Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: ariansworld on July 23, 2007, 08:30:24 PM
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What would be a good rifle for small game hunting and is not super expensive?
What is your reccomendation?
Thanks.
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.22 :aok
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If you want a pure .22 rimfire rifle, one of the very best values is probably the Ruger 10-22 semiautomatic rifle. The 22 rimfire is probably the best all around small game rifle if you intend to hunt game such as squirrel, rabbit, and that type of small game.
As an alternative, you can get a single shot take down rifle, or rifle shotgun combo. I won a little 22/.410 take down rifle/shotgun at a NWTF convention, my son loves it. It is very accurate, and suitable for most any small game you'd want to take. It is an inexpensive little combo both to buy and to shoot.
Try looking at http://www.galleryofguns.com they have a gun locator you can use to search by type and caliber as opposed to brand.
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You need to define "small game" to get any good advice. I wouldn't shoot even a coyote with a regular .22 because of the chance it won't be a fatal shot, but as noted before a .22 is fine for rabbit and other small animals. I also like the 10-22, and you can buy pretty cheap kits to make it a lot more accurate. There are aftermarket stocks, barrels, and trigger kits that can let you really customize the gun for whatever use you have for it. As an example, a stainless 10-22 with a mild bull barrel, custom trigger, and composite stock, can make a great all-weather varmint or very small game rifle accurate enough to hit a rabbit out to 200 yards.
A hunting rifle chambered in .223 will take game up to small deer and can be more accurate than a .22 especially beyond 100 yards, and the ammo is still fairly cheap. AR-15 lookalikes will be very expensive, but there are other less hyped .223 rifles that would do just fine and won't cost as much.
Avoid a mini-14 for hunting unless you intend to take close-range shots only. They are not known for their accuracy even factory new, and making a mini-14 more accurate will cost just as much as buying a more accurate gun to begin with.
AR-15 (M-16) variants are quite often very accurate, but the cost is typically more than double than a regular hunting rifle.
If you want to shoot deer and larger game, you should get something beefier. Realize that picking the gun and picking the type of ammunition are two separate issues... Some guns are only chambered for certain rounds so if you fixate on a particular round, you might miss out on the chance to own a really good gun that just happens to be chambered in something else.
This article discusses bullet size/weight relative to the type of game you're shooting: http://www.chuckhawks.com/hunting_bullet_guide1.htm
I personally decided to buy a browning a-bolt chambered in 7mm remmington magnum, because that combination can take everything from small deer (with a lightweight bullet) to elk/moose (with a heavier bullet) and is quite accurate out to 400 yards or more straight from the factory. The downside is that premium quality rounds cost about $3 each and I don't reload, so every time it goes bang it costs me $2-$3. Compare that with my .223 mini-14 (bought for practice, plinking, and varmint hunting) which costs about 10 cents per shot.
I own a 10-22, a mini-14, and the a-bolt. My brother owns an olympic arms AR with the A2 design and a heavy barrel. His AR completely outshoots both my 10-22 and mini-14. When he got back from army bootcamp, I saw him nail a running jackrabbit at 50 yards, and I personally shot .7 inch 5-shot groups at 100 yards from a simple sandbag rest with his AR. My mini-14 shoots 3 to 4 inch groups at 100 yards and I'm told that is "typical" for a mini-14.
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Originally posted by ariansworld
What would be a good rifle for small game hunting and is not super expensive?
What is your reccomendation?
Thanks.
If by small animal hunting you mean about the size of rabbits and such with a maximum range of 150 yards or less a .22 is really the best bet. You'll get all kinds of recomendations for a rifle.
I have both a Marlin and a Ruger. I shoot the Marlin most often. With iron sights the Marlin's sights are more accurate. I haven't scoped either one to see which one shoots the smaller groups. The Marlin is the only one I have brought game back with. I can hit faster and more often with it than the Ruger as it fits me better and is lighter to carry to boot. If you get the chance, try to shoot a couple examples of different rifles and see what feels best to you.
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Originally posted by Maverick
. If you get the chance, try to shoot a couple examples of different rifles and see what feels best to you.
I will be most certainly be talking to a prison gaurd that I know.
She has all kinds of firearms, and practices a lot with them.
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Ruger 10-22 can't be beat. You're almost required by law to own at least one.
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I personally use a Remington model 710 30-06. Cost around $300. Can kill a deer at 300 yds easy.
Came with a scope, I swapped it out with my old gun though, can't remember what it was.
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Eagl,
Is that the ultra mag or regular mag? I have the ultra mag version that I only use on elk and it's ammo cost is about $2 a shell. My brother gets them reloaded for about $0.70 a piece which saves some.
Re: small game gun -- as has been said, depends on which species of small game you are going for and what your typical shooting scenario will be.
I have .22's for plinking and squirrels/rabbits. I don't varmit hunt, so I skip over the centerfire 22 cals (22-250, 223, etc.). My children use a 243 (smallest caliber my state allows for deer and a 308. I use a Rem 280 model 700 as my primary whitetail sized game hunting. My father actually uses this caliber as his elk rifle also and it will be my backup gun this fall for a Colorado trip.
For upland birds, I have a couple of different shotguns in 12 gauge I use. The kids use a 20 gauge.
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springfiled 30.06!
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.22 or .22 magnum.
A friend of mine has a Russian .22. I don't recall the sort, but it's frigging good.
.22 auto is also good for small game. I presume you are referring to rabbits etc.
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marlin model 60 .22 caliber
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My mini-14 shoots 3 to 4 inch groups at 100 yards and I'm told that is "typical" for a mini-14.
ya...we owned 3 mini 14's and they did hold about a 3 inch group at best at 100 yard...but!! most mini 14's made after 2002 i believe hold about a 1 to 2 inch pattern now at 100 yards..i guess they have fixed alot of the inaccuracy issues in the mini-14.
i really like a 22 mag:) has a alot more punch than a 22 long rifle and not too spendy on rounds.. 223 is a great round too for small game..but its a little much for just goofer shooting..lol..and its powerfull anuff to kill large game..but here in washington state..you cant hunt for deer with a 223..think biggest they will let you hunt are coyotes with a 223 in this state.a really neat small game round is that 22hmr and 17 rem..if you want somthing a little more powerfull than a 22..try the 22mag..22 hmr or 17 rem:)
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the mini 14 is a rifle to hit stuff on the fly with. while it certainly will not win any accuracy contests it does it's intended job efficiently. it's a carbine gents and as such it is very good.
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The Arctic Warfare Super Magnum (http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.impactguns.com/store/media/ai_awsm.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.impactguns.com/store/AI-AWSM338.html&h=283&w=1008&sz=54&hl=en&start=1&um=1&tbnid=q0rtvUCsO74-5M:&tbnh=42&tbnw=150&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dawsm,%2B.338%2Blapua%26svnum%3D10%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DN)
4-5 inch groups at 1200 yards.
If you are worried about price, you can probably do without the optional butt rest.
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Man... I don't know where you guys are getting these 10/22's that are accurate. I always felt that, out of the box.. they were just a way to waste 22 ammo... seems a good 22 pistol will outshoot em... for sure any good single shot or blot action 22 is at least twice as accurate as any 10/22
Oh.. I haven't shot one but Ruger now makes a mini 14 that is supposed to shoot minute of angle groups.. It hardly even looks like one tho. My mini 14 is lucky to shoot 2" groups at 50 yards.. it has a lot of "fast as you can pull the trigger" hip shooting till a 40 round mag is empty shooting done with it tho.
The most accurate 22's I have ever shot are almost forgotten calibers... the 22 hornet and the 22-250. It is easy to shoot 3" groups at 300 or so yards with the 22-250 and the hornet will have more energy at 100 yards than a 22 long rifle at the muzzle.
If you want to only kill ground squirrels and such... the 17 is supposed to be good. I would rather have the hornet or 22-250 tho and reload myself for about the same cost.
The 22 rimfire is the best for cost...if you go to 22 mag or 17 you might as well go to the centerfire hornet or 250 and reload your own. go with a savage or mossberg bolt gun and a 4x10 or so scope.
lazs
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Ruger have a new Mini14 target rifle in their line up. It's an ugly looking thing but they say it's capable of shooting 1" moa. And while on the Mini theme but not small game related; it's a shame they haven’t fixed the problems with the XG1 and resurrected it. I'd go for one of them in .308win in a flash if they did. The XG1 is the Mini14's big brother chambered in 243 and 308win that Ruger canned about 20 years ago. A lot hype back then about it and it was a big disappointment for some of us when it never made it to the gun shop racks.
Back on topic. For small game .22lr or .22 magnum are hard to beat. But centrefire is better if you have the room to use one and you don't have a lot of game to shoot at close range.. if you do, then you going to want a .22 as well. In centrefire my preference is for .223. Tons of choices in rifles for .223, it's an accurate and relatively inexpensive cartridge if you reload it. Cheap and abundant milsurp ammo for plinking/practice is a bonus if the rifle is chambered to handle it like the Mini14 or the AR15
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Small game = Varmint
The 22-250 or a .243.
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forgot about the .243.. good round.. a little more expensive to buy the slugs for if you reload tho.
223 is good but the same cheap bullets work better (at the lower end) from a hornet or (at the higher end) from a 22-250
lazs
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I will most likely using the iron sights, for I prefer them over the scopes.
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what ranges will you be shooting at? What is "small game" to you? What accuracy level will you be happy with? Do you reload your own ammo and is price of ammo anything you worry about?
sorry.. should have asked all these questions right from the start.
lazs
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out here, white tail are considered small game...
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Originally posted by Bodhi
out here, white tail are considered small game...
what about hugging bear cubs? :noid
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Best .22 rifle I've know is also an economical one. A marlin semi auto with the tube magazine. Never thought a .22 rimfire could be so accurate as that rifle is.
And for god sakes don't take a military style rifle hunting game, that is extraordinarily tacky.
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From Lazs:
"The most accurate 22's I have ever shot are almost forgotten calibers... the 22 hornet and the 22-250. It is easy to shoot 3" groups at 300 or so yards with the 22-250 and the hornet will have more energy at 100 yards than a 22 long rifle at the muzzle."
This also boils down to the ammo price. The last one to be really cheap is .22 magnum, after that you are in the bottleneck business. A Hornet is cool, slightly more powerful than a .22 magnum, which still is supersonic. Then you have what, 222? Then 223 ? And 22-250, that's one of the fastest bullets of them all. At 250 yards you still have no drop, - but with a fast bullet like that, you better have the ground in the background!
Forgotten caliber????
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Angus, he's right. Most people don't talk about "22 Swift's, 22 Hornet's or 22-250's". They are a "near forgotten caliber".
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Angus..yep... I am going by what is happening here in our country.
You have to realize that we have hundreds of calibers available in hundreds of different guns and that, when you add the ability to reload ammo... it gets unreal. You can buy about any caliber you can think up and a type of action to shoot it..
handguns and rifles.. 22 magnums and 17's are almost more expensive to shoot than hornets and 223's if you reload. At least here.
lazs
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how about the 25 wssm:) thats a cool round..hehe now if you wanna really varmit hunt..take a 338 lapua!! hehe jk
think the most accurate 22 i own is a old 1930's long barrel 22 rem single shot.....great old gun..i still enjoy poppin off shots with it.
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Originally posted by lazs2
Angus..yep... I am going by what is happening here in our country.
You have to realize that we have hundreds of calibers available in hundreds of different guns and that, when you add the ability to reload ammo... it gets unreal. You can buy about any caliber you can think up and a type of action to shoot it..
handguns and rifles.. 22 magnums and 17's are almost more expensive to shoot than hornets and 223's if you reload. At least here.
lazs
That is sad, sort of. The 22-250 really rocks. Well, while with no drop at 250 yards, you can allow yourself to snipe a goose without destroying it. After all we go hunting for the meal, not just the kill ;)
A friend of mine had one and used it a lot, - but the ammo was expensive so he loaded up his own.
Up here, there were always Hornets, but I have the feeling that they are getting fewer.
The other day I was firing a 223 Ruger. While the scope was only 4x, anything you aimed at would be hit. A goose at 200 yards, no problem. It was indeed a very nice gun.
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Originally posted by Masherbrum
Angus, he's right. Most people don't talk about "22 Swift's, 22 Hornet's or 22-250's". They are a "near forgotten caliber".
What a shame,had 22-250 years ago,groundhogs at 300 yards and some farmers even paid for your rounds:aok
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Originally posted by forHIM
Eagl,
Is that the ultra mag or regular mag? I have the ultra mag version that I only use on elk and it's ammo cost is about $2 a shell. My brother gets them reloaded for about $0.70 a piece which saves some.
Reg 7mm Rem Mag.
Cost is high because I originally sighted it in with some premium heavy winchester brand stuff that was rated very highly by some shooting mags, and the results were so good that I've been afraid to try anything else. You just don't mess with 1" groups at 200 yds off of a sandbag rest :)
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There is a family friend up North here in Michigan that bags about 10 deer a year with a 22-250. He takes head shots as long they aren't running. They eat the venison all year.
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I had a Rem 700BDL with a bull barrel in 22-250 once. Did my own loading and worked on the gun a bit. Best 3 shot sand-bagged group at 200 yrds was .130" center to center using a 20 power scope. Wish I still had that rifle. Great shooter.
Word.
Mark
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7mm is scary! A friend of mine has that. He said it's so good that shooting is almost boring!
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I had a mossberg heavy barrel 22-250 and it was an accurate rifle. A good caliber but pretty hard on barrels and cases.
Angus.. it is not really as much of a "shame" as you might think.. tho almost forgotten... there are still thousands of the guns out there and hundreds of new ones made every year.
It is just that we have such a myriad of choices that people don't stick to one caliber anymore. This is a good thing in my opinion.. we are allowed a lot of choice in firearms and it makes for a great situation for the sport, hunter and hobby shooter alike.
Oh.. my first rifle was a 1960 remington single shot and that gun was deadly accurate... course... 10 year old eyes were like micrometers...
lazs
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They say Sako 22-250 HB is one good one too.
BTW they go both Reindeer hunting and Fox-hunting with those heavier ones. We get quite some hunters up here from abroad. Most actually are after the wild geese, but the sport is stretching into the reindeers and beginning with the foxes also.
If you are going to come over the pond, consider a stopover, - I might be able to pull some hunting ropes for ya.
I would have to find out if you can bring your own guns though. Not sure how that works.
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angus... I like all guns. When I was in canada at my brothers place I reserected a couple of barn find 22 rifles that were in various states of disrepair.
cleaned and fixed and tested they were old but true.
I spent a fun couple of days with him and his friends shooting hundreds of "gophers" as they called em.
I don't need my guns to have fun... I simply can't live in a place that puts too many restrictions on what I can own.
It makes me feel less than a human with human rights to be told by someone not fit to carry my ammo what guns I can have.
lazs
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Foo on the Ruger 10-22, world's most overrated gun. Had a good older model, but the newer rifle I bought a year ago had the worst possible magazine release and bolt lock, and the bolt should have locked open after last shot anyway.
Took the advice of many others and got a Marlin Model 60 which is superb. And a single shot Savage I-G which is precision shooting personified.
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yeah... I just don't see the attraction for the ruger 10/22. just about any pawn shop single shot bolt action 22 will outshoot it once the pawnshop gun is cleaned up and at worst... recrowned. I have recrowned em with a drill bit and lapping compound. Have taken about a pound of lead out of the old barrels too.
10/22... brand new... is not worth running 22 ammo through in my opinion. I have no interest in em.
lazs
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You guys remember the Remington Nylon 66, or the Apache 77? Almost entirely built of nylon impregnated plastic, light to carry, obviously, and quite accurate. I still have my Apache and will carry that long before I would want to carry my 10/22. Marlin Model 60 and Savage semi-auto (can't remember the model number) are my # 2 and 3 choices.
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I'd like to revisit my answer with a little more detail behind my rationale.
A good rifle is one that you can shoot often. A Safe Queen that leaves your house twice a year for deer season wouldn't meet this criteria for me, even if it fired laser guided smartrounds, was hand crafted by Sir. Winchester himself, or had a five inch thick match-barrel.
That's why I like the Ruger 10-22. You can run thousands of rounds through it cheap. You spend your time shooting instead of hand loading and operating a bolt, you build up the fundamentals in a way that a super gun with heavy grain can never offer, and you can customize it any damn way you want. If you're a paunchy gamer who wants something that looks like an M-16, done, there's a stock for it. You want a laser because you saw it in a movie? There's like 20 different choices. You want to spent time refining the accuracy? Get a new barrel and spent some time on the firing mechanism. There are kits, if you're so inclined, to assist. Want 25 round banana clips? Sure. Metal lipped clips for better reliability? Sure.
As far as Good rifles go, I'd argue that it's hard to beat the 10-22 because of the factors I mentioned. In brief: Price to buy, price to operate, flexibility, and fundamentals. These are all fields in which the 10-22 scores very well. There are rifles that are better in some areas at the expense of others, but for an all around good, cheap rifle, my money is on the 10-22.
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10/22's are cheap and offer a alot aftermarket parts than no other 22 offers..folding stocks...banna clips...drum clips...even a bipod set up were you can run 2 of them at once with a hand crank like a gatling gun....i know there is no other 22 offers as much extra's...i dont own one and dout i will unless i get so cheap i cant refuse..lol
my brother has a older 10/22 ruger tube fed long barrel...if i had a 10/22 i would try to get his..he has owned it for a good 20 years and it still hammers away and is dead on.
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You guys remember the Remington Nylon 66,
oohh yes..i use to have one..lol..and at are local gun shop there is a old nylon rem sitting over there for rather cheap..i allmost thought about it..but i really dont need any more 22's at the moment..lol
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Originally posted by FBBone
You guys remember the Remington Nylon 66, or the Apache 77? Almost entirely built of nylon impregnated plastic, light to carry, obviously, and quite accurate. I still have my Apache and will carry that long before I would want to carry my 10/22. Marlin Model 60 and Savage semi-auto (can't remember the model number) are my # 2 and 3 choices.
I liked that model Remington as well. I'd like to get one if I find one at a good price. I also like the old Remington model 600 centerfire rifle. I didn't mind the odd looking sights. I finally got one a few years ago, a nice short carbine in .308 that's a great shooter.
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Can't go wrong with this beauty. :D
(http://johno.myiglou.com/images/kyrifle1.jpg)
(http://johno.myiglou.com/images/kyrifle2.jpg)
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Remington .270
(http://www.arisvi.com/fotosarm/189-05.jpg)
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Small game to me means 22 magnum...cheap, easy to shoot.
The .22 - 250 survives and thrives! Many rifles are chambered for it, and many commercial ammo options exist.
The 220 swift went south a long time ago, but even that is available.
These rifles will cost a lot more than a 22 mag.
For bigger game, the .30 - 06 remains the most versatile...with ammo from 110 grain to 220 grain.
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(QUOTE) you can customize it any damn way you want. If you're a paunchy gamer who wants something that looks like an M-16, done, there's a stock for it. You want a laser because you saw it in a movie? There's like 20 different choices. You want to spent time refining the accuracy? Get a new barrel and spent some time on the firing mechanism. There are kits, if you're so inclined, to assist. Want 25 round banana clips? Sure. Metal lipped clips for better reliability? Sure. (UNQUOTE)
These attributes are fine for people who like to spend more time and money customizing stuff, but irrelevant to shooters who prefer to buy their guns already optimized.
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Originally posted by Saxman
Can't go wrong with this beauty. :D
(http://johno.myiglou.com/images/kyrifle1.jpg)
(http://johno.myiglou.com/images/kyrifle2.jpg)
Now youre just bragging!:furious
Nice piece:D
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Oh, it's not mine (I SOOOO wish!!!). I just wanted to say the Kentucky longrifle pwns all! :aok
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Originally posted by lazs2
angus... I like all guns. When I was in canada at my brothers place I reserected a couple of barn find 22 rifles that were in various states of disrepair.
cleaned and fixed and tested they were old but true.
I spent a fun couple of days with him and his friends shooting hundreds of "gophers" as they called em.
I don't need my guns to have fun... I simply can't live in a place that puts too many restrictions on what I can own.
It makes me feel less than a human with human rights to be told by someone not fit to carry my ammo what guns I can have.
lazs
In the rifle department, I can have almost anything ;)
Looking into this thread because I'm thinking about adding one.
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chair... for the reasons I said.. the 10/22 is crap to me.
Why have a rifle that is clunky and not accurate in 22? IN TWENTY TWO.
There are zillions of old 22 rifles like the nylon 66 mentioned or the remington single shot bolt or a myriad of elegant and accurate marlins and brownings out their... the ruger is a club. If I need a rifle to build a bridge out of or had to get rid of a lot of crummy ammo.... I would get a 10/22 and pay someone to shoot it.
If a 10/22 is in the bunch with a group of rifles and handguns and a group of people.. before long.. they 10/22 will get bumped off the table.... and no one will notice.
I would rather shoot my old ar7 than a 10/22. If you have ever shot a real 22 you would throw rocks at the 10/22
I think people like em because of the large mags available...it is the only fun thing to do with the gun... but... I have never enjoyed rapid fire for more than 5 or ten rounds out of a 22 anyway... what is the point?
lazs
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Shooting ptarmigans close up :D
(they're so stupid that if you have a silencer and are fast enough, you can drop a whole flock of them from down to 30 yards. And they taste very good ;))
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well... I still think I would rather have a good tube mag old marlin or browning 22... they are accurate and 12 or so rounds should be cool... hell.. If you wanted to rapid fire 25 rounds or so you could just get two of the things and line em up.. they would still probly cost you as much as a new 10/22.
lazs
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Was playing with 2 of those automatics (tube-load and scope) some years back. One had a silencer. But to save my life even, I don't remember the types.
Was some 20 years ago.
:confused:
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I have owned dozens of 22 rifles over the years but there is not a one in my gunsafe that is mine right now. Last one was a model 90 winchester pump and I gave it to my son.
I have no use for em and they are about the least fun gun I can think of to just go out and shoot. I have several 22 handguns.. they are fun to shoot and a challenge... and... with colibi's.. I can shoot em in my living room. good practice.
If I had a need for one I would get one.. probly an old bolt action or tube feed semi auto... good thing is they never get shot out.
But... I reload and have a lot of centerfire guns that I shoot well.. I can download centerfire guns to short range and have more fun when I move to the sticks and shoot the occasional ground squirrel or stray dog pack. or... just use one of the handguns I own.
lazs
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Here is a link to a excellant little varmit rifle. It is super accurate and relatively inexpensive. http://www.gunrush.com/firearm/gun/New-England-SB2-204-Rifles.htm
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Originally posted by ariansworld
What would be a good rifle for small game hunting and is not super expensive?
What is your reccomendation?
Thanks.
Now that we are on the 3rd page of this I figured maybe it would be a good time for you to elaborate on what purpose you have in mind. What kind of hunting are you planning on? Varmint hunting calls for a different kind of rifle and likely no intent to bring home any "game" which would be far different from getting rabbits for the pot.
What firearm you would use depends on what you intend to do with it. While you have gotten good info here, it would help if you could narrow the scope of the subject. (pun intended)
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mav... I believe that several posters have asked the exact same question without getting an answer sooo...
We are left with discussing the merits of various like powered firearms.
not a bad thing at that.
lazs
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Yeah Laz, I just figured a pointed question was due to fine tune the situation. It has been a nice thread, lots of good info. It seems most either really like the 10/22 or kinda hate it. I'm kind of ambivalent about it as long as I have my Marlin the Ruger will be second string.
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.17 Small but high velocity
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If a man can own only one firearm, it should be a quality dependable .22 caliber rifle IMHO. It's capable of so much more than people give it credit for.
My first rifle was a Winchester model 290 inherited from my grandfather. It's still my favorite, but mostly for nostalgia reasons.
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.17 Small but high velocity
17 rem's are fun for a little round:) and they will make laser cutt holes in pennies..lol my bud has one we take out once and a while.
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Yea, it is a great rifle. MY brother uses his to hunt squirrels.
Actually my favorite is the Remington 700 BDL, 30.06. I have owned one for the last 20 years and hunted with it only 3 times. :(
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If I could only own one firearm I wouldn't much care what it was since... with one firearm... I could get any other firearm I would want.
22's are great to teach kids on. They are boring to shoot tho when you have a lot of other guns. I don't much enjoy shooting them anymore even tho I have shot a gazillion rounds through them in the distant past.
I will shoot some old 22 that is interesting once in a great while just for the nostalgia of it.
I guess I am just jaded and... well off enough and... a reloader that shooting a rifle with the sound and recoil and about the same impact at short range of a pellet rifle doesn't do much for me.
I don't "need" one and have a lot of other more fun/challenging guns to choose from.
I already reload 223 for my mini 14 sooo... If I run across a good cheap 223 bolt gun I will probly buy it. Play with some loads... If I ran across a good hornet bolt gun I might buy that.. both would be more versitile and fun than the 22 lr and 22 mag.
lazs
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Originally posted by Maverick
Now that we are on the 3rd page of this I figured maybe it would be a good time for you to elaborate on what purpose you have in mind. What kind of hunting are you planning on? Varmint hunting calls for a different kind of rifle and likely no intent to bring home any "game" which would be far different from getting rabbits for the pot.
What firearm you would use depends on what you intend to do with it. While you have gotten good info here, it would help if you could narrow the scope of the subject. (pun intended)
Mav, I intend to hunt Squirrels, Rabbits, and certain birds. I like iron sights better than scopes for some reason, I hit better with them. It wont be varmint hunting either, I fully intend to bring home "game" and cook them.
Yes I have gotten a lot off good info on the 3 pages so far. Thanks everyone for the information.
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Originally posted by ariansworld
Mav, I intend to hunt Squirrels, Rabbits, and certain birds. I like iron sights better than scopes for some reason, I hit better with them. It wont be varmint hunting either, I fully intend to bring home "game" and cook them.
Yes I have gotten a lot off good info on the 3 pages so far. Thanks everyone for the information.
1.) 22-250
2.) .243 or .270
All 3 above can also be used for Deer.
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I think centerfire rifles might be just a little bit of "overkill" on small game he intends to cook and eat.
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Originally posted by Masherbrum
1.) 22-250
2.) .243 or .270
All 3 above can also be used for Deer.
Careful there, check you local regs. before you hunt deer with a .22 cal rifle. Thats illegal here in Colorado, you must use a minimum .24 cal.
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Originally posted by Masherbrum
1.) 22-250
2.) .243 or .270
All 3 above can also be used for Deer.
Ariansworld
If you are hunting for meat the 22-250 is not a good choice. Neither is the .17, 225 and other "varmint calibers. They tend to do way too much damage. I hunted lots of rabbit as well as varmints with a 22-250. Unless you get a head shot there won't be much "eating" left on the bunny.
They also tend to "blow up" on larger game and cause surface wounds without doing sufficient penetration for a good quick kill. As was already posted a .22, even a center fire may not be legal for larger game.
The .243 and .270 are definitely good choices for deer. Way overkill for rabbits and squirrels though. All 2 are bad choices for any bird hunting.
For what you said in your last post I think what you want is a .22. A nice bolt action would likely have the best accuracy potential but some of the semi's do pretty good. I prefer the Marlin, like I posted earlier, and others have good luck with the Ruger. Try shooting a couple examples and see what feels good to you and what shoots best. Besides what I already said the .22 is cheap to shoot, far more so than any center fire caliber.
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Last year my father bought a Japanese Howa M1500 in .223 Remington. It is in the cheap end of the price range and scores high in tests (very high for its price). My father uses it for small game hunting like Grouse, Black Grouse and Hare. He loads light, using sub-sonic ammunition in the forests around his hunting lodge, and high-velocity ammo when hunting in the mountains. He speaks very highly of this rifle.
In total, including the gunsmith work of fitting the surpressor, he spent less than $1500 on this rifle.
(http://i187.photobucket.com/albums/x134/xVIKINGx/Howa1.jpg)
Removing the white camo-tape he uses for winter hunts. My father uses an Australian Nikko-Sterling Gold Crown scope.
(http://i187.photobucket.com/albums/x134/xVIKINGx/Howa2.jpg)
Tape removed. Unscrewing the suppressor for cleaning.
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You would need sub-sonic for the silencer anyway right?
Anyway, didn't know you'd have Hares that far north, or is your father much further south?
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The suppressor will kill most of the report no matter what ammunition is used. However a supersonic bullet will make a sharp crack as it travels downrange, but it's not really loud. My father uses the suppressor so he won't need to use hearing protection, not for stealth.
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Nice looking rifle there. For some reason, suppressors are harder to get here than a live MG. I was looking into them for my AKS-74U and discivered they take longer to get thru the Fed system.
We have some strange laws.
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so shlotzie.. you would say that silencer (suppressor) laws are bad laws?
We have to much gun control here not too little.
lazs
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Originally posted by lazs2
so shlotzie.. you would say that silencer (suppressor) laws are bad laws?
Huh? ... no?
Originally posted by lazs2
We have to much gun control here not too little.
Same here.
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You think silencer laws are good laws? You guys have em (legal silencers)... several countries have em too...
Aren't you afraid that they will warp people into going on shooting rampages?
lazs
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No, why would they? :huh
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Here is sad news.
We had the first murder of the year, and it was a guncrime :(
and a puny .22 normal, BRNO bolt action. One shot.
No supressor or silencer, since the killer was not really thinking about it I guess. I think we can have them anyway, and if not, they're easy to make.
Then, he went away and shot himself. Also dead.
2x22 bullets and two corpses. The victim almost survived though, but tough luck, even .22's do a lot to big arteries.
Terrible. And the whole circumstances were quite dramatic.
Anyway, of silencers. I once tried a .22 automatic, with a scope and a silencer. Now that is one for the grouse or ptarmigans. It only makes a slight click and a "pfft" and a "thump" where the bullets hit. If you are hid or still, the birds will look and not fly. You wait a few secs then fire again.
If you pick them off with a rifle as well, and hit the chest nicely, you won't have to be chewing on them pellets as well when you eat them.
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Oh, just read my text, you must think I'm a sicko.
The point I wanted to make was that you don't need an artillery piece for hunting small game. .22 family will do just fine.
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Thanks for all the reccomendations.
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Originally posted by ariansworld
What would be a good rifle for small game hunting and is not super expensive?
What is your reccomendation?
Thanks.
As others have surely posted, go with a rifle in .22 caliber. Many good rifles to choose from. I went with a Browning BL-22. Great little level action rifle IMO.
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yep angus.. any rifle or hatchet or knife or club or whatever will kill...
I can make a handgun. I can make any firearm and you can make an effective silencer by taping a liter plastic bottle to the gun....so can you. that is why gun laws meant to keep people from killing each other are stupid.
It is in the heart of man not in the tool. You are fortunate to not have many with such hearts in your country but it has nothing to do with your laws..
if someone wanted to kill with a gun in your country they could do it with... a 22.
lazs
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He missed your point, Angus. Just let it go.
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You missed the point. So I let go. Or should I start a counter?
Anyway, I recall you saying that gunshots weren't that dangerous. There you have the smallest of calibers, killing 2 people with 2 bullets.
And as a sidenote, - in a similar case (same cause) the wannabe assasin tried to hit the victim with his car, since he was unarmed. Victim survived and the wannabee went into the place of rectal enlarging :D
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I missed the point? seems to me that if you ban one type of gun thinking it will stop homicide then you have to ban em all. Why would you allow 22's? If you want to start a counter then go ahead but it would simply be a counter for all the irony that went over your head.
As to the other... what I have said about gunshots in the past... if you are going to not be truthful... or.. to be charitable... if you have no ideas as to what I have said in the past....
Don't bother to mention it. What I stated that you may be misrepresenting... is not that gunshots are "not that dangerous" but the fact that 80% of those shot with handguns survive.
If you can't see the difference then it will be difficult for us to interact.
I have to ask tho... do you think that a ban on 22's would have saved those 2 lives?
lazs
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LOL, you missed all points. Okay, I'll fill you in with some extra info
1. This guy killed another guy with a gun. He chose the gun because it's rather easy and effective. Also for killing himself.
2. The victim almost made it. .22 and bolt action single shot didn't quite do it right away. He ran caught a car, and was driven away.
3. Had he been gunned down with a good automatic weapon, he would have been dead on the spot, and killer gone.
4. Killer got spotted, since the rifle was easily visible. So all the blue lights are on, and he runs away.
5. Killer freaks out after getting out of town and shoots himself.
6. A mere .22 is obviously dangerous enough to kill humans in a single shot, which contradicts what Lazs once said, - that gunwound weren't that dangerous.
7. A similar case (jealousy related assassination attempt) occured some years ago. The wannabe-killer stalked the to-be victim and then ran him down with his car. But the victim survived. It was a thing that happened in a moment in a traffic environment, so he did not have the chance to finish it.
I wish that that .22 had been loaded with short shots though, - then you'd have had the victim in Hospital (maybe) and the killer as well with a hole in his gum. But it went bad. Final point to that is that a .22 is enough for all small game, you only need bigger loads for accuracy at more range.
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angus.. you are proving my point not yours... 80% of people shot by handguns survive... many who do not are able to get in their cars and die on the way to the hospital or die later.
The 22 has killed more people than any other caliber except in war. Why not ban the 22... the big killer. Why not start with the caliber that is the big offender? I believe most 22 deaths are caused by rifles too.
soooo... by your logic.. allow large caliber handguns and rifles but get rid of 22 rifles.
A 22 is quiet.. people are killed by em all the time and no one even hears it much less sees it.
I could cut down (as could you) a 22 to a very short length that could easily be concealed.
People attacked with knives have about the same chance of survival as people shot with handguns.
The figure of 80% is about ten years old tho... I admit that I think the newer ammo is increasing the percent... event the pissant 9mm did a 100% job on the poor helpless unarmed students in Va.
I don't know that tho.. just a guess but even if it were true... You are still far from certain to die of handgun wounds.
you still might want to take your chances of getting shot with a handgun vs being run over by a two ton car.
lazs