vs the other 50 cal rides? Granted, all 50 cals back in AH1 had more punch but the FM2 seemed to tear the bejeezus out of everything within gun range.
Sure seemed to be the case didnt it.:D
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Originally posted by TequilaChaser
Max,
I do not think it has anything to do with 50's being more powerful in one plane/gun platform vs another......I think it has to do with the gun platform itself.......
I love flying the F4U and F6f because of the way the gun platform is.......( aqnd I like navy planes ) I love flying the P-51D except the same gun package on a different platform does not privde me the same result.......
FM2 and P51B with 4 50's I am better with than the P51D.......
as far as convergence goes, I never have like harmonzing my primary & secondary guns, I prefer all set to same convergence, and I prefer all set to 350......I will extend the convergence for a mixed setup though, cannons I will extend 25 to 50 further out beyond the machine guns.so they all drop on same spot.......test it offline or in the TA.......you will see what I mean.or do a search for gun convergence in the Help/Training section....this has been discussed before a few many times ;)
convergence is a personal preference inregards to one players flying style.....
Yup, in a hog u can **** the rudder and stabilize the platform immediately, not so in pony!
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the FM-2 DEFINATELY lost it's punch in the change. I think it's a safe bet that I have more kills in it than most and maybe more than anyone. Not trying to toot my own horn but rather to add validity to my opinion. And certainly not whining because we all faced the same adjustments. But it went from my favorite ride to well down the list instantly. I still fly it with convergeance set to 300 for all guns.
Now my long range aim changed also so it could be a combination of the two things as it's been awhile since AH2 came out I don't remember my exact observations from way back then.
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Convergence really is a matter of your own flight profile...and by that I mean...how skilled is your SA (Situational Awareness)...and how skilled is your sight picture for the shot you wish to take...how skilled are you at flying the aircraft you have chosen?
The shot you wish to take is Crucial...because before you can MAKE the shot...you must first fly into the position FOR the shot.
Most of us can get up in the morning and drive our cars to work.
Most of us can drive ANY car to work, at any hour of the day, in any traffic condition...and maintain a safe bumper-to-bumper separation of the car we are driving, from the car we are following, under normal circumstances...because we have Situational Awareness (we check all mirrors, and our heads are on a swivel on our necks looking all around us). And because most of us know the performance capabilities of our cars versus other cars on the road, most of us can eloquently cuss-out the car that cut us off!
During Rush-Hour Traffic we look for "openings" in front of us, a place into which we wish to safely slide in order to improve our position amongst the other traffic.
This is SA at work! When we spy an opening...a place into which we might fit...this is convergence...AND the shot! Whether we drive an old 1962 Volkswagon, or a modern Race car...SA is the same. What differs is ...
Convergence...that's your accelerator...the pedal on the floorboard that makes you go faster, or slower! If you go too fast...you collide with the car in front of you! If you go too slow...you miss squeezing into the slot you saw! If you judge everything just right...you get the slot!
Questions:
How far ahead of you did you see the slot?
How many cars were in front of you?
How many cars in front of you were looking at the same slot?
How far ahead of you is the slot?
How much time do you have to make a positive decision?
Are you confident you can make the move?
Like the accelerator on a car...convergence has its limitations...you can stomp on it and hope for the best (600 yds)...or...you can keep your foot above the accelerator and wait... (200 yds)... and manuver for the shot.
How well do you Drive?
How well do you Fly?
Is this post confusing? Probably...
My .50 Cal Convergence is set for me to kill Bombers and Fighters...
Remeber...there are Big Trucks on the Freeways as well as cars...
My Convergence...6 x .50s....275
Knowing when to shoot comes with a bit of experience...just like knowing when to slide your car into the slot you've eyed.