Aces High Bulletin Board
Help and Support Forums => Help and Training => Topic started by: Chubbie on January 01, 2008, 04:54:21 AM
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I cant decide what to fly. I'm a decent pilot in IL2 and WWIIOL but this game is completely different. I can't seem to do anything right. I can get 4 kill missions but half the time people just HO you all day long. I've tried avoiding the HO but that just to them getting a deflection shot on me and ripping my tail off. I love the handling on the 109k but hate the torque and I don't like the low ammo loadout on the 30mm. I love the guns on the p38 and the vertical capability, but it seems like the 109k outclasses it in every way that matters.
Basically, what should I fly and why?
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Fly what ever plane you like, regardless of its ranking as "best".
Why?
Why not?
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Just hook up with one of our wonderful trainers in the Training Arena and they will have ya' dodging the head on in no time.
Out of the (litterallly) thousands of ho attempts made on me a month, only a handfull ever get me, and there is a reason for this.
109 or 38 eh?
Both excellent picks, and both have their strengths.
My 1st question would be, do you like to bomb things? If so, then the p38 is the logical choice. It is btw one of the best and most stable bombing platforms.
If you are talking pure air to air dogfighting, I would give the knod to the 109. Once you figure out what all it can do, and get y'er aim down, you will find there is not much you can't kill when flying a 109.
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Mainly A2A fighting, I can fly the 38 well enough to bomb stuff and those 2 1000 pounders rock for popping tanks, but that's besides the point. I do like to stall people out in vert as one of my noob moves, but both the 38 and the 109k do this well so I dunno.
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Perhaps neither?
You should experiment with the other airplanes as well :)
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The 109 K4 is my pick, more agile and it has more tricks in its bag.
The 30mm will present a very different challenge for you though. Prepare for your gunnery in other aircraft to suffer as a result of being used to the Mk 108.
I find that the better my gunnery gets with the 30mm the worse my gunnery gets with .50cals and 20mms.
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I have experimented, the only two others I like are the la7 and the p51d, but I don't wanna fly noob rides. I'd rather not handicap myself by flying something that is gonna get me out of jams because of the airframe and not me.
Also, I'm starting to love the 38, but it seems like it's a crappy solo ride. I have come to realize that I have to pretend like I'm solo every time because people in this game do not back you up at all. Just a second ago I was killed by a spit that I couldn't outrun and was dragging while my 3 other country mates(enemies, might as well be) were trying to climb and catch some lancasters.
To be honest, the 109k's cockpit makes me a sad panda, and even looking out the front you don't get much to see. The 38 has a great cockpit except for the bar in front, the side bars are easily gotten around.
I'm a min maxer kinda, I don't wanna fly the 5 eny planes, but I do wanna fly the best 15-20 eny plane. I know it's mostly the pilot, but eventually that will not matter once I learn and then it will come down to the plane's limitations. So assuming I become an expert at either the p38 or the 109k, which would be most successful?
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Get a ki-84 or a yak then :) also spit9 is a beauty at 20 eny.
Personally I don't like being limited to just one plane. I can't answer the question of p38 vs k4 but it's not a huge undertaking to master both. I have 5 different main rides but I'm gonna be flying something entirely different this month, else I'll get bored of the game.
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Haven't tried the ki but I hate the yak, hate all spitfires and will always hate them until the end of time in any game, and hate the a6m.
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I'm a bit partial to the 38..... well I have to be to be in SAPP :D Turn off combat trim, trim that baby neutral and shes a great plane, even when flying solo.
As an "E" fighter its one of the top rides, and as a slow turner she can hold her own pretty well.
The only problem is she's a big target and sometimes draws a lot of attention.
In your spit story, slowing down and getting into a rolling scissor with it may have saved you. 70-80% of the spit pilots really have no idea what they are doing in it and can be had pretty easy if you get aggressive with them. Sure, the other 20-30% can hand your head to you, but a new plane is free. :p
Bottom line is fly what you want to have fun in, it's all about the fun right? Rumor has it that the is a SAPP mission on the 8th 9 eastern time. Come fly with some of the top 38 sticks in the game!
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Originally posted by WMLute
Just hook up with one of our wonderful trainers in the Training Arena and they will have ya' dodging the head on in no time.
Out of the (litterallly) thousands of ho attempts made on me a month, only a handfull ever get me, and there is a reason for this.
109 or 38 eh?
Both excellent picks, and both have their strengths.
My 1st question would be, do you like to bomb things? If so, then the p38 is the logical choice. It is btw one of the best and most stable bombing platforms.
If you are talking pure air to air dogfighting, I would give the knod to the 109. Once you figure out what all it can do, and get y'er aim down, you will find there is not much you can't kill when flying a 109.
Agreed, on all points.
- oldman
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38.
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I personally like to mix it up.
My 4 main rides are the 190A-8 for general fighter use and buff hunting, the Spit (any) for base defense and light furballing, the F6F-5 in an attack role (great fighter after the ord's gone) and the AR234 as my primary buff.
That said, I tend to fly between 30-40 different planes most camps. It's nice to keep a fresh knowledge of what my opponents capabilites are.
Both your choices are good ones but between them I personally favor the 109's over the 38's (but the 38G and the 38J are both nice rides). The 109G-14 is every bit as capable as the K-4 BTW.
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Ive flown both...if you are not bombing things and not flying for history purposes, take the K4, take your lumps learning the 30mm.
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my planes of choice are usualy like this
general fighter use
p51d or b
n1k2j
p47d11
f6f
spit8 (ocasionaly)
190d9
f4u1a
f4u1c
jabo
p47n or d40
p38j
f6f
f4u1d
n1k2j dual role (ack vehichles town buildigs then fighters)
i dont fly german planes much though the 110 has interested me
interested in the mossie and a few other birds
i rarely fly the same plane two days in a row.
im good enough with jabo now that i can hit my ground targets regardelss of which plane im in but i like the f6f p47 and n1k2j best cause i can actualy fight when the ord is gone. the others i dont have that much experience in.
i have had a whole lot of fun flying tbm's and other carrier birds.
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Originally posted by Chubbie
I cant decide what to fly. I'm a decent pilot in IL2 and WWIIOL but this game is completely different. I can't seem to do anything right. I can get 4 kill missions but half the time people just HO you all day long. I've tried avoiding the HO but that just to them getting a deflection shot on me and ripping my tail off. I love the handling on the 109k but hate the torque and I don't like the low ammo loadout on the 30mm. I love the guns on the p38 and the vertical capability, but it seems like the 109k outclasses it in every way that matters.
Basically, what should I fly and why?
how long do you fire your 30 for normaly 2 shot is enough if you lead your target
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Can I make an out of the box suggestion? Try the OTHER 109's. There isnt JUST the 109K. ALL of the 109's kick arse. Before you make your decision, try the 109G14, the 109G2, and the 109F4 (the G6 and the E4 arent really all that great, but they are fun planes). The G2 and the G14 are pretty fast, fairly maneuverable, and have the option to carry a 20mm instead of the tater gun. The G2 has 8mm's instead of 13mm's, so you'll have to put some rounds on target, but its quite fast and very maneuverable so this shouldnt be a problem. The F4 also has the 8mm's, but it is a beast of a turner (Spixteens and Spit 8's beware) and it eats Spit 9's for breakfast (just completely better in almost every category on the deck). It is quite a bit slower than the other 109's though.
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Like Motherland said, if you like the 109K4 but not the 30mm, try the 109g14. It's got a 20mm option, and up to about 16k it's VERY close in performance to the 109k4.
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Sounds like basically the very same issue I went through. I ended up choosing the 38, except I'm going with the J version over the L. Stop by the DA, I'm almost always in there. We can fly together and friendly duel a little. Let you get a feel for both of those planes and I can get some more experience. :aok
donkeh
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To be honest the whole reason for flying the 109 over the p38 is the 30mm. I think I really want to fly the p38 but it just seems like given equal pilots a 109k would dominate a p38.
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Originally posted by Chubbie
To be honest the whole reason for flying the 109 over the p38 is the 30mm. I think I really want to fly the p38 but it just seems like given equal pilots a 109k would dominate a p38.
Don't think dominate is the right word.
I've had some really good brawls with 109K drivers while flying my 38G. Depends a lot on who is driving it.
Often times the 38L is being flown by guys who are porking bases and aren't really skilled in it as an ACM bird.
Both the 109s and 38s are planes that take time to master. In fact some of us have been working on it for years :)
Fly em both and have fun.
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As most people know I am a 109k4 driver. I have been flying this bird since the day I started (almost 2 years). I asked the same question then as well.
I picked the 109k4 becasue it was almost the hardest plane to fly for a rookie. I wanted to learn how to angle/stall fight. But I had a very good teacher in the beggining. I learned quicky this way. If I had no teacher I don't know if I would still be flying it.
I flew this plane regardless of numbers, alt or types of other enemy planes. I would engage under any circumstances. I got killed thousands of times. I went for months in the beggining without getting any kills that weren't otherwise " set up for me by squaddies".
The 109k4 is NOT a rookie plane. Among other things it doesn't do good is it turns like crap at least until you learn HOW to MAKE It turn. It stalls very easily. Gets fast so quick you just fly into the ground turning. 30mm are the devel to hit with. They drop like rocks. Deflection shots are near impossible.
BUT.....young grasshopper....the 109k4 is in fact one of the best planes in this game. It is fast, powerful and can kill with one round. It has excellant stall turning ability and can out climb almost everything.
I am not saying you should pick this plane but should you choose to accept the mission be prepared for a steep learning curve. Should you eventually reach maturity with this plane you will be feard and much worse....hunted like a dog everytime you up. Anytime ch 200 gets wind of a "k4 driver" around its a race to who can kill it first.....:O
May the force be with you.....good luck
I am in the DA mostly now. PM me and I will be glad to give you an introduction to flying the 109k4
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Originally posted by Agent360
As most people know I am a 109k4 driver. I have been flying this bird since the day I started (almost 2 years). I asked the same question then as well.
I picked the 109k4 becasue it was almost the hardest plane to fly for a rookie. I wanted to learn how to angle/stall fight. But I had a very good teacher in the beggining. I learned quicky this way. If I had no teacher I don't know if I would still be flying it.
I flew this plane regardless of numbers, alt or types of other enemy planes. I would engage under any circumstances. I got killed thousands of times. I went for months in the beggining without getting any kills that weren't otherwise " set up for me by squaddies".
The 109k4 is NOT a rookie plane. Among other things it doesn't do good is it turns like crap at least until you learn HOW to MAKE It turn. It stalls very easily. Gets fast so quick you just fly into the ground turning. 30mm are the devel to hit with. They drop like rocks. Deflection shots are near impossible.
BUT.....young grasshopper....the 109k4 is in fact one of the best planes in this game. It is fast, powerful and can kill with one round. It has excellant stall turning ability and can out climb almost everything.
I am not saying you should pick this plane but should you choose to accept the mission be prepared for a steep learning curve. Should you eventually reach maturity with this plane you will be feard and much worse....hunted like a dog everytime you up. Anytime ch 200 gets wind of a "k4 driver" around its a race to who can kill it first.....:O
May the force be with you.....good luck
I am in the DA mostly now. PM me and I will be glad to give you an introduction to flying the 109k4
I'll take you up on that offer agent :) . I'm an up and coming 109K stick, i'm loving it so far and i'm FAIRLY accurate with the tater, i can't hit turnin targets that well YET, but with some pratice, i'll get there.
You mind if i take you up sometime in the 109K for some tips and tricks?
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Agent360 is one of my favorite pilots to fight. When i see a winter cammo K4 chances are i'm in for it.
Im not picking on anyone, this fight could have gone either way. One of my favorites.
Agent
38J v. 109K4 (http://www.mediafire.com/?859zx5htmhk)
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Heheh I hope you don't hate real-life Spitfires b.c a lot of my Canadian pals flew them.
:D
Try flying the F4U Corsair for a bit. It's got very good flaps in this game that help you pull vertical maneuvers easily and it's also got the mass to zoom well/turn-climb and leave people hanging and at low speeds, you won't have to fight off the torque as much like in the 109. And, before good ol' Sax pops up, let's stress on its very strong rudder that will flip you over when you really need it. Just try not to kick it too hard while pulling up at low speed or you might bite a nasty stall.
For the record, roping people isn't noobish at all.
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Why fly a bomber when you can fly a fighter.:cool:
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Originally posted by Chubbie
To be honest the whole reason for flying the 109 over the p38 is the 30mm. I think I really want to fly the p38 but it just seems like given equal pilots a 109k would dominate a p38.
Given equal pilots you have a great match up....
Both planes are exceptional but very pilot dependent. The 109K4 is significantly easier to learn IMO then the 38. Primarily do to the nature of its strengths (outstanding verticals and good rudder authority). Basically its simply the best non perk E fighter in the game. As mentioned the real "weakness" is the 30mm...unless you hit with it then its a big+:eek:
The 38 is really more dependent on the judgement of the pilot. It's combat flaps and lack of torque combined with suprisingly good rudder authority and stability at high AoA allow an awful lot of "that fancy pilot stuff" but even with its excellent E fighting qualities the 109 can dominate and control the fight (E state wise) from an even start.
109K is actually a pretty good plane to learn E fighting with and is suprisingly nimble if you use throttle and rudder. While both planes are far from "easy mode" the 109k is very formidable even when flown as an "easy lite"....where as the 38 only has two settings...
predator and target
All depends on whose in it....
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Humble has it there, given equal pilots the P 38 shouldn't have a chance in hell.
When I'm in a 109 the P-38 only gives me happy thoughts. It is rarely a threat, unless piloted by an excellent stick or in exceedingly unbalanced odds.
Even with unbalanced odds, the 109K still has many avenues of escape.
As I said before, the only 'disadvantage' is the Mk 108, which is also a blessing if you know how to use it.
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Ok I still can't decide and I'm about to quit, I can own with the LA-7 but I don't wanna fly that noob ride. I really suck with the 30mm and I use up tons of ammo cause of my gunnery, so I need someone to teach me how to fly the p38 before I quit this game and just go back to owning people in WWIIOL.
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Originally posted by Chubbie
Haven't tried the ki but I hate the yak, hate all spitfires and will always hate them until the end of time in any game, and hate the a6m.
Originally posted by Chubbie
Ok I still can't decide and I'm about to quit, I can own with the LA-7 but I don't wanna fly that noob ride.
That's not meant disrespectful in any way, but I think you should reasses your attitude. Not that I want you to fly the LA-7 or even want you to like that plane, but such tags are, pardon me, bs. There are no noob planes, there are no dweeb planes... there are just planes and people flying them, for whatever reasons. Fly what you like, where you like and how you like. That noob, dweeb and other labels are usually just parroted by people succumbing to (perceived) peer pressure.
And I think you are putting too much pressure on yourself: On one hand you don't want fly planes you think of being easy "noob" rides, on the other hand when not having a similar level of success in more challenging rides, you are frustrated. Somehow that's a bit inconsistent. What would it be worth of selecting more challenging planes without having a challenge? ;)
Don't give up so quick! If you can get kills in one plane, you can get kills in most others - it just takes some time do adapt. Get a more relaxed attitude!
BTW, if you are fond of the 109K-4, but have problems hitting with that MK-108, do what already has been recommended in this thread several times: Fly a G-14 with 20mm option. Similar horse, different gun.
(And RUMBLEBee was completely right when he said you should try all the other planes too. Maybe you will suddenly find yourself comfortable with a ride you would never have thought of...)
EDIT... I took the liberty to look up your tour 95 stats. While I know that stats are not always meaningful and should be analyzed with care, I couldn't ignore the fact that actually your K/D in K-4 and P-38 are not that much different from your K/D in La-7: 0.65, 0.89 and 0.89 respectively. You seem not to fare worse in a 38 than in a La 7 :aok
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Do stats account for GVs too cause I bombed quite a few tanks and such in the 38. The only two planes I really really LIKE are the p38 and p51, I don't like how the p51 doesn't have a cannon and I don't like the 5 eny value.
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Originally posted by Chubbie
Do stats account for GVs too cause I bombed quite a few tanks and such in the 38. The only two planes I really really LIKE are the p38 and p51, I don't like how the p51 doesn't have a cannon and I don't like the 5 eny value.
Eight isn't it?
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Originally posted by Chubbie
Do stats account for GVs too cause I bombed quite a few tanks and such in the 38. The only two planes I really really LIKE are the p38 and p51, I don't like how the p51 doesn't have a cannon and I don't like the 5 eny value.
You only killed 2 vehicles in a p-38 and were killed 2 times by them, so it doesn't change much - You are still as good or bad in a 38 as ina La7 ;) (unlike me - I really suck in 38's.)
So if you really like 38's stick with 'em! Don't be impatient. Hook up with a trainer, some of them really excel in 38s and can help you master that very capable bird in short time.
(And yes, P-51D ENY is 8 not 5. You could fly the B pony with 20 ENY only, but I'm sure you won't be fond of having 2 guns less :D)
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Where do you find these stats, that's kinda cool.
Also I think my main issue with the 38 is that nearly every fight I have much less e than my enemy and in the 109k that's ok cause I can for some reason get away easier and come back at a higher alt. In the 38 I die pretty much every time.
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Originally posted by Chubbie
Where do you find these stats, that's kinda cool.
Community-->Scores-->Your in-game handle-->This tour and then same except expanded scores.
donkey
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Originally posted by Chubbie
Where do you find these stats, that's kinda cool.
You can find these stats under Community/Scores/Kills stats in an expanded format. If you then select "player stats", tour of choice and type in your handle, you can see in which planes you killed and were killed and what you did shoot down.
There is just one problem: "Player vs" is not displayed properly. To see how often you died in your 38 vs vehicles, I had to use Opera, select the browser's "user view" mode then manually select "Chubbie" vs Panzer, T34, Tiger ect to see if you scored / died in P38's. Quite cumbersome.
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Any advice on my edit?
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Originally posted by Chubbie
Any advice on my edit?
That's just an SA issue Chubbie. You need to be aware of enemy alts, aware of your own alt and when a higher con is getting close enough to take interest (unless you're comfortable with your reversals and evasives that's when you start moving away)
You should always be looking around. If you suddenly look up and see there's a con 2k and closing that's a bed you made. If the skies are clear all you should see are dots, 6k, judge their E and decide what to do.
Yes, it will be easier to stay alive in a k4. That doesn't mean it's hard to in a p38, it's all SA.
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Originally posted by Chubbie
Ok I still can't decide and I'm about to quit, I can own with the LA-7 but I don't wanna fly that noob ride. I really suck with the 30mm and I use up tons of ammo cause of my gunnery, so I need someone to teach me how to fly the p38 before I quit this game and just go back to owning people in WWIIOL.
I think Lusche is right, you need to adjust your attitude. You said you "own" in the LA. According to your stats last month you died as many times in the LA as you got kills. You died more often then you got kills in both the 109K4 and the P38L, tho you did better in the 38.
The adjustment you need to make, is you are going to get "owned" quit often. There is ALWAYS someone better, this is what make the game so challenging. We alway strive to be that ONE! Also take into account you can't be looking everywhere at once. This means when you take your eye off a guy for a second, it's very possible he's the one that going to kill you before you look back at him.
I don't care where you flew before, or how much, nobody gets real good at this game in a couple months. I've been here years and still stink more often than not. Fly what you want to have fun, even if its the LA :D Just remember when you get slammed, remember what they did good, or what you did wrong and go from there. Have fun doing what you like, the kills will come at a steady pace....over the long run
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Maybe we're all asking the wrong questions/offering the wrong advice. How is it that you like to fly/fight? T'n'B, B'n'Z, Energy fight, furball, cherry pick, combination of all of these? The answer to this will guide your plane choice. Above all, be honest with yourself. Don't worry about labels or what's considered dweeby.
You also seem to have a preference for cannons (as do I) but don't discount the .50 cal U.S. planes. They are highly accurate and effective weapons. 4x.50 are about the same as 2x20mm Hispanos. Most U.S. planes carry 6x.50.
BTW, if you're comfortable in the La-7 why not try the La-5 or the Yak-9U? Neither of these is labeled a "dweeb ride" yet both are competant aircraft. Many swear by the Yak (one of my favorites) and I've got a squaddie who fly's the La-5 almost exclusively.
As to getting bounced in the 38, it simply sounds like you need to visit the TA and get with the trainers or a dedicated 38 stick to learn how to control a disadvantaged situation. Obviously, this isn't always possible as the best sticks aren't going to give away an advantage but it would help you with 80% of the arena.
As to the K4, again, a trip to the TA using the .target command might help out your gunnery.
Don't give up. It takes time (11+ years for me and I still make mistakes daily) and practice.
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Agree with the previous 2 posts, except for 1 nitpick.
3 .50 cals are about the equivelant of 1 20mm, so most US planes with 6x .50cals are about equivelant to a 2x 20mm-armed plane. That said, you can still get plenty of kills with a single 20mm cannon (see the 109F, 109Gs yak9u, p38)
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Originally posted by BaldEagl
Maybe we're all asking the wrong questions/offering the wrong advice. How is it that you like to fly/fight? T'n'B, B'n'Z, Energy fight, furball, cherry pick, combination of all of these? The answer to this will guide your plane choice. Above all, be honest with yourself. Don't worry about labels or what's considered dweeby.
You also seem to have a preference for cannons (as do I) but don't discount the .50 cal U.S. planes. They are highly accurate and effective weapons. 4x.50 are about the same as 2x20mm Hispanos. Most U.S. planes carry 6x.50.
BTW, if you're comfortable in the La-7 why not try the La-5 or the Yak-9U? Neither of these is labeled a "dweeb ride" yet both are competant aircraft. Many swear by the Yak (one of my favorites) and I've got a squaddie who fly's the La-5 almost exclusively.
As to getting bounced in the 38, it simply sounds like you need to visit the TA and get with the trainers or a dedicated 38 stick to learn how to control a disadvantaged situation. Obviously, this isn't always possible as the best sticks aren't going to give away an advantage but it would help you with 80% of the arena.
As to the K4, again, a trip to the TA using the .target command might help out your gunnery.
Don't give up. It takes time (11+ years for me and I still make mistakes daily) and practice.
I TnB if it's a bunch of friendlies vs. 1 or 2 planes. I BnZ and all that other stuff when the odds are more even. So I pretty much do everything.
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OK. So I've assembled a list of those fighters that are "jack of all trades" types absent the Spits (and other British planes), the La-7 and any perk planes. Obviously, some are better at some aspects of fighting than others (t'n'b, b'n'z). Here it is:
C.205 (good all-around fighter)
Bf 109G-2 (good all-around fighter... I prefer this one with the 20mm gondolas. All 109's require care in a dive)
Bf 109G-14 (very much like the K4)
Bf 109K-4
F4U-1 (good all-around fighter but the rear views are difficult in the F4U's)
F4U-1A (good all-around fighter. All F4U's require flap use)
F4U-1D (leans toward ground attack)
F6F-5 (good all-around fighter, requires flap use)
Fw 190A-5 (leans toward B'n'Z)
Ki-61-I-KAIc (good all-around fighter)
Ki-84-la (good all-around fighter, careful in a dive, requires flap use)
La-5FN (good all-around fighter)
N1K2-J (big gun loadout and lots of fuel)
P-38G
P-38J
P-47D-11 (8x.50's in the Jugs. This one turns best but has difficult views through birdcage)
P-47D-25 (best all-around Jug IMO)
P-51B (better turning than the D and still pretty fast)
Yak-9U (a true E fighter)
If we eliminate non-cannon birds we're left with:
C.205
Bf 109G-2
Bf 109G-14
Bf 109K-4
Fw 190A-5
Ki-61-I-KAIc
Ki-84-la
La-5FN
N1K2-J
P-38G
P-38J
Yak-9U
It would probably take you about 3-4 hours to take each one up and get a rough feel for it, less since you've already tried a couple of them out.
I'd highly suggest you do this as, whatever you decide on, it will help you to have some idea of your opponents capabilites when you engage them.
Also, I'd still do the TA thing no matter what.
[EDIT] Once you've decided on a plane, visit the Aircraft and Vehicle forums. Do a search on it. These have all pretty much been discussed at one point or another.
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Why not the p38l instead of the j? Isn't the l the same plane as the j except it has better high speed maneuvering?
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Originally posted by Chubbie
Why not the p38l instead of the j? Isn't the l the same plane as the j except it has better high speed maneuvering?
I left it off the list as the L is generally used as a ground attack platform. You could certainly add it.
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Originally posted by BaldEagl
I left it off the list as the L is generally used as a ground attack platform. You could certainly add it.
But is that correct? The l is the same as the j just better high speed performance?
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Originally posted by Chubbie
But is that correct? The l is the same as the j just better high speed performance?
http://www.gonzoville.com/ahcharts/index.php?p1=p38g&p2=p38j&p3=p38l
You will see that speed & turn radius of J and L are virtually identical
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Originally posted by Chubbie
But is that correct? The l is the same as the j just better high speed performance?
I couldn't tell you about high-speed performance differences between the two. I've only flown the L a couple of times and the J a handful of times so I can't really compare on that limited experience although I can tell you they are competant fighters. I've spent most time in the G as I most often like to turn-fight and it's the best of the 3 at it.
Maybe Ack-Ack or Guppy or Benny will chime in to help you there.
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Originally posted by Chubbie
But is that correct? The l is the same as the j just better high speed performance?
Yes, but only slightly better. As they stand in the game they are very close.
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Originally posted by Chubbie
I cant decide what to fly. I'm a decent pilot in IL2 and WWIIOL but this game is completely different. I can't seem to do anything right. I can get 4 kill missions but half the time people just HO you all day long. I've tried avoiding the HO but that just to them getting a deflection shot on me and ripping my tail off. I love the handling on the 109k but hate the torque and I don't like the low ammo loadout on the 30mm. I love the guns on the p38 and the vertical capability, but it seems like the 109k outclasses it in every way that matters.
I would say the K4 over the 38 if you insist on using a plane that isn't lower ENY. It has much more survivability than the P38 and will help you develop better SA. As far as the low ammo loadout if you consider one 30mm hit is pretty much a kill on anything except buffs and maybe some attack planes, it really is comparable.
Go with the K4, it forgives mistakes you make in it like getting into a bad situation much quicker than the P38.
Sidenote: Part of the handling of the K4 is learning to use the torque to your benefit.
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J and L are very similar. One edge the L has are power ailerons, which is nice. I like the J better, not sure why though. Not much to add, to what has been said, except...If you get good at dog fighting, you are going to be a good pilot. Learning the qualities of all planes, will make you better able to get the most out of your plane against other planes.
Bottom line, don't fly something because you think you need to have a better plane. Fly stuff because it is simply fun to fly. The 38 is every bit as capable as any other plane generally speaking. When matched up against a K4, you have got a battle on your hands, but you haven't lost the fight from the beginning....even if equal pilot skills. Mistakes can still be made. I think there are only a few planes that b'n'z is the most viable option, either one of these planes can fight in different fashions, the versatility is a big asset. Though the 109 seems to hold some big edges, the 38 is a fantastic plane in it's own right. It does many things well, but is not the best at anything. If you are a better pilot, there is a good chance you will win. If it's fun, do it.
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I like the 38 because it is smooth and my gunnery sucks. I like the 109 cause it gets me out of jams easier but it's a very bumpy ride for me and my gunnery sucks. My k/d is getting worse and worse every day, I'm not improving, it wouldn't be as frustrating if I wasn't a combat sim vet with 5+ k/ds in all the other games I play. As it is, I'm not having fun getting shot down every time when I'm nearly always the one doing the shooting down in the other games.
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Do you film and review your combats? If not, you should start doing it. I learned mostly by watching and analyzing how I was shot down (I actually never was trained at all ... maybe I should some day ;) )
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Yea and a lot of my deaths in the p38 are from people pulling ridiculous deflection shots then stalling out after killing me, it's frustrating.
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Originally posted by Lusche
Do you film and review your combats? If not, you should start doing it. I learned mostly by watching and analyzing how I was shot down (I actually never was trained at all ... maybe I should some day ;) )
I never visited the trainers OR watched films. All trial and error (lots of errors... and it shows).
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I think that's the wrong way to learn. I never did either, and told myself "I'll figure it out myself" -- well I wasn't. I even realized I kept telling myself that, but forced myself to watch films and read tips and whatnot on the forums.
You might figure something out in 5 years by yourself, or you might read up on it and perfect it in 3 months. So yes, you CAN learn by yourself, but it's the wrong way to learn.
I'm not saying you need a trainer (but those can help). I'm saying don't think it's better to figure stuff out yourself.
This public service announcement has been brought to you by Ford, Pepsi, and the letter Q.
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Originally posted by Krusty
I think that's the wrong way to learn. I never did either, and told myself "I'll figure it out myself" -- well I wasn't. I even realized I kept telling myself that, but forced myself to watch films and read tips and whatnot on the forums.
You might figure something out in 5 years by yourself, or you might read up on it and perfect it in 3 months. So yes, you CAN learn by yourself, but it's the wrong way to learn.
I'm not saying you need a trainer (but those can help). I'm saying don't think it's better to figure stuff out yourself.
This public service announcement has been brought to you by Ford, Pepsi, and the letter Q.
QFT! The 38 isn't the easiest plane to learn by yourself at all, especially when you're new to the game. That reminds me, I have to hook up with a trainer...:noid
donkey
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Just for clarification, there are several ways to improve, each one better than the preceding one:
1. Just fly around, get shot down, rant about it. "Game sucks, planes suck, everybody cheats" :D
2. Fly around, get into fights, try to think about what happened afterwards.
3. Get some information. Read all help files, look at all that helpful links. Then try to apply what you just have read.
4. Get someone to train you.
An amazing number of players are stuck in mode 1 and will be little more than targets regardless how long they are playing. ;)
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I'm about to give up on the 38, when someone gets on your 6 there's nothing I can do to shake them. Trying to make them overshoot doesn't work cause it gives them a nice slow target, trying rolling scissors gives them a big target, split s, big target, rope, they usually hit the big target before they stall out.
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Originally posted by Chubbie
I'm about to give up on the 38, when someone gets on your 6 there's nothing I can do to shake them. Trying to make them overshoot doesn't work cause it gives them a nice slow target, trying rolling scissors gives them a big target, split s, big target, rope, they usually hit the big target before they stall out.
hehe rope usually works for me (I use it like it's my God given right). I wouldn't say give up on it yet. Get with a trainer.
donkey
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Originally posted by pluck
J and L are very similar. One edge the L has are power ailerons, which is nice. I like the J better, not sure why though. Not much to add, to what has been said, except...If you get good at dog fighting, you are going to be a good pilot. Learning the qualities of all planes, will make you better able to get the most out of your plane against other planes.
Bottom line, don't fly something because you think you need to have a better plane. Fly stuff because it is simply fun to fly. The 38 is every bit as capable as any other plane generally speaking. When matched up against a K4, you have got a battle on your hands, but you haven't lost the fight from the beginning....even if equal pilot skills. Mistakes can still be made. I think there are only a few planes that b'n'z is the most viable option, either one of these planes can fight in different fashions, the versatility is a big asset. Though the 109 seems to hold some big edges, the 38 is a fantastic plane in it's own right. It does many things well, but is not the best at anything. If you are a better pilot, there is a good chance you will win. If it's fun, do it.
there is one other difrance in exceleration it has the same time overall but from certain area they excelerate beter
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Originally posted by Chubbie
I'm about to give up on the 38, when someone gets on your 6 there's nothing I can do to shake them. Trying to make them overshoot doesn't work cause it gives them a nice slow target, trying rolling scissors gives them a big target, split s, big target, rope, they usually hit the big target before they stall out.
May sound a bit silly.. but the main trick is don't letting anybody get there in the first place ;)
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Not to be flippant or anything as this is actually meant to help but anytime you let anything onto your six it'll be hard to shake them regardless what you're flying, especially if it's a good stick who's experienced in his plane and even moreso if he's also experienced in yours.
Going back to one of your earlier posts, you said the 109 got you out of jams but the 38 was better for your gunnery. Let's revisit that list again taking these two things into account plus remove the need for flap use from the equation. We are left with:
C.205
Fw 190A-5
Ki-61-I-KAIc
N1K2-J
The 38 is a hard plane to learn as you're finding out. You might want to try one of these until you improve your SA, ACM and gunnery.
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Originally posted by Chubbie
I'm about to give up on the 38, when someone gets on your 6 there's nothing I can do to shake them. Trying to make them overshoot doesn't work cause it gives them a nice slow target, trying rolling scissors gives them a big target, split s, big target, rope, they usually hit the big target before they stall out.
Since day 1 i have flown the 38 almost exclusively. I love the plane, its history, its looks and its capabilities. I have had some time with trainers, who helped immensely. I have spent even more time looking at my videos and others (murdr is a GREAT resource). With my dedication it has still taken me about a year to become good in it, but i am still far from notorious, i figure that will take another year :D .
Hang in there :aok
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Ok after playing around with every plane for a bit offline and in MA, the two planes I like are the C205 and the 38, I've realized I really don't like the 109k to quirky for me. The 205 and 38 are smooth. I'd really like to fly the 38 I think but it's such a huge GD target in MA that every spitdweeb and la7 wants to gun for you disregarding their own safety. They kill me but end up dead 5 seconds later.
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Originally posted by Chubbie
I'm about to give up on the 38, when someone gets on your 6 there's nothing I can do to shake them. Trying to make them overshoot doesn't work cause it gives them a nice slow target, trying rolling scissors gives them a big target, split s, big target, rope, they usually hit the big target before they stall out.
Hook up with Murdr @ flyaceshigh.com and set up a time for some training. Murdr is a good trainier, as well as being one of the top 38 pilots around. Check out his Squad's Site (http://479th.jasminemarie.com/) for a lot of great info, but hook up with him, he can teach you a lot.
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Originally posted by Chubbie
Ok after playing around with every plane for a bit offline and in MA, the two planes I like are the C205 and the 38, I've realized I really don't like the 109k to quirky for me. The 205 and 38 are smooth. I'd really like to fly the 38 I think but it's such a huge GD target in MA that every spitdweeb and la7 wants to gun for you disregarding their own safety. They kill me but end up dead 5 seconds later.
.... then learn to kill them first :aok
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I can't schedule when I play video games, I play to relax whenever I feel like it, scheduling time to play video games is one of the reasons why I quit the last game I was playing which we won't mention the name of.
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I'm one of those guys who target the P-38 because most people don't know how to fly them. I'm always surprised when I run into a GOOD 38 stick.
I thought you might like the 205. It's reasonably fast, has decent climb and acceleration, good turning ability and an excellent gun package with plenty of ammo. The only downside to the 205 is it doesn't take to damage very well.
If I were you, I'd stick with the 205 until you get your legs under you from a SA/ACM/gunnery perspective, then if you still want to, you can always jump back into the 38's.
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Originally posted by Chubbie
I can't schedule when I play video games, I play to relax whenever I feel like it, scheduling time to play video games is one of the reasons why I quit the last game I was playing which we won't mention the name of.
Training, ain't "playing" ! It's a whole 'nother ball game.
I've been flying for years, and do it for fun. I'd like to be one of the top killers, but I just don't have the time to put in for practice. I do however enjoy shooting other planes down more than I like getting killed myself.
My latest "hump" I'm having trouble getting over is the HO (head on shot). I think my timing is off as to when to turn in, or out depending on the situation. I seem to be getting nailed too often. So I'll get with a trainer and they will see where I'm going wrong, and give me a few tips on how to get better at avoiding the HO, and practice with me a bit so that I understand what I should do.
Spending that hour or so training will make me that much harder to hit in the MAs, leting me survive longer, giving me the chance to kill more per flight. I don't see a down side to that !
If you look at training as a "chore", or "something you HAVE to do" then maybe your not into the game as much as you thought you were, and its time to move on to something else. The fun of this game is "besting your opponent", and anything that going to get me there is part of the fun.
Aces High isn't one of those FPS games where you throw a ton of ammo at the other guy and hope you hit more than he hits you. A good portion of the people who play this game study tactics of WWII, and practice off line to hone their aim. For the most part, your not playing against "kids".
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I tried on and off over the past year to learn how to fly the p38 effectively and was getting very frustrated. Well, a month or two ago I decided to really give it my attention and learn to at least hold my own. The biggest difference between now and earlier I would hazard to guess is that my SA has improved bucketloads. I don't get "picked" as often, I don't get target fixated, I can track a few different enemies in the area, and most importantly I've learned to see who the biggest threat to myself is. These improvements in SA have lead to more successful furballs. On the flip side I'd still say I'm fairly horrible 1v1 with anyone who really knows what they are doing but I have gotten better by doing what Lusche and others have mentioned: reading tactics, attempting them, and reviewing what went right and what went wrong.
Give the Ki84 a whirl, shes got a couple tricks up her sleeve.
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Stupid question and probably on a help page somehwere but........ how do you take and watch AH2 films later?
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Originally posted by kozhedub
Stupid question and probably on a help page somehwere but........ how do you take and watch AH2 films later?
Press Alt + R when you want to start recording, again to stop (a red 'R' will appear in the top left of screen).
To view them go to your Aces High directory folder (HTC -> etc -> Films).
As for getting better in the P 38 or any aircraft in the game the best advice I can offer you is to find a squad of guys you get a long with. This might take a while, but if you find a group of people who are good at what they do and you learn to work together you'll pick up all sorts of handy tips and tricks.
My squad has a friendly inter-squad duelling comp that we run on the side. Random draw and no expectations, just pick an aircraft for the month, jump in and duel away.
If you're flying with decent sticks you'll pick up some good habits very quickly. Little things about maintaining E, efficient use of flaps, evasive manuevers, gun calibration and all sorts of nonsense.
I definitely improved after joining my current squad. Even if I'm having a watermelon day and I'm dying all the time I'm still having fun while I do it, so at the very least finding a good group of people to fly with is one of the best things you can do.
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Originally posted by Xasthur
Press Alt + R when you want to start recording, again to stop (a red 'R' will appear in the top left of screen).
To view them go to your Aces High directory folder (HTC -> etc -> Films).
As for getting better in the P 38 or any aircraft in the game the best advice I can offer you is to find a squad of guys you get a long with. This might take a while, but if you find a group of people who are good at what they do and you learn to work together you'll pick up all sorts of handy tips and tricks.
My squad has a friendly inter-squad duelling comp that we run on the side. Random draw and no expectations, just pick an aircraft for the month, jump in and duel away.
If you're flying with decent sticks you'll pick up some good habits very quickly. Little things about maintaining E, efficient use of flaps, evasive manuevers, gun calibration and all sorts of nonsense.
I definitely improved after joining my current squad. Even if I'm having a watermelon day and I'm dying all the time I'm still having fun while I do it, so at the very least finding a good group of people to fly with is one of the best things you can do.
same here
i joined a good squad and ive learned more from them in the past few months than i ever learned in my first year flying solo.
good to have someones honest opinion on your skills and good advice.
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Originally posted by Xasthur
Press Alt + R when you want to start recording, again to stop (a red 'R' will appear in the top left of screen).
To view them go to your Aces High directory folder (HTC -> etc -> Films).
Thanks
btw chubbie what is your WWIIOL tag?
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109K
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Learn to fly the Hurricane well and I've been told by the pros that do, Eaglehrt for instance, that all the others will be easy in comparrison. Anybody insane enough to do a HO against a Hurri is just plain nuts.
What a lot of guys do is not necessary to ram you, but come close, hit rudder hard one side and snapshot a burst will blow away major assemblies like wings and tail fins.
I like La-7 back to a high base below radar, conserve fuel by running real slow to get there and pop bombers takin off when you do get there. Nobody will expect you will be back there. When the last tank switches over, head home, and run slow to conserve fuel. La-7 a ladies or wussie ride? Ask the Russian aces about that one. Problem with La-7 is not in EW or MW inventory.
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Originally posted by Daubie
Learn to fly the Hurricane well and I've been told by the pros that do, Eaglehrt for instance...
You might want to get some tips from someone else than him about flying any plane. Unless that is you need tips on HOing other aircraft because that's all Eaglehrt is capable of teaching.
ack-ack
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I'm not a fan.
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109K. Will give any pilot a run for there money. That's of course, if you take the time to learn her.... She's a winner hands down, and i'm loving her more and more daily :) .
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re: I'm not a fan...
Doesn't matter who I quote or what plane I fly, it is always somebody with negative discourse as to not liking the guy or the plane or both.
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Originally posted by Daubie
re: I'm not a fan...
Doesn't matter who I quote or what plane I fly, it is always somebody with negative discourse as to not liking the guy or the plane or both.
If you've ever fought against Eaglehrt then you'd know he's no "Pro" as you claim but rather someone that is below average without any knowledge of ACM or even BFM.
It would be a disservice to someone to point him in Eaglehrt's direction for training in any aircraft in AH. Better off pointing the player in the direction of an AH trainer, at least that way the player will at least get the proper instruction.
ack-ack
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I've been flying the f4u-1a lately and while I like it, runners anger me greatly and I've been trying out the 109k. I'm pretty good in it I just don't see any way to beat the lgay7 noobs. I know I wanna bring the fight up higher, but the lgay can outturn the 109k and climbs just as well until you get higher. Is there ANY way to beat this stupid plane in the 109k given equal pilot skills and starting off co alt co e below 10k?
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wow I read Daubie's post and got some blood pumping but ack ack was there, ready and willing :)
Eagle is very much a ground vehicle type of guy. His squad also. Bomb them a couple of times and they will move to the next un-defended field.
Haven't fought them recently though as they usually hang out in EW, MW. i think they maybe headed in the right direction though.
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Originally posted by Chubbie
I've been flying the f4u-1a lately and while I like it, runners anger me greatly and I've been trying out the 109k. I'm pretty good in it I just don't see any way to beat the lgay7 noobs. I know I wanna bring the fight up higher, but the lgay can outturn the 109k and climbs just as well until you get higher. Is there ANY way to beat this stupid plane in the 109k given equal pilot skills and starting off co alt co e below 10k?
The specific plane you're looking for doesn't exist. Scanning over your posts (not nit-picking) it looks like you want a plane that's-
Fast enough that nobody can run away from it,
Manueverable enough to out-manuever all the planes that can't run away from it,
Armed with a huge, easy-to-hit-with gun,
Has open views that make it easy to see the poor sap who's behind you,
Easily able to put the poor sap that's behind you out in front of you,
Preferably doesn't need a lot of flap use to be able to do the above,
Accelerates quickly, and has lots of verticle ability,
Isn't considered a "newb" plane,
and,
Has a 15-20 Eny.
First of all, if such a plane existed, it wouldn't have a mid or high Eny. Second, it would be viewed as a newb plane. Third, if it was free, 1/2 the MA would be in it. Fourth, if it dominated all opponents, there would be no challenge in flying it.
The plane selection is all about trade-offs. In general terms, gaining speed will cost you maneuverabilty. Gaining weight (big guns, ammo loads, or fuel) will do that too. Armor will add weight, and probably cost you some visiblity (F4U's, for example), but may help avoid pilot wounds and 1 ping kills.
I could go on, but won't...
The best you can hope for is to find a happy mix of "happy mediums". Find a plane that's fast enough, maneuverable enough, etc, to keep you happy, but realize there will always be guys faster, and more maneuverable, with bigger guns, etc... That's what makes it fun. Or pick a plane that just "looks cool", or that you like for other reasons, and learn to use it.
That's just life.
There simply isn't a plane in the game that we can't find negative aspects of, especially when we compare it to others. (Well, maybe the F4U, hehe).
The flight model in AH is different than in those other games too. It'll take some getting used to.
I'd say you're off to a strong start, having seen you in the DA and the MA. You'll improve quickly, and I'm sure realize in the end that the perfect plane doesn't exist, and even if it did, the guy flyin' it is the biggest factor.
BTW, I'd strongly recommend the F4U's. They're flat-out the best planes in the game, and the coolest lookin' too! They're fast, turn very well, have deadly guns, great views, radial engines, mid-range Eny, etc!
MtnMan
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It should be pointed out that those mongoloid cannons weren't really intended or needed to shoot down fighters. They're for shooting big, lumbering easy to hit targets that shoot backwards, sideways, up, down, and even forward, with a heckuva lotta guns!
Sure, they'll work on fighters, if you can hit 'em, but you're using the wrong tool.
A hammer will work to drive a screw- but it's not the right tool. Results may not be all you'd hoped for. Using a chain saw to cut pancakes can be as frustrating as using a butter knife to cut a 2x4. Sure, the job gets done, but...
For fighters, .50's are best, mounted in the sleak, beautifully bent wings of the purtiest fighter ever- the F4U! Set your convergence for 275, and let 'em have it at D200!
MtnMan
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Mtnman, I think they weren't developed only for bombers. They were in the works before the bombers were a major threat. Heck, even the MG151/20 was in the works for a long time before it entered steady production.
I think a lot of it had to do with efficiency of kills. The number of possible shots a pilot might take in a dogfight, how many times he needed to hit a plane to bring it down, his average hit percentage, and all that. They figured the bigger gun means less needed "possible shots" and more chance of faster kills when hits landed, and etc etc.
Also I've heard one reason they may have come about during this time was also the Eastern Front, where heavily armored craft like the IL-2 defied 20mm cannon rounds at times. I've heard speculation that the 30mm was wanted on fighters to help combat these planes.
Definitely it was for bomber attacking, as well! I just wouldn't say it was the only reason.
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Originally posted by mtnman
For fighters, .50's are best...
I'd have to argue with this. The .50's are good but so are 20mm Hispanos and the Japanese 20mm's.
Spitfires, Zeke's and a lot of other 20mm carrying ac were'nt designed as buff-hunters.
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Well, given the route eventually taken to phase out guns on fighters, I'd say you're probably partly right Krusty. I'm thinking of the missile replacing MGs on the Vietnam fighters. Not all ideas are good ideas.
I'd consider the IL-2 as a bomber, at least before I'd class it as a fighter. Not really either I suppose. I can see your argument for the 30mm against IL-2's, and would consider it the right tool for the job. Shooting down IL-2's is not the same task as shooting down a Spit. Different task, different tool. I have zero doubts that people often choose the wrong tool for the job at hand. I'll use my wife as an example. You should see what she tries when she needs to change the batteries on my sons RC car, hehe.
If I'm going to try to shoot down a plane that flits around like a housefly, I'm gonna need some extra bullets!
Now, if all you have is the 30mm, and a spit shows up, sure, I'd give it a whirl, and maybe I'd even hit it. I might even get good at it given enough practice. I can even drive a screw with a hammer! (Not as well as my wife, of course, since she gets more practice. I usually go straight for the screwdriver...)
I doubt they had a way to measure hit%, and if they did, I'd guess it was far from accurate. Had it been measured, I can't imagine any result other than piss-poor expectations for hitting anything. Reducing ammo load out would seem the wrong way to go. Fewer attempts possible, but in the off chance you actually hit something, it was way cool? Even small caliber hits are better than no hits. Reducing ammo reduces chances for hits, and is really only a good choice in certain instances. The requirement of large ammo for IL-2's is an example.
Did the 30mm prove effective enough against fighters that they put it on more planes, specifically for use against fighters?
MtnMan
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BaldEagl quote:
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Originally posted by mtnman
For fighters, .50's are best...
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I was snickerin' a bit when I wrote that, hehe!
Again, this is an instance of there being no perfect answer. But there are still "good" answers. Balance ammo load against lethality. .50's have decent lethality, with a large ammo load possible. As lethality goes up, we trade off ammo load. (20mm's) That's fine, if we still have a healthy balance. If lethality gets excessive to the point where it doesn't matter anymore, then trading off ammo load for lethality doesn't make much sense. That is where I personally put the 30mm. Too little ammo load, (and rate of fire) for too much lethality, at least vs fighters.
Dead is dead. A plane killed with .50's or 20mm's is not any less dead than the one killed with 30mm's. The higher loadout of the .50's or 20mm's gives me a higher probability of hits though, any one of which could be the "golden" hit.
MtnMan
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Keep in mind historical firing ranges were what we'd cringe at. Historically you'd get in to 150-200 yards. At that range a 30mm almost can't miss. It's only at AH ranges that we start questioning its effectiveness. 300 yard shots against fighters was long-ish range in real life.
IMO having a lot more ammo isn't an excuse to spray, just because the target is squirrelly. You have to work to get the shot, whenever you GET the shot, it'll usually go down regardless of what you shoot at it. If you're spraying you don't have that shot yet and need to hold the trigger til ya do :D
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I agree with you 100% on that one Krusty!
MtnMan
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Originally posted by mtnman
It should be pointed out that those mongoloid cannons weren't really intended or needed to shoot down fighters. They're for shooting big, lumbering easy to hit targets that shoot backwards, sideways, up, down, and even forward, with a heckuva lotta guns!
Sure, they'll work on fighters, if you can hit 'em, but you're using the wrong tool.
A hammer will work to drive a screw- but it's not the right tool. Results may not be all you'd hoped for. Using a chain saw to cut pancakes can be as frustrating as using a butter knife to cut a 2x4. Sure, the job gets done, but...
For fighters, .50's are best, mounted in the sleak, beautifully bent wings of the purtiest fighter ever- the F4U! Set your convergence for 275, and let 'em have it at D200!
MtnMan
BS, IMHO, in 109's you setup for snap shots, the more damage done with a few hits the better. .50's are not the best guns for snap shots.
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Originally posted by Dutchie
BS, IMHO, in 109's you setup for snap shots, the more damage done with a few hits the better. .50's are not the best guns for snap shots.
Who needs snapshots when you can spray HMGs all over their plane at 600 meters
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If you have 8 of them they do pretty darned good in snapshots! (6 ain't too shabby either!)
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In a knife edge dogfight you don't get allot of trigger time, in a k4 i only need to get 1-2 30mm in and its over :)
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Unfortunately Dutchie not everyone is a good as you with a 109k4 ;)
Or should i say thankfully :cool:
Bruv
~S~
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Originally posted by Dutchie
In a knife edge dogfight you don't get allot of trigger time, in a k4 i only need to get 1-2 30mm in and its over :)
I agree. As much time as I've spent in the 190A-8 and 109K-4 I'm quite used to the 30mm. It's as good as anything else and maybe better than most for snapshots.
On the other hand, just last night I was in a Spit XVI, cannons dry and killed a Zeke on a snapshot with just my remaining 2 .50's.
It just depends where you hit.
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Originally posted by Dutchie
In a knife edge dogfight you don't get allot of trigger time, in a k4 i only need to get 1-2 30mm in and its over :)
Well, the same can be said for any round, if it hits the right place. From my experience, it doesn't take much of a burst from the .50's to score a kill.
I won't argue that the bigger gun makes for an easier kill in a snapshot though.
I actually find in most "knife-fights", I have more time for a shot than if I'm looking for a snapshot. My knife-fights seldom end with a snapshot, but more of a good hosing, hehe.
My guess is you've learned to score with the big gun, while I've learned to score with the smaller.
12 of one, a dozen of the other.
MtnMan