Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Rolex on August 17, 2007, 03:56:40 AM
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Changed my mind. Delete me!
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Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr............ ...........had my reel and tackle box ready to go. :)
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I think it's a great idea, you should go fishing. now would that be spear, gig, fly, flats or deep sea?
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Originally posted by Rolex
Changed my mind. Delete me!
Awe, shucks.
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OK, here is what I wrote and erased, but it's probably not what you thought it was going to be. :D
"Let's go fishing today kids!" Dad yelled from the hallway as he woke his two sons in the early-morning darkness of 4 am. The boys, 12 and 14-years old, jumped out of bed, threw on their clothes and raced downstairs. They couldn't stop talking as their mother cooked up some eggs and pancakes.
She was as happy as the boys, since they rarely got the chance to get out together as a family. She packed up a picnic basket after breakfast as the boys and dad loaded up the car with rods, reels, lures and nets. His boys were growing up fast and he thought back to the time when he and his father had done this same ritual - spend the entire day at the national park, coming home exhausted and sunburned with a box full of fish.
Loaded up, they hit the road for the two-hour drive to the national park. The morning fog burned off after the first hour and the boys fell back to sleep in the backseat until they pulled up to the park gates. A long line of cars had already formed at the entrance. It seemed like it took longer to inch their way toward the guards at the gate than drive the two hours to get there.
Finally, it was their turn. The guards were all stern-faced and carrying automatic weapons. "It looks like we're entering a war zone," he whispered to his wife as he shook his head, taking in the body armor, helmets and swat-team mystique the new Park Rangers.
"I liked them better when they wore green and those Yogi Bear hats," she said with a laugh.
The car was surrounded by men in black masks and machine guns. "Driver, step out of the vehicle slowly," one of them commanded. Dad got out the car and followed their orders to open the trunk. "Patience..." he thought to himself as they rooted around in the trunk, "Just do as they say and we'll be through this in no time." But he couldn't help the feeling of emasculation. He was embarrassed in front of his wife and boys.
The same commanding voice followed up, "I need the ID of everyone in the vehicle."
"You need to see it? Is it so hard to just ask to see it... politely?"
"You are on federal property. I need your ID now."
"Fine, here's my drivers license."
"This license is not in compliance with federal rules."
"What are you talking about? It's not expired."
"It does not comply with the federal RealID program. Do you have your passport?"
"Passport? Of course I don't have my passport. I'm just here with my family to go fishing! Are you nuts? "
"Step away from the vehicle, now! Put your hands in front of you where I can see them!" the man in black yelled as another guard reached for a taser. "You are forbidden from entering this facilty."
"Good. Give me my license back."
"We are under heightened security color 'pastel blue' against terrorist attacks."
"You have a report of Allstate insurance salesmen and their families attacking with fishing poles?"
"This is no laughing matter. Homeland security is serious business."
"I can see that."
"You need to exit the facility entrance immediately."
"No problem. I can't get out of here fast enough. By the way, I own this park as much as you do. This is my park."
"Get an ID that complies with federal regulations and you can enter it."
He snatched back his license and slammed the car door shut. "Come on kids, let's go find a place to fish where we don't need a passport," emphasizing the word passport by holding his nose to block the smell.
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If you live in a state that does not comply with the federal RealID program, you won't be able to use your state drivers license to board an aircraft or even enter a national park, according to the Homeland Security people. When they ask you to show them your papers, you'll have to use a passport.
Link>> (http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/08/16/real.id/index.html)
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amazing thanks for the heads up. I reckon it's time to contact my representatives again.
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But boy, if you can make it into that national park, those lakes and streams will be swarming with fish! Overfishing is the main cause of poor fishing around here.
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A site with more info:
http://www.papersplease.org/
An alarming development, the Department of Homeland Security is proposing the following:
All would-be passengers on international or domestic flights to, from, over, via, or within the U.S. would have to have both government-issued ID credentials and explicit case-by-case prior permission from the DHS to the airline to allow each passenger to board a plane.
You would need a TRAVEL PERMIT, Soviet style, to travel domestically.
For all you Eaglers out there who have been yelling "chicken little", you may wish to review the facts.
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I LIVE in a National Park.
Good FLIPPIN' LUCK trying to pull that here.
They would be greeted by four heavily armed hillbillies that would blow their heads off.
68ROX
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Originally posted by Chairboy
A site with more info:
http://www.papersplease.org/
An alarming development, the Department of Homeland Security is proposing the following:
You would need a TRAVEL PERMIT, Soviet style, to travel domestically.
For all you Eaglers out there who have been yelling "chicken little", you may wish to review the facts.
Chairboy.
You obviously want the terrorists to win.
I think we need to strengthen the sedition laws to put a stop to your blatant anarchistic thinking process.
shamus
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If that went through it would essentially end the airlines as a business.
Doubt that will happen.
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HHHMMM it seems states have the option to implement or not. It would seem that the Park employees, including the Park Guards (aka Rangers) would live in and have license from the state in which the Park is located. Therefore in accordance with the "chicken little" story posted here, they themselves would not be able to enter the park and they would have to arrest themselves for entering without proper ID. After they escorted themselves to the appropriate detention facility there would be no one at the Park guarding it. It would then become a terrorist training ground and would have to be nuked from space, cuz' that's the only way to be sure.
And they lived happily the sky is falling the sky is falling ever after.
:rolleyes: (we really need the old rolly eye thing back)
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Are you saying that I am chicken little, Maverick?
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Nope I didn't say YOU are chicken little, just the fictional dramitization you posted. Or are you saying you really went through this situation on a law that has not gone into effect yet. Please note the rest of the post I made as well.
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Can I ask you a question? What is your blood type? I'm serious... is it A?
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Nope
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B? AB?
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Originally posted by Maverick
Nope I didn't say YOU are chicken little, just the fictional dramitization you posted. Or are you saying you really went through this situation on a law that has not gone into effect yet.
If a 1764 New England colonist wrote of a time when the King would heavily tax him in the future without representation, is he a Chicken Little?
If a 1938 Warsaw jew wrote about the danger of being pushed into a ghetto and being starved to death, would he be Chicken Little?
If a 1969 university student wrote about the danger of National Guard firing into a crowd of protesters, would he/she be a Chicken Little?
The stuff in the original post here isn't just being pulled out of the air, the legal framework is being constructed to make it a possibility. If you told someone in 1950 that in the near future, all air travelers would need to present drivers licenses and be physically searched every time they got on a plane, he'd laugh at you. But we're being worked into a slow lather about things in a way that's desensitizing us to the real problems. It's the old frog in hot water analogy. You throw the frog in a pot of hot water, he jumps out. But if you put him in cool water and gradually warm it, he doesn't notice until it's too late.
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This is why I erased it after first writing it. I knew this happen.
I knew some people would not grasp that the story was fiction, just a dramatization, to introduce the reality of the how the federal government will coerce states into complying with Real ID. Sure they don't have to comply, but their residents will force their legislatures to comply when faced with the inconveniences that will come from non compliance.
States are being forced into subservience to the federal government.
I should have just posted a picture of a fish.
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Well it is a good thing we aren't taxed without representation then. It is called voting. That is your representation.
And I fly a lot. Anywhere from 50k-100k annually. I am still trying to recall if I have been physically searched. Step back and think of what this post is implying is just around the corner. Does it make rational sense? Hardly.
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it wouldn't be the first time states have clashed with the feds over issues. one hundred forty two years ago ended a big clash over the issue of states rights. the feds have been gaining ground steadily ever since.
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Chairboy you left out that other bit of writing about the coming apocolypse called "Red Dawn".
Rolex,
My blood type is simply not your concern, unless you need a transfusion. In that case I recomend you seek competant medical assistance rather than the internet. It is red however. If you are going to do a personal attack, simply get on with it.
I would have thought that posting a link with a bit of a comment would have gotten the message across without the need for the fiction. You might have a future in the script writing or novel industry however.
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Maverick: Eternal vigilance is the price of liberty. You're free to be the trusting sort who doesn't think he has to worry about big boy subjects like Constitutional rights, that's your choice.
Personally, I feel a more sensible doctrine in life is to hope for the best while preparing for the worst. If there's something I as a citizen can do to salt the earth in which oppression grows, I'll do it. It's a fool who waits until that plant bears its poisonous fruit before caring.
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I would be interested in knowing what would happen to a person who had no passport in a State that did not comply with the new guidelines who was called for Federal jury duty?
Would a warrant be issued for him after he no showed because he was turned away at the door?
shamus
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Shamus: Something very similar happened recently to someone who had a court date as the defendant and was turned away because he/she didn't have ID to get into the courthouse. That's a paddlin.
So, yeah.
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Chairboy,
The danger with making a fictional prophetic situation about a circumstance that does not yet exist is that the fiction may be a bit "over the top". If it is written in a manner that is so obviously untrue in present circumstances it begs to be disregarded. Hence my comment about linking the article and providing a bit of commentary rather than the "story" he did provide. That is the sum total of my point with Rolex. That is also why I specifically answered his question about whether I was calling him "chicken little".
I am also not yet ready to dismiss the court system and it's responsibility to provide the check against unconstitutional intrusions as totally ineffective. Unfortunately there is a bit of lag at times in the exercise of the system but so far it has been working. I don't think the system is really broken but it could use a tune up for sure.
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What of 1984, the preposterous fiction that couldn't possibly be true... except now it is, in some places more than others. England is heavily wired with CCTV, China has just purchased a massive surveillance system to try and one-up even that, the US, well, that's a different thread.
What about Animal Farm, why, that's just craz- oh wait, the USSR.
Believe it or not, it's possible for fiction to serve as a warning of things that, left unchecked, will come or are in the process of being made.
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"Gestapo States of America"
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All the angst and worry yet 99% of the people in this thread will vote in 2008 for a person running for President that wants to continue to expand the power of the Federal government.
I, otoh, will vote for Ron Paul. :)
So, when your kid asks you in 20 years who is to blame for the loss of our Constitutional rights you will at least be able to say..."well, I know one thing for sure... it wasn't Toad."
:)
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I'm thinking Ron Paul too. It'll be interesting to see how his campaign develops.
Here's a handy chart of where folks sit on the issues:
http://flickr.com/photo_zoom.gne?id=868063604&size=o
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As long as Hillary or Obama arent elected, I will be happy
I am ashamed to have Obama the O'Joke as a senator of IL.
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It was intended to be "over the top." I just woke up, so there is a very real risk this will be less than lucid.
I resent the inference that I'm trying to make some veiled personal attack.
I also resent being emasculated. Law by law, Americans are being emasculated by federal government intrusion into their lives. The security theater is embarrassing, and I am embarrassed for America. The growth of the terror threat industry and Homeland Security is a perversion, not just in principle, but in practical, fiscal terms. It is not good economics. It's creating another industry beholden to the federal treasury that provides no real, measurable value. It will be another revenue stream of lobbyists using the taxpayer money to lobby for more taxpayer money.
Homeland Security has grown from having nine contractors to 34,000 companies with a common vested interest in more federal laws and programs to monitor, track, guard, spy on and regulate movement of people. The jobs created in the industry do nothing to help American competitiveness and are just a replacement for manufacturing jobs being lost. Instead of learning skills to manufacture or service something, kids will be learning to stand around in airports play acting.
If anyone suicidal wanted to harm air travelers in the past 6 years, the security play acting would have helped by having hundreds of people lined up waiting to go through "security." The threat protection business would like you to think everyone is a potential threat, but the truth is that the country is filled to the brim with people who have no intent whatsoever to blow people up every day.
If you subtract the jobs created by the terror threat business and the health care business, which is more healthy for the industry than the nation, there would have been no jobs added to the economy in the last six years.
The federal government needs some de-construction. It's the wrong industry to build.
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Rolex++
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hear hear rolex.
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Originally posted by Meatwad
As long as Hillary or Obama arent elected, I will be happy
I fear you are going to be very unhappy from (at a minimum) January 2009 to January 2013.
As much as it pains me to say this, I think Billary is a lock.
Let's see.... Bush, Clinton, Clinton, Bush, Bush, Clinton. 24 years of royalty ruling the country; quite possibly 28 because we can probably add a Clinton after that last one given how hard it is to unseat an incumbent.
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Well said Rolex but I fear the only way you deconstruct a government in power that is this big and this overreaching already is by force of arms.
Hmmmm.... which flag, which flag.....
Maybe the Culpepper Minutemen flag?
(http://www.americanrevwar.homestead.com/files/culpep3.gif)
:)
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Rolex,
Your question about my blood type, was totally irrelevant to the discussion at hand, yet you asked for it twice. No reason I can think of for it other than you wished to somehow use it for a personal attack.
You've seen my posting on the board here more than a little bit. I'd like to think that you would recognise that I pretty much say what I think and I am not particularly politically correct.
FWIW I agree with you that there is too much government already and the idea of a national ID bothers me. That also harkens back to another Heinlein character in a differant novel that I happen to agree with. You had a valid point in your intent, you just discredited it with the story you wrote. The more and louder you cry wolf and add things to make it worse than it already is, the less likely it is to be taken seriously. My whole point, period, message good, method bad.
Chairboy,
Please note that animal farm dealt with a situation that was not fictional, it portrayed human actions that have already happened. That's not necessarily a prophesy for the future. It's a description of the past and a generalization of some of the bad aspects of human nature.
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The US goverment thinks that they can lead us all down their path until no one is capable of resisting. That by the time we see the executioner killing other sheep there is no way back.
One bye one, month by month our personal liberties and rights have been falling. How far down this path do we have to go before we decide if we are going to be dead sheep. We'd prefer to at least be FREE dead sheep. If we act soon enough, some of the sheep may live. If we wait too long, there is no hope for any of us.
Time to kick the whole Washington crowd out, and start from scratch again.
Based on the Constitution, and Bill of Rights. With perhaps a few more checks and balances on things.
There is law, but there is precious little justice.
There is virtually no accountability for groups like Social Services, who can break up homes, decide who gets children, and who's paying. And who does this on a daily basis, before anyone is proven guilty. A local friend was charged with child abuse of his 3 step children, 15 months later jury found him not guilty. But did Social Services give him and his wife back their children? No, they did not, they sent them from North Dakota to live in Florida with their dad. Who by the way is a known pervert.
At what point do we say "this is no longer government of the people, by the people, for the people" and revolt?
Yes there are people out there who want the USA to fall. But this is not the way, not by removing the very things we stand for.
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Originally posted by Maverick
No reason I can think of for it other than you wished to somehow use it for a personal attack.
I don't mean to speak for Rolex, but it looks like the sort of exageration for making something obvious rather than for ridicule that most everyone uses now and then when plainly saying something doesn't make their point obvious enough.