Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: wrag on December 20, 2007, 09:39:45 AM
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A new Nation is born?
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,317548,00.html
This could get interesting...............
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Wonder how much land they can claim.
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You go Indians!
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I wonder where the US government will get the small pox infested blankets this time?
:rofl
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Originally posted by GtoRA2
I wonder where the US government will get the small pox infested blankets this time?
:rofl
Myth.
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Should be interesting.
Give them the land back, remove the evil and vile technology that has plagued them, take out the roads, the water, the sewer, and give them back their teepees.
After 140-150 years, their population has the highest teen suicide rate and shortest life span of the males, while others thrive. The fact that they stew about things and blame others is telling, they are not survivors. They need to be careful what they ask for. In this current weak kneed culture bent on apologizing for everything, they are liable to get it. Hope they remember how to use a bow, because the connection fee's to use the US power, water, electrical and infrastructure is going to be more than they can afford.
And yes, my grandfather is Cherokee, my family has a long history with the Indian culture, so I do get to speak to this moronic move on their part,
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Originally posted by lasersailor184
Myth.
Joke derr... :rolleyes:
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Originally posted by ROC
Should be interesting.
Give them the land back, remove the evil and vile technology that has plagued them, take out the roads, the water, the sewer, and give them back their teepees.
After 140-150 years, their population has the highest teen suicide rate and shortest life span of the males, while others thrive. The fact that they stew about things and blame others is telling, they are not survivors. They need to be careful what they ask for. In this current weak kneed culture bent on apologizing for everything, they are liable to get it. Hope they remember how to use a bow, because the connection fee's to use the US power, water, electrical and infrastructure is going to be more than they can afford.
And yes, my grandfather is Cherokee, my family has a long history with the Indian culture, so I do get to speak to this moronic move on their part,
I have to agree with ROC.
I also share the Native American Heritage being part Mohican.
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Oppression at the hands of the U.S. government has taken its toll on the Lakota, whose men have one of the shortest life expectancies - less than 44 years - in the world.
Lakota teen suicides are 150 per cent above the norm for the U.S.; infant mortality is five times higher than the U.S. average; and unemployment is rife, according to the Lakota freedom movement's website.
Christ, lay off the booze and dope then quit blaming others for your problems, you'll live longer!:lol
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There will probably be some kind of new treaty, One in which they get more assistance/subsidy's, and then they'll be quiet for awhile. The U.S. gov't. won't let it get as far as an independent Indian nation.
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Until they make some overt act to interfere in the operation of the Govt. and it's citizens this is all a bunch of hot air.
In the mean time since the treaties are now void by their claim, simply stop ALL subsistence payments and support operations to the members of those tribes. It's long since past the the time they should have been stopped. Stop also the upkeep on any reservation in the area.
Anything dealing with a state or fed govt. agency should also stop until they decide how they are going to proceed or if they will even be recognized by the state or feds. You can claim independence all you want, but that does not mean it has to be recognized.
Casino licenses should also be looked at with the purpose of deciding if they can be allowed to continue using real money. If they don't recognize the feds. then perhaps they should not be allowed to use federal currency in any enterprise.
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notice how he mentioned a "Non-binding" UN resolution. That's a redundant term if I ever heard one.
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I plan on being the first dam White Man to open a Casino on their land...tax free!
Beads and Blankets Baby!!!!
:aok
Mac
Does this mean we get to play Cowboys and Indians again?
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Originally posted by AWMac
I plan on being the first dam White Man to open a Casino on their land...tax free!
Beads and Blankets Baby!!!!
:aok
Mac
Does this mean we get to play Cowboys and Indians again?
That's already happened, but wasn't the Lakota's iirc. There's an Indian Casino on a reservation that belongs to a drive that went extinct as a culture 60 years ago. A few guys that were 8% indian used that 8% to open up a casino. Now it's the most profitable casino in the US (and probably the world). How much of that money actually goes to the tribe? well, none. :huh
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Originally posted by GtoRA2
I wonder where the US government will get the small pox infested blankets this time?
:rofl
Please support this claim that the Indians were deliberately infected with pox ridden blankets. Of all the ridiculous claims against the Indians this one is one of the worst. People back then didn't even know how small pox was transmitted let alone knew how to wage germ warfare.
Of all the silly accusations of that era this one is probably the silliest. But even the accusation, silly as it is, involved a British citizen named Jeffrey Amhurst and didn't involve Americans at all. There wasnt even an America at the time of this co called incident.
And just think of the savings to the US taxpayer of the Lakota and Puerto Rico start their own nations like they have promised. Over 60% of Puerto Rico is on welfare and I bet at least that much of the Lakota is getting their monthly check.
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Originally posted by Rich46yo
Please support this claim that the Indians were deliberately infected with pox ridden blankets. Of all the ridiculous claims against the Indians this one is one of the worst. People back then didn't even know how small pox was transmitted let alone knew how to wage germ warfare.
Of all the silly accusations of that era this one is probably the silliest. But even the accusation, silly as it is, involved a British citizen named Jeffrey Amhurst and didn't involve Americans at all. There wasnt even an America at the time of this co called incident.
And just think of the savings to the US taxpayer of the Lakota and Puerto Rico start their own nations like they have promised. Over 60% of Puerto Rico is on welfare and I bet at least that much of the Lakota is getting their monthly check.
Lighten up francis. Then go look up "joke" at Dictionary.com.
Then remove the bunch of pantie acting like a thong.
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Originally posted by GtoRA2
Lighten up francis. Then go look up "joke" at Dictionary.com.
Then remove the bunch of pantie acting like a thong.
When you have stupidity coming from California its hard to tell if they are joking or not.:lol Were talking about a place that lets ex-football players and TV stars get away with murder and turn a Rodney King into a cult hero.
"remove the bunch of pantie acting like a thong".?
You rate low even for a Californian. So where do you think that places you on the worldwide scale? :rofl
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Originally posted by Rich46yo
When you have stupidity coming from California its hard to tell if they are joking or not.:lol Were talking about a place that lets ex-football players and TV stars get away with murder and turn a Rodney King into a cult hero.
"remove the bunch of pantie acting like a thong".?
You rate low even for a Californian. So where do you think that places you on the worldwide scale? :rofl
Maybe if you had read the whole thread before getting yourself all worked up over a Californian you would have seen I stated it was a joke well before your post. You do know what JOKE means right?
They must not teach reading all that well where you are from. That being the case I can see why you don't say.
Have fun on the little yellow bus I didn't think they had them for old men like you.
:rofl
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Give them California! Nothing but a bunch of nuts, fruits and flakes.
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Hell give them a res and remove all federal and state property first. Cut the power, water, phone and any other utility. Then charge them for EVERYTHING!
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Perhaps they will get more in US foreign aid than they did under the treaties with the US.
Shoot, they could declare war on the US then get war reparations.
Perhaps they can lease rights to a foreign military base to say... Russia in exchange for say... money.
Perhaps they can threaten to do that and receive US funding to agree not to.
Perhaps they will legalize Marijuana and openly sell it to the white eyes.
Perhaps they can open casinos and avoid paying taxes to the US and State governments.
Perhaps they can lease land for manufacturing facilities to American companies and provide low cost foreign labor from say Mexico and provide foreign tax hedge for these companies and earn money on the leases and collect lower taxes instead of taxes going to the US Government.
Perhaps they will qualify as a 3rd world country and receive UN assistance for medical care and money to improve their infrastructure.
Perhaps they can get a seat in the UN.
Perhaps they will force the US Government to redraw US State boundaries and show a new nation.
Perhaps there are natural resources they can sell to foreign countries like the US.
Perhaps they will make treaties with other countries to protect themselves from the US Government in the event of a US invasion.
Prehaps they will make toys using Mexican labor and compete with China for US imports.
Perhaps they will provide secret bank accounts to companies and individuals.
Perhaps they will laugh all the way to their own banks.
Seems to me there can be an upside for them in all this.
TIGERESS
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Amen Tigress...
About time the Redman stuck it to Whitey.
What's that old saying... the Native American man hunted and fished all day, payed no taxes,a nd the women did all the work... The White man arrived and though he could improve on that.
Down with Whitey!
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Somehow I can't see them forming guerrilla bands and besieging cavalry forts. I suspect the motivation is more to do with the mighty dollar, these people being Americans after all, native or not.
As much as anything it's a media stunt, designed to draw attention to their cause. However maybe they have a point. Unless you fall in line with the mainstream. The treatment you receive can be pitiless. The truth is that living off handouts does nothing for self esteem. No wonder drink is still a big problem and life expectancy is so low.
Reading between the lines. I think they are asking for help to end the vicious circle of poverty and depression.
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Originally posted by Tigeress
Perhaps they will get more in US foreign aid than they did under the treaties with the US.
Shoot, they could declare war on the US then get war reparations.
Perhaps they can lease rights to a foreign military base to say... Russia in exchange for say... money.
Perhaps they can threaten to do that and receive US funding to agree not to.
Perhaps they will legalize Marijuana and openly sell it to the white eyes.
Perhaps they can open casinos and avoid paying taxes to the US and State governments.
Perhaps they can lease land for manufacturing facilities to American companies and provide low cost foreign labor from say Mexico and provide foreign tax hedge for these companies and earn money on the leases and collect lower taxes instead of taxes going to the US Government.
Perhaps they will qualify as a 3rd world country and receive UN assistance for medical care and money to improve their infrastructure.
Perhaps they can get a seat in the UN.
Perhaps they will force the US Government to redraw US State boundaries and show a new nation.
Perhaps there are natural resources they can sell to foreign countries like the US.
Perhaps they will make treaties with other countries to protect themselves from the US Government in the event of a US invasion.
Prehaps they will make toys using Mexican labor and compete with China for US imports.
Perhaps they will provide secret bank accounts to companies and individuals.
Perhaps they will laugh all the way to their own banks.
Seems to me there can be an upside for them in all this.
TIGERESS
Yep I hope they do every one of those :)
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more power to em.. anyone who can set up a nation within our nation and avoid all the nanny laws should get a big pat on the back.. it is of course unfair to everyone else but...
taxes and nanny laws are unfair in and of themselves.
hell.. if they set up a free enough country I might just declare my lakotaness.
lazs
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None of the tribal presidents were involved in the announcement, this may be a publicity stunt. This group... doesn't represent everyone in the tribe. It's an action committee, not the government.
(I'm part Lakota-Sioux, btw, this issue is important in my family)
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Originally posted by lazs2
more power to em.. anyone who can set up a nation within our nation and avoid all the nanny laws should get a big pat on the back.. it is of course unfair to everyone else but...
taxes and nanny laws are unfair in and of themselves.
hell.. if they set up a free enough country I might just declare my lakotaness.
lazs
You might not have to move seems as though the indigenous people of your area lived as you like :)
Tell the Maidu/Nisenan to get the lead out
The greatest concentration of Indians within the state was in the Central Valley. The Maidu, which simply means "the people," lived in the Sacramento Valley and surrounding foothills. The southernmost Maidu were the Nisenan.
Maidu society was organized in tribes. A tribe was a conglomeration of villages numbering from two to twenty or more. One village was the main village, sort of the capitol, and this would be the site of the ceremonial and religious buildings such as the temescals or sweat houses. Some villages had populations of 500 or more, and others were made up of one or two families. The villages were very loosely organized. Leaders of the villages were mainly advisors, not decision makers. There might be one leader for war, another for religious matters, but there was not a designated leader who could speak for the entire village on all matters.
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fine with me... if they get a good enough deal I will be one of them. Hell.. I can run a casino.
lazs
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Originally posted by Chairboy
None of the tribal presidents were involved in the announcement, this may be a publicity stunt. This group... doesn't represent everyone in the tribe. It's an action committee, not the government.
(I'm part Lakota-Sioux, btw, this issue is important in my family)
You have my permission to take over California. Send Lasz to Arizona, he can live out his dream of being Wyatt Earp. :D
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Does that mean carpetbombing teepee's for invading US soil?
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no more carpet bombing, they now use smart bombs, one bomb, one target.
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Heres a wild fact for you, by the year 1600, 90% of the population of Indians had died of disease transmitted (accidentally) by Europeans.
Heres another fact for you. Indians didn't live in harmony with nature. They drove the slower reproducing animals into extinction.
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Heres another fact for you. Indians didn't live in harmony with nature. They drove the slower reproducing animals into extinction.
That's arguably true for all of humanity. By the way, the Buffalo herds' did'nt go away because the Indians' overhunted the herds. That was because of the market for Buffalo hides' back east.
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Originally posted by AquaShrimp
Heres a wild fact for you, by the year 1600, 90% of the population of Indians had died of disease transmitted (accidentally) by Europeans.
BS maybe in southamerica
http://www.kporterfield.com/aicttw/articles/disease.html
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Originally posted by Dago
You have my permission to take over California. Send Lasz to Arizona, he can live out his dream of being Wyatt Earp. :D
Naaaa
Capt. Parmenter :D
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Originally posted by Bingolong
BS maybe in southamerica
LMAO
BS?I suggest you reread that timeline more carefully
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(True)
I have stood atop Mato Paha while the ceromonies went on in the valley below.
I respected the belief and wishes and turned my back to the valley to avoid viewing them.
I left offerings.
Pretty awesome , peaceful feeling when you consider you are standing on history itself.
(True...and an awesome experience)
I have had the vision of the white buffalo. Very vivid that I have ingrained in my memory to the point of the vapor from the nose, the splashing of the water in the shallow stream by the hooves, etc.
(Extreme twist)
I am waiting the vision of a white Harley, the mark of the lightening scar and the hail stones. At this time I will mount up, cover my steed and my face with dust, place a small stone behind my ear, hope the Game Warden doesn`t nail me for the hawk feather...............and ride into history.......if I don`t get sidetracked at the first biker bar.
From Texas to no Taxes in no time at all.
:rofl
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Originally posted by DREDIOCK
Originally posted by Bingolong
BS maybe in southamerica
LMAO
BS?I suggest you reread that timeline more carefully
I suggest you try again ive read it five times
lets try this
Mesoamerican Indians?
http://www.britannica.com/eb/article-9117315/Mesoamerican-Indian
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Hey my fellow Injuns!!!!
Im Indian too,,
Im from the Slapaho tribe
; )
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Wow. Only on the intardnet can one find a thread with a buncha white guys grousing about ungrateful Native Americans.
Lest we forget, this move to declare independence from the United States is simply an attempt to return to that status which was theirs until well into the twentieth century....that of a nation within a nation, bereft of any rights as citizens.
More power to them. Why should we expect them to kiss and make up?
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Considering what was done to the Indian Tribes who were quite content before the arrival of "civilization" it's a small reparation.
Hell.....the Black Hills were stolen for their Gold.
Ain't "Civilization" great! I didn't know Kool-Aid was available at that time.
It's what's best for you! :aok
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we never did anything to the indians that they didn't already do to each other... we just did it better.
lazs
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Ahhh, another thread with a bunch of hypocritical self-righteous indignation, each one trying to be the big man with the correct posture. :rolleyes:
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In all seriousness, it is going to be very interesting to keep track of.
At the very least I suspect some pretty significant changes, negotiations and concessions will be made.
If agreements are not met and enough backing from the people, not only of the Lakota Nation, but from others and it is pushed enough.................who knows.
Pretty interesting all in all.
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Originally posted by Shuckins
Wow. Only on the intardnet can one find a thread with a buncha white guys grousing about ungrateful Native Americans.
Lest we forget, this move to declare independence from the United States is simply an attempt to return to that status which was theirs until well into the twentieth century....that of a nation within a nation, bereft of any rights as citizens.
More power to them. Why should we expect them to kiss and make up?
Considering we fought for 4 years to keep the South from doing the same
thing, they might reconsider.
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Originally posted by Rino
Considering we fought for 4 years to keep the South from doing the same
thing, they might reconsider.
Considering the cost in lives , destruction and the revelations in history since then that the stated motives used to swing the actions behind the war with the south was a total farce, the U.S. Government would probably also be wise to do some serious consideration.
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Originally posted by AquaShrimp
Heres a wild fact for you, by the year 1600, 90% of the population of Indians had died of disease transmitted (accidentally) by Europeans.
Here's a wild fact. 99.9999% of all stats and facts posted online without a credible source are false.
Source (http://www.google.com)
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Here's another wild fact! According to archaeologists, the Indian population of Arkansas at the time of DeSoto's expedition in 1521 was around 76,000.
The next group of white men to visit the state 141 years later, Marquette and Joliet, found the area largely bereft of human occupants. Historians state that the Native American population had dwindled to less than 10,000.
The consensus among scholars is that they did not emigrate from the region due to a bad job market.
Similarly, in the 100 years after Cortez conquered the Aztecs, the Indian population of Mexico shrank from approximately 10 million to about 1 million.
Not rumors....FACT. The causes were several; man-killing slave labor on the Spanish plantations and in the silver-mines being one, but the main cause was epidemics of smallpox, measles, and typhus, which were unknown in the New World until the coming of Europeans.
Fact.
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Originally posted by Shuckins
Not rumors....FACT. The causes were several; man-killing slave labor on the Spanish plantations and in the silver-mines being one, but the main cause was epidemics of smallpox, measles, and typhus, which were unknown in the New World until the coming of Europeans.
Fact.
it was a fair trade, white man gave the indians smallpox, measles, and typhus, and the indians gave the white man tobacco and syphilis.
do you have any idea how many white men have died from tobacco?
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Originally posted by john9001
do you have any idea how many white men have died from tobacco?
Pretty sure smoking, chewing tobacco is a choice. I don't know too many people who chose to get infected with small pox etc.
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Originally posted by lazs2
we never did anything to the indians that they didn't already do to each other... we just did it better.
lazs
That my friend, is SIG material.
true true true.
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http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2007/12/23/133010/57/277/425848
Per my post above, other folks are coming to the same conclusion.
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Originally posted by Chairboy
http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2007/12/23/133010/57/277/425848
Per my post above, other folks are coming to the same conclusion.
Other folks are also trying to justify/deny using political figureheads also. White eyes style.
It will be interesting to see where it leads with the Lakota Nation and the U.S.
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thanks tac...
You could also say that we never did anything to the environment that the indians didn't already do... we just did it better.
lazs
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Except for Laz I am appalled by the racism from you all. I was on the rez. If the liberals have destroyed the black family from the 60s, they had a 50 year head start with our Native nations. It is a 3rd world country, with 3rd world rules you would not understand unless you visited. I did not, now I do. It is crazy how it is there. I felt more secure in Bulgaria. Freedom and what was promised in the treaties should be upheld here. But hey lets vote for a guy who should be running from a Madrassa in the Jungle instead.
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(http://www.bluecorncomics.com/pics/southpk.jpg)
Ha ha ha ha! Ha ha ha ha!
ack-ack
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None of it matters, now watch as people sell all land to mall and parking lot developers, who should waste no time puting up nice big sun and view blocking city's.
Should prove interesting. "sorry we have to cut off your water flow, your natural river is runing through the land we need to make this here fancy parking lot."
-shrugs-
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None of it matters, now watch as people sell all land to mall and parking lot developers, who should waste no time puting up nice big sun and view blocking city's.
Should prove interesting. "sorry we have to cut off your water flow, your natural river is runing through the land we need to make this here fancy parking lot."
-shrugs-
...Thsi was like 8 months ago.