Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aircraft and Vehicles => Topic started by: loonetik on September 27, 2007, 12:55:42 PM
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I have been flying simulators for along time now. I started out in flight simulator and moved into things like air warrior, war birds, etc... I have been in aces high off and on since launch.
My favorite plane in air warrior was the p38. In aces high I started flying the 190d (well ok LA7 but, everyone did right?), moved to the p51 for awhile, throw in a Hurricane IIC when we are being camped and now I am pretty much purely a KI84 pilot. I am mainly an energy fighter, little bnz, and very little t&b.
I recently watched dogfight episodes about the Corsair and P38 so I am pumped up and want to learn something new. I know the P38 is no where as good as it was in air warrior. Maybe because its more realistic here?.. I know the Corsair is a good plane, but I see some talk over flying the f6f instead. I also see guys in the tempest survive so much so that kind of interests me. I’ve never flown a typhoon or tempest.
I know this is question is all based on opinion but, what would you guys suggest?
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Spend a couple of months in a spitfire first learning the Flight Model and gunnery and damage models. Then slowly start experiementing with different planes and tactics.
Yak9u is another good choice for an intermediate plane that will both turn and E fight.
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Originally posted by Ghosth
Spend a couple of months in a spitfire first learning the Flight Model and gunnery and damage models. Then slowly start experiementing with different planes and tactics.
Yak9u is another good choice for an intermediate plane that will both turn and E fight.
What it sounds like you are saying is "learn the basics". I feel I already know a lot of the basics. Is there another reason for you suggesting this path?
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Go with the corsair... blue planes are fun.
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Originally posted by loonetik
I know the P38 is no where as good as it was in air warrior. Maybe because its more realistic here?
Actually, whatever you could do in the P-38 in AW, you can do it with the P-38s in AH and a lot more. In the hands of an experienced player, the P-38 is by far one of the more deadly planes in the game.
ack-ack
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Corsairs's a great plane to learn. Holds E OK but absolutely deadly in the BnZ and turnfighting. I would suggest learning the 1-hog first (just the plain 1 model) so you can get a feel for the other F4U's. 1-A a great turnfighter and BnZ AC, while the 1-D is more of an attack/multirole aircraft. 1-C has great armament and a good payload, but is perked. F4U-4 im pretty sure THE fastest prop aircraft on the deck, and is perked pretty well. Also a great payload. This bird can TURN!!
But really its up to you on what plane you should pick. As prevuisly stated, Yak is a good plane as well :D
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Originally posted by loonetik
I know this is question is all based on opinion but, what would you guys suggest?
There are so many planes in AH2, almost all of them are fun to fly (I exclude the P-40B from this statement). So, MY advice is to try them all, sooner or later.
The AH P-38, as Ack-Ack says, is one of the best fighters in AH, once you learn how to fly it. I think that it's also one of the hardest to learn to fly well, just as it was in AW FR. Same for the Corsair.
- oldman (And I'm still working on the FW 190A8.)
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Really is up to you Loonetik, you say you've been here on & off. But that really doesn't tell me how good you are, or where your at skill wise.
Its possible a couple of nights in the TA and some time with a good trainer would have you setup and ready to go. Over the years I've seen a lot of people come here from other sims. Some just need a few days to adjust and they are ready to go. Others never really mastered one on one combat with a live human and virtually start from scratch to get it right. It is of course your dime and your time.
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From what I hear, the P-38's not even a plane.
It's a monster.
One deadlier to the wielder than to the enemy if flown aimlessly.
But if flown correctly, I'm assuming it is one of the most deadly energy fighters in the game even if there are other guys out there that are experts in their spixteens, lala's and what have you.
Except MAYBE the F4U. I can't even find a way to kill Hog's while flying P-38's but that's just cuz i stink.
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Whether the p38 in aces high in the right hands is good or not, it was a dominating plane in air warrior. Even in bad hands. All I was trying to say was that was my plane of choice in air warrior.
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Originally posted by loonetik
Whether the p38 in aces high in the right hands is good or not, it was a dominating plane in air warrior. Even in bad hands. All I was trying to say was that was my plane of choice in air warrior.
So, you're saying that you sucked? :p
Anyway, try the Yak-9U. It's an extremely deadly plane below 10,500 feet... In capable hands (just as the MiG-3 is black death above that altitude, but since we don't have it, that point is rather moot, isn't it?).
It accelerates very well. It turns very well. Its controls are very responsive, and it's a stable plane. It has some pretty heavy shortcomings that keep most pilots away from it, though.
For starters, it doesn't have the most devastating weapons package --- 2x 7.62mm and 1x 20mm, in the nose and cowl, respectively. Along with that, while the Yak is a stable fighter, it's not quite so stable when you're trying to position yourself for a kill. And to top it all off, it doesn't have very much range, and it flat-out sucks up high.
That said, it's excellent below the previously stated altitude. If you fly it properly (read: don't turn fight with Spitfires), you'll succeed. And the Yak is second only to Focke Wulfs in Rolling Scissors.
Try it... But watch that trigger finger.
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I think you should discover the wonder-plane called the B-26 Martin Marauder.
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Seconding the Yak-9U. It's one of the lightest and fastest planes in the game. With a 50% fuel load it can out-turn a lot of other planes. The problem is it carries about 3 seconds of ammo for its MGs and cannon.
But since it's made out of Russian plywood, by the time you run out of ammo you've probably lost half your control surfaces as well :aok
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You could always try A6M, I would suggest the A6M5b for starting though. It's a fine plane but you won't see it often do to the idea no one likes slow planes, and other reasons.
Maneuverability: The best in the game when the speeds are slow except for the A6M2. Although if the speeds pick up past 250 it becomes a lot harder to turn and you start blacking out fast.
Speed: Probably the biggest factor that dictates why it isen't used. It's slow, really slow... 288 MPH on the deck and 330 at 10,000 Ft. Anything higher then that is a waste of time. There is also no WEP for it.
Armament: Pretty fair, but unfortunetly the gun ballistics themself are atrocious. With 1x 7.7mm(680 Rpg) Cowl Mounted and 1x 13mm(250 Rpg) Cowl Mounted and 2x 20mm(125 Rpg) its not horrible on ammo. Keep the 20mm's for 200 Yrd. shots and the Cowlings for everything else, with practice you can hit targets out to 800 Yrds. if they are flying a straight line.
All in all this is a short over-view of the plane, there are plenty more Pros and Cons to look at, but for the best experience try it yourself a few times, if you like it, keep flying it, if you don't, you can always try an other plane.
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Originally posted by Fruda
Anyway, try the Yak-9U. It's an extremely deadly plane below 10,500 feet...
And to top it all off, it doesn't have very much range, and it flat-out sucks up high..
Yak-9U dominates 16-17k. Only thing faster w/o wep @ that alt (prop plane) is a Tempest. 190D and 190K are a bit faster w/ wep. (and of course the temp)
Of the 4 planes that are "close" or en par to it's speed @ that alt, it out maneuvers 'em handily.
Great ride.
(http://www.hitechcreations.com/ahhelp/models/charts/yak9uspd.gif)
(http://www.hitechcreations.com/ahhelp/models/charts/p51dspd.gif)
(http://www.hitechcreations.com/ahhelp/models/charts/190d9spd.gif)
(http://www.hitechcreations.com/ahhelp/models/charts/109K4spd.gif)
(http://www.hitechcreations.com/ahhelp/models/charts/tempestspd.gif)
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Originally posted by Ack-Ack
Actually, whatever you could do in the P-38 in AW, you can do it with the P-38s in AH and a lot more. In the hands of an experienced player, the P-38 is by far one of the more deadly planes in the game.
ack-ack
Yeah...might want to talk to Guppy...he can teach ya how to wreck one in 15 seconds...:D
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I still have my original Air Warrior disc. The P-38 was my favorite plane, and it's pretty good in AH too.
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I'm going to need to learn how to fly it once i get enough time to play again.
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Originally posted by WMLute
Yak-9U dominates 16-17k. Only thing faster w/o wep @ that alt (prop plane) is a Tempest. 190D and 190K are a bit faster w/ wep. (and of course the temp)
Of the 4 planes that are "close" or en par to it's speed @ that alt, it out maneuvers 'em handily.
Great ride.
(http://www.hitechcreations.com/ahhelp/models/charts/yak9uspd.gif)
(http://www.hitechcreations.com/ahhelp/models/charts/p51dspd.gif)
(http://www.hitechcreations.com/ahhelp/models/charts/190d9spd.gif)
(http://www.hitechcreations.com/ahhelp/models/charts/109K4spd.gif)
(http://www.hitechcreations.com/ahhelp/models/charts/tempestspd.gif)
Well, that's a load off of my mind. I was always told to stay under 10k, but I never actually looked at any whitepaper stats.
Now that I know, well... Hahaha. I'll be using it just a bit more often, then!
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no one ever shows 109's any love :(
i guess thats a good thing then, huh?
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I think the best thing you can do.. given the time is fly EVERY plane.. exclusivly for like.. 10 sorties to a week depending on how much stick time you devote to AH..
after that, no matter what you fly, youve got an edge.. because you have been on the other side, you know what the opposing ride can and cant do, what gave YOU problems in it and what YOU could do well in it, and act accordingly based on that info.. hell, learn em all.. 2 weeks ago i would have never guessed i would end up loving the yak 9u, but its by far my favorite ride... before MAKING myself fly it.. i never gave it a second thought. :aok
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Originally posted by Snubby
I think the best thing you can do.. given the time is fly EVERY plane.. exclusivly for like.. 10 sorties to a week depending on how much stick time you devote to AH..
after that, no matter what you fly, youve got an edge.. because you have been on the other side, you know what the opposing ride can and cant do, what gave YOU problems in it and what YOU could do well in it, and act accordingly based on that info.. hell, learn em all
Which is to say: Welcome to AvA.
- oldman
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Is there another reason for you suggesting this path?
Ghosth's opinion is very sound, because Spitfires are like a testbed for learning the feel of one game to the other. You'll know what this means, especially if you've been flying Flightsims for a long time.
With every new Flightsim game, I try the Spitfires first. When I feel how this Spitfire in this game handles differently from other Spitfires in other games, that kinda immediatelty gives me an idea on what the difference in the FM between the two games.
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Originally posted by WMLute
Yak-9U dominates 16-17k. Only thing faster w/o wep @ that alt (prop plane) is a Tempest. 190D and 190K are a bit faster w/ wep. (and of course the temp)
Of the 4 planes that are "close" or en par to it's speed @ that alt, it out maneuvers 'em handily.
Great ride.
Well, the P-51B is faster at 17k at MIL power and faster yet in WEP. The F4U-4 is also faster, as is the P-47N. It's largely a dead heat with the Spit14, but the Spit is much better in the vertical and accelerates much faster.
High speed turns are g limited. At low speeds (below 200 mph) the Yak is nothing to sweat, being unstable at the limit and will snap-spin at high AoA. Only between 200 mph and corner speed is the Yak a threat to out-maneuver another fighter.
When compared to the F4U-4, it's almost helpless. This F4U out-performs the Yak in every parameter.
At 17k, the Yak accelerates in a leisurely fashion, and the climb rate isn't much to write home about. At that altitude, the P-51B accelerates faster, climbs faster and can run down the Yak in a chase.
Comparing the Yak's speed to the 109K at 16-17k tells you little. The 109K accelerates and climbs much faster. Getting to max speed takes almost twice as long for the Yak as it does for the 109K. While the Yak has an impressive top speed, it takes forever to get there.
I agree that the Yak-9U is a very good fighter, but it's not exceptional. I'd take an F6F-5 over the Yak any day. Ditto for the F4U-1A/-1D. I'd take a P-38J/L over the Yak too. Same goes for the Spit8. Now the Yak is 20 mph faster than the Spit8 at sea level and 17k (the Spit is its equal at 20k). However, the Spit8 accelerates so much faster that it can run down the Yak before it can build enough speed to escape, getting from 150 mph to 300 mph 15% quicker. The higher you go, the bigger the gap in acceleration.
I don't want to discourage people from flying the Yak-9U, but I want them to understand that a slow Yak is usually a dead Yak. Keep it fast and avoid getting into slow turn fights.
My regards,
Widewing
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Originally posted by Widewing
Well, the P-51B is faster at 17k at MIL power and faster yet in WEP. The F4U-4 is also faster, as is the P-47N. It's largely a dead heat with the Spit14, but the Spit is much better in the vertical and accelerates much faster.
High speed turns are g limited. At low speeds (below 200 mph) the Yak is nothing to sweat, being unstable at the limit and will snap-spin at high AoA. Only between 200 mph and corner speed is the Yak a threat to out-maneuver another fighter.
When compared to the F4U-4, it's almost helpless. This F4U out-performs the Yak in every parameter.
At 17k, the Yak accelerates in a leisurely fashion, and the climb rate isn't much to write home about. At that altitude, the P-51B accelerates faster, climbs faster and can run down the Yak in a chase.
Comparing the Yak's speed to the 109K at 16-17k tells you little. The 109K accelerates and climbs much faster. Getting to max speed takes almost twice as long for the Yak as it does for the 109K. While the Yak has an impressive top speed, it takes forever to get there.
I agree that the Yak-9U is a very good fighter, but it's not exceptional. I'd take an F6F-5 over the Yak any day. Ditto for the F4U-1A/-1D. I'd take a P-38J/L over the Yak too. Same goes for the Spit8. Now the Yak is 20 mph faster than the Spit8 at sea level and 17k (the Spit is its equal at 20k). However, the Spit8 accelerates so much faster that it can run down the Yak before it can build enough speed to escape, getting from 150 mph to 300 mph 15% quicker. The higher you go, the bigger the gap in acceleration.
I don't want to discourage people from flying the Yak-9U, but I want them to understand that a slow Yak is usually a dead Yak. Keep it fast and avoid getting into slow turn fights.
My regards,
Widewing
I decided to try the Yak-9U up high after hearing that it was dominant up there, and to my surprise, it wasn't quite what I was told. As you said, its acceleration is quite poor at that altitude... As is its stability and turning rate.
I've found that my best altitude in the Yak-9U (and -9T) is about 4,500 - 8,500 feet. It does everything well in that range, it's fast, and it rolls nicely. I don't get shot down very often in the Yaks at that altitude range, unless of course four or more enemies decide to gang up on me...
...But three, I can handle to a reasonable degree. Not as well as I can in a 109 or a Spitfire Mk. IX, but well enough.