Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Neubob on September 16, 2007, 04:21:14 PM
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Because it's about time that some other groups had the moral imperative to attribute everything negative that happens to them to the powers that be.
Namely, the Alaskan Inuit!
Down with the man!
Up with whale blubber!
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Vote for Nagin. I'm sure he would like to make this a "Chocolate" country.
Actually I wished he had put his hat in the Gov race just to see him stick his foot in his mouth some more.
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Be sure to cut holes for the eyes so you can see the cross burning.
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Originally posted by Neubob
Because it's about time that some other groups had the moral imperative to attribute everything negative that happens to them to the powers that be.
Namely, the Alaskan Inuit!
Down with the man!
Up with whale blubber!
If there's a black guy out there who's worth my vote, fine. If not, fine. Gotta earn that vote.. and it ain't earned by being born with one skin color or another.
*edit* removed some stuff
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Originally posted by midnight Target
Be sure to cut holes for the eyes so you can see the cross burning.
Actually, I prefer to just take the hood off. It's sort of a fire hazard, as we had the misfortune of finding out after Billy-Bo-Jim-Bob burned his-self right down to the nub...
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OK, lets see if i got this right, if Nagin calls New Orleans a "Chocolate" city it's OK, but if a white person mentions that Nagin said it then the white person belongs to the KKK?
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What's the big deal with black & white?
Doesn't anyone use the rule of common sense, reliability, and a proven history of dedication as a servant to those who they represent in determining who they want to elect?
And just because Nagin is a retard idiot doesn't mean that all black candidates would be.
And just because most elected officials are white doesn't mean that they're not retard idiots.
And the alaskans don't want you even bringing them into it. Just keep all the mainland crap down here.
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Seriously guys, do you even own a sense of humor? (the Inuit comment was the definition of randomness)
You can make jokes about white people all day long, but open your mouth about a minority and it's bigot city... About time that equality actually had some semblance of equalness, don't you think?
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Originally posted by Neubob
Seriously guys, do you even own a sense of humor? (the Inuit comment was the definition of randomness)
You can make jokes about white people all day long, but open your mouth about a minority and it's bigot city... About time that equality actually had some semblance of equalness, don't you think?
It ain't that random ~ I'm an Inuit. More of a minority than ANYONE here. And I STILL use the 'prove it' test instead of 'cause you're black' or 'cause you're white' test when I look at someone I'm considering to elect.
The entire idea of 'time that someone black is the president' is just the most ridiculous statement I've heard.
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Originally posted by john9001
OK, lets see if i got this right, if Nagin calls New Orleans a "Chocolate" city it's OK, but if a white person mentions that Nagin said it then the white person belongs to the KKK?
Indoctrination has obviously failed with this one. Detain on sight, Homeland Thought Police are enroute.
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Originally posted by texasmom
The entire idea of 'time that someone black is the president' is just the most ridiculous statement I've heard.
Yeah, I know... That was the idea.
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Okay, I see.:)
You're a good sport neubob
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Originally posted by Neubob
Yeah, I know... That was the idea.
Bull ****
The idea was to paint the entire black race as a bunch of whiners who blame everything on everyone else. When you use that broad a brush it stinks.. period.
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You mean there's no such trend?
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Originally posted by midnight Target
Bull ****
The idea was to paint the entire black race as a bunch of whiners who blame everything on everyone else. When you use that broad a brush it stinks.. period.
Like I said before, it's okay to smear whites, but when something silly and retarded is said about a minority, it's time for the waterworks. Well I think that that's the real bull****.
There are two ways to react: You can get the **** over yourself, or you can become the joke.
Either way works just fine for me.
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Originally posted by midnight Target
Bull ****
The idea was to paint the entire black race as a bunch of whiners who blame everything on everyone else. When you use that broad a brush it stinks.. period.
That broad brush stuff never comes clean in the wash. There's plenty of responsibilty-dodging blame-shifting white idiots just the same as black. And each person is responsible for their own actions ~ and their demonstration of responsibility (or lack of) isn't an indication of how the rest of their 'race' behaves.
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I am niether sexist nor racist when it comes to politicians.
They are all equally worthless.
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Originally posted by mentalguy
I am niether sexist nor racist when it comes to politicians.
They are all equally worthless.
I'm definitely sexist when it comes to politicians. Women just don't have what it takes to lead in most cases. Too much heart & not enough brain.
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Originally posted by texasmom
I'm definitely sexist when it comes to politicians. Women just don't have what it takes to lead in most cases. Too much heart & not enough brain.
If I hadn't read the first sentence of this post, I would have assumed you were talking about Democrats.
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Originally posted by texasmom
I'm definitely sexist when it comes to politicians. Women just don't have what it takes to lead in most cases. Too much heart & not enough brain.
Just for that comment, if you were running, I'd vote for ya.
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Originally posted by Neubob
If I hadn't read the first sentence of this post, I would have assumed you were talking about Democrats.
Actually yes, I believe that about democrats as well. For the most part, I do believe that they are good people, and have a desire to see good things for the people around them. Their method of getting there is what I object to.
Democrats: just like the kids book: 'bread & jam for francis' who eats her meals so they all 'come out even' & who want to provide everything for everyone.
Republicans: want you to get off your keester & provide the gain for yourself. And don't expect you to share once you've gotten that gain on your own. And if you fail, they tell you 'better luck next time, mate' instead of bailing you out. It's not that they want you to fail, but that they expect you to attain success on your own merit.
See, there I go against my own 'painting with a broad brush.' It's not entirely across the board like that with each of those parties. Close enough that you'd be able to watch for it when you are evaluating your candidates though.
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Originally posted by mentalguy
Just for that comment, if you were running, I'd vote for ya.
Just for the reasons behind that comment, I wouldn't run. :D
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Lady, you're alright. :)
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Originally posted by texasmom
Just for the reasons behind that comment, I wouldn't run. :D
Well, if you have the brains to know that and the guts to say it, you make a perfect example of what America needs as a pesident.
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:lol Threads like this make the holier than thou shine so bright. Doesn't take long for the bleeding hearts to start throwing stones in thier oh so clean glass houses.
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Originally posted by john9001
OK, lets see if i got this right, if Nagin calls New Orleans a "Chocolate" city it's OK, but if a white person mentions that Nagin said it then the white person belongs to the KKK?
There was an uproaor down here when he made that remark. It was considered a racist remark.
Of course the libs will accuse me of being racist just because I quoted his remark. Just like they will call people like Powell, Watts, Rice, etc. "Uncle Toms" and its not a racist remark because they are black conservatives.
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quote: Originally posted by midnight Target
Bull ****
The idea was to paint the entire black race as a bunch of whiners who blame everything on everyone else. When you use that broad a brush it stinks.. period.
...sounds like whining to me...
:cry
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Originally posted by RedTop
:lol Threads like this make the holier than thou shine so bright. Doesn't take long for the bleeding hearts to start throwing stones in thier oh so clean glass houses.
Spot on .:aok
Bronk
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Where all the white women at?
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I'm black, what did i trip and land face first in Republican, right wing, country? (The one they don't want you to know about). At least back in the day they had the common decency to identify themselves. My mom and dead are 72 and 75, they tell stories all the time. My dad exclaimed how after being drafted in 53 he came back to the states after serving only to be asked to leave a diner in a NY train station. I try to tell them it ain't like that no more, but old scars die hard.
I'm 29 so i know about today's lingo, can't tell you how many times i've seen a bunch of white kids calling each other "*****". I saw a bunch of teenage white girls, looking like Paris Hilton, blasting ghetto rap, in a 88 seville, dropped down, with do-rags. I thought it was funny. Not that it matters though. Today's young generation has an advantage in that they don't even see a problem with that or read anything into it. My mom thinks there's something to it. I know it's just culture and people havin fun.
There are way too many "black leaders" (i use parenthesis because that is relative) spouting off at the mouth about racism evertime something happens. I get sick of em. At least hold off and be sure before you use that line, although sometimes they could be right.
Whoever the guy was saying that if the purpose of this thread was to paint black folks as a bunch of whiners blaming everybody, sure some of em are, some are not. If that's your point then whoever you are, your an idiot. I don't care who is president be they woman, black, white, gay, spongebob or whatever. Just let them have a brain, more than the one we got now hopefully. So go Mc Cain !
Ghetto logic
By The Pig :cool:
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Mom for president!
(OOOOKKKKKKkkkk, Ron Paul can be your veep, if ya promise not to let him DO anything:rofl )
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Originally posted by bj229r
Mom for president!
(OOOOKKKKKKkkkk, Ron Paul can be your veep, if ya promise not to let him DO anything:rofl )
Ron Paul's a wuss. Would have to have someone stronger than that for my VP ;)
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Well, I figgered the Texas thing....I always liked Phil Gramm:aok
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Originally posted by LEADPIG
I'm black, what did i trip and land face first in Republican, right wing, country? (The one they don't want you to know about). At least back in the day they had the common decency to identify themselves. My mom and dead are 72 and 75, they tell stories all the time. My dad exclaimed how after being drafted in 53 he came back to the states after serving only to be asked to leave a diner in a NY train station. I try to tell them it ain't like that no more, but old scars die hard.
I'm 29 so i know about today's lingo, can't tell you how many times i've seen a bunch of white kids calling each other "*****". I saw a bunch of teenage white girls, looking like Paris Hilton, blasting ghetto rap, in a 88 seville, dropped down, with do-rags. I thought it was funny. Not that it matters though. Today's young generation has an advantage in that they don't even see a problem with that or read anything into it. My mom thinks there's something to it. I know it's just culture and people havin fun.
There are way too many "black leaders" (i use parenthesis because that is relative) spouting off at the mouth about racism evertime something happens. I get sick of em. At least hold off and be sure before you use that line, although sometimes they could be right.
Whoever the guy was saying that if the purpose of this thread was to paint black folks as a bunch of whiners blaming everybody, sure some of em are, some are not. If that's your point then whoever you are, your an idiot. I don't care who is president be they woman, black, white, gay, spongebob or whatever. Just let them have a brain, more than the one we got now hopefully. So go Mc Cain !
Ghetto logic
By The Pig :cool:
White people with cornrows should be thrown in prison:rofl (I remember high school in the 70's.....white kids looked at black kids THEN to see what was cool too...(ARGH..it was JJ Walker:O )
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Originally posted by bj229r
White people with cornrows should be thrown in prison:rofl (I remember high school in the 70's.....white kids looked at black kids THEN to see what was cool too...(ARGH..it was JJ Walker:O )
You mean this guy?
(http://vermontdailybriefing.com/wp-content/my-images/jj.jpg)
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I'm black, what did i trip and land face first in Republican, right wing, country? (The one they don't want you to know about). At least back in the day they had the common decency to identify themselves. My mom and dead are 72 and 75, they tell stories all the time. My dad exclaimed how after being drafted in 53 he came back to the states after serving only to be asked to leave a diner in a NY train station. I try to tell them it ain't like that no more, but old scars die hard.
I'm 29 so i know about today's lingo, can't tell you how many times i've seen a bunch of white kids calling each other "*****". I saw a bunch of teenage white girls, looking like Paris Hilton, blasting ghetto rap, in a 88 seville, dropped down, with do-rags. I thought it was funny. Not that it matters though. Today's young generation has an advantage in that they don't even see a problem with that or read anything into it. My mom thinks there's something to it. I know it's just culture and people havin fun.
There are way too many "black leaders" (i use parenthesis because that is relative) spouting off at the mouth about racism evertime something happens. I get sick of em. At least hold off and be sure before you use that line, although sometimes they could be right.
Whoever the guy was saying that if the purpose of this thread was to paint black folks as a bunch of whiners blaming everybody, sure some of em are, some are not. If that's your point then whoever you are, your an idiot. I don't care who is president be they woman, black, white, gay, spongebob or whatever. Just let them have a brain, more than the one we got now hopefully. So go Mc Cain !
Ghetto logic
By The Pig
Exactly! It's a friggin' joke, for goodness sake! I'm multi-racial AND somehow manage to have a sense of humor. Hell, I live in Wyoming, let's have some sheep-shagger jokes, guys and gals!
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Ok a sheep walks into a bar .........:D
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It's simple math.... 90% or better of the negro vote for the democrats and socialism so... you have a 90% chance of better of picking the best candidate if you don't vote for the negro.
lazs
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Originally posted by texasmom
What's the big deal with black & white?
Doesn't anyone use the rule of common sense, reliability, and a proven history of dedication as a servant to those who they represent in determining who they want to elect?
Personally I wouldnt care what color or gender a candidate was provided I thought they would be best for the job.
Unfortunately.
There are alot of other people that do not think that way.
For example. Reguardless of which ends up running. There will be a good amount of people that would vote for Hillary simply because she is a female.
And for Obamba simply because he is black.
Thankfully. there will also be alot of people who would vote against those like them. simlpy for those reasons.
Ideally they two groups will cancel each other out
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Lazs, why use that word?
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It's sorta like entertainers and women tho... women conservatives make fairly good politicians while the liberal ones are just awful... a trend of voting for liberal women has run it's course I hope..
Entertainers? conservative ones make good candidates but no one would even think of voting for a socialist one.... look at the kinky for gov campaign for instance.
lazs
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Originally posted by moot
Lazs, why use that word?
Ok wait just a damned minute... All jokes aside, does the word 'negro' have any negative connotation at all? Isn't just as offensive as, say, 'caucasian' or 'asian'?
Note: This is not meant to incite anger. I honestly want to know.
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Originally posted by Neubob
Ok wait just a damned minute... All jokes aside, does the word 'negro' have any negative connotation at all? Isn't just as offensive as, say, 'caucasian' or 'asian'?
Note: This is not meant to incite anger. I honestly want to know.
Basically it was the acceptable term for blacks back in the good old days...err....before the 1960s.
Nothing "wrong" with it per se....but if you want to get the real "low down" call the next large black man you see a negro and let us all know the reaction you get...mmmmkay?
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Originally posted by Curval
Basically it was the acceptable term for blacks back in the good old days...err....before the 1960s.
Nothing "wrong" with it per se....but if you want to get the real "low down" call the next large black man you see a negro and let us all know the reaction you get...mmmmkay?
He asked me what I wanted.
What now?
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Originally posted by Neubob
He asked me what I wanted.
What now?
Please....I doubt very much that is the case.
Let's ask LEADPIG his opinion....hey LEADPIG, my negro, wasssup....can you help us out here?
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this year they are called "dark skinned americans of african descendancy"
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Originally posted by Curval
Basically it was the acceptable term for blacks back in the good old days...err....before the 1960s.
Nothing "wrong" with it per se....but if you want to get the real "low down" call the next large black man you see a negro and let us all know the reaction you get...mmmmkay?
how about i call him "boy"?
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Originally posted by Curval
Please....I doubt very much that is the case.
Let's ask LEADPIG his opinion....hey LEADPIG, my negro, wasssup....can you help us out here?
Yeah, leadpig, come on... Help a caucasian out!!
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Originally posted by john9001
how about i call him "boy"?
Sure...give that a whirl. :aok
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Originally posted by Curval
Sure...give that a whirl. :aok
you mean like when a NFL couch says "my boys can win this game"?
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Originally posted by john9001
you mean like when a NFL couch says "my boys can win this game"?
An NFL couch?
You asked "how about if I call HIM boy"...stop trying to be smart and looking stupid.
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First off i cant believe this thread is still unlocked next IN
last get a grib fellas dont be a racist. do you think god himself sees color NO. black brown blue pink spit what ever you may be when you run for prez. dont vote on what race or what sexuality you are.
vote for good reasons like what they plain to do while in office. what are they going to do about gas prices. not well we going to make sure that everyone in america has to have insurance. **** that not everyone can afford it. raise our paythen tell us that.
thats the kind of stuff that you vote for not race.
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Neubob what part of Alaska you from.
I in Fairbanks
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Originally posted by kilz
Neubob what part of Alaska you from.
I in Fairbanks
Nice! I think I remember you saying that before Kilz. My family is north of Nome (Deering).
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Originally posted by kilz
Neubob what part of Alaska you from.
I in Fairbanks
I'm not from Alaska. I live in Central PA, and the closest I've been to Fairbanks was when flying over Western Alaska on the way to Seoul.
I was just using the Inuit to try to make the initial thread that much more random.
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Four random Inuits walk into a bar... The first one asks the bartender....
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Originally posted by LEADPIG
I'm black, what did i trip and land face first in Republican, right wing, country? (The one they don't want you to know about). At least back in the day they had the common decency to identify themselves. My mom and dead are 72 and 75, they tell stories all the time. My dad exclaimed how after being drafted in 53 he came back to the states after serving only to be asked to leave a diner in a NY train station. I try to tell them it ain't like that no more, but old scars die hard.
I'm 29 so i know about today's lingo, can't tell you how many times i've seen a bunch of white kids calling each other "*****". I saw a bunch of teenage white girls, looking like Paris Hilton, blasting ghetto rap, in a 88 seville, dropped down, with do-rags. I thought it was funny. Not that it matters though. Today's young generation has an advantage in that they don't even see a problem with that or read anything into it. My mom thinks there's something to it. I know it's just culture and people havin fun.
There are way too many "black leaders" (i use parenthesis because that is relative) spouting off at the mouth about racism evertime something happens. I get sick of em. At least hold off and be sure before you use that line, although sometimes they could be right.
Whoever the guy was saying that if the purpose of this thread was to paint black folks as a bunch of whiners blaming everybody, sure some of em are, some are not. If that's your point then whoever you are, your an idiot. I don't care who is president be they woman, black, white, gay, spongebob or whatever. Just let them have a brain, more than the one we got now hopefully. So go Mc Cain !
Ghetto logic
By The Pig :cool:
nicely said pig.
yall know that i am white my best friend is black i call him my brother well i call him white boy and he calls me his N#$#r, and i wear wranglers.
and by the way pig its not called Ghetto Logic its called poetic
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Originally posted by texasmom
Nice! I think I remember you saying that before Kilz. My family is north of Nome (Deering).
yea mom we had this talk before. i know where deering is. plus you been thru the town where i grew up. Brenham Texas. pluss i been drunk and been to many cow tipping parties where your from :D
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Originally posted by Neubob
I'm not from Alaska. I live in Central PA, and the closest I've been to Fairbanks was when flying over Western Alaska on the way to Seoul.
I was just using the Inuit to try to make the initial thread that much more random.
i was going off the location that you gave. Where the sun dont shine. that would be alaska
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Originally posted by kilz
yea mom we had this talk before. i know where deering is. plus you been thru the town where i grew up. Brenham Texas. pluss i been drunk and been to many cow tipping parties where your from :D
Right... from the burger thread :)
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Originally posted by kilz
i was going off the location that you gave. Where the sun dont shine. that would be alaska
I see...
I spent a few days in St. Petersburg some years back. It was summer when I was there, so it was the land where the sun never stopped shining.
Maybe one day I'll see it in the winter.
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kilz... I guess you got me... my best friend is not a negro but I do have a recent picture of me and some negros at an eatery... does that mean I am ok now?
I live in the bay area of kalifornia... it is likely that I have seen more negros than someone from alaska. They may be a more diverse grouping of the race too.
moot... why do I say it? why not? It is hard enough to keep up with all the names that they like or don't like... I thought a very funny bit in the movie "clerks" was the whole porch monkey thing they did.
Why did I do it? why do you pick on the brother in the family who is overly sensitive? just to hear em scream I guess... and.. to make a point too.. to toughen people to reality and to make us more equal...not less... How equal is it to say that some people can't be spoken to? That some people need extra rights? Hate crimes? how equal are those things?
It really is funny... until we can make fun of everyone equally there will be no equality..
And there in lies the reason to not vote for a negro....It would be a rare one that didn't have all that baggage... A rare one who wasn't a socialist because they felt owed.
I am sure that there are many exceptions to the rules but it doesn't hurt to play the odds.
lazs
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Originally posted by Curval
Basically it was the acceptable term for blacks back in the good old days...err....before the 1960s.
Nothing "wrong" with it per se....but if you want to get the real "low down" call the next large black man you see a negro and let us all know the reaction you get...mmmmkay?
Thats cause there arent alot of black men who speak Spanish
Hmmm I wonder what would happen if you found a large white man and callen him a "blanca" :rofl
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Originally posted by Curval
An NFL couch?
You asked "how about if I call HIM boy"...stop trying to be smart and looking stupid.
If you ever see an NFL "couch" say anything.
Its time to stop drinking LOL
I think you both mean "COACH"
And they tell me I cant spell LOL
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Originally posted by lazs2
kilz... I guess you got me... my best friend is not a negro but I do have a recent picture of me and some negros at an eatery... does that mean I am ok now?
I live in the bay area of kalifornia... it is likely that I have seen more negros than someone from alaska. They may be a more diverse grouping of the race too.
moot... why do I say it? why not? It is hard enough to keep up with all the names that they like or don't like... I thought a very funny bit in the movie "clerks" was the whole porch monkey thing they did.
Why did I do it? why do you pick on the brother in the family who is overly sensitive? just to hear em scream I guess... and.. to make a point too.. to toughen people to reality and to make us more equal...not less... How equal is it to say that some people can't be spoken to? That some people need extra rights? Hate crimes? how equal are those things?
It really is funny... until we can make fun of everyone equally there will be no equality..
And there in lies the reason to not vote for a negro....It would be a rare one that didn't have all that baggage... A rare one who wasn't a socialist because they felt owed.
I am sure that there are many exceptions to the rules but it doesn't hurt to play the odds.
lazs
my post was not directed toward you laz:)
i may live in Alaska but i did not grow up here. i grew up in texas. lived in the queen city. i have lived in alot of diffrent citys.
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....Whoo after i picked myself up off the floor from laughing, let me let you know. I don't see anything wrong with the word negro. It's the official word for black person. Just like caucasian is for white. It is somewhat antiquated a word but i'd understand it. There's a fellow who is a family friend, a white gentleman about 72, who uses the word "colored" still because he came from that era. We don't care because he's the nicest guy goin. It's like if you grew up in Britain and said Bloody or chap all the time. However if you did say negro to a lot of black people it would be somewhat funny and might ellicit this conversation as you leave.
" Hey bro, you hear that, what was that about? (insert puzzled laughter from said parties). I ain't heard that word in a while. (more laughter). He must be one of those southern conservative folks.
If you meant no harm from it, you wouldn't have no problem. If you did, then you'd probably have a problem. Depending on how you handled said situation.
I think Lasz was just trieing to be PC, because it can be hard to understand. Such as " Hey what do you Negro's call yourself's nowadays." A good question indeed.
After such a huge social cataclism as slavery, and all that came after it, your going to have to admit such topics are going to be sensitive for awhile. Try a hundred years for every hundred years slavery was in activity. Multiply that by number of lynchings and pain caused. You come up with around 600 years before America lives that huge blot on it's personality down.
Given that i'm half white, half black, (great grandfather was a white guy from france) take that into account.
Funny story as i leave... My grandfather looked so much like a white man that he used to ride the buses and come and go as he pleased fooling everybody but the ones that noticed....hilarious..go grandpa. lol
:aok
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Originally posted by lazs2
kilz... I guess you got me... my best friend is not a negro but I do have a recent picture of me and some negros at an eatery... does that mean I am ok now?
I live in the bay area of kalifornia... it is likely that I have seen more negros than someone from alaska. They may be a more diverse grouping of the race too.
moot... why do I say it? why not? It is hard enough to keep up with all the names that they like or don't like... I thought a very funny bit in the movie "clerks" was the whole porch monkey thing they did.
Why did I do it? why do you pick on the brother in the family who is overly sensitive? just to hear em scream I guess... and.. to make a point too.. to toughen people to reality and to make us more equal...not less... How equal is it to say that some people can't be spoken to? That some people need extra rights? Hate crimes? how equal are those things?
It really is funny... until we can make fun of everyone equally there will be no equality..
And there in lies the reason to not vote for a negro....It would be a rare one that didn't have all that baggage... A rare one who wasn't a socialist because they felt owed.
I am sure that there are many exceptions to the rules but it doesn't hurt to play the odds.
lazs
Uh Lasz don't quite agree with all of that, i don't really pick on anyone cause i'm not really like that, and hate crimes, don't look at those people being the representatives for a race, they're stupid. The porch monkey part was so funny i nearly blew out a tear duct laughing, excellent social commentary there.
The part about president, ugh not quite Lasz, most black folks, especially ones intelligent enough to run for president, realize alot of this stuff black folks cling to is stupid. So they'd most likely know better, (omit Al Sharpton here.)
Believing that is a bit genaralizing of people and a bit broad stroking. Perhaps a bit pre-judging=(prejudiced) if you think about it. Apply only your beliefs to the man himself not the group said man belongs to, because truth being, no man belongs to a group. Other than that, i think i may see what your saying, correct me if i'm wrong. Lasz
P.S. And your right it is hard to tell what were calling ourselves these days, i don't even know sometimes. Somebody let me know.
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I was just curious Lazs, Neubob.
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leadpig... I am glad you feel the way you do. I find that I get along fine with older negros but that young ones...not so much... and ones who buy into the whole "black culture" thing... not at all. nada.. none.. even the older ones... if you scratch the surface you will get to the hate and socialism.
I feel for you and your pain at being a slave so recently... with brothers and sisters just released... My grandfather came from scotland and they would send the scotts down in the mine before the mules cause the mules were expensive.
ask around in any mining town about the history of the mines... the cotton field looks pretty good compared to our brand of slavery...
get over it. even you... seem unable to let it go...you brought it up fer christsakes! You proved my point... negros can't let it go and become part of America.. why should I bother with em if they keep dragging themselves down into the whole mess?
As for your contention that they are not all socialists.... maybe.. but I am for sure more accurate than you are... look at the voting records of negros...The colored vote is a given. it is a giveaway by people with a chip on their shoulder that drags them down.
Look as osamabama.... are you going to tell me that his voting record is not right out of some socialist pity pot agenda?
There are coloreds I would vote for. Shelby steele for instanace... a few other conservatives but... oddly enough... they are hated and vilified by their own race. And simply because they espouse having negros join America
lazs
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I've been in this french colony for 3 years, and there's almost the same sort of dynamic between the french and the locals descendent from slaves.
It gets old fast, although in my experience, it's worse in the US.
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Originally posted by texasmom
If there's a black guy out there who's worth my vote, fine. If not, fine. Gotta earn that vote.. and it ain't earned by being born with one skin color or another.
*edit* removed some stuff
Or a pair of breast.
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moot... what would you suggest? I agree that it gets old real fast... you only have to listen to our media and entertainment to see it from the white perspective.
I am about sick of being blamed for everything that is wrong with an entire race... I have found that with people so far gone in hate and selfpity and selfloathing that it is simply best to avoid them.
Even the best of them (the aformentioned negro photo op at eatery) you have to walk on eggs and listen to how tough it is to be them because of people like me.
they simply can't get over it. As such.. they get more and more dragged down..
Now... with a new race to feel guilty about.. a whole new people to feel bad about.... illegals... the negro will lose even the status of picked on... they can "black culture" all they want but the illegal will take everything that the negro should have been working for all this time....
There is only so much white guilt to go around.. the illegal will be taking a bigger and bigger share of it.
lazs
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on the subject
http://www.gmu.edu/departments/economics/wew/articles/05/reality.html
VICTIMHOOD: RHETORIC OR REALITY
As my colleague Tom Sowell pointed out in a recent column, "Liberals, Race and History," if the Democratic party's share of the black vote ever fell to even 70 percent, it's not likely that the Democrats would ever win the White House or Congress again. The strategy liberal Democrats have chosen, to prevent loss of the black vote, is to keep blacks paranoid and in a constant state of fear. But is it fear of racists, or being driven back to the plantation, that should be a top priority for blacks? Let's look at it.
What about the decline of the black family? In 1960, only 28 percent of black females between the ages of 15 and 44 were never married. Today, it's 56 percent. In 1940, the illegitimacy rate among blacks was 19 percent, in 1960, 22 percent, and today, it's 70 percent. Some argue that the state of the black family is the result of the legacy of slavery, discrimination and poverty. That has to be nonsense.
A study of 1880 family structure in Philadelphia shows that three-quarters of black families were nuclear families, comprised of two parents and children. In New York City in 1925, 85 percent of kin-related black households had two parents.
In fact, according to Herbert Gutman in "The Black Family in Slavery and Freedom: 1750-1925," "Five in six children under the age of 6 lived with both parents." Therefore, if one argues that what we see today is a result of a legacy of slavery, discrimination and poverty, what's the explanation for stronger black families at a time much closer to slavery -- a time of much greater discrimination and of much greater poverty? I think that a good part of the answer is there were no welfare and Great Society programs.
Only 30 to 40 percent of black males graduate from high school.
Across the U.S., black males represent up to 70 percent of prison populations.Department of Justice statistics for 2001 show that in nearly 80 percent of violent crimes against blacks, both the victim and the perpetrator were the same race.
-------------------------------
This is why I give a big rolling eyes to all the victimhood arguments..
Hell Midnight said it best, I even sig,ed it.
!
!
!
\/
"I am just a victim of my Liberalhoodedness. "midnight Target 7/23/2004
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If you want a black conservative economist point of view, you need to read.
Walter E Williams and
Thomas Sowell
Two leading Economist in the country.
http://www.jewishworldreview.com/cols/sowell1.asp
or
http://www.townhall.com/columnists/thomassowell/archive.shtml
http://www.jewishworldreview.com/cols/williams1.asp
or
http://www.gmu.edu/departments/economics/wew/articles.html
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I'm not sure what I'd suggest.. I'm not in your shoes, but in my experience the best rule of thumb is to just ignore the self-pity and listen only for the pertinent parts of the conversation. If the conversation is too full of the woe-is-me BS for you not to get aggravated by, or even nothing but that BS, just take a raincheck.
When it's worth taking the time to filter through what they're saying, keep at it, and if they ever choose to make their paranoid BS explicitly your fault, then show in a very down to earth or transparent common sense way (the same way you'd quote someone's posts on this forum when they won't admit they did in fact say something) it's them who's insisting on involving that BS into the otherwise normal conversation.
At that point they either (in my experience) go off the deep end, or recognize it. If the former, the useful part of the conversation's usualy over right away, the latter you can just accomodate them in whatever brief way will get them over the embarassement and get back to the important part of the conversation.
I'm completely sick of that BS. I've lived in France, and when I was small, I was a foreigner. I moved to Canada, and there I was a frenchie. Back to France and I'm a Canuck, or Arab :lol Moved to the US, and I'm a Frenchie again, or freakin latino. Now I'm on this island, and the locals here stubbornly categorize anyone who's not from the local's descendence and customs as "foreigner", even me who looks like them if you don't take your time to recognize all the other ancestry I have. And from there it's hands down, carte blanche BS blaming and whining and any self-pity, endless rationalizing of the same sort of crap you get from "those" blacks in the US.
It's a bit like the impatience of us that have gotten past and know better than that BS for those whiners, and in a way you could argue that it's fair game. I mean, they had/have their little island, it's homely to them, and like a lot of people justifiably defensive of their culture and sovereignty, they ought to strive for its continuation just like you ought to strive for your own survival. The problem though, is when they take it too far and trespass onto your own concerns. It's fine that they are different and want to keep it that way, but it isn't defensible to use it as an excuse to blame you for anything when you aren't even trying to interfere with their livelihood, when you are just trying to get things done without yourself trespassing on their concerns; i.e. what FX1 was doing recently for his real estate work.
It has nothing to do with ethnicity ("black" culture and memetics aside) and everything to do with individual psychology. It's just a ****in crutch and the wild card racism blame nearly always saves their ass. Anyone can play it anytime. A good analog is women or gays and sexual harassment. It's a path of least resistance abuse that's gotten a free ride all this time thanks to history (slavery etc).
Two wrongs don't make a right.
edit- Did you mean what word I'd suggest? Sorry for rambling then :p
I'd suggest black because it is the plainest, but that's less PC than african american, which itself is too PC. Negro is ok in spanish (commonly used IIRC, not sure about in the US though), and in French too. It's gotten a good dose of connotation in English though. I asked because it seemed like the sort of word that someone like you would have a hard time defending against the black-stigma.
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Originally posted by lazs2
leadpig... I am glad you feel the way you do. I find that I get along fine with older negros but that young ones...not so much... and ones who buy into the whole "black culture" thing... not at all. nada.. none.. even the older ones... if you scratch the surface you will get to the hate and socialism.
I feel for you and your pain at being a slave so recently... with brothers and sisters just released... My grandfather came from scotland and they would send the scotts down in the mine before the mules cause the mules were expensive.
ask around in any mining town about the history of the mines... the cotton field looks pretty good compared to our brand of slavery...
get over it. even you... seem unable to let it go...you brought it up fer christsakes! You proved my point... negros can't let it go and become part of America.. why should I bother with em if they keep dragging themselves down into the whole mess?
As for your contention that they are not all socialists.... maybe.. but I am for sure more accurate than you are... look at the voting records of negros...The colored vote is a given. it is a giveaway by people with a chip on their shoulder that drags them down.
Look as osamabama.... are you going to tell me that his voting record is not right out of some socialist pity pot agenda?
There are coloreds I would vote for. Shelby steele for instanace... a few other conservatives but... oddly enough... they are hated and vilified by their own race. And simply because they espouse having negros join America
lazs
Oh i'm over it, i just brought it up to point out the scars it's left on the generation before me, and how deeeep they are. I try to tell them things are much better, and deep down they know, but's it's tough for my mom for instance to forget, growing up in the middle of that. Of course some of those things are hard to forget, so you'll just have to understand it. It happens, time will come. As far as those folks that lean on it all the time, i don't get it. Truth is most folks nowadays are good and are not prejudiced, the world has really changed. Some folks run around like it's 1935 screaming racism all day i just wished they'd shut up, alot of the time it's not the case. Sometimes it is fishy however like in the Rodney King case, did they really have to beat the man that many times? But to go around hollering racism at every thing like Al Sharpton does, come on.
Never have i seen how things were still unequal than when the hurricane hit New Orleans. I noticed it, i don't know if too many Americans did. I noticed how it seemed that every person left, it seemed was black. It seemed like the uncovering of a great social divide, right in front of our eyes. It showed me how unequal things still are, deep down in the country. I had a number of white friends say why didn't they just leave? To ask that very question shows how much you don't get it, and almost becomes an answer in itself....The answer. Alot of those folks couldn't load up the suburban and head out to the family second home in the suburbs. Let alone afford a motel 6 for 1 night. I some times wonder how some of the poor white folks got out, and seemed to be alot of black folks left. A good question isn't it? Why what does that say?
I don't think you can blame all of that or even alot of it, on people blaming everyone else for their situation as alot of conservatives don't seem to understand. I think alot of them live in a bubble and don't really get the gravity of the situation. Worse off they seem to want to talk and tell everyone what their problem is instead of listening. I think alot of that situation in New Orleans showed the impact that our divisions, historical and contemporary are still causing, in front of our very eyes.
One musing before i go..
I had a girlfriend once, a white girl from a very affluent community. I saw freedoms i never knew possible from my youth, in living attitude, and economic structure. This girl however was from an addictive family, alcoholism and such, she was a cocaine addict. She relapsed as i knew her. I noticed how she was able to score, the drug. The funny thing was this, she used to drive down to the poor neighborhood i grew up in and buy drugs from black folks. Black folks that sold the drug because of an economic and collapsing poverty and a lack of hope that these people only knew since birth. She had the money, she wanted to buy drugs to escape the boring oppulence of her life, and also cause she could, they couldn't. These people sold the drugs, in a primal need for survival that they searched to supply their most basic hungers of life and shelter, that their situation provided them for. Quite a divide....what does that say about America? What is the flip there? If you took either group of people and put them in either situation the results would be the same. I pondered on that myself.
It's no excuse, but in finding the truth this question must at least be acknowledged.
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Oh, also Lasz ignore people who try to make you feel guilty, for what, being white?? The most ludicrous bolderdash i've ever heard. Such people have their own problems, don't bother with theirs. Just be a good guy and you have nothing to worry about. Anyone who tries to make you or anyone feel otherwise is in need of a major point of view and attitude adjustment.
Don't worry life usually supplies that. :)
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That's not exclusive to America. The slavery era was, and it's been over for centuries. Move on.
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You're a cool customer, Leadpig... This is exactly the sort of thinking that will make society more livable in the long run. All societies, not just ours.
I still get bent out of shape when somebody says 'Jew' with the intonation anywhere in my presence. Nevermind that people generally use that word/intonation combo to indicate that they got taken, were taken advantage of, or made a fool of by the target of the reference.
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Originally posted by moot
That's not exclusive to America. The slavery era was, and it's been over for centuries. Move on.
I agree, but like seismic waves from an earthquake, the waves do tend to move on, after the event. I think America is still noticing differences in status of life and economics of life, health, culture and everything else from this event. These peoples attitudes that people owe them something just makes it worse. If someone murders a family member, is it worth it to get revenge. Well your family member will still be dead, you can satisfy some internal selfish urge by holding on but it ultimately does no good. Just know this when you tell people from such families how easy it is too move on.
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I don't get it. What families?
Are you saying that something that doesn't make sense can make sense if the conditions are dramatic enough?
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Well, I have to say that Leadpig did a great job of stating the point.
I know I sometimes become flippant and I might even go a step too far in this regard. I know that most people in here are not racists and I am sure most have good hearts. I sometimes see things regarding race that come from the urge to protect those around me from discrimination. Sometimes, no, most of the time people don't even realize they are treating people unequally. Please understand that it happens more frequently than you might think, and that we should all strive to treat everyone equally.
I'm off the soap box.
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Yep, equally. Which means you disregard ethnicity as though you were blind to it. The whole "I'm black so I can be an ******* because of you/them" goes out the window with other braindead BS like the anti-war hippy retards' rhetoric.
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Originally posted by Neubob
Ok wait just a damned minute... All jokes aside, does the word 'negro' have any negative connotation at all? Isn't just as offensive as, say, 'caucasian' or 'asian'?
Note: This is not meant to incite anger. I honestly want to know.
Actually, the term afro-American or xxxx-American for that matter irritates me.
My paternal great-grandparents were Italian-American, my maternal great-grandparents were German-American. They were Italians/Germans who moved here and made this their home. In addition, they were proud to call themselves Americans (sans prefix), once they received their citizenship!
If you were born here, you are an American, period. What I am also sick of are the whiners that claim "I can't do this cause the man puts me down for being white, black, asain, purple, etc" Only YOU have the power to change your own destiny. I served in the Army during the first "vacation" we went on in the Middle East. I served with, commanded, and was commanded by blacks, whites, jewish folks, muslims, you name it. I was proud to call all of them my comrades in arms. I also learned a lot about many different cultures and their customs. When involved in a live firefight I, personally gave a rats hind end what color or race they were. As far as I was concerned they were all Army issue green (or desert camo chocolate chips in this case), and as long as we all had each other's six covered, thats all I ever needed to know.
No matter where a canidate is from, I don't care what there sex, color of their skin, or sexual orientation, etc is as long as it it Red, White, and Blue. If you have what it takes to do the task at hand (in this case, being president) then go for it. I will vote for the least idiotic person regardless of race, religion, etc.
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Originally posted by LEADPIG
[BI don't see anything wrong with the word negro. It's the official word for black person. Just like caucasian is for white.
If you meant no harm from it, you wouldn't have no problem. If you did, then you'd probably have a problem. Depending on how you handled said situation.
[/B]
I think technically the term you are referring to is Negroid...when attempting to correlate it to "caucasian".
You second comment I agree with wholeheartedly. If you think lazs was being "PC" though you obviously haven't been posting here too long.
He was just being lazs...not PC.
:)
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ledpig and moot... I very much agree with you that it is best to just walk away once the conversation gets off topic and onto the whole self pity race thing but..
We all have different ideas of what the self pity race thing is... to me... ledpig... you would make my eyes glaze over with the whole poor new orleans picked on negros and the poor rodney king thing... I don't think there was anymore mistreatment there than anywhere... what irked me was the reaction to it...
All out of proportion and all race based. I knew white guys that were hospitalized... bikers.. when they "resisted arrest" I didn't see the white community rioting and burning the place down... there were white folks in new orleans that lost everything... most due to their own stupidity but.... they didn't loot and rob...
a white is 7 times more likely to be a victim of a black perpetrated violent crime than vice versa but how many blacks are convicted of hate crimes?
you can't be around any negro for any length of time before he brings up race and... in a negative way... some example of how rough he has it because of his race. that has been my experiance... most, like you for instance... hardly even realize they are doing it but listen to yourself.... sheesh... I don't even want to know how you feel about vic and oj.
lazs
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See?
;)
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Originally posted by lazs2
you can't be around any negro for any length of time before he brings up race and... in a negative way... some example of how rough he has it because of his race.
Since part of racism is grouping people together by their race and saying something like "all Asians are ...", then the above quote is racist.
That being said, anybody who has a problem with the term Negro should not take money from, or give any money to, the United Negro College Fund.
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Lazs,
Leadpig's bringing up race because that was the topic here. It's sort of hard not to when the whole conversation centers on the pitfalls of attempted equality in this country, namely the hypocrisy of forced race relations.
He's answered all the questions without getting defensive, and has cited very plausible reasons for why others do. Before this thread, in fact, I had no idea he was a 'Negro'. Frankly, I don't know what the problem is.
That being said, I haven't run into too many black people who are this way. I started to notice it years ago, when, as a young child, I started hearing some of the early rappers pounding their chests in public forums, screaming about the 400 some odd years that slavery existed (they never could seem to come up with a number they agreed on, but it was always at least a century or two more than historically possible).
Today I'm in law school, and the black students I go to class with generally whine and complain about the current inequalities more than anyone I've ever met(rappers included)--all this despite the fact that they have dozens of organizations and scholarships created specifically and exclusively for them--organizations that I have no access to at all. Mind you, these are kids in their 20s, not grandparents in their 70s, and yet the fact that their test scores and grades are on average lower is still the fault of the white man, not the man that raised them.
It is a bunch of bull****, as all this whining and complaining effectively turns them into their own latest and biggest oppressor.
I haven't seen leadpig making any of these excuses, however. Being bind to race is hard, but he's made it easier.
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On a related note, apparently Isaih Thomas has some opinions on who can say what to whom
white man calling a black woman ***** (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20824797/)
Simply astounding.
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NAACP, National Association for the Advancement of Colored People.
who dem colored people? :confused:
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I honestly believe that it would be good for this country to have a president who is someone other than a wealthy, white, Republican or Democrat, Christian male.
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And yes, I'd vote for this guy:
(http://www.alaska-in-pictures.com/data/media/21/inupiat-eskimo-hunter_2127.jpg)
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J.C. Watts from Oaklahoma.....I like that guy.
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Originally posted by eskimo2
I honestly believe that it would be good for this country to have a president who is someone other than a wealthy, white, Republican or Democrat, Christian male.
Farrakhan?
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Originally posted by LEADPIG
I think Lasz was just trieing to be PC
:rofl
Anyone need sig material????????
This could be a record breaker of eBay.
:lol :rofl
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Originally posted by moot
I don't get it. What families?
Are you saying that something that doesn't make sense can make sense if the conditions are dramatic enough?
Moot what if you were Jewish and i told you. "The Holocaust, get over it that was 55 years ago, so your Grandmother was gased in a chamber, big deal move on".
I would think i was being a bit flippant in those statements, an not very understanding or compassionate. I'm not the type to tell anyone to "Just get over it" of something of which i know nothing about. I respect people an let them have their time. I'm not that arrogant.
However people that try to make you feel guilty about something like that are ridiculous. Please don't use them as your basis, for a whole group, in truth there are no groups. For instance, i don't believe that.
They should move on and "Get over it" as you say. However that is not for you to say, and is easy for you to say. Just understand that point and leave it alone, it's not your problem, nor should people try to make it your problem.
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Originally posted by john9001
NAACP, National Association for the Advancement of Colored People.
who dem colored people? :confused:
John, do you have any idea you are exposing yourself more and more with every post?
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Originally posted by lazs2
ledpig and moot... I very much agree with you that it is best to just walk away once the conversation gets off topic and onto the whole self pity race thing but..
We all have different ideas of what the self pity race thing is... to me... ledpig... you would make my eyes glaze over with the whole poor new orleans picked on negros and the poor rodney king thing... I don't think there was anymore mistreatment there than anywhere... what irked me was the reaction to it...
All out of proportion and all race based. I knew white guys that were hospitalized... bikers.. when they "resisted arrest" I didn't see the white community rioting and burning the place down... there were white folks in new orleans that lost everything... most due to their own stupidity but.... they didn't loot and rob...
a white is 7 times more likely to be a victim of a black perpetrated violent crime than vice versa but how many blacks are convicted of hate crimes?
you can't be around any negro for any length of time before he brings up race and... in a negative way... some example of how rough he has it because of his race. that has been my experiance... most, like you for instance... hardly even realize they are doing it but listen to yourself.... sheesh... I don't even want to know how you feel about vic and oj.
lazs
With the NewOrleans thing i was trying to illustrate, the differences in the people that were left behind. What does that say about America. What do you think are the lingering effects of our society that have caused that. What do you think the reason was Lasz? In answering that question i'd imagine you'd answer my question and your question and illustrate the divides still between us as people without even knowing it. I'll give you my ideas about it when you finish. We can all finish this and understand each other together. If we all did this, we could all move the world along quite further in understanding, if we all did that one simple thing.
As far as the Rodney King thing. Remember when the rapper Ice-T came out with the song "Cop Killer". Remember how Dan Quayle and alot of the republican establishment didn't get it. They attacked Ice-T instead of realizing why such an angry song was made. If i was president, i would realize that art and culture is an excellent way for exposing how parts of a society feel deep down inside, and whats really going on, between us. I would take that as saying something.
Here's the reason.... Ice-T made that song to expose an amount of harrasment that was going on in LA that most of conservative white America wasn't getting at the time. Why weren't they "getting it"? Because they didn't live in South Central LA and weren't getting beat by billy clubs regularly. Yet it never ceased to amaze me how quickly they were willing to get up and speak for those people and tell them what was really wrong with them, without listening to them or really hearing what they were expressing for themselves. There's alway been a certain amount of arrogance to conservatism that i just couldn't understand.
Anyway, that song was an angry outlash against a bad situation that had been stirring for years. It was no more different than someone, crying out in pain after being punched in the face. But Quayle didn't get that, or Bush senior. So instead of realizing what was really goin on and fixing that, they attacked Ice-T instead, the messenger. The result "Bam" a social explosion.
I didn't agree with the way Ice-T expressed his concern, i felt like there would be those easily swayed souls that would take that sarcastic, fantasy, inspired song and actually go hurt cops with it. Which was not the point of the song. As far as people burning LA and going crazy, i can understand it, i don't agree with it, but i understand. It was the lid being blown off a pressure cooker that those folks had been under for awhile. The Rodney King beating was just one example of a situation that had been going on for awhile. If you don't believe that, i'd say go live in South Central La for awhile, you might, think differently. Untill then don't be so quick to judge.
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Originally posted by RedTop
J.C. Watts from Oaklahoma.....I like that guy.
It's "Oklahoma" Dumbarse....
BTW we need a RedHeaded President!!!
:D
Mac
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Originally posted by AWMac
It's "Oklahoma" Dumbarse....
BTW we need a RedHeaded President!!!
:D
Mac
Carrot Top 2008.
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Originally posted by LEADPIG
Moot what if you were Jewish and i told you. "The Holocaust, get over it that was 55 years ago, so your Grandmother was gased in a chamber, big deal move on".
I'd agree. Some of my family that I was born just too late to know went through camps. One of my grandfathers served in both world wars.
I haven't had the KKK burn family members, or any houses of theirs, but I did have giant swastikas painted on the side of a house I lived in, I did go to a school deep in french countryside where pretty much 2/3's of the people were blatantly of the opinion that brownies and anyone not french were sub-human. I lived through the routine of going to school everyday, knowing the efforts I made would most likely not be recognized, etc.
I had my father be denied entry to shops and restaurants... heck I could go on.
I could even go as far as saying my ancesters were eradicated (indians), or enslaved (africans), just as much as I could say that this very day I'm persecuted for things I haven't done, e.g. representing the french ("the man") here on this ex-slavery island, by merely speaking formal french instead of the local dialect.
Not for me to say
That's bunk. Who's for it to say, then? Can I just keep grieving about some past occurence that is cold hard, immutable history, and insist that others buy into it too? And call it unfair if they don't? You may not say it in too rough a way, you might have to sugar coat it, but it will always boil down to the same thing.
**** happens. Get over it.. Adapt or die.
There's nothing arrogant about that, it's the truth. If someone's denying it and insists on wallowing in their own pity, then they're doing themselves a disservice.
it's not your problem, nor should people try to make it your problem.
Exactly. So when you've got (almost) a whole culture grounded on and furthering the idea that it should be others' problem, and it's commercialized and taken as gospel, it's hard not to see it for the big bloated bag of acne that it is, ready to burst with BS at the slightest poke of reason.
Life is as good as you make it.
edit- in fact, about half-way through my visit to a holocaust museum (back in early high school, complete with nazi torture tools, etc), I had a strong aversion to what I saw but "big deal move on" was pretty much what I concluded, especialy after some classmates went all frothy about those ****in nazis. WTF was the sense in that? Turn the same way as the racists were? That's a perpetual cycle.
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ledpig... you prove my point.
When I look at new orleans I look at what happened... I seen a colored run city with a high crime rate and people living off crime and handouts and when a disaster struck I seen the dregs that stayed behind looting and robbing and raping and brutalizing each other.... I seen colored cops robbing a walmart. I seen looters taking stuff that had nothing to do with survival.
When I seen rodney king I seen a man who was a career criminal and was loaded and attacking cops... if it were me when I was a biker I would have been beaten just as bad. maybe worse. I seen the colored people of that city burn their city to the ground and then wait in line at a burned out welfare office cheeping and begging like little baby birdies after spending the last week burning and beating and killing... they went from feral to beggars.
I seen asians in the same area with rifles defending their property. They lived there too.
I heard my grandfather talk about the mines and the company stores... he didn't hate... he didn't get welfare.. he just worked his way out. I did not grow up rich... I know what it is to be a criminal. I know whose fault that is sooo.... your example about the white girl and what would happen if we all switched places.... well... I have done it... guess what... I worked my way out. And what help does a white get with all this "racism"? I have seen affirmative action and it sure as hell don't help anyone who looks like me.
my point is that I see the event... you see reasons for the event... since we really can't ever know all the reasons for something.... talking to you (people like you) is frustrating for me... listening to excuses for behavior that is inexcusable is not something that I can tolerate.
The lessons I learned from being a criminal and a biker was.... clean up your act before you go whining about how everyone is discriminating against you.... I would say to your race... clean up your act before you go whining about how everyone is discriminating against you.
In fact... I would say that a negro has it better than I did.... If he cleans up his act he has more opportunity than I had... more of a chance to get ahead with AA and all. I would say that cleaned up negros who try to fit in have way less real bigotry aimed at them than they imagine.
lazs
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Originally posted by lazs2
I would say that cleaned up negros who try to fit in have way less real bigotry aimed at them than they imagine.
lazs
Maybe so, but they also have way more bigotry aimed at them than you imagine. I didn't quote your entire post, cause I hate that, but I think it speaks volumes. You see colored people doing this or colored people doing that and you assign a behavior to an entire race of people based on the color of the skin of the people you see on TV. It would be just as logical to say that you saw curly haired people doing this or that and assigning a behavior to all people with curly hair.
What you really saw were the poorest people in our country. You saw people who were desperate and undereducated and hungry and yes even criminally minded in some cases. You saw some who were victims of horrible circumstance and some who were taking advantage of the situation.
Unfortunately all you chose to register in your mind was the color of the skin on those people. Bigotry in any form is wrong.
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Nonetheless it is a trend MT. Even if it does break down at the individual level.
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A trend based on race? Sorry, but that is just silly.
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No it isn't. Japanese culture until recently was unique to their island, whose population was nearly perfectly japanese in ethnicity. All the people conformed to the average of that population's characteristics, characteristics which couldn't be found anywhere else. You could in fact say that that population followed trends exclusive to it.
Like you said, "desperate and undereducated and hungry" can be applied to some of the NO population. If a sufficiently large portion of a population conforms to a certain profile such as the above, then you can in fact say so. It isn't exclusive to black, but it is prevalent and it is a trend.
It's not a trend brought on by their race, but (and this is the important part I think) by their own will. But that's another story. In both the japanese and the black examples, you could argue that the race caused the trend or vice versa, but either way the trend exists.
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no mt.. what I see is people of a color going feral in every case... over and over and then I see people like you making excuses for em and saying that such behavior is uncommon and that they had no choice and that it was not their fault.
I see people of other races living in the same areas under the same conditions not going feral. I don't claim to know the reason and I most certainly do not claim that every single negro is exactly the same. I do claim that the truth is that.... for whatever reason.... the negro is more prone to going feral... more prone to being a criminal... more prone to attack other races.
I also note that the more excuses and welfare and "help" the worse it is for a large segment of the population... those who do well and use the help exist for sure but... there is a very large segment who get worse not better.
I also think that it is you who is painting me with a broad brush... you say that I see all negros as the same.
I think it is you who is painting with a broad brush.. you see victims everywhere where victims do not exist. I was not a "victim" when I was a criminal and a biker. These are not victims the ones who stay in a riot zone and loot. Be it over a hurricane or a beating or a trial verdict or a basketball game.... the rioters are simply feral people needing an excuse to do what they want to do anyway... you are helping them stay just the way they are too... You tell them.."it's ok... it's not your fault."
It sure as hell is their fault...from beggining to end.
To answer ledpigs question about what would happen if whites and negros switched positions... in a few years.... everything would go back to the way it is now.. with badly run colored areas and cities full of criminals and whites hustling money and sending kids to school... my grandfather never went past the third grade fer chrisakes... he coulda just wallowed in it I guess.... you would say he was a "victim" I suppose.
lazs
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Just as kids can be brought up to hate jews and to believe that martyring themselves is what they are meant to do, given their genetic heritage, you can be brought up to think you are meant to burden yourself with the (incidentaly self-prophecized) stigma of other people similar enough to you (that you don't think to question whether it's a valid reason), that lived today or decades ago.
"Don't make a ***** act like a *****", or something like that. Tailor made memes that some people never manage to recognize as erroneous, because they never think of themselves individualy enough. You aren't your race, but some people will work really hard to renounce that truth.
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moot.. I agree but I don't see it happening... I think it has to do with socialism.. the lack of individual identity. quit identifying yourself with a race and others will too....
Don't defend the actions of people of your race that are indefensable and you will be taken seriously. When you defend based on victimhood and excuse based on race... you make everyone a racist.
I think that I am probly the least racist person I know... but I am a realist.
lazs
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Originally posted by moot
No it isn't. Japanese culture until recently was unique to their island, whose population was nearly perfectly japanese in ethnicity. All the people conformed to the average of that population's characteristics, characteristics which couldn't be found anywhere else. You could in fact say that that population followed trends exclusive to it.
Like you said, "desperate and undereducated and hungry" can be applied to some of the NO population. If a sufficiently large portion of a population conforms to a certain profile such as the above, then you can in fact say so. It isn't exclusive to black, but it is prevalent and it is a trend.
It's not a trend brought on by their race, but (and this is the important part I think) by their own will. But that's another story. In both the japanese and the black examples, you could argue that the race caused the trend or vice versa, but either way the trend exists.
If you took two groups of people and threw them each on a deserted island for 10 years and came back later. I'd imagine the people would have developed a unique and very individual culture and way of life on each island. Sure there would be similiarities because they are human, but there would be differences caused by their isolation. Countries, governments, laws, religions, culture, speach, art, and the differences in them have alot to do with this. However color or any other such superficial characteristics wouldn't figure much into it, except how close or far away said islands happened to be to the equator.
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Originally posted by texasmom
If there's a black guy out there who's worth my vote, fine. If not, fine. Gotta earn that vote.. and it ain't earned by being born with one skin color or another.
*edit* removed some stuff
^ i second that.
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Saying that you saw stuff on TV news as being absolute evidence of something...particularly when you then ascribe that evidence to an entire race of people is really really funny lazs.
Are you THAT much of a media stooge?
I bet you didn't flinch when you saw CNN describe the white couple who "found" food supplies and the shot of the black kid "looting" food supplies.
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Originally posted by lazs2
moot.. I agree but I don't see it happening... I think it has to do with socialism.. the lack of individual identity. quit identifying yourself with a race and others will too....
Don't defend the actions of people of your race that are indefensable and you will be taken seriously. When you defend based on victimhood and excuse based on race... you make everyone a racist.
I think that I am probly the least racist person I know... but I am a realist.
lazs
Looking for the answers behind situations is never a bad thing. Finding answers and blaming your behaviour on them can be. We as humans have that very important thing called free will.
For instance if i knew someone and i did something disrespecting to them and that person got angry at me about it. I would simply just not off the bat blame that person and say they were wrong. I would most likely listen to what they had to say and their reasons and analyze my own actions to get a better understanding. It is possible i could have been rude or disrespecting without even knowing it. Such analysis and reasoning is not wrong and dosen't consist of me blaming a situation. It consists of me wanting to get down to the bottom and understand the heart of a matter.
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Originally posted by Curval
Saying that you saw stuff on TV news as being absolute evidence of something...particularly when you then ascribe that evidence to an entire race of people is really really funny lazs.
Are you THAT much of a media stooge?
I bet you didn't flinch when you saw CNN describe the white couple who "found" food supplies and the shot of the black kid "looting" food supplies.
Now that's a good point especially the last part, thats just funny...:D
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Originally posted by lazs2
quit identifying yourself with a race and others will too....
Don't defend the actions of people of your race that are indefensable and you will be taken seriously. When you defend based on victimhood and excuse based on race... you make everyone a racist.
lazs
Very good point Lasz...:aok
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Originally posted by moot
No it isn't. Japanese culture until recently was unique to their island, whose population was nearly perfectly japanese in ethnicity. All the people conformed to the average of that population's characteristics, characteristics which couldn't be found anywhere else. You could in fact say that that population followed trends exclusive to it.
Sure, but those characteristics occurred because of the isolation, feudal system, availability of natural resources, terrain, weather... etc. etc. NOT because they were asian.
Just as the actions / reactions of the people in NO were due to factors both in and out of their control.... but they did not react that way simply because their race dictated it. This is not an excuse as lazs would say, just an observation.
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Originally posted by lazs2
I think it has to do with socialism..
You know what.. when I first returned to France, that was one of the first things I thought. The crappy state of things definitely all stemmed from socialism, somehow.
LEADPIG, I don't mean to cop out, but there's no doubt to me that there's a corelation between appearance and personality. Color of skin, local environment etc do play a part in the evolution of culture because culture is just the mosaic of all its authoring people.
E.G. You wouldn't find (given large enough sample of parallel universes) white europeans' culture and folklore etc perfectly matching that of africans, no matter how many times you rolled the dice.
The one and only real common trait among all humans is reason.
MT you have to look further up the chain of events. Facial expression alone is itself a pretty big factor in the development of personality, as well as in interaction with others. So it does play a part in the eventual culture produced by people's livelihood.
I think it's a pretty primitive force, but it still exists today nonetheless.
It's not so much their race that dictated it, but their conforming to that archetype that made it happen. I'm simplifying things so you can see what the distinction I'm making is. I'm not saying people of a certain ethnicity are predetermined to a certain future, but that they are predisposed to it if they don't realize that their appearance or heritage doesn't take precedence over their own individual will.
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Originally posted by midnight Target
What you really saw were the poorest people in our country. You saw people who were desperate and undereducated and hungry and yes even criminally minded in some cases. You saw some who were victims of horrible circumstance and some who were taking advantage of the situation.
Unfortunately all you chose to register in your mind was the color of the skin on those people. Bigotry in any form is wrong.
The reason is that the state of being poor doesn't stick out, to the eye, the same way the state of being of a certain color does. That and the unarguable fact that in this country, a black man is statistically more likely to be poor, more likely to wind up in prison, than a white man. If this is not common knowledge, it is certainly common suspicion.
Now the reason why black people are more likely to suffer from poverty, or be jailed, is the root of all this bigotry. If they are at fault for the cycles of poverty and criminal behavior, then the bad reputation they earn their entire race isn't quite so shocking, now is it?
You can't blame a common observer for playing the odds in making a character judgment based on skin-color when this character judgment, as much as you hate it, is more often right than wrong.
If they are innocent, however, and fall into these cycles because of somebody else, then yes, the pigeonholing is very cruel--to those that managed to avoid these oppressions, as well, as especially to those who have fallen into them.
So the question is, who or what is at the root of this social situation, and please don't tell me that the statistics lie.
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Originally posted by AWMac
BTW we need a RedHeaded President!!!
:D
Mac
What... you respect Thomas Jefferson?
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Originally posted by Holden McGroin
What... you respect Thomas Jefferson?
Thomas Jefferson was red headed??
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Yup
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Was he a step-child?
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Originally posted by moot
LEADPIG, I don't mean to cop out, but there's no doubt to me that there's a corelation between appearance and personality. Color of skin, local environment etc do play a part in the evolution of culture because culture is just the mosaic of all its authoring people.
E.G. You wouldn't find (given large enough sample of parallel universes) white europeans' culture and folklore etc perfectly matching that of africans, no matter how many times you rolled the dice.
I think a person's personality determines their appearance, i.e. the way they dress and such. I don't think their appearance, race or otherwise determines their personality. Local environment plays a huge part in culture, while i think color of skin plays hardly any at all, if at all. You seem to be making the assumption of all because a certain group with a certain skin color is most often seen acting in such a way. In reality the color has nothing to do with it, it's just that society and nature has made us group together either because of where we live, or because of the fact that man's shallow eye can't see past color and it causes us to seperate ourselves. When we seperate ourselves, local traditions and cultures are born. Why does it seem like race or color is a deciding factor? It's because man decides to seperate himself along such inconsequential borders, and doesn't realize it, and then thinks race is the reason.
Ever see a black fellow from Britain talk and you can't tell the difference from the whitest white guy from the U.K. around. Or hear a white guy raised in Africa, and have the blackest, black African accent around. It's not the race, it's how we see ourselves, seperate ourselves, and develop our cultures because of this.
You ought to see me lol. I don't like rap, don't talk in ebonics, don't wear baggy pants, and don't blame "The man". lol
I'm almost the opposite, although i was raised around, all black people, till about 14 or 15, in a very urban, ghetto environment, amidst drive by shootings, and friends in jail. What i had, was most important, parents that cared, a good home, a way to get out, (grandparents had a big home in the country). Most kids i knew had none of this. They were like th folks in the New Orleans flood, which is why i understood it.
I remember going to a friends house to ask if he could stay over the night. I went into the house (apartment in the projects) with him to ask and was confronted with about 7 brothers and sisters all wild in a house with no mom or dad. Mom was on crack, dad was in jail. Poverty like you wouldn't believe, hardly no furniture, house was dark, and low on everything. I asked if it was ok, the oldest sister said fine, (she's about 17 and running the house).
Why was everyone poor in the house? A number of reasons. One is, their mom and dad came from a house that was born in the 50's and 60's, mass discrimination, no rights, lynchings, a black man could get killed and the police thought it was a joke, ok bad time, not their fault, America was just screwed up. Go back another generation, your in the 20's and 30's, oh boy that's even worse, go back again, it's the 1800's even worse. Then it's mom was a freed slave, and their parents were born into slavery. So these people were born into a bad situation not of their own doing, and what does that cause? A lack of hope, no hope you have failure, crime, it's not good. Was all that those people's fault? No. Alot of it was America's fault and all the reprecussions that it's affinity for slavery and racism caused, and were're still seeing those effects today. That's one of the things the flood in New Orleans exposed. It's not all of America's fault, it's just getting so people who came from that background can get outta that mess. But after America sucker kicks you in the balls that hard, it's gonna be hard to get up.
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nice theory ledpig but that is all it is.... it matters not if you or your parents were picked on because of your appearance... it has been decades... You looked at a situation where everyone in the house was doing drugs and there were 7 illigitimate kids and you made them..... victims.... victims? see... you and I will never agree. They are making victims of themselves for no good reason.
lazs
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curval... I know that you are not from here but... the "media" is not the only info we get... I don't think that anyone here on this board will say that the riots over rodney king or the looting in new orleans or any of the basketball riots were white riots or did not have 99% blacks.
as for whites looting... I would shoot a white trying to loot just as soon as I would anyone else... no problem there. But.... if one white was looting out of say....every 10,000 and if 999 negros were looting out of every few thousand... I might act differently when seeing a group of whites compared to seeing a group of negros in that situation.
I would be cautious in any case tho.
The FBI stats are what they are also... the crime rate is much higher for some races... negros commit over half the homicides in this country for instance and are 7 times more likely to attack whites than vice versa.
you would be foolish to ignore these stats and to say that you were at no more risk being around one race than the other.
you don't see whites burning their neighborhoods to the ground over a verdict or some slight... the "media" has nothing to do with it.
lazs
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USA Today- The Rev. Jesse Jackson criticized Sen. Barack Obama, D-Ill., for "acting like he's white" when it comes to the case of six young blacks who were charged with crimes in Jena, La., according to The (Charleston, S.C.) State.
Obama, a Democratic presidential candidate, issued what the civil rights leader describes as a tepid response to the case, The State reports. “If I were a candidate, I’d be all over Jena,” Jackson tells the paper after giving a speech in Columbia SC.
Saying that somebody should act a certain way because of his race is apparently not racism.
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Originally posted by lazs2
nice theory ledpig but that is all it is.... it matters not if you or your parents were picked on because of your appearance... it has been decades... You looked at a situation where everyone in the house was doing drugs and there were 7 illigitimate kids and you made them..... victims.... victims? see... you and I will never agree. They are making victims of themselves for no good reason.
lazs
They were born victims pretty much and then have to work their way out of a really bad situation that America put them in, and there still recovering from. Just as sure as a crack baby is born and then someone says. "Don't take crack, it's easy for me not to do it, what's your problem, what are you weak or something? Answer.. i wasn't born a crack baby.
I'm surprised the Jewish made it back from the Holacaust so quickly and strongly. I wouldn't want to go toe to toe with Israel right now. They ain't taking no watermelon from no one lol... I love that about them. :) But i feel like they haven't been wallowing in their depression as much either. Of coarse the Holacaust wasn't a couple hundred yeeeeeaaars of social and racial rape of a people either.
Dangit where's your compassion and understanding Lasz? Just because you say something like that about soneone doesn't mean there're complete victims. Just a bit disadvantaged, that's all.
It's like the way people used to make fun of how black folks talked and their inability to read. When they weren't, by law, allowed too. Well what do they expect? It's not a theory Lasz, it still hasn't reached an equal level. When my mom tells me of being called ****** and not being allowed to vote. That ain't too long ago, that's just one generation removed. The civil rights movement wasn't that long ago in the whole scheme of things. That's when things first started to change from the way they were before, from hundreds of years before that. Reversing a couple hundred years of wrongs ain't gonna take over night. 30 or 40 years ain't a drop in the bucket to that. So come on Lasz understand that one point and we can move it along another ten minutes. I'll get the black folks to understand that they are not victims anymore, and we can move the time up to 20 minutes closer to total equality. I can't tell which is going to be harder, convincing you, or convincing them..:p
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Originally posted by Holden McGroin
Saying that somebody should act a certain way because of his race is apparently not racism.
Oh come on Jesse Jackson "acting like he's white" i hate that statement, from a man that should know better. Anybody who had the guts to walk alongside Martin Luther King in the heat of the civil rights movement, when it wasn't very popular, or good for your health, oughto know better.
I wished they'd hold off a little bit before they declare everything racism. Things aren't as bad as they used to be Jesse, most folks are good. Maybe he has post traumtic stress disorder from the bad old days and is just flinching at everything. If i was standing next to my friend on a balcony and saw him get shot over that crap, i might be jumpy too.
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Originally posted by LEADPIG
But i feel like they haven't been wallowing in their depression as much either. Of coarse the Holacaust wasn't a couple hundred yeeeeeaaars of social and racial rape of a people either.
No, it wasn't. What it was was just a couple years of wholesale industrialized slaughter, immediately preceded and followed by a period of passive and active persecution that has persisted for a couple millenia now. Starting with the Romans, and carried on, most recently, by Mel Gibson (Mel Gibson I mention only jokingly).
I know you weren't born a crack-baby, leadpig... You mentioned that in the beginning of the quoted post, but how much of it did you have to smoke to make that comparison with a straight face?
The Jews were never victims because they never allowed themselves to be treated like victims. Not now and not 15 minutes after the holocaust ended. Yes, they're known to ***** and moan from time to time, but when it comes down to it, the Jews always took care of each other, and took care of business. Their special interest groups were their families and friends, not bleeding heart hippies who acted out of pity and a total lack of understanding--to put a bandaid on a gaping headwound.
Why, I wonder, was the approach that much different?
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Originally posted by Neubob
No, it wasn't. What it was was just a couple years of wholesale industrialized slaughter, immediately preceded and followed by a period of passive and active persecution that has persisted for a couple millenia now. Starting with the Romans, and carried on, most recently, by Mel Gibson (Mel Gibson I mention only jokingly).
I know you weren't born a crack-baby, leadpig... You mentioned that in the beginning of the quoted post, but how much of it did you have to smoke to make that comparison with a straight face?
The Jews were never victims because they never allowed themselves to be treated like victims. Not now and not 15 minutes after the holocaust ended. Yes, they're known to ***** and moan from time to time, but when it comes down to it, the Jews always took care of each other, and took care of business. Their special interest groups were their families and friends, not bleeding heart hippies who acted out of pity and a total lack of understanding--to put a bandaid on a gaping headwound.
Why, I wonder, was the approach that much different?
Yea Neaubob i can't decide which was worse. Honestly i think i would have rather been a slave compared to the holacaust. Picking coton don't seem so bad compared to that lol. Yea i wasn't really talking about the milenia of bigotry on Jews, sheesh, how could i have forgot that!!....:confused: :O
And also i don't know what it was but the Jewish people pulling themselves up after that atrocity so quickly i think is one of the seven wonders of the world. I respect Israel immensely. I tell ya one thing if Hitler tried that crap now he'd have another thing coming that's for sure. I wondered why the slavery ancestors can't do that. Seem to be more a center on family and pulling together with the Holacaust survivors. I wish you could bottle some of that strength and sale it honestly. But i don't think anyone would want to pay the price.
S~:aok
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There are plenty of little hitler still out there, trying to get big. Call them Islamists, call them Neonazis, call them crazy Russian nationalists. And they all have plenty of work to do, to.... I guess you can say that the cool thing about anti-semitism is that thanks to the Jews' resilience, it can come back into vogue very quickly.
That's the price I think you're talking about, but then again, we've all got our own sack of potatoes to haul around.
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is this topic still going.
on a lighter note WHAT ABOUT THEM 49ERS:aok
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Originally posted by kilz
is this topic still going.
on a lighter note WHAT ABOUT THEM 49ERS:aok
I like Dem Cowboys Kilz, and Texans. Hey... I'm Texan ok. :D
On a lighter note. I wonder if different color hamsters discriminate against each other?? :rolleyes:
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"Of coarse the Holacaust wasn't a couple hundred yeeeeeaaars of social and racial rape of a people either.".
Careful. Jews have been persecuted for THOUSANDS of years. Next time you happen to pick up a bible read the old testament. One example would be Moses leading the Israelites out of Egypt. Why was he doing this? Because they had been set free from slavery...until of course the Egyptians changed their minds (bad move on their part as it turned out).
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ledpig...we can't bring the topic into the present because you refuse to... you continue to excuse the inexcuseable by bringing up the past... they are not victims... the rioters are not victims... rodney king was not a "victim" any more than anyone who gets beat up by the cops. OJ is not a victim.
everyone who came to America was treated badly.. the Irish and the Scots and the italian and the Jews always were and still are... jews are treated with contempt here from time to time and are called deragatory names to rival your poor colored "victims".
You want to have a conversation then don't bring up the past as an excuse for anything. I would have to walk away from you if you started spouting the crap you are here while we were meeting in person... if I couldn't walk away I would just glaze over.
In the world I live in... the present... you are not a victim... you get special treatment in jobs and loans and in the media... you commit most of the crime and riots... you have some of the highest illigitimacy rates and refuse to learn in school... Denounce your "black leaders" for the racists that they are...work on those things and keep the past out of it... treat the rest of us with some respect and you will earn ours.
Quit being thugs and quit whining and we can work from there.
lazs
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Admit it, Lasz, you've got a bigger-than-life poster of Jesse Jackson pasted to the ceiling over your bed.
Admit it!
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Originally posted by Neubob
Admit it, Lasz, you've got a bigger-than-life poster of Jesse Jackson pasted to the ceiling over your bed.
Admit it!
I whack off to mine regularly.... :rolleyes:
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I'm not saying that it's an excuse for anything Lasz. I'm just saying that it's a tough situation that's all. I feel compassion for anyone who goes through a tough situation, particularly that was not their doing in the first place. I have understanding, doesn't mean i condone it though. Same way if a woman killed her husband after years of mental and terrible physical abuse by an alcholic *******. I understand what drove her to that point and have compassion for her and the situation, especially if the guy was an evil abusive bastard, but i don't condone such an action or excuse it.
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so... all you need is a few generations under your belt to go from slavery to presidential candidate, and your excuse is what?
no doubt the day after slavery was abolished the vast majority of slaves flocked to the best schools and universities and were all welcomed with open arms.
those that deny slavery has no residual effects are just as dishonest as those that use it for their main crutch.
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Originally posted by LEADPIG
Why was everyone poor in the house?
See answer below.
Mom was on crack, dad was in jail.
OK here is our plan to better ourselves. I`ll go screw up and get put in jail. You go suck on a crack pipe.
That should do it.
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You need to give Black men a break, Lazs... They have to deal with this, afterall:
(http://www.aolcdn.com/ch_bv/new-york-flavor-of-love-400a091906.jpg)
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Originally posted by Torque
no doubt the day after slavery was abolished the vast majority of slaves flocked to the best schools and universities and were all welcomed with open arms.
Are you crazy, i mean seriously for you to say something like that means you are a guy that doesn't have a clue. Some slaves were aware enough to know to educate themselves but most didn't have a clue because of the beat down uneducated state this country had put them in. Which was a very evil thing to do. The ones that did educate themselves had to go to black schools that were just put in existence. Alot of white schools including ones in the north wouldn't take them. Did you know there was a whole rush by this country to find a way to educate slaves. But alot of these efforts were cut off, and slowed by the massive inaction of such a policy and the racism that some people held against it.
Here's basically what happened.
1. 300 basic years of slavery in which people against their will were put in a role of servitude for no pay, reduced human rights, being looked on unequally by society, death, injury. Basically the holacaust just spread out over a longer time, with less intense, but a more gradual effect.
2. Abraham Lincoln drafts the Emancipation proclamation. Here's the kicker...if you think slaves were free on the effect of the Emancipation proclamation you are delusional. Slaves technically were freed but were put into a state of lesser servitude. Because of racism, the fact that slaves were not allowed by law i believe to be educated, read etc, they basically couldn't hold a good job and were put back in the same role that they had come from, minus the not getting paid. They had some rights for themselves, but either America and it's people weren't even recognizing them, because of the previous situation. Thus you had the effect of sharecropping because of the fact that most blacks had no skills, and were givien 40 acres and a mule on their former slavemaster's land to farm for themselves, only to have the slave master take nearly all of it and leave them with approximately 20 to 10 % of their initial earnings, which wasn't much.
During the next hundred years you have racism and the South trying to keep slaves in a servitude role by inacting the "Jim Crow" laws not allowing blacks to vote, hold certain jobs, etc. These laws were in effect untill about 1955. In about the 1950's blacks began struggling to get their "real rights" instead of waiting and believing that America was going to do it on it's own. America had to pay the piper at that time for what it had done, and it did, and probably still is. This is approximately 37 years ago, America is still feeling the effects of this economically, socially, culturally, and so on, only in less effect. If you think the effects of all this is going to be erased in that ammount of time you are crazy, and that my friend is one of the reasons those folks i mentioned and the ones in New Orleans were in the situation they were in. Along with the fact that some of them are blaming people and putting themselves in the victim role without getting up. If they educated themselves and stopped complaining they'd get alot farther.
It never ceases to amaze me the ability of ignorant people to play down a situation, as well as others to play up the situation. I stand in the middle ground and am sensible enough to notice both sides exist, and neither are both the total cause of the situation.
The wide majority of most people are wonderful, as evidenced by this forum. But i see there are some that may be closet races and they don't even know it. For you to state what you just said shows it, and certainly some ignorance. And need i mention that countless people of other races were involved in the civil rights movement because they were, compassionate and loving and because they realized if this can happen to one group in our country in America, it can happen to you next.
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Originally posted by Torque
those that deny slavery has no residual effects are just as dishonest as those that use it for their main crutch.
This is one of the best quotes of this thread. And basically explains what i am saying.
:aok
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Originally posted by Curval
"Of coarse the Holacaust wasn't a couple hundred yeeeeeaaars of social and racial rape of a people either.".
Careful. Jews have been persecuted for THOUSANDS of years. Next time you happen to pick up a bible read the old testament. One example would be Moses leading the Israelites out of Egypt. Why was he doing this? Because they had been set free from slavery...until of course the Egyptians changed their minds (bad move on their part as it turned out).
sadly so have the blacks :(
i have many american jewish friends who belong to the naacp and ADL or anti -defimation-leauge ;)
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Originally posted by lazs2
In the world I live in... the present... you are not a victim... you get special treatment in jobs and loans and in the media... you commit most of the crime and riots... you have some of the highest illigitimacy rates and refuse to learn in school... Denounce your "black leaders" for the racists that they are...work on those things and keep the past out of it... treat the rest of us with some respect and you will earn ours.
Quit being thugs and quit whining and we can work from there.
lazs
This statement contains some of the most blanketed generalized statements, lack of comprehension and cognitive reasoning skills. Inabilty to break down a situation from it's surface appearance and see the main critical causes and effects. The inabilty to understand history and it's current possible causes and effects on the present conditions of a situation. Some of the simplest surface, superficial reasoning and theorized rhetoric. Lack of ability to sift through main points and make a summarized understanding of another persons written statements.
Honestly Lasz you must be a genius to have the immaculate comprehension and reasoning skills that you have. It's like you take the words right out of my mouth and understand them immediately and accurately.
Honestly Lasz you said you had been in Jail (i guess not just in police custody but "The Penn" as they say). Who commits the crimes? Who has the highest illiteracy rates, and does very well in school, is it ex-cons? Or just black ex cons? Ex-convicts are usually some of the best and brightest of a society i understand. You seem like a very simple man, yet very nice, who's brain operates somewhere in the 70 I.Q. region. So let me spell it out for you.
1. I do not think that black Americans are victims, but that the effects of a terrible situation not of there own doing is affecting them even to this day.
2. It is time to stop blaming and complaining, everybody and everything, i believe my faults, for example, are mine and mine only.
3. I think they should do the same, acknowledge the facts, because things have gotten quite a bit better, and real American oppurtunity can now be achieved on the backs and the blood of the people who fought for them.
4. I think they should stop blaming and get educated.
I've treated you with respect untill now, but with such statements i may have to come down a notch so you can understand.
:rofl :aok
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I'm surprised the Jewish made it back from the Holocaust so quickly and strongly. I wouldn't want to go toe to toe with Israel right now. They ain't taking no watermelon from no one lol... I love that about them. But i feel like they haven't been wallowing in their depression as much either. Of coarse the Holocaust wasn't a couple hundred yeeeeeaaars of social and racial rape of a people either.
Seems that Jews aren't usually born to unmarried, 16 year-old mothers. THAT fact alone buries a child into a hole he/she/it rarely climb out of...sad that few black 'leaders' comment on it.
link (http://homepage.ntlworld.com/david.bennun/interviews/chrisrock.html)
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If blacks want real recognition and respect, they should really consider making some strides in the area of white-collar crime. Thuggery and peddling crack can only get you so far, and makes for some really crappy stereotypes. White collar crime is the way to go.
Plus, you ain't gonna be embezzlin' much without a college ejumucation... And that's a fact.
Stay in school. Defraud your bosses... Let's get some minorities into Minimum Security for a change.
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I think maybe the Jewish's religious beliefs help alot of this from happening and ties that group together, black folks don't have that, as race is a way of classification not a religion. Maybe a Jewish person could comment on that.
And being born to a 16 year old mother doesn't help, and that situation doesn't just happen to black folks, look at the Jerry Springer show for instance. It ain't impossible for a child to come outta that straight, just harder. Parents form a childs backbone, and if your parents are stupid, you've got to really work against that.
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Originally posted by Neubob
If blacks want real recognition and respect, they should really consider making some strides in the area of white-collar crime. Thuggery and peddling crack can only get you so far, and makes for some really crappy stereotypes. White collar crime is the way to go.
Plus, you ain't gonna be embezzlin' much without a college ejumucation... And that's a fact.
Stay in school. Defraud your bosses... Let's get some minorities into Minimum Security for a change.
AlLRIGHT Neubob... blanketed prejudiced sarcastic statement. But damn funny nontheless.....
:rofl
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Originally posted by LEADPIG
I think maybe the Jewish's religious beliefs help alot of this from happening and ties that group together, black folks don't have that, as race is a way of classification not a religion. Maybe a Jewish person could comment on that.
And being born to a 16 year old mother doesn't help, and that situation doesn't just happen to black folks, look at the Jerry Springer show for instance. It ain't impossible for a child to come outta that straight, just harder. Parents form a childs backbone, and if your parents are stupid, you've got to really work against that.
yup, was reading up on that...out-of-wedlock-teen birth rates of Hispanics are passing blacks on by....guess the assertion that our newest immigrants are "Catholic, and their religion will make them good citizens"....is going by the wayside as they become 'Americanized'
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Originally posted by mentalguy
I am niether sexist nor racist when it comes to politicians.
They are all equally worthless.
Politics - The word is actually based on two other words. Poli, the Greek for many, and tics - a blood sucking parasite.
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LOL ledpig... Ok... ya got me... a 70 IQ? that would put me about average for your people by the bell curve now wouldn't it?
Many many people here in the states started from scratch several generations ago... most had no education such an my grandfather.... they had to work... no time for school. many did not even speak the language... but... while they spent time learning the language and putting their kids through school... you spent the time unlearning the language... and forgeting who your dads were.
You are victims alright... victims of your own self pity... that is probly the worst thing that a man can do... wallow in self pity. Even with my 70's IQ I understand that. I was a drug addict and a criminal... I most certainly don't need anyones pity and never use it as an excuse... I did it to myself. I got over it.
Yeah...you keep thinking you are a victim... I feel a new victim based riot coming on... thousands of victims are mobbing up as we speak because they can't even gangbang a white guy without being persecuted by the law.... yeah.. that will make me want to take your side.
I think that other than my low IQ... what has been revealed here is that... just as I said... scratch a liberal or a black and they will go off... so long as everyone agrees with you then you were fairly pleasant.. with only a few idiotic victim things going... when you were challenged you went off... you lost it...
You even attacked torque who is left of karl marx. He probly does have a poster of jesse jackson over his bed!
oh... and to be honest.. you strike me as someone who's IQ is about 110... smart enough to pass exams and go to school but too dumb to think for himself. The only thing that separates you from joe six pack is that you got a different brainwashing brand.
lazs
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neubob.. I do not and you can come over to my garage and see! (line from a song)
Who is that ugly woman BTW?
lazs
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Originally posted by LEADPIG
I think maybe the Jewish's religious beliefs help alot of this from happening and ties that group together, black folks don't have that, as race is a way of classification not a religion. Maybe a Jewish person could comment on that.
And being born to a 16 year old mother doesn't help, and that situation doesn't just happen to black folks, look at the Jerry Springer show for instance. It ain't impossible for a child to come outta that straight, just harder. Parents form a childs backbone, and if your parents are stupid, you've got to really work against that.
Trust me when I say it's not just religion, per se...
Jews have a famous habit of binding themselves to each other socially, and it goes above and beyond religious practice. Of of the key functions of Kosher itself was as a method of keeping Jews closely knit, because when you lack a nation with physical borders, you have to invent ways to create borders of your own. Kosher became that nation. Those who don't keep kosher can be friends with a Jewish family, but traditionally, at least, such a person would not be able to sit at a Jewish table. Therefore, such a person would never be allowed into the inner circles.
Religion does play a role, but the religious beliefs themselves were tailored to a social situation that amazingly has not changed much over the centuries. An overriding sense of blood bond, as well as family, has been the backbone. Jews are also, at least in my experience, incorrigible gossips. The communities are small and tight, and everyone knows everything. It provides pretty incentive to behave... To top is off, the Jewish mother stereotype is as true-to-life as any other stereotype. Kids grow up wanting to impress and please, and it sticks with them their whole lives.
Of course, today that too is changing. Put an Orthodox jew in the same room with an agnostic such as myself, and an spiteful argument is just as likely to result as any sort of mutual understanding. As for family bonds, well, that's all being redefined daily.
Pop culture rules all.
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Originally posted by lazs2
neubob.. I do not and you can come over to my garage and see! (line from a song)
Who is that ugly woman BTW?
lazs
She's the main character in a god-awful reality TV show. The stereotypical assertive-aggressive hoodrat. Her mere presence on this earth paints Black women in a horrible light, and makes me wonder why all Black men aren't either in a monestary, or self-imposed homosexuals.
No I do not think she's indicative. It's just sad that she's in a spotlight, be it short and insignificant.
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so is that why so many of the men go after fat white women?
lazs
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Originally posted by lazs2
so is that why so many of the men go after fat white women?
lazs
I don't know why any man would ever go after a woman that can roll faster than she walks.
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Originally posted by LEADPIG
This is one of the best quotes of this thread. And basically explains what i am saying.
:aok
(http://davidgmiller.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/bandwagon.gif)
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No it's statements like
As stated by Lasz2
you commit most of the crime and riots.
you have some of the highest illigitimacy rates and refuse to learn in school.
Denounce your "black leaders" for the racists that they are.
Quit being thugs and quit whining and we can work from there.
It's blanketed, genaralized, neophyte thought process statements like this that cause me to respond back in a less than pleasant light or "go off" as you say. Not your beliefs. I think i responded in the most pleasant and calm manner as i could and state my point. I could have been alot more insulting. I respect your beliefs and a man's right to have them, but it's statements like this that make me jitterish.
Honestly Lasz, when you make statements like this it makes me wonder about you. Are you so simple that you cannot comprehend a situation below it's base effects and appearances. Can you not see beyond the numbers and charts and comprehend alll of the reasons. I believe alot of black folks are in the situation they are in because they blame, don't take responsibilty, don't try to do well in school and give up.
I believe that is not the only reason however and that America has really screwed these people up and thats part of the reason blacks are still some of the poorest, uneducated, crime ridden in the country. Along with their own folly. I think poverty is the main factor and this economic status we are still seeing as the effect of slavery and racism. Which the racism caused by this really only started to end about 37 to 57 years ago. That's not too long in a economic social melting pot such as America with all it's interpersonal, dynamics and cultural and fiscal leanings.
It is long enough however and they should stop blaming and get up and get educated.
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Originally posted by moot
(http://davidgmiller.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/bandwagon.gif)
When i scrolled down i honestly thought for a second those two timpani drums were two huge tits, and got kind of excited.
Moot i'm sending you a bill for my new key(bored) lol
:rofl :rofl
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Leadpig,
But do you honestly think that 'black leaders' such as Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton are helping the situation?
Seems to me that having 'black leaders' at all, flies in the face of achieving real equality, because so long as you have leaders whose main defining characteristic is their skin color, their cause will never be taken seriously, and their words and intentions will always remain suspect. Martin Luther King was the great exception, of course, and his shoes have yet to be filled. And yet I think that today, a white man could fill those shoes just the same.
Those who seek colorblindness should lead by example, rather than demand colorblindness while sticking to their guns and nurturing their, dare I say, race-based interest groups such as the NAACP.
Do you not agree?
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Originally posted by LEADPIG
Are you crazy.
well... that was my point leadpig, the statement was so bent from a rational reality it was self mocking.
just like being labeled a 'leftist' by a unionized civil servant from kalifornia.... :rolleyes:
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Originally posted by Neubob
But do you honestly think that 'black leaders' such as Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton are helping the situation?
I`d have to say that if I were a caring black man these two clowns would be a total embarrassment to my race.
I am white so they just make good laughing stocks.
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Originally posted by Jackal1
I`d have to say that if I were a caring black man these two clowns would be a total embarrassment to my race.
I am white so they just make good laughing stocks.
I agree with the first statement. The second statement is a mixed bag for me. Yes, that are pretty pathetic, but they're also dangerous. Too many mentally-challanged individuals put a lot of stock into what they say.
A happy and prosperous black population would help this nation immensely. Guys like those mentioned about are major barriers to this progress. We all suffer as a result, and nobody more than those who buy into the bull****.
And saying crap like 'we're not gonna take it anymore', as was quoted during the Jena 6 debacle, is a perfect example of the backwards thinking. Not gonna take what? Who's oppressing who here? The whole sentiment is that there is a master abusing the servant. There simply is not. Residual effects from slavery or not, today, the disparity is more self-imposed than anything else, and statements such as these just reinforce this out-dated thinking.
Jackson and Sharpton are the ones carrying the nooses today. Besides promoting self pity and a sense of entitlement, they do nothing at all. I hope they die out real soon so we can start to move on.
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Originally posted by Neubob
The second statement is a mixed bag for me. Yes, that are pretty pathetic, but they're also dangerous.
Well........I think the only danger they hold is to the black race.
In any case if you can watch Sharpton open his mouth and not be laughing by the second sentence, you have me beat by a mile.
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Originally posted by Jackal1
Well........I think the only danger they hold is to the black race.
In any case if you can watch Sharpton open his mouth and not be laughing by the second sentence, you have me beat by a mile.
I'd like to laugh, believe me.
The problem is that so long as sweetheartbags like him continue to have a following, the cycle will continue. That racially-motivated scholarships will continue. The double-standard admissions policies in colleges, graduate schools, will continue. The sense of 'society owes me' because my grandfather sat the back of the bus, will continue. It hurts us all, by extension, when we have to deal with appeasing these demands for hand-outs.
I hate to go back to this, but look at the Jews once again. Hardly do you hear of Jewish communities 'asking' for equality. They take what they know they need to get by, they work towards their goals, and they achieve what they want.
The result is that jews are often seen as aggressive, tricky and dishonest. But, frankly, all those accusations are just veiled terms of empowerment. Never do you hear a jew being called a kike because he was weak, lazy, or drowning in his own pity. Rarely do you see a bunch of Jews marching on Washington demanding equality. They take what they believe is theirs.
Blacks are no less capable of achieving what they need. Its just that instead of having your dad as your role model, dad is nowhere to be seen, while Jesse Jackson and his ilk are never at a loss for words reminding you that the white man still owes you. Over generations, this sort of indoctrination results in exactly what is going on.
Oh, and to add one last thing... Notice that the N word gets filtered, while kike (no less insulting), is not. Just another example of us walking on eggshells for the benefit of one formerly oppressed race, while treating the other like they're nobody special.
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Originally posted by Neubob
Leadpig,
But do you honestly think that 'black leaders' such as Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton are helping the situation?
Seems to me that having 'black leaders' at all, flies in the face of achieving real equality, because so long as you have leaders whose main defining characteristic is their skin color, their cause will never be taken seriously, and their words and intentions will always remain suspect. Martin Luther King was the great exception, of course, and his shoes have yet to be filled. And yet I think that today, a white man could fill those shoes just the same.
Those who seek colorblindness should lead by example, rather than demand colorblindness while sticking to their guns and nurturing their, dare I say, race-based interest groups such as the NAACP.
Do you not agree?
I don't think they are nessecarily helping the situation. Especially when they go around screaming racism, it seems, at everything that is happening. I think there are situations today of racism, (which is why programs like affirmative action exist, to even the playing field) to say anything else is foolhardy, and i think they are needed for those situations. To say racism doesn't exist and America is completely back to normal after slavery and the ensuing racism after it, is ludicrous. I see a bunch of white guys running around today, speaking of something of which they know nothing about, so i wish they would just shut up. But to run around saying everthing is racism in the other direction is quite ludicrous as well and i don't believe in that either.
However i see more instances of racism against different groups, cultures and races today and i wish they would fight for them as well. I have also seen, some instances, by some very radical black groups of racism against whites, which i think is even more scary. I think to myself, "do we really wanna go through that again?"
America is still not back together after it's racist past. And i think organizations such as the NAACP and the ALCU are good fighters in that regime. I do however believe that their power is being abused wrongly, other than what should be there're basic function of, "Help everyone that is abused and in need of equal treatment."
I still think they are nessecary. When situations such as the man from Vidor, Texas, not too far from where i live actually, are dragged behind a truck for two miles, to the point where his head, arms and torso are dismembered. I think organizations such as the NAACP and the ALCU are needed for that, but nothing more, they are being over used i feel.The goal is equality not, equality taken and given back the other way.
Do these organizations need to go away? Yes. But untill no one is dragged behind a truck or anything else happens for racial reasons i don't think they should. There in you have the question, are they supporting racism or fighting it. However when they respond to events like the one i just mentioned and others like it, no. The racism existed, something happened, and they responded to it. They shouldn't go around, having an alleged racist event, and then have everybody show up for it. That's my point people are getting overzealous i think and they are getting abused. Hence, you have the suspicion and disbelief i hear in the voices of people in this forum, who believe they are abusing their power, that's because they are.
Al Sharpton i don't know much about him. But Jesse Jackson i respect. I respect him, because he was in thick of the civil rights movement when it wasn't popular in the terrible 50' and 60's. When a man could get shot for doing what he was doing, get hung, his house blown up, his family killed. He marched alongside Martin Luther King when a car backfiring would cause them both to duck in fear. He was also there when there was no money in it, and it was not profitable financially to them. I don't know what's going on with him now, but those things i mentioned above tells me his heart was and most likely still is in the right place.
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Jesse Jackson is a extortionist, he goes to big companies and tells them he will call for a boycott unless they "donate" money to his non-profit push/rainbow group.
he made Budweiser give his son a bud distributorship in a major city for only $50,000 and made bud loan his son the money to "buy" it.
Even the IRS is afraid to audit him.
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Originally posted by john9001
Jesse Jackson is a extortionist, he goes to big companies and tells them he will call for a boycott unless they "donate" money to his non-profit push/rainbow group.
he made Budweiser give his son a bud distributorship in a major city for only $50,000 and made bud loan his son the money to "buy" it.
Even the IRS is afraid to audit him.
Where'd you get that information John? From your other white conservative racist friends.
Could be, i don't know, i wouldn't doubt it, but John you are not the best source of information for me to get that from. But i'll consider it.
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Originally posted by Neubob
Oh, and to add one last thing... Notice that the N word gets filtered, while kike (no less insulting), is not. Just another example of us walking on eggshells for the benefit of one formerly oppressed race, while treating the other like they're nobody special.
Now that's messed up, i'm hoping it's because of the popularity and the promotion the N word has had and not, racism and disrespect. I fear it might be though.
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Originally posted by LEADPIG
Where'd you get that information John? From your other white conservative racist friends.
what makes you think I'm "white", for your information i am euro-american.
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Originally posted by lazs2
LOL ledpig... Ok... ya got me... a 70 IQ? that would put me about average for your people by the bell curve now wouldn't it?
lazs
For my people???.... Who's my people Lazs??.. were all people as far as i'm concerned, so i don't know who you talking about.
If that's not an underground, genaralized, outed, racist statement i don't know what is?
Lasz is a closet racist everybody and he doesn't even know it, nobody tell him it's a secret ok.
:rofl
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Originally posted by john9001
what makes you think I'm "white", for your information i am euro-american.
That's the point i'm just guessing, not that it matters what color you are anyway. I was really responding to what you were saying.
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you inferred that i was a "white racist", calling me "white" is itself racist.
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Originally posted by john9001
you inferred that i was a "white racist", calling me "white" is itself racist.
That's the point i was making a dumb, generalized, assumption, that doesn't have anything to do with anything, just like you were. I don't know any of those things, any more than you know if Jesse Jackson did those things. I was making a dumb blanketed assumption on you only with the little information i've seen you post here and elswhere. I don't know those things and i don't care. Now was i right at all or was i wrong? Let's see how stupid my assumptions were. I guess the only thing i was wrong about was the racist thing, right??
:rofl
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Racism....
Big heady stuff for us bunch of low IQ Mongrels to deal with.
Let me give this a shot.
Racism is supported by this government (Don't need to list the numerous govt programs that favor one race over another)
Corporate Media ( Don't need to list the numerous magazines, cable channels and radio stations that are oriented to one race)
Prison population and violent crime statistics........ Anyone want to comment on that one? How about Public school drop out figures and stats anyone want to comment on that one? Jenna six?? Media event thats it nothing else really. Their are some obvious and horendous issues that plague the black population of this country. Should I vote for a man for president because he is black?? NO! I will vote for a woman or a man because of their abbillity to represent all of us citizens fairly and honestly.
Not because of their skin color or sex or religion.
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ledpig.... where to start?
"Honestly Lasz, when you make statements like this it makes me wonder about you. Are you so simple that you cannot comprehend a situation below it's base effects and appearances. Can you not see beyond the numbers and charts and comprehend alll of the reasons."
Ah... soooo.. like a good little liberal or... simply a negro... you want me to ignore fact and go by "feelings" it matters not to you what is really happening only what YOU PERCEIVE to be the reasons behind it... since neither of us can really know the reasons behind anything... all a person of reason is left with is the facts.
A good example is how you gleefully called me a racist for quoting a study. The bell curve does show that some races score better in IQ than others... I know you "feel" that this should not be true but... get over it. Heck..... I aint all angry at the asians over it and in denial.
It is not racist to say that the negro race scores lower on IQ tests... it is however.... rude... more than rude... to say that someone, that you don't know anything about, has an IQ of 70
While I am not a racist for pointing out facts...you are most certainly rude and childish for your statements...
black people commit most of the violent crime in this country.. they have the highest illigitamacy rates and they commit half the homicides. they are 7 times more likely to attack a white than vice versa. these are all facts. I really don't care what you "feel" is the reason... it just needs to stop... it is not whites that are making you a victim but yourselves.
I have no sympathy for someone who isolates himself with dress and culture and speech and then cries like a little baby about how isolated he is and how unfair it all is.
You do seem smart enough that you don't buy totally into all the excuses and dogma but not smart enough to dump the liberal hand wringing and speculating and... peer pressure.
I would not like to spend much time around you I would think. It would be boring and frustrating.
lazs
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Originally posted by uberhun
Racism....
Racism is supported by this government (Don't need to list the numerous govt programs that favor one race over another)
Corporate Media ( Don't need to list the numerous magazines, cable channels and radio stations that are oriented to one race)
Prison population and violent crime statistics........ Anyone want to comment on that one? How about Public school drop out figures and stats anyone want to comment on that one? ..
Good stuff except for this part, ever care to delve deeper into why those reasons exist. And no it's not all because one race blames everyone. Anyone care to explain how it got that way in the first place before all these blaming retards started.
America still isn't equal that's why all those programs exist. You know why it's harder to find a black doctor, airline pilot, lawyer? The previous generations were suffering from the effects of what happened and before.
My Grandfather was born into one of the most races periods in history, the 1900's into the 1960's. It just started to change then. Blacks couldn't vote as late as i believe 1955. You can imagine if you can't vote you'd be pretty poor and have no representation. His father was the son of a freed slave, My mother was born into segregation, black folks couldn't really hold jobs above menial labor, even if they tried alot weren't allowed to because of America's racist ways. To find a black with a good job on average was pretty unheard of till the 1970's. Things were just from beginning to change from slavery by then. So you have 1865, the signing of the Emancipation Proclamation to about 1965 to 1970 when things really started to change for the better. Before then rampant poverty existed not always but mostly to the racist ways of America.
Lyndon Johnson really started equalizing the law books so that blacks were legally seen as equals in 1965. So you have one domino tips another domino tips another. So the blacks before were climbing out of the race inspired poverty of his father, and his father. See where this is going the folks living today are still effected by all that. It would go faster if they stopped blaming everybody and got up now though.
1970 wasn't that long ago... Another thing alot of you miseducated folks seem to think the Emancipation Proclamation was a magic wand that wiped it all out and equalized everything at once.... wrong. It took about 100 years after that for America to get her slow arnold in gear and get movin after that. And even then she had to be downright prodded. Then you have the lingering social and economic impact of all that and the lady justice is still trying to right her scales after that catyclism.
Most kids today (old ones never got it) ain't educated about all this and i see it now.
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[4- Members should post in a way that is respectful of other users and HTC. Flaming or abusing users is not tolerated.
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Originally posted by LEADPIG
Good stuff except for this part, ever care to delve deeper into why those reasons exist. And no it's not all because one race blames everyone. Anyone care to explain how it got that way in the first place before all these blaming retards started.
America still isn't equal that's why all those programs exist. You know why it's harder to find a black doctor, airline pilot, lawyer? The previous generations were suffering from the effects of what happened and before.
My Grandfather was born into one of the most races periods in history, the 1900's into the 1960's. It just started to change then. Blacks couldn't vote as late as i believe 1955. You can imagine if you can't vote you'd be pretty poor and have no representation. His father was the son of a freed slave, My mother was born into segregation, black folks couldn't really hold jobs above menial labor, even if they tried alot weren't allowed to because of America's racist ways. To find a black with a good job on average was pretty unheard of till the 1970's. Things were just from beginning to change from slavery by then. So you have 1865, the signing of the Emancipation Proclamation to about 1965 to 1970 when things really started to change for the better. Before then rampant poverty existed not always but mostly to the racist ways of America.
Lyndon Johnson really started equalizing the law books so that blacks were legally seen as equals in 1965. So you have one domino tips another domino tips another. So the blacks before were climbing out of the race inspired poverty of his father, and his father. See where this is going the folks living today are still effected by all that. It would go faster if they stopped blaming everybody and got up now though.
1970 wasn't that long ago... Another thing alot of you miseducated folks seem to think the Emancipation Proclamation was a magic wand that wiped it all out and equalized everything at once.... wrong. It took about 100 years after that for America to get her slow arnold in gear and get movin after that. And even then she had to be downright prodded. Then you have the lingering social and economic impact of all that and the lady justice is still trying to right her scales after that catyclism.
Most kids today (old ones never got it) ain't educated about all this and i see it now.
LEADPIG,
I understand that the majority of black ancestory in this country was not brought here by their own free will. I understand that the absolute and total ignorance of man through the ages has usurped and enslaved one race or culture through time immortal. But to subject a race of people (stay with me here now lead) to unfair scruitiny by installing lopsided govt. programs to favor one race at the expense of the whole population does not make sense either. The constitution was written for all of us in this country and should be the standard that the whole country lives by. To punish the great great grandchildren of our forefathers for their ignorance is unacceptable. Should one segment of the country pay repreations to another segment of the country for something that has nothing to do with either one? And create even more resentment. You see the answer is not what are you going to do for me (That was done already) It is what are you going to do for yourself?
!
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Originally posted by LEADPIG
4- Members should post in a way that is respectful of other users and HTC. Flaming or abusing users is not tolerated.
Actually, Asians could be more intellegent, due to the fact of their geographical location and dietary habits. Most Asian cultures have a lot of fish in their diet because a lot of Asian countries are either bordered by or near the ocean.
DHA which is an Omega3 fatty acid is not produced internally by many mammals, with the exception of lactating females. Colostrum ( first milk after pregnancy ) is rich in it. On the other hand, most fish (cod especially) are loaded with it. The fish get it mostly from kelp. DHA is the most major amino building block for brain cells. DHA is very important, especially in the developmental years of children.
Here in America, we tend to have a diet rich in bovine meat, and cows milk or formula (for the infants which didn't have DHA added until recent years). In Asian countries, breast feeding is more popular, and the diet is more seafood rich. Cow milk and bovine flesh contain BGH(bovine growth hormone). I'm not referring to the rBGH (recombinant BGH) where we genetically snip parts of the dna and RECOMbine with BGH. This hormone is also a fatty acid that promotes physical growth not brain growth. So.......
Is this why, Asians tend to be slimmer and smarter, and Americans are becoming fatter and dumber. Think on that. How often did your mom/dad feed you milk.(from a cow)
Also as far as the races go there are, (besides the obvious skin and feature differences) some very interesting genetic differences as well. I'll name two and I will stop babeling. Some black folks suffer sickle cell anemia. No White folks ever have it (if purely european/caucasion, etc) Only Jewish folks develop Tay Sachs disease. These are genetically coded defenses that are race specific. You may not know, but native Africans that carry this "sickle cell" and live in Africa (drum roll please......) ARE IMMUNE TO MALARIA (tada). When not in a country with malaria it becomes a malady. As far as the Tay Sachs goes, well, I'll let you do some homework. But, I'll bet it has something to do with the tradition of their race/culture of being a nomadic desert people.
Also, just another tidbit. During the Black Plague in Europe, most of the Jewish population was untouched. Why? Well their tradition of cleaning out all leavening (anything having to do with bread to simplify it) down to the last crumb, for Passover, lent itself to less food for the rats and vermin to find in their homes. Less rats = less plague. Hmmmmmm.
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Von Messa one the most interesting and thought provoking reads i've had in these forums. You seem to know your stuff. I've always wondered if dietary, and infant raising and breeding habits due to cultural traditions could have an effect. I'll say this, i've had some Asian friends, and there parents put a heavy importance on education. I believe this belief in their culture is a large reason Asian children score so high. Black kids focus more on sports i can remember this dumb thing in black society when i was a kid that you had to be an athlete to be cool. I was just the opposite and concentrated on my schoolwork and read voraciously when i was a kid, even won a Navy Rotc academic scholarship. But i was a nerd though, a loser if you will. lol
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Originally posted by uberhun
LEADPIG,
I understand that the majority of black ancestory in this country was not brought here by their own free will. I understand that the absolute and total ignorance of man through the ages has usurped and enslaved one race or culture through time immortal. But to subject a race of people (stay with me here now lead) to unfair scruitiny by installing lopsided govt. programs to favor one race at the expense of the whole population does not make sense either. The constitution was written for all of us in this country and should be the standard that the whole country lives by. To punish the great great grandchildren of our forefathers for their ignorance is unacceptable. Should one segment of the country pay repreations to another segment of the country for something that has nothing to do with either one? And create even more resentment. You see the answer is not what are you going to do for me (That was done already) It is what are you going to do for yourself?
!
I so much believe in your statement and i believe you are quite right. I think that America still has not quite recovered totally especially in economic growth and poverty, inflicted on people from the previous generations of racism and slavery. I believe those effects are still lingering today giving a slight disadvantage. I think that's a good reason you saw so many poor black folks after Hurricane Katrina, along with those peoples own attitudes caused by the poverty America's trickled down racism effects help put them in. I believe it's still equalizing. Now only if they'd pick up a book and study, but it's hard to do that when all you know is negative.
For instance i became a pilot when i was 19 years old, i soloed when i was seventeen. Now alot of the kids i went to school with in the projects were so poor they couldn't think of doing anything like that. They weren't exposed to such things. America's economic effects have helped them be in that situation, so they have a little bit farther to climb. I was lucky
So those programs equalize it, those programs are more about cancelling out an economic advantage that America itself imposed on some of it's people, than on taking away anyone's rights. I think a good indicator would be to flood New Orleans again in 20 years and when you see just as many white people along with everyone else stranded then i'd say it's done.
I've often wondered should there be an affirmative action for poor white and mexican people, along with others. But i think it's more about cancelling out America's racist past and the lingering economics effects caused by generations than anything.
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Oh..also i think homosexuals are getting discriminated against and it's not fair. It never ceases to amaze me how people care so much what others do with their private parts. I feel like if your not having a homosexual relationship, than what's your problem? America, give gay people their rights and stop treating them like second class citizens. Let them get married and be recognized legally as people. Whatever the religions want to do is their business, but American law and religion have nothing to do with each other. Boy you sure have to kick America in her arnold to get her to live up to her credo. Even the Soviet Union was letting women be astronauts in the 1960's, way before we were. Jeez.
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gays can get married in this country, a gay man can marry a gay woman.
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Originally posted by LEADPIG
Oh..also i think homosexuals are getting discriminated against and it's not fair. It never ceases to amaze me how people care so much what others do with their private parts. I feel like if your not having a homosexual relationship, than what's your problem? America, give gay people their rights and stop treating them like second class citizens. Let them get married and be recognized legally as people. Whatever the religions want to do is their business, but American law and religion have nothing to do with each other. Boy you sure have to kick America in her arnold to get her to live up to her credo. Even the Soviet Union was letting women be astronauts in the 1960's, way before we were. Jeez.
Stick a fork in him. He`s done.
Nice attempt, but too obvious. I give it a 3.
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Originally posted by LEADPIG
Oh..also i think homosexuals are getting discriminated against and it's not fair. It never ceases to amaze me how people care so much what others do with their private parts. I feel like if your not having a homosexual relationship, than what's your problem? America, give gay people their rights and stop treating them like second class citizens. Let them get married and be recognized legally as people. Whatever the religions want to do is their business, but American law and religion have nothing to do with each other. Boy you sure have to kick America in her arnold to get her to live up to her credo. Even the Soviet Union was letting women be astronauts in the 1960's, way before we were. Jeez.
I stayed out of the thread because I already said what I had to say & moved on. Wasn't gonna keep repeating the same race/gender stuff over & over while others argued their own point over & over. However, if queers are now in the post ~ I'll start anew.
I don't want to hear any "I got my rights" bullsheet from the queers. Queers have a right to understand that you are not lawfully able to marry another queer. Then you have the right to get the hell over it & move on.
Then shut the hell up... we don't want to hear the same ole line from the fudge packers over & over about how "we just don't understand" their needs. "*sniffle* but... but... but..." Screw their perverted sick needs (oh wait, they do that already). So what about pedophiles? Are we "just supposed to understand" the needs of those sickos?
Listen, any man who is attracted to a man instead of a woman has something so sick deep from within him that he definitely doesn't belong in a position of authority in a governing body. Actually extend his sick & twisted mind from governing himself into governing entire groups of people? HORRIBLE IDEA
Comparing the soviet advancement of women to the damn queers (in any country or society) is just the most idiotic thing I've heard. Leadpig, I've seen you actually think in some of your posts before, deserving of much credit. I didn't expect to see the whining crybaby bullsheet about queers from you at all.
*edit* oh, I see the problem.... see the line where you started it with "I feel..." try thinking instead of feeling when you're making decisions of any importance.
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Originally posted by LEADPIG
Oh..also i think homosexuals are getting discriminated against and it's not fair. It never ceases to amaze me how people care so much what others do with their private parts. I feel like if your not having a homosexual relationship, than what's your problem? America, give gay people their rights and stop treating them like second class citizens. Let them get married and be recognized legally as people. Whatever the religions want to do is their business, but American law and religion have nothing to do with each other. Boy you sure have to kick America in her arnold to get her to live up to her credo. Even the Soviet Union was letting women be astronauts in the 1960's, way before we were. Jeez.
Nobody should be discrimanted against. End of story! The Soviet Union??
Please Lead:rolleyes: Crush and stomp the many into dust for the select few of the politburo to thrive in a hypocrisy of Marxism.
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Originally posted by texasmom
I stayed out of the thread because I already said what I had to say & moved on. Wasn't gonna keep repeating the same race/gender stuff over & over while others argued their own point over & over. However, if queers are now in the post ~ I'll start anew.
I don't want to hear any "I got my rights" bullsheet from the queers. Queers have a right to understand that you are not lawfully able to marry another queer. Then you have the right to get the hell over it & move on.
Then shut the hell up... we don't want to hear the same ole line from the fudge packers over & over about how "we just don't understand" their needs. "*sniffle* but... but... but..." Screw their perverted sick needs (oh wait, they do that already). So what about pedophiles? Are we "just supposed to understand" the needs of those sickos?
Listen, any man who is attracted to a man instead of a woman has something so sick deep from within him that he definitely doesn't belong in a position of authority in a governing body. Actually extend his sick & twisted mind from governing himself into governing entire groups of people? HORRIBLE IDEA
Comparing the soviet advancement of women to the damn queers (in any country or society) is just the most idiotic thing I've heard. Leadpig, I've seen you actually think in some of your posts before, deserving of much credit. I didn't expect to see the whining crybaby bullsheet about queers from you at all.
*edit* oh, I see the problem.... see the line where you started it with "I feel..." try thinking instead of feeling when you're making decisions of any importance.
Wow Texas Mom, you really have some heartfelt feelings about Homosexuals:O But comparing Homosexuals and Criminals (pedophiles) is wrong. Homosexuals deserve to be treated as equals just like everyone else. Once you start discriminating against one, it is really easy to start descriminating against others. Nazi Germany can tell you all about that.
!
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Originally posted by uberhun
Wow Texas Mom, you really have some heartfelt feelings about Homosexuals:O But comparing Homosexuals and Criminals (pedophiles) is wrong. Homosexuals deserve to be treated as equals just like everyone else. Once you start discriminating against one, it is really easy to start descriminating against others. Nazi Germany can tell you all about that.
!
Here's the reason pedophiles are criminals:
Society has decided that the acted upon desire to have sex with children is unacceptable... hence: pedophiles go to prison.
The acted upon desire a man has to have sex with another man has simply not been determined to be a criminal act. So your "criminal" arguement does wash.
Queers can completely be treated as equals... with the understanding that until one of them becomes a woman... they don't get to marry. You can't cry both ways. Do you want it to be equal? Or do you want to bend out of the way (outside of marriage b/ween man&woman)? It's either one or the other... but don't use both sides of the same arguement to sway it in your own direction. Make a decision there.
And hell no, it's nothin like the Nazis. I'm not saying they need to be eliminated (they do a fine job of that themselves with AIDS... which I wouldn't wish upon them or anyone). However, I'm saying ~ you wanna be queer ~ fine. Be queer and don't expect to be treated equal ~ BECAUSE YOU'RE NOT. YOU ARE NOT MAN AND WIFE. Don't expect to be afforded the same luxuries that MAN AND WIFE are afforded... and don't whine about it.
*edit* p.s. those aren't "heartfelt feelings" there uber... it's pure & simple logic
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Nuke Islam
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Originally posted by Neubob
Nuke Islam
Nuke a religion?
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Originally posted by texasmom
Here's the reason pedophiles are criminals:
Society has decided that the acted upon desire to have sex with children is acceptable... hence: pedophiles go to prison.
The acted upon desire a man has to have sex with another man has simply not been determined to be a criminal act. So your "criminal" arguement does wash.
Queers can completely be treated as equals... with the understanding that until one of them becomes a woman... they don't get to marry. You can't cry both ways. Do you want it to be equal? Or do you want to bend out of the way (outside of marriage b/ween man&woman)? It's either one or the other... but don't use both sides of the same arguement to sway it in your own direction. Make a decision there.
And hell no, it's nothin like the Nazis. I'm not saying they need to be eliminated (they do a fine job of that themselves with AIDS... which I wouldn't wish upon them or anyone). However, I'm saying ~ you wanna be queer ~ fine. Be queer and don't expect to be treated equal ~ BECAUSE YOU'RE NOT. YOU ARE NOT MAN AND WIFE. Don't expect to be afforded the same luxuries that MAN AND WIFE are afforded... and don't whine about it.
*edit* p.s. those aren't "heartfelt feelings" there uber... it's pure & simple logic
I appologize for the heartfelt comment !
#1 Pedophiles are the most vile of criminals of the first degree!
(Being a father of 2 daughters I do have a bias conviction in respects to that social abortion)
#2 Homosexual people need to be afforded the same rights as any individual citizen in this country. If two Homosexuals want to be a couple joined legally through a civil ceramony. So be it. They should also be afforded the same rights and privalleges as a (Married ) couple under that civil union. The sensitivity with the Married lable, I think is what is getting everybody in a tizzy. Fine if some Rabbi, Priest or Iman has a problem with it. I respect that. But do not discriminate because they do not tow the line you identify with.
Respectfully!
Uber.
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Originally posted by uberhun
I appologize for the heartfelt comment !
#1 Pedophiles are the most vile of criminals of the first degree!
(Being a father of 2 daughters I do have a bias conviction in respects to that social abortion)
#2 Homosexual people need to be afforded the same rights as any individual citizen in this country. If two Homosexuals want to be a couple joined legally through a civil ceramony. So be it. They should also be afforded the same rights and privalleges as a (Married ) couple under that civil union. The sensitivity with the Married lable, I think is what is getting everybody in a tizzy. Fine if some Rabbi, Priest or Iman has a problem with it. I respect that. But do not discriminate because they do not tow the line you identify with.
Respectfully!
Uber.
I'm sorry "homo's should be" arguement just isn't good enough. Man & Wife means MAN AND WIFE ~ not MAN AND... ANOTHER MAN. If they want the rights afforded to a married couple, they need to start dipping their wicks on the other side of the candleshop.
Period. It's not a "label" that gets me in a tizzy. It's the fact that whining sniveling queers think that "but... but... but... I want the same thing as they have" (pointing their queer little fingers over to the side of the room as the straight couples).
Get over it. You don't get the privileges afforded to a married couple until you are MAN AND WIFE.
*edit* I'm not going to respond to the religious remarks you posted. Once you start mixing the two the entire discussion takes a nosedive.
*edit again* I toe this line: Until you're man & wife, shut up.
And I don't think twice about saying it loudly or often. And I don't care if it's like, not liked, despised, or ridiculed. Doesn't change the fact that until they're man & wife... they ain't getting married.
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We could get OJ Simpson for Pres!
(http://evilbeetgossip.film.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/06/oj-simpson.jpg)
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Originally posted by uberhun
Wow Texas Mom, you really have some heartfelt feelings about Homosexuals:O But comparing Homosexuals and Criminals (pedophiles) is wrong. Homosexuals deserve to be treated as equals just like everyone else. Once you start discriminating against one, it is really easy to start descriminating against others. Nazi Germany can tell you all about that.
!
And I'm sorry, I meant to ask, how exactly are they being discriminated against? Because they're being required to follow the rule of law & not marry?
HOW exactly (list them... ANYONE) are they being discriminated against?
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Originally posted by texasmom
I'm sorry "homo's should be" arguement just isn't good enough. Man & Wife means MAN AND WIFE ~ not MAN AND... ANOTHER MAN. If they want the rights afforded to a married couple, they need to start dipping their wicks on the other side of the candleshop.
Period. It's not a "label" that gets me in a tizzy. It's the fact that whining sniveling queers think that "but... but... but... I want the same thing as they have" (pointing their queer little fingers over to the side of the room as the straight couples).
Get over it. You don't get the privileges afforded to a married couple until you are MAN AND WIFE.
*edit* I'm not going to respond to the religious remarks you posted. Once you start mixing the two the entire discussion takes a nosedive.
Texas Mom,
Your view point is biased and based upon a discriminatory base. I feel I have not made my point well enough here so let me try this.
In Chicago they have a "Gay Pride Parade" every year. I do not support it!
Why? Because it is discriminatory! It is a parade for a select group of people celebrating their sexual orientation in a blatant disrespectfull fasion.
It is inappropriate and wrong in so many ways. What would happen if Chicago had a Heterosexual pride parade? The Lawyers would be falling out of windows to jump on that one. The religion thing was not out of disrespect. I respect all religions! Just don't tell me your better because, My God is better then your God because blah, blah, blah. I have no time for it.
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Originally posted by texasmom
And I'm sorry, I meant to ask, how exactly are they being discriminated against? Because they're being required to follow the rule of law & not marry?
HOW exactly (list them... ANYONE) are they being discriminated against?
Thats easy. Because the way the current laws are written their is a biased distinction between being "married" and a civil union. Their is a whole list of things afford a married Man and Woman couple, that two people of the same sex are not allowed.
p.s (don't take this so personally it is not meant to be, it is just open debate of opposing view points) !
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Originally posted by uberhun
Texas Mom,
Your view point is biased and based upon a discriminatory base. I feel I have not made my point well enough here so let me try this.
In Chicago they have a "Gay Pride Parade" every year. I do not support it!
Why? Because it is discriminatory! It is a parade for a select group of people celebrating their sexual orientation in a blatant disrespectfull fasion.
It is inappropriate and wrong in so many ways. What would happen if Chicago had a Heterosexual pride parade? The Lawyers would be falling out of windows to jump on that one. The religion thing was not out of disrespect. I respect all religions! Just don't tell me your better because, My God is better then your God because blah, blah, blah. I have no time for it.
My view point is not biased or discriminatory.
The Gay Pride Parade? That's fine ~ let them proudly march in the streets. Fine ~ that's all well & good. And why not support that? They are proud of who they are. Just like any other group in a parade ~ why do you think they separate into groups in a larger parade ~ so they can be identified as being together. What's the matter with that?
Oh... I get it... You don't like it because EVERYONE isn't allowed in it... it's just for the queers. Look, this sounds like the "bread & jam for francis" syndrome again. It doesn't come out even for everyone. Period. We don't regulate in taking from the rich (who the riches rightfully belong to) and give to the poor (while many of them do that on their own... we don't require it as a society...). We let people fail or succeed on their own ~ and we let queers join their lives together with the understanding that THEY WON'T BE GETTING MARRIED.
And where did you gather that I felt you were disrespectful toward my religion? All I said is that I wasn't going to use any religious remarks in any of my responses. What I do or do not happen to believe (in a religious context) is entirely separate from the fact that until a queer couple are able to become MAN AND WIFE, they won't be getting married. Period. MAN AND WIFE.
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TexasMom,
I respect you conviction on this and am slowly walking away..............
!
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Originally posted by uberhun
Thats easy. Because the way the current laws are written their is a biased distinction between being "married" and a civil union. Their is a whole list of things afford a married Man and Woman couple, that two people of the same sex are not allowed.
p.s (don't take this so personally it is not meant to be, it is just open debate of opposing view points) !
So let me see if I reckon this right: They're being discriminated against because our society won't change the current laws to accomodate their feelings of wishing to be joined in marriage the same as a MAN and a WOMAN?
I'm sorry Uber, I believe you are a fine fellow , and I believe that your intentions here towards homosexuals are decent and kind. However, a desire "to be nice" isn't a good enough reason to change the law to accomodate their wish to be joined in marriage.
Is that the discrimination that you are talking about? That they can't marry? I'm sorry, that's not a good enough answer. They're being required to follow the rule of law. period. If you want to demonstrate how they are being discriminated against, you're going to have to provide something more than that.
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p.s. Where's leadpig in all of this? He made the inflamatory remark then booked... leaving you (uber) to make his point for him.
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4- Members should post in a way that is respectful of other users and HTC. Flaming or abusing users is not tolerated.
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I'm not trying to impose my beliefs on anyone Leadpig. The simple fact is that a man and another man are not afforded the same rights under the rule of law as a man and a woman.
My personal lack of politically correct terms doesn't make my point any less valid, other than you think I'm a tasteless pig. Insert "persons of another sexual orientation" into all of those same remarks ~ the point is still the same.
If you want to be married and be afforded the same rights under the rule of law, you must be man and wife.
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well... i don't think dick cheney would invite her over for thanksgiving dinner...
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Originally posted by LEADPIG
4- Members should post in a way that is respectful of other users and HTC. Flaming or abusing users is not tolerated.
Oh, and what's with the parade remark? I clearly stated that I don't object to them marching in a parade.
And if one of my kids ends up gay, that's fine. I've raised them well enough to know that they must follow the rule of law ~ and they won't expect to be afforded the same privileges as a MAN and WIFE.
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Is there some kind of confusion here? I don't object to folks being queer (yes, I'm being politically incorrect again using "queer") How they want to have sex is entirely their own business...
What I object to is that they expect to have the same privileges afforded to MAN and WIFE.
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Originally posted by texasmom
So let me see if I reckon this right: They're being discriminated against because our society won't change the current laws to accomodate their feelings of wishing to be joined in marriage the same as a MAN and a WOMAN?
I'm sorry Uber, I believe you are a fine fellow , and I believe that your intentions here towards homosexuals are decent and kind. However, a desire "to be nice" isn't a good enough reason to change the law to accomodate their wish to be joined in marriage.
Is that the discrimination that you are talking about? That they can't marry? I'm sorry, that's not a good enough answer. They're being required to follow the rule of law. period. If you want to demonstrate how they are being discriminated against, you're going to have to provide something more than that.
Oh ... another thing.... Get this just because something is a law doesn't make it right. Slavery was a law, women couldn't vote, that was a law.
Obviously those laws weren't right. Stop imposing your will and what you think is right on other people. Your opinion on whether it's right are not doesn't matter. I'm not crazy about the whole gay thing either. But get this...nobody in this world should be looked, down on, called names (as you did) or discriminated against by anybody for any reason ever.
I'd like to see you call your kids those names if they were gay, or tell them to their face what you said earlier. Go somewhere and buy a big plate of empathy.
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Originally posted by LEADPIG
Oh ... another thing.... Get this just because something is a law doesn't make it right. Slavery was a law, women couldn't vote, that was a law.
Obviously those laws weren't right. Stop imposing your will and what you think is right on other people. Your opinion on whether it's right are not doesn't matter. I'm not crazy about the whole gay thing either. But get this...nobody in this world should be looked, down on, called names (as you did) or discriminated against by anybody for any reason ever.
I'd like to see you call your kids those names if they were gay, or tell them to their face what you said earlier. Go somewhere and buy a big plate of empathy.
Yes, you are correct. Slavery was wrong, women should vote, and those improper laws were changed, as they should have been.
LOL ~ I'm not imposing "my will" or "what I think is right" on anyone. Fact is, until they can be MAN and WIFE, they can do whatever they want in their twisted sexual orientation... without the same privileges as MAN and WIFE
I already replied to the remark about my kids being gay ~ how many times are you going to repeat that? You'll get the same answer every time. They'll have been raised well enough to know that if they want to be studmuffinots, they won't expect to be afforded the same privileges as a MAN and WIFE. I won't repeat that again though, no matter how many times you say you wish my kids end up gay. Twice is now probably enough for you to understand that I meant it.
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You seem to be willing to call everyone else's gay children queers, studmuffinots, fudge packers, and every other derogatory remark in the book, but when it comes to your kids. It's i'll love them and respect them for whatever they do. If your going to be like that, be like that all the way.
I personally think people in religion should stop blaming, condemning, and pointing down on other people because they don't follow their rules of law. And saying it's in the name of God. I personally don't think God is so petty to be that condemning and uncompassionate to people. Not saying your christian, this is just my idea on religion and gays, and religious discrimination.
Alot of christians need to get this point about the bible. The whole purpose of that book is this.....Love everyone, treat your fellow man as equals, treat yourself with respect, treat others with respect, respect others lives and decisions without judgment or condemnation, love is unconditional, love is all, that is all.
God exists independant of religion, religion is our way of trying to interpret God and what already exists, no matter how right or wrong it may be at times, but it should never be used to judge anyone.
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wow txmom.
I think I have just had a seen some "ugly"....back pedalling not included.
RTR
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Originally posted by LEADPIG
You seem to be willing to call everyone else's gay children queers, studmuffinots, fudge packers, and every other derogatory remark in the book, but when it comes to your kids. It's i'll love them and respect them for whatever they do. If your going to be like that, be like that all the way.
I personally think people in religion should stop blaming, condemning, and pointing down on other people because they don't follow their rules of law. And saying it's in the name of God. I personally don't think God is so petty to be that condemning and uncompassionate to people. Not saying your christian, this is just my idea on religion and gays, and religious discrimination.
Alot of christians need to get this point about the bible. The whole purpose of that book is this.....Love everyone, treat your fellow man as equals, treat yourself with respect, treat others with respect, respect others lives and decisions without judgment or condemnation, love is unconditional, love is all, that is all.
God exists independant of religion, religion is our way of trying to interpret God and what already exists, no matter how right or wrong it may be at times, but it should never be used to judge anyone.
Who brought God into it? (other than you) I never said it was my Christian belief... I never said that my belief was as a result of what God instructed.
You just automatically popped off with that because that's the standard answer.
And yes, if one of my kids ends up gay...will I love them? Yes, absolutely.
But I'm not changing to accomodate "hurting feelings." I think what I think what I think. Why are you wrapped around the axel on my kids? Same answer as before: if they end up studmuffinots, they're going to have been raised well enough to understand that they WON'T be afforded the same rights under the law as MAN and WIFE. Period. I'm sorry, am I going to have to repeat that again? Or is the "kid" route the only one you think is going to work here?
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No i, "popped off with it", as you say, because i wanted to for your info. If you would have read it you would have noticed i said something to the effect of. "Not saying your christian, these are just my beliefs on gays and religion and religious discrimination." That was your cue to know i wasn't talking about you. Any more questions?
Oh and as far as your kids go, it is a rhetorical as well as inconsequential, point of view to explain the ambiguity of the situation.
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Originally posted by LEADPIG
No i, "popped off with it", as you say, because i wanted to for your info. If you would have read it you would have noticed i said something to the effect of. "Not saying your christian, these are just my beliefs on gays and religion and religious discrimination." That was your cue to know i wasn't talking about you. Any more questions?
No more questions necessary. If you were remarking about how your own Christian beliefs led you to show how we shouldn't discriminate, you conveniently left out all of the multitude of passages in which God specifically condemned homosexuality. period.
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Well, I think you should leave god out of it. period.
I mean, come on, the poor guy's already in hiding as it is. What with being sued and all.
Not to mention the fact that he's suspiciously MIA and hasn't responded to the allegations against him. I wouldn't be surprised if he showed up on Americas Most Wanted. Ahh well, we could always start rounding up priests.:noid
But I digress.
Oh wait, no I don't. My whole post is pointless. It is rounded at the ends. It is obtuse. It is without angles. To a point, it is blunt.
oh well..back to your regularly scheduled O'Club bashing.
cheers,
RTR
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Originally posted by texasmom
No more questions necessary. If you were remarking about how your own Christian beliefs led you to show how we shouldn't discriminate, you conveniently left out all of the multitude of passages in which God specifically condemned homosexuality. period.
Yea all that stuff about god hating homosexuals and sending them to hell, complete crap to me. God ain't that hateful, mean or condemning in my eyes, only us judgemental people are. I have a feeling all the people hating on folks and saying everyone else is going to hell will be the ones actually going, and the ones not paying attention to all that and just loving people unconditionally and nonjudgementally won't. The bible is not the untainted word of of god, just my opinion. People misinterpret it, it is written in story form to show the basic ideas and principles and you must look underneath the entire surface for the true message and get the main idea. It is taken too literally. If that is the case i should take my only begotten son and try to burn him and wait for god to stop me before i do it i suppose. That's some wicked God that would play a joke like that on his people. And people believe that stuff word for word. Sounds like something we would do instead of God.
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Originally posted by texasmom
No more questions necessary. If you were remarking about how your own Christian beliefs led you to show how we shouldn't discriminate, you conveniently left out all of the multitude of passages in which God specifically condemned homosexuality. period.
He left out the stuff about our specific duty to stone to death any woman found guilty of adultery, or the specific right of us to have slaves and do to them whatever we like etc. etc. etc. that is evident throughout the bible too.
Cherry picking the bible for anti-gay rhetoric is akin to zealous musilms cherry picking the Koran for passages that justify strapping on bombs and killing non believers.
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ledpig...you must be very young.. you are very passionate and very silly... unable to see what is right in front of you because you are trying to figure out how many angles can dance on the head of a pin.
I would do fine in marketing... If I said that jews don't eat pork... it would not be discriminator... it would not matter at all the reasons only that the fact would not be changing any time soon. you would waste a lot of time trying to understand it.
When you get older you will realize that generalizations are.. for the most part. a good thing.. If they are true. They save time and grief.
You claim victim status... neither of our grandparents went to school... both worked like slaves.. many came here not knowing the language only a few years ago... asians came here and were hated for their skin color and their racial physical traits AND they didn't speak the language... yet... when the negros burn their own cities to the ground... the asians protect their property... they don't snivel.. they get on with the program.
When they told me that no programs were available for me because I was white and none were left for white.... Why didn't I just learn some form of gaelic ebonics and steep myself in self pitty?
In America.. especialy in the last half a century... but even before then... the only victims are those who make themselves such.
It doesn't matter to me why your people are the way they are... the crime.. the violence and the clothes and culture... I just don't want em in my neighborhood because the are IN GENERAL bad for the place... no good at all comes from being around them... they have nothing to offer but crime and blame.
They don't do well... it is because they aren't getting schooling... bus em to school.. they ruin the school and then drop out... and every time... no matter what... it is someone elses fault. You are going to have to grow up some day and see that people have to take responsibility for their own actions...
lazs
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Originally posted by uberhun
Thats easy. Because the way the current laws are written their is a biased distinction between being "married" and a civil union. Their is a whole list of things afford a married Man and Woman couple, that two people of the same sex are not allowed.
p.s (don't take this so personally it is not meant to be, it is just open debate of opposing view points) !
In other words, gays are discriminated against because they cannot have the new 'right' which has been newly invented just for them, which has never before existed in the annals of history?
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Being looked at in this country as a human being without being looked at with regards to race, sex, preferance, religion with total freedom and having that protected by law is a bad thing. Is a new idea? If people of a certain religion don't want gay people to be married fine. But America is not a religion and should not treat people as if it is one with it's own ideals to be thrown onto people. People should be looked at as human beings period, i don't care if you like what they do or not. And a country winch touts it's mantra as total equality should be protecting those rights without regards of judgement, creed or mentality.
Just because something existed before in the past doesn't mean it's right to be continued or repeated.
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Originally posted by lazs2
you would waste a lot of time trying to understand it.
Since when is trying to understand a different viewpoint or phenomenon a bad thing. I guess if you were Thomas Eddison and you noticed some funny light come from the point of the atom, you'd just ignore it and accept it. People like you never find anything out Lasz because you are oh so willing to except things at face value. We'd be sitting in the dark right now if it was up to you. You are a follower not a discoverer, hinging on the backs of people who are willing to think.
By Lasz2
When you get older you will realize that generalizations are.. for the most part. a good thing.. If they are true. They save time and grief.
Generalizations are just that generalizations, and are just surface measurements. They neither explain the impetus or the motivation behind a situation and as such leave the real reasons unexposed to full understanding.
By Lasz2
It doesn't matter to me why your people are the way they are... the crime.. the violence and the clothes and culture... I just don't want em in my neighborhood because the are IN GENERAL bad for the place... no good at all comes from being around them... they have nothing to offer but crime and blame.
They don't do well... it is because they aren't getting schooling... bus em to school.. they ruin the school and then drop out... and every time... no matter what... it is someone elses fault. You are going to have to grow up some day and see that people have to take responsibility for their own actions...
This is one surface thinking genarilized, prejudiced, insubstantially recognized and processed thought of incomplete information, which he is not able or smart enough to reason the real reasons behind.
I am black Lasz
I do not commit crime
I do not where "funny" clothes or blame
I want nothing from you.
I did not drop out of school
(I was constantly on the dean's list and usually held somewhere between a 3.4 to 3.8 GPA)
Book learning is not higher learning
I have been a pilot since i was 16 years old.
Just by the fact that i am or do any of those things throws your whole judgement into perspective and proves your generalizations are wrong.
For a generalization to be wholly correct it must count and encompass the possibilities of every situation. I am not one of those situations. Think deeper Lasz your generalizations are incorrect.
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Originally posted by LEADPIG
I do not where "funny" clothes or blame
I did not drop out of school
(I was constantly on the dean's list and usually held somewhere between a 3.4 to 3.8 GPA)
you don't "where" funny clothes and you were on the deans list? What list was that, the bad spelling list? :lol
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(http://www.forumspile.com/Spelling-DictionaryNazi.gif)
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4- Members should post in a way that is respectful of other users and HTC. Flaming or abusing users is not tolerated.
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Originally posted by Curval
Cherry picking the bible for anti-gay rhetoric is akin to zealous musilms cherry picking the Koran for passages that justify strapping on bombs and killing non believers.
Didn't read all nine pages, but that's got to be about the stupidest statement in the thread.
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Originally posted by Murdr
Didn't read all nine pages, but that's got to be about the stupidest statement in the thread.
Really? That is saying something, because there is alot of stupid stuff here.
Care to elaborate or are you just doing a fly-by comment?
I think it is stupid to take a few passages written by men and call it the word of God and then use it to justify discrimmintaing against a whole group of people.
Don't like my anology...pick another.
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IMO (I grew up with muslims) it's not the Koran on its own, it's the culture. I think neither of them play a minor part, but culture and traditions are more to blame than their bible.
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Originally posted by LEADPIG
4- Members should post in a way that is respectful of other users and HTC. Flaming or abusing users is not tolerated.
no, really, i don't see any personal attack here, do you? :rolleyes:
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LOL.. ledpig.. do you even know what a generalization is? If I say that "in general, blacks commit 7 times the crime of whites and commit more than half of all homicides." And you say... " I am black and I am not a criminal and I have not committed any homicides."
That does no make the facts of the generalization wrong... only that you don't fit the generalization. The generalization is still valid.
So far as understanding goes....
You probly need to understand light and the mechanics of the thing to invent light... you don't need to understand the why to turn on a light switch... if you try to understand why a light works by how you "feel" about it... then you are wasting time. I don't think "understanding" means what you think it does.
You seem to do a lot of mental masturbation... that is fine.. you are a student.. you are naive too it seems but... excessive masturbation of any kind is not good for you. Sometimes you just have to accept that something is as it seems. That simple feelings are not a path to understanding... just mental masturbation.
In my opinion... all this victimhood crap is causing the problem and that is about all the deeper I want to get into it so far as my "feelings" I do believe that my "feelings" are more logical than yours and that the more you treat people like victims the more excuse they have to not get anywhere.
I can't help but wonder if you have ever even had an original thought.
lazs
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Oh... and to burst another of your pet liberal ideals... gays have exactly the same rights in marriage as does anyone else.
Marriage is the union of two people of the opposite sex who are not immediate family. Gays have every right to participate in that way.
You want to define marriage as sex. Two people having sex and wanting to be married... a single man raising his daughter loves that daughter and is having a hard time with the bills and what not.. (been there)... why shouldn't he be allowed to marry his daughter and get all the benifiets? What about pedophiles? shouldn't they not be discriminated against?
Or... do you accept some rules? some restrictions? Perhaps you want a new definition of marriage and what it should be? There is nothing stopping gays from entering a financial agreement with each other or a contract... they just can't call it a marriage because it doesn't fit into the current guidelines.
lazs
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Originally posted by Curval
I think it is stupid to take a few passages written by men and call it the word of God and then use it to justify discrimmintaing against a whole group of people.
Ok, let's go with that then. For the sake of discussion, lets just say the bible is a collection of alagories to discourage behavior that is counter-productive to a community/society, and promote behavior that is good for society (morality).
Is it cherry picking to cite passages about adultery?
How about greed?
How about sloth?
Oh wait...you brought up discrimination in this quote....Back to morality for a second. Goverment legislates morality...seriously, think about it. Not only do they make laws against what is wrong, but they also give insentives for good behaviour in some instances. Take marriage for instance. Thousands of years ago people figured out that a child with both parents there to support them had a better chance for survival, and as civilation developed, a better chance of becomming a contributing member. Obviously the acients were on to something since the tradition has taken hold in almost all societies world wide throughout history.
So the 190something legal perks granted by the US government, are incentives to carry on the tradition. Yes, some are pratical protections for property and transfering services, but many are perks for doing what the government sees as keeping society going for generations to come.
So exactly were does the concept of "same sex marriage" benifit society with the production of future generations to carry on society? Admittedly, there are ways for that, but let's continue to be pratical. So with premiss for the concept being absent, how is it discrimination to withhold those perks?
I don't think it is. Everyone has the choice to "marry" as it has been defined throughout history, hence no discrimination. People who don't like that option may not think it's fair, but that does not make them entitled to a redefinition of marriage.
I do in pricipal support some legal protections to be extended to same sex couples. It is obviously not cool for a "partner" to be denied some sort of "next of kin" status in many instances. I'll buy that lack of those protections in many states lead to descrimination. That does not mean that they are entitled to all the perks the government has seen fit to grant to people who are actually married as has been defined throughout history.
Back to your quote. I take exception to you comparing a simple statement of personal belief, with going out and murdering people. I take exception to the premiss that an opposition to same sex marriage is automatically anti-gay/pro-descrimination. Just because someone draws the line short of same sex marriage based on thier beliefs, does not automatically make them a bigot/zealot.
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Good for you...you managed to put all that down in a post without using the term "fugepackers" "queers" or "studmuffinots". This implies a level of discussion without emotion. The same cannot be said for others.
Now...to this:
"Back to your quote. I take exception to you comparing a simple statement of personal belief, with going out and murdering people. I take exception to the premiss that an opposition to same sex marriage is automatically anti-gay/pro-descrimination. Just because someone draws the line short of same sex marriage based on thier beliefs, does not automatically make them a bigot/zealot."
I was not reacting to a simple statement of personal belief...I was reacting to the name calling and then backtracking and using a bible reference to justify the hatred that is evident. Take exception all you like to that...I take exception to the posts I reacted to.
You claim that a line has been drawn "short of same sex marriage based on their beliefs"...but have you read the posts I am referring to? Have you? The venom coming out of those posts CLEARLY relates to something deeper than same sex marriages.
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Hi Texas Mom,
No disrespect intended, but what exactly are these "rights" that a married man and woman have? I've been trying to figure that out since well before this thread. Is it just the insurance? With most of the rights of Americans in general being surreptitiously spirited away by the government, I'm fuzzy on which ones are actually left, let alone afforded exclusively to a "married man and woman".
I was curious to know, because the whole turn on this discussion has brought you out of silence to a roaring stance on opinion. It is obviously something that you have a strong opinion about. Does it hit close to home? Wondering what made you go from zero to holy ****, something has her bent, in 2 posts or less.
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I'm against gay marriage.
They have every other right imaginable as a normal couple, except for marriage.
Yes i say normal, because nearly every creature on this planet has a male and female. Males fertilize the eggs of the female and the species continues.
The line DOES have to be drawn somewhere.
If we don't set a standard then the gates are opened for alot worse than a man/man, or woman/woman marriage. What happens when some nutbag says he wants to marry his pet turtle. You can laugh, but you allow one set of abnormal behavior, and the nut with the turtle will cry discrimination, and it WILL be just a matter of time before some banana lawyers get behind the case/cause.